HomeMy WebLinkAbout2018-10-09 Salary Commission MinutesPage 1
TRANSCRIPT OF PROCEEDINGS
SALARY COMMISSION MEETING
Held at the Hawaii County Building, 25 Aupuni Street,
Hilo, Hawaii, 96720, commencing at 9:31 a.m., on
October 9, 2018.
REPORTED BY: TERI HOSKINS, RMR, CSR #452
ISLAND COURT REPORTING & TRANSCRIPTION SERVICES
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APPEARANCES
CHAIR:
HUGH Y. ONO, P. E.
BOARD MEMBERS:
FLORENCE K. IKEDA, VICE -CHAIR
THOMAS E. FRATINARDO
GEORGE W. CAMPBELL
JAMES W. HIGGINS
MILTON PAVAO, P. E.
HAROLD D. DOW, M. D.
NELSON H. HARANO
ALSO PRESENT:
AMY SELF, DEPUTY CORPORATION COUNSEL
WILLIAM V. BRILHANTE,JR., EX -OFFICIO
MEMBER
GLYNIS YAMADA
JENNIFER SAKAMOTO
MICHELE LAMKIN
PAULA PAVAO
NANCY COOK-LAUER
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1 CHR. ONO: Call the meeting to order.
2 Okay. Good morning, everybody.
3 First of all, before we start, there's a
4 sheet of paper that has salary information on it, and
5 it was just distributed. I just received it this
6 morning. It's from the Department of Human Resources.
7 So we're going to be talking about this today.
8 Probably going to take it out of order to some degree
9 because Bill has someplace he has to run off for about
10 a half -an -hour. So, anyway, just to bring it to your
11 attention so that we can look at it as we're going
12 through the agenda. (SEE ATT. A)
13 So, let me see. The meeting has been called
14 to order. Let's do a roll call vote. This time let's
15 start on -- Bill, did you want to say something?
16 MR. BRILHANTE: I see people fumbling through
17 papers, so I just wanted to let the Commissioners know
18 that that report is in your green folder. Tom and
19 Nelson, it's in your green folder.
20 MR. HARANO: Yep.
21 MS. SELF: Should be right on the top.
22 CHR. ONO: Right. Observant, yeah, you.
23 MR. HIGGINS: Oh, man.
24 CHR. ONO: Okay. So George was complaining to
25 me because we always start the roll call on that side,
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1 so --
2 MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah, I'm feeling left out.
3 CHR. ONO: -- we'll start with George now.
4 MR. CAMPBELL: George Campbell, Ka'u,
5 present.
6 MR. HIGGINS: Jim Higgins, 7.
7 MR. PAVAO: Milton Pavao, 4, I think. 4. 4
8 or 5.
9 CHR. ONO: Hugh Ono, District 3.
10 MS. IKEDA: Florence Ikeda, District 2.
11 MR. DOW: Harold Dow, District 5.
12 MR. FRATINARDO: Thomas Fratinardo, District
13 1.
14 MR. HARANO: Nelson Harano, District 6.
15 CHR. ONO: Okay. With that said, we also have
16 Nancy Cook -Lauer from the Tribune -Herald, and we have
17 Teri here, the court reporter, and Paula is there. And
18 you're staff with the --
19 MS. LAMKIN: Michele Lamkin, HR.
20 CHR. ONO: Okay. This morning we have
21 statements from the public.
22 We also have Amy and Bill. Yay.
23 MR. BRILHANTE: Good morning.
24 CHR. ONO: So, we have Mr. Sadegh, and he's
25 representing the Universal Realm of the Lord Almighty.
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1 So with that, would you, Sir, give your statements or
2 statement.
3 MR. SADEGH: Good morning.
4 CHR. ONO: Good morning.
5 MR. SADEGH: My name is Abolghassem Abraham
6 Sadegh, and I am the founder of the Universal Realm of
7 the Lord Almighty. Briefly, I was here in the United
8 States, starting in 1960, going through pilot training
9 for His Majesty. I changed my mind about being in the
10 Air Force, asked for asylum. That was rejected. I
11 returned to Iran and came back. I was here for 15
12 years and then went back to Iran; and this, in a way,
13 was a blessing in terms of my learning and knowing my
14 country and faith.
15 Experienced job -searching for four years and
16 believed that we were going to have democracy, so I
17 joined the revolution before Shah left Iran and before
18 Khomeini came. And the greatest lesson happened when I
19 realized that the ladies sitting up there in their
20 magnificent attire would have to look like Mother
21 Teresa if they go in public and that is hypocrisy.
22 That is absolutely against Islam because it's a lie.
23 50 percent of the public go out -- like during the
24 Shah, my mother would go to mosque. Anyway, she would
25 look like Mother Teresa, and my niece and nephew would
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1 go to a bar or something. So I realized also that the
2 Shiites of Islam, which is 50 percent of the total,
3 about 200 million, is actually a cult.
4 So I started thinking about the new one,
5 and -- by which I may -- when I came back to the states
6 officially registered, and now I call it the Universal
7 Realm of the Lord Almighty, on the true foundation that
8 believing in God is optional. And that makes the whole
9 of humanity my congregation. And believing in humanity
10 is not.
11 With that, this room -- I'm saying with the
12 permission of Mr. Ono -- this room would be full if the
13 people knew that this meeting is taking place. You
14 have a very strange newspaper. It's actually a
15 money -making machine and not really the kind of thing
16 that Mr. Jefferson was talking about, that, you know,
17 "I would choose newspapers if I had a choice between
18 that and the government."
19
There are two pages
that -- per week
that has
20
every event -- really two full
pages, maybe.
I even
21
counted them; I think it was in
the hundreds.
Maybe
22
Nancy can clarify that.
And then yours was
just a
23
small item in there. I
mean, anything that
happens in
24
the island for the next
couple of weeks: the
meeting,
25 the dances, the music, the mountain -climbing, the
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1 volcano, and whatever, and yours was just an item in
2 between. That's why this room is empty.
3 CHR. ONO: Mr. Sadegh, your question had to do
4 with how the announcements are made?
5 MR. SADEGH: My question has to do that in
6 today's paper, almost one-fifth of the first page,
7 which is the most important one, was taken about two
8 people and a horse -- really the first page -- that
9 became homeless; and yours is just one item that I ran
10 into by accident because, although I hate those two
11 pages, I'm not involved in everything that happens, and
12 I don't -- well, they do it just --
13 CHR. ONO: So your question is how is
14 announcement made, because --
15 MR. SADEGH: The announcement is this
16 announcement should be made so the public sees it.
17 It's very important that it would be on page 1.
18 CHR. ONO: Yes, Sir, that is your opinion, but
19 there is a legal requirement as far as public
20 notification of this meeting. Is that what you want to
21 ask about?
22 MR. SADEGH: Well, yes. I'm saying that the
23 notification should not go with the other items on a
24 two -page -full -- where people hardly see it because if
25 the public -- I assure you if the public was aware,
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1 especially with all the controversies happening last
2 year and this year, this room would be full. Probably
3 nobody saw that. Nobody cared for it. And who is
4 responsible? Then that is something that needs to be
5 taken care of.
6 CHR. ONO: Okay. Well, Bill, are you able to
7 say how we publicize the notice? Either you or Amy?
8 MR. BRILHANTE: The Office of Information
9 Practices requires that we publish the notice
10 electronically. We also place -- Glynis, you can
11 correct me if I'm wrong -- a hard copy on the front of
12 the County building as required by the statute and the
13 regulations. And we're in compliance, every meeting,
14 six days prior to. That's how we do it.
15 CHR. ONO: So we have a procedure that we have
16 to follow, and we are following that procedure.
17 MR. SADEGH: I realize that, Sir, but what
18 needs to be done to see if it could be changed, that
19 you would make -- or someone would make a
20 recommendation that this is not correct.
21 MR. FRATINARDO: Mr. Ono, can I make a
22 comment?
23 I am a radio announcer for 90.3 FM. We're an
24 educational radio station. So the month preceding
25 these meetings when I'm on air, which is normally in
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1 the morning from 6:00 to 8:00, during rush hour, I
2 announce it at least two times during my radio
3 broadcast. And that's not just this particular
4 meeting, but other meetings also and other PSAs; and
5 people can bring PSAs, and we read them for free.
6 So, just to let you know, during my broadcast hour I
7 will announce the actual meetings. And I'm encountered
8 by people at the mall or at Starbucks, for example,
9 that know that this meeting has occurred, and they're
10 complaining to me, and I'll ask them, "Why didn't you
11 show up?" And they just didn't want to take the time
12 to come over here. And I hear what you're saying, the
13 lack of attendance, but --
14 MR. SADEGH: I've never listened to the
15 radio, with due respect, that you're mentioning. What
16 I'm saying is that Hawaii Tribune Herald gets -- the
17 public gets to see that. The public gets -- even if
18 they don't read it, they may -- should see it in the
19 upper half of the first page, which is the most
20 important one.
21 And I'm not questioning what it is now; I'm
22 suggesting that it could be different in the future.
23 CHR. ONO: We'll take that into consideration,
24 but our Deputy Corporation Counsel has a comment.
25 MR. SADEGH: Thank you very much.
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MS.
SELF:
You may want to contact the
2
newspaper because
we
are not responsible for how
3
things appear
in the
newspaper. That's the newspaper.
4
We don't control
--
5
MR.
SADEGH:
You -- somebody pays for that,
6
right?
7
MS.
SELF:
No, we're not --
8
MR.
SADEGH:
Am I correct?
9
MS.
SELF:
We don't require --
10
MR.
SADEGH:
You don't pay them --
11
MS.
SELF:
We're not required --
12
MR.
SADEGH:
Then --
13
MS.
SELF:
-- to by Sunshine Law.
14
MR.
SADEGH:
-- I would -- if you really want
15
the people to
know, you
put it somewhere where people
16
like I do -- I
read the
paper every morning. I see the
17
paper every morning,
and then I look at the internet.
18
All I'm saying
is that
the newspaper would be most
19
effective if you
really
want the people to be here. I
20
was here in the
last
December's meeting that you
21
almost -- you
know, you
were furious because of Lee
22
Loy's recommendation
about an amendment and 1.2 million
23
raises.
24
CHR.
ONO: Mr. Sadegh, we'll take your
25 recommendation under consideration today.
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1 And you had another thing you wanted to
2 address?
3 MR. SADEGH: Another thing for me because of
4 my faith, believe it or not, I've been being persecuted
5 for eight years, the likes of which I have never
6 experienced in my life. And I have literally lived in
7 six countries, including Holland, as an invited
8 political refugee.
9 We need to take this island as a corporation,
10 concern about every single human being. I would not
11 give a penny raise to the police chief, whom I have
12 called Mafia head, Paul K. Ferreira, I believe it is.
13 And this is my only way of saying things. I'm saying
14 every human being can be the savior in what they do:
15 fight injustice, help yourself and others, and do no
16 harm.
17 The police department uses the most
18 vulnerable to do its job, like my being attacked on
19 Highway 19 with drug addicts and leading -- at least
20 that's one of them -- to two brain surgeries within ten
21 days and being watched every moment of the day.
22 MR. PAVAO: Excuse me, Mr. Chairman. This
23 has nothing to do with the Salary Commission.
24 MR. SADEGH: I'm talking about Salary
25 Commission.
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1 I would not give a penny to the mayor, to
2 the -- and also I consider our County a police state,
3 and I consider our County an oligarchy and run by the
4 top 1 percent, like the whole island owns by the
5 highest people.
6 And, also, you mentioned that nothing but
7 politics -- no public organization, public commission,
8 should have 100 percent authority. The amendment would
9 create a little crack and really made you guys very
10 angry.
11 And also giving the Corporation Counsel the
12 highest level of salary. He surely does not deserve
13 it. It looks -- as I say, it's like a family looking
14 after itself. I'm saying that we need to deal with our
15 island. We want to know what is going on in Maui or
16 anybody else, and someone mentioned county council,
17 that they were really happy with the raise you gave
18 them, that, oh, people -- someone from New Zealand
19 said, "Oh, what a different salary you're getting." We
20 don't care. This is an island. This is our home. We
21 listen to what's going on, and we decide in a way that
22 nobody would come and sit here and accuse this island
23 of being -- which is God's paradise -- as being a
24 police state and oligarchy. That's what I'm saying.
