The URL can be used to link to this page

Home My WebLink About2019 02-12 Game Management Advisory Commission Minutes Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 Game Management Advisory Commission County of Hawaii Minutes Meeting Date: Tuesday, February 12, 2019 Time: 6:34 p.m. Place: Hawaii County Building – Council Chambers I. CALL TO ORDER/ROLL CALL: Meeting was called to order at 6:34 pm. Stanley Mendes, District 1 – here Kean Umeda, District 2 – here James O’Keefe - District 3 – here Naniloa Poglen, District 4 - here Abraham Antonio, District 5 - here Grayson Hashida - District 6 - here Bronsten-Glenn “Kalei” Kossow, District 7 - here Teresa Nakama, District 8 – here George Donev, District 9 - absent Quorum established ALSO PRESENT: Malia Hall, Corporation Counsel Donna Urban-Higuchi, Executive Assistant to Mayor Kim GUESTS: Jaerick Medeiros-Garcia, Peeked Shoreline Fishing Assn Ian Cole, Wildlife Biologist, DLNR/DOFAW Eric Koch, Fisherman and Aquarium Fish Collector Hawai’i Island CALL TO ORDER: BKK: The Game Management Advisory Commission meeting for Tuesday, February 12, 2019, has been called to order at 6:30 pm. APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES – January 29, 2019 meeting BKK: Teresa Nakama moved for approval of the January 29, 2019 meeting minutes as submitted. 1 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 JO: l was listed as being here last meeting but was not. And, it said our vacant seat was here... Abraham, were you here? OK. But not on official, we’ll have to make the correction. BKK: Teresa Nakama moved for approval of the January 29, 2019 meeting minutes with corrections. Seconded by James O’Keefe and carried unanimously. FINANCIAL REPORT BKK: Teresa Nakama moved for approval of the Financial report as submitted. Seconded by Nani Pogline and carried unanimously by voice vote. Is there anybody that wants to make a statement on any agenda item or anything in general? Just a reminder – at anytime during any speaker you can come up and talk – just let me know – we’ll try to accommodate you. STATEMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC - Statements from the public will be taken throughout the meeting SH: Steven Hurt. OK. I have a question here. You have a listed slaughter house – are you referring to the mobile slaughter house or to the brew ha that’s going on at Kulana Foods? BKK: I think the intention of that agenda item was to put it all inclusive – so it’s not necessarily pertaining to one or the other. SH: OK. Thank you. TN: I can give you a little update. The representative from this Island – from the County – Tim Richards and Sue Leeloy and what is the one from Puna? Ashley – met with the representatives and gave the report regarding Kulana and they are an investigation on the reporting that stopped Kulana Foods from slaughtering pigs, sheeps, goats. And so they’re working on that. And as far as the mobile Slaughter House is concerned – it’s a coop and Hokukano Ranch is handling the Slaughter House coop – so the rancher that wants to be part of it has to join their coop. As far as the Hamakua Slaughter House – where David DeLuz is concerned – they’re in limbo right now – they’re not sure whether they’re gonna continue or not – so they’re meeting with them to see how they can continue... So that’s the update I got from Tim Richards. SH: Oh, good, that’s basically what I was gonna bring up – as long as our representatives have been aware of it and they’re starting to work on it – my 2 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 thought and take on it knowing a little bit about it – they stopped slaughtering small animals due to the fact that the inspector from the USDA – from the federal side – is a member of PETA. NP: Tell us about PETA... SH: People for Equal Treatment of Animals and basically, the big brouhaha started – they had trouble with one pig that it took multiple shocks to do the pig in prior to slaughter and the second one that was involved – the pig refused to go and it got drug in to a place to where they could disperse it and this lady has had posted on Facebook being a member and pigs are one of her pet items to protect – so my thought is if that is occurring how much would PETA be involved in the division itself as far as the inspectors – and if that’s inhumane – it makes me wonder how far it can spread out – meaning, if you’re gonna load something in your truck you have to have an inspector there to make sure that you’re not treating it inhumanely to get it to the Slaughter House to be slaughtered and it’s way over reach and just based on that is where my concern was for our community. But now that... TN: Please contact Councilman Tim Richard’s Office and ask them for any progress they’ve gotten so far in reaching out to the House and Senate – Hawaii State Legislation. PRESENTATION JMG: Aloha everybody. My name is Jaerick Medeiros-Garcia and I am the acting president for Pepeekeo Association. I’m the chairman for Pepeekeo Shoreline Fishing Association. Thank you guys for your guys’ time. Sorry I’m late. So, yeah, I just want to talk about what happened since the spill – that’s not one spill but it was intentionally released chemical that was in our shoreline from Huhonua and we did have fishermen that did get sick from eating this fish after that intentionally released chemicals. We are right now in a process of trying to get this fluids that was given to me by the whistle blowers – the welders – and we’re sending it off to the mainland to be analyzed – the fact that we – the community members in Pepeekeo cannot trust the Department of Health – the reason I say that is because they’re the very ones that could stop these buys from proceeding with what they’re doing and in my eyes I see there’s nothing good coming out of this facility down there – with all EPA done from the very beginning, really, they was gonna do an EPA right now – tomorrow – or whatever – there’s no numbers to run it off of on where we stand in the pollution of our shoreline. BKK: I just want to do a clarification – when you say facility – just for the record – what facility are you talking about? 3 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 JMG: I’m talking about Huhonua Power and Energy Plant – I really don’t know why people would be supporting this stuff. There’s one reason I can think of but I don’t think I should disclose that at this time because it’s not for me to say but really – we’re not getting nothing out of this thing. They said we’ll cheaper power – we’re not gonna get cheaper power – it’s gonna be twenty times more than what it is now. Yes, sir? SM: What do you want the Commission to do about this –– cause in my mind it’s the Department of Health or you guys sending your guys own stuff out. JMG: I’m here to give an update. Thank you Mr. Mendes, sorry about that but, I talked with Auntie Teresa with her a lot of times cause I try to protect the rights of our local people – the rights of gathering food for put on their table, yeah, um, at this point now – we’re in a position where these guys are being allowed to do everything wrong and I say we cannot trust Department of Health because number one – I reached out to them before the spill – letting them know that our shoreline was being polluted. The response was if I had evidence – I said no, but I will have evidence. Two days later I had evidence. They was out there the day of our hearing up that Imiloa for a Huhonua – Huhonua never came to talk and answer questions – they came to debate us – so I ask you guys as a commission – I want to know what can you guys do for my community because really I don’t think our county council person can do it by herself, you know, because she’s fighting her own fight over in Ookala. I would like this Commission to tell me what we can do? TN: This is Teresa. He’s asking for our assistance – if we can write a correspondence because it’s affecting their gathering rights. When we take care of mountain to ocean it’s about them gathering – now that I’ve heard that they have illness because they’re eaten the fish that has gotten pollution now I’m gonna talk with Jared cause he’s part of my Committee of Traditional Practices and we need evidence and he’s gathering evidence for us – so this is in the works and he’s here to report to us that which is affecting his rights to feed his family. JMG: When I took over this committee two years ago – I told them we need to keep track of our own resources \[unclear\] you going go pick opihis – that’s fine – don’t forget the next person. You going pick opihis – don’t forget to take a sandwich ziplock bag – fill that buggah up – and as you leave the aina – put it back in somewhere else. Let me know where you got it from – log it down – time, date, area – and where you release it back into the ocean: time, date, area – and I’ll keep this log so that we can keep track of our resources instead of having people come in that the Aquatics Division and DLNR are funding to do research that really – I went to their meetings – we’re not 4 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 allowed to ask questions, you know, for the permitting and the – on the licensing and stuff like that which was one really bad thing for our community cause what they got was they got signatures as you went into these meetings and these signatures going to be used so when they go to the legislation – they going say, oh, you need two thousand signatures saying that they agree with you – well, they already got three, four hundred people to sign in these two meetings and not one of them got their questions answered – they’re using people to sign in – to so – when they want to go to the legislation to pass a bill – they already get the signatures that wasn’t meant for them to use to say we held our meetings and these people was in favor of all our information that we gather. ‘Well, when you ask the guys that do the research – what kind fish swim at night? Nobody get one answer. What was they – what were you guys researching out there? Are you guys researching this for the rich people like Hualalai? Stop the locals from going and gathering their rights – if you look at the legislation – all the bills that they want to try and pass – they going stop throw net – they going stop cross net – they going stop shoreline fishing – they want to permit and license these guys – majority of these local fishermen that is not commercial fishermen – they go out there to provide food for their families – but find themselves in court – or find themselves paying fines – or find themselves imprisonment. Really, we don’t need that. We really don’t need that so I’m asking you guys to please guide me the right direction to be heard. SM: Regarding the letter from the Commission – I think we should wait. TN: No. There’s no need to wait because all that letter states is the laws... It has nothing to do with his area. A letter was sent to the Mayor to approve and it states