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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2019-04-22 Regular Session MinutesHAWAII COUNTY BOARD OF ETHICS MINUTES — REGULAR SESSION Monday, April 22, 2019 10:02 a.m. to 12:11 p.m. Hawai`i County Building 25 Aupuni Street County Council Chambers Hilo, Hawai`i 96720 Members and Staff Present: Kenneth Goodenow, Vice -Chair Rick Robinson, Member Nan Sumner -Mack, Member David Wiseman, Member Lawrence L. Heintz, Member J Yoshimoto, Deputy Corporation Counsel Maria Pagala, Secretary 1. CALL TO ORDER (10:02 a.m.) Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Goodenow: Okay we'll call the Board of Ethics meeting to order. Before we move on to statements from the public, I just wanted to introduce...we have a new member...replacing Ms. Kahakalau. Maybe you could just give us a few words who you are and... Okay. I'm the new member. My name is Larry Heintz. I'm retired from the University of Hawaii at Hilo. I've been a resident in Hilo since 1980. I continue to work as a consultant in healthcare ethics for the State Department of Health and the Hawaii Health Corporation. So I'm a novice to this Board but not a novice to...matters of ethics. Well thank you. Welcome aboard. Also present we have the remaining...all members of our Board of Ethics present so with that...we will move to statements from the public on agenda items. 2. STATEMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS (10:04 a.m.) Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: The first person to testify is Cory Harden. Testifying on items 4. a. 1. and 2. Mr. Chairman if I could briefly interject, if you could announce the date and time of today's meeting just so that the record is clear. It is April 22, 2019. It's now about 10:04 and we've started the meeting. Ms. Harden, thank you for testifying, please proceed. 1 Ms. Harden: Yeah. Good morning Board of Ethics Members and thank you for your service on the commission. Speaking about the petition before you. I think Ms. Kierkiewicz seems to be a capable Council member...asking good questions about the Mass Transit budget and other issues. And she has already addressed some concerns in the petition by resigning from Hastings & Pleadwell. And by verbally disclosing connections with Steve Ueda but I hope you'll offer some official guidance for similar situations in the future. As the petition say Ms. Kierkiewicz introduced Bill 16, chaired the committee, considering the Bill and voted in favor of it. She did not disclose that she worked closely with Steve Ueda, president of Matsuno Enterprises which owned the property in question. And she did not disclose that she was on leave but had not resigned from Hastings & Pleadwell. And they still listed Suisan as a client. Steve Ueda is president of Suisan. To provide guidance for the future, please advise whether Ms. Kierkiewicz should have refrained from introducing Bill 16. Should have recused herself from chairing a meeting on Bill 16 and from voting on the Bill. And should she have disclosed her connections with Ueda. And I hope you'll recommend that Ms. Kierkiewicz refrain from introducing Bills that benefits clients that she has worked with at Hastings & Pleadwell. And that she make disclosures when taking official actions that involve her past clients at Hastings and Pleadwell. Thank you. Mr. Goodenow: Thank you. The next testifier is Deborah Ward. Also providing testimony on Petition 2019-01. Please come forward. Ms. Ward: Aloha and good morning. I'm Debbie Ward. Testifying on my own behalf. I just wanted to concur with what Cory said. Ms. Kierkiewicz is my Representative for the County Council and I appreciate the work she's doing and I have no personal disregard for her at all. But I do feel that we govern better when we have full disclosure. And I'd like to encourage the Ethics Commission to assist us in finding out how best to do that. And I thank you for your time. Mahalo. Mr. Goodenow: Thank you. Next testifier is Hanalei Fergerstrom. Also testifying on Petition 2019-01. Mr. Fergerstrom: Good morning. I wasn't really prepared to testify but I do what to say I concur with what has already been spoken about the ethics and the problem we have...there was conflicts of interest. It serves us better if we don't have those conflicts. And if they are there, they should be exposed immediately. Thank you. 2 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Souza: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Souza: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Souza: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Thank you. Next testifier is Mr. Kalani Souza. Ditto with what he said. For the record, you're just...incorporate the previous testifier's... And I also wanna add that you know I agree that her services in you know in public service in general has been exemplary so far so. Okay. Well maybe we should put that on the record but...that wasn't recorded for the minutes. Do you want to...I'll just restate it for you that you believe the Council members services have been exemplary and other regards. Right. Okay. Thank you. The next testifier is Claudia Rohr. Mr. Chairman, Ms. Rohr has asked for an assisted hearing device so our staff is getting it right now. But I don't know if she wants to...are you... If it's there... Well let's just take a brief recess. I'm sorry everyone, we... You are our last testifier so we should take care of this first. I thought it started at 10? Yes. I can testify without a listening device. It's just that maybe you need to speak up. Okay. When you ask me a question. Oh we have somebody here. That's alright, let's just go. Okay then, please proceed. We'll speak loudly. 3 Ms. Rohr: Thank you. I'm Claudia Rohr. I'm gonna tell the truth. I made a request for information from the Clerk to get the actual minutes of what Council Member Ashley Kierkiewicz test... ah stated as her statement of...into the record of the Council. But I did re -listen to it. The video and I don't believe that she has actually admitted to understanding the nature of the favoritism. That she would be partici...that she would be participating in. And number one...she was chairperson. She wasn't...