HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN FC 2022/03/09 2020-2022 Committee on Finance
29th Session
Hawaii County Building
25 Aupuni Street
Hilo, Hawaii
March 9, 2022
CALL TO The regular meeting of the Committee on Finance was called to order at
ORDER: 9:00 a.m., in the Council Chambers, Hilo, by Mr. Matt Kaneali`i- Kleinfelder,
Chair.
ROLL CALL:
Present: Mr. Matt Kaneali`i- Kleinfelder, Chair
Ms. Heather L. Kimball, Vice Chair
Mr. Aaron S. Y. Chung, Member
Ms. Maile Medeiros David, Member
Mr. Holeka Goro Inaba, Member
Ms. Ashley L. Kierkiewicz, Member
Ms. Susan L. K. Lee Loy, Member
Mr. Herbert M. "Tim" Richards III, Member
Ms. Rebecca Villegas, Member (via videoconference, came in later)
STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business,
FROM THE Statements from the Public on Agenda Items.
PUBLIC ON
AGENDA ITEMS: The following individuals registered to speak regarding Comm. 644, and came
forward when called by the Chair:
Kevin McCabe.
Maile Melrose.
Patricia Todd.
Rose Schilt.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: We are now closing public testimony
and moving on to the businesses of the day. Mr. Clerk let's go to Communication
636, please.
Change Order As directed by the Chair and with no objection from the Council Members,
of Business: the following items were taken out of order:
FC-29 March 9,2022
Comm. 636: FOLLOW-UP AUDIT OF THE DEPARTMENT OF HUMAN RESOURCES'
HIRING PRACTICES —REPORT NO. 2017-03
From County Auditor Tyler J. Benner, dated February 7, 2022, transmitting the
above report pursuant to Hawaii County Charter Section 3-18(d)(3).
; and
Comm. 636.1: From County Auditor Tyler J. Benner, dated January 21, 2022, transmitting a
Flyer describing the Fraud, Waste, and Whistleblower Hotlines.
Motion to Close File: Ms. Lee Loy moved to close file on Comms. 636
and 636.1 Seconded by Mr. Inaba.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: We do have here with us today,
Mr. Tyler Benner, our County Auditor; and Mr. Leopoldino, our Acting Director
for the Human Resources Department. If you would, gentlemen, come up to the
front. And you did provide us with a few documents here, but if you could just
discuss and give us kind of a high-level overview of what was the result and
where we stand and your thoughts and the matter.
(Note: At this time, County Auditor Tyler Benner came forward to
address the members of the Committee.)
MR. BENNER: And then remember to push the button when you go to speak,
and then introduce yourself for the record, please.
MR. BENNER: Thank you, Council. Good to be with you today. Tyler Benner,
County Auditor. I appreciate the opportunity to present to you today. What we're
presenting here is the Department of Human Resources' hiring practices follow-
up audit, and it's Report No. 2022-01, dated February 7.
I'm going to start with a quick publication education piece here. Going back to
our original audit,page 15. I'll read this directly:
"In March 2013, the Staffing Review Committee was established by the
prior Office of the Mayor and the DHR to manage the Request to Fill
(RTF)process. The SRC determined:
o the method of recruitment(i.e., internal recruitment, external
recruitment, etc.),
o the selection process (SRC to conduct selection or the department
can conduct) and
o confirms the selection process (indicates person selected, date of
hire, and the SRC representative signature).
Departments were instructed not to make any employment or appointment
offers without first receiving SRC confirmation of the selection process."
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So that is really key to what caused the initial hiring practices audit. A body was
put into place, and that body was able to exert influence in and throughout
processes. They were able to pick methods to be able to select people, internal or
external, based on candidates that they desired, and then they were able to walk
through that process and circumvent segregation of duties. So that is what caused
us to have that audit conducted in 2017. This became a very open secret in 2014,
2015, 2016, and really festered by 2017 when we finally conducted this audit.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Wow. Just for the public, what does SRC
stand for?
MR. BENNER: The SRC is the Staffing Review Committee.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay.
MR. BENNER: Okay?
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yeah.
MR. BENNER: All right. The power of appointment should lie with the
appointing authority. So HRS (Hawai`i Revised Statutes) 76-11 has the definition
of the appointing authority as the department head or designee having the power
to make appointments or change the status of employees. So the goal of the
original audit was to put that power back into the hands of the appointing
authority.
So based on that audit, we had made eight recommendations. Today we found
that the appointing authority determines the method and provides justification to
the Mayor and Council based on the position. The Department of Human
Resources refers the list to the department for interviews. Eligible lists are viable
for six months to a year. For open repetitive—excuse me, open competitive
recruitment, top five ranked applicants are sent to the department for interviews.
And for registered recruitment, the Department of Human Resources selects ten
random candidates for interviews.
The department can ask for the entire list but must reach out and disposition
the entire list. Disposition is tracked during NeoGov, and date and time-stamped,
and it creates a very clear audit trail. Appointing authority makes the hire. So
based on that explanation, do you folks have some questions for me?
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Benner. Council
Members, questions?
MR. INABA: Chair?
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CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Mr. Inaba, go ahead.
MR. INABA: Thank you. Good morning, Mr. Benner. If you could for the
record explain to us and the public the difference between completed versus
resolved in the report?
MR. BENNER: Yeah, absolutely. So completed, we have as a sufficient and
appropriate evidence that was available to support all aspects of the
recommendation; whereas, resolved is the department implemented an alternative
solution that fully addresses the audit findings or risks. So for example, one of
our recommendations was to approach the State, and to ask them to bring back
some rules regarding prohibited personnel hiring practices that they had repealed.
And although the department did reach out, they were unable to get them to put
those rules back into place. So instead, the department acted internally to
strengthen its own controls to a measure that would sufficiently mitigate that.
MR. INABA: Thank you. And this initial audit, to confirm, was initiated in
2017?
MR. BENNER: That is correct.
MR. INABA: And was completed ?
MR. BENNER: It was completed in 2017.
MR. INABA: Got it. And this follow-up began ?
MR. BENNER: I believe we entranced in, in around November of 2021.
MR. INABA: Okay. And the timeframe in which we conducted this follow-up
and reviewed, you know, what the department had done, was over the course of
how many months? A couple months?
MR. BENNER: We looked at the interview packets that were audited in the
positions that were originally identified, which was the Department of Public
Works, Laborer; the Finance, Clerk III; the Park and Recreation, Park Caretaker,
and the Department of Environmental Management—Scale Attendant. We
looked at an audited packet that was done in 2020.
(Note: At this time, Human Resources Director Waylen Leopoldino came
forward to address the members of the Committee).
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Waylen Leopoldino, Director of Human Resources. If I
may just add to that? The audit report states that the County Auditor actually
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picked up from late 2017 to current. So they did testing on, as our Auditor is
saying, our interview packets that went back as far as 2018 to current.
MR. INABA: Okay, thank you very much. Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. Ms. Kierkiewicz,
go ahead.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. Thank you both for being here. Could
you just help me better understand, and I'm sorry if you mentioned this already,
but in terms of sending ranked names to directors,why five? What was the issue
with submitting the entire the list, and identifying eligibility, or where someone
was not meeting requirement in the job description? I'm just trying to understand
the danger of sharing the entire list, and how folks were fully vetted and scored.
Director, go ahead. And congratulations of becoming the Director.
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Thank you.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yeah, thank you.
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Thank you. So I just kind of wanted to shed some
light. So I had short stint as a recruitment manager. Historically the five-plus
high scores rule that—it was—it was in place for a long time before the change,
where the department would receive the entire eligible list. So if you can imagine
when a department receives the entire eligible list, and we're leaving it up to the
department to whittle down that list based on skillsets that's developed. And so
we were getting—our department, we were getting some concerns about that, and
we wanted to address that. And we felt that as part of this audit, to kind of have a
little bit more, not control but little bit more guidance with the department, we
decided to reinstitute the five-plus high scores because it was working for so long.