25 And also the Mayor. My God, he must be a
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1 millionaire, which is fine; be a billionaire if it's
2 not at the expense of others. But talking initially,
3 oh, the County member -- this was what he said --
4 CHR. ONO: Okay, Mr. --
5 MR. SADEGH: -- average County --
6 CHR. ONO: Can you wrap it up, Mr. --
7 MR. SADEGH: Yes, Sir.
8 CHR. ONO: Okay, thank you.
9 MR. SADEGH: Yes.
10 This is his statement. "Do you know that
11 there is" -- this is Mr. Mayor. "Do you know that
12 there are people here that are making only $18,000 a
13 year?" And up to that point, I had great respect for
14 him because of the way he runs his elections. And then
15 he's in the list for 33,000 raise.
16 CHR. ONO: Okay. Thank you, Sir.
17 MR. SADEGH: Thank you.
18 CHR. ONO: Okay. There's no other speakers
19 that I'm aware of.
20 Okay. With that, let's move on to the
21 agenda. The approval of the minutes. There are none
22 to approve.
23 Let me go through the communications first.
24 There is a memorandum from the Salary Commission Chair,
25 myself, to Charter Commission Chair Douglass Shipman
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1 Adams dated September 19th, 2018, responding to the
2 request for input concerning the Hawaii County Charter,
3 and also an e-mail message from the Charter Commission
4 dated October 1st, acknowledging receipt of the
5 Commission's output. (SEE ATTS. B AND C)
6 As you recall, it was that our communication
7 expressed some concerns or some items with respect to
8 the charter commission amendment having to do with the
9 way we conduct business.
10 And so, I would recommend that we just file
11 this. So, unless there's any discussion, may I have a
12 motion to file this?
13 MR. PAVAO: So moved.
14 MS. IKEDA: Second.
15 CHR. ONO: Moved by Milton, seconded by
16 Florence.
17 Any discussion?
18 All those in favor say "Aye."
19 (All members responded affirmatively.)
20 CHR. ONO: That memorandum and the response
21 are filed.
22 Also there's item No. 2, Summary of Chair
23 Ono's discussion with Susan Dursin of the League of
24 Women Voters. She contacted me and we contacted her,
25 and our discussion had to do with she had read or was
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1 informed about our position or some of our responses to
2 the Charter Commission, so she had questions about -- we
3 had a real lengthy conversation. It was very good, very
4 informative, and, you know, I was able to provide her
5 with some information. And so, basically what I did was
6 I recorded that in terms of like a memo for the record
7 so we could just have something on file. (SEE ATT. D)
8 So unless there are any questions on that,
9 can I have a motion to file that too?
10 MR. HIGGINS: I have just a question,
11 procedurally.
12 For you in the future and future chairman and
13 chairpersons and us as we sit here right now, am I to
14 assume by this that if somebody contacted any one of us
15 or you in the future, that off the record you are to
16 respond?
17 CHR. ONO: Oh, that's a question?
18 MR. HIGGINS: That's a question, yeah.
19 CHR. ONO: Yeah. I don't think I was
20 responding to any questions of policy by her. It was
21 more information because it was like a recap of what
22 we had done in the past.
23 MR. HIGGINS: Yeah. Yeah, I understand that.
24 I have, obviously, full confidence in what you did
25 because common courtesy would have responded to her;
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1 but today the world is obsessed with transparency,
2 obsessed with having everything up front, and I'm just
3 wondering if your discussion and then your response by
4 this memo might someday come back to bite you or us.
5 Because what it boils down to -- to me reading this
6 memo, I have full faith that that's exactly what
7 happened, but we've seen and witnessed recently what's
8 going on in our Capitol. What one person thinks
9 happened and what another person thinks happened may
10 not be entirely true.
11 So, all I'm saying is that, if Nancy -- and sh
12 would never do this, but what if Nancy called me up at
13 home and wanted to discuss something? Or the Rotary
14 chairman? Or anybody else? I would not take that
15 call. I would refer that to coming to our meetings,
16 looking -- or talking directly to you - and, hopefully,
17 you would do the same thing.
18 So, I'm just throwing out a warning that it
19 may be a precedence of receiving calls from outside
20 that is not at our meeting, or that person is not in
21 attendance at our meeting, that we might be aware of
22 that.
23
CHR.
ONO: Yeah, you know, that's
a good
24
question, Jim.
It really is, because it's maybe
25
something that
we should incorporate just
because the
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1 way the world is what it is today.
2 So, any comment from Amy or Bill?
3 MR. HIGGINS: Well, can I just --
4 CHR. ONO: Yeah, go ahead.
5 MR. HIGGINS: -- follow up a little bit more?
6 Because this has to do with the charter, and
7 that's a big change. That's a real big deal. So let's
8 just say that this was more controversial and she went
9 before Mr. Shipman and said, you know, "I did meet" --
10 "I had a phone conversation with Mr. Ono, but we didn't
11 say that. We didn't talk about that" or "That
12 particular point was not what I understood it to be."
13 Well, then what happens? You know, then the whole
14 thing -- that's all I'm saying.
15 CHR. ONO: No, I understand.
16 MR. HIGGINS: Yeah.
17 And then my second follow-up to that is, Amy,
18 on your memo, why is any of it redacted? Why should
19 there be any blackouts at all?
20 MS. SELF: I don't know what -- I didn't
21 black it out, so I --
22 MR. HIGGINS: Well, who did?
23 MR. PAVAO: E-mails.
24 MR. BRILHANTE: Our office, Department of HR,
25 redacted it because it had personal information
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1 regarding Mr. Ono's private e-mail, so that's the reason
2 we redacted that.
3 MR. HIGGINS: Oh, okay.
4 MR. BRILHANTE: Because now this is a public
5 document.
6
MS.
SELF: Yeah.
reason the "From" was
7
MR.
PAVAO: Why is "To"
redacted?
8
MR.
BRILHANTE: That was
the e-mail of the
9
requester.
And
the reason the "To" was
10
MR.
HIGGINS: Oh, now --
requester's private
11
MR.
BRILHANTE: Private
information.
12
MR.
HIGGINS: -- that's
--
13
MS.
SELF: Why would that
be private?
14
CHR.
ONO: I don't think
Jim heard that.
15
MR.
HIGGINS: No. What
is the answer to
16 that?
17
MR. BRILHANTE:
The
reason the "From" was
18
redacted is that was Mr.
Ono's
private e-mail account.
19
MR. HIGGINS:
Yeah.
20
MR. BRILHANTE:
And
the reason the "To" was
21
redacted is because that
was the
requester's private
22
e-mail account.
23
MR. HIGGINS:
Okay.
I didn't know that
24
was -- we don't have classifications
of top secret and
25 confidential and all of that, so if this is a memo
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1 that's going into the records and it's a memo for this
2 meeting, for the members of this Commission to see, I
3 don't understand why anything should be redacted.
4 MS. SELF: It's under Sunshine Law. It's a
5 right to privacy. And so, I don't know if a private
6 e-mail address is confidential or not. I would have to
7 check.
8 MR. FRATINARDO: May I ask a question? You
9 know, if this is going to be an issue, then perhaps the
10 Chair and the Vice -Chair have a County e-mail rather
11 than a --
12 MR. BRILHANTE: And that's the slippery slope
13 is there's been requests in the past. Just remember
14 that each of you are serving in a volunteer capacity;
15 you're not official officers of the County. So that's
16 been the position from IT Department with giving out
17 commissioners and board members, you know, County
18 e-mails, because there's an association with that that
19 they're acting in an official capacity when that e-mail
20 is being used.
21 So, in this case, Amy is correct. Ms. Self is
22 correct in that under the Sunshine Law or the privacy
23 law, there's no specific requirement that individuals'
24 personal e-mail account is deemed private. Their phone
25 numbers, their addresses, and all documentation that
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1 the County issues, we protect the individual's privacy;
2 so oftentimes you'll see in a police report just a
3 reference to "A 43 -year-old male was injured," you
4 know, at such -and -such accident until consent is given
5 by the party. And so, that's why there's generalized
6 terms used because of those privacy issues. And we
7 did the same thing here out of an abundance of caution.
8 We didn't have any consent to release either of the
9 e-mail addresses. That's the only reason.
10 We're not trying to hide anything or cloak
11 and daggers. The primary discussion here regarded the
12 contents of the e-mail, and I can tell you the "From
13 Hugh Ono" was his private email address, and the "To,"
14 the reason that was redacted was because it was a
15 private e-mail address of the requester.
16 MS. SELF: And this is available to the
17 public, so --
18 MR. BRILHANTE: It is now.
19 MS. SELF: -- if anyone from the public was
20 here and requested a copy of this, we'd have to turn it
21 over. So, that's why it's redacted.
22 MR. PAVAO: I would like to add one comment
23 based on giving e-mails, County e-mails. I totally agre
24 with what Mr. Higgins said earlier. There should be no
25 reason for anybody to contact any one of us
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1 individually other than at this meeting. I don't -- in
2 fact --
3 CHR. ONO: I think --
4 MR. PAVAO: -- I don't think it's a good
5 idea.
6 CHR. ONO: Let me say I would suggest we put
7 this on as a discussion item for at a future meeting
8 because it has policy implications.
9 And just a summary of how this happened, it
10 was referred to me by the Department of Human Resources
11 that this query came in, and I said I would be glad to
12 talk to her. And after my discussion, which I was
13 happy about, I thought that, you know, since this is
14 Commission business, my intent here was to let the
15 Commission know the content of the discussion purely
16 for information.
17 MR. HIGGINS: Terrific.
18 CHR. ONO: No, I know there's nothing wrong
19 with that, but we have a policy implication over here
20 which is really -- I think it's important.
21 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
22 CHR. ONO: So with the Commission's permission
23 I would like to put it on as a discussion item at our
24 next meeting on how we handle this.
25 MR. FRATINARDO: Just a part of our rules.
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1 Add it to our rules.
2 CHR. ONO: It could possibly be, sure.
3 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
4 CHR. ONO: Because we will inevitably
5 get queries from different people. It may come to
6 me; it could come to any one of you. So it would be
7 nice to have maybe a uniform way of handling this.
8 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes. Yes.
9 MS. SELF: Chair, one thing I could suggest
10 Is because I know there were documents where this
11 information came from, so maybe the next time it would
12 be better to refer the person to HR, then they could
13 provide the documents that provide the information to
14 this person requesting because I know all of this
15 information exists, so, you know, maybe they could just
16 contact the secretary for the Salary Commission to get
17 that information in the future.
18 CHR. ONO: Uh-huh.
19 Anyway, I think it deserves a special
20 discussion on how we -- because we will get asked from
21 different places. Okay?
22 Does that sound okay? Okay, so we'll put it
23 on the agenda for a future meeting.
24 Okay. Let me see. We're going to take
25 something out of order, and that would be --
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1 We need a motion to close that file. Thank
2 you, Glynis.
3 We need a motion to file that last item,
4 summary of the Chair Ono's discussion.
5 MR. PAVAO: So moved.
6 CHR. ONO: Milton moved it.
7 MS. IKEDA: Second.
8 CHR. ONO: Florence seconded.
9 All those in favor say "Aye."
10 (All members responded affirmatively.)
11 CHR. ONO: Okay. Motion is carried.
12 Okay, we're going to take an item out of
13 order here. That would be "Unfinished Business," and
14 that would be item C, "Suggested salary adjustments as
15 recommended by the Department of Human Resources." And
16 let me recap this. At the last meeting, we asked that
17 the Department of Human Resources make a recommendation
18 for their suggested salaries for the positions under
19 our jurisdiction to become effective on July 1st. And
20 in doing so, the background is to recommend them taking
21 into consideration the private sector, the other
22 jurisdictions throughout the state of Hawaii, and also
23 the inversion salary factor.
24 So, with that in mind, this document was
25 received this morning, prepared by the Department of
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1 Human Resources. And what we would hope to do with
2 this is to use this information "as is" or with
3 recommended changes for our actions that we're going to
4 be taking in the future. (SEE ATT. A)
5 So with that, let me turn it over to Bill to
6 provide the explanation.
7 MR. BRILHANTE: Thank you very much, Chair
8 Ono.
9 Just as a cautionary note, I need to leave
10 here in about 15 minutes, at quarter after, then I will
11 be gone for about 30 minutes, then I will return after
12 a presentation that I have to give.
13 As far as the document itself, that's
14 correct. The Chair accurately reflected what our
15 department was requested, was to come up with
16 recommendation regarding addressing salaries for
17 department heads and deputies and appointed elected
18 officials.
19 So, with that in mind, I didn't want to make
20 a firm recommendation. What I did was we took a look,
21 and I tasked my department, and I said, "Okay, let's
22 look at the contract language for our mid-level
23 managers, what their current contracts will be moving
24 forward to July lst of year 2019."
25 And, with that in mind, we came up with the
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1 contract language, the proposed -- well, the actual
2 raises under contract for our mid-level managers is a
3 2.25
percent annual
increase for mid-level managers.