(phone ringing). I'm sorry, I thought I had that on...let me turn it off, hold on. She wasn't just a Councilmember. She was the chair of the committee. That meant she was in control of the hearing. The hearing, the discussion veered from the agenda item. She didn't correct that. She didn't hold the other members to the agenda item. And she doesn't appear to admit to the type of favoritism that would occur here. The Council is being asked to amend a zoning ordinance. It's the construction deadline in a zoning ordinance that expired 19 years ago. And this was for a new project. But what's being considered now is just amending the construction deadline so that the landowner, Suisan and this is a quote by their representative that the landowner is Suisan. He stated that first thing at...at the hearing. Anyway they want...what was being discussed was going ahead and amending the ordinance even though nobody's supported the Pi'ilani water bottling plant. But they just wanted to amend it so that Suisan could have permanent useful...a useful zoning ordinance that allowed for industrial zoning rather than a zoning ordinance that had expired 19 years ago and was a nullity. What she didn't admit to, is that they did this on the basis that there was a lack of...there was a...lack of fee simple industrial properties in Hilo. That implies a scarcity. And anyone who checks the tax records will see that industrial zoned properties are worth at least a third...at least 50 % more than a commercial property. It means a lot of scarcity may mean that its...has even more value and it's been admitted that Suisan's selling this property. So the Council is being persuaded to facilitate a real estate deal. This real estate deal was disclosed. But they're being encouraged to facilitate a real estate deal which is an option to purchase the land if they get the rezoning ordinance amended. That means it will have more value. The proper procedure, Mr. Goodenow, Vice-Chairman...the proper procedure is to... Yeah, I like it when people listen to me. Okay...so they were...being encouraged...or certain members like Aaron Chung were encouraging other Councilmembers to facilitate a real estate transaction. And to make this property more valuable than it would have been if the landowner had used proper procedure which is to put in an application to repeal the ordinance in its entirety. That's the proper procedure. Repeal the ordinance in its 4 Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Rohr: entirety and start over. So having not disclosed the true nature of their favoritism and admitting to it...to me...makes it that she hasn't really completed her obligation under the ethics code. Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Wait one more thing. I was in real estate for years, so I looked all this up. I was a licensed real estate sales person. Oh, Mr. Wiseman... You have a question? Yes. Just clarification. Any other question will be later for discussion. But you mentioned that you don't have the transcript of the Council meeting. But...were you present at the Council meeting? Right. I looked up the rules...the Council rules. Were you there? Well the rules are that Ashley has to have a statement of her personal... I see. But you weren't present at the Council hearing. Wait a second. I asked the Clerk. The Clerk has to have on file...a copy of what the statement was that she made in front of the County Council. Did you watch the DVD of the proceeding? I did. So you weren't there...but you watched the DVD? I was there. Okay. Thank you. And she was there? Yeah. I watched it a second time. 5 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Rohr: Mr. Goodenow: Member of public: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Okay. Thank you. Thank you. And if you...you can stay for our discussion...members may ask you more questions at that time. Are you planning to stay? Yes, but I only have 59 minutes on my parking meter. Okay. Is there anyone else wishing to testify at this time? I think this was an example of Claudia needing her hearing. Okay. Okay. We're gonna...oh... I wanna clarify something. Even though I'm hard of hearing...that means I work harder at listening. Okay. And it also means I work harder at remembering what I hear. So I have a photographic memory and I have a complete memory of what I hear because I replay it in my mind. Thank you. At this point...we're gonna take a brief recess because the respondent hasn't been given an opportunity to read... I mean the respondent gets the petition, the other party hasn't seen any response and we can't do that until we officially move it into our files. But I'm gonna take a brief recess. I appreciate it...it should only be minutes. Alright, thank you. Is there still an opportunity for the public to speak? This is the last chance. Is there anyone else who wants to testify? Alright we'll proceed then with the public testimony. Also for the people who signed. Like, I don't understand the process. I didn't sign up to testify. But why was one of the signatories in the initial... I'll address that now since...I mean this is public testimony...I don't want to violate the Sunshine Law. I'm talking about other 6 Member of public: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: things. But I'll just note that the law requires signatores of the petition and those were given notice. The other people didn't...they didn't sign it themselves. So only those that actually signed it... But anyone can testify. You're welcome to testify now if you want to. We weren't notified. Well we're going to have to discuss this after the recess cause we're technically on public testimony now, right. Okay so, I signed... Alright, we won't have any discussion now. It's if you want to testify, you may testify. This is the only time? Yes. Okay. If I can clarify. So the process...we can talk about the procedure so the public is informed. So the process is right now we take public testimony. Anyone from the public can testify. If you're a petitioner, then you'll have your opportunity to present your arguments, any discussions you want to make to the Board, after public testimony, after the case is called and after the Board says we're ready to hear from the petitioner and the respondent. So does that answer your question a little bit better? Okay, cause I could tell... Did you sign? Yes. She's one of the... Then you're fine. You can be one of the parties, so to speak. Then you're a party, if you signed the petition...this if for just regular members of the public that are not parties. So to clarify though Mr. Chairman. Alright, I'm sorry...why don't you testify? Alright. The next testifier is Sherri Thal, speaking on petition 2019-01. 7 Ms. Thal: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Aloha. Thank you for meeting today. I just have a very short point and that is...I really wanna understand and note the difference between what's illegal and what's unethical. I think that this is...you know...it's something that's coming up right now and Ashley Kierkiewicz you are my Representative so thank you for your service. And I as other people said would really like to see the most transparency in our government as possible. We need to know what's going on. We need to know people's history and I'm hoping then, I don't have to go back and look at you know, Google, to get that...that we're gonna get that from our Council people and from our Representatives in our Hawaii State Government. So thank you. Thank you. Okay. Five minute recess. I would like to testify now as well. Oh. You filled out the yellow paper? Yes. You have a right to testify now. You gotta fill out that form. Someone did for me. Sorry we gotta follow the paperwork. Okay so the next testifier is from Koohau Paik. Am I saying that right? Well I admire...I admire the attempt because you're definitely reading each vowel and it's not a Hawaiian name, it's a Korean name...it's Koohan Paik-Mander. Oh it's an N. Koohan. Yeah, yeah thank you. Thank you Honorable Board of Ethics and Chairwoman Ashley Kierkiewicz for listening to this. I actually wanted to point out how a lot...if not all of the people here in the galley are part of a group called Extinction Rebellion. Have you heard of it lately in London...they've been going on their seventh day of rallies? Calling on our elected officials for meaningful action on climate change because we are in the middle of the sixth extinction and that's why you might recognize this logo. I'm calling on our elected officials to recognize the urgency of climate change includes ethics and includes transparency and that is the underlying motivation for this inquiry into what is proper protocol. 