And so the thought behind that is that we would rank an entire eligible list based
on if we're instituting an E&E, which is called an Education and Experience
exam, or a written exam. So obviously with a written exam, the top five-plus high
scores would be referred. E&E is education and experience over and above the
minimum qualifications of that position. But that added a layer of fairness and
consistency, and the departments would be required to go through all five-plus
high scores before they request additional names.
So there was a little bit more control; although at the end of the day, the
appointing authority did make that decision. But we wanted to make sure there
was a solid, fair, and consistent process in place, and we felt the five-plus high
scores has always worked in the past, so we decided to reinstitute that.
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MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. And are you able to just kind of share how often
directors are requesting the full list be shared?
MR. LEOPOLDINO: As far as I know, since December 16, 2019, when we
reinstituted the five-plus high scores, I don't recall any department requesting the
entire list. The departments do have the opportunity to request three additional
names; so it would five-plus high scores plus three additional. So they don't have
to go for the entire list because they understand that—if they get the entire list,
and let's say it's 100 names, they have to go through the whole interview and
selection process, and interview and go through that entire process.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: And how typical is that for all of the County positions,
because there's a lot online that are open?
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Right.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I mean, what percentage of jobs is yielding 100 potential
applicants that are eligible to fill it?
MR. LEOPOLDINO: I can tell you as of right now that's zero.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay.
MR. LEOPOLDINO: As you all may know, we're having difficulty. You've
seen the continuous recruitments. We're up to 42 classes of work that we just
can't fill. It would be totally justified if departments wanted to come in at this
point for the entire list. I mean that would be justified because of the difficult to
fill.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Just out of curiosity, Park Maintenance position, how
many folks are applying for that versus Engineer? Just trying to get a sense of
how many are applying for the various positions.
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Yeah. No, thank you for that. So interestingly enough, our
registration recruitments include our Park Caretakers, our Custodian
Groundkeepers, and our Laborer IIs. So those classes of work, we term them
"unskilled." I don't like using unskilled, but those are considered our registration
recruitments, and we're not having issues with doing our registration
recruitments. And as our County Auditor mentioned earlier, that's where the
department institutes the random selection because the lists are so large.
Now when we look at the Civil Engineer classes of work, we're at zero, basically.
I mean, it's very difficult. It's challenging to fill those Engineer positions. So,
it's really a big contrast between the two classes.
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MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. Thank you for allowing me to be really curious.
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Sure, no problem.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I'm sure I have more questions later. Thank you, Chair.
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Thanks.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Kierkiewicz. Okay,
looking over the floor. Mr. Chung, go ahead.
MR. CHUNG: Yeah. Sorry. You know, it was really hard to follow your
presentation because, you know, I reviewed this earlier, and I was trying to do it
in conjunction with what you had presented. So what was the formal hiring
policy that was in place now, that utilized this Staffing Review Committee?
What—you were referring that you opened with that, and you said page 14 or
something.
MR. BENNER: Yeah, excuse me, Council Member, for not being clear on that.
I'm referencing the original audit that was done. The original hiring practices that
was done in 2017.
MR. CHUNG: Oh okay, so page 14 of that.
MR. BENNER: Yes, of that original audit. We've made basically it's a
statement in there that explained what was the root cause of the reason for
launching that audit.
MR. CHUNG: All right. So now if you don't mind, and it's not going to take too
long.
MR. BENNER: Sure.
MR. CHUNG: Explain what that hiring practice was. You know, I was fumbling
through this thing.
MR. BENNER: Absolutely. Yeah. So again, hiring authority should rest with
the appointing authority, which really is a department head.
MR. CHUNG: Well, what was the hiring ?
MR. BENNER: And what happened is in March of 2013 the prior Office of the
Mayor and the Department of Human Resources established a Staffing Review
Committee, and that Staffing Review Committee determined the method of
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recruitment, and so they could determine whether or not it was going to be
selected internally or externally.
MR. CHUNG: This is across the board for all departments?
MR. BENNER: Yes, sir.
MR. CHUNG: Okay, go on.
MR. BENNER: And then once they provided which body that could look at, they
could also determine the selection process, which means the Selection Review
Committee could actually conduct the selection or they could allow the
department to conduct it. So they were in a position of being able to determine
the pool that they could evaluate, and then further evaluate that poll.
MR. CHUNG: And who comprised this Staffing Review Committee?
MR. BENNER: It was a designee of the Managing Director, the Human
Resources Director at the time, and a third member I believe was the department
head.
MR. LEOPOLDINO: I believe so, based on the report.
MR. BENNER: So that person revolved, depending on which department was
recruiting.
MR. CHUNG: Three people across the board?
MR. BENNER: Right.
MR. CHUNG: Okay. What about this other practice though, that I heard about,
within, you know, one department in particular? I don't know if it happens
anymore, but where these things were vetted by other members of the department.
Are you aware of anything like that?
MR. BENNER: I'm not.
MR. CHUNG: Okay, maybe we've got to check on that. I mean, specifically it
was Planning Department. Not you guys anymore. But that's kind of crazy. You
know, because what happens is—and so that's what I thought this Staffing
Review Committee yeah, this one a little bit more insidious I would think. But
yet, you know, to allow people from within the department to have any kind of
vetting powers over the hiring is nonsense.
MR. BENNER: Right.
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MR. CHUNG: So don't let that happen, you know, because I did catch wind of
this occurring. And what happens is when you do that, it's almost where the
department head is abdicating his or her role in behind the hiring, because you
guys did conclude that it is ultimately their responsibility, and I agree 100 percent.
But what happen is when you do that, it opens up the potential for creating
fiefdoms within the department, and cliques, yeah? So just be cognizant of that
too, yeah.
And I know we're in really good hands, and not making any disparaging remarks
about people in the past or anything. That's pau already, yeah. But I just needed
clarification. Thank you very much. And I think we're in good hands. Thanks.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chung. Okay, I don't see
any further questions from the Council.
MR. INABA: Chair, real quick. One more question.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Council Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: Just for clarification purposes, the intent of this audit, it's just for
normal civil service-type positions in the County, that's right?
MR. BENNER: That's absolutely correct.
MR. INABA: Awesome. Thank you so much. Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. Okay, my question
is, where do we go from here?
MR. BENNER: So we're happy to report that we've stood up, yeah,
whistleblower and fraud hotlines. Those lines are actively receiving calls
currently, so we're encouraged that that is a tip-line that will kind of sound as a
bell-weather for us, if those processes should begin to denigrate. You know,
we've reached out to Human Resources and told them that should those kinds of
influences begin to try to exert themselves—because we believe this is a process
that is under—could be under pressure, you know, depending with the names and
people that change, that that could easily become something that comes on
becomes a prospective change in the future. So we've asked that should those
things occur, that we be notified early on so that we're able to kind of evaluate
what sort of risks we might be facing if those things change.
We are building out and networking with a number of individuals in our industry
to try and create a really robust process around the whistleblower program. We're
going to be attending an AGA (Association of Government Accountants) in May
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and speaking with—we're taking two different modules that will be speaking
directly to whistleblower lines, and also visiting with one of our industry peers,
who operates a mature line.
So, that iswe consider this engagement closed at this time, but we're going to
look for cracks in that process going forward.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. And that hotline, open to the public,
open to County workers, open to everybody?
MR. BENNER: What is the number? Give us the number right now.
MR. BENNER: Yep. The Fraud and Waste hotline number is (808) 480-8213,
and the Whistleblower hotline number is (808) 480-8279, and we'll be publishing
analytics quarterly on that.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So 480-8213, that's Fraud and
Waste?
MR. BENNER: Yes, sir, 8213 is Fraud and Waste.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And then 480-8279, that's our
Whistleblower.
MR. BENNER: That's correct.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, good. So in your eyes, the problem
has been stated; and you are comfortable going forward that we're not going to
see this kind of thing anymore. We've addressed it.
MR. BENNER: No.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. I was just kidding.