our gathering rights and also Article 11, Section 6 that says in State and Hawaii Revised Statutes – their – all fishing shall be free to the public. So we state these laws to our Mayor to give approval and the meetings you’re talking about is the RPL – Registry, Permit and Licensing that was done in Kona and Hilo and they gave no opportunity to the public to speak. Which was an informational meeting from Hawaii Conservation International whose director is Mathew Ramsey. BKK: Can I interject for a second? I’m not really understanding what side we’re going on because we’re all of a sudden talking about RPL but then we’re talking about Huhonua so... I want to know what correspondence... TN: It’s encompassing everything – what’s happening is... 5 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 BKK: Hold on one second, Teresa... I want to know what type of correspondence that you wanted to refer To about RPL. JMG: First of all these permits and stuff that Huhonua applying for we need you guys backing and not allowing these permits to be permitted because the fact that – really – they really don’t have answers for us. BKK: OK. Have you talked to Mayor Kim? JMG: I talked to Mayor Kim on different stuffs but not exactly this thing... BKK: We’re an advisory group that advises the County and we would go straight to the Mayor. Our first line of correspondence would be to Harry Kim and so if he says yeah, we’ll support your measure or however he words it – we can proceed to assisting you. But until that one direction doesn’t – it can get cut off by just a swing of no. TN: The permit you’re talking about – Huhonua – they don’t have all of their permits in place? JMG: No. TN: And so they’re still going through the permit process? JMG: They’re trying to get it re-established because a lot of them expired. TN: Is this through the Planning Department? JMG: Yes, and the Department of Health. TN: So can you set up a meeting with Planning Department and Department of Health and let one of us know that you’re setting up this meeting and we can listen in? JMG: I can always request for a meeting. TN: OK. And then we can find out what the permit process is for Huhonua and we can decide where we fit in supporting you. JMG: A lot of stuff that they’re doing is contaminating the water – the fish, and what they did, which was intentionally – not inadvertently – it was intentionally released – thousands of gallons of this chemical and when I get the results of these chemicals you guys gonna be the first report that I let know what was in this water. 6 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 NP: Please. That would be great. JMG: Yeah, I will definitely come back to this meeting and let you guys know what the results on what was released into the ocean because like I said – like I told these guys before – our fishing buoys for our commercial fishermen – that put the fish in the markets that we all eat sashimi and poke and all that good stuff – that’s no more than 3 miles out though – out of Pepeekeo, you know. At night when we fish for ahi, you know, we sit on Pepeekeo buoy – the 900 fathoms and we drift up to Hakalau \[unclear\] – Hakalau buoy – which is at the 1500 fathom – now if the bagasse had travelled ten miles from Pepeekeo Plantation back when the plantation was moving – what makes them think that this chemical is not gonna travel to Kumukahi Point where the lava flow was, you know? That’s why it’s important for these guys to do what dye testing so they – cause you know they want to inject these chemicals into our aquafer – this percolating hot water – that’s gonna come out on the shoreline of our ocean where Hawaii fishermen fish for their dinner – I want to know where this thing come out – now why wouldn’t they want to do one dye test so we know that this chemical percolating hot water that’s gonna kill the reef, the fish – contaminate the fish – not only the bottom fish but the ahi, the ono, the mahimahi that is sitting out at our buoys – it’s not only five miles outside of Pepeekeo – like I said the bagasse went travel ten miles to Bayfront – another five miles to King’s Landing – this thing is – these chemicals are gonna travel because 26.1 million gallons every day from the aquifer? That’s a lot of water, you know, that they going be contaminating everyday to cool off the turbines of this plant that really not – we not going get nothing out of ‘em as a community – all we going get is sick people contaminated stuff in our communities, in our ocean, yeah. NP: When you collect the information, we could have somebody from the Department of Health and EPA come and tell us what’s up. We could invite them here and ask them to explain what they’re doing about it. We gotta hold them to it. JMG: We’ve been kinda holding ‘em to ‘em, you know, and we really got nothing back and I am the president of Pepeekeo Association and the liaison for them is the former president of Pepeekeo Association and what she’s done in the past speaks for exactly what is happening today – she really did nothing for our community but I really would like her to answer on why she would change the zoning for these \[unclear\] without the public – with our committee – well, our committee at least knowing about it, you know, so I get a lot of work on my hands and you guys will be the first people that I’ll come back with a report to let you guys know exactly how this thing fell out. TN: Would be important to add to your facts of information the reports from the doctors why people became sick and the related cause of their illness. 7 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 Department of Forestry and Wildlife BKK: Next, Department of Forestry & Wildlife – Mr. Ian Cole – I’d like to transfer this over to Nani. NP: Ian Cole – he is our new Department of Forestry & Wildlife – Wildlife Biologist. We had Joey Mello – you can come up if you would please – thank you so much. We had Joey Mello with us for a long time and he was so great and we had a good relationship with him – we miss him – but now we’re hoping to have the same with you, Ian, and get to k now you a little bit and some of us have some questions. IC: My name is Ian Cole – I work with the DLNR – Division of Forestry & Wildlife – I’m a wildlife biologist in East Hawaii and I’m not currently assigned to Joey Mello used to be the wildlife manager – who retired in January – myself and one of the other biologists in the office have been alternating for the temporary assignment until they fill Joey’s East Hawaii Wildlife Manager position. I’m a full time biologist – I’ve been at the Wildlife Section for a couple of years now at East Hawaii. IC: I’m just a temporary for East Hawaii – we’re just switching back and forth doing the manager’s position – Joey’s old job. NP: I appreciate you coming because I know though fires have been a thing that you’ve been busy fighting the fires on Saddle Road? Could you give us an update on the fire? IC: The fire is contained – there was some decent moisture on Saturday night – those winds came but fortunately it was pretty cold and some high humidity so the fire breaks that we had installed earlier in the week held the fire and then Sunday night there was some good moisture so they checked the fire – and they’re still checking the fire – but they pulled the resources off on Monday. NP: Do they know how the fire was started? IC: The first report from Blue Hawaii that I think saw the smoke saw a tent so they think somebody was camping just outside of the fence in the Humuula Section of DHHL – if you’re familiar with that piece. 8 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 If you haven’t been up there or even in Hilo it’s been really cold so if somebody was camping there I think they had made a fire – so that’s what – with the report we got. NP: What size area did the fire spread to? IC: About 160 acres... NP: We had a speaker last meeting that Don Fujimoto – he presented the problem of the grass fire fuel without the grazers now and the drought hostilities and wind factors and then right after he presented that it went on Big Island Video News and then there was a fire. IC: It’s unfortunate right now the mountain is got a lot of dead material on it, you know, can’t tell you if the grass was more or less than it was but if you’re familiar with the Naio Thrips that little bug that introduced about 8 years ago – it came in on some ornamentals – it killed off a lot of the naios – you see a lot of the dead trees on Mauna Kea are from that Naio Thrips.. NP: That’s fire fuel also is what you’re saying... IC: It’s the larger, heavier fuels that are probably what you see that looks dead on the mountain – like the heavier wood fuels, yeah, and it’s obviously grasses and the fire weed – we’ve all heard about the fire weed from Mr. Hoefflinger and others but... NP: But the loss of grazers certainly must have some impact on grass fire fuel. IC: Probably, I think there’s a lot of things at play there. NP: What are the herds of Mouflon like now on Kapapala Ranch, on state land? IC: There’s quite a few Mouflon out there right now... I know I did an aerial survey last spring – I have to get the numbers for you – spring of 2017 and we counted – a direct count of like 400+ animals and then during the, I’m sorry, I did a spring count in 2018 while the, sorry, the lava event was going on? There was the ash stuff – but we were out of the ash flow – and we had another count of like – I think it was 260 animals or something on the ranch proper and then we did the forest strip too – I don’t have the numbers off the top of my head. NP: Is there a population management going on? IC: There’s not hunting on the ranch for game mammals. NP: So nobody’s eradicating those Mouflon? 9 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 IC: All we have of that cooperative GMA – Game Management Area – Kapapala – is currently just a bird cooperative GMA. NP: I know they were doing a lot of iliahi planting on Mauna Loa... IC: If it’s the South Kona portion where – I can’t remember the company name – but the gentleman is a Lee – I’m not sure if that’s what we’re talking about. NP: There was a man who was out planting iliahi and he was complaining about the turkeys eating the iliahi or the seed. He was really raging about it and I was wondering if anything was being done to control the turkeys. IC: I don’t know – if he calls me I’ll go catch ‘em and take ‘em to Kapapala. Anyone who has a turkey problem call me – I’ll go grab ‘em for you and take ‘em to a hunting area. NP: Of course, we want the game resource. TN: The replanting of the iliahi – were you talking about Hokukano Ranch on Mauna Loa side... I know there’s replanting being done. NP: There’s all over the place. SM: You guys get any plans to incorporate that Kapapala into hunting for the Mouflon? And what about the herds in Kahuku Ranch. You guys doing anything about moving them... IC: In the national park? SM: Yeah. IC: I tried to approach National Park and they told me that they – I’m trying to think of the wording – well, I’ll just summarize it – I won’t say it is verbatim that they couldn’t give – they couldn’t let us capture them and move them. SM: Kill ‘em all? IC: That’s what they told me. Cause I was trying to get some from the lower portion – I wanted to see if we could move ‘em to a GMA, elsewhere and they told me that we couldn’t. I was trying to do it before they transferred some of the last little bit of lands at the bottom of the – above the old ranch area there was a piece. 