8 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Robinson: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Robinson: Ms. Paik-Mander: So we were interested in...would it be to disclose, recuse...I think Cory Harden summed it out... summed it up very well. So basically it seems like a disconnect. What does extinction have to do with this County of Hawaii Ethics Board hearing? But if you look around at where we are in the planet where we've got 200 species dying every day. 200 species going extinct, dying every day. It's because of cutting corners around ethics. It's because of our elected officials taking...having...doing favors for corporate friends rather than serving the public who elected them... and transparency...and that's the importance of ethics. And because this particular case...I mean we don't watch every single case through ethics unless it has to do with environment and democracy. Well, I guess...I guess -all of governance does. But this was about a plastic water bottling plant. That was overwhelming opposed by the public. And so in service to democracy and service to transparency...we were watching how the County Council would vote on this particular item. And then when we saw that, that Councilwoman Kierkiewicz did have a professional relationship with the petitioner, Suisan and it was not disclosed...certainly a red flag came up. So we come to you to ask for guidance in how such a case would...should be carried out. So thanks for that. Thank you very much. Isn't today International Earth Day? Yes! Thanks for pointing that out Mr. Wiseman. How did you get here today? I hitchhiked...no I didn't...and you know what? It's not about...okay...I think you're driving at the fact that personal choice that I am hypocrite for using fossil fuels to get here. However... I didn't, nor did I accuse you of that. I was just curious. No but I got here from driving my SUV which is a fossil fuel SUV. A lot of people would take that to think that I'm a hypocrite...however what extinction rebellion and what the climate activist are urging our public officials to do is to institute and implement infrastructures by which we don't...have to rely on fossil fuels to get to work...to get to hearings. Right now we have no choice and so you know...just a quick statistic between 1988 and 2015, 71% of all carbon emissions were from only 100 9 corporations. It had nothing to do with personal choices. It had nothing to do recycling or what kind of car you drive. And this is one of the things that's so urgent that we really urge our elected officials to take a...a really clear look at how can we transform our paradigm so that by the time 20 whatever rolls around in 11 years when we passed the tipping point. We have a future for 7 generations into the future and that we can see some sort of perpetuation of life on earth. Mr. Goodenow: Alright, thank you, thank you very much for your testimony. Next testifier, Leilani Lindsey-Ka'apuni. Also on 2019-01. Ms. Lindsey-Ka'apuni: Aloha. My name is Leilani Lindsey-Ka'apuni. I live here in Hilo. Ms. Kierkiewicz is not my Council woman but I am also one of those who joined in on this...filed this ethics complaint against her. I understand that since this was filed, she has made corrections. However, if we had not been vigilant and filed this complaint...I question whether she would have disclosed her conflicts. And because that didn't happen until after this complaint was filed so...the waters of the Mauna Kea aquifer, Ka Wai Ola Akane are sacred to us...as Hawaiian practitioners. This particular aquifer that is...being proposed for a water bottling company is a pristine... almost 5,000 year, untouched aquifer. It is a public trust resource of the State of Hawai'i if you...if you...are part of that. But it is an ancient pristine untouched aquifer that is sacred to Hawaiians and could at some point in time be very necessary for sustaining the public here on this island. And the fact that a private bottling company proposes to enrich itself using the public trust resource...this is the very issue that this morning...today is being taken up at the State Capitol. The Governor is...the Governor is now calling on senators and inserting himself into the legislative process. Calling for the continued theft of the public trust resource and so this is the very issue that we are also facing here on this island. And I think Ms. Kierkiewicz was keenly aware of her conflicts and did not disclose them. And if we had not been vigilant and brought it to your attention, I questions whether it even have come up today. So I ask you to be very clear with her and all elected officials here in the County of Hawai'i about disclosing their conflicts of interest from here on. Thank you. Mr. Goodenow: Okay. Thank you. Seeing no more testimony from the public...again I anticipate this to be five minutes or less. We'll take a recess. 10:29 to 10:35 a.m. The Board took a recess. 10 Mr. Goodenow: Okay we will be recalling the meeting to order. Thank you. Thank you for your patience. Before I start, is there anyone else wanting to testify...just to be sure? I didn't wanna feel like we're rushing or I wanna make sure everyone feels they can testify. Seeing no one. We'll move on then. We are on item 3. Approval of the regular session minutes of February 12, 2019. May I have a motion to approve? Oh we're not all here. Alright I'm sorry. I'm gonna call another brief recess. I would like to put on the record at this time however that Ms. Claudia Rohr was provided with a hearing device. I believe she has that now. Oh, she's not here either. Mr. Yoshimoto: She's standing outside. Mr. Goodenow: Alright. Well sorry. Recess until our Member comes back. 10:35 to 10:37 a.m. The Board took a recess. Mr. Goodenow: Alright. Now we're all here. Ms. Rohr has come back and you have...she has the listening device. Okay. Next order of business. 