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Hawaii Fire Commission <br /> Regular Session Minutes <br /> January 26, 2023 <br /> Page 5 <br /> Commissioner Mattos said going back to the argument regarding Fire/EMS, the <br /> problem is that they come in as a paramedic, and they get a ranking, whereas a <br /> firefighter, their alternative is to get promoted to FEO. All the time that they're on the <br /> job, they're TAing into the engine, but they don't get any points, but when they take <br /> the test, the FMS guy who has no time on the engine gets points. Chief Todd stated <br /> he understands and agrees. He further explained it's difficult because making any <br /> major changes requires a union consult. One of the issues is with the point system, <br /> which is entirely based on ease of math because it's easier to add everything up in <br /> the end. The reality is, do you think a Fire Rescue Specialist, Fire Hazmat specialist, <br /> or Fire Medical Specialist is getting twice the experience as a firefighter? Not really, <br /> but does he think they should get some additional points for doing harder, more <br /> challenging work and having more knowledge? He does. The same argument <br /> applies to Hazmat and Rescue, they get extra points because they have extra <br /> knowledge. It's a mixture of different aspects, it's something he would like to address <br /> and open up for a conversation with the union, but he hasn't had the time. <br /> Chair Kosaki asked what about allocating some points to people who TA as drivers <br /> etc. Chief Todd stated it would be entirely fair, he agrees with the concept but has no <br /> idea how they would account for TA times. He further explained one of the thoughts <br /> thrown out there was a cap. If you're going for FEO there's a cap of 24 points from <br /> T&E, you could get it through education, or a position. Other opportunities would be <br /> offered to get points such as attending the National Fire Academy or passing a <br /> course, etc. <br /> Commissioner Magsalin asked if paramedics make more money than firefighters. <br /> Chief Todd stated potentially, the paramedic is one of the positions in the <br /> department where if you want to work, you could probably make more money than <br /> anyone else. There are paramedics in the department that make more than the <br /> chief. <br /> Commissioner Magsalin asked if he sees more females applying for the paramedic <br /> position. Chief Todd stated he doesn't have exact numbers, but in his opinion, there <br /> seems to be a higher percentage of women who are interested in going to the <br /> paramedic side than men. They currently only have eight women in the department. <br /> He's hopeful that having this other route encourages more women to join the <br /> department. He feels the department has to change and grow and deal with the <br /> times that are today. One of the big pushes was to split the budget, where the EMS <br /> money isn't under Fire. The Fire Department is a combination of four departments; a <br /> volunteer dept., a fire dept., an EMS dept., and an ocean safety dept. and he wants <br /> all these departments funded appropriately. <br /> Chair Kosaki stated that fire-based EMS is very valuable. Throughout history, it has <br /> been shown to be important in many instances where a firefighter who is a <br /> paramedic can provide help. If it's separated it would be no different from Maui, <br /> Oahu, and Kauai where they have private ambulances. Chief Todd stated to clarify, <br />