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defined as "counsel retained to represent the County" and not include in the definition those cases where we have to hire people to represent individuals. That's pretty complex stuff and I'm sure there's questions and I'll be glad to answer them. RAY: Ms. Irvine. IRVINE: I wonder why should it take two-thirds a vote of the County Council for you to hire an outside person in the first place, for any reason? WURDEMAN: I don't know. That's what it currently reads. HERKES: So if you're caught in between the Union and the Council - WURDEMAN: And the Police Commission. HERKES: And the Police Commission, or Parks and Rec, or somewhere else and other places - WURDEMAN: The Police Commission, that's set up in State law. State law also has a provision for firefighters which says that when a firefighter is acting within the course of scope of his employment, counsel will be provided but it doesn't say how • that's determined, who decides that. Most of the Union Contracts say the same thing. They say course of scope, we provide counsel and that's fine. I agree with that. It's proper. But when you get into an argument about whether the gray area, when a person is on the edge of course of scope, that's when we get into a difficult situation. For example, if the Union would come to us and say look, we think this guy was in the course of scope, we're going to grieve it. We say no he wasn't. Then we get into a discussion. Meanwhile the case is moving along. I mean, is the person going to get a lawyer or not and we say, well, all right, we agree with the Union. We'll provide a lawyer. Then we go to the Council and they turn us down. Then what? Real potential for crisis there. IRVINE: Is "special counsel" something defined or would it be better just to say that counsel may authorize the employment of additional counsel for any matter presenting a real necessity for such employment? WURDEMAN: Well, "special counsel" - IRVINE: Is that a term? WURDEMAN: Is commonly used to mean someone outside the office. HERKES: Just like a special prosecutor.