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Home My WebLink About2022_10_18 Game Management Advisory Commission Minutes Game Management Advisory Commission County of Hawaii Minutes Meeting Date: October 18, 2022 Time: 2:00 pm – 4:00 pm Zoom Origination: 25 Aupuni Ctr., Suite 2603, Hilo HI 96720 nd In-Person Site: West Hawai’i Civic Center, Bldg. C, 2 Flr., Conf. Rm., 74-5044 Ane Keohokalole Hwy., Kailua-Kona, HI 96740 CALL TO ORDER/ROLL CALL: (2:00 PM) AA: Sylvia, can you hear me? I’ll call this meeting to order at 2:00, October 18, 2022. Barbara can you take roll call please. BK: Sure. District – 1, Robert Duerr? RD: Present. BK: Thank you. District – 2, is unavailable and will not be attending. District – 3, Leomana? If he’s not on he’s running late, he’ll be Zooming in. District - 4, Brian Ley? I see Brian, OK. District – 5, Chair Abraham Antonio. AA: Here. BK: District – 6, Austin Griffey? Austin, I see you on the screen. District – 8, Cortney Okamura? And I see Cortney, but I see a tree, oh, Cortney? AG: Sorry, I can’t see or hear anything right now… BK: Cortney? District – 8? I’m hearing a lot of background noises, can somebody please mute. Commissioner Cortney Okamura. SW: I think she’s having a hard time unmuting her… BK: OK. But I see her now… OK. District – 9, George Donev. I don’t see George on and George did not respond to my text earlier today. AA: George is excused. He’s still out sick. \[Unclear\] absent. BK: OK. I didn’t hear back from him at all. Thank you. So we have quorum, we have five and then Leomana will be Zooming in about a half hour from now. OK, go ahead Chair. 1 AA: Housekeeping rules. Make sure all cell phones is turned off or in silent mode. For all of us attending in person speak clearly into the microphone when you’re speaking so the statements can be recorded and transcribed. Can we have a motion to – did everybody review last month’s minutes? APPROVAL OF MINUTES: AA: Everybody… AG: Yes, I reviewed. CO: I move to approve the minutes of the last meeting. SW: And, I’m sorry, but since we’re on Zoom, can you please – this is Sylvia Wan Corporation Counsel. Can we please state your name before you – because we’re all on remote. CO: This is Cortney, District – 8, I would like to move to approve the minutes of the last meeting. BL: Brian Ley, District – 4, I second the motion. AA: All in favor? Aye. SW: So I believe that was… CO: District – 8, Cortney Okamura, aye. SW: Austin, District – 6, an aye; Robert Duerr, District – 1, did a raise of the hand, aye, is that correct? RD: \[Unclear\] aye. SW: And District – 4, Brian Ley, I’m sorry, did I get a response? AA: Brian was an aye and I’m an aye too. SW: OK. And then Chair, District – 5, was also an aye. AA: Yeah. SW: Five ayes, the motion passes. STATEMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC: AA: OK. Any statements from the public on agenda items? AA: OK. No statements from the public. Moving on to the presentation. PRESENTATIONS: 2 DOFAW West Hawaii Wildlife Biologist Kanalu Sproat will discuss general Administration rule changes in public hunting areas. AA: Kanalu are you up? KS: Yeah, I’m on… AA: Go ahead. KS: So I can do a share screen? AA: Yeah. SW: Barbara, since you’re administrator I think you need to allow him to share screen. There you go. KS: So can everyone see my screen? AA: Yes. KS: OK. So last time I was on we talked about rules changes for Puuwaawaa and Puuanahulu. Ah, today, I’m just going to talk story about the changes that we proposed for Mauna Kea Unit A. Um, Unit G, which kind of matches Unit A, and then Unit Ipu \[?\], um, Pohakoloa training area. So I’ll start with Unit A. And so all we’re proposing for Unit A is to increase the bag limit of pigs to four per hunter per day. And then to allow or to restrict mammal hunting below the tree line during legal game bird hunting days for safety reasons so that’s what they used to do before and then in the last \[unclear\] there was some confusion in that they don’t allow pig hunting but they do allow sheep hunting. So I’m just trying to pin it all up so that on game bird hunting days there’s not mammal hunting below the tree line, but you can hunt mammals above the tree line and that’s for pigs and sheep and goats. And then moving on to the changes we’re proposing for Pohakuloa, um, I don’t know why it did that – hold on. Sorry… So right now Pohakuloa is only when they have their hunts – they’re only allowed to harvest one sheep and one goat per hunter per day, um, we believe that the population of sheep and goats in the area is way too much and so we want to give them the ability to reduce that using their hunting program and so, we’re basically just saying we want to allow the commander to set bag limits when they do have their hunts and so just whatever the commander deems as appropriate to remove, to reduce the number of animals in the area. Last time we already talked about Puuanahulu so I will move on to Hunting Unit G – Kaohe and Hunting Unit G – Kaohe – just matches Unit A, same thing, of increasing 4 pigs – the bag limit to 4 pigs per hunter per day and same thing about restricting mammal hunting to above tree line during the fall game bird season. And that’s all I have for the additional – that’s the stuff I wanted to talk about the last time but wasn’t able to. So I’m open to whatever questions you guys might have or any thoughts you might have on those proposals. AA: Abraham – District 5. The Unit A and the \[unclear\] areas, how much mammals are there below the tree line area? Do you have any idea? 3 KS: Ah… AA: Like is there any animals, is it a low number, high number? KS: Yeah, I don’t really, because the population for sheep is so low up there I don’t… AA: Yeah… KS: I don’t know how many there are. I would – just looking at how many animals we are continuing to be harvested and that are taken during our aerial eradications I would guess that there’s about 300 sheep, maybe a little more. Pigs I have no idea. But a lot of people do a lot like too much pig hunting up there. But if somebody were to go and they wanted to harvest above what the limit is now we just figured we’d allow them to do so. AA: Right. Any other questions from the Commissioners for Kanalu? BL: Brian Ley – District 4. Hey, Kanalu, has there ever been an issue between the game hunters and the bird hunters \[unclear\] doing that? Has there been conflict or we just play in the same \[unclear\]? KS: Most of you’re playing the safety card, um, before, my understanding is that before my time the rule that I’m proposing to change is what the rule was and so for safety reasons they restricted mammal hunting to above the tree line, um, and I think most hunters – I could be wrong and if anybody’s out there thinks I’m wrong let me know, but I think most hunters kind of grew up with that so they kind of follow that already anyways and maybe they didn’t know that the rule changed that would allow them to hunt below tree line, um, and so I’m just trying to put it back \[unclear\] how I understood that it was important. BL: I have another quick question I just thought up. Any thoughts on allowing the bird hunters to harvest the pigs, you know, with to allow buckshot, cause I know with the high grass and everything and I, you know, consistently run into pigs at a close range but not allowed to harvest them – you guys ever think about allowing the bird hunters to harvest the pigs. KS: I’ve never thought about it – I guess if it’s something you guys are really interested in I can, yeah, I might be open to it. BL: \[Unclear\] using dogs and not legally \[unclear\] use dogs anyways… You know, the grass is so tall, I mean, the only time you see a pig is when \[unclear\] with the dog. KS: Right. I’m open to a discussion about it, yeah, it’s not something I thought about so. BL: OK. That’s all I have, thank you. RD: Abraham, I have a few questions. District – 1. AA: Alright. RD: Yeah, Kanalu, isn’t there chucker hunting above the tree line? 4 KS: There is chucker hunting above the tree line. I think the idea behind the safety above tree line is that there’s much more visibility and so people can be much more sure about their shots. RD: OK. And then, um, PTA. You said there’s way too much mammals. Do we know what that means? KS: Oh, like is there a population estimate? I have no idea but I don’t, I mean, as I drive by PTA and I look PTA side of the road and DOFAW side of the road, the PTA side looks like a wasteland and you see sheep all over the place and they themselves have approached us with some questions about how we can help reduce the numbers over there but as far as like numbers, we don’t, I don’t know how many there are. I have no idea. RD: OK. And then how about the 4 pig limit. Are any hunters gonna get 4 pigs in day, I mean, is there that many pigs or, if they get lucky and they run across 4 pigs that it’s gonna be OK or... KS: I don’t think it’s… Oh, go ahead sorry? RS: Is there that many pigs up there? KS: Oh, there’s, I would say that if somebody runs across 4 pigs in a day while they’re hunting they’re probably gonna be pretty lucky, especially 4 pigs that they’ll want to harvest. I think we were trying to match – if I’m wrong on this – I’m sorry – I think we were trying to match what is proposed for the changes at Unit I and Unit D. And so we’re just trying to match what they’re doing as well. RD: OK. Thank you. KS: Yeah, no problem. AA: Abraham – District 5. Yeah, Robert, I think that’s pretty much what they’re trying to do is just match it right across the board because we, because they raised the bag limits in that Unit I here – Unit I, Unit D area in lower Puna then they’re trying to just do a straight patch across the board. KS: Yeah, just trying to be consistent. AA: Yeah. But as far as up in that area I not – like Kanalu said – the pigs that they might actually get is not – a majority of them is not gonna be worth harvesting – like they might shoot whatever running in front of them but the amount to actually take home of that number going real low – lucky if they get one – and extremely lucky if they get two. OK. Anybody else have any more questions or comments for Kanalu? BL: Brian Ley – District 4. AA: Yeah. BL: Just popped up, again, hey, I know we discussed this before – can we re-look the idea of transferring