4 And
that's called an
across-the-board salary increase;
5 so everybody gets 2.25 percent. And also on an annual
6 basis, they will get what is called a within -range
7 progression for the year, and that's approximately
8 $2,580 per employee. It's kind of like their longevity
9 or seniority pay that they will get annually.
10 And so, with that in mind, the union, what
11 they do under the union contract, is generally they
12
give
percentage
increases, 2.25 percent.
You
see, I'm
13
not
a big fan of
that because what that
does
is when
14 you give somebody making $140,000 a 2.25 percent raise
15 and you give somebody making $80,000 a 2.25 percent,
16 there's a significant difference in the two levels, the
17 amount of salary there. And what happens is I've
18 noticed it -- and I see it significantly. Like the
19
Fire Department,
as the years go
by,
that
gap never
20
narrows; it just
gets wider and
wider
and
wider with
21 each annual percentage raise.
22 So, with that in mind, what I recommend is
23 that we came up with a proposed increase of a flat
24 rate. So the suggestion, the recommendation, is that
25 there would be to give all of the department heads,
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1 deputies, appointed and elected officials a flat raise
2 comparable to what the average of the mid-level
3 managers are getting along with their across-the-board
4 raises and their within -range progression, their
5 longevity pay. So that figure came out to -- for
6 department heads and deputies, that's a $5,641 figure,
7 and for the deputies it's a $5,359 figure.
8 And if you look at the column, the two
9 columns on the left is what the current salary is --
10 the non -highlighted columns -- for department heads and
11 deputies, mayor, managing director, counsel, going all
12 the way down. We have it batched in three groupings.
13 And then the highlighted area is always a point of
14 contention.
15 The first column on the left of the
16 highlighted area is the highest-paid subordinate. So
17 that's a senior manager in each of the departments that
18 are noted department heads or deputies. So that's the
19 salaries reflected per each department.
20 The next column, the middle column of that
21 highlighted area, is the proposed department heads,
22 deputy, mayor, and council members, with the flat
23 $5,641 raise.
24 And then the final column on the right is the
25 proposed deputy salary, with a $5,359. And if you look
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1 at that, there's still four departments that we still
2 have inversion as it relates to the deputies' salaries.
3 So all of our department heads with this
4 proposed raise would be -- they would not be subject to
5 inversion, but we still would have four deputies who
6 would be subject to inversion.
7 So, that's the proposed. It's up to you. I
8 can't make a recommendation as to whether or not you
9 should pass the raises or approve the raises; all I can
10 do is provide you with information and, you, in your
11 individual capacity, discuss and you consider and you
12 make a determination as to what you are going to do.
13 I'm not saying we should grant raises; I'm just saying
14 in a comparison of what the other County employees are
15 making, this is where we would be.
16 CHR. ONO: Let me recapture something.
17 One of the reasons we did this is that the
18 Chair's opinion is that the Department of Human
19 Resources is the best source for this information,
20 being that he handles negotiations and other pay
21 scales.
22 The second thing that we wanted to do is the
23 intent of this is to discuss raises now that could
24 possibly go into effect the beginning of the next
25 fiscal year, which is July lst of 2019. And by doing
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1 so, whatever we adopt presently could be included as
2 part of the County's budget process and approval
3 process; so I think that lends itself to much more
4 openness than what we have done in the past.
5 Anyway, that was the intent with doing that.
6 So, with that said, any questions of Bill as
7 he walks away?
8 MS. SELF: He's checking on this one amount.
9 CHR. ONO: George?
10 MR. CAMPBELL: Seems to me that -- I wonder
11 if the highest-paid subordinate number is correct.
12 MS. SELF: That's not correct. That's what
13 he's checking now because I know for sure that that is
14 not correct because we have two supervisors that make
15 more than the other deputies. So that would be the
16 highest-paid subordinate.
17 MR. CAMPBELL: And if that's what the
18 non -supervisor individuals make, time for Corp. Counsel
19 to start sharing his raise.
20 CHR. ONO: Oh, George, your question was column
21 No. 3, that 72,500?
22 MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah. Correct. And --
23 CHR. ONO: That appears to be incorrect.
24 MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah. The answer I got is
25 it's incorrect.
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1 MS. SELF: Yeah, he's checking on that now.
2 CHR. ONO: We're having a query on that on what
3 it should be, possibly.
4 MR. CAMPBELL: And the other thing I note,
5 that if we did nothing, there would be three department
6 heads who, as of June of next year, would be also --
7 we've got an inversion, that being Public Works, Park
8 and Recreation, Environmental Management.
9 CHR. ONO: Uh-huh. And as this Commission
10 recalls, that was our primary intent when we did the
11 last round of raises, to address those long -overdue
12 inversions. So from the Chair's standpoint, hopefully,
13 we can stay ahead of it so we don't get into that same
14 thing, but it's a Commission decision in whole.
15 I did want to ask --
16 MR. CAMPBELL: The thing we had -- excuse me.
17 CHR. ONO: Sure.
18 MR. CAMPBELL: The thing we had last time.
19 You know, I like the path that you have taken us down
20 here to give us some numbers to talk about, but the
21 other thing we did last time was to compare against
22 other islands, and I think that would be useful
23 information as well.
24 CHR. ONO: We do have that information. It was
25 handed out quite a while ago.
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1 MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah.
2 CHR. ONO: Because we were discussing this
3 back in May, I think.
4 MR. CAMPBELL: I know. And my point with
5 that is do we have anything that shows, I guess, next
6 June? The numbers we had were from the past, so...
7 MR. BRILHANTE: Sorry, I'm on the phone with
8 my assistant. I'm trying to get the accurate figure
9 for the Corporation Counsel.
10 MR. CAMPBELL: Right.
11 MR. BRILHANTE: But as far as your question,
12 Commissioner Campbell, currently there's no proposed
13 raises for any of the other jurisdictions. They are in
14 discussions. Between my communication with the HR
15 directors from Maui, Kaua'i, and City and County of
16 Honolulu, they are in discussions. There's a strong
17 likelihood that they will be receiving raises but, at
18 this point in time, there's no estimated or actual
19 figures on the table.
20 MR. CAMPBELL: Okay.
21 MR. BRILHANTE: So that's where we are at
22 now.
23 And as far as the number so far, that 72,528,
24 the reason they're using that number is because that's
25 the highest civil service position salary in Corp.
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1 Counsel; because as you know, there's higher deputies
2 that work for corp. counsel, like Ms. Self, but because
3 they are appointed, historically we haven't used those
4 salaries. But I'm getting the accurate figure right
5 now. And as you know, by charter, the Deputy Corp.
6 Counsel's salaries can be no greater than 90 percent of
7 the department head and no less than 50 percent of the
8 department head, so there's some fluctuation between
9 the two.
10 MS. SELF: The Prosecutor or the Corporation
11 Counsel.
12 MR. BRILHANTE: Yes.
13 MS. SELF: With the higher of the two.
14 MR. BRILHANTE: I think they're the same.
15 MS. SELF: Because I think the Corporation
16 Counsel and the Prosecutor now make the same amount.
17 It used to be it was the higher of the two, that you
18 can make --
19 MR. FRATINARDO: I have a question for the
20 Chair.
21 MR. BRILHANTE: Wait. Just before we go on,
22 I have that number.
23 So right now, the highest-paid Deputy
24 Corporation Counsel is $130,248. And, again, the --
25 MR. HIGGINS: Thanks.
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1 MR. BRILHANTE: -- 72,528 is the civil
2 service position, highest-paid civil servant.
3 I'm sorry for interrupting, but go ahead.
4 MR. FRATINARDO: I want to withdraw that
5 question.
6 CHR. ONO: Oh, now you don't want to ask me a
7 question?
8 MR. FRATINARDO: No, I'm going to think about
9 it.
10 MR. HIGGINS: Can I ask a question? Who
11 answers it, I don't know.
12 This is fantastic. Gives us a heads up.
13 Great idea. Gives the budget people some headway as
14 well. When would we be expected to go thumbs up,
15 thumbs down, or change some of these numbers? By when?
16 Do we have a deadline so that the budgetary people can
17 work with it?
18 CHR. ONO: Let me throw something in here on
19 that, okay? With this charter amendment coming
20 through -- and we expect that it will pass -- I'm not
21 sure what -- we need to find out what the impact of
22 that will be. Does that mean that -- as I recall, once
23 the vote takes place, the very next day it's put into
24 effect. So, in my thinking, if we have anything and we
25 adopt it before November the 6th, we don't have to
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1 follow that, but if we wait until after the election
2 and that charter amendment passes, which it likely
3 will, then we would be governed under those new rules
4 over there, to have the public informational meeting
5 via the internet or published notice and all that,
6 which nothing is wrong with that, but if we are pretty
7 convinced that this is the right thing to do, we have
8 an opportunity to put something in effect which doesn't
9 have to go through that process; it can go straight
10 through to the County's budget process. Anyway...
11 MR. FRATINARDO: And it talks about if the
12 raises are more than 10 percent? Is that --
13 CHR. ONO: Right. I don't think any of these -
14 MS. SELF: No. No.
15 CHR. ONO: So, Bill, you want to respond to
16 Jim's question?
17 MR. BRILHANTE: I'll let Ms. Self respond
18 since there's some legal implications there.
19 CHR. ONO: Oh, okay.
20 MS. SELF: You are correct about her proposed
21 amendment hasn't gone to ballot, yet. If it passes --
22 if you did something now, I believe that would be set,
23 and then the Finance Department would make the
24 adjustments come the new budget.
25 If the bill passes on the election day, then
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1 I believe it takes effect -- is it the day after --
2 the day after the election? So, then, you would be
3 subject to the proposed amendment to the charter; but
4 that means you would have to publish at least once, in
5 at least two daily newspapers with general circulation,
6 the detailed account of its proposal and the dollar
7 amounts and all that, you have to hold at least one
8 public hearing in East Hawaii and one in West Hawaii,
9
and you'd
have
to submit a detailed
report of
your
10
findings
to the
County Clerk -- give
notice.
Public
11 notice is required for...
12 But the one thing that I think you were
13 concerned about is the last part of it, is any
14 adjustment that increases or decreases any salary by
15 more than 10 percent shall require affirmative vote of
16 two-thirds of the entire membership of the Salary
17 Commission, but none of these are an increase of more
18 than 10 percent.
19
MR. FRATINARDO:
So here's
my question, then.
20
So, in the future -- and,
actually,
going back December
21
forward --
to
address
the inversions,
how do we build
22
that into
the
system?
Because there's
people in Human
23
Resources
and
Finance
that are going
to be the
24
bean -counters to say, "Now this
person
is now"
-- "This
25
position is now in inversion."
So, how
do we
keep that
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1 from happening? Is there a way that we can build that
2 into the system where, if there's a inversion, the
3 supervisor's salary will be automatically adjusted? Is
4 there some way of doing that?
5 CHR. ONO: My recollection is no.
6 MS. SELF: Well, you could have a procedure
7 in your rules. You could pass rules to do that, but
8 then you would also have to comply -- if this passes,
9 even if you have it in your rules, you would have to
10 follow this as well, which I think maybe you could do
11 both.
12 MR. CAMPBELL: Charter amendment supersedes
13 the rules.
14 MS. SELF: Yeah.
15 MR. FRATINARDO: Right, right.
16 MS. SELF: But I think your rules could be
17 set up to where you would do both. You could follow
18 both, depending on what your rules say.
19 MR. PAVAO: Mr. Chairman, if I might, for us
20 to pass this for the sole purpose of circumventing the
21 charter amendment and not complying with what the
22 amendment says, I really don't think that's in the best
23 interest of this Commission. I think it will send a
24 really bad message, like we're trying to --
25 MR. FRATINARDO: Rush stuff through.
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1 MR. PAVAO: It just doesn't sit right. It
2 doesn't sit right at all. I think we'd be doing
3 ourselves an injustice by passing this for the sole
4 purpose of avoiding the requirements.
5 CHR. ONO: Okay. So noted.
6 MR. PAVAO: Based on the fact that we
7 recently approved salary increases, I would say that
8 this gets postponed to some future date. It just sends
9 a bad message, and I don't think that's the kind of
10 message we want to send the public.
11 CHR. ONO: Want to make a motion?
12 MR. PAVAO: I make a motion that we table
13 this until some future meeting.
14 CHR. ONO: Milton, can you do me a favor and
15 provide us with a recommended month by which?
16 MR. CAMPBELL: When do they need it to make
17 the budget?
18 MR. HIGGINS: Yeah. I want to ask that
19 question.