MR. BENNER: No, we don't make that claim. Because again, you know, we
may have all of the faith in the people who sit in the chairs today, but we can't
make that inference on people who may come down the line. There isn't a strong
enough process to hold that, which is why having some compensating controls,
like the whistleblower line is important, because if those things start to form,
we're going to hear about it on our end, and we're going to be able act quickly on
those things.
To that end, one thing that I'll just kind of bring up early on to Council, is
elements that would make the whistleblower line more successful for us. We are
continuing to add features to our website navigation to help educate the public
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about what we do and don't do with regard to that. We do want to add a feedback
mechanism to then brief department heads and offer them an opportunity to make
improvements proactively on low-consequence calls. We've had some people
who just call in and just have some general improvement tips for their department,
and they're afraid that it's going to put them on the radar with their boss. And so
we want to be able to communicate those improvement opportunities to
departments as well, without endangering the individual and their anonymity
associated with this.
But ultimately what is going to make this really important iswhat's really going
to be important is that we need to seek some investigative powers to aid us in
whistleblower research. Section 3-18 of the Charter states, I'm just paraphrasing
the Section 2 and subsection (e) grants us the authority to perform performance
and financial audits of any County agency programs, supported in part or whole
by County funds as set forth by the Auditor, and the Annual Audit Plan
transmitted to the Mayor and filed with the County Clerk. And Section (g)
requires that the County Auditor shall conduct those audits in accordance with the
Government Auditing Standards.
We're going to seek some latitude to try to conduct inquiries under a subsection,
the yellow book, that allows us to perform professional non-audit services. We
need the ability to produce reports without the extreme evidence, support that
underlies the traditional audits. And we're going to learn more about that when
we attend that whistleblower workshop in our upcoming trip to AGA.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. And then these numbers, who takes
the phone calls?
MR. BENNER: My audit analyst.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. I think what's interesting and
unique about us here in Hawaii is we're so tight knit as a community, and strong.
It's a really strong community. But there are some instances where it can actually
work against you a little bit, yeah?
MR. BENNER: Absolutely.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So I appreciate what you did. Appreciate
the report. Thank you very much. And thank you for having some outcomes.
Oh, okay. Who is first? Ms. Kierkiewicz go ahead.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Auditor Benner, for that
update. I think you're awareI think when we first met I shared some of the
work I did in my first term to get some funding in our budget to resolve this
particular issue within the audit to have a whistleblower program. I have grave
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concerns that it's your office answering those phone calls, specifically calling out
what our Chair mentioned. Everyone knows everyone in this community, and
there needs to be a level of anonymity, and so I want to express those concerns
here. And also, concerns that—in communications from your office to this
Council and to the administration, this hotline was termed a pilot program?
MR. BENNER: Yes, that's correct.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: So after the end of the pilot program, what are you
expecting to make a decision on, whether or not we should have the
whistleblower hotline?
MR. BENNER: Oh, not at all. And I appreciate the question.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you.
MR. BENNER: We brought this as a pilot program, because as you know we did
this without any additional resources. We're tapping into what we have, or
reallocating
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Why is this not in the budget? Is this going to be in the
budget request?
MR. BENNER: This was not done in the budget request. Initially there were
some funding that was put into Human Resources. We do have the position for
another FTE(Full Time Employee), which we're actively recruiting for. We've
not received responses to that recruitment request yet. But the dollars weren't
allocated to the Office of the County Auditor, they were allocated to Human
Resources, and eventually clawed back.
So what the pilot is going to do is give us a period in which we can gather and
analyze data, and then bring that back to this body with some ideas of some more
permanent funding requests to move that thing forward, whether or not we keep
in-house, or what resources would need to be allocated in order to delegate it to a
third parry.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: There was significant research done by Gabriella Cabanas
and others with HR(Human Resources) that provided a plan forward on this, and
so I'm not quite sure why that wasn't pursued, like engaging a third parry to be
answering those phone calls. Why are there two lines? Is there a specific reason
why we have two different numbers that folks are calling, and is it a different
person answering each of those lines?
MR. BENNER: It's not a different person. It helps to delineate he categories of
the complaints that are coming in. Generally a whistleblower is going to be more
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person-centric, whereas the other two are going to be more about misallocation of
resources. So as far as why we did that, we've seen that some of our industry
peers support one line and not the other. Some of them only support a fraud line.
So we don't know what kind of divergence that we might want to make in the
future, so we just tried to architecturally set it up in a way that would allow us to
make those changes without having to make major disruptions to that line.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. I can appreciate your design of this, but I'm still
going to push for an independent third party to be answering those phones. Its,
again, a very small community
MR. BENNER: Right.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: And I think folks knowing that their voice could be
potentially recognized may stop some people from making a phone call.
MR. BENNER: Yeah. And again, I definitely appreciate that. And we did let—
during
etduring our first budget meeting with Finance, we let them know that—we know
what that cost would be. So once we have that data, and we can come back and
again present the call-volume, what it takes to process, then at that point we'd let
them know that we like to farm that out to a third parry.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. Well, we'll get into this a bit more during our
budget hearings. Thanks or the update. Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Kierkiewicz. Mr. Chung.
MR. CHUNG: Yeah, you know, with regard to this Staffing Review Committee
and the creation thereof, who has the ultimate power of formulating these types of
practices? Is it Waylen, the Mayor, or who?
MR. LEOPOLDINO: From what I understand that committee was requested by
the administration at that time. I can't recall any authority that would allow me to
create any kind of committee like that.
MR. CHUNG: Yeah. Or to object to it?
MR. LEOPOLDINO: Correct.
MR. CHUNG: Then what I would suggest you guys think about also as part and
parcel of this review, it's the thing of some types of legislation which could be
enacted that will further take this process out of political hands. Because that's
what we're trying to achieve, right, a level playing field for everyone. But from
what I've seen in the past, we have some really well-meaning—what is your title
exactly, Waylen?
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MR. LEOPOLDINO: My current title is Director of Human Resources.
MR. CHUNG: Okay, the directors. But politics being as it is, you know, you
don't want to run afoul of any person, as well-meaning as they may be, too. I'm
not making any disparaging remarks about any administrators past or present, but
there needs to be protections. The director needs to be able to uphold the integrity
of the department and the hiring practices of the County at all costs, yeah.
So just, maybe if you guys can somehow think about some mechanism which
would achieve that yeah, and it probably will be in the form of either a Charter
amendment possibly, or some sort of legislation, yeah. That's all. Thank you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chung. Ms. Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you, Chair. I had to reflect a little bit on what my
colleagues are saying, because when this report first came out it was clear that we
were trying to achieve a space for people to apply at the County and make it in on
merit, right? And at that time, it was we want people to get in because of what
they know, not who they know. And so that's what I hear again today between
my colleagues, is that—you know, there's this process, whether it's a written
application or your education that provides a score, but once it goes over to the
departments, all of a sudden it's about, or could become about who you know, not
what you know.
And so you know, I have to reiterate what Mr. Chung is saying, if there's a way
to even start providing a space where it's just based on merit and what you know
to elevate you. I just wanted to share that. Chair, I yield at this time.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Lee Loy. Okay, in an
effort of time management, I appreciate you guys. Thank you for coming in
today; and thank you for this report, I think it's given us a lot of direction. And I
like that you've followed up and wrapped up something that was kind of floating
for a while, so thank you.
MR. BENNER: Thank you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. With that, Council Members, we
have a motion on the floor to close file on Communication 636 and 636.1. All in
favor?
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Vote on Comm. 636: The motion to close file on Comm. 636 and 636.1
Filed was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Richards,
and Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Member Villegas — 1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Moving on our next order of business. Sir,
can we please take Communication 644?
Comm. 644: 2021 ANNUAL REPORT OF THE PUBLIC ACCESS, OPEN SPACE, AND
NATURAL RESOURCES PRESERVATION COMMISSION
From Mayor Mitchell D. Roth, dated February 16, 2022, transmitting the above
report pursuant to Hawaii County Code Section 2-218, providing a detailed
summary of the purchasing history and status of lands acquired through the fund,
a report on management and stewardship of acquired lands, and the updated
prioritized list for proposed acquisition of land.