these animals from one game unit to another. I know they just \[unclear\] with PTA is the, ah, you know, they’re doing a lot of training so we’re not able to get in there and hunt very often. Is there some way we can do like they did with the goats on the state land – we grab a whole bunch of these 5 sheep and move ‘em to hunting area and open up a special unit \[unclear\] hunt kind of thing, I mean, if there’s some way we could throw that on the table and look at where we get a large amount of animals at once open to a different hunting area where there’s not a lot and have a special hunt? Just a suggestion and an idea for a later talk… KS: Yeah, that’s something I’m trying to explore as well, if it’s something that we could do. I know – \[unclear\] my predecessor, Huns, did something similar \[unclear\] sheep from Mauna Kea down into Keamoku and got into a lot of trouble for it – so there’s a lot of people that are very hesitant to move animals in that nature, but it’s something I would like to explore and, I mean, I think I have a legal ability to put them into a game management area, um, but I’m not sure if I would have the approval of my superiors or not, I don’t know, I have no idea, so it’s something I’m willing to explore. BL: Brian Ley – District 4. Hey, since we just had 1872 pass that says the game animals are allowed quality habitat – I would think we could use that as an excuse to take these poor sheep out of these over grazed areas and move ‘em to an area that is – has suitable habitat for them as, ah, you know, just a stick to poke out there. KS: Yeah, I will try to help, try to use that to fight my case. RD: Abraham, I have a question. AA: OK. RD: Ah, Kanalu, I saw recently in the paper where they were talking about building a fire breaks on the mountain to get down on the fire fuel hazard in mamane and palila. KS: Yes… RD: Yeah, my question is when they said they talked about eradicating the sheep they said they were mostly successful. My question is this – if I recall – the judge’s order was to get to a zero population of sheep. Is that correct? KS: Correct. RD: Is, is, and then so – quite frankly you’ve had a lot of time to do that and you’ve not been able to do it – are you – my question is this – are you breaking the judge’s order and is the judge’s order able to be fulfilled the way it’s written now? KS: Hmm… I’m not a lawyer so I’m not sure if I’m qualified to answer this to, you know, I will just say what I understand. RD: OK. KS: Um, we are making – we continue to eradicate and shoot animals so we have no season and no bag limit for sheep and goats on Mauna Kea and we also have, um, aerial eradication operations that we carry out a minimum of twice a year – most times it’s four to six times a year, um, I believe that those efforts fulfill that judge’s order. I don’t think there was a time line on you have to eradicate these 6 sheep down to zero by a certain year, um, and, so, to answer that question I think, I mean, we’re doing the best that we can and I think that is sufficient to be following that order. RD: Um, in the matter of the fire breaks and using bulldozers to go into critical habitat the comment in the paper was there was no need for an EIS. I that true of bringing bulldozers into a critical habitat with the palila population that’s declining? KS: Yeah, so we consulted with the US Fish and Wildlife Service for this project and they wrapped our project into a programmatic EIS that they already have, ah, and, so, they basically did all of the ground work for environmental compliance in that programmatic EIS and so we fall under it and so we don’t have to do a new one – if that makes sense. RD: Does GMAC have a copy of that programmatic EIS? KS: Um, I don’t know. I can send you guys the draft. I did send the draft plan for this – so I have discussed this before this – I’ve discussed it multiple times actually with the GMAC – the fire field break project, but I can send… RD: OK, sorry… KS: ….it again. AA: Abraham – District 5. Kanalu, that’s the time when we was just speaking about the fire breaks, right? KS: Correct. AA: Yeah, so, yeah. We had all that already sent to us, so, um, if you need ‘em, Kanalu can you send it Barbara and then Barbara can send it over to Robert. KS: Yes, I can do that. AA: Thanks. Um, Stanly Mendes – you get your hand up. SM: Yeah. AA: OK. Comments, ah, cannot ask questions ah… SM: Well, um, so my comment is that Area A by the Mauna Kea Park is that gonna go to safety zone or archery, Kanalu? KS: Ah, it’s not part of this rules change that we are proposing so for the short term no. SM: Yeah, cause I remember you guys mentioning that so. Just asking. KS: Yeah, we’re definitely looking into it but it’s not part of this proposal. SM: Cause I power rifles around that park. I don’t know… 7 KS: Yeah, yeah… AA: OK. Ah, any other comments or questions from the Commissioners? OK. Thanks, Kanalu. KS: Yeah, no problem. NP: I have a question from the public, Nani here… AA: OK, Nani, make it quick. Not a question but you can have a comment. NP: Well, um, because of HB 1872 game animals merit quality habitat, um, sufficient water, food and refuge, I was just wondering if DOFAW had any plans on enhancing the watering units for game animals? KS: Um, we don’t have any plans to increase the number of watering units that exist. We have quite a few already and so we just maintain them. NP: Thank you. AA: OK. Thanks, Kanalu. KS: All right, you’re welcome. AA: Just making mention that Leomana is now in present. Leomana are you present? LT: Aloha, District – 3, Leomana present. Sorry, I just had a newborn this past weekend and the doctor just came to do a checkup so my screen might be all over the place. AA: Right on, congratulations man. LT: Hey, right on, mahalo. OLD BUSINESS Discuss and make a motion to Laupāhoehoe Boat Ramp and Seawall Investigation. AA: OK. Moving on to Old Business, ah, discuss and make a motion to the Laupahoehoe Boat Ramp and Seawall Investigation Committee. Um, so this is just, we going just form one committee to investigate the Laupahoehoe Boat Ramp and Seawall Investigation. Um, me and Brian went to one community meeting the beginning part of last month and the community is very in support of the boat ramp. As far as the seawall, that’s kind of still unclear but the County also has the funds for the boat ramp itself. SW: So are you proposing a motion to form this committee? Sylvia Wan, Deputy Corporation Counsel. AA: Well, somebody needs to… Somebody needs to make a motion for it, right? SW: Yes, so you’re calling for the motion or are you making the motion? 8 AA: No, I calling for the motion… SW: OK. LT: District – 3, Leomana. I wanna make a motion to create a committee to investigate the Laupahoehoe Boat Ramp. Sorry, I just trying to make a motion, I couldn’t hear what you were saying. AA: No, it’s just to make a motion – I’m asking to a make a motion or I want you guys to make a motion to investigate the Laupahoehoe boat ramp and seawall. LT: And seawall rebuild, yeah? AA: Yeah. LT: OK. Leomana – District – 3, I’d like to make a motion to create a committee to investigate and check out the Laupahoehoe seawall and boat ramp. CO: Cortney – District 8, I second the motion. AA: OK. Open for discussion. Is there any discussion from Commissioners? LT: Leomana – District 3, um, there’s a lot of – I went to Waipio this past two weeks ago and I was talking to a lot of the fishermen in that area and there’s a lot of people that were, ah, against closing Waipio for access to gather and fish and so I think there’s a lot of need for updates to boat ramps in the area or just fishing area access, you know, not everybody is expert level so this type of easy access for common person to go down and spend the day with the family fishing is much needed on that coast so I just wanted to bring that up for my talks at Waipio two weeks ago. RD: Ah, I reached out to Heather Kimball, ah, District – 1, and, um, she’s up for giving an update on the – Waipio, Laupahoehoe, and, um, Hakalau and Pepeekeo, um, I mean, essentially all these need updates, um, I’m wondering what a committee does that GMAC can’t do? AA: Um, Sylvia can you answer Robert’s question? SW: I’m sorry, I’m Sylvia Wan, Deputy Corporation Counsel. I’m unclear as to District – 1 Commissioner’s question. As far as a GMAC \[unclear\] I’m reading here straight from the Sunshine Law – you can create an investigatory group of two or more members of less than quorum provided that a) the scope of the investigation and the scope of each member’s authority is defined at the meeting, which is what I believe is what we’re trying to, what GMAC is trying to do right now in discussion, 2) all results, findings, and recommendations are presented to the board at a meeting and 3) deliberation and decision making on the matter investigated, if any, occurs at a duly noticed meeting of the board held at a subsequent meeting at which the findings and recommendations of the investigation \[unclear\] presented. So right now, I believe the motion before the Commission is do you want to create this investigatory group and what would the scope of your investigation and the members’ authority. \[Unclear\] create \[unclear\]. Does that answer your question? RD: Yes, thank you. 9 SW: OK. LT: Leomana – District 3. Um, I just wanted to add in there, I think the important parts of us creating the committee this past year was so that we can get together and talk in like three or four sized people groups without breaking the Sunshine Law. That was like just this past year, I know, we had to create the committees because just talking about stuff outside of the one day of the month that we had was, I guess, needed to be legal. SW: Well, yes, but your discussions can only be going toward your investigation. It shouldn’t be towards gathering consent one way or another for something that is board business. So you could investigate theoretically what is needed in order for the County to go forward with the boat ramp. What if anything are obstacles with the boat ramp going forward as well as, you know, creation of the seawall and if any advice can be rendered from GMAC in helping with that particular obstacles. It appears that at this point we might not know all of the obstacles that are present