3. APPROVAL OF THE REGULAR SESSION MINUTES OF FEBRUARY 12, 2019. (10:35 a.m.) Mr. Goodenow: Can I get a motion to approve the regular session minutes of February 12, 2019? Mr. Wiseman: I move to approve the minutes of February 12. Ms. Sumner -Mack: I second. Mr. Robinson: Second. Oh go ahead. Mr. Goodenow: Alright, it's been moved by Mr. Wiseman. Seconded by Ms. Sumner -Mack. I don't know if you'll want to... You can recuse yourself...you weren't here but. Okay all those in favor say I. Any opposed? The vote is four votes in favor and our newest Member is recused... didn't vote because he wasn't present. Next item of business, Petition 2019-01. Motion and Vote: Mr. Wiseman moved to approve the February 12, 2019 minutes. Ms. Sumner -Mack seconded. Four members voted aye and 1 recusal from Mr. Heintz. 4. NEW BUSINESS (10:38 a.m.) a. Petition No. 2019-01 11 Mr. Goodenow: Also there's the letter from respondent dated March 18, 2019. And the letter from a member of the public dated April 4, 2019. Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Chairman, also there's one thing to add. We received an e- mail from Tanya Aynessazian... Member of public: Aynessazian. Mr. Yoshimoto: Aynessazian. Okay. Thank you. That was received April 22, 2019 at 7:05 am and the Board has the discretion of course to also consider that as materials for today's hearing. Mr. Goodenow: Okay. Thank you. And I guess to put on the record. Koohan Paik. Ms. Paik-Mander: Think of like Pac Man. Paik-Mander. Mr. Goodenow: Okay Paik...has provided a correspondence that she's just passed out...written testimony. Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Chairman. Go ahead. Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: So if I could have... Well before we start...there's a procedural issue. Mr. Yoshimoto wrote a memo dated April 16 ...have all the Members seen that? Alright. Our procedure is...in fact I'll ask Mr. Yoshimoto to clarify the situation. So the procedure that we have for today's hearing is that the Board... According to the Board rules, all documents are confidential until presented in a public hearing and that's today. So what we have today is a letter from the respondent dated March 1811', a letter from a member of the public and the e-mail. So these documents are going to be presented to other parties so to speak. So to keep it simple. So the petitioners have not seen the respondent's letter to my knowledge. So we're going to present that today. The petitioner will have an opportunity to review that. And at that point, the Board Chair will ask the parties how they want to proceed. There's several options. One option is to take additional time to review the response and see if you need to prepare and we can schedule this for another hearing, probably in a month. If the parties are ready to proceed, then you know we have that discretion to proceed with the hearing today. And in that case what would happen is the petitioner would come up and present whatever arguments they want to. The respondent will then have that opportunity to respond. The Board will ask questions of the parties. The Board will then deliberate, decide how to move 12 Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Yoshimoto: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: forward. And then an opinion will be generated, depending upon what the outcome is. Okay. Did you...I don't know the petitioners...there's five who signed. I don't know if you have a representative. I don't know if there's a...petitioners have a representative for their group or not. But the first question is...you're gonna get the respondent's response. She'll get anything else you've submitted. Should we continue it so you have chance to respond to her response and come back at the next hearing or do you want to proceed now with the hearing? I guess we should ask each petitioner who signed, if they're present. Can we take a little recess to answer that question please? Sure. We'll take a brief recess. Recess. Or we can first read it and then decide. Yes, that's what I was gonna say. Okay great. So is it okay. Can I have a vote that we... Should we have a vote to distribute it at this time? Right. Before we can distribute it, the Board needs to accept these documents into evidence right...and to become part of the record...and then that can be distributed...and then the parties can decide how they want to proceed. I so move to do that. To accept the documents and to distribute them to the public. So to be clear, that would include items No. 1, 2 and the new addition No. 3 email from Tanya. Correct? Yes. Thank you. Right. And the testimony just... I would clarify the motion to accept all documents with respect to the petition filed, that's at issue at this time. That'll be four documents in total. So it's been moved and... 13 Mr. Heintz: Question, that also includes Ashley Kierkiewicz's letter of response? Mr. Goodenow: Yes. Mr. Heintz: So five documents? Mr. Goodenow: Oh, alright. Well, all documents. Mr. Heintz: All documents. Thank you. Mr. Goodenow: Received by us at this point that we distribute them. It's been moved by Ms. Sumner -Mack. Seconded by Rick Robinson. All those in favor say aye. Any opposed? Motion carries 5 to 0. And we'll take a brief recess to distribute them. Thank you. Motion and Vote: Ms. Sumner -Mack moved to accept documents and to distribute to petitioners and respondent. Mr. Robinson seconded. All members voted aye. 10:44 to 10:58 a.m. The Board took a recess. Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Okay. It looks like some consensus has been agreed to so I'm gonna call the meeting back to order. So would representative of the petitioners, or come forward. One other note, we got a voicemail from a petitioner, David Hunt who's out of town for medical reasons could not make the meeting...for this meeting. So I just wanted to put that on the record. So you know, just a little background here...why we're even talking about continuing. The way the current rules are and we're working on amending the rules and we're sending things to the Council maybe to look at so that's later in our meeting. But a former petitioner felt that...because he didn't have access to the respondents...what they submitted...that it wasn't fair. So now we want to be very careful that everyone has time to read things. So that's why we're asking do you want to continue at this time, just having received these documents? Aloha. Commissioner. After considerable deliberation, we decided that the letter brings up further concerns. And we're very grateful that you've made this procedural decision to bring it up and make it transparent because this is precisely what we are after here. Further, we have not seen the minutes for the subsequent County Council hearing in which Councilwoman Kierkiewicz disclosed. So we would like to get a copy of that and review everything...the new letter...the minutes from the first hearing which is in question and the subsequent County Council hearing. 