Motion to Close File: Ms. Lee Loy moved to close file on Comm. 644.
Seconded by Mr. Richards.
(Note: At this time, Mayor Mitchell D. Roth came forward to address the
members of the Committee.)
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you for joining us today,
Mayor Roth.
MAYOR ROTH: Thank you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yeah, if you would, you want to kind of
lead us out here?
MAYOR ROTH: Sure. Thank you for allowing me to come and talk. This is a
very simple presentation of what the PONC (Public Access, Open Space, and
Natural Resources Commission) has put together. But before I move to that, I just
want to kind of comment on the last hearing. Just real quick, and what Council
Member Lee Loy said, I fully agree with. It should be on what you know versus
who you know.
You know, we try to set the tone with the way we chose our cabinet. I did not sit
in any of those interviews; and you know, let those people do the interviews.
Some people who worked on my campaign didn't get jobs, and some from—my
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friends expected, but do it because I believe exactly what you guys are trying to
do, and what came out of the audit.
That being said, I'd like to first off just really thank the members of the
commission, the PONC commission for putting together this report that's here in
front of you. I really wasn't planning on coming down here and talking today, but
I did get a couple of concerned calls in the last couple of days about the
management funds, and who's getting approved, who's not getting approved. I
heard, as I was going from one meeting to another actually, I heard Maile Melrose
talk about the Amy Greenwell Park. I got a call on that, and I had actually
checked on that with some of my staff, and my understanding is they're actually
getting a favorable recommendation, and so that's good.
I'm really down here to make a statement that this administration is committed to
this process with the PONC, the Public Access, Open Space, and Natural
Resources Preservation Program. We've purchased a few properties already
during this administration. We are working on several more, which is in the
communication.
In addition to this, I don't see—on my letter, we've been going out to different
properties. I've personally been out to several different properties. I was at
Mahukona, which we are very interested in working together with Hawaii Land
Trust to make a PONC property, as well as some other properties. One in
Keaukaha that I was able to take a visit with Council Member Lee Loy. We have
got our first property in Puna for the PONC Commission.
So we are very interested in supporting. And I just want people to know that this
is not a program that's just out there. We take this very serious. You know, our
administration has really been focusing on sustainability, and for me sustainability
is making sure that our keiki can raise their keiki, and their keiki can raise their
keiki on this island. You know,part of that is jobs, part of that is housing, but
another part is we want them to have places where they can enjoy for the future,
and so these PONC properties are very important to us.
And that's really all I want to say. I wanted to thank the members of the
commission and the staff that really has taken this very serious and has been
doing some great work. And also just allay some of those fears that we're not
funding some of those maintenance programs may have thought that they aren't.
We are looking at those very serious. And I think the one thing in the
communications that people need to understand if they're getting funds, and they
have to get permits and things like that, that they're going to have to go through
the legal requirements to get them to get these funds.
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And so that's all I wanted to say. I thank you guys. I've got to make another
presentation this morning. But I was listening to some of the public testimony,
and I just wanted to allay some of those fears. Thank you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mayor. Did you want to stick
anyone for anything else or are you on your way out?
MAYOR ROTH: I've got 13 minutes to be upstairs and make another
presentation. So if there are any real quick ones, I'd be happy to answer some
questions.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Council Members, any discussion for the
Mayor specifically? I know we have other members in the administration who
can help with some of the other questions, as well.
MAYOR ROTH: All right. Thank you very much.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, thank you, Mr. Roth. Okay, Council
Members, any discussion on Communication 644? Mr. Inaba.
(Note: At this time, Real Property Manager Hamana Ventura came
forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MR. INABA: Yeah, thank you. I see Mr. Ventura here. If you have anything
you might want to share, being you're heavily involved with what goes on. I
know you probably have a ground-level to high-level understanding of this. So is
there is anything the Council might want to know?
MR. VENTURA: Good morning. Hamana Ventura, Property Manager. I just
wanted to kind of concur with what the Mayor said, is that we're really excited
about the direction of the program. The fact that we're looking at all parts of the
island and that we have so much participation. We're even more excited that we
get to work with our stewardship groups going forward.
So getting boots on the ground, getting a better understanding of what their wants
and needs are, and being able to implement, are some of the things that we're
looking forward to. That's it.
MR. INABA: Thank you. And is there anything that you see we may need to
improve on or may need help from this body, or the PONC Commission might
need help with to further improve and move forward with the acquisitions of these
properties, or getting properties evaluated to become eligible on the list?
MR. VENTURA: Actually I think the make of our commission right now helps
us to get a better understanding, and really dig into issues that may not be on the
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surface. But they do such a good job of researching our properties that by the
time it comes to making a positive or negative recommendation, I mean, they've
dug.
And following up on that, going forward is really looking at having these groups
to steward these lands. I've said in the past, and I'll say it again, most of them
have been doing it long before these properties were acquired, without any
indication that they were looking for financial support; that we have this arm
available. I think a positive thing for all of us involved.
MR. INABA: Thank you. And thank you for being here in Hilo today to answer
these questions.
MR. VENTURA: Mahalo.
MR. INABA: Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. Ms. Kierkiewicz,
go ahead.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. Aloha, Hamana, great to see you.
Thanks for all of your hard work. Just was really excited about the acquisition of
Wai`ele. That was one of the first parcels that was, I think, on the original first
PONC list, and so that was Aunty Emily was here on the Council, and it has taken
many, many years for that to actually happen.
So the question I have is, once these lists are generated and you understand the
priorities of the commission, what sort of the process, the methodology within
your office to start prioritizing what sort of gets assessed, and then moved on to
acquisition using the PONC funding? What does that look like, because it's quite
an arduous and long process.
MR. VENTURA: Yeah, and I think what it comes down to is that if you're going
to be involved in the process, you have to understand they that it is a process. So
if we have potential sellers looking at participating, they need to understand that
it's not going to happen overnight. But if they want to be part of the process, then
we're more than willing to work with them. If Billy (Former Mayor Kenoi) had
his choice back in the day when the program came out, he would say, "Buy them
all,"but we're just not quite there yet. So I think what—if possible, we want to
look at participation in all of our districts.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: That's great to hear. It's great to hear that you're looking
to acquire in every district around the island, and that we're also going to be
looking not just at makai lands, but also mauka lands which are so important to
our watershed.
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MR. VENTURA: Yeah, watershed. I mean, restoration of native canopies,
indigenousI mean, native plant sources and so forth. So there are a variety of
options that are on the table. We were looking at more involvement with
conservation easements so that the owners have the ability to preserve, protect;
keep their families involved in maybe ongoing businesses, yet setting aside areas
for preservation and protection. It's kind of mind-blowing at times.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yeah, it is and, you know, shout out to all the community
groups, the nonprofits that before any assistance was available through the
Maintenance Fund. We're already doing the work because they were so
passionate about caring and preserving our `aina.
I don't know if it's too much to ask or if this is already in the works, but ways in
which we can be building up capacity within community so that parcels that don't
have an active steward and caretaker that there is a model. There is a framework
for anybody to put together a core team and make it happen. And I think knowing
that there are financial resources available to support that, those kinds of activities
is really critical.
MR. VENTURA: Agreed. And so we've had this conversation, right,prior to
acquisition that once we acquire then what are we going to do moving forward?
So we're looking at community participation. Maybe `aina-core programs, where
they can supplement our stewards to really assist with. I mean, some of these
parcels are huge, so back to boots on the ground. So if we have, in addition to our
stewards, the ability to get more bodies involved, whereby they gain experience,
knowledge, maybe some type of certifications. And we talked abut it, is that I
think it's just a positive for everyone who is involved.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yeah, they're such an important workforce development
piece. I'm glad to hear that is still on the table. I mean, there is just so much that
you can be doing with the job development that's happening there, strategies
around climate mitigation, the infusion of technology and science. I mean, we
could go on and on about this. So, there's a lot of potential.
So, keep up the good fight. This is really important. Work in kuleana. And
we're glad you're there. Thanks, Hamana.