for the boat ramp actually being built and/or the seawall being rebuilt so that might be things that you would consider. This is just a suggestion this is not a \[unclear\]. This is your Commission. AA: Abraham – District 5. So, um, Leomana you’re kind of right but like Sylvia said you just got to talk about what you guys investigating within that committee. Bob Duerr – and then we’re – and so that committee, Bob, is looking, you know, investigating searching for facts and then coming back and reporting to the Commission as you guys just did with the lay net rules and I feel committees is much better than just having you by yourself being the representative for your district and trying to take on that task, right? So now if we get three other commissioners plus two other from the public then they can help you out within your, within the committee’s investigative powers to come back and report to the commission. I think it’s just easier for do the investigative part versus one person versus five or whatever the committee, however much people is in the committee. But, Rob, you gave another good point, um, we just discussed about the Laupahoehoe boat ramp and the seawall but under – at your suggestion to Heather Kimball and because that’s through your whole district, um, do you feel that we should just stay on just the Laupahoehoe boat ramp and seawall investigation and let’s wrap that up first or, um, then next month we can put on Waipio Valley… RD: Yeah… AA: ….on another committee next month after you join the Laupahoehoe seawall, ah, committee and then we’ll just cancel that one out and then reconvene as in the months ahead. RD: You know, Abraham, that makes sense. I mean, keeping it narrow, that makes sense. You know, Laupahoehoe has already been meeting so it shouldn’t be that difficult to get some kind of minutes or consensus or idea of what’s going down. AA: Right. RD: Right, ah… AA: And even like the Waipio one that’s already been investigated through us and, ah, still getting issues going on forward. So that one is kinda serious but that one through GMAC should actually be kind of \[unclear\] too then we can move on to Hakalau and so on and so on down the line. They are all 10 important, right, for us gatherers, fishermen and however you see fit to gather in that area but the hot topics right now I think is Laupahoehoe and then we can go to Waipio after that and then so on and so on like I said. SW: Deputy Corporation Counsel, Sylvia Wan. I would make a suggestion to Commissioner Duerr from District 1, if you would like to add an item to the agenda, you can, you know Barbara, after this meeting so that it can be added to the agenda and you can discuss it at the next meeting… RD: OK. Great. SW: ….regarding a potential – to form a potential investigatory group regarding that particular topic. RD: Yeah, and I was hoping at the end of the meeting if we have time we could go through the districts so we could hear issues with the districts that may become agenda items. SW: Yes, and I believe that is at number 8, yes. RD: OK, great, all right, thank you. AA: Abraham, District – 5, and that’s just a reminder for everyone to, ah, all the Commissioners, you guys, and even for the public too, right, Sylvia? If you guys have anything that wants to go on the agenda, you know, Barbara, she’ll share it, so… SW: Correct. AA: So… OK. RD: So should we form a, you know, I mean… AA: Yeah, we already had the so are we done with the discussion? SW: Ah… AA: Any discussion from Commissioners? BL: Ah, just one thing. Just that the ramp group via fact finding for their initial report… AA: Say that, again, Brian. You’re muted, Brian, cannot hear you. BL: Now can you hear me? AA: Yeah. BL: Yeah, the ramp group, fact-finding for the initial group. Just for the first part we just fact-find \[unclear\]. AA: Yeah. 11 SW: Chair, discussion is over, I believe, um, it would be appropriate here to Segway also for a discussion – who would be the chair and more or less discuss the parameters and then also have a chair so I don’t know if you want to split it up into separate sub-motions. AA: Well, that doesn’t really have to but it’s two ways to get the chair, right, one is by vote by majority or I can choose the chair myself, right? SW: Yes, so I’m just kind of opening that up there just to make sure that a chair is chosen by the end of this discussion or rather by the end of the vote. AA: Yes. SW: OK. AA: So I just like make sure we get enough to actually form a committee first, right? So at this time is there – any volunteers for this committee. SW: I think we need to hold a vote first and then we do the… AA: The vote? SW: ….yeah. AA: OK. Would you kindly take a roll call vote? SW: Yes. I’ll go ahead and start it. I’ll do the roll call vote. AA: Thank you. SW: District – 1, Robert Duerr? RD: Yes, aye… SW: District – 2, Kean Umeda – excused. District – 3, Leomana Turalde? LT: Um, is this, sorry… AA: It’s the vote to create a committee for Laupahoehoe boat ramp and seawall investigation. LT: Aye. Aye means, yes, sorry… SW: Yes. District – 4, Brian Ley? BL: Aye. SW: District – 5, Abraham Antonio? AA: Aye. 12 SW: District – 6, Austin Griffey? AG: Aye, can you hear me? SW: Yes, we heard you. District – 8, Cortney Okamura. CO: Aye. SW: And District – 9, George Donev is excused. There are 7 ayes and 2 excused. Motion passes. AA: OK. Now is there any volunteers for this committee? RD: I’ll volunteer, Abraham. AA: Thanks, Bob. LT: I can be on the committee. Don’t know how much free time I’ll have in the next two weeks though. AA: I know, my son recently – his girlfriend gave birth too, but anyways... SW: Robert Duerr… BL: Brian – District 4, I’ll be on the committee also. AA: OK. That’s three commissioners. Any members from the public that wants to be a part of this committee. TN: Teresa here… AA: Hey, Teresa, you want to be a part of the committee, Teresa? TN: Yes. AA: OK. Get one echo over there. Any other members from the public? OK. Any volunteer to be chair of this committee? RD: Abraham, I’ll chair it. AA: Thanks, Bob… RD: You’re welcome. AA: OK. Bob’s gonna be the chair of this Laupahoehoe boat ramp and seawall investigation committee. Ah we got Commissioner Leomana, Commissioner Brian Ley, member from the public is Teresa Nakama. Thank you guys for volunteering. 13 SW: And, um, Ms. Nakama, just as a matter of administration, can you please contact, sorry, forward your contact information to Barbara so she can forward it to committee members. Thank you. GMAC development and finalization of Draft Rules. AA: OK. Moving on to Old Business – GMAC development and finalization of Draft Rules. So did everybody get the draft rules? I would say this is about 2 months old already. RD: Abraham, I don’t know if I got them. AA: OK. Did everybody else get the draft rules, um, the Commissioners? LT: Leomana, District – 3, I got ‘em. AA: OK. AG: Austin, District – 6, I got ‘em as well. AA: Thanks, Austin. So only three of us got the draft rules? Only three of us got the draft rules, I’m going table this to next month’s meeting till everybody gets it and takes a look at it. SW: I’ll just note for the record that it is currently on the Boards and Commissions website under exhibits, 2022, it was previously provided during the August 16, 2022 meeting. It is currently housed there. See if I can drop a link in the Chat. CO: Chair, this is Cortney, District – 8, I just found them. I do have them yes. AA: Can you take a look at it, though… CO: Yes, I have reviewed them previously but I had to make sure… AA: OK. BL: Brian, District – 4, I’ve looked at ‘em, sorry. AA: OK. Any discussions about the draft rules, any improvements, any changes, you guys \[unclear\] needs to be made? CO: Chair, this Cortney, District – 8, I’m just noting that the meeting time is still noted, at least on the draft that I have, at 6:00p which… ?: It’s on the draft that I have also… SW: Deputy Corporation Counsel, Sylvia Wan. When this draft was originally formulated it was when the Commission was meeting at 6:00p. Since it does appear that that would otherwise need to be deleted from the draft rules, um, as according to the charter, it doesn’t appear that and it’s referring to commissions being able to make rules regarding time. It’s not talking about specific time but it’s 14 talking more as in timing during the week, timing during the month, timing during the year. So I would agree that that portion needs to be deleted. AA: Can you say that again? It came in kinda static… SW: I would agree that that portion – that 6 p.m. time will need to be deleted because right now it is contrary to law. AA: It’s contrary to law meaning? SW: Meaning that the Commission doesn’t have the authority to set the time of day when the charter talks about – I think it’s 14-3 – they’re saying that the Commission can do rules as far as time. The word “time” is meaning time of month, time of year, time of the week, it doesn’t mean time of the day, because time of the day falls under the administration, under the Office of Management. AA: So it was to have another administration, not the administration that’s in right now that does not support this and another administration that would support it, then we’ll be locked into the 2:00 meetings, right? SW: Not necessarily, no. So, um, this, the time of day can be changed – what I’m saying is that the Commission doesn’t have the authority to regulate the time of day and so the time of day – this – if you were to pass these rules as is – it would get rejected as to that portion because it doesn’t comport with the statute. RD: Ah, Chair, I got a question for counsel. AA: Go head Bob. RD: Yeah, do we have that where it’s actually stated in the charter or is that just an over reaching ability of the administration that set a time of Commission meetings. SW: No, no. It’s two different parts of the chapter of the charter. So for just one second, I’ll pull it up. AA: So it’s under 13-4 section I, each board and commission shall have the power to establish its rules of procedure necessary for the conduct of its’ businesses which rules shall contain the time and place of all regular meetings and which shall testify that a quorum shall be a majority of the members to which the board or commission is entitled. RD: Did I hear you