14 Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Kierkiewicz: Mr. Goodenow: So we would like to request for those reasons to defer decisions or procedure until a subsequent commission meeting. Thank you very much. Ms. Kierkiewicz, do you have any objection to continuing this to our next month's meeting. Can you please come speak in the mic? Aloha Vice -Chair Goodenow, Members of the Board. Thank you for your time and Happy Earth Day. No objection on my part to continue in May. However, I did speak with Deputy Corporation Counsel J Yoshimoto and I did let him know that the May 14th meeting does not work for me. I've had some things scheduled on my calendar for some time and I'm hoping not to have to shift because I've already done it to constituents that are booked for meetings with me on that day. Sure. We have couple options there, Members. We could change our meeting date or we could schedule it for the June meeting. So I would like a motion regarding continuing. Mr. Robinson: I'd make a motion then that we continue this hearing until the June meeting. Mr. Goodenow: Any second? Mr. Heintz: When is the June meeting? Mr. Robinson: It's on June the 10th Mr. Heintz: Okay. Thank you. Mr. Robinson: Okay. That's a Monday. The 10th is a Monday. Ms. Sumner -Mack: I'm sorry but I did not hear the reason for the May meeting to not be possible. Your voice is very soft. If you could speak more loudly. Ms. Kierkiewicz: I'm sorry, I'm still getting over a cold. I noted to Deputy Corporation Counsel J Yoshimoto that I have a number of things on my calendar for that day that I've had to reschedule in the past. And I would not like to have to reschedule meetings with constituents that I've already done that for. And so I'm hoping that the Board will indulge me and move the meeting to June. Also to note that the County Council will be in the throes of budget discussions. And if you're watching the news in Council meetings, you can see that I am very much a part of that process and wanting 15 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Ms. Pagala: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Ms. Kierkiewicz: Mr. Goodenow: Public: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Kierkiewicz: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: 11:03 to 11:05am to make sure that we are doing right by our constituents with this budget cycles. So moving the meeting to June would be preferable. Our meeting for May is currently scheduled for May 13th at 10:00 o'clock. Is that right, madam secretary? 14th. May 14th Oh May 14th I had it marked as the 13th originally and then got a new note from the office saying the 14th. So I'm just wondering if there's any other date in that week. I had to put it off so long. I really do. I can do the 13th but if that's not workable. The room is reserved, I believe. Yeah. I'm on PONC commission at that time. Okay. There you go. Or the 15''? Madam Secretary, any other possible dates? We can check with staff to see if this room is available on the... Is the 15th okay with everybody? Okay. Why don't we take a brief recess? Take a brief recess. We'll check on that. Thank you. The Board took a recess Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: We are calling the meeting back to order. Thank you. So Mr. Chairman. May 15 is available. Council Chambers and we have to finish...we can stay here until 2 pm on that day. So suggestion is...did you want to start at the regular time? That leaves us some time. You want start a little bit earlier, if the parties are able to make it earlier. Say like at 9, I'm just thinking out loud. But I don't know about Members that have to travel too so. 10? Okay. 16 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Paik-Mander: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Goodenow: Would there be any objection from the petitioners that we have it at the June meeting. It looks like we're having trouble coordinating this. We have a motion on the floor for the June meeting. Is there a second or we gonna... Well I'll second it. Okay. Discussion. Depends on when in June. June 10th June 10th June 10th is our regularly scheduled meeting. I'll be back by then. It seems to me, both the Petitioners and Councilwoman Kierkiewicz would probably wanna look for other dates in May and just get through this all and perhaps the Commissioners as well. Alright, well, do we have any other dates in May? Actually, we...through consensus...we've decided to delay. We need to look at more information. That's...you gotta give um that...option. Yeah. So May 15th is not good? Cause... I'll be in Honolulu. That's the third Wednesday though. That's the third Wednesday. Sorry. Let me just check the commission website. I believe it's the 15th. May 15th is the next Campaign Spending Commission meeting. I'm sorry. I'm not available May 15th 17 Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Kierkiewicz: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: So you want us to check on different May dates. Maybe we can get other May dates from the parties so we know. Do you have any date in May that would accommodate you, Councilmember Kierkiewicz? I mean we could have a special meeting almost at any time. We could come back in a week. Next week is totally free, for me. So how about we look at...Tuesday, May 7th? No. I have family coming May 3rd to the ninth. What about...and May 14th you can't because...May 14th you can...oh she can't. Councilmember is May 14th you have the problem. We could have the 13th at a different location.' Ah well how about... I'm not available after the 15th until June 6th. The 15th of May till the 6th of June, I am not available. I've got court all day May 10th. I could do...May 8th Vice Chair, I have Council that week. Oh. How's about May9th. Wait you're not here. Yeah. My daughter in law. A lot of family. They're leaving on the 9th. I wouldn't be free until 11 and I'd have to finish...I have court at 1:30. Ms. Sumner -Mack: What is that date? Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: The 9th What is that June date you proposed? June 10th? I'm afraid we may just have to take it till June 10th Ms. Sumner -Mack: What about the 9th? Mr. Wiseman: I won't be here. 18 Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Goodenow: What about the 9th? I've got court and he's not here. And then he's not here till June 6. So I think June 10th is just going to have to be it folks. And June 10th is Flag Day also. Alright. Well it's been moved and seconded. Any further discussion that it'd be moved to the June hearing? That would be June 10th. All those in favor say aye. Alright, any opposed? Motion carries... 5 to... One Oh. Sorry. Was there a no? Four to one...Ms. Sumner -Mack voting no. Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Chairman did you announce the time? You said... Mr. Goodenow: At a...10 o'clock. At our June meeting which is currently scheduled for June 10th. Here in the Council Chamber Room. Thank you. Alright, with that then, this matter is continued. Motion and Vote: Mr. Robinson moved to continue the hearing on Petition 2019-01 to the June 10th meeting. Mr. Wiseman seconded. Four members voted aye and Ms. Sumner - Mack opposed. 