MR. VENTURA: Thank you.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thanks, Chair. I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Kierkiewicz. Mr. Chung,
go ahead.
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MR. CHUNG: Yeah. I mean, I wasn't going to bring it up, but since the two of
you talked about it, it kind of jogged my memory, and this might be the last
opportunity to make this suggestion.
You know, you talked about the canopy. You talked about mauka areas. You
know, last term former Council Member Val Poindexter had introduced and had
passed a piece of legislation which dealt with native trees, I think, and tax
incentives for that. So you could meld that idea with this whole concept. Get
mauka lands, pretty cheap. You can get big tracks over there. And then you do
value added, yeah. You start planning these things, and the beauty of that is
you're going to engage youth. You can get youth organizations to go over there
and start planning, and they can camp. I think it would be really, really nice. So
if you guys can just think about that, yeah.
MR. VENTURA: Actually even back on Mayor Kim's watch, he started tasking
some of his admin to look at these possibilities.
MR. CHUNG: Good.
MR. VENTURA: And then we got hit with other items that we had to deal with
on all of those disasters. But that was part of the conversation.
MR. CHUNG: Yeah.
MR. VENTURA: Was even back to Billy's watch. Kind of, what are we going
to do going forward? How can we maximize capacity, look at getting more of our
youth involved. I think we've had those conversations in the past and now we're
getting that opportunity to start getting back to putting them in the forefront, or on
the front burner.
MR. CHUNG: Good, good. Because we're tapping ourselves out in terms of
more valuable pieces of land, especially in the oceanfront properties. I think the
opportunity is there, and it won't cost that much.
MR. VENTURA: I agree.
MR. CHUNG: Thank you.
MR. VENTURA: Mahalo.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chung. Ms. David, go
ahead.
MS. DAVID: Thank you, Chair. Aloha, Mr. Ventura, for being here today. I just
wanted to reflect on some of the things that my colleagues have been saying about
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the real benefits of this program and this public access purchases. What I've seen,
and I have to commend the commission for this, what I've seen is when I first
started there was the growing pains of having owners even consider the fact of
selling their property under the PONC program. And now in the matter of a few
years, it's transitioned to not only sales but to conversation easements, which
gives a balance to the owner and conserving valuable portions of their property,
but still not taking away their opportunity to develop the property.
So I think it's grown to a point where more willing sellers have come about to
even consider doing this. I think it's because of the work that the commission has
been doing all these years, and also the things that Vice Chair Chung has been
talking about. Because conservation easements also open the opportunity for the
education and the participation of our youth. We're already doing it without
being part of this PONC purchase program. And some owners are actually having
kids go onto their mauka land to reforest the forest and that sort of thing.
So I think it really ties in. I have to commend you guys for what I've seen the
commission grow through the time I've been on this body. So I just want to say
thank you to everybody on the commission and the administration.
MR. VENTURA: The commission, as they transition, term out, and new
commissioners come in, it just the constant influx of knowledge from various
fields, they keep adding to the pot. So yeah, it's growing, the knowledge base
keeps growing, the input, the feedback.
MS. DAVID: And the commitment, I think, from even lineal descendants of the
land, because it's their kuleana. Right now it's so obvious, and it's been talked
about, it's their children's kuleana passed down, that they need to care for the
land. And the opportunity as I see it is with the PONC program. So thank you so
much for all you do, and this report.
MR. VENTURA: Mahalo.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. David. Mr. Richards.
MR. RICHARDS: Thank you, Chair. Thanks, Hamana. My district, District 9,
has a lot of PONC activity going on, and I really appreciate the fact that the
corridor from Polulu Valley coming down keeps expanding as the PONC
purchases are coming forward. Great program, great future. And Hamana, to
your point, that the incoming commissioners are bringing more knowledge.
We're not getting stagnant. We're actually evolving, going in a good direction.
I'm just going to raise a concern for the Council because I've said this before.
For our PONC program, we have a two percent real property tax funding that is
not capped. However, our stewardship is capped at .25 percent if I recall
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correctly. There's a cap on how much fund that can go into that. Currently it's
not an issue, but as we get more PONC lands and more programs, I think this is
going to become an issue. I've raised this problem years previously. At some
point, this Council will need to make a change in that. I don't know if it's a
Charter amendment that we're going to have to address that. Near term it's not a
problem, but long term I think we're going to start bumping up into a cap that we
can't fund more.
So I put that out as an on the horizon issue that is not I don't think it's
contentious at all, it's just that we have to address it. So great program, great
direction, the fact that we are able to do this is fabulous, but I think we have to
attend to this before it becomes a problem. So again, thanks Hamana. I yield.
MR. VENTURA: Thank you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Richards. Ms. Lee Loy,
go ahead.
MS. LEE LOY: Thanks, Chair. I actually had a few things to say, but Ms. David
and then Mr. Richards said the exact same thing, which is the use of that
conservation easement allows property owners to be incredibly flexible, and then
at some point we're going to have to turn the ship a little bit on putting more
funding.
So I actually pulled that one page out, and in your report, you have real property
tax transfers, a total balance of$17 million. We're going to spend that, right
Hamana?
MR. VENTURA: We've already encumbered quite a large portion of that. I
mean, we've set aside $8 million for Mahukona in anticipation that by the time
Mahukona closes, we'll have gone through multiple tax cycles, whereby we're
putting money back into the fund. So the offset should be minimal, but yes, we're
spending it.
MS. LEE LOY: Great. And I do want to reflect on our time down in Keaukaha,
because I actually think that's the one stewardship program that we can learn a lot
from. And as Ms. Kierkiewicz mentioned, creating a model of stewardship, I
think that's one area where we can start. Because that particular parcel has the
conservation easement so they can actually go a little vertical with, you know,
providing for a pavilion, outdoor classrooms, teaching spaces. I think it's really
exciting there.
Yeah, I think as we contract with some of these stewardship programs and allow
them the funding, if there's mechanisms within the contract for them to do the
data collection and create those models so that we can share it with other
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programs that are interested in doing the stewardship, I think it gives those
programs a leg up to make things happen faster.
MR. VENTURA: Sure, or even having a platform whereby we can share links
that when they're going through the process, look at other nonprofits, how they're
reporting requirements, what they're doing. I mean some of them are already at
that point, where they can share. It's just that there's no real repository for us to
click on these links. But we're getting there.
MS. LEE LOY: Really excited for you Hamana. Thank you, Chair. I yield.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Lee Loy. Anyone else?
Okay, seeing none, Mr. Ventura thank you very much.
MR. VENTURA: Mahalo.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Appreciate your efforts, and we have the
motion on the floor, Council, for closing file on Communication 644. All in
favor?
Vote on Comm. 644: The motion to close file on Comm. 644 was carried by the
Filed following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Richards,
and Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung and Villegas —2.
Excused: None.
Res. 332-22: AUTHORIZES THE OFFICE OF THE MAYOR TO ENTER INTO AN
AGREEMENT WITH THE STATE OF HAWAII, HAWAII TOURISM
AUTHORITY
Authorizes the Mayor to enter into a three-year agreement to establish the roles
and responsibilities for the implementation of the Hawaii Island Destination
Management Action Plan.
Reference: Comm. 650
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to recommend adoption of
Res. 332-22. Seconded by Mr. Richards.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Mr. Adams, thank you for joining us this
morning. Can you give us a little background on the resolution in front of us so
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we can understand what the agreement is that we're entering into and what the
scope is?
(Note: At this time, Research and Development Director Douglass Adams
came forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MR. ADAMS: Thank you, Chair and members of the Council.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Introduce yourself, please?
MR. ADAMS: Alright. Of course. Doug Adams, Director of Research and
Development. The County has been working with the HTA (Hawai`i Tourism
Authority) on the Destination Management Action Plan (DMAP). It's part of the
work that the HTA has been doing with all of the counties, and that started last
year, it's been ongoing. That fits well in with Hawaii County's Tourism
Strategic Plan. All of that stuff is great.