right, Chair, that the Commission shall – does it say that the administration shall or does it say the Commission shall… SW: No. So rules are going to be subject to the administrative powers of the Office of Management and the Office of Management is delineated under Chapter 1, of Article 6 of the Hawaii County Charter, and that is under 6-1.3 which says that the Office of Management shall supervise the administrative functioning of all agencies, departments, boards and commissions. So you can’t regulate beyond your authority. So Section 13-4 regarding Boards and Commissions will not vest in you a power that is outside of your authority as a board and commission. So if you are under the Office of Management 15 then that means you cannot have an authority that goes beyond the authority of the Office of Management. LT: Leomana, District – 3. Is that what’s setting a rule if/or is that what’s setting the time because we’re talking about setting rules. SW: Yes. So the rules are gonna be subject to approval by the Mayor and so the Mayor… LT: So can we just – can we set our own time though… SW: No. LT: ….is what I’m trying to ask. No. SW: You can set up your time as far as what day of the week in the month that you want to hold your meeting but you can’t have it for the time of day because that’s gonna firmly fall within the administrative powers of the Office of Management. LT: OK. AA: So, again, my question is – since this administration does not support the evening meetings and we have another administration sometime in the future, now I’m not talking about right now but let’s say maybe the next administration or the administration after that and we can and they support having evenings meetings then I don’t want to lock us in day time, you know, to this time of meetings or any… SW: I would think it… AA: ….can still can be where it’s still movable and not where we’re gonna lock ourselves into something. I don’t want to finalize this draft and lock us into something that everybody’s not in support of – especially this administration. SW: I’m sorry, Chair, \[unclear\]. AA: No worries… Kind of normal already, right? SW: I apologize. That was not what I intended to do – Deputy Corporation Counsel, Sylvia Wan – as far as the timing goes I do believe that the time specific should be deleted and should not be mentioned especially because Chair Antonio is correct in that the time can change depending on what the administration – the Office of Management deems – is the administrative \[unclear\] of the Commission. So that could be because a particular public facility is not – there’s no public facilities that area available at that time and what not, so that falls clearly within their role and responsibility within the County so I agree with the Chair in that 6 p.m. – the mention of a specific time should just be deleted. RD: Chair, I’d like to ask a question. So… AA: First state your name… 16 RD: Robert Duerr, District – 1, in the matter of understanding what is time – did I hear right that in fact GMAC could set for example the day of the week but we couldn’t set the time of the day of the week. Is that correct. SW: Yes. RD: So why don’t we pick Saturday, for example. Would we be in our rights then? SW: Probably not because there’s no public facilities that are open on Saturdays. RD: OK. So time is – so time has other nuance than just the time of the day. Correct? SW: Yes, so again, you can only regulate within the powers that are granted to you – with – so you fall under the Office of Management. So right now they have said that you are a County agency – County operates and this is stated elsewhere but the County operates what are considered to be business days for the County and will not operate on otherwise holidays outside of very specific functions. RD: OK. OK, got it… AA: Any other parts in the draft rules for the people that have seen it – have any comments, rule changes? LT: Leomana, District – 3, I support the 3 minutes testimonies. AA: OK. I guess if no more comments or questions of concerns besides the time – so let’s verify the time – make a motion – let’s vote on it and then we can finalize the discussion. SW: I’m sorry. Drafting rules have a different set of \[unclear\] that it has to comply with. So once this board determines a draft that it is amenable to – it would need to be posted for at least 30 days, preferably more – there needs to be a public notice of that you are considering adopting rules and in order to completely comply, it should be considered a separate meeting. That separate in notice can be just prior to the GMAC meeting but it would need to be separate and distinct from the regular operating of GMAC. Um, so if the board wants to consider the draft rules with the one amendment, um, I can… AA: Actually, you know what, Sylvia, I got another amendment and I brought this up to you the other day was… SW: OK. AA: ….if you can put it in somewhere along with you vote for Chair and Vice Chair that they have specific Chair and Vice Chair training of, you know, new Chairs and Vice Chairs and also for just the Commissioners themselves that they have proper training as soon as they get sworn in within a certain time. SW: OK, um, you can add a rule that’s talking about the functions of the Chair and Vice Chair but I do not believe that you can add a rule that would otherwise govern what another agency does, which I believe is what you’re asking for. Now, granted, Corporation Counsel is responsible for providing 17 trainings, but I don’t think you can legislate or rather make a rule that the Corporation Counsel has to do something by a certain time, but you can – do you understand what I’m trying to say? AA: Yes. SW: You can make rules regarding the responsibilities and roles of the Commissioners and how testifying and testifiers and the public can interact with the Commission, um, but I think what you’re asking is a little bit beyond. So if you want to have a deeper discussion about that we can have that open. AA: OK. And then we can bring this us again at the next meeting? SW: Yes. So if you would prefer, what I can do is I can make two drafts for this Commission – one draft which is the rules as is just deleting the time because it seems like most Commissioners are OK with wanting to contemplate that particular draft and then I think I can make a second draft based on what it is that you’re contemplating \[unclear\]… AA: Well, like we said before and I’ll make it public now it’s just to protect the incoming Chair and Vice Chair because we – nobody has – and even the Commissioners – it’s still one voluntary position and nobody has had the proper training and you guys or the administration is holding us at a high standard and, you know, without the proper training how can you be held at the high standing, right? So all I’m asking for is in the future Commissioners or Chairs and Vice Chairs to know their roles and be trained in the proper way. SW: OK. I believe I might be able to craft something to the \[unclear\] that. AA: Yeah. SW: The Chair and Vice Chair must participate in training as to their roles and responsibilities… AA: Yeah. SW: By the \[unclear\]… AA: Corporation Counsel… SW: Yeah. AA: OK. So as far as the draft rules we moving it on to next month’s meeting and I guess you can work with Barbara to how it’s gonna be stated. SW: Well, I believe it can be put on the agenda but it sounds like what you’re contemplating is two different drafts and I will provide the two different drafts as discussed by the Commission today to Barbara so that all of the Commissioners can have it and we can discuss it at the next meeting. AA: Yes, yeah, OK. RD: Chair, I have a comment. 18 AA: Go ahead, Bob. RD: A public policy question. The Corporation Counsel has said that the Commission is in fact a County agency. Quite frankly, Abraham, I think we need to look at Office of Information practices that has Sunshine Laws that helps Commissioners understand their role in front of the public. What the Commissioners who may have needs of why the Commission needs to meet other than it’s always met and they may be very legitimate, however, the jurisdiction and mandate of the Commission is separate from the that of the Administration and I think we need to delve into this with the Office of Information Practices, because in looking at it per cursorily it looked like what they were saying is our duties to the public and we have to do our best effort to be in front of the public so the public can know and the public can attend and the public can have their opinions understood. And, um, that’s my look at it – so that’s basically – I think we need to look into this a little deeper. SW: I’m sorry, um, Deputy Corporation Counsel, Sylvia Wan, ah, this is for District – 1, Mr. Duerr, if you have questions regarding the rules and responsibilities as well as the jurisdiction of the Commission you can speak to me about it – that is my role – is to help inform and educate Commissioners as to that, um, I said “agency” probably in artfully, you are a Commission of the County and you fall under the County, um, I can provide you with an organizational chart so that you can see where exactly that falls within the county, um, if that’s where your question lies. But otherwise, if you have more specific questions, it would appear that it’s better fitted… RD: To be in writing. I’ll put that in writing… SW: Yeah, either an executive meeting or between you and I personally as your – as the attorney for the Commission. AA: Abraham – District 5. So it sounds like maybe next meeting let’s set up an executive meeting in regards to, ah, I guess what we went over last Friday, this past Friday, cause that sounds like along the same lines as what Robert’s asking, right? SW: Yes, um, if the Commission wanted to do that now it could enter executive session, um, it would require a motion and 2/3rds vote but I’m not sure if Barbara is prepared to enter that and turn a Zoom into… AA: Yeah, that’s why I’m saying let’s move it to… SW: ….and executive session. AA: So let’s move it to next – we have other things that we need to get on to… So let’s schedule that to next month’s agenda to have an executive meeting and, then, you can cover all the Commissioners and not just Robert because I know some of the other ones