5. UNFINISHED BUSINESS (11:12 a.m.) Mr. Goodenow: We are moving on to the next item for business. Which is 5. Unfinished Business. No unfinished business. 6. Executive Session. May I have a motion that we go into executive session? Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Goodenow: So moved. Second anyone? Second. Been moved by and seconded to go into executive session. All in favor please say aye. Any opposed? Motion carries five to zero. Okay we'll recess to go into executive session. 11:12 a.m. The Board moved into executive session. 11:48 a.m. The Board returned into regular session. 19 Mr. Goodenow: Going back into regular session. 6. VOTING ON EXECUTIVE SESSION MATTERS (11:48 a.m.) 11:48 a.m. a. Review of the executive session minutes of February 12, 2019. Mr. Goodenow: First matter to finish is approval of the minutes of the executive session of February 12, 2019. May I have a motion to approve? Mr. Robinson: Motion to approve. Mr. Goodenow: May I have a second? Ms. Sumner -Mack: Second. Mr. Goodenow: It's been moved and approved. All those in favor say aye. Any opposed? Okay so motion carries four ayes, one abstention. Thank you. Motion and Vote: Mr. Robinson moved to approve executive session minutes. Ms. Sumner -Mack seconded. Four members voted aye, with one abstention by Mr. Heintz. 11:49 a.m. b. Review of Confidential Financial Disclosure Forms filed pursuant to Section 2-91.1(d), Hawaii County Code, by County board and commission members and designated County employees, where personal matters will be reviewed. Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: We have reviewed the financial disclosure forms. Oh I forgot to ask. We have only one. So all except No. 22 we... Can I have a motion to approve and file. So moved. Second. It's been moved and seconded. All in favor say aye...any opposed? Motion carries five to zero. The one remaining one will be returned for clarification. On to 7. Motion and Vote: Mr. Heintz moved to approve and file all the items except for no. 22. Mr. Robinson seconded. All members voted aye. 20 7. DISCUSSION REGARDING AMENDMENTS TO THE RULES OF PRACTICE AND PROCEDURE OF THE BOARD OF ETHICS OF THE COUNTY OF HAWAII. (11:49 a.m.) 11:49 a.m. a. Correspondence dated April 15, 2019 from Vice -Chair Goodenow. Mr. Goodenow: We just need a motion to file at this point. The communication. Get a motion to file. Mr. Wiseman: So moved. Mr. Goodenow: Can I get a second? Mr. Robinson: Second. Mr. Goodenow: Okay it's been moved and seconded. We'll have discussion and let's just have our general discussion on this item. So you'll see... This is like the third time that this has been on our agenda. These revisions have received input from Corporation Counsel Amy Self, who was at our meeting previously when this was initially discussed. Again it was Corp. Counsel's opinion that we could go ahead and request code amendments without the Charter being amended necessarily. And so I'm asking that these revisions be made. These revisions are solely limited in scope. And a little background for our new Member. So back in 2008...1 believe. The County Council passed an ordinance right...saying that the Board of Ethics could issue fines. And a part of that bill says that we need to amend the rules to allow us to do that. Well...after reviewing the matter for quite some time, it appears that the code, right...is a prohibition for us to do...to fine...because under the code...it is the department not the Board of Ethics that has the Chapter 91 hearing. And so what literally would happen is that, the whole matter would be referred to the department after if we found a violation...department would have a whole other hearing and do all this. So I...proposals...I've included only address that...it's to really clarify that no...it is the Board of Ethics that has the Chapter 91 hearing...we have the fine and if they appeal that to the Circuit Court...that's how it goes. It doesn't...there's not an intermediary step that involves the department. So I would like us to send a letter to the Council and recommend that they adopt these changes. However, it was also brought up that any member can submit any recommendations they have to amending the code if they want to do something beyond this so. I don't know if anyone has any proposals but this is the one that we've had...that we've been working on the issue of the fine. 21 Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodman: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: I have a few concerns. Perhaps J can...assist... Oh mic. Thank you. And I'm looking at your memo of April 15th. The title section 2- 86 Informal Advisory Opinions. Okay you get down to subsection b. Should that be a subsection...complaints? Which is totally distinctive from informal advisory opinion. I think that's a good suggestion. It's just out of ease that we... Yeah, it should be a main section. Comparable to the informal advisory opinion. I tell you why...cause it looks like it's a part of the informal advisory opinion and it's not. Yeah. It's a good comment. It's a whole different world. So okay. That's a one. Yeah but complaint should not be involved in a informal advisory opinion. Right. Why don't we...we could just change the heading of section 2-86 to Informal Advisory Opinions and Complaints? Ah that could do. Aha. And then I would also go one step further and put complaints in bold and where subsection b. is...yeah...so it stands out a little. Ms. Sumner -Mack: Yeah. Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: And distinguish it. Okay. I see. My other concern. I think I raised this before. Is the complaint given six years for a complaint? That seems under these circumstances, very unreasonable length to file a complaint. As attorneys notice statute of limitations for contracts and most cases is six years. That's a contract. I don't know...I just sort of have an uncomfortable feeling with giving six years for someone to file a complaint. I think its fine. Again I just limited it to formal separating it out. But...would you want to make a suggestion? 