Recently, within the last month or so there was a suggestion, maybe even stronger
than that, by members of the State Legislature that the funding that HTA was
using for the DMAP be provided to the counties to continue this work. So HTA
came to the counties and indicated that they would like to put together an MOA
(Memorandum of Agreement) that takes care of the continuation of the DMAP
work, that's in its second year right now of a three-year process, with all the
objectives that are included in that. And frankly, our County's DMAP is going
along pretty well in terms of the objectives and what we're trying to get through.
But of course for us to enter into any type of MOA, particularly if there's any
funding involved, we need to come to you. Not all the counties necessarily have
that requirement.
So through our Department of Finance we've submitted this so that we can
continue that work in the event that there is some change to the way the program
is run, and the funding is run for the DMAP process.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Director Adams. Council
Members, discussion? Ms. Kierkiewicz, go ahead.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. Mahalo, Director, for being here and
for that explanation. Just wanted a little bit more clarity here. How are we
currently working to implement the DMAP without this?
MR. ADAMS: Right now we're working as staff in our department, the IHVB
(Island of Hawaii Visitors Bureau) folks on the County, we have stakeholders on
a variety of the locations. So for example Waipi`o Valley is an area that we've
been focused on. The Polulu Valley actually was also another element, and HTA
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provided funding out of last fiscal year's funds to support the steward program
that they have there.
So HTA has funds. If there are funds that are required to implement any of the
programs that may come out of the objectives that we're trying to achieve, then
the funds right now would come primarily of HTA. Although there are also
innovation grants that our County has supported, that are also supporting these
processes as well. So each of us has responsibilities incumbent within the
process, of the DMAP itself, and then the purpose here is that if in fact HTA loses
those funds and those funds are then going to come to the County, that creates a
different funding mechanism that we have to take into account.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Got it. Because now HTA is going to be a line item in the
budget and the Legislature is going to be interviewing them just like every other
department. So it's possible they may not get funding, or less funding or more
funding, and you just want to be in a position to continue moving forward
regardless of that.
MR. ADAMS: Right.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. Then there is potential forI know Frecia was
working with many community groups around the island on preserving wahi
pana. So is there potential funding for a lot of the work that the community did to
design what those management place could look like?
MR. ADAMS: Thank you for the question. We're taking a lot of the work that's
being done in Lower Puna as a result of the Kilauea Recovery Resilience work
and applying that around the island as you note. Some of that funding is the
salary of our Tourism Specialist. In addition, if there are other opportunities for
us to be able to fund community activities that will move us forward, and we'll
take a look at what those are, but those will be on a case-by-case basis. Right
now there is no specific program designed for all of these community and
stakeholder activities around the island.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Got it. But it's through this agreement where you could
have conversations about that being a need to kind of come about, right?
MR. ADAMS: That's correct.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, that's really helpful to know. And in these
conversations, you could also elevate the need for potentially more people,
because I think everything falling on Frecial mean, she's super woman, but
still, she's one person and I would live to have several Frecias really working
diligently with community on plan implementation.
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MR. ADAMS: I'll relay that. Thank you.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Perfect. Thank you, Director. I'll be supporting this.
Thank you, Chair. I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Kierkiewicz.
Mr. Richards, go ahead.
MR. RICHARDS: Thank you, Chair. Thanks, Doug. Without question, I'm
going to support this. We need to manage the tourism. We've discussed this the
last two years and to the point, you mentioned Polulu Valley, obviously near and
dear to my heart. This is something that Council Woman Kimball and I have
been discussing. Because of the closure of the Waipi`o Road, now we have issues
in Hamakua with Waipi`o, and Council Woman Kimball knows about this. We
need to better manage this. The pilot project at Polulu actually has worked
substantially well, but now we need to throttle up on that one and even support it
more. So definitely the concept.
We have to manage tourism. We cannot ignore it. I think we can do a really
good job if we commit the resources to it. So as has been pointed out by
Ms. Kierkiewicz, this is a way to do that and if we need to help Frecia, because
again, we can't dump it all on her. We need to give you guys the resources to get
this done. I know that the West Coast Resort Association is very supporting of
doing something towards management. So definitely supporting this and we need
to know what we can do more to support this initiative going forward. So thanks,
Chair. I yield.
MR. ADAMS: Thanks, Councilman. If I could just make a quick comment. Of
course I agree with everything that you said. I would just further comment that
management in this case is not a mainland term, if I could use that. This is
management here on this island, and refers to the community conversations, the
discussions with our lineal descendants, the discussions with what the cultural
sensitivities are around many of these locations, many of these homes, many of
these places. So the ability to make sure that those conversations are happening
and that everyone is having the chance to hear from each other is really, really
important as a part of management.
MR. RICHARDS: Just Chair, respond to that real quick?
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yes, Mr. Richards. Go ahead.
MR. RICHARDS: Thank you. You articulated that exactly. This is not about
just a document that explains we will go "a, b, c, d." This is sitting down, talking
story, figuring out what the needs of the community, the lands, the people,
everything, and blending it together. Probably in the true sense, ho`oponopono,
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starting with no preconceived idea of where we're headed with what it's going to
be. So absolutely, but that's going to take resources. So thank you very much for
the initiative. Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Richards. Ms. Kimball, go
ahead.
MS. KIMBALL: Thank you. Thank you for being here, Director. I will be
supporting this as well. I just want to acknowledge what an excellent partner
HTA has been through Hawaii Island Visitors Bureau. Island of Hawaii
Visitors Bureau, with respect to Waipi`o, we have a facilitated process that is
beginning, that was actually initiated well before the closure, but it is starting
soon, and is something that they've supported and arranged. And I'm optimistic
that we'll come up with some long-term solutions.
And to respond a little bit to your question about funding, I do understand Council
Member Kierkiewicz' question that through HTA there was funding for Hawaii
Island, and I don't want to quote the numbers, but there is support out there for
some of these programs once we develop the action plan. So thank you for
bringing this forward, and happy to support the agreement. I yield, Chair.
MR. ADAMS: Thank you, Council Member. I appreciate that. I think it's
probably appropriate based on your comment just to indicateI mean one of my
predecessors obviously is the CEO of HTA, John DeFries, he's brought a real
cultural shift. Unfortunately, or the timing of his ascension into this particular
position as well as then concerns that there may be at the State level—some of
this timing is unfortunate, but they are moving forward along with some of the
new folks that they have in important positions there to make sure that we're
being pono in the way that we're approaching our visitor industry moving
forward.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Adams. Thank you,
Ms. Kimball. Anyone else today? Okay, seeing none, thank you for your time,
Mr. Adams. Thank you for being here. We do have the motion on the floor to
forward Resolution 332-22 to Council with a favorable recommendation, all in
favor Council.
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Vote on Res. 332-22: The motion to recommend adoption of Res. 332-22
(Approved) was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Richards,
and Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung and Villegas —2.
Excused: None.
Bill 131: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 21-39, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO
PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE
FISCAL YEAR JULY 1, 2021 TO JUNE 30, 2022
Increases the Environmental Management Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant
Upgrades-Phase I project by $13 million, bringing the total appropriation to
$18 million. Funds for this project shall be provided from the General
Obligation Bonds, Capital Projects Fund - Fund Balance and/or Other Sources
and would be used towards the design of an alI-encompassing renovation of
the Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant.
Reference: Comm. 653
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to recommend passage of
Bill 131 on first reading. Seconded by Mr. Richards.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: We do have the department ready to join
when we are ready and then we can kind of begin. Maybe, Ms. Sako, if you want
to come up for the Finance Department regarding the appropriation, or the
increase in appropriation. Then, thank you, Mr. Brown.
(Note: At this time, Finance Director Deanna Sako came forward to
address the members of the Committee.)
MS. SAKO: While they're getting the department online, I think this is related to
the next bill, Bill 132 with the bond. When the Mayor and many of us toured all
that Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant, it just the project was originally phased,
so we're going to do it in phases. But I think it makes more sense to do the
planning and the design in totality so that we know exactly what we're going to
get and then be able to bid it and do the work on a faster basis. Because the plant
definitely does need work.