gonna have questions later on so we’ll just cover all bases, OK? SW: OK. Letter to Mayor Roth for approval of GMAC’s “Out Doors Day” event 19 AA: Um, moving on to Old Business Section C. Letter to Mayor Roth for approval of GMAC’s “Out Doors Day” event, um, at this time was waiting for Leomana to finalize – just go over the letter that was drafted, but at this time I think we should table this until we – I personally feel that this Administration does not support it, um, you know, due to financial – so let’s table that till we get an Administration that would support something like this. AA: Finalizing Puuanahulu and Puuwaawaa Rules Change Committee. Um, last meeting… SW: I’m sorry, Chair. I think you need a vote to table… AA: OK. Let’s have a vote. Can you take a roll call vote? SW: I need a motion first. RD: I make a motion that we table the last item. BL: Second the motion, Brian Ley, District 4. SW: I’ll now proceed with the roll call vote. I’m sorry, before a vote – is there discussion as to table? AA: Any discussion from the Commissioners on the letter to the Mayor for approval of “Out Doors Day?” LT: Leomana, District – 3, is it because, um, I guess just the basic cost of living going up, ah? They say it’s financial reasons… AA: Ah, you know, to me, Abraham, District – 5, to me it’s, you know, they saying that 1) was safety reasons that they don’t have financial support to provide safety, right, for having our meetings night time… LT: Um-hum… AA: I guess they just got approved for safety in all County facilities security for 2) they’re saying they don’t have enough staff and that they cannot financially support staff for our night time meetings, right, so… LT: Um-hum. AA: To me it’s like they don’t have the funds for simple things like that so why are we gonna continue on with our “Out Doors Day” that they would have to… LT: Yeah. Um-hum… AA: …. help and support, right, so… LT: Yeah. AA: …. I’m just tabling it till we have an Administration that feels that the Commission can feel comfortable with it – not just me. 20 LT: Yeah. I agree with that. AA: That’s why we having this discussion and if you guys all feel the same then we can table it, if not, then we can have a discussion right now and we have a discussion. So any other discussions from the Commissioners? OK. No other discussion, um, Sylvia, can you make a roll call vote please? SW: Yes. District – 1, Robert Duerr? RD: Aye. SW: District – 2, Kean Umeda – excused. District -3, Leomana Turalde? LT: Aye. SW: District – 4, Brian Ley? BL: Aye. SW: District – 5, Abraham Antonio? AA: Aye. SW: District – 6, Austin Griffey? AG: Aye. SW: District 7, vacant. District – 8, Cortney Okamura? CO: Aye. SW: District – 9, George Donev excused. There are 6 ayes, no nays, two excused and one vacant. Motion passes. Finalize Pu’uanahulu /Puʻu Waʻawaʻa Rules Change Committee AA: Thank you. Now, moving on to the finalization of the Puuanahulu/Puuwaawaa Rules Change Committee. Last month we had this committee formed to investigate the rule changes for that two hunting areas. Um, I had technical malfunctions on my side so this committee wasn’t finalized so at this time can the Commissioners and if the public members are available just reconfirm your voluntary positions and then we can choose a chair and move forward with this. OK. Barbara or Sylvia do one of you guys have the list of who volunteered for this committee. SW: I believe it was Barbara who has the whole list. 21 BK: I’m sorry, which committee is this one? SW: I believe this is the DLNR rule change committee. My understanding or my \[unclear\]… AA: Abraham – District 5. I going be on mute, my wife just came home and the dogs going crazy. RD: Is this lay nets? SW: No – Deputy Corporation Counsel, Sylvia Wan, no… RD: Thank you. BL: District – 4, this is supposed to be the Puuwaawaa hunting rule changes that Kanalu talked about the last meeting. We formed a group but we never picked a chairperson so we can’t move forward until we pick the chairperson. SW: Sylvia Wan, Deputy Corporation Counsel, yes, right now I believe Barbara went to go see if she can find notes as to everyone who had previously volunteered, unless everyone is present today or somebody else can remember who… AA: OK, can we just stay with this for a few minutes until she gets back and then let’s move on to New Business and then come back to that. SW: I think a motion vote, motion second. AA: OK. Can I have a motion to move the meeting forward to New Business, section A. SW: I’m sorry, you’re just passing, right? I think you can \[unclear\] and then come back to it… AA: Yeah, we just passing it. SW: OK. AA: And we’ll come back to it. OK. New Business. GMAC discussion regarding effects of changed time, meeting time. So… Any effects for the Commissioners on the meeting time change from our evening meetings to now our new daytime meeting? I’m gonna be on mute for a while. SW: I’m sorry, Chair, but I think you need to go into recess for a moment because Barbara has not come back and she needs to be able to take minutes of the discussion that’s happening just in case \[unclear\] fails. So if we can have a standing recess. AA: OK. That will be fine. Do we need a vote? OK. Let’s just take a recess until Barbara comes back then. \[Recess\] BK: Chair I’m not able to find it right now, I’m trying to look for it in my email. 22 AA: I don’t think it went out to, well, unless you sent it out to Sylvia… I think it was Brian, Stanley Mendes, um, I think, Cindi from Kona. BK: You know what, it should be in our minutes. AA: I think Austin Griffey was also on that committee. AG: Yeah, this is Austin, District – 6, I did volunteer for that. AA: So we had Austin, Brian, Cindi, and I not sure who was the last person… BK: I see a Natalie Reynolds… AA: Yeah, that’s it. Natalie Reynolds. BK: Yes, it’s in your minutes on page… AA: Can we, with having 2 Commissioners, is that still an official committee? SW: Yes, cause it says two or more. You need at least two. AA: OK. Perfect. Um, and chairs can only be Commissioners, right? SW: That is correct. AA: OK. Brian or Austin – would one of you guys like to volunteer to be the chair for that committee? BL: I’ll volunteer to be chair for that committee. AA: OK. AG: This is Austin. I’ll be happy with Brian, he’s solid. AA: OK. So the chair for this committee is Brian, Austin is number two Commissioner, then we have I forget Cindi’s last name so Cortney if you can help me out with that. CO: It’s Cindi Punihaole, chair, and I would be happy to provide her contact information. AA: OK. And then, ah, Natalie Reynolds and also Stanley Mendes. Stanley, you still volunteering for being part of that committee, Stanley, if you’re still online. SM: Yeah. Um, I think Cortney too. Cortney wanted to be on that too. AA: Yeah, would be good that’s her district to, ah? Cortney, did you volunteer? CO: I can’t remember if I volunteered but I’d be happy to join. AA: OK. Perfect. There you go. 23 CO: I’ll send Barbara the contact information of Cindi and Natalie assuming she doesn’t have them. AA: OK. Thanks. And then Stanley, I know Barbara get your contacts but just send it to her again. SM: OK. AA: And then Barbara if you can send up to everybody just so make sure everybody all on the same page cause we had problems within the lay net committee, right? Yeah, they had communication problems in the beginning but we fixed ‘em. BK: OK. AA: Sylvia, do we need to vote and finalize that committee or it’s all good already? SW: Um, I think you already voted to create the committee… AA: Yes, yes we did. SW: You now determined the chair… AA: Yes… SW: I believe maybe you should just clarify the scope as to what they are investigating – that would probably be beneficial. AA: The scope of this or that committee was just to investigate the GMAC \[doesn’t he mean DLNR\] rules changes for Puuanahulu and Puuwaawaa. SW: Was that just to investigate and report back to the committee. AA: Yes, and then we can – after that then the Commission can draft up a letter and give our advisory to the state – to DLNR. SW: OK. So… AA: Whether we’re in support of it or not in support of it. SW: OK. So just recommending support or not support and why. AA: Yeah. SW: OK. AA: So we can move forward now? SW: I believe so. It’s a little strange cause it was half done… 24 NEW BUSINESS: GMAC discussion regarding effects of changed meeting time. AA: Yeah. OK, New Business – GMAC discussion regarding the effects of changed time meeting time. Any discussion from the Commissioners about the effects of the changed meeting time? AG: Austin, District – 6. Yeah, it’s been affecting pretty hard cause it involves this time of day with like sports and stuff with my children. But be nicer if it was more to the back to six o’clock for sure. AA: Thanks, Austin. Leomana, you had comment too. Hello? CO: Chair, this Cortney. I don’t see him on the call any longer, he might have dropped. AA: OK. Do you have any comments, Cortney? CO: I do. SW: Austin, can you please turn on your video because we need to have you on video to maintain our quorum. Thank you very much. Now you can continue your discussion. CO: Chair, this is Cortney, District – 8. My comments on the meeting time – it’s definitely been more difficult to, you know, have attendance. I have child care issues and other obligations including work and other meetings during the day and I joined the Commission based on the knowledge that the meetings would be between 6:00-8:00 p.m. when I have consistent child care and, ah, not during my regular work hours. I just want to put that on record, thank you. AA: Thank you, Cortney. BL: Brian Ley, District – 4. The Commission thing is – right now I’m not working but when I do go back to the mainland and work I will be unable to do these meetings because of time constraints, you know, I could do the evening meetings but these meetings being at this time I would be unable to Zoom. So we’re looking at two to six months a year that I will be unable to perform my duties based on like Cortney said, you know, it’s always been 6:00 – 8:00 p.m. it was always something that I could do and like I said, you know, the public looking at the screen hardly see any public response, you know, a short change to the public too on this so that’s my two cents worth. AA: Hey, Leomana, you