10 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 NP: Well, thank you for trying. IC: It’s hard to relocate animals right now. KU: Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t there public hunting on Kapapala above that where you get the code – you have to call at a certain time? IC: Yes, the Forest Reserve is open. KU: It is open? IC: So if you’re familiar with it – from the highway essentially up to I want to say 6,000 – I’m kinda taking a guess but about 6,000 is the Kapapala Ranch lease proper – that’s the general lease – and they also have some revocable permit to the south of that – and that’s where the cooperative GMA for bird hunting is. Above there, if you use the Ainapo access or the Hononui access – which are both call-ins – you can hunt mammals above the ranch. KU: Thank you. SM: What about the numbers up there – out of the ranch? IC: Oh, in the Forest Reserve? SM: Yeah. IC: Definitely lower. I’m sorry I don’t have the numbers with me right now, I mean, I think with the grass and stuff in the ranch is pretty – is better and there’s no pressure, right, or the pressure’s just from outlaws, unfortunately, but above the ranch gets quite a few visitors. It’s good habitat but there’s probably – I don’t have the numbers I’d probably count a fraction of what I count in the ranch. SM: Right. TN: This is Teresa – you initially gave us a number of 400 in 2016-2017... IC: Yes, ma’am... TN: And then now its 2018 count is 260. IC: I wouldn’t put too much into it – it’s an aerial overflight – it could be weather – until we get like consistent numbers over a period of time you can’t really see any trends. TN: So there’s no hunting in that area? 11 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 IC: No mammal hunting. No legal mammal hunting. AA: Not in the lower area. I guess up in the higher areas there’s hunting. TN: Thank you. AA: I’d like to tell the committee that I’ve been working with Ian a little bit in the last year and Joey Mello. They doing some work right now in tree planting road – cutting the sides of the road and fixing that road with a lot of damage from all the heavy rains and just overgrowth that was covering up the roads so they’re doing a pretty good job up there. I wouldn’t mind doing one drive through with you some time – we can go and check it out. IC: I’d like to sort of get a little bit of time on the machine so we can see what it looks like – I want to go see and take a look. AA: Also, I worked with Ian up in the Kulani in the higher area in the buffer zone area – we worked together and putting up a kiosk and just more informative – like who was hunting in that hunting area so all that helped – all that work was pretty good, I think. We got a more – at least me – I got a more open view of who’s actually in the area and can pass it on – once they go up there and get the information from that kiosk that we put – that they put up there. AA: Dustin... IC: Dustin. When these guys came to us it was very helpful cause they have like on the ground stuff that’s really easy – not really easy but it’s ideas that we can implement and a lot of these guys were – have been around a long time remember when \[sounds like Buffer\] was call in and that switched but they were trying to look for a solution to hunters stacking up on each other and that was easy for us to implement – but that’s kind of the thing – it’s helpful if people want to come talk to us and feel free at any one time to come talk to me or email me and set up a meeting and then we can – that kind of stuff is real easy to implement quickly and I think that shows good relations for sure – you know – rules changes – you guys ever want to see rule changes – they don’t happen quick at all, you know... AA: What I got from them from even when Joey was in there – rule changes takes quite some time. The other thing is – maybe in the next meeting you and your new partner can – Ian’s partner – maybe you guys can come to the next meeting and bring some better numbers of the game mammals up in Kapapala Ranch – be more ready next time – that’s one – the other one is with the lava down in District 4 and District 5 – what’s the status with Malama Ki Forest Reserve – like how bad is it – how bad did it get taken out – how’s the game in that area – do you have any info on that? 12 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 IC: We don’t have any game information – apparently there’s a lot of pigs – I’m still getting calls of pigs coming out of there into Leilani and stuff... I assume there’s a lot of pigs cause I still get a lot of – we still get a lot of the complaint calls for nuisance pigs and we get a lot of them from there. We’re still using that County trapper list back that – I think it was Dominic Yagong put together when we had the last high pig numbers – so we’re still working off that County trapping list when it’s areas that are private property – residential. Only – I went down briefly – I think it was between 25-30% of Malama Ki was inundated by lava... AA: Are you guys gonna make another access road to Malama Ki eventually, or, because right now the lava came down and took out the old road so there’s no access unless you got to walk over the a’a lava and that’s pretty treacherous – that thing is pretty mean. IC: You’d have to show me on a map. AA: OK. IC: I’m not as familiar with it as like so off the top of my head I wouldn’t know...but when I just heard the Mayor on the radio this morning talking about prioritizing the three routes they’re gonna open back up. I suppose once they got opened up... AA: They’re on…I suppose, probably, maybe 137. I know it’s on the Pohoiki- Opihikao Road or Pohoiki-Kalapana Road and had one access road pretty much right by McKenzie State Park – probably like half a mile away from, you know, going towards Pohoiki – there was an access road that you could drive up into the forest and... IC: And it’s under the flow right now? AA: There’s no access to the forest of whatever’s left... IC: I would have to just approach Steve and the Forestry Manager cause it’s a forest reserve. Unfortunately, I tried to manage game and game rules and stuff...But it should be give or take a non-intrusive thing – a brand new lava flow shouldn’t have cultural resources to worry about. AA: But I’m still pretty sure what I’m hearing around too is the Mayor is kinda strict about anybody touching the new lava too, eh? 13 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 IC: I’m sure we’ll run into some political hurdles...but I don’t think it’s us, you know, I think it’s a reasonable request – how’s that? AA: Last one would be – we talked before about putting more kiosks in the District 4 area – see where we can move forward about that, you know, just putting one hunting check-in station in the Lava Tree State Park. And then maybe we can put another hunter check-in station we can get more information about the game in the area. IC: That’d be good and we definitely are willing to do that – I would like to work with somebody from District 4 – if somebody that hunts down there – so that I can figure out the best – cause there’s so many different accesses to, where do you guys think strategically they would be best. AA: I hunt in that area, too, and I think Lava Tree State Park would be a good area because it’s on state land and that’s kinda like right around the area but it’s kinda harder now because of the lava – what the lava did – so the areas are a lot smaller, you know, the hunting areas are a lot smaller then what it was and, um, Lava Tree State Park is next – pretty much right next to the two Nanawale Forest Reserves. IC: Basically we just need to look at the routes – like where you think the most people are gonna go by – cause it you put it out of the way – being as you’re not necessarily required to go to the hunter check-in station – you know what I mean? AA: I think they going change once they open up Highway 132 and gain that access back down towards Kapoho and then you can get more people, you know, using that road again. As of right now – I think the only people using that road is PGV employees cause that’s like the only way – the only place that people can access is actually PGV. IC: And I don’t know if you guys have also been informed but there is – we’re trying to work out a mobile app and it’s just because people are – I mean there’s always going to be old timers who want to use the paper stuff – but we’re trying to work out a mobile app so we think we’ll gather more data that way because of – you know in places like Kahaulea and stuff where there’s no hunter check stations up there... AA: Yeah. IC: ....So plenty people are hunting in there without recording anything because there’s no check station to or from so they just don’t bother, right? They just go hunt – so if they’d be willing to put the data in a mobile application that they’ve recorded I think we’ll get more data from the remote spots where we 14 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 don’t have check stations. I’ll find out in a couple of weeks when that – how much that’s progressed. AA: OK. Thank you. JO: One thing that’s a little bit off-topic but the 16 Mile, I understand – that’s gonna be shut down soon. st IC: The week of February 25th through March 1. The DOFAW crew’s going to be clearing Morita Trail which goes right behind the more mauka portion of the range. If you guys have been up there then you know the lay of the land that’s kind of – it’s not real good right now – the range direction and the trail... ….will be hauling some material so that we can eventually start working on a better berm and trying to arrange the range in a better direction... JO: Very good... IC: Basically, turning it – if you’re looking out towards Hamakua clockwise a little bit like 15 degrees or something... JO: Right, yeah, so that we’re not shooting on to the trail, thank you... AA: Is there any way we can open – we can talk to Nick and open up the NARS area or what’s the status of the NARS area in Fern Forest? IC: Oh, they’re working on it. AA: I know that it was closed for a long time because of all the volcanic activity but now there’s no volcanic activity so – get that thing... IC: Don’t quote me on the dates but I think they have the crew to go reopen, work clearing Captain’s Trail...like in the next couple of weeks. And I don’t think they have to go back to the Board to open it – I think