So this is related to the next one, but this is to complete the design and do it all
together rather than phasing it.
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CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, thank you for that kind of summary.
I see we have Director Mansour online with us, and then someone else as well
ready to jump onto our Zoom meeting. Mr. Mansour, if you could give us a
summary as well, and then we'll jump to questions from the Council.
(Note: At this time, Environmental Management Director Ramzi Mansour
came forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MR. MANSOUR: Good morning, Chairman Kleinfelder. This bill, and our
Finance Director had mentioned, is to start the design of the Hilo as one phase
rather than phasing it out because every part within that facility is contiguous to
the other parts. So the whole system works together. After a lot of analysis and
through talking to the consultant and the experts in that field, definitely it makes
sense to do it all at once, so we don't end up doing any mishaps or spills moving
forward, once it's all constructed.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Director. Appreciate that.
Council Members, discussion for Bill 131, if any. Mr. Richards, go ahead.
MR. RICHARDS: Thank you. Thanks, Deanna. This is something that we've
actually had on a different conversation concerning the planning going forward.
Wastewater is a huge need and I think efficiency will be found if we are planning
for the big need, not piecemealed going forward.
Now specifically to this planning, when we talk about east side/west side, and we
talk about north side/south side too, but this is specifically about east side? Is that
what we're talking about here?
MS. SAKO: Yes, this is specifically for Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant that is
experiencing some issues with the condition of the plant.
MR. RICHARDS: Keaukaha?
MS. SAKO: Yes.
MR. RICHARDS: That's a very big understatement as far as the issues. So okay.
Yeah, I did tour that and I know that we are—we're still functioning, but we have
a looming storm on the horizon if we don't attend to this. So the expectation,
when would this planning be done? Because this is something there is
infrastructure funding potentially available. I know, and we all read the
newspaper about bumping up against our bond ceiling
MS. SAKO: I have some comments about that for the next communication, but
yes.
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MR. RICHARDS: Okay. Alright then I'll reserve that conversation.
MS. SAKO: I believe that because we started Phase 1, Director Mansour and his
team have already worked with the consultant, and they are ready to full-on take
on this larger undertaking right away. And they would be able to do it together.
MR. RICHARDS: So timeline. Do we have a timeline? Because the concern on
this, some of the funding out of DC is going to expire. And the big concern is that
it's going to expire before we can actually implement. Time is of the essence
with all this stuff.
MS. SAKO: Ramzi, do you have an answer for when the design would be
complete?
MR. MANSOUR: The design for the head work on the digester, the one that we
already started, the design process started and it's going to be completed by the
end of this calendar year. Our intent is to get that out on the street, get it out by
April. At the same time, the other part of the design, we are finalizing the
proposal and negotiating the scope and the proposal. They already have given us
an estimate, so they're going to start the design of the second phase within a
month or two. That also hopefully we'll have the design completed, the design
document completed, right after we put the first design out on the street. And
have it go out to construction by the end of 2023. So within two years, we should
at least have half of Phase 1 construction complete and starting the other half.
MR. RICHARDS: Okay.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Just a point of information. Mr. Mansour,
did you say eight years or three years?
MR. MANSOUR: No, the end of 2023, two years. Two.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, thank you.
MR. MANSOUR: Alright.
MR. RICHARDS: Okay, generally I am supportive of this, but time is of the
essence and so I want to listen to my colleagues a little bit. But rather than having
the design completed by calendar year, December 31", can we move that up three
months? Can we push this? Because I'm concerned going forward that we're
going to expire on funding that we're going to miss the boat on. So with that,
Chair, I'm going to yield because I want to listen to my other colleagues.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Richards. Ms. Lee Loy,
go ahead.
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MS. LEE LOY: Thank you. Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Mr. Richards, for
starting us off. You know, this is Keaukaha, right? And we know that if there's a
failure there, we're going to have unimaginable consequences. So if I'm reading
this appropriation correctly, and I might be characterizing that differently, we
already have $5 (million) for this CIP (Capital Improvement)project, we're
adding $13 (million), so this is actually an $18 million CIP project at this time.
MS. SAKO: Yes.
MS. LEE LOY: You know, Mr. Richards touched on this, Deanna. You know,
we have other funding coming, and of course, urgency. Will there be ways to pay
this back with some of the other future funding, or are we creative accounting?
MS. SAKO: Yeah, to a certain extent. We are definitely hopeful that we will be
able to get infrastructure money. There's actually a bill before the Legislature to
help with the funding as well, from the State. You know, there's multiple funding
sources we're looking at, which is why even in the bond ordinance, we try to keep
it generic. So that we couldn't be accused of supplanting later and other things
the federal government doesn't like.
So we're still looking at all of our options but until the funding is released at the
federal level, you know, like what size projects. I know that we're probably not
going to get enough funding to pay for the entire Wastewater Treatment Plant, but
could they pay for Phase 1, or you know, what type of options do we have. So
we're still exploring all of that as all the rules are coming down. So we're
hopeful for additional funding, yes.
Yeah, I will tell you that the SRF (State Revolving Fund)no longer covers design,
so it's doubtful that we'll get this design portion back, but we are really going for
the construction portion.
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, thank you for reminding me of that, because that safe
water piece doesn't cover design, but it would cover construction. So this is
something we have to bear at some point.
You know, I'm in the same position. We need this done. I reallyI have a lot of
concern about how quickly we can get things done. And earlier today we heard a
lot of open positions here in the department, at the County specifically, you know,
our Engineering positions. So I have a lot about of concern about how we can
truly execute.
MS. SAKO: I think DEM and the Director are very well aware of the urgency of
this project, and they've actually been successful in hiring Engineers recently. So
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Ramzi may have something he wants to add, but I think they do understand the
urgency especially of this project.
MS. LEE LOY: Thanks, Deanna. Ramzi, you heard Mr. Richards and myself.
We're genuinely concerned about timing, the ability to execute. I have a bigger,
larger concern and I've shared this in multiple arenas, that we're going to start
pushing up against supply chain issues. Because every county across America is
trying to grab $63 billion. And so we heard it two weeks ago on ordering
vehicles. I mean we really need some assurances we can get this done, Ramzi,
and we have the capacity to do it. Because if not,we're going to leave that
money on the table and it's just not a good look.
MR. MANSOUR: I totally understand. We have been meeting with the design
consultant on a weekly basis. We have a meeting tomorrow with them on they
already started the process, they start laying out the design parameter, and they
start picking up following the design criteria and the needs. So definitely there's
a lot of pressure on us here in house and also on the consultant. The goal and the
intent is to get these designs out as soon as they can. So I think we were. They
also needed more time. We were able to bend them down to the end of the year
because part of it also I need to work with the Department of Public Works on the
permitting, because we allow three to four months just for permitting. So
hopefully between Ikaika and myself we can navigate through that and try to save
about three months plus or minus to get us there. But yeah, believe me. I
understand the urgency. I've been pushing this project, and I want to get there.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you for that, Ramzi. If you start hitting some snags along
the way, let us know so we can help. This is an important project for not only the
community that I have the privilege and honor of representing but for our entire
island and that precious coastline that we have in Keaukaha. So Chair, I yield at
this time.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Lee Loy. Ms. Kimball,
go ahead.
MS. KIMBALL: Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Director, for being here. Both
directors. I just had a couple of questions. Have you evaluated the ability to use
the ARPA (American Rescue Plan Act) funding under the new rules, or the final
rules, I guess I'd call them?
MS. SAKO: We're looking at that as well. But as you know, there are many,
many wastewater projects across the island. So yes. I mean where definitely that
is one of the pieces, I just haven't had the chance to look at the final rules in terms
of what it has to be related to. But that's definitely our thought for the second
tranche.
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MS. KIMBALL: Yeah, I think—my understanding is that the wastewater rules
have gotten a little broader in terms of what is acceptable in addition to the ability
to identify a portion of lost revenue. And we've talked about that. There's still
some guardrails on that. But it does expand the possibilities even more.