20 CHR. ONO: Probably in January or February.
21 MR. PAVAO: Then let's do it in February.
22 CHR. ONO: Well, okay.
23 MR. PAVAO: Or January.
24 CHR. ONO: Well --
25 MR. PAVAO: No later than February.
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1 CHR. ONO: Okay. Restate that motion for me
2 so that we can --
3 MR. PAVAO: I move that we table this
4 proposed raises at some future meeting no later than
5 February of 2019.
6 CHR. ONO: Do I have a second on that?
7 MR. HARANO: I second.
8 MR. FRATINARDO: I second, but I would also
9 like -- going forward, the new rules have to reflect
10 how we come about creating the raises so it's a desktop
11 procedure for the next guy coming in behind me, you
12 know. So all he has to do is open up the rule book, the
13 administrative rule, to see how those -- and I'm in
14 Milton's camp with this -- that we start applying it to
15 the rules now, start formulating the rules of how we're
16 going to address the inversions so it's technical, so
17 we have to sit down with Mr. Brilhante and his staff.
18 That needs to be in the rules so it's open to the
19 public how we come about awarding these raises and how
20 we address and fine-tune situations like inversion, and
21 how we apply that to their bargaining unit, and how
22 their collective bargaining is agreed upon. Whatever
23 percentages they get, how do we apply that to the
24 appointed and elected officials. So that needs to be
25 all in the rules.
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1 CHR. ONO: Okay. Hang on a second.
2 It was moved by Milton and seconded by Nelson
3 that we keep this on the agenda and act on it no later
4 than February of 2019.
5 So, with that said, it was moved and seconded.
6 Now let's go into discussion.
7 MR. FRATINARDO: Sure.
8 CHR. ONO: So what you mentioned as part of
9 the record --
10 MR. FRATINARDO: Discussion.
11 CHR. ONO: Discussion.
12 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
13 CHR. ONO: Any comments by anybody?
14 MR. PAVAO: I think that discussion is really
15 a separate issue and that issue would come about as we
16 go and revise the rules. As Amy said, that can be put
17 in the rules. So when we are at that point that we're
18 discussing Amy's proposed change, that discussion can
19 take place.
20 MR. FRATINARDO: And I hear you, Milton, but
21 what we have to also address is that we're not falling
22 behind and that we're keeping current with the raises.
23 So, that's why I'm saying maybe we start working on the
24 procedures for awarding the raises in the rules so
25 we're not falling behind, so we're not having to play
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1 catch-up, because we're going to be playing catch-up if
2 we -- I don't want to say -- I just want to be open to
3 the public so they can see what we're doing so this
4 way, when we do award these raises, there's no secrets.
5 CHR. ONO: Let me also mention that the rules
6 discussion is on our agenda for today --
7 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
8 CHR. ONO: -- at a later point in time.
9 So, any more discussion on that? Go ahead,
10 George.
11 MR. CAMPBELL: Yes. Just to comment, that if
12 the new charter amendments go into place the day after
13 the election, at which time we'll probably be obligated
14 to incorporate them into our standard operating
15 procedures, then, again, if the budget people need the
16 information by February to do the budget, we need to
17 consider how long it's going to take us to go through
18 that process. Do we have to start in January, get the
19 numbers approved, so the numbers can be in the paper
20 before the next month's meeting? And so, I just want to
21 caution to make sure that we've considered the
22 appropriate time scale so that we can allow the finance
23 people to incorporate whatever numbers we approve or
24 not approve to be put into the budget process.
25 CHR. ONO: Good point.
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1 I have my reservation whether we can do it by
2 February. Implementing the charter amendment requires
3 a lot of information to take place. But that's okay
4 because we have to go through it. Once we go through
5 it, it will be in place for our future deliberations.
6 Anything else?
7 MR. HIGGINS: I'm just a little bothered
8 by -- I'm feeling pressured that we have to give pay
9 raises without having some input or some coordination
10 with the budget people, even though they're not working
11 on it yet. But the question of affordability. I keep
12 thinking that if this volcano had not stopped, the
13 budget would be in huge jeopardy. And so, I don't feel
14 right about us proposing something, throwing it at the
15 budget people, without having at least the input that
16 you mentioned on many times, that we ask somebody --
17 what's her name -- directly, "Is there enough money to
18 pay for this?" And she said "Yes." Well, we haven't
19 even gone through that. Here we are talking about
20 major pay raises.
21 The thing of it is -- is right now, the optics
22 to me really stand that we just made massive pay
23 raises, and it was overdue and for good reason, but
24 right now, there's a lot of people in businesses that
25 are struggling, and here we hit the pavement with a new
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1 pay raise without some degree of coordination with the
2 people that have the budget in mind.
3 Secondly, I feel pressured by the fact that
4 there's nothing in our discussion or what Bill's
5 homework did that talks about merit. In other words,
6 it's so automatic. And we're supposedly comparing to
7 other counties, municipalities, and the private sector.
8 The private sector does not work that way. The private
9 sector is merit -based. And so, here we are -- you know,
10 I don't want to vote on something that's so automatic.
11 And not everybody works as hard as Glynis does.
12 So, anyway, I think we would be wise to at
13 least have those two items, that is, affordability and
14 merit -based discussion, some discussion before we come
15 to a vote.
16 CHR. ONO: George?
17 MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah, if I could add to that,
18 you know, one of the things, Mr. Chair, you talked
19 about was having some of the other commissions come
20 forth and talk about what's been happening with the
21 people that they oversee and represent. And so, one of
22 the ways it occurs to me that we could get some merit
23 input was to hear from the Liquor Control Commission,
24 from Public Works, Parks and Recreation, Fire
25 Department, Police Commission, and get some information
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1 on how those people are performing. Whether we're
2 required to use it or not doesn't keep us from asking
3 for it and getting that merit information. And if we
4 get an honest response from them, we can consider that
5 as part of our process.
6 So, I think, that being the case, we need to
7 start hearing from those people for the next couple of
8 months.
9 CHR. ONO: I might suggest that we amend the
10 motion to remove the February. Okay? No pressure that
11 way. And let it run its course.
12 MR. PAVAO: No problem with me.
13 CHR. ONO: No problem?
14 I think everybody -- we're fine with that.
15 Okay.
16 So, the motion would be restated that this
17 item will be under discussion in the future and
18 indefinitely until we arrive at some kind of a decision
19 either way.
20 MR. PAVAO: Yeah.
21 CHR. ONO: Okay. Any other discussion on that?
22 MS. IKEDA: I'd like to say about --
23 currently we look at inversion a lot to see, so that
24 you bring up the salaries on our County, but if they
25 change, like the unions and everybody else changes, and
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1
don't base it
on inversion, then we would have to -- if
2
we set it in
our rules, we would have to change our
3
rules. Is that correct, Amy?
4
MS.
SELF: Yes. In fact, you would
5
probably -- I
was just looking at this and, kind of,
6
marking up the
rules. I think it would be better to
7
provide a new
section, like a Rule 5 --
8
MR.
FRATINARDO: Right.
9
MS.
SELF: -- concerning a procedure for
10
review and compensation because you don't even have
11
anything like
that in your rules yet.
12
MS.
IKEDA: And one other comment. Someone
13
brought it up
to me, and they said like we based ours
14
on how much we collect in taxes, but if you look at
15
Maui County,
they bring in much more taxes than we do,
16
so I think we
should keep that in mind.
17
MS.
SELF: They've got a lot of movie stars.
18
MR.
HIGGINS: Yeah, the thing about that --
19
I'm going to
take the commission -- I'm going to put a
20
different hat
on. And this hat is the hat --
21
MR.
PAVAO: You only have one hat.
22
MR.
CAMPBELL: That's all he can afford.
23
MR.
HIGGINS: This is my taxpayer hat --
24
that's a whole
'pother thing -- which we all are,
25
everybody in
this room. And if we cannot get some kind
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1 of coordination with the budget people because they
2 have -- nationwide and businesses outside in the real
3 world, salaries and wages, and salaries and benefits all
4 are measured easily. They know exactly what it is. In
5 fact, she told us -- I forgot what it was -- 65
6 percent. I'm just pulling that out. Let's just say
7 it's 65 percent. And we propose another pay raise, and
8 this thing compounds. It doesn't -- it isn't just for
9 one year -- it's forever, these pay raises. So they
10 have to give us some indication that we're at the 65
11 percent; we can't go up to 70 percent because guess
12 what, taxpayers? We either got to borrow money or we
13 got to raise your taxes even more. So that's why I'd
14 like, as a taxpayer, to have this input on -- they
15 cannot just be looking at the next year; they got to be
16 looking at how are we going to afford this going on?
17 Moreover, it's compounded dramatically with
18 the amount of money that the County has to put into the
19 retirement plan. This thing doesn't just end tomorrow;
20 it goes on forever. People live longer. It's already
21 underwater bigtime. The retirement plan that all of
22 these wonderful people here are included in is
23 underwater. And so, we have to be more responsible so
24 that we're not put under the --
25 MR. FRATINARDO: Microscope.
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1 MR. HIGGINS: -- spotlight of not considering
2 affordability and how are the taxpayers of this County
3 going to afford to pay for all of this?
4 So, anyway, I apologize dramatically for my
5 lecturing on that, but --
6 CHR. ONO: No, point well made. Point well
7 made.
8 MR. HIGGINS: -- nobody has ever paid
9 attention to that. We just keep kicking the can down
10 the road. It's automatic. And that's what I feel
11 about this. And Bill has done a remarkable job, but
12 all of a sudden I'm looking at this and saying on June
13 19th, we're expected to give all these pay raises. Oh?
14 I don't feel good about that without having somebody
15 tell me that we don't have to borrow any more money to
16 pay for salaries and benefits.
17 MS. SELF: If I may interject, that's the
18 sort of thing that could go into your rules. So you
19 would have rules for review of the salaries and rules
20 for compensation, which is what you're mainly charged
21 within the charter is you shall review and compensate.
22 So, just because it says -- it just has to be you have
23 to compensate them so that their total salaries and
24 benefits have a reasonable relationship to compensation
25 in the public and private sectors.
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1 So, I think that you could make that part of
2 your rules, to meet with or have the Finance Director
3 come before you and discuss the budget and ask the
4 questions you want -- that could be part of your review
5 process. And you make the determination because it's
6 you making the determination that it's reasonable, that
7 it has a reasonable relationship to the compensation in
8 the public and private sectors. So, any information
9 that will help you make a determination. Maybe there
10 should be rules regarding a bad economy, you know.
11 Then maybe you would have a different process or
12 whatever you come up with, but maybe you just rely on
13 information that you gather -- but all of this should be
14 in the rules.
15 So that's what you need to start thinking
16 about is what kind of procedure do you want to put in
17 place? And once you have got that set, then we'll put
18 that into the rules.
19 MR. PAVAO: Mr. Chairman, I think all this
20 discussion just reinforces the fact that we should go
21 to the question and delay this.
22 CHR. ONO: Yeah. In fact, someone needs to
23 advise the Chair on this. I don't think a motion is
24 necessary. We can just leave it on the agenda without
25 taking any action on it.
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1
MR. PAVAO:
That's fine.
14
2
CHR. ONO:
Because that way, we don't have
a
3
directive because we
know that depending on what
YAMADA: So I can put it on a future
4
happens, we're going
to have to revise our current
18
5
rules. Plus there's
a lot of other things that have
to
6
take place because once we enact any type of pay
I can put it back.
7
adjustment, either way, there's a detailed report.
MS.
8
MR. PAVAO:
Well, my motion was basically
to
9
the fact that we don't
act on this today.
24
10
CHR. ONO:
Absolutely.
MR.
11
MR. PAVAO:
And if we don't need a motion
for
12 that, then I withdraw.
13
CHR.
ONO: Someone advise me. Do we need a
14
motion on that?
Amy?
15
MS.
SELF: To continue?
16
MS.
YAMADA: So I can put it on a future
17
agenda and also
appear on every agenda because there
18
is no motion.
It can just be filed or just kept off
19
the agenda, so
there has to be some kind of a motion so
20
I can put it back.
21
MS.
SELF: So you need to know when they want
22
to put it back
on?
23
MS.
YAMADA: Ideally.
24
CHR.
ONO: No, it will stay on the agenda.
25
MR.
CAMPBELL: Just stay on there.
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2
3
4
5
6
7
8
9
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14
15
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17
18
19
CHR. ONO: It will remain on the agenda.
MS. SELF: Just not take action?
CHR. ONO: Just "Unfinished Business."
MS. YAMADA: So I just leave it on every
agenda? Is that what you're saying?
CHR. ONO: We don't need a motion for that, do
we?