back on? LT: Leomana, District – 3, sorry my phone died, um, yeah, my comment. My kids they all get done at school at 3:00 p.m. and, um, you know, they go to charter schools and they’re not done before 2:00 p.m. so it’s kinda hard for me to leave my job and then leave school and then make it back home in time to get on this meeting without being in a car or I was having my electronics charging during the day so I can make it, ah, and, you know, even if public – in Hilo, this is where everybody live and it’s, you know, they love to jump on these meetings and stuff and you know I get scoldings from the public, I get scoldings from the uncle who created this board and this commission and, um, yeah, you know, all the people who are responsible for putting this whole thing together when I see them they’re like, eh, what happened? You know, like what’s going on, how come you guys making it 25 earlier and we cannot be involved anymore, all this, all the hunters and all the old timers so, yeah, it’s a real – having these meetings at 2:00 p.m. instead of later on when all the hunters are done with their regular jobs is really not beneficial for anything at all. Anyway, that’s my two cents about that manao. AA: OK. Um, I’d just like to say, even though we dealing with this difficulty right now – just thank you guys for your voluntary efforts, your guys’ time, um, that you guys put in. Hey, Rob, Rob, did you have something, do you have any comments? Is he still on? Robert Duerr, do you have any comments for this? RD: Um, yeah, you know, quite frankly, um, one of my friends is the head of the Finance Commission and he says, wow, we never have anybody show up. So over the years the years since this Commission’s been formed a number of times I’ve gone to County Council Chambers and been in an audience and testified and what have you and quite frankly there’s always been a large public participation. What I’m wondering is, is there any way to quantify how much the public really cares about GMAC. What I mean by that is, are there records on how many people from the public came to meetings? And how many people on Zoom from the public and most importantly I would like to know how this Commission stacks up to other commissions. So the point being that we may not be like all of the other commissions. That being said, if the Administration has issues with the time, which is security – there’s been a number of things that have been stated, but none of those things have been stated to GMAC as the Commission. So we really don’t know what the issues are and how to address it. So, for example, we do have a budget and I know running, having been involved in \[unclear\] if we were concerned about security we hired off-duty police officers \[unclear\]. So there may be ways, I’d like to know how much the public cares about GMAC and \[unclear\] what the Administration \[unclear\] so that 1) we can address them and 2) the Administration \[unclear\]. AA: Sylvia, is there any way we can get that kind of information? SW: As far as the attendees I do not believe so from the public because I don’t think the County keeps stats on that. LT: I got that stats. SW: You have that stats? OK. LT: Leomana, District – 3, I took screen shots of all the attendees who had screens on the meeting the past 4 months. SW: So I will, um, I do understand that that is important \[unclear\] however, I don’t know how that would inform a change in time \[unclear\] cause I don’t think there’s any legal mechanism for that specific \[unclear\] we can talk more about that online or in an executive session if you want to. But, yeah, I do know that, my understanding that they don’t keep specifics stats. The County doesn’t keep specific stats as far as Cortney. AA: OK. Um, what about Kevin? I know what you’re going tell me but can we request the financials to how much does it cost to run a GMAC meeting? 26 SW: Probably not. Um, also as far as the budget goes – that is a budget that was provided by the Office of the Mayor so it is not statutory – it’s not mandated – it has been provided as a matter of policy from the Office of the Mayor. AA: OK. As for me, um, you know, it has been a little, I have to like everybody else, I have to leave work, um, other members from the public don’t think this is right. You guys got to, you know, what happens at 2:00 p.m. school get out. What happens and 3:00 p.m., 4:00 p.m. you gotta, like Leomana said and Cortney and Austin – you got to take your kids to practice so I once – my sons, you know, they were, when they were younger there was no way in the past where I could do this kind of thing – there’s no way. If I wasn’t in the position and I’m not saying position as Chair, just where I’m at in life, I couldn’t, there’s no possible way in the past that I could do this. It’s still an inconvenience and it’s funny how we can inconvenient, well, soon to be 9 people, and not just a small portion, even though in the charter it states that the Mayor can provide us or the Mayor’s Office can provide us what we need but, you guys found a loop hole around that as well. The other things is Boards and Commissions, section 13-4, members of boards and commissions who do not receive compensation from their employers during the time they are serving on boards and commissions may be reimbursed by the County for actual work hours lost at a straight time rate of pay of such members in the regular employment but in no cost shall such reimbursement exceed two times the state’s minimum wage hour rate. So my question is for the people that, you know, are working can we be reimbursed for lost hours for working on this voluntary commission because now it’s such an inconvenience? SW: Chair, are you directing that question at me – Deputy Corporation Counsel? AA: Ah, sorry, yes. SW: Cause my understanding is that this was the discussion on the Commission. AA: Oh, sorry. SW: I only pipe in when I’m directly… AA: Oh, OK, then. OK, sorry. It’s not a question \[unclear\] you can answer me that question later but it’s just making it publically known to the Commissioners of that section in the charter. OK. Any other comments from the Commissioners? LT: Leomana, District – 3, can I just get that one again. AA: Yeah, it’s in the charter, Boards and Commissions, Section 13-4, um, part F. LT: Thank you. AA: Yeah, you’re welcome. Ah, no other comments from the Commissioners? NP: So \[unclear\] from the public. AA: Go ahead, Nani. 27 NP: Thank you. Um, yeah, it’s a real sacrifice for anyone to give up daylight hours for and, um, get things done to attend GMAC. So it eliminates a lot of people right there cause people are busy and it’s a big sacrifice and also I think it’s been like this for ten years and there’s a lot of old timers \[unclear\] so \[unclear\]. AA: Nani, sorry, Nani, you coming in blurry. NP: Oh, I don’t know why. AA: You sound better. NP: Is that better? AA: Yeah. NP: Anyway, I’ve been with GMAC for ten years and a lot of the old timers would come and support GMAC – but, you know, they’re uncomfortable with Zoom meetings, they’d like to be in real meetings – that’s just how they are, they wouldn’t participate in these meetings for both those reasons – daytime hours and the fact it’s a computer Zoom meeting so you’re eliminating a lot of people by having a daytime meeting. That’s all I have to say. Thank you. AA: So at this time I’d just like to ask if the Commissioners would like to draft up one last letter to ask the Mayor’s Office to get our meetings back to night time – to our original times. SM: Abraham, can I say something. AA: OK, go ahead Stanley, make it quick. SM: What happens to this Commission if no Commissioners can make the meeting? AA: Ah, Sylvia \[unclear\] last meeting, if we cannot make quorum we still can have the meeting, we just cannot make no executive decisions without having one quorum, right, but we still can hold meeting. SM: So my question is what is good for the Commission then if you cannot conduct business, I mean, how can stuff get done without the Commissioners? AA: I cannot ask that question and you cannot ask her that question though. SM: OK. Thank you. AA: Yeah. RD: Chair, I’d like to make a motion. AA: Go ahead, Rob. RD: Ah, yeah, I’d like to make a motion that we send to the Administration a letter and that in it we request three things, um, 1) we ask for specific reasons why the 6-8 p.m. meetings were cancelled, 2) 28 if reimbursement for time lost is correct for GMAC members attending day meetings and 3) what is the cost of a GMAC meeting for the Administration. SW: So, I’ll just note that 1) as far as the cost of Administration I don’t think that that’s relevant or even within the powers of GMAC to ask that specifically. Two, I’m sorry, what was the other point… RD: Actually… SW: The reason why. I believe the reason \[unclear\]… RD: \[Unclear\] I’m making a motion. Corporation Counsel can answer this in writing after – if this motion passes. SW: I’m commenting on the legality of the motion. As it appears it exceeds the powers of the GMAC itself. RD: Chair, can I comment. Cause basically, you know, anything that’s spoken is hearsay. I say that – what my motion – is that this goes in writing and that in writing the Corp Counsel or anyone else in the Administration can answer specific reasons why the meeting was cancelled from 6-8 p.m., the reimbursement as it’s stated in 13-4 and 3) what are the costs of meetings? AA: Abraham, District – 5. As far as me, I support one and two questions, as far as your third question that’s outside of GMAC’s authority. You could probably do it publically and ask for that response. RD: Quite frankly, I know the Finance Commission actually quantified how much their meetings were costing and with that result they came up with a time of day to meet. AA: So your motion for drafting the letter… RD: Change the motion to only two… Change the motion to ask for specific reasons why GMAC meetings were cancelled from 6-8 p.m. and 2) if the meetings are held from 2-4 p.m. per 13-4… AA: Yeah, 13-4, Section F. RD: Right. What will the reimbursement procedure be? SW: So, I’m just going to note for the Commission that there appears to be a misunderstanding as to 13-4, F. It says that members of the Boards & Commissions who do not receive compensation from their employers during the time they are serving on boards and commissions may be reimbursed by the County. They key word there being “may.” LT: Leomana, District – 3. Can I second that motion and we have a discussion after. AA: OK. Motion has been from Robert Duerr and seconded by Leomana, yeah, let’s continue on with discussion. LT: I’m good with drafting a letter asking those questions. I want to know the answers to them too, especially to the procedures to the reimbursements and seeing what other commissions and boards out there are operating on that same process. 