Are we going to have to issue a whole new RFP (Request for Proposals), or are
we going to—is this a change order with the existing consultant?
MS. SAKO: Same system with professional services. I believe they're planning
on doing a change order, but it wouldn't be an RFP. They could either do a new
professional service, which usually is fairly quickly, but I believe they're just
planning on change ordering it since they already have been working with the
consultant.
MS. KIMBALL: Okay, so if it's the professional services we can stay with the
same consultant? We don't have to ?
MS. SAKO: Yeah, there would be—I think we'd want it to all be integrated so
they yeah, yeah.
MS. KIMBALL: Yeah, yeah. That what my concern is, if we have to go to
somebody else when all this work has been done already.
MS. SAKO: Yeah, we can pick the same consultant. Yeah.
MS. KIMBALL: Okay. And then my final question, and this maybe is to
Director Mansour. Where are with the EPA (Environmental Protection Agency)
on this particular location?
MR. MANSOUR: We have EPA meetings as well to discuss this location and
other locations on April 1st. So at this current moment, not having redundancy is
very concerned to the EPA and the Department of Health. But hopefully now as
we see, we are committed to do something. So hopefully that shouldn't be an
issue because we are moving with the design. We committed to the fund. So
we've got to share with them that on the April 1st meeting. So hopefully that at
least will get us green passed.
MS. KIMBALL: Okay, so is there currently an AOC (EPA Area of Concern) for
this?
MR. MANSOUR: That side doesn't have currently AOC, but it's being
negotiated, was there for the last—since I started, that was one of their potential
AOC, or consent decrees. But that will be negotiated when we're telling them
that we're committed to do something, and now we're showing them that we are
committed. So given the project design already started, the funding already start
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growing, hopefully we don't get to an AOC on this side or consent decree on that
side.
MS. KIMBALL: Okay, thank you. Yeah, I'll be supporting this. I've been to the
site as well and it's very concerning. There are places where the metal is just
completely eroded, and all fused together. And the lack of redundancy is
certainly very concerning. Thank you both. I yield, Chair.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. Just a quick question
concerning efficiency. We have the west side, that funding that came out of the
State for Puako and the funding for planning there. I don't know if there's
synergy or if we can save some money by a bigger plan or whatever, but I'm just
throwing that out as a suggestion, that I think there's $1.5 million there to look
at wastewater planning. Because we have to have a concerted County plan, not
just west side/east side. So I'm throwing that out there as a suggestion, and I
don't know if there's a way to help that efficiency there but offer a suggestion.
Thanks, Chair.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Richards. Okay, seeing no
further discussion from the Council, I appreciate the conversation today. Thank
you for being here, Director. You know, before I jump, Ms. Villegas did you
have any comments? I see that you've jumped on and joined us.
MS. VILLEGAS: No, thank you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you very much. Appreciate the
conversation. We'll be forwarding this to Council. So if there are further
questions or further concerns that come out, we can address them there as well.
With that, we have a motion on the floor to forward Bill 131 to Council with a
favorable recommendation.
MS. KIMBALL: Just a reminder, Chair, because we have a Zoom attendee, we
have to do roll call for that resolution.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Thank you, Ms. Kimball. Thank you
for reminding me. Okay then, Mr. Clerk, roll call please.
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Vote on Bill 131: The motion to recommend passage of Bill 131 on
(Approved) first reading was carried by the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David,
Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Richards,
Villegas, and Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Member Inaba— 1.
Excused: None.
Bill 132: AUTHORIZES THE ISSUANCE OF GENERAL OBLIGATION BONDS OF
THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE PURPOSE OF FUNDING ALL OR A
PORTION OF THE COSTS OF VARIOUS IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS;
FIXING THE FORM, DENOMINATIONS, AND CERTAIN OTHER DETAILS
OF SUCH BONDS AND PROVIDING FOR THEIR SALE TO THE PUBLIC;
AND AUTHORIZES THE TAKING OF OTHER ACTIONS RELATING TO
THE ISSUANCE AND SALE OF THE BONDS
Authorizes the issuance of up to $139,500,000 in General Obligation Bonds to
fund certain Capital Improvement Projects including: design and construction
costs for renovation of the Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant; Public Works
facility repair and maintenance; Parks and Recreation facility repair and
maintenance; repair and maintenance at County Housing projects; Animal
Control facilities acquisition and maintenance; Solid Waste facilities repair and
maintenance; and Bond Issuance Costs.
Reference: Comm. 654
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Richards moved to recommend passage of
Bill 132 on first reading. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Okay Council, discussion?
MS. KIMBALL: Chair, if we could just start with the Director giving an
overview?
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Okay, Director?
(Note: At this time, Finance Director Deanna Sako came forward to
address the members of the Committee.)
MS. SAKO: Thank you for the opportunity. Before you is a bill for a bond
ordinance. The last bond ordinance we did was primarily roads, which you know
we are able to use General Excise Tax to pay back. There were some other
projects in that as well. But what spurred this right now is definitely our
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wastewater situation, and we do need to have funding. But in addition to the
design for the Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant, the previous bill, there's also the
WIFIA match(Wastewater Infrastructure Finance and Innovation Act).
So we have applied for the WIFIA loan program, and we were accepted. But
there is a they pay 49 percent, and we have to come up with a 51 percent match.
So that loan is, you know, they're ready to help us close on that loan at any time.
We want to kind of time it with our projects. We don't want to borrow too early.
But definitely we're ready to move forward with that. So we do need to have the
match in place.
Then the remaining amount is really for whatever emergency measures or
construction we need. We do kind of need to show that we are funding,
especially as, you know, we're going to be asking, trying to get as much federal
money as we can, but also with the State bill before the Legislature, we want to
show that we do have our money in place, you know, that we are committed to
this project. So that's another big part of it.
But since we are going to do bonds, definitely we have infrastructure facilities
across the island that are in need of repair. Many have been waiting a long time.
So both Public Works and Parks and Recreation as well as Housing have facilities
that are in urgent need of repair.
Then you might recall the recent bill to acquire the Animal Control facility that
we do need. And whether we continue to do it in house or we hire it out again,
you know, we do realize that we do need to have the facilities in order to carry
out those activities.
The most recent one is the Build Back Better grant that is going forward. We do
have to provide our portion of the match as well. And this has to do with
recycling-type composting facilities. So we wanted to ensure that the grant match
is available to help strengthen our application.
So the Build Back Better match—and I'm really hopeful the Council got our
communication which got lost in transit—so it was delivered yesterday afternoon,
but we did submit an amendment. And that Build Back Better is on the
amendment that hopefully you all have in front of you. Sorry for the delay. We
thought it came down last week and it didn't.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Does everyone have the communication?
MS. KIMBALL: 654.1, that's the communication you're referencing.
MS. SAKO: I believe so, yes.
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CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, thank you.
MS. SAKO: When we submitted our originally communication, it was prior to
submitting the March 1st budget, so we used the numbers we had available at the
time. That's why those numbers are a little bit higher. But when we apply that to
the new budget that was submitted on March 1st, that you might have seen in the
Capital Project cover letter, that amount was roughly 12 1/2 percent. And then
with these additional bonds, it would put us up to 13.69 percent. You know,
when you look at actual, where we're actually at based on bonds issued, we're at
8 1/2 percent, and that's because we need the bond ordinance to be able to
encumber funds.
We have to be able to certify funds. We have to know we have the capacity to
borrow the money, which is the authorization from the County Council, and then
once the department starts to spend, that money can be encumbered. But a
construction project can take two to three years to complete, so as the cash is
needed to pay down the bills is when we go out to borrow the money. So that's
why there's such a discrepancy. So with our actual funding in the budget, we're
at 8 1/2 percent.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Deanna. I appreciate the
overview. Ms. Kierkiewicz, go ahead.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Very kind. Thank you, Chair. Deanna, so the total
amount of the bond would actually be $149 million.
MS. SAKO: Yes.