MS. SELF: No.
MR. PAVAO: Then I withdraw my notion.
MS. YAMADA: I think you do need a motion.
MS. SELF: To continue?
CHR. ONO: I don't think so.
MR. PAVAO: If it's on "Unfinished Business,"
it can stay there forever.
MS. SELF: Yeah, I don't think you need a
motion.
Business."
MS. YAMADA:
That's just my thoughts.
It just continues on "Unfinished
20 CHR. ONO: Okay. That being the case, it will
21 remain on the -- we have lots to work on, on that item
22 anyway because it more than encompasses just a pay
23 adjustment -- there's administrative rules.
24 Okay. Moving on.
25 MR. HIGGINS: Mr. Chairman?
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1 CHR. ONO: Yes.
2 MR. HIGGINS: Is it possible to take a
3 five-minute break?
4 CHR. ONO: Absolutely.
5 (Recess ensued from 10:34 a.m. to 10:43 a.m.)
6 CHR. ONO: Let me call the meeting back to
7 order.
8 Okay, where were we?
9 MR. PAVAO: To adjourn.
10 MR. CAMPBELL: The motion to withdraw.
11 CHR. ONO: So, just to recap that, it's going
12 to be continued on the agenda. And really, there's no
13 rush. I mean, it's an important item. I shouldn't say
14 we can delay it forever, but you don't have to act on
15 it with any deadline. We can let it run its course.
16 MS. SELF: So, this is all No. 1 that's being
17 continued?
18 CHR. ONO: No, it's just item C.
19 MS. SELF: Item C.
20 CHR. ONO: Yeah.
21 Which now takes us back to --
22 MR. HIGGINS: We did C.
23 CHR. ONO: Yeah. So it's going to remain on
24 the agenda.
25 MS. SELF: To be continued.
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1 CHR. ONO: So, let's go back up to Unfinished
2 Business 1.A., "overtime compensation for executives
3 and officials." And it says, "Adjustments to salaries
4 for extraordinary demands due to disaster response."
5 I think I suggested that one.
6 MS. SELF: I thought it was Milton.
7 CHR. ONO: Was it Milton? Was that your item?
8 MS. SELF: It was your item?
9 MR. PAVAO: No.
10 MR. CAMPBELL: No, it was our radio
11 announcer.
12 That woke him up.
13 CHR. ONO: It was your item, Tom?
14 MR. FRATINARDO: What's that?
15 CHR. ONO: Was that your item?
16 MR. DOW: Overtime.
17 MR. CAMPBELL: You brought up the idea about
18 overtime for all those people that are putting in all
19 that extra time.
20 MR. FRATINARDO: Oh, totally. Yeah. I mean,
21 a lot of people's lives were interrupted, including
22 managers. I'm sorry, a lot of persons' lives were
23 interrupted Countywide, but including those people
24 that actually are employed by the County in a
25 supervisory capacity. You know, there's that old
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1 saying of working for love, but when does it go beyond
2 working for love and they get compensated for that
3 love? So, at some point, we need to compensate these
4 people for doing consistent shifts at the EOC, but
5 coming up with that formula is something that Bill
6 needs to be here for -- so I wish he was here. So
7 can we table this until he comes back in?
8 CHR. ONO: Yeah. It just might fall in with
9 what we just deferred.
10 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
11 CHR. ONO: It might fall under that same
12 discussion, so we'll just keep it on the agenda.
13 MR. PAVAO: Yeah.
14 CHR. ONO: Okay. The next item is future
15 salary recommendations from a representative
16 of these board or commissions or supervisors
17 to include Mayor, County Council, Police Commission,
18 Fire Commission, Merit Appeals Board, Liquor Commission,
19 Corp. Counsel, Prosecuting Attorney, and others;
20 and discussion on whether or not to receive input from
21 these boards or commissions on current status, their
22 recommendation and input on the past 2018 adjustments
23 I would say, as well as the 2019 and into the future.
24 George?
25 MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah, I think it's really
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1 important, if they're going to come and talk here,
2 shouldn't just come here and say, "We think X
3 department head" or "police chief" or whoever "should
4 get a raise." We really need them to come here and
5 say, "We've considered the merit and the productivity
6 of these people and, based on that, we think they
7 should be compensated for it" or "They aren't doing
8 well and we don't recommend one." And I really think
9 we should ask all of these groups that we're asking to
10 come before us to give us that kind of information
11 before we take any action.
12 CHR. ONO: So, include them as part of our
13 process?
14 MR. CAMPBELL: Yes.
15 CHR. ONO: That's logical.
16 MR. PAVAO: I agree. I don't know how you go
17 about doing it. Amy, maybe you would know. But go
18 about inviting them to our meetings and...
19 MR. FRATINARDO: Well, it's already in the
20 charter that we consult with them anyway, correct?
21 MR. PAVAO: No, but we got to invite them,
22 though.
23 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
24 MS. SELF: It's just like when you invite the
25 Finance Director to come here. So it would be the same
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2
ji
It
7
8
9
10
11
12
13
14
15
16
17
18
19
20
21
22
23
24
25
process.
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MR. CAMPBELL: Except that we need them to
come here prepared.
CHR. ONO: Absolutely.
MR. CAMPBELL: Not just answer our questions,
but come here prepared to talk about the people that we
consider giving raises to and give us the appropriate
information to -- at least some information to add to
it that there is some merit reason that this person
should get a raise.
CHR. ONO: It would be good for our process.
MR. HIGGINS: Yeah, excellent points made.
Also, we have to consider this is our October
meeting and next meeting is November. Time moves on,
so if we're going to invite all of these folks to talk
to us, as George suggested earlier, we better get on
that. At some point in time, we've got to start
inviting them to come.
MR. PAVAO: Let's do it for the next meeting.
MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah.
MR. FRATINARDO: Or split it.
CHR. ONO: Yeah, I think it needs to be
split. Otherwise, it's going to be --
MS. IKEDA: Too long.
CHR. ONO: Yeah, too long a meeting. Maybe in
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1 three of the future meetings. But starting, probably,
2 with the commissions first, the independent commissions
3 first -- Police, Fire, Merit Appeals Board, and Liquor
4 Commission?
5 MR. PAVAO: Uh-huh.
6 MR. FRATINARDO: Can we make that
7
mandatory --
ONO:
They would come, though.
8
CHR.
ONO: Sure.
17
9
MR.
FRATINARDO: --
for either the chair or
10
the deputy or
the vice -chair?
19
11
MR.
PAVAO: I don't
think we --
12
MS.
SELF: I don't
think --
13
MR.
PAVAO: -- have
the power to make it
14 mandatory.
15
CHR.
ONO:
They would come, though.
16
MR.
FRATINARDO: They would come anyway.
17
CHR.
ONO:
I mean, we're asking to hear from
18
them with regard
to
the salary for their department
19
heads or commission
heads. They would be here.
20
MS.
SELF:
You don't have to worry about them
21
being here.
22
CHR.
ONO:
If they don't come, well, so be it.
23 And nothing.
24 MR. PAVAO: We invite them nicely.
25 MR. HARANO: Chairman Ono, if individuals
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1 come to this meeting can we, as Commissioners, give
2 personal input or queries to certain individuals?
3 CHR. ONO: Yeah, it --
4 MR. HARANO: Personal opinions?
5 CHR. ONO: It might have to go into Executive
6 Session, but that's what we have Amy here for. Okay?
7 MS. SELF: Glynis just pointed out -- and I
8 agree -- that when you're talking about inviting
9 another commission here, you need to give them time. I
10 think what you would need to do is send a memo to each
11 of these commissions and tell them what you want, but
12 they're going to have to have their own commission
13 meeting and make a decision because it's a commission;
14 it's not a person.
15 CHR. ONO: That's right.
16 MS. SELF: And then, they would give the
17 authority to their chair to come before you with a
18 recommendation.
19 MR. FRATINARDO: Like Milton said, we don't
20 want to be in a rush anyway, so give them time.
21 MS. SELF: But this would take some time. So
22 if you're going to do it, you would need to get
23 started because they have to -- I don't know when they
24 meet, but they would have to have a commission meeting
25 and put that on their agenda and discuss it and come up
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1 with what they want their chair to come here and tell
2 you.
3 CHR. ONO: Why don't you let this Chair come
4 up with a schedule on who comes to which meeting, and
5 then we can talk about that and use that as a basis for
6 carrying this out because it's all part of our
7 examination as far as executive raises.
8 MR. FRATINARDO: Absolutely.
9 CHR. ONO: Probably take place over the next
10 three months.
11 MR. FRATINARDO: Absolutely.
12 CHR. ONO: Sound okay?
13 MS. SELF: Yeah, it's like what you guys did
14 when the Charter Commission asked you for proposals,
15 right? You discussed it, you put something together,
16 and then you voted to give the Chair the authority to
17 sign the memo or whatever. So it would be the same
18 kind of thing for each of these commissions.
19 MR. PAVAO: Okay, very good.
20 CHR. ONO: Okay. So we're going to do that.
21 And the Chair will develop a schedule for discussion at
22 our next meeting.
23 MS. SELF: Did you make a decision that
24 you're going to wait for next meeting?
25 CHR. ONO: We can do it here. What would the
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1 motion be, for me to work on a schedule?
2 MS. SELF: Yes. Someone has to make a motion
3 to give the Chair the authority to work out a
4 schedule --
5 CHR. ONO: Then I won't do it.
6 MS. SELF: -- or give somebody the authority.
7 CHR. ONO: Go ahead, Milton.
8 MR. PAVAO: I make the motion to have the
9 Chair work on a schedule to invite the boards and
10 commissions as discussed as soon as possible.
11 CHR. ONO: Okay. Understanding that it's going
12 to be a monthly schedule because our typical plan is
13 one meeting a month. Okay.
14 MR. CAMPBELL: Second.
15 CHR. ONO: Moved and seconded that the Chair
16 develop a schedule for these boards and commissions and
17 representatives to meet with the Salary Commission
18 regarding input.
19 Any discussion?
20 MR. CAMPBELL: I presume that you will be
21 contacting them to say, you know, "When could you
22 come?" and things like that, and to give them the
23 detailed information that they'll need to bring to us?
24 CHR. ONO: We can do that. I'll take a good
25 stab at the information that we're requesting unless
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1 you can -- if we pass a motion and give me your
2 suggestions right now, I can incorporate it, but we
3 should pass the motion first so that I can work on it.
4 MR. HIGGINS: I think if you just read back
5 what George said about ten minutes ago, that's exactly
6 what the wording ought to be on what we're looking for.
7 CHR. ONO: Merit, productivity, and --
8 MR. PAVAO: I'm sure she has it.
9 MR. HIGGINS: Yeah. Effectiveness. All of
10 those things. And pluses and minus, I believe.
11 MR. CAMPBELL: Yes.
12 MR. HIGGINS: Your point was be prepared for
13 pluses and minuses. We just don't want a rah -rah.
14 MR. FRATINARDO: Well, we'd like to receive a
15 fitness report of that supervisor for that particular
16 division.
17 MR. HIGGINS: I don't know if they can do
18 that. Isn't that personnel private information?
19 MR. FRATINARDO: Well, they're going to give
20 their opinion.
21 MR. HIGGINS: They can give their opinion.
22 MR. FRATINARDO: Right. So that would be --
23 because, for example, the police department gets a
24 report card. The police chief receives a report card
25 once a year.
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1 MS. SELF: If that's the case, then maybe
2 they could just submit that if it's not -- I don't know
3 if it's confidential or not.
4 MR. HIGGINS: The other problem with -- I
5 just thought of it right now -- is the chief isn't
6 going to come in and talk stink about anybody, and
7 that's going to get back to the troop, so how do we
8 keep the integrity of the supervisor that's talking
9 about people? It may not work because of that.
10 CHR. ONO: Isn't this the commission chair that
11 we're inviting?
12 MR. HIGGINS: Yeah.
13 MR. FRATINARDO: Commission chair.
14 CHR. ONO: So, it wouldn't be any chief --
15 MR. HIGGINS: Well, okay. So let's say the
16 chair, then, of another commission. Is he going to be
17 likely to talk stink about anybody underneath or under
18 his jurisdiction?
19 MR. CAMPBELL: Well, if he doesn't, he or she
20 shouldn't be in the job.
21 MR. HIGGINS: Yeah, but --
22 MR. CAMPBELL: If he's going to be chairing,
23 you need to talk honestly about the people that you're
24 working for.
25 MR. HIGGINS: Well, would you talk stink
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1 about any of us?
2 CHR. ONO: Absolutely. I wouldn't miss an
3 opportunity.