29 SW: I’m just gonna note for the board that the proposed letter at this point – the questions that it’s asking fall outside of its specific role as the Game Management Advisory Commission because it does not specifically pertain to one of those \[unclear\] areas as provided within the charter. AA: So it has – it specifically states in regards to the Commission itself. SW: Yes. So I’m gonna continue. So the questions that you are posing are administrative in nature and you can engage with the Mayor’s Office administratively with \[unclear\] with the different members of the Commission has, so if you provide a formal letter regarding administration of GMAC the Mayor’s Office may or may not respond, is what I’m saying, because it’s not, um, specific advice that’s being provided under the powers of GMAC under the Charter. It’s administrative, yeah, I don’t know, I think maybe I just confused everybody. But I’m just trying to set parameters as far as expectations go. AG: Is it, is it really that hard to just ask a question why we changed the time they’re really just not going to take the time to answer – why they changed the meeting time. SW: No, I’m not saying that they wouldn’t respond, I’m just saying that they’re not required to. AG: OK. BL: But we can still ask them the question regardless if they respond or not, just the same thing is if we write a letter of advice and they take that or not, you know, we did our part, we’re just asking for a letter asking formally in writing these questions and if the Administration wants to answer that then they can answer it and if not, that’ll be an answer in itself so, I think we’ve spent enough time on this, and that we’ve had a motion, we’ve had a second, I think we should vote on getting this letter and see what happens after that. Thank you. AA: Thank you, Brian. So let’s vote. Ah, Sylvia can you take a roll call vote? SW: Yes. District – 1, Robert Duerr. RD: Aye. SW: District – 2, Kean Umeda – excused. District – 3, Leomana Turalde? LT: Aye. SW: District – 4, Brian Ley? BL: Aye. SW: District – 5, Abraham Antonio? AA: Aye. SW: District – 6, Austin Griffey? 30 AG: Aye. SW: District – 7, vacant. District – 8, Cortney Okamura? CO: Aye. SW: District – 9, George Donev, absent and excused. There are six ayes, the motion carries. AA: OK. Leomana can you work with Robert Duerr on the letter? LT: Aye. Hiki no. Discussion and Approval of GMAC 2021-2022 Fiscal Year Report. AA: OK. Thank you. New Business, Section B, discussion and approval of GMAC’s 2021-2022 Fiscal Year Report. So did everybody get the Fiscal Year Report and took a look at it? AG: Austin, District – 6. I never did get any yearly report. RD: I never did, Chair, District – 1. AA: Barbara, did you send it to everybody in their email? When did you send it out? BK: Um, I’m not sure. I need to look at my email. SW: Um, Chair, Deputy Corporation Counsel – Sylvia Wan, I believe I had provided some suggested changes but I don’t think we ever got a response as to affirmation or denial of the suggested changes so I don’t know if the draft actually went out. And that was as to legality and form. BK: OK. I’m not sure. AA: OK. So we going table this or we going move – can we have a vote to table this discussion to next month’s agenda. CO: This is Cortney, District – 8, I’d like to make a motion that we table this discussion until the next meeting please. LT: Leomana, District – 3, I second that motion. AA: Ah, Sylvia can you make a roll call vote please. SW: Sure. Ah, District – 1, Robert Duerr. RD: Aye. SW: District – 2, Kean Umeda – absent and excused. District – 3, Leomana Turalde? LT: Aye. 31 SW: District – 4, Brian Ley? BL: Aye. SW: District – 5, Abraham Antonio? AA: Aye. SW: District – 6, Austin Griffey? AG: Aye. SW: District – 7, vacant. District – 8, Cortney Okamura? CO: Aye. SW: District – 9, George Donev – absent and excused. There are six ayes, no nays, the motion to table passes. Discuss recommendations for a GMAC representative for the HCR17, West Hawai’i Ungulate Control Task Force. AA: Thank you. Ah, we’ll move to New Business - discussion recommendations for GMAC representative for the HCR17, West Hawaii Ungulate Control Task Force. So everybody, I’m pretty sure we discussed this before the HCR17 – everybody familiar with it? If you guys shaking your guys head I cannot see so please be vocal. BL: Aye. AA: Thanks, Brian. CO: This is Cortney, yes. AA: Thanks, Cortney. AG: Eh, Abraham, Austin, can you please repeat what you said I didn’t catch it. AA: Ah, we having the discussion on the recommendation for GMAC representative for the HCR17. So I’m just saying if you guys got the HCR17, cause I think we discussed it once before already so I just making sure that we all on the same page. AG: OK. Got it, yes, same page. 32 AA: OK. Thanks. Robert, you got it too? RD: No, I have no idea what this is about, I’m sorry. AA: OK. So basically HCR17 was passed through legislation last season with David Tarnas – he made a West Hawaii Ungulate Control Task Force, um, there’s many fingers in this hand, state, private, county. Ah, we as GMAC – we need to initiate a representative to represent us in this task force, ah, in the HCR17 it just says that I need to suggest somebody but I feel that, ah, we, instead of me by myself, we as a Commission should pick somebody. So, as far as me, I have two people, um, one is – Cortney, what’s Cindi’s last name again? CO: It’s Punihaole… AA: Punihaole. She’s come from a hunting/gathering family. She lives on the Kona side. She also works for the Kohala Center. CO: That’s correct. AA: Yeah. And then the other person I have was, um, what’s his name… Shoot, I forget his name. Brian you remember his name? Not Jon Sabate but the other guy? Brian? SM: Allen Nakagawa. AA: Yeah, Allen Nakagawa. Thanks, Stanley. So Allen Nakagawa he’s a hunter that hunts, he’s a retired school teacher, ah, Stanley? SM: Yeah, biology teacher. AA: Yeah. So he’s a retired school teacher. He’s up in that hunting areas pretty much every day, ah, if you follow him on social media, so I feel he’s a strong candidate for that task force position. So, ah, any comments from the Commission. SW: I’m sorry, just before move to comments I just want to note I put a link for all the Commissioners and everybody attending to the County website where HCR17… AA: HCR17… SW: Was posted at the last meeting… So there’s a link so everybody can access it. AA: They were present at last meeting the two candidates but I don’t think they’re here at this meeting. Allen Nakagawa are you online? Cindi are you online. CO: Chair Cindi said she couldn’t make it today, but she did want to express that she’s still interested on serving on the task force if needed. AA: Thank you, Cortney. So discussion from the Commissioners from I know you guys probably don’t know who they are – like I said, Allen – retired school teacher, hunter in there pretty much every day 33 from dusk to dawn, you know, within hunting hours, ah, Cindi comes from a hunting/gathering family, lives in Kona. Both members of the public. AG: Eh, Abraham, Austin here. What’s the responsibilities of their task force? AA: It just going be, according to that thing they just says that they just going be working with the state and the private entities for those areas. But we can them – that representative that we choose to come back and, you know, keep us posted. AG: OK. Got it. AA: Any other comments? BL: I’ve known Allen for a long time, he’s a very avid hunter. He’s very vocal in the past on our GMAC \[unclear\]. I feel confident \[unclear\] not saying the other lady – I just don’t know the other lady; I just know Allen. AA: Thanks, Brian. OK, so I guess with, ah, any, last chance – Cortney you got anything to say about Cindi? I guess at this time I going choose Allen Nakagawa. I’ll reach out to Kanalu and put him on that task force. SW: Ah, Chair, I guess it’s within your authority under that particular resolution… AA: Great. SW: ….to just make the appointment yourself, but if you wanted the Commission to make an informed decision – it would make sense to potentially table this to make sure that you know both of the candidates present so that they can address the Commission. AA: Well, that would be good but like everything that GMAC does we’re always late so I no like take up any more time. I want that person in there and active, right, so technically, if it was like on time then, yeah, I would say, I would agree with you, but we’re already behind, like always so I would say no. ANNOUNCEMENTS: Fall bird hunting season runs from November 5, 2022, to January 30, 2023. AA: Fall Bird hunting season runs from November 5, 2022, to January 2023. So I think right now bird hunting season you can actually go up and run your dogs, condition your dogs and get them ready for bird hunting season, um, Brian you got anymore comments you want to say on this Brian. You’re the bird hunter. BL: Oh, yeah, you don’t have to get the permit, you can just sign at the check in station on Old Saddle Road and the state is actually going to be releasing several hundred chucker this year so I was at the, oh, with Kanalu and Jason Omec yesterday running the dogs doing game bird counts so I – they were saying they were looking for places to release the chucker so there will be a planted farm birds this year for the first time in my memory on Mauna Kea. 34 Rule changes to lower Puna hunting areas. AA: Thanks, Brian. Um, rule changes to lower Puna hunting areas. Brian would you like to touch on that since that’s in your area, if not, I can. BL: Oh, we talked to Kanalu and we’re, you know, in the process of trying to open up the hunting season cause of the pig problem in Puna. Ah, kinda like the same thing they’re doing