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the other phases of the project and has specified what their intent is with respect to those phases.
<br />I’ll point out that Mr. Clapp has received notice of these applications as an owner who is within 300
<br />feet of the project area and is interested in the project, because it’s difficult for an agency to parcel
<br />out, or segment, a project in order to avoid public input, particularly in the context of an SMA
<br />permit where one of the fundamental tenets of the SMA law is to encourage public participation in
<br />the planning and execution processes. So we had, we had, you know, proposed to the Department
<br />of Public Works a condition to this SMA permit that simply said that in the, that they will do a
<br />supplemental EIS and another SMA permit before they proceed with the design of the lower
<br />section, but they haven’t responded to that proposed condition. And that’s why we are here. I
<br />mean, if, if the Commission would agree to put a permit condition in this permit that says that
<br />Public Works will be required to do a supplemental EIS and required to do an SMA permit before
<br />proposing modifications to the intersection between La‘aloa and Ali‘i Drive, we’d be pau. Because
<br />he doesn’t have to do it now, but he does have to, he feels he has to have the opportunity to do it.
<br />And if they are not willing to commit to do it, to do that kind of assessment and further permit in the
<br />future, then we’ll do it now.
<br />
<br />GIFFIN: Well, that was going to be my next question. You know, have you or Mr. Clapp,
<br />communicated with Public Works at all regarding this, and what kind of feedback did Public Works
<br />give you and/or Mr. Clapp?
<br />
<br />VITOUSEK: Well, you know, this has evolved rather quickly, and so, to be fair to Public Works,
<br />you know, we haven’t had a lot of time to communicate. But I have given a, I’ve given Mr. Clapp’s
<br />position and I have given a draft condition to Public Works, and I have not received their response
<br />to the drat condition.
<br />
<br />GIFFIN: Oh, okay. Could you give us some time sequence – how long ago was that?
<br />
<br />VITOUSEK: I gave them the draft condition yesterday.
<br />
<br />GIFFIN: Oh, okay -.
<br />
<br />VITOUSEK: I got a request, I got a request if, for a statement of our position and whether there
<br />was anything we can negotiate yesterday, and I gave them a draft condition yesterday.
<br />
<br />GIFFIN: Okay, okay.
<br />
<br />VITOUSEK: So my, you know, my main concern -. And in fact, you know, I mean my main
<br />concern is really that, you know, Mr. Clapp does not want to have to be involved in a contested case
<br />hearing; he doesn’t want to, you know, be in a position to slow this down or prevent it from going
<br />forward. But, you know, like the other people who testified, there’s some issues there, hanging out
<br />there, that he wants to be addressed before the project started, because once you start, it’s kind of
<br />hard to go back and get them to be clear on things. And he just takes a different tact to that, you
<br />know; he just says that, you know, if we can’t reach an agreement on it, then we’ll go to a contested
<br />case.
<br />
<br />GIFFIN: Commissioners, any other questions of Mr. Vitousek?
<br />
<br />VITOUSEK: If I may, just so you understand, Gene Clapp’s mother is Millicent Maud Greenwell
<br />Clapp, and so that’s one of the Greenwell family who -. His mother married on the mainland,
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<br />EXHIBIT B
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