4 MR. CAMPBELL: And to his face, right?
5 MR. HIGGINS: Anyway, okay.
6 CHR. ONO: What I would like to do is I would
7 like to draft something up first for discussion, you
8 know, a schedule and what we're asking. I don't know
9 how I'm going to get that out to you unless we have an
10 emergency meeting, so I think it's going to have to be
11 at our next meeting that we present this schedule for
12 discussion.
13 MR. PAVAO: I would suggest we just take a
14 look at what's being written and, as Mr. Higgins said,
15 just use Mr. Campbell's information. And I don't think
16 you need to get back to us because I think it's going
17 to be in there.
18 MS. SELF: I think it would probably be
19 better -- because any kind of personnel information is
20 going to be confidential, so you may want to request a
21 confidential memo from them or something. I don't
22 know -- maybe Bill could better answer because he deals
23 with HR situations.
24 CHR. ONO: Yeah, Bill, let me recap that for
25 you. What's come up over here is inviting in the
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1 commissions and some of the heads that supervise some
2 of these positions. Like the Mayor oversees Public
3 Works and DEM and some of those. But some of the
4 Commissioners were asking about performance issues by
5 these department heads or these positions under our
6 jurisdiction.
7 I recall a discussion at one of our previous
8 meetings that we're not to be doing that by -- I don't
9 know who said what/when, but refresh our minds on that
10 because we're going down that road to ask about
11 performance.
12 MR. BRILHANTE: Let's take the first part of
13 your question first.
14 To me, in my opinion, you're going to call
15 commission members to come in and talk about their
16 subject matter department head? I can assure you with
17 99.999 percent certainty every one of them are going to
18 come in and say, "Our chief" or "Our director" or "Our
19 department head is doing a 100 percent outstanding job
20 and they're grossly underpaid." So I think if we have
21 any deviation from that testimony from a commissioner,
22 I would be incredibly surprised. So, I'm not sure what
23 information we're trying to gather.
24 As it relates to performance issues with
25 various department heads and deputies, that's a really
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1 slippery slope. Again, we're here to administer the
2 salaries of the individuals. The salaries and whether
3 or not we give a salary increase or not should not be
4 determinate on whether or not this Commission feels
5 that somebody is performing at a higher level than
6 somebody else because, quite honestly, we're not the
7 subject area experts. We have no idea what the
8 director of Public Works is supposed to do.
9 MS. SELF: It says they're supposed to
10 consult boards and commissions.
11 MR. BRILHANTE: Yeah. And the reason -- and
12 Ms. Self just showed me the language from the Charter,
13 "consult with the boards and commission." I think
14 that's a great idea, but really what board or what
15 commission is going to come in and say, "Our department
16 head that we supervise is doing a terrible job. I
17 think they're getting paid too much." From a
18 reasonable standpoint, I don't think that's going to
19 happen.
20 MR. CAMPBELL: Well, whether it does or not,
21 I think they still should come here and do it. I
22 think --
23 MR. BRILHANTE: They can come here, but just
24 for your guys' edification also, the boards and
25 commission individuals, they serve on a voluntary basis
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1 as well, and we're going to ask them -- you know how
2 hard and difficult it is for you to come in and attend
3 each of the meetings, and I appreciate and I know you
4 guys do it willingly and happily, but they're under the
5 same obligation as well for their boards and
6 commissions.
7 My preference would be through written
8 communication, we can elicit the same information that
9 the commissioner would give if they came out of their
10 work day and they came to our meeting, besides their
11 meeting, and came to testify. We've had the Fire
12 Commission chair here several times, and I don't think
13 his testimony has differed, whether it be his verbal
14 testimony that he's given here in front of us or
15 through his written communications.
16 MR. CAMPBELL: His written was great. I
17 mean, if someone wants to go to the detail that he did,
18 it would be --
19 MR. BRILHANTE: And from our perspective, I
20 think that would be the best way going forward, in my
21 opinion.
22 Now, it's up to you. Whatever you guys
23 decide to do as a Commission, that's your --
24 MR. FRATINARDO: Amy mentioned that, too, that
25 they just respond in writing.
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1 MR. BRILHANTE: And from my standpoint,
2 again, we have to keep in mind that we're all
3 volunteers here in your guys' capacity, and they're no
4 different; and to come in and attend a commission
5 meeting out of their busy day, I can almost assure you
6 if we gave them the invitation, they would come,
7 because I know the commissioner and board members we
8 have, and I know their passion, and I know the passion
9 they have for each department. And that's not going to
10 sway -- whether that be in the form of a written
11 communication or oral testimony.
12 MR. CAMPBELL: We certainly had a lot of them
13 come before we made a decision last year, and they gave
14 us a lot of good information; and I just don't want to
15 miss that, and I want to make sure that we have covered
16 everything that we can glean before we make any salary
17 recommendations.
18 MR. BRILHANTE: And I think, to that point,
19 the reason that so many of them came was because of the
20 fact that so many of their department heads or their
21 chiefs didn't have raises for such a long period of
22 time that they felt that it was reaching a point where
23 it was becoming grossly unfair. And so, they had that
24 attachment, they had that need, that desire, in them to
25 say, "Come on, enough is enough." And that's why I
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1 think a lot of them said they wanted to make sure the
2 issue was addressed.
3 But,
fortunately,
we got through that hurdle.
4 We took the big
hit. We knew we were going to take the
5 big hit. We did. Whatever
the fallout may be, the
6 fallout is, but
what we did
was fair, and what we did
7 was equitable.
And I think
going forward, as long as
8 we maintain that
fairness, we maintain that equality
9 going forward,
I think the
issue won't be so dramatic
10 going forward. And I think if we have regular
11 dialogue, we open up regular dialogue with the
12 commissions, I think that will be a great thing, and we
13 have a better understanding. And you know what? It
14 might even create a better working relationship with a
15 lot of them.
16 MS. IKEDA: I think, though, if you came,
17
they would
have
to
do
a generalization,
you know,
18
because if
you
did
it
individually, then
each time a
19
person
came,
you
would
have to reassess the new
person
20
coming
in.
So I
would
think that they would do
a
21 generalization and say -- like police chief, you know,
22 they do certain things. "Well, it seems like this
23 person is doing their job," but it's not like saying,
24 "Mr. Smith is not doing this portion but doing this
25 portion." I really think, as a department person, I
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1 would come out with a generalization.
2 MR. BRILHANTE: Another factor, too, is that
3 each board and commission who owns a supervisory
4 responsibility over a department head or a chief or
5 something, they are required by Charter to do an annual
6 evaluation and performance evaluation. So they are
7 tasked with that responsibility and they do it
8 annually. I get mine done annually by the Merit
9 Appeals Board. I just had mine done last month, so I
10 know they're doing it.
11 MR. CAMPBELL: So, all we're asking for is for
12 them to relay that information to us.
13 MR. BRILHANTE: Yes, along those lines, if
14 the employee who was the subject of the evaluation
15 consents to the release of his evaluation, then that
16 becomes public information; but if the employee doesn't
17 consent, then that's private. We had that discussion
18 earlier.
19 MS. SELF: What if it was kept confidential?
20 Because they are part of the County, too. This
21 Commission is part of the County.
22 MR. BRILHANTE: If that was the case, I would
23 recommend that they provide us with the annual review
24 finding because that becomes public information.
25 MR. CAMPBELL: That would be --
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1 MR. BRILHANTE: So, like, for myself, they
2 made a determination that I was performing up to their
3 expectations. So, that information would be public.
4 MR. CAMPBELL: Sure. That gives us some
5 information on the merit, achievements of the
6 individual, and that there was a fair evaluation done,
7 and there was some summary of that or whatever the
8 process is that each commission and/or board uses.
9 CHR. ONO: Here's what the Chair needs to be
10 comfortable with this. I'm willing to work out a
11 draft. We'll ask them for a presentation and what it's
12 to include, plus having the schedule of how we're going
13 to get through this, but I am not comfortable with
14 coming out with something finite by the next meeting.
15 I need to bring something back to this Commission for
16 the Commission to look at and approve before we proceed
17 on it.
18
So,
with that in mind, I
am certainly willing
19
to do that. If
not, someone else can do it.
20
MR.
PAVAO: I think that
was the question.
21
Can we just go
to the question and
vote on it?
22
MR.
CAMPBELL: Yeah.
23
CHR.
ONO: Okay.
24
MR.
PAVAO: We moved and
seconded. Now all
25 we need is the vote.
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CHR.
ONO: Okay. All those in favor, say
2
"Aye."
(All members responded affirmatively.)
3
CHR.
ONO: Motion carried. That's what we're
4
going to do.
Okay.
5
Where
are we?
6
MS.
SELF: 2.
7
CHR.
ONO: Update concerning our rules of the
8
Salary -- Tom,
I know you had questions. We'll get to
9
that.
10
MR.
FRATINARDO: Oh, yeah.
11
CHR.
ONO: We're okay?
12
MR.
FRATINARDO: Yeah.
13
CHR.
ONO: Okay. Item No. 2, "Update
14
concerning the
Rules of the Salary Commission by Deputy
15
Corporation Counsel
Amy Self."
16
Take
it away, Amy.
17
MS.
SELF: To tell you the truth, I have not
18
gotten back to
the rules. I've had some appeals going
19
on that I have
not had time to go back.
20
But
I do have some suggestions for
21
formatting. I've
already taken care of all the
22
problems I saw
with Sunshine Law, but what I would
23
suggest for the
formatting is take out all these
24
chapter things
and --
25
MR.
BRILHANTE: Just for discussion, we found
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1 the reasons for the reference to each chapter. The
2 Human Resources Department has three documents which
3 we're responsible for overseeing. The first is rules
4 and regulations as it reflects the Department, so those
5 rules are incorporated under the 100 series; then we
6 have rules and regulations which oversees the Salary
7 Commission, so those are the 200 series; and then we
8 have rules and regulations for the Merit Appeals Board,
9 and those come under the 300 series. So that's the
10 rationale for the 100, 200, and 300. So they gave
11 themselves enough gap/space in between each one. So,
12 that's the reason it's done that way.
13 MS. SELF: Okay. So never mind my
14 formatting.
15 CHR. ONO: Retracted.
16 MS. SELF: But here's what I would suggest,
17 that you've got up to 203, so the next section I would
18 label as Chapter 204, and I would call it "Rules
19 Regarding Procedure for Review and Compensation." So
20 this is where you would include the rules on your
21 procedure for increasing the salaries or not making any
22 changes or whatever, and whatever procedure you want to
23 pass rules on for your review, what you are going to
24 review, how you are going to review it, are you going
25 to have some sort of a system for automatic increases
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1 or -- you know, that's up to this Commission to decide
2 on how you want to do that.
3 Once you've come up with some draft rules,
4 then we would need to go through the Chapter 91
5 rule-making procedure, hold a public hearing for
6 adoption of the rules. So that's the section you guys
7 need to come up with your procedures. And I don't know
8 that you are going to be able to do that in one
9 meeting.
10 The other thing, too, is if that Bill 98
11 passes at the ballot, you are going to have to include
12 that within your procedure, yeah, because it's got
13 certain things that you have to do if you are going to
14 increase salaries. So that would have to be part of
15 your process as well.
16 CHR. ONO: Chair's comment. It's going to be
17 interesting how we do this. You know, some departments
18 actually hire outside independent consultants to do
19 this kind of thing, because it can be --
20 MR. BRILHANTE: We have no money.
21 CHR. ONO: Yeah, I know. That's why. I'll
22 take a collection from everybody here.
23 MS. SELF: I don't think it's that difficult.
24 It's not like a ten-year review of the General Plan.
25 That's where we hire consultants. But for this, if you
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1 want to follow the same process you followed this past
2 time, then you just put it into writing. I think most
3 of that is already in writing. But it depends on if
4 you want to change your process. It just depends on
5 what you want to do.
6 Putting it into words is not going to be
7 difficult. It's just if you're talking about changing
8 the process you just recently went through and if you
9 want to follow the same process every time, then that's
10 when I would suggest, putting it into rules, so that
11 the public sees what the process is.
12 MR. HIGGINS: Amy, do the other islands have
13 Salary Commissions that we can kind of use their
14 documents or look at their documents?
15 MS. SELF: Yeah.
16 MR. BRILHANTE: Yeah, the other jurisdictions
17 have Salary Commissions. I know Maui, for example, and
18 City and County, they do.
19 MR. HIGGINS: Well, maybe they have solved
20 this dilemma that we have.
21 MR. BRILHANTE: And subsequent to November
22 6th, the election, as to what takes place right after
23 that, I think a portion of our rules may be drafted
24 just through the language of the charter. So
25 incorporating that would be something that, like
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1 Ms. Self alluded to, would have to be something we do.