they can just remove the closure – but once they go clear the trail even though, you know, the hunters probably don’t care if the – I mean - don’t need the trail to be cleared, I should say, um, once that’s cleared they’re gonna re-open it. AA: And you guys gonna get more tourists in there too,? IC: Yeah. And if you’ve been there the flow pretty much shrunk the trail by like 300 meters. It kinda inundated that end part – so we’re trying to keep people from going on the flow – that’s where everyone gets lost – they go on the flow going to try to go up the puu and the clouds come and then they cannot find the... 15 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 AA: They pretty much get lost in the forest reserve itself. I... IC: But that’s supposed to open up soon – so if you had hunted there prior to the – after the closure – you could still get a permit and go hunt – you just supposed to be mauka of Captain’s Trail – if I remember correctly. So now the whole thing should be open... AA: So I think it was more makai of Captain’s Trail but could be – I mean we’d have to clarify it. IC: So now when if it re-opens it’s gonna be both – it won’t be totally open – both mauka and makai will open…A lot of people been coming for the permit but it was – you could still hunt you just had to be... AA: I don’t think too much people know about the permit process...I think a lot of people that hunting in there is just residents. IC: That’d be another spot for just same thing would be a kiosk. We don’t get any information from there cause the next one is Volcano Transfer Station, I think. So I want to figure out where to put them but that’s the same kind of situation – there’s 50 dead end subdivision roads that abut there so it’s really hard to get the masses of people that are utilizing the area, but, you know, Captain’s Trail is gonna catch a few of ‘em. AA: Thank you. BKK: Is there any other discussion? Questions? I have one. Sorry for making more of a workload for you. What are some of the priorities that the DOFAW on the East side is looking at right now for 2019? IC: Joey kind of left – not suddenly – been threatening to for a while so I’m kinda trying to fill two shoes but we’ve been trying to wrap up our cooperative GMA efforts at Kapapala - then meeting with the hunters on the East side to try to just accommodate some of their needs and situations. Right now I’m just looking at opening up access – addressing the things that are bothering the hunters the most – I mean, well, to a certain extent, you know, we have the control efforts from the different sections and stuff – it’s hard – it’s something we always have to negotiate, but, um, making the hunting that is available and hopefully will remain available more pleasant – easier to get to – I’ve had people come and tell me about delineation of areas - they like better – we are going through a rules change so we’re going through some of that – kinda treading carefully the rules change – don’t want to get in a situation where they want us to make it unlimited or whatever – I’ve been trying to just survey some of the resources so we can figure out, you know, where they are and what opportunities they might provide. Like I said though – changing the rules is hard so if we’re trying to change bag limits and stuff to help better manage 16 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 game –it takes so long – I’m looking for other solutions to try to work through that and then this is always the hard one but we’re trying to identify lands that we can turn into cooperatives – that don’t have the strict rules of forest reserves and stuff. That’s gonna boil down to lease lands and see where we can get with some of those as far as at least making cooperative – I’ll tell you right off the bat – cooperative bird hunting areas are more palatable to a lot of lessees – I don’t know why but that seems to be the way – but we need more places to hunt mammals that are not gonna be offensive to people trying to preserve, you know, just areas that may be already degraded and stuff that we can still have active hunting and managed hunting. So I’m trying to identify some of those areas and then areas where we do have animals I’ve noticed that we don’t have a lot of good data for how many are there so it’s hard for me minus what I see in the field I can’t really tell you – so I’m trying to start a more – a little bit better survey methodology so I can figure out what’s out there. BKK: What’s the preference of the survey? IC: Preference? BKK: Like preference is how you would take the survey? IC: Ah, right now it’s down and dirty fastest ones are aerial surveys for mammals. We started doing game birds surveys in Kapapala on foot – the same methodology that they did on Mauna Kea this last fall and they’re gonna do this coming up week, I think. So for game birds we’ve been trying to do – we’re doing ‘em on the ground, obviously, cause it’s hard to see ‘em from a helicopter but, um, for game mammal – at least in the open country we’re using helicopters. It doesn’t work in forested areas, you know, for pigs and stuff but there’s – it’s actually really hard to survey for pigs. BKK: And based off of your past assessments – do you think they’ve increased, decreased – the same? IC: We haven’t been doing it long enough. BKK: No? IC: We haven’t been doing it long enough. Yeah. If we do, um, see an increase or decrease I hope it’s because – if it’s a decrease I hope it’s cause we’re allowed to hunt some of ‘em but, um, it doesn’t always work that way. We’ll see what happens. TN: At legislation I heard Representative Nicole Lowen be bombarded with calls that these ungulates – goats – are now on private property – have you received any calls of the complaints of goats being in private area like Pine 17 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 Trees Café area – right there in Kona and then in Waikoloa? I’m just wondering if you received the same amount of bombardment calls that they’ve been received. IC: I get some of the goat calls but usually when I get the goat calls you guys know my counterpart – Kanalu – on the West side. I almost automatically know that it’s a West side issue so I try to send them over there – but I do get goat calls. It’s I... And I guess there’s some goat trapping going on from different individuals – I don’t know the full extent of it but I do hear a bunch of goat – I hear from time to time I hear goat issues – I get more of the pigs – pig calls. TN: So on the rule changes are you folks gonna open up the bag limit so they can be increased from just... IC: I don’t think these goats are coming off of State land. TN: No, they’re not. They’re on private land but because of the bag limits hunters are limited – if it’s on private land or, or does it apply only on... IC: I can’t control – I don’t control – the State doesn’t control take of game on private lands. Take as much as they want... TN: They can take as much as they want – OK. I’ll let her know. SM: What is the process for this rule change? Guide us through that – who we go see… TN: Is this Chapter 91 under Hawaii Administrative Rules or is this Hawaii Revised Statutes? IC: So we’re looking at 122, 123 – just – a lot of it’s cleaning it up. The process is - a lot of it is just cleaning things up but right now staff’s going through with ideas and then it gets submitted to you folks for comment/review. SM: So who we submit stuff to like we like change seasons and stuff like that? IC: Then we’ll probably work from there. SM: Will the DLNR be able to negotiate with these people, it’s like Liliuokalani and Matsuyama’s – large tracts of land – maybe they could get... IC: They could be approached. I mean they definitely could be approached, I don’t know the full extent of it but it sounds like they have resorted to trappers – I don’t know what the – I don’t know – they could be approached – if you 18 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 have a good one for Kanalu – if there’s – how big these tracts of lands are... If they’d be willing to let hunters on I don’t know. SM: Thank you. SH: Steven Hurt and this is more or less what I’ve – I’m gonna ask him the question here point bland – cause you’ve – the Department has helped Big Island Bird Hunters with some materials and stuff – if groups – like what he’s talking about – it would be beneficial if an organized group came and you wanted check station in an area – if you could provide the materials and organized group would supply the manpower to put it up – something of which they’re very short of at this point in time. IC: Definitely, if you guys want to – if it’s a better fit for a group or an organization – I’ll provide the materials for them to be put up. We do finally – I mean, I know in the past we haven’t – we finally are getting more fully staffed and actually feel like we can go somewhere cause we have our technician positions filled and stuff – so – that’s why I feel like we’re getting some stuff done, but, um, I’d always rather work with any group to accomplish small, medium, large tasks, I mean, it gets tricky cause most time groups have to work on weekends and it’s trouble, you know, we all work usually Monday through Friday but we can definitely make it happen, I mean, even road clearing like Abraham’s come to us with – get me some bodies I’ll put some staff towards it too – or some chain saws or whatever – you know, whatever it is – it’s always good. It’s good, glorious to pull weeds. SH: It’s positive. Our Big Island Bird Hunters have received help from them in excess of 25 years and it’s always been positive – I know we’ve saved these guys a lot time and we’ve erected quite a few items in assisting them. Thank you. IC: My email and my door’s open when I’m around so if you guys have questions or concerns set up a meeting and we’ll talk story and if it’s – if there’s something we can help, you know, facilitate – please – it’s always good to get info from the folks that are trying to do, you know, or like directly, yeah, and I’d rather get it on the front end then the complaining rear end of it, so... If you want to come early and then I can try and do something about it versus – oh they going do nothing, you know... SH: I think on the positive side you have people that are looking about what are you gonna do about it – see if they have people that are interested in being part of the solution and not just bringing up problems and empty handed ideas or concepts that may address what they’re looking at. KS: Howzit? My name’s Kelsey Tsuchiyama. I just came for just listen – actually – I’m interested in all these topics tonight but – I just wanted to clarify about 19 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 Kapapala Ranch lease – that’s a State lease and you said that there’s no control efforts being done on the ranch... IC: Just as far as I know... That the State’s running – I don’t know if the ranch is doing anything. KS: So the ranch has a damage