the other places 24/7 – up the bag limit – and, ah, we’ve also discussed Abraham and I – went and looked with the DLNR about getting better access and better parking for these hunting areas so we can draw more hunters into these areas too, so… AA: Yeah, the last – I think before last month’s meeting, um, it was on the agenda because at this time I think it’s actually the rule changes for that lower hunting unit is actually in the Board of Land and Natural Resources’ hands so they was supposed to have a meeting last month before our meeting but, ah, it got tabled or they just moved it down the line. We tried to get more information on the next meeting or what’s the status of that rule change and I guess we didn’t reach out to the right people yet for that. COMMITTEE REPORTS: GMAC Investigatory Committee – Laynet Rule Changes – Chair – Commissioner Robert Duerr. AA: Committee Reports: GMAC Investigatory Committee – Chair Robert Duerr, please take over. CO: Chair, this is Cortney, District – 8. Bob actually asked me to fill in for him on this portion if that’s OK. AA: OK. That’s fine. CO: OK. Thanks. So the committee met as you all received, or you should have received in our email along with this agenda the committee report, um, prepared by Chair Duerr, or sorry, yeah, he prepared it. Anyway, you can read further about what information was gathered, um, from the investigation and what people found out in the community and then the committee wanted to put forward a couple of recommendations for GMAC ‘s consideration, um, so the first one is that we recommend that the forfeiture provision should be limited to fishing gear and net permits, and the second recommendation is that there should be no $25.00 permit fee \[unclear\] lay net. AA: OK. Would like to ask for a motion for the Commission to draft up a letter with the recommendations from the Lay net Committee. SW: Um, just a second, let me refer back to the Sunshine Law as far as – I believe there needs to be discussion about the recommendations and then if you’re to take action it would be at the next meeting. Let me just double check real quick. AA: Cortney, can you just summarize while Sylva’s looking up… CO: Absolutely. So the two recommendations so for GMAC we’d like to recommend the following: 1) that the forfeiture provision should be limited to fishing gear and net permits and the second recommendation is that they remove the $25.00 fee as part of the registration for lay nets. 35 SW: OK. And then I believe you should probably put for the Commission the reasonings behind those two recommendations. CO: Sure. Yup, the reasoning is based on the feedback received from the community. SW: Is it possible to summarize what they were saying? CO: Ah, yes. \[Unclear\] in our report you can find quotes from members of the community gathered by both Chair Duerr and also Natalie Reynolds who, ah, \[unclear\] the quotes in detail, ah, and additionally, there was testimony that was part of the Department of Aquatic Researches, ah, their process, \[unclear\] and myself and Chair Antonio both observed – it was a Zoom meeting and the majority of the comments were from the public from those testifying for that they did not want basically to have their ice boxes being charged to access their ice box basically. SW: Thank you. I think as far as the next step goes – we’re now in subsection 1C which would be deliberation of decision making on a matter investigating that needs to occur at the next meeting. AA: So like now is more of a discussion. SW: Now is more of a discussion of the Findings and Recommendations and then any deliberation or decision making on the matter of investigating needs to \[unclear\] and subsequently. AA: OK. Ah, any other, any questions or comments from the Commissioners? RD: Ah, well maybe – great job, Cortney, really nicely done. Ah, Brian Ley had a very interesting observation with what’s – the ones are now being banned for killing sharks – does that apply also to a bang stick and \[unclear\] to the committee that bang sticks are not considered guns by the police department so that may be something that we also want to include as a clarification. BL: Hey, Bob – Brian, District – 4. Hey, I had another discussion with a police officer at the Pahoa Police Station regarding \[unclear\] dispatching a pig next to the school and, ah, he went back and he says now they consider bang sticks \[unclear\] because they’re using basically ammunition and using gas so it is now considered a firearm. So regardless of what they told me years ago – he said they’ve changed the thing and they will consider it a firearm now – so bang sticks would be considered a firearm in dispatching a shark. AA: OK. I guess, Abraham, District – 5. I guess at this time we got to get more clarification on that but we just discussing the lay net rule changes, we didn’t discuss that in the committee, ah, when we formed it about the other rule changes so if we guys like discuss the other rule changes then we can put it on next month’s agenda. BL: Ah, no need. AA: OK. Thanks. Any other discussions about the lay net results from the committee? OK. I just like to say thank you guys for you guys’ work, ah, seems like you guys did a good job… BL: Abraham – quick thing before we wrap it up. 36 AA: Yeah, Brian? BL: Is it possible if we can make a motion to put on next month’s agenda that we allow two people to be determined at a later date to be at the opening ceremonies of the 2023 legislation season that we send two representatives to talk for the opening ceremonies? And the persons to be determined at a later date but just get that cast and moving cause I know with the holidays we might miss a meeting or two – to pick up on the next agenda. AA: If you like put ‘em on the next agenda then like we stated earlier send it over to Barbara and then our attorney got to look at it – look over it – and they going put all their things in so… BL: I appreciate \[unclear\]. AA: So if it makes it on, right on. If it doesn’t, it’s not my fault. OK. Discussion, recommendation… SW: I believe we already addressed that. AA: Yeah, I know. SW: OK. AA: Then we finalized that, um, Committees. I want to make a motion so we can get started on formalizing some legislative workings – what exactly is the verbiage that needs to be discussed within us. SW: I’m sorry Chair, I’m unaware as to what agenda item you are referring to. AA: It’s not on the agenda item, you probably going scold me about that. SW: Yes, I’m sorry. That would have to be put on next month’s agenda. AA: OK. DR: Chair, on number 9 Commissioner Report by District. I’m very interested from hearing from fellow Commissioners of what’s going on around the Island. I think this should be at the head of the meeting and maybe it should be limited to how much time, but I think this is the only time that we are all together that we can discuss things and let information out so it’s just my kuleana on it. AA: That’s a good comment, Bob. Is that something that we – well, I guess when we just create the agenda then we can just move it at that time right? SW: Ah, yes, if, um, yes, it can be reorganized within the agenda, um, since this has been the standard if you guys want to discuss that and vote on it you can make sure that it works that way on the next agenda. What item would you like it to be placed at? AA: Ah, we do the presentations in the beginning just so we can get our guest speakers in and out as timely as possible. So that’s why the presentations has always been in the forefront but, ah, 37 Commissioner Reports by District, that’s a good one to move forward. Any other discussions from the Commissioners about it? BL: Brian, District – 4. I like Bob’s idea. I think maybe we can do it after the main presentation and before we get to Old Business and New Business and that way in case we have something in our Commission Reports that we might want to add on New Business for the next month. AG: Same thing… CO: Agreed, Cortney, District – 8, I support that as well. AA: So that’s right after presentations, right before Old Business – we moving Commissioner Reports by Districts, correct? OK. Anybody like to make a motion – we can just vote on it. SW: I think that it’s administrative now that you’ve discussed it – you can make that decision. AA: OK. RD: Chair, I’d like to make a motion that we adjourn. AA: Ah, before we adjourn we still need Commissioner Reports by District. RD: It’s 4:00 p.m. I gotta go. AA: You can go then, we get da kine ah… RD: Aloha, it’s been a lot of… AA: …. still make quorum, yeah, thanks, Bob. RD: Good night, cheers. SW: I will note that your agenda does say that you’re gonna have to adjourn at 4:00 p.m. COMMISSIONER REPORT BY DISTRICT: AA: So you’re just pushing it along? Any Commissioners have anything to report? If not, then we can make a motion to adjourn. LT: Leomana, District – 3. Um there’s been an uptake after that last fire on Pohakuloa that nobody who created, um, there’s a lot of game animals running into the Hilo side of the border and talking to the policemen in the area there is a lot more traffic accidents caused by wild game animals running into the Hilo District because of the fire. 300% up from normal and that’s it. AA: Any other Commissioner Reports? OK. 38 AG: Hey, Abraham, Austin, District – 6. I spoke to Maurice Honaunau boat ramp issue he said we can talk with the other Commissioners and figure out the wordings for the signs to go on down there at the Honaunau Boat Ramp and he’ll get ‘em printed up and installed. AA: Abraham, District – 5. Commissioners meaning us GMAC Commissioners or the commissioners down in your guys, cause I know there’s other community members running down there, yeah? AG: Yes, he told me to talk it over with you guys first and then I’ll go to them. AA: OK. Get ahold of Barbara after and then we can put ‘em on next month’s agenda. AG: OK. Sounds good. AA: Thanks. AG: And then, um, that petition you gave me I also have it in one of our stores down South Kona and it’s got a few pages on it already signed. ADJOURNMENT: AA: Roger. OK. A motion to adjourn at 4:04 p.m. LT: Leomana, District – 3. I’d like to set a motion to adjourn the meeting at 4:04 p.m. CO: Cortney, I second. AA: All in favor? Aye. Have a goodnight. Thank you, guys. BK: Bye guys… PAU 39 40