2 And that's why, quite honestly, if we look at the
3 subsection in this topic area, my recommendation was to
4 postpone the discussion, but for the formatting,
5 Ms. Self has brought up a good point that the
6 formatting dates back to the '70s, and now --
7 MR. HIGGINS: So do I.
8 MR. BRILHANTE: That's kind of young.
9 MS. SELF: Me, too.
10 MR. BRILHANTE: From a formatting standpoint,
11 we can still continue to go forward and address those
12 issues; but the real substantive aspects, the public
13 notification and that -- that's going to be dependent on,
14 and determinative of, what happens during the election,
15 and I think we should have that discussion at that
16 time.
17 CHR. ONO: Okay.
18 MR. PAVAO: If I may also suggest, in
19 addition to seeing the other islands' commission rules,
20 the salary commission -- which is a great idea, and also
21 the fact that some of us want to see specific language
22 on how we consider raises, maybe we should all kind of
23 table this or postpone it, go home, think about it,
24 come back at the next meeting with specific language
25 that you would like to see, and then we can discuss it
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1 at that time because, if we start discussing it now, we
2 can go the whole day and not have nothing accomplished.
3 CHR. ONO: Good idea. That was the intent
4 anyway, right? We're going to wait for the --
5 MR. PAVAO: No, but also go home, think about
6 specific items we want to include and bring it back at
7 the next meeting -- like you mentioned that you wanted
8 to see certain things in there.
9 MR. FRATINARDO: Yeah. When it comes to
10 inversion, how do we address the inversion factor?
11 MR. PAVAO: So you can put that into
12 language.
13 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes. Exactly. How do we
14 address the overtime factor for appointees putting all
15 these hours in?
16 MR. PAVAO: Yeah.
17 CHR. ONO: Okay. So, that's homework.
18 MR. PAVAO: Yeah, homework. Yeah,
19 definitely.
20 MR. FRATINARDO: Um -- I'm sorry.
21 CHR. ONO: No, Tom?
22 MR. FRATINARDO: No.
23 CHR. ONO: Okay.
24 MR. CAMPBELL: Mr. Chair, are we going to
25 deal with all the routine things that I keep bringing
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1 up? Like it says we have a meeting every other week
2 and stuff like that. Seems like we could deal with
3 that stuff and get it off the table.
4 MR. PAVAO: I'm sure Amy will take care of
5 that.
6 MS. SELF: I'll deal with what?
7 MR. PAVAO: All the inconsistencies.
8 MR. HIGGINS: She said that three months ago.
9 MR. PAVAO: Like there's a provision there
10 that says we're supposed to meet --
11 MS. SELF: I've already done that change.
12 That's because she had to redo the whole thing, so now
13 I got to go back and redo it.
14 MR. BRILHANTE: Can I make one suggestion?
15 If each of you are going to come up with your proposed
16 language, just to expedite the discussion and everybody
17 is looking at what is going on, my recommendation would
18 be if you could get your proposed questions or
19 language/amendments in to our secretary, Commission
20 secretary, Glynis Yamada, at least six days or a week
21 prior to our next scheduled meeting; that way, she can
22 go and make copies and she can make sure to disseminate
23 the copies.
24 MR. CAMPBELL: Send it just to her, right?
25 MR. BRILHANTE: Correct, just to her. Yes.
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1 Individually directly to her.
2 CHR. ONO: We need to set a date on that.
3 MR. HIGGINS: Redact your e-mail.
4 MR. CAMPBELL: Too late. It's already out
5 there.
6 CHR. ONO: We need to set a date by which to
7 submit.
8 MR. BRILHANTE: I think we need the date for
9 our next meeting, and we'll work our way backwards.
10 CHR. ONO: Okay. Let me see. "Opportunity
11 for Commissioners to request items for placement on the
12 next agenda."
13 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
14 CHR. ONO: Okay, go ahead.
15 MR. FRATINARDO: Okay. So the last meeting,
16 we were discussing the Charter Commission, and I had
17 mentioned that I was thinking about a charter amendment
18 to present to Mr. Adams. I should have contacted you,
19 but I got really busy. Is it written in stone that we
20 have to get back to them by the 26th of October? I
21 mean, can we --
22 CHR. ONO: I don't believe so.
23 MR. FRATINARDO: Because there's two years.
24 CHR. ONO: Anytime is a good time. Anytime
25 is a good time.
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1 MR. FRATINARDO: So discussion of a --
2 CHR. ONO: We'll do it anyway --
3 MR. FRATINARDO: Yeah.
4 CHR. ONO: -- regardless.
5 MR. FRATINARDO: So discussion of charter
6 amendment.
7 CHR. ONO: Okay. I'm going to put it down.
8 MR. FRATINARDO: Proposed charter amendment.
9 CHR. ONO: You as a lead on that.
10 MR. FRATINARDO: Yes.
11 CHR. ONO: Okay. And then we're going to also
12 put back the election of officers.
13 Let me see. What's here? What did I write
14 here? I can't even read. Policy on -- oh, we have
15 that -- discuss what you were talking about, Jim, you
16 know, that League of Women Voters, and how we will
17 respond to these inquiries from outside. Okay.
18 And then what about this merit item? Does
19 that go back on? While you were gone, I think, Bill,
20 we talked about discussing merits of the individuals in
21 these positions, like the rating of the Police Chief,
22 the Fire Chief.
23 MR. CAMPBELL: I thought that's what we were
24 talking about in your coming up with a schedule having
25 them visit.
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1 CHR. ONO: So it's part of the invitation thing?
2 MR. PAVAO: Right.
3 CHR. ONO: Okay.
4 MR. BRILHANTE: Again, just for
5 record-keeping, I think we have to go back to item
6 No. 2, C.2. of the Unfinished Business; and what we
7 should do is we should propose two actions. One is the
8 group makes a decision as to whether or not we would
9 like to continue discussion on this topic; and, two, if
10 the outcome of that is yes, you do, then we should set
11 a date --
12 CHR. ONO: Right.
13 MR. BRILHANTE: -- for the questions or for
14 each Commissioner's own proposed amendments to be
15 submitted to the --
16 CHR. ONO: To Glynis, right.
17 MR. BRILHANTE: -- the Commission secretary
18 by. So, then, we should have just a informal discussion
19 when the next meeting will be held so we can kind of
20 work our way back because I know that that topic
21 area -- the date of the next meeting is last on our
22 agenda; so I recommend we do a informal discussion.
23 CHR. ONO: Yeah, let's do that right now.
24 Okay. Glynis, the next scheduled date is
25 Thanksgiving Day. That's a great day.
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1 MS. SELF: Will you bring the turkey?
2 CHR. ONO: No, let's go to some bar.
3 MR. BRILHANTE: That's stricken from the
4 record.
5
MR.
CAMPBELL: I
thought you switched to
6
drinking coffee.
7
CHR.
ONO: So, Glynis,
do you want to suggest
8
some dates so
everybody can
look at their calendars?
9
MS.
YAMADA: Let
me see when the room is
10
open.
11
CHR.
ONO: Okay.
12
MR.
FRATINARDO:
I have a question for the
13
Chair regarding
that next meeting addressing the
14
charter amendments.
15
CHR.
ONO: Yes.
16
MR.
FRATINARDO:
Do I have to seek permission
17
from the Chair
to go do research regarding -- it's
18
going to take
a little bit
of research. I may have to
19
speak with Jon
Henricks.
20
CHR.
ONO: I don't
think so. You're going as
21
an individual,
right?
22
MR.
FRATINARDO:
Okay.
23
CHR.
ONO: You're
not representing the entire
24
Commission.
25
MR.
FRATINARDO:
Well, it's going to
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1
be something I'm
going to be introducing as a charter
2
amendment through the Commission.
3
CHR.
ONO: I'm sorry.
4
Okay.
21st, the day before Thanksgiving.
5
23rd, the day
after Thanksgiving.
6
MS.
SELF: That's bad.
7
MR.
HIGGINS: Yuck, yuck, yuck.
8
MR.
PAVAO: Before.
9
CHR.
ONO: 21st?
10
MR.
HIGGINS: The next week.
11
CHR.
ONO: The week after?
12
MR.
HIGGINS: Yeah.
13
MS.
SELF: 28th?
14
CHR.
ONO: That would be fine. I travel from
15
the 27th, but
you can have a meeting when I'm not here.
16
MR.
PAVAO: Go the day before, then.
17
MR.
CAMPBELL: 26th, then.
18
MR.
HIGGINS: Yeah, I'm free.
19
CHR.
ONO: There's something going on in here.
20
MS.
SELF: 27th is -- oh, you're going to be
21
gone.
22
MR.
PAVAO: 21st.
23
MR.
FRATINARDO: We go back to the day before
24
Thanksgiving?
25
CHR.
ONO: We can do the 27th.
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MR.
HIGGINS: How about 19 or 20?
2
MR.
CAMPBELL: He can do the 27th.
3
CHR.
ONO: We can do the 27th. We may have
4
to start it
at
-- can we start earlier? Because I'm
5
flying out
that
day.
6
MR.
PAVAO: For you, I will sacrifice.
7
MR.
HIGGINS: Yeah, me, too. Anything for
8
you.
9
MR.
PAVAO: I'll be pissed off, but I'll
10
sacrifice.
11
CHR.
ONO: How about 7 a.m. in the morning?
12
MR.
CAMPBELL: Not that much of a sacrifice
13
MR.
HIGGINS: As long as you're buying
14
breakfast.
15
CHR.
ONO: I think we can do 9:30 again.
16
MR.
HIGGINS: 27th?
17
CHR.
ONO: Yeah, 27th at 9:30.
18
MR.
HIGGINS: I'm good.
19
MS.
SELF: November 27th.
20
MR.
PAVAO: 9:30. Oh, the traffic.
21
MS.
SELF: Oh, come on, Milton.
22
MR.
PAVAO: Hey, you come on the road by my
23
place and
see
the traffic. I'm not lying.
24
CHR.
ONO: Well, you better to talk to
25 Department of Transportation, Highways Division.
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1 MS. PAVAO: You should see in front of our
2 house on school mornings. The traffic is backed --
3 CHR. ONO: I know.
4 MS. PAVAO: -- all the way down --
5
CHR. ONO:
I know.
6
MS. PAVAO:
-- on Pohaku Circle.
7
MR. PAVAO:
Oh, no. Never mind. They don't
8
believe us anyway.
9
CHR. ONO:
It doesn't matter.
10
Let me see.
With that in mind, I think we
11
can set the date.
12
Glynis, if
that meeting is going to be on the
13
27th, what would be
a good date for the Commissioners
14
to submit --
15
MS. YAMADA:
I'll need to safely post the
16
agenda by the 20th,
so all the information --
17
CHR. ONO:
Can we get it to her by the 16th, th'
18
comments on the administrative rules?
19
MR. PAVAO:
I think we know what we want to
20
do, so I don't think
it would be a problem.
21
CHR. ONO:
Okay.
22
MR. PAVAO:
By the 16th?
23
CHR. ONO:
Yeah. To Glynis, yeah.
24
Glynis, do
you want to send out a reminder to
25 the Commissioners?
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ji
It
7
8
9
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MS. YAMADA: Yeah, I can.
CHR. ONO: And you better include the format
that you need it in. I don't know whether these people
can just line out and --
MS. YAMADA: Well, actually, it will be like
new language; so the language will be all brand-new for
the new section regarding the review and consideration,
recommendations.
CHR. ONO: Okay.
MR. HARANO: So when is it? The 16th?
MR. PAVAO: Yeah.
CHR. ONO: Yeah, by the 16th. Close of
business by the 16th.
MR. HARANO: I have one currently that I
just -- and it's the use of the word -- it's in Chapter
200-3(c), "Use of number and gender." Says, "Words
importing." The use of the word "importing." Is it
"importing," or is it "imparting"?
MR. PAVAO: Where is that?
MR. HARANO: Chapter 200-3 (c) .
CHR. ONO: This is a clarification you're
looking for, yeah?
T RT) T7 T T-) T TT/l .
MS. YAMADA:
Yeah.
Did you find it?
These are the original rules.
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1 It is "importing."
2 CHR. ONO: The original one says "importing."
3 MR. HARANO: Yeah. My question is should it
4 be "imparting"? If you read the whole section, section
5 (c) . Just clarification.
6 CHR. ONO: Nelson, clarification. Are you
7 asking what it should be?
8 MR. HARANO: I'm asking whether it's
9 "importing" or should it be "imparting."