control permit. IC: Ah – no, it’s not, well, they have in the past, I don’t know if they still do. KS: If they did have a damage control permit what would they be allowed to take? IC: Probably would be for pigs – I can’t say that we wrote one for sheep for them. I’ve never written one. I’ve never seen it. How’s that? KS: Could it be possible that they have a damage control permit that it would also include birds – that could include all game mammals and birds, pigs, sheep, as well as bird species because I know that on Maui birds – some of the farmers have damage control permits for the pheasants bothering the lettuce so could that damage control permit possibly affect the public hunting not only in the Kapapala Forest Reserve but also the bird hunting in the Kapapala GMA or the cooperative? IC: I’ve spent a lot of time I’m sure there’s no bird, damage – I mean, there would be no reason for them to be shooting birds – like what – how is that going to help the ranch? KS: I just curious what that permit might allow them to do – like if that permit would also – I’m just more curious if you would allow them to take Mouflon and because that ranch – because the fence is not totally enclosed between the hunting area and the ranch area if they’re taking on the ranch as part of their damage control could potentially affect the public hunting which is bordering it and not a completely enclosed fence. IC: Oh, mauka side? So the mauka fence between the forest reserve and the ranch is not sheep proof – until recently it wasn’t anything proof – but they’ve done some new five strand bar on that mauka ranch fence makai forest reserve fence so mostly to keep their cattle in. If there’s a - I’m not aware – I don’t think there’s a damage control permit – though in the past before my tenure here they had a pig trapping permit, I think, I don’t believe it’s been renewed – I could be wrong though. KS: I just would be curious about, you know, if they are drawing a permit what the numbers they’re taking and possibly like you said if the numbers are lower in the forest reserve than on the ranch well there’s no public hunting if that’s 20 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 potentially just having an impact just on the resources there – that’s my only concern – I just wanted to check on that if you had any information. IC: I think majority of the – I think the ranch harbors more sheep currently because there’s no pressure – almost no pressure – we know that we have a outlaw problem but it’s not my problem cause it’s not mine to manage it – the ranch knows they have outlaws but, um, looking at the sheep down there and looking at the sheep up mauka in the forest reserve I’d say they’re under almost no pressure in the ranch by their behavior. NP: Kelsey. So I just want to understand what I think what you’re trying to say is that in – isn’t it true – that the game resources belong to the people of Hawaii whether they’re on private land or whether they’re on public land – they are entrusted to the DLNR but they belong to the people of Hawaii – the natural game resources. So if – I – Kelsey – my impression is you’re saying like these animals, right, they are migrating – they don’t stay here – they don’t stay there – they’re moving around private land, public lands – so shouldn’t that – that damage control permit be monitored – shouldn’t it, you know, be checked on whether they’re taking liberties that they shouldn’t – is that... IC: That’s why I don’t believe there is a damage control permit cause they would have to report on it and I’ve never seen anything. NP: So that would be my concern. Is that what you’re saying? KS: That’s just what I would want to check on... Not necessarily opposed to a – about to the action but just to see maybe what those numbers are, you know, considering... JO: Where would we find these damage control permits – are they filed so they’re easily researchable or...? IC: I’ll get back to you on that. I don’t know that I’ve – I don’t know that anyone’s applied for one via me so... I’ll get back to you. OK? JO: Thank you... AA: At the next meeting we get invited again and bring your partner and we can get more info and be more prepared next meeting and... IC: I’ll be more knowledgeable... SH: Steve Hurt. This is just a side not on the discussion about the damage control and game birds. Almost all of your ranchers favor having game birds around and the purpose in that is the game birds check the pies from the cows or 21 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 sheep or whatever they’ve got in there that they want to look for grubs and worms. It’s beneficial for them in that the pies get broken off into many pieces and fertilizes the ground – the grass grows faster and better and they want the birds there so damage control Kapapala for birds non-existent. Gordon Krantz, when he was alive told me – that the more birds he saw the more he liked it because that means his cows are gonna grow better and we think back Nature 101 this is where they’re coming from. Commercial Aquarium Fishing BKK: So next up – I’m gonna give it over to Teresa to introduce the next speaker. TN: This is Teresa. Our next speaker is over on the Kona side – Eric Koch is with the Aquarium Collectors and he’s gonna give us an update on their EIS study that is ordered by the Supreme Court. EK: My name is Eric Koch – I’m a commercial fisherman and an aquarium fisherman and a farmer. I reside in Naalehu down by South Point and I came here, I guess, so I could speak about the EIS but I also wanted to give you guys a brief review just kind of on the background and the history of the aquarium fishery particularly in West Hawaii – the West Hawaii Fishery Management Area. The fisheries been actually going on in the State – at the State level for – since the mid-Fifties and it was primarily on Oahu at the time and then thorough out the Fifties the Sixties and, I believe, most of the Seventies about 1980 – I guess it was – it started to spread to the outer- islands and it’s remained relatively a small fishery throughout the time – reason being is that it’s not really a giant industry so it’s kind of – people come and go through it over time – but there’s actually in the – 1979 is when management started DLNR/DAR started to put regulations and rules toward the fishery and there’s actually been three substantial rules packages that have been passed – the most important one being Act 306 – that was done in 1999 and implemented in 2000, I believe it was and what that actually did is it set up a – what’s known as the West Hawaii Fishery Management Area, which is from Ka Lae, South Point up to Upolu Point – the northern tip of the West Side of the Big Island – there’s a Coast Guard station – that’s Upolu Point up there – geographically speaking the whole management area is 145 miles long and in this management area there’s eleven separate “No Take’ areas that have been established – whether they’re Fish Replenishment Areas known by the acronym FRA; Fish Management Areas – which is known as FMA; or MLCD, which is a Marine Life Conservation District. FMAs and FRAs are aquarium specific – they only apply to aquarium fishermen and there’s nine of those, I believe, and then there’s two MLCDs up along the coastline – Marine Life Conservation District – and that applies to any sort of marine resource extraction – any type of fishing – it doesn’t matter what it is it’s kapu. When you total up all these fishery management areas – the FMAs, 22 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 the FRAs, and the MLCDs it encompasses 37% of the coastline on the West side of the Big Island, so it’s – and that’s been in place since 1999-2000 – in addition to that they set up some other regulations and rules such as labeling the boat – you have to put AQ – it has to be a certain size – one foot high, six inches wide, one inch block letters on a contrasting background. A pennant that has to be flown on the boat that it’s a yellow pennant but has an A on it so that people from the shoreline can clearly observe you if you’re out there aquarium fishing – and that was pretty much that for Act 306. They did another rules making process in 2014 – it actually began in 2012 and it wrapped up in 2014 – it was implemented in 2014 – I forgot the HAR code on it but basically what that one was is it established further regulations – it created what’s called a white list – it’s a list of approved species – so originally before pre-2014, pre-2015 you could take any type of marine fish, basically, there really wasn’t any restrictions or rules. This further defined what the aquarium fishery was actually allowed to catch so it reduced the amount of species available – the aquarium fishery from my belief 230-40 approved species – so that’s what’s known as the white list. In addition to that – there was bag limits and size restrictions and what’s called a slot limit – that was put on the top three fish of the fishery: the top three fish of the fishery, number 1 is the Yellow Tang, the Hawaiian name on it is Lau’ipala – the second fish is the Kole Tang – and the third fish is the Pakakui, which is also known as the Achilles Tang. Those three fish are the top three landed fish in the fishery and they account for 97% of the entire fishery – what’s landed and reported. The other 3% would be the balance of the white list – the other 37 fish on the 40 fish white list – they make up 3% of fish landed so it’s a much smaller amount. So primarily the focus in the aquarium fishery are those top three fish – of those top three fish Kole and Pakakui are taken at a much lower rate than the Yellow Tang. The Yellow Tang – it’s pretty much a Yellow Tang fishery because Yellow Tangs are in extremely high density – they’re very abundant – especially along the coastlines of the Big Island of Hawaii. It’s the number one place. Yellow Tangs come from other places in the world – they can – they actually span all the way over to the Philippines and Guam but they’re not in close to the same concentrations – they actually think the Yellow Tang originated in the Hawaiian Island and actually it did like a reverse – after it kind of adapted and evolved over a long, long period of time it actually started to spread back toward the Mid-Pacific, which is kind of unusual – a lot of fish actually radiate the other way – from like the end of Pacific out – but in this case – some of the fish have evolved in Hawaii for such a long time some of them are actually bouncing back out and that’s how they’re spreading that way. The Yellow Tang is the number one fish landed, like I said, the populations on the Yellow Tang – let me get back to the regulations, I’m sorry – so the bag limit and the size restriction, the slot limits – so what it is, is for the Yellow Tang it has a slot limit on it – which means you can catch fish from 2” to 4.5” inside that slot. You’re not allowed to catch under or over – there’s a bag limit. You can