22 Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Yeah. I'd go for two years. I'd go for two years. Okay. So let's do it this way to be a little formal. You want discussion... Well I have a question...I mean. The range and the nature of the complaints could be quite diverse. Some of which, you might want more than two years. But I'm thinking just look at this...I mean what kind of complaints are we talking about here? The complaint would be whether someone violated the code of ethics. Either they... you know they... a fair treatment... or Ah I see. Okay. Let's take for example. Today. This is an example here. Today's issue. Let's say that someone under this had till 2024 to file the complaint against this woman who wouldn't even be in office at that time. So maybe wouldn't be in office. Yeah so that's my concern...facts get old...people disappear...memories fade...people die. Well that's... excuse me. Go ahead. I'm finished. Well. Since our terms of office are five years. It might be wise to have, have a six year period in which somebody could file a complaint against someone who may no longer be on the Board but which might be relevant and might be worth bringing up. That's just my thought. If it's standard in many contracts and so on, why limit ourselves in this case. So Mr. Chairman? Yes. One issue to consider is...in the past...this Board has rendered opinion basically saying that the Code of Ethics only applies to current officers or employees so then...you know in scenarios where they're no longer in that capacity. You know the six years 23 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: obviously couldn't go beyond that...so there needs to be clarity in terms of what we're doing because on the one hand if we're saying... But this is the Boards opinion. This is not in the code right...so the Boards opinion has been...if you no longer in office or employee, the Code of Ethics does not apply to you. But if you go beyond...four, five, six years...and you know you're in office then. It becomes unclear. So I don't know if the Board wants to weigh that in it's... Right. I believe Corp. Counsel issued an opinion that jurisdiction ends. That under the code it only applies to current members. Let me find that. You're just saying that's our internal... I don't recall if it was Corp. Counsel's opinion but I do recall the Board making that opinion in past petitions, right so. I'm just saying that this might be an opportunity to clarify rather than rely on opinion. We just put it in the code. If we're going to be suggesting amendments, that we say. So that way, it's clear. I think it does say in Section 2-79 right. Prescribe standards of conduct for the guidance of county officers and employees prohibit conduct involving officers and employees. Now my concern is...for example...an employee. Who's not subject to any term of office, right? It's going to go on maybe twenty years or ten years. Alright. So, I mean, that employee has a grievance today. It can wait for five, six years to file that. It's totally prejudicial to the person being filed against. Cause they may no...no longer be there or even if they're there...their facts are old...the files are gone...I mean memories are faded. That's my concern. It's an inordinate amount of time, I think. I support your proposed amendment there. And it does also state right...nothing herein shall bar proceedings against a person who by fraud or other device, prevents the discovery of a violation. Oh yeah...yeah. So it's not...you know if there's fraud well it's still open. Yeah statute is bypassed if there's fraud... So I think...I would... Would you like to make an amendment that we... Yeah. I'd like to... 24 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Wiseman: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: So the first one, add...and complaints...to 2-86. Yeah. And put it in bold. And we'll put inquirer's conduct and complaints in bold, okay. Yes. And then complaints down in subsection (b) would be in bold. Okay. And let's just take that one for now. I'll second it if no one will. I'll second. Okay, we have a second by Mr. Robinson. All in favor say aye...any opposed...motion carries five to zero. And then the second amendment? The second amendment is... 2-86 (b). Yeah. 2-86(b) on the complaint that a time period for filing complaint of six years should be amended to read two years. Two years. Is that a motion? Yes. I'll second. I'll second that. Alright seconded by Ms. Sumner -Mack. All in favor say aye... any opposed... One abstained so passes four to zero. I have one last issue...and that's at the end. On the last page. Subsection (c)...the last section there. I'm just curious if...like the...where the board may recover any civil fines imposed it may institute proceedings to recover any civil fines. In these matters, if someone's complained against...I'm looking at possible provision for attorney's fees. 25 Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: I could be part of the fine...fine that's imposed? Correct? Well right now... This would be...for example...an employee in some clerical position...has to defend himself or herself. Oh I see. I see. Hires an attorney...and runs up a few hundred dollars, a thousand or more...you know. He submits a reasonable attorney fees...you know we could award it. Just a thought. I don't know...maybe J has any experience in that in the government? I think it's... Attorney's fees... What is American rule? Right, right, right. Each party pays its own. Which I've ruled against in the past. It's not a...it's not by stature or anything. And may have statutory... Yeah. Where civil rights for example and other things you know... Well I really like the idea. I wonder though if it would have a chilling effect on people coming forward and making complaints. If they thought oh gosh...if I make a complaint and I'm not successful. I might have to pay some attorney's fees. It could be thousands of dollars or... I mean I hear you...but I'm not sure... I'm a little... Okay. Leave it open. I'm not set on it. Yeah I was thinking about that. I was thinking like...remember the two attorneys that represented Billy Kenoi and those people that had fought. And you know...think what...have was on that portion of the money we found that he was you know... Violation. Yeah. In violation. But then I think about the lady that had the complaint against the...administration about the...someone else had been retained... 26 Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Ms., Sumner -Mack: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Wiseman: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Goodenow: Right. And then you look at what she went through. If she had not had and we said there was nothing there. But we had that she could have... Yeah. Okay. If there's no interest, then I'll withdraw that suggestion. Okay. And that's all I have on. All right. Any other Members? So can I get a...did we have motion to approve? I think... I'll make a motion to approve the proposed code amendments as discussed with the two revisions that were made in the course of the discussion. One is to the two year instead of the six year period. And the other was to... Just the heading...2-86. Yeah the heading. Change the heading. Change the heading. I'll make a motion. Can I have a second? Second. Any discussion? Seeing none. I'm confused. The first question is...we voted on the changing on the sections and we voted on the years...changing it from six to two. And now we're voting on the both. The whole thing...the whole thing. And I abstained on the one and voted in favor of the other. So I...now I get to vote again? Yeah. You have to vote again. 