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minutes 02-09-00Page 9 of 41
<br />TYLER: Absolutely.
<br />SANTANGELO: But in the process of taking out a certain in-product, then it does make it a little easier, but it can’t be a
<br />knee jerk thing. It still takes time and the time line that requires some thought, so that it can’t occur in one meeting and end in
<br />one meeting. So, that was just part of it.
<br />TYLER: Good, well, I’m glad to hear the performance based concept.
<br />SANTANGELO: And it’s up to them.
<br />TYLER: Because on the Mandatory Program Review, this was, sort of, what was in my mind, as in the background of this,
<br />was it’s performance based. It’s outcome based, so how do we determine what we set out to do is accomplished, and how do
<br />we measure this, because frequently in government, we don’t do this. And so I’m glad you brought that up because, to the
<br />extent that we can incorporate that kind of language in our Charter in terms of performance based budgeting, that really
<br />makes a lot of sense to me.
<br />SANTANGELO: But can you imagine, Curtis, that you’re hiring a Chief, you’re sitting on that Commission and one of your
<br />criteria in this performance base is that ‘I will reduce public complaint by X amount and here’s how I plan to do it’. Public
<br />complaint doesn’t go down. You bring your Chief in and you’re having this discussion about why, and a lot of things can
<br />happen in that. But again, that’s up to them, and so that’s why that was left that way.
<br />TYLER: It’s like anything. If you were to go with a County Manager, one of the things that has to be in there is you’ve got to
<br />have a performance based contract, and it’s only as good as the performance measure. So if you have a measure that is not
<br />reflective of a good job or a bad job, but it’s just something that is easy to measure then it becomes ineffective, and you’re
<br />wasting your time because your outcome measure either cannot be measured or it’s measuring something that is really
<br />inconsequential. So that’s the real key to this and that’s the difficult part, and I know members of the public have written to
<br />you regarding that. I think the main thing about the Police Commission and the Fire Commission is they should act
<br />independently. There shouldn’t be a prevalent perception that, rightly or wrongly, they’re working for the Chief or for the
<br />department. Maybe I misunderstand this but, to me, it’s a public Commission of oversight, and I’d like to see it conduct itself
<br />that way and not as some people have said this is a rubber stamp, and we don’t need anymore of that. It’s not helpful for the
<br />Administration, whether it be the Executive Branch or the Fire or the Police Department. It’s not helpful. So whatever we can
<br />do to make this positive, I appreciate it and thank you very much.
<br />HERKES: One more question. I thought of you immediately when we read this Maui Charter and it had a Cost of
<br />Government Commission, and I hope you’ll read that because I think that’s right up your alley. We all like that and we’re
<br />going to put that in ours.
<br />TYLER: I have read it and I’m familiar with it. I’ve read all four Charters many, many times. It certainly has worked on
<br />Maui and I know there’s some questions today but nevertheless, anything we can do to make government more efficient and
<br />make best use of the taxpayers’ dollars, I’m in favor of.
<br />HERKES: One other thing. I found our County Charter difficult to understand because the Commissions were not with the
<br />departments that they were overseeing, and so I think that we’ve - Haven’t we made a decision to put them the departments,
<br />or if we haven’t, I’ll make a motion later on that they have the Commissions with the departments, so that you have a
<br />complete entity of the Commission and the department and the Department Head.
<br />TYLER: I think that’s a good idea because you’re not searching all over, where is this thing. If you do that, keep that other, I
<br />think it’s 13-4 so that the line in each of the department areas will say ‘and their appointments will be accordance with
<br />Section 13-4', so that everyone follows the same procedure, so it’s not like this one has at-large seats and this one has - Do
<br />that, please. I think it’ll make it much simpler. Thank you again, Aloha.
<br />RAY: Jim Otterson.
<br />OTTERSON: This is my friend and co-worker, Bob Barry. Have any of you changed ideas on this manager type?
<br />HERKES: Everybody changed their ideas.
<br />OTTERSON: Pardon?
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