10 CHR. ONO: The original says "importing."
11 MR. HARANO: Yeah, I understand that.
12 MR. HIGGINS: Is that right or wrong?
13 MR. HARANO: Yeah.
14 MR. CAMPBELL: My wife is an English teacher.
15 I'll ask her.
16 CHR. ONO: I would submit that as part of your
17 submittal on the 16th.
18 MR. HARANO: Okay. I'll let Bill decide.
19 MS. SELF: And I'm also going to have to
20 change the rule-making section, because I can look at
21 it right now and know that it's not in compliance with
22 Chapter 91, so these rules were probably adopted before
23 Chapter 91 was passed or at least before -- maybe there
24 were amendments to Chapter 91 and these rules were
25 written before that.
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2 CHR. ONO: Okay. Anything else, anybody?
3 MR. PAVAO: No.
4 MR. CAMPBELL: Yeah, I have a question on the
5 rules.
6
CHR.
ONO: We need a motion for the item 2,
7
that the item
is postponed or --
8
MS.
YAMADA: Postponed to our next meeting.
9
CHR.
ONO: Yeah, it's postponed to the next
10
meeting. Your
comments need to be submitted to the
11
Commission secretary,
Glynis Yamada, on or by the 16th
12
of November.
13
MS.
IKEDA: So moved.
14
CHR.
ONO: Second.
15
MR.
PAVAO: Second.
16
CHR.
ONO: All those in favor say "Aye."
17
(All
members responded affirmatively.)
18
CHR.
ONO: Okay, it's on the agenda.
19
Motion
to adjourn.
20
MR.
PAVAO: So moved.
21
MS.
IKEDA: Second.
22
CHR.
ONO: Okay. All those in favor say "Aye."
23
(All
members responded affirmatively.)
24
(The
meeting adjourned at 11:27 a.m.)
Mw
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STATE OF HAWAII
SS.
COUNTY OF HAWAII
Page 85
I, TERI HOSKINS, a certified court
reporter in the State of Hawaii, do hereby certify
that the foregoing pages are a true and correct
transcription of the proceedings in the above matter.
Dated this 19th day of October, 2018.
ISLAND COURT REPORTING & TRANSCRIPTION SERVICES
(808 ) 933 -98 00
Ms. Teri Hoskins, Certified Court Reporter, transcribed the aforementioned proceedings of the
Salary Commission at its meeting held on October 9, 2018.
Glynis Yamada, Secretary, Salary Commission, had incorporated some minor
formatting/housekeeping revisions throughout the transcript.
Respectfully Submitted,
41/14A2 , aiptad(L
Glynis Yamada, ecretary
APPROVED:
L9)-1
„.4y Hugh Y. Ono, P. E., Chair
Salary Commission
Q
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September 19, 2018
To: Douglass Shipman Adams, Chair
Hawai`i County Charter Commission
From: Hugh Y. Ono, Chair
Hawaii County Salary Commission
Subject: Request for Input from the Salary Commission
At its rescheduled meeting on Monday, September 17, 2018, the Salary Commission is
informing you that:
1. This Commission has issues and concerns with Ordinance No. 18-30 (Bill 98,
Draft 2), which was approved by the Hawaii County Council earlier this year.
2. This charter amendment, if approved, will add additional duties and tasks to the
Salary Commission's approval process in setting salary changes for the appointed
level positions under its jurisdiction.
3. The main concern is that these new provisions will add cost to the existing
process and there are questions as to the cost-benefit of this new amendment.
A motion to the above was approved by the Commissioners at the subject meeting. For
informational purposes, please find enclosed Ordinance No. 18-30.
HYO/gy
Enclosure
eorge./W. Ccunpbell, }fa.roia.Dow, M. D., 71w-m,a4eE. Fratinw rico-, Nei/so-n/14. }fc ra,vw;
Javfe.s-W. 1-(4g4,114,,, Matovvpcwao- P. E.
Mem42)e-rs, ATT. B
ftawa.viCownty iba.wEqu.al/Opportu-s y Provi,der and/Employer.
J�SY Oi N ,.
COUNTY OF HAWAII .fes`" f`•' STATE OF HAWAII
BILL NO. 98
(DRAFT 2)
ORDINANCE NO. i 8 30
AN ORDINANCE TO INITIATE AN AMENDMENT TO ARTICLE XIII, SECTION 13-
28 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CHARTER(2016 EDITION), RELATING TO THE
SALARY COMMISSION.
BE IT ORDAINED BY THE COUNCIL OF THE COUNTY OF HAWAII:
SECTION 1. Article XIII, section 13-28 of the Hawai`i County Charter (2016 Edition),
is amended to read as follows:
"Section 13-28. Compensation; Salary Commission.
(a) The salary of all county elected officials and appointed directors and deputy directors of
departments and executive agencies shall be established by a salary commission which
shall consist of nine members appointed by the mayor with the approval of the council, in
the manner prescribed in Section 13-4(b). The members may be removed in the manner
prescribed in Section 13-4(b).
(b) One member shall be a resident of each council district. In addition,the director of human
resources and deputy director of human resources shall serve as ex-officio members of the
commission in an advisory capacity.
(c) The commission shall establish its rules of procedure, which shall provide that it meet at
least annually, and adopt rules and regulations having the force and effect of law.
(d) The commission shall review and compensate all county elected officials and appointed
directors and deputy directors so that their total salaries and benefits have a reasonable
relationship to compensation in the public and private sectors. The salary commission shall
consult with those boards and commissions which have appointing authority for
department heads.
(e) At least thirty days prior to the approval of any salary adjustment, the salary commission
shall:
(1) Publish at least once in at least two daily newspapers of general circulation in the
county a detailed account of its proposal,or proposals, including specific increases
or decreases in both actual dollar amounts and percentages;
(2) Hold at least one public hearing in either east Hawai`i or west Hawai`i,provided
that any public hearing shall be conducted using video conference technology to
allow for public participation from both east and west Hawai`i; and
(3) Submit copies of a detailed report of the commission's findings and conclusions
used to develop its proposal, or proposals,to the office of the county clerk and the
office of the mayor for public inspection.
The public notice required pursuant to this subsection shall include notification that
the report of the commission's findings and conclusions is available for public inspection
at the aforementioned locations.
(f) Any adjustment that increases or decreases any salary by more than ten percent shall
require an affirmative vote of two-thirds of the entire membership of the salary
commission."
SECTION 2. New charter material is underscored. When revising, compiling, or
printing these charter provisions for inclusion in the Charter of the County of Hawai`i,the reviser
need not include the underscoring.
SECTION 3. If any provision of this ordinance, or the application thereof to any person
or circumstance is held invalid, such invalidity shall not affect other provisions or applications of
the ordinance,which can be given effect without the invalid provision or application, and to this
end,the provisions of this ordinance are severable.
SECTION 4. Upon adoption of this ordinance, this council,by appropriate resolution,
shall provide that this amendment be submitted to the electorate of Hawai`i County for approval
in the 2018 general election.
SECTION 5. The charter amendment proposed in this ordinance shall take effect upon
its approval by a majority of voters voting on this legislation in the 2018 general election, as duly
certified.
ODUCED BY:
AIIP"
415
.' CIL MEMBER, CO r AWAI`I
Hilo , Hawai`i
Date of Introduction: March 14, 2018
Date of 1St Reading: March 14, 2018
Date of 2nd Reading: March 28, 2018
Date of 3rd Reading: April 11, 2018
Effective Date: November 6, 2018, if approved by the voters
712.2
REFERENCE Comm.
2
COUNTY CLERK
OFFICE OF THE COUNTY CLERK COUNTY OF HAWAII
County of Hawai`i
Hilo, Hawai`i ZOO APR 25 AM 9: 05
•
Introduced By: ROLL CALL VOTE
Date Introduced: AYES NOES ABS EX
First Reading: Chung
Published: David
Eoff
REMARKS. Kanuha
Lee Loy
O'Hara
Poindexter
Richards
Ruggles
Third Reading: April 11, 2018
To Mayor: April 19, 2018
Returned: April 25, 2018 ROLL CALL VOTE
Effective: Novarher 6, 2018, if awecl by the voters AYES NOES ABS EX
Published: May 5, 2018 Chung X
David X
REMARKS. April 11, 2018 : Third of
Eoff X
three required readings pursuant to Kanuha X
Section 15-1 (a) ; Hawai`i County Charter
Lee Loy X
O'Hara X
Poindexter X
Richards X
Ruggles X
8 1 0 0
I DO HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing BILL was adopted by the County Council published as
indicated above.
COUNCIL CHAIRPERS N
rove isapproved this '1,L1111 day
}� Q
of l � 20 IS LINTY CLERK
/ 98 (Draft 2)
MAYOR, COUNTY OF - C Bill No.:WAIT Reference: C-712 .2/FC-83
Ord No.: 18 30
COUNTY CLERK
OFFICE OF THE COUNTY CLERK COUNTY OF HAWAII
County of Hawai`i
Hilo, Hawai`i 2018 APR 25 All 9: 05
Introduced By: Susan L. K. Lee Loy ROLL CALL VOTE
Date Introduced: March 14, 2018 AYES NOES ABS EX
First Reading: March 14, 2018 Chung X
Published: March 24, 2018 David X
Eoff X
REMARKS: Kanuha X
Lee Loy X
O'Hara X
Poindexter X
Richards X
Ruggles X
Second Reading: March 28, 2018 8 0 1 0
To Mayor: N/A
Returned: N/A ROLL CALL VOTE
Effective: AYES NOES ABS EX
Published: Chung X
David X
REMARKS.
Eoff X
Kanuha X
Lee Loy X
O'Hara X
Poindexter X
Richards X
Ruggles X
9 0 0 0
I DO HEREBY CERTIFY that the foregoing BILL was adopted by the County Council published as
indicated above.
COUNCIL CHAIRPERSON
Approved/Disapproved this day
of , 20 COUNTY CLERK
BillNo.: 98 (Draft 2)
MAYOR, COUNTY OF HAWAII Reference: C-712 .2/FC-83
Ord No.:
Yamada, Glynis
From: Charter Commission
Sent: Monday, October 01, 2018 1:22 PM
To: Yamada, Glynis
Subject: Salary Commission's Response to Request for Info from Charter Commission
Dear Chair Ono and Secretary,Yamada,
Glynis, please share this e-mail with Chair Ono.
Thank you for your continued interest in the Hawai'i County Charter Commission's work.Your correspondence has been
provided to all Commissioners and will become a part of the permanent public record.
Your communication regarding the Salary Commission's recommendations to the Charter Commission will be included
on the agenda for potential discussion during the upcoming October 12, 2018 Charter Commission meeting. The
Commission will diligently consider your comments and suggestions and greatly appreciates your efforts on behalf of a
better future for our island home.
Have a wonderful day.
ATT. C
1
Yamada, Glynis
From: Yamada, Glynis
Sent: Tuesday, October 02, 2018 4:07 PM
To: Yamada, Glynis
Subject: RE: Recap of Salary Commission Phonecon w/Susan Dursin.
From: Hugh Ono
Sen Saturday, September 29, 2018 5:37 AM
To.
Subject: Recap of Salary Commission Phonecon w/ Susan Dursin.
For Salary Commission Record:
1. Susan Dursin is a Director with the Hawaii Couty League of Women Voters.
2. She called to discuss Salary Commission's concerns about future Charter Amendment. This was based on her
seeing the discussion on our Commission meeting on 9/17/18.
3. Information from Hugh Ono to Ms. Dusin:
a. General Details of how the Salary Commission approved the executive raises in 2018 to include baseline
information from other Counties, Private Sector and others.
b. Concern over the County's ability to pay and as represented by the Department of Finance that funding
was available.
c. Concern over the County Council's Charter Amendment proposal: Public Hearing/s &2/3 vote on
increase of more than 10%.
d. Shared that our Rules are being revised to update some very old and obsolete rules.
e. And that this last round of Salary Increases were made to catch up for the lack of any adjustments as far
back as 3 -8 years.
f. Also, that all the members of this Commission are new and none of the previous commissioners is a
current member of this commission.
g. Our opinion that there was "very little" activity by previous commission/s to make appropriate Salary
Pay adjustments.
4. Ms. Dursin, appeared to understand what this commission is and was doing.
5. H. Ono to send her our summary of how these 2018 pay process and adjustments were executed.
Phonecon: 20 minutes,4:00pm or so, 27 September 2018.
From:
Sent: Thursday, September 27, 2018 5:18 PM
To: Hugh Ono
Subject: Mahalo!
Thank you so very much for your quick, helpful response. I appreciate it.
Susan Dursin 1111.11111.
Director, Hawai' i County League of Women Voters
ATT. D
1