27 Mr. Heintz: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Heintz: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Just trying to clarify. And so what we'll do is we'll...it's that we adopt this is our position and the Chair will send a letter to the County Council asking for them to consider these changes. Okay, right. Okay. It's been moved and seconded... all favor say aye... any opposed...seeing none...motion carries five to zero. Okay. Thank you. Next. One last comment on this item 7. So now that this is done. The last step is...the rules themselves...we can either wait for the County Council to take action. Cause that'll have to happen before we can change our rules. Or we could go ahead at the next meeting and say we're changing our rules... In anticipation of. In a yeah...contingent on them passing it. The only reason I bring this up is...I will be leaving. I have accepted a job as an attorney general and because of that, there'll be conflict for me continuing to serve. So that would be effective July 1St. But I'm fine with someone else will have to take over the mantel and work on the rules once the Council takes action. I'd just throw that out there for you to see if you have any thoughts on that. J, would that be you who'd ah... Which issue? So the next step...with one option would we be...that we look at all our...the rules. That we've gone over it already so many times. This would be the final kind of approval of the rules subject to the editing. You know the language...fixing it up stylistic stuff. Then we do that at the next meeting and then say its contingent on the Council passing this or should we just wait till the Council takes action and when that happens you'll put it on agenda...amendments to the rules. Ah. That's up to the Board. I mean I previously gave the opinion that the Board already has the authority to impose fines by virtue of that ordinance from 2008, right? So the fact that the Board sought additional clarification, you know that's subject to interpretation. So, what I'm trying say is it's up to the Board. Because it's not a legal determination. 28 Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Ms. Sumner -Mack: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Robinson: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: The issue though is...unless if that 2-86 doesn't change...we can't really change our rules. That's true because 2-86 needs to be consistent with our rules. Everything needs to fit together as a package. So should we just wait for them to amend...to do their business and amend the code? Or should we just go ahead and approve the rules at the next meeting and say it's contingent once the... I would hold off on approving the rules cause we have no assurances that the Council will approve the changes as noted. They may make additional changes...then we have to change our rules and you know it's just a... A mess. Right. So there will be nothing...so we will not have number 7 on our agenda for the next meeting...number 7 will come off. Right so the rules are at a good place right now right for our purposes and we just need to get confirmation of whether it's the charter or the code changes and... Okay. So if we adopt this, who submits it to the...or go ahead and submits it the County Council. I'll write a letter and submit it. Just to note though. I just noticed in your memo. There is some typos but I'11...I can talk to you about it. Can you point them out though? On page 2...2-87. Your second sentence says the Board... and then there's a capital...it may...that board is actually not part of the original so when you submit that...that should be clarified. Look...that's a typo. So under (a)? 29 Mr. Yoshimoto: Yeah. It's the second sentence...the board...and then space...it may institute. When you look at the original of the code...the board is not in there. Mr. Goodenow: Oh. Well that a minor typo. Mr. Yoshimoto: Yeah. But yeah. You should clean that up before you submit because the Council will... Mr. Goodenow: Alright. Anything else? Mr. Yoshimoto: I'll let you know. Mr. Goodenow: Okay. You guys are alright with that? Mr. Robinson: Yes. Of course. Motion and Vote: Mr. Robinson moved to approve the proposed code amendments with two revisions. Mr. Wiseman seconded. All members voted aye. 8. DISCUSSION REGARDING CHANGES TO THE BOARD OF ETHICS MONTHLY MEETING SCHEDULE. (12:08 p.m.) Mr. Goodenow: Alright, then let's move on to the next item 8. We already have the May 14th date scheduled and the June... Ms. Sumner -Mack: 10tH Mr. Goodenow: 10th. And then I won't be there afterwards, so you may not need this anymore so we don't need to do anything at this point. Alright. 9. ANNOUNCEMENTS (12:09 p.m.) Mr. Goodenow: Next item of business. You already know I was going to announce that I'm going to have to resign my position effective June 30tH After the meeting today, I will submit a letter to the Mayor, notifying him of my resignation. And so on the next agenda, I'm sorry, I meant to put it on this month's meeting agenda but it didn't make it. I forgot. We will have an item to choose officers. We will need a Chair and a Vice -Chair. So that will be on the next agenda. Mr. Wiseman: If I was a still a practicing Judge, I would issue an order restraining you from leaving this... 30 Mr. Goodenow: Sony. Mr. Wiseman: Commission. Mr. Goodenow: Thank you. Any other announcements or... Mr. Robinson: David, can you do it, can you still do it? Mr. Wiseman: I can do it, but I don't know how it...enforce it. Mr. Goodenow: I'm sorry. Ms. Sumner -Mack: Can we have some guidance from J or somebody as to the usual procedure for replacing and voting and all this? Mr. Yoshimoto: Usually procedure is...you have nomination and discussion and whomever is voted in becomes the Chair and Vice -Chair. Ms. Sumner -Mack: But we have to get...we have to recruit a new member. Does that happen...when does that happen? After you leave right? Mr. Goodenow: Right. Mr. Yoshimoto: Right. Mr. Goodenow: So you could theoretically pick officers at the next meeting. I could be gone and you could have another officer selection after. Whenever the Board wants to vote in officers it can. Mr. Yoshimoto: Mr. Goodenow: The charter basically says once a year. A calendar year. Usually in January right so. In this particular case, Ku held over for 90 days...which she's allowed to do so. I'd say in the past, it has been kind of the procedure that you know it's staggered every year. So the senior person is the Chair...is how they used to do it but I don't know if we really need to follow that? Mr. Yoshimoto: No. Mr. Goodenow: Alright. Good. Thank you. 10. ADJOURNMENT (12:11 p.m.) Mr. Goodenow: Well, if there's no further announcements, I'd like a motion to adjourn. 31 Mr. Robinson: Motion to adjourn. Mr. Wiseman: Second. Mr. Goodenow: All those in favor say aye...any opposed...motion carries...five to zero...the meeting is adjourned. Thank you. Motion and Vote: Mr. Robinson moved to adjourn. Mr. Wiseman seconded. All members voted aye. Respectfully submitted: Maria Pagala, Secretary 32