take 5 over or 5 under of, you know, like over 4.5 or under 2” per diver per day. The Kole Tang – it’s not a 23 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 slot limit – you’re just not allowed to take anything over – I want to say it’s 4 inches but it might be 4.5 inches. So like a fairly larger Kole Tang. You can take – there’s a bag limit – you can take five oversized per day and then the Pakakui – the Achilles Tang – there’s a bag limit of ten fish per diver per day – and that’s pretty much that. The aquarium fishery, though, is different than a lot of other fisheries because primarily what it does is it targets small fish that are still in their juvenile phase and I don’t know if you guys are very familiar with how that works but typically – especially with reef fish – they’re in the highest densities post recruitment – like they really have a high fecundity rate – they reproduce at an extremely high amount on a very regular basis and they’re kind of at the bottom of the food chain as far as – they’re not like an Apex predator or anything – they’re actually more a part of the food web – feeding other types of fish and obviously performing their duties eating algae and things like that or whatever they consume – but they’re highly abundant and there’s large quantities of them and they pretty much recruit on to Hawaii’s reefs from about March until November – it correlates with the spawning season so we have, you know, our water in Hawaii is typically warm 8 months of the year and it’s really only like four months of the year when we kinda have drops in temperatures and things like that and when that occurs reproduction – the broadcast spawning of all these reef fish slows down and that’s when there’s less recruitment occurring – and when I say “recruitment” what that is, is these fish are all broadcast spawners – meaning at dusk all the fish from the reef of a particular type – let’s say Yellow Tang – they all gather up – they kind of follow a trail and they’ll go out to the edge of the reef and they’ll form a big hui out there and they’ll start spinning around and oscillating and ones will start popping up into the center casting egg and the other ones will cast roe and it fertilizes them – from that point – and this is a huge congregation of fish – if you can use your imagination – this is like all the Yellow Tangs on that one particular reef – you know, there could be thousands even – coming together right there doing this thing and they’re all reproducing on it – and this actually occurs on a daily basis – with the heaviest egg development being around the full moon – one Yellow Tang can produce on average 75,000 to 100,000 viable eggs per fish. Some of the ones that are a little bit more – have more vitality – like a younger adult can produce upwards to 150,000 – so double that – of vital eggs and that can actually be on a daily basis – they create eggs that quickly and what happens is once these eggs are fertilized then this broadcast spawn – they go through a period of metamorphosis – they’re drifting – they’re bound to the rules of the environment – they get – the current kind of dictates where they go – they get swept out into the gyre – there’s a gyre that runs on the west coast of the Big Island and they kind of move around there in their planktonic phase. Yellow Tangs, for example, have a larvae phase of approximately 50-55 days... TN: Could you get on with the EIS study that the Supreme Court... EK: The Supreme Court – well it kind of ties into – so we had all these that we put into place and over the years we’ve had many things at the County and the 24 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 State level legislatively where people have tried to – these environmental groups have came in and they’ve tried to ban the fishery. It’s been largely unsuccessful because of all the management that’s been put into place – it’s the most studied fishery in the State of Hawaii – it’s got more data and research on a federal and a state level than any other fishery within the state and so legislatively these environmental groups have had – and these are mostly mainland environmental groups such as Earth Justice and things like that – collaborating with local partners – they’ve – they haven’t had a whole lot of success at the legislature and so what they did was about four or five years ago they went to circuit court and they tried to get the fisheries shut – they wanted an environmental review – HIPA – what’s known as HIPA – it’s like an impact statement or an environmental analysis done – at the first court they got shut down – the second court – the appellate court – it got shut down – finally got kicked up to the supreme court – the supreme court, you know, the Attorney General of this state – he didn’t feel that the permit – the way that the structure of the permitting that was done for the state that HIPA applied – I actually agree with him – I do not think it should apply – I think that that’s quite alarming for any fishery or any permitted resource extraction – whether you’re talking aquarium fishing or any - your commercial marine license. TN: Where are you folks at with the EIS study? EK: That’s what I’m getting to – so basically what’s going on is the supreme court issued the injunction and they said that we needed to be HIPA compliant so they applied HIPA to a fishery – a regulated managed fishery from – that’s already overseen by the state – they made us do it so what we did was partnered up with a group actually from the mainland that was gonna help co- fund – it’s a very expensive process to do this and very time consuming – so we teamed up with a group called PIJAC – which is the Pet Industry Joint Advisory Council – they’re based out of Washington, DC – and we began doing the HIPA process right, I think, January or February of 2018. The first thing that we did was we did, you know, there’s kind of a chain of command – you’ve got to do through the HIPA process. Step one is what’s known as your EA – your environmental Analysis – so that was the first thing that we did through most of 2018 – we had the – there was like some public hearing stuff on it and then ultimately Chair Case from DLNR – she thought that it would be more proper to do a full environmental impact statement – so she denied the EA and asked for us to do the EIS. So what we did was we agreed to do – we had to come up with more money from our stakeholders to do it and now we’re doing the EIS. The only difference between and EIS and an EA – all your scientific analysis and data and your measuring of impact is done within the EA document pretty much what’s left to do is what’s known as a CIS – a cultural impact statement – that’s pretty much what makes the difference between an EA and an EIS. So currently, that’s where we sit today. We’re working on – we’ve hired a company that’s based in Hilo and basically what 25 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 they’re doing is, is they’re going around and they’re talking to different kupunas and people that have ancestral knowledge or a spiritual connection – aumakua – things like that – so they’re kind of going to – we’ve narrowed the scope of the document so instead of doing the entire Island we’re only doing the West Hawaii Fishery Management Area – that 145 mile stretch that I was describing when I was kind of giving you guys the background – so this company that’s doing the EIS – they’re going to the different ahupuaas and the kupunas in the area up and down the West coast of the Big Island and spending less time in the areas where the FRAs are – like the current – if we don’t fish there – like the management – like I was telling you – that’s kinda why I was giving you guys the background – it’s kind of complicated but the areas we don’t fish – they’re spending less time there because there doesn’t need to be a whole lot of dialogue in particular that helps the land board make their determination or the chair – so they’re kind of focusing more specifically in the areas where there is – you can measure an impact, right, there is actually fishing taking place – so that’s kind of where we’re at right now – so basically this company ASM – it’s who we contracted out – and they’re currently involved in the interview process and we as a group have reached out to our community to a lot of different fishermen and people that we know that are of Hawaiian descent that wanted to participate in this discussion and that’s where we’re currently are sitting right now is it’s just a process of interviewing and they’ll talk story with one guy and he’ll say, oh, you need – go talk to these guys over here and it’s just like one thing leads to another but the whole process is supposed to take another six to eight months before it’s completed. TN: Are you waiting for an EIS study to be done which the dateline should be completed in six months? Does it include Maui, Oahu, Kauai, Lanai, Molokai. EK: Six to eight months, and EIS study only applies to West Hawaii. TN: It’s only on this Island. EK: Specifically, it’s just the management area... TN: The 37% of the coastline – from Upolu Point to Ka Lae? EK: The reason we did that is because this management area – this big rules package – this Act 306 that was done in 1999-2000 was significant. When they set this thing up there’s no other fisheries that have these types of rules and this intensive a set-up that’s been done – so I’m – we limit it to this area because that’s where the most of the data is – we can prove our case – we can measure impact and there’s research and studies. We’re not just pulling numbers out of the air... 26 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 TN: Do you have any current data given to you by DAR as to the sustainability and could you share that with us. EK: I’m not prepared right now with all this stuff on me – but what I could do is I can forward copies of pertinent information to you guys and then you’ll have to look at it in your leisure. A lot of it’s real long – I don’t really have any condensed version – a lot of these studies are several, several, I mean, forty, fifty pages long – but what I could do is I can send these things over to you and I’ll point out page numbers and things like that, paragraphs to look at – you can kind of see for yourself what I’m talking about, but, yeah... Yeah, there’s absolutely – there’s plenty of studies... TN: Because the fishery is dependent upon its ability to be sustainable, right? And so the EIS study is gonna show us that the fisheries either is not sustainable or is sustainable, right. Isn’t that what they’re looking at and isn’t that what the conservationists are saying – that the fisheries are not sustainable for marine collecting? EK: The Earth Justice and these environmental groups that doing this, yeah, they’re saying that it’s not sustainable and that there’s all these problems. They’ve actually shifted their argument over the years – it’s gone from moral issues kind of like what the gentleman earlier was talking about Mr. Hurt – with the PETA people. You know they started out talking about moral issues like you know don’t expose a fish to air – don’t withhold the fish’s food – don’t do this – it’s inhumane – all this kind of stuff to – now we’re in cultural, you know, like is this fish culturally, is it, you know, is it a significant fish... TN: We have to sum it up over here and so we’ll wait until the EIS study is done and then we can go forward from there and so if you could forward any research that shows that aquarium collecting is sustainable in Hawaii and there’s not a lack of or depletion of marine species – that would help us support efforts, the same fish you catch for aquarium collecting – those are the same fish that people eat – your Pakapui – your Kole... TN: You know, and DAR Division is telling us fishermen because of the RPL issue that we’ve depleted the resources here so... You know, your studies would be very important to us. BKK: Does any of the other commissioners have any questions? OK. Eric if you can just take a minute or two – just to summarize and then we’ll just move forward – I also wanted to thank you for coming over today. EK: In summary this is just more informative – we were asked to come and kind of discuss what’s going on – I guess the only take-away thing that I would kind 27 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 of understanding what you all’s commission’s about here – I would say that you guys should be particularly paying close attention to the application of HIPA law to fisheries or any game stuff for that stuff for that matter – any permitted activity because that’s what they did – is they went throught he permitting process and the structure of the permit process in the state – anything is susceptible to this same attack and that’s troublesome when you start talking about small groups – for example – right now there’s a currently a bill at the legislative level where they’re saying the lay net guys – the guys that use lay net – they’re gonna have to go through – if they want to have their permit renewed or reissued to them from the state – they’re gonna have to get a HIPA review done. Now, I mean, that may sound fine and dandy to a lot of people but the reality is, is that’s basically a ban because the lay net guys don’t have the resources to go and muster that sort of a review – I mean these guys are – these things are hundreds of thousands of dollars. TN: The committee – the WTL Committee tabled the lay net issue and is asking Chairperson Susanne Case to define certain wording of her bill so the bill got tabled and if it doesn’t go through this Friday it may not be passed. EK: That’s how a lot of bills get deferred, triple deferred, double deferred – I mean I get all that – I guess my point is though is that you already see it occurring. You see – like you look at our status – and the automatic these guys are switching over to doing it to another fishery. That’s my whole point – it’s not necessarily about the, you know, where this bill currently sits for lay net guys – that’s not the point at all – the point is that this line of attack will be used over and over and over again and it will be applied to fish and it’s – the people that are pushing these things – they’re not even from Hawaii – they don’t even live here – they’re from the mainland and they’ve got millions and millions of dollars and they come in and they start dictating rules and they start using these loop holes and the reality is, is that fishermen, fisheries – they don’t have the resources or the organization to fight these guys – these guys have lawyers on tap – you know, big – these are big firms, you know, so that’s why... TN: Thank you, Eric. Yeah... BKK: Some of the correspondence – can you work with Donna and send it to her and then she’ll email it all to the commissioners. EK: OK... BKK: And then she’ll send it over to all of us. OLD BUSINESS 28 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 Committee Assignments - Chairmanship BKK: We’re moving forward with Old Business under Committee assignments. In the last meeting we had a discussion on whether or not we should proceed with a chairperson for each committee – these individual five committees are: Government Affairs, Rules, Traditional and Customary Practices, Shooting Range Working Group, Public Relations and Communication Committees. Is there a motion on the table to bring this back? Teresa Nakama moved to bring the rules back on the table. Seconded by Nani Pogline and carried unanimously by a voice vote. BKK: That was A. going over to B. We tabled the combining of Public Relations and the Communications Committee – is there a motion on the table? Combining Public Relations and the Communications Committee BKK: There is a second. Is there any discussion? OK. The only concern I have about this one is who is gonna be the member of those committees and I think we looked at those before. So unless we want to bring that up to discussion it would be an amendment – how would that work? MH: It doesn’t need to be an amendment because that’s just a rule – like only a GMAC member can chair a commission so it just is what it is. There’s no need to... TN: Thank you. MH: So basically no non-commissioned members can chair any committees... AA: I’m not sure if this is the time to state this but Malia what’s the status or information that you found on about the going about communications versus like doing a website or doing Internet things? BKK: Teresa Nakama moved to combing the Public Relations and the Communications Committee. Seconded by Jim O’Keefe and carried unanimously by a voice vote. BKK: I believe the people that were on the Public Relations Committee and the Communications Committee were two of the same – so we’ll just have those members combined as one. OK. All in favor of the main motion to combine the Public Relations and the Communications Committees say aye. All 29 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 opposed? Motion carries. Under C. Proposed GMAC rules – hopefully you folks had time to review. Proposed GMAC Rules MH: Just one point of order. Is it gonna be called the Public Relations Communications Committee or just? BKK: No, it would just be Public Relations. It would just be the Public Relations Committee unless anybody had another name – another classy name for it? No? MH: Just wanted to clarify, OK, thank you. BKK: Moving to the proposed GMAC Rules – hopefully everybody had time to read through it – sorry Abraham... AA: I think we should table this one cause I never get chance to read any of the proposed GMAC meetings or I didn’t receive a binder yet. JO: Yes. I wasn’t here even though I was listed as here. So I did not get a binder. BKK: OK. We will – is there anybody that wants to add stuff in before we move on? TN: Could I just clarify what the rule would read...Rule would read … we’ll assert that any commission member representing GMAC who would want to convey any verbal or written communication or correspondence... BKK: No, the proposed GMAC rules - was in the binder that we gave out. TN: Thank you for the clarification. Shoreline fishing Registry, Permit, and License (RPL) – Letter to Mayor Harry Kim BKK: We’re gonna go ahead and table the proposed GMAC rules – moving on to letter D. Shoreline Fishing – Registry Permit and License RPL – and there was a letter to Mayor Harry Kim. Haven’t heard anything back so there’s no status on that – on the letter E. Shooting Range – there was a letter that went out to Council Member Richards because he had requested information regarding the Shooting Range and I’d talked to Tom regarding what the updates were... AA: So letter D – we’re just tabling that for now or? 30 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 BKK: It was just an update. So the letter was sent out and then from there it’s being held in the Mayor’s Office. AA: Maybe the next meeting we gonna update on it? BKK: Hopefully by then we’ll have an update by then. AA: OK. Thank you. Shooting Range – Letter to Council Member Richards BKK: Same thing with letter E – which is the Shooting Range. And that was the letter to Council Member Richards, who we bumped into at the State Capitol. OK. Anybody have any Old Business they wanna – oh, I have an Old Business – before I forget. Stanley I bring you gifts – I have a County Code for you, um, it was also emailed from Valerie Poindexter and the County Clerk, um, so it kinda outlines – there is mauka and makai to it so I don’t know if there’s other County ordinances that have that language in there – so from my understanding it’s still in the works. SM: The reason I brought that up the last meeting was because – Bower – the guy from Na Ala Hele Trails – told me that it wasn’t – so that’s why I brought ‘em up – but now according to Val it’s in there already but it – maybe we can just tweak ‘em a little so that they, you know, they, they pay attention to it. BKK: It is in the Hawaii County Code...And then there was two ordinances that had specifically mountain and they didn’t specify mauka or makai...there was just shoreline and mountain. But, if there was anything out of the ordinary – I asked them just to send it over to us. SM: Thank you. NEW BUSINESS: Slaughter House BKK: Is there any other Old Business? OK. Under New Business – the 7a is Slaughter House... This topic has been brought up a couple of times in my district – I’m sure on Teresa’s as well, um, and then talking to Stanley – so I think that with this as a topic – I think we should send a letter to Mayor Kim – he’s gonna love all my letters but, um, send a letter in support of future Slaughter Houses and how we can work with that community to help build those up – so that being said – because it is a letter and correspondence to the Mayor I kinda wanta bring it up to – if that’s something that GMAC would want to push forward. 31 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 BKK: Teresa Nakama moved to send a letter to Mayor Kim showing support for Slaughter Houses being proposed in the Island of Hawaii. Seconded by Abraham Antonio and carried unanimously by voice vote. Commercial Aquarium Fishing TN: No, since I learned that at being at legislation last week that the EIS study is only for this Island and only on the West side of Hawaii Island and each island does not have to comply with what we do here – and each island has their own rules – Maui is very strict and Oahu now has a bill that was tabled besides the Net Bill being tabled and the Aquarium Prohibiting Aquarium Collecting on Oahu has been tabled also – so I’ll keep an eye on this and report back to the group on the next round of legislation reports. AA: That Net Bill – was it just for Oahu or was it for the whole State? TN: For the State of Hawaii. AA: That’s what I heard – it was for the whole State so that’s not kinda cool. TN: There were more opposition than there was support for it and the opposition came from the fishing community because they did not give the opportunity for DLNR of DAR Division to go to the public and inform them that this bill is out there. COMMITTEE REPORTS Government Relations – Bills update/Testimony BKK: Under section – what is it number 8 – under Committee Reports – anything from the Government Relations – as a bill update/testimony? NP: I have a partial update. As far as committees go – I would like someone in this committee to take responsibility for the bills related to the rights to bear arms – if anybody would focus on just those it would be really great to report about them... JO: I think that may be something in my bailiwick... BKK: Teresa you had an update on bills, right, oh, no, Stanley – or one of your two or three... 32 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 NP: I got an update on some of the bills. Mainly the ones that we voted on – OK, so HB 590, HD 1 – that was the bill requiring transparency, accountability from the DLNR involving the Wildlife Revolving Fund – the State commission GMAC have a say in the use of the funds and that bill – it was introduced and passed in the Legislature - SB 1226 – it went to the Water, Land and Hawaiian Affairs Committee and it passed with amendments and then... NP: and then it goes to the Energy, Environmental Protection and that passed with amendments and now it’s headed toward Judiciary, so, so far so good – I don’t know – but the amendments are scary – so that’s the thing – so HB 591 – asking the DLNR to obtain approval from the State GMAC when taking lands from public hunting areas and putting them in watershed – that bill also passed in the same way – in the same. So, and it’s also referred to Judiciary. And then – SB 324 – we’re all saying support – but then – the amendment of the wording changed so drastically that now this morning we’re like – say opposed. So these things are really tricky because the reason why is because the wording got changed so that we, we had it originally in the bill we voted on – was that the bill – I’m sorry – the bill would say that DLNR has to collaborate, consult and work with the State GMAC in relationship to a watershed decisions – projects and plans but they changed the word to – they will give just prior notice to their actions and so that goes back to the dictatorship we’re fighting against all along. So... It’s really a tricky, slippery fish so we, ah, and then we just had till 2:00 today with very little notice. I wrote in a testimony – a few other people did opposing the language so hopefully, um, we’ll have some result – I don’t know yet. BKK: If I recall from that bill – the Attorney General’s Office was there and present and they were concerned about the language of the word “consult” and due to the State GMAC not necessarily having a watershed background was one of the – was one of the concerns from that. NP: The problem is that watershed is so ambiguous. What is watershed land? So that leaves the public still vulnerable if they’re just gonna have prior notice of what they’re doing rather than having more of a working relationship – it’s just scary to me, so... TN: This passage of the bill at this point with the changing of the wording is only th 1/4 of the stage of the bill so we still have time to oppose and maybe change the wording again... th BKK: It’s 2/4 now. NP: So it’s on its way to the Ways and Means Committee now... SB 324... So, um, let’s see... SB 324 – that also has been – let’s see what I – OK – I’m confused st in my – yeah, that also has been passed 1 readings and it’s going, yeah... 33 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 BKK: I was actually there for that one... NP: Good news there... And then the other bill that we never voted on following this but I’ve been following is HB 265 about the eradication of the deer on Molokai – so at first the bill was that they would all be eradicated but now the language is changed that they would be managing – DLNR is seeking funds to manage the access deer populations and substantially reduce and eradicate other invasive species which is kind of non-descript but, um, it was a real concern cause the people on Molokai depend a lot on the resource of the axis deer. BKK: Can I make a recommendation for this one – in this bill – the correspondence has already begun on with Teresa since she was at the Capitol so maybe it would be best for Teresa to start a conversation with some of the legislators on behalf... TN: I was approached by their House Representative from Molokai, Maui and Lanai to converse with her regarding this bill and I’ll follow through with that and share whatever she shares with me – I’ll share it with the members of this committee and body. BKK: And before I forget this probably – I should send a letter to Mr. Kim regarding this as well before we start the correspondence... BKK: Teresa Nakama moved to start correspondence to Mayor Kim to have an exchange of information between the Representative of Molokai, Maui and Lanai regarding HB 265. Seconded by Nani Pogline and carried unanimously by voice vote. Traditional Customary Practices BKK: Under Section 8b – Traditional and Customary Practices – you have any reports? TN: I sent in my report for last month and I’m drafting the report for this legislative experience and you’ll get it by next week. Thank you. BKK: All right, thank you. OK, so we got 8c Public Relations and we’ve combined Public Relations with the Communications Committee so I’ll go ahead, Nani... Public Relations NP Tom’s not here to give us the Shooting Range Working Group Report – so, um, Public Relations I would say comes under Pig Hunters of Hawaii and I 34 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 want to take just a little moment here to welcome Abraham Antonio to our Commission. Welcome. And he’s heading up Pig Hunters of Hawaii and the first meeting – February 28 at the Shipman Park Pavilion – he could use all the support he can get – this is a really great thing to promote our game resources at 6:00 pm. AA: I would like to invite all the members that can make it out to that meeting just so we can – you guys can introduce yourselves. I not too sure how much people gonna be there or what districts are coming but just so we get this problem with communicating with the hunters and the public so you guys can introduce your guys selves and also give a little maybe insight about your guys selves and what we’re promoting and eventually we can work with Ian and have DOFAW come to the meetings just and you know so the public can know more or less what DOFAW does and DLNR does cause I think there’s a lack of education of what people do... GH: We have a March 22 and March 23 Basic Hunter Education Certification Class happening at Pahala – DLNR’s putting this on and we’re gonna be using the County Multi-Purpose Room and Gym there so... If everybody can spread the word we’d greatly appreciate it and I really want to try to encourage a lot of the teenagers in the community who love hunting to come out to this class and get certified. BKK: Thank you for emailing that to us. We’ll get it to the Commissioners – what time is that at? GH: The first night starts at 5:45p and goes till 10:00. And then the second day is March 23 – it’s from 7:45a to 5:00p. JO: Grayson – how many slots – how many students will you be able to accommodate? GH: Well, I spoke with DLNR and they – we were playing around with numbers like 50 to 70 so that really will surprise me in how much we could handle – so the gist of it was the more the merrier – especially if they’re from that community. If you have been to the Kau District Gym – it’s beautiful – it’s nice – it’s a huge multi-purpose room and beautiful gym so it should be able to accommodate quite a bit of people. JO: Very well... AA: Is that just a two-day event cause usually the hunter education course is three days... GH: Yes. The beginning part is online, I believe the entire class is 12 hour class. 35 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 AG: Allen Gimmer of DLNR West Hawaii Hunter Safety Instructor. So the class is 12 hours – the11th hour is the test and there is an online version that avoids the first 8 hours of the class – but this is the full \[unclear\]. AA: So, again, this is just a two day class instead of a normal 3 day. Usually, I want to maybe take my son out there cause in Hilo I don’t see – I going on line I don’t see no classes coming up in Hilo anytime soon and I just was on there two weeks ago and I’ll be interested to taking my son out there so he wouldn’t really – he’s not ready to go out and do online course – that’s why instead of going the three days – that’s why I’m asking if it’s just two days – cause he’s not ready to do the online section. AG: Please have him sign up – we’d be happy to have him. NP: One other thing real quick – the public access issue – Stanley has been having meetings down Hamakua about the access issues and talking to Valerie Poindexter and I think this is an issue we really should pursue and as far as making access to mauka and makai as a policy – so did you have anything to say about that Stanley? SM: I reported last time – it’s in the hands of Valerie and Bob Masuda. BKK: OK. I have one more for PR. I have the Turkey Federation Hunting Heritage Banquet at the Kona Imin Center in Holualoa - that’s on Saturday, February 23, he gives me a group text but doesn’t give me a time – so if you have any questions text Jon Sabati. OK. Any other from Public Relations – without hearing – OK – so we’re gonna over to d. – nothing from Tom for a Shooting Range Working Group? Shooting Range Working Group JO: Nothing. Communications Committee BKK: And Communications Committee combined with the Public Relations – any commissioners’ reports by district? BKK: Going back up to Public Relations – we had a discussion at last meeting about social media and the website – that’s one thing I forgot to follow-up on, sorry... Malia do you know anything? 36 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 MH: I also forgot to follow-up – sorry – this meeting caught me by surprise, so... I will go back and now that we’ll have a proper space between meetings I’ll go check it out – the IT policies and stuff. BKK: So we’ll table that for now. We didn’t have any commissioners’ reports – is there a report. COMMISSIONNERS’ REPORTS BY DISTRICT AA: I’d just like to say – thank you and I’m looking forward to working with everybody. JO: Thank you. TN: Welcome aboard. JO: Thank you, Abraham... One thing before that motion – next meeting date? Are we doing the second Tuesday? th BKK: March 19. ADJOURNMENT: BKK: Teresa Nakama moved to adjourn the meeting at 8:30 pm. Seconded by Nani Pogline. Motion carried unanimously by voice vote. Respectfully submitted by: Donna Urban-Higuchi Secretary ATTEST: Bronsten “Kalei” Kossow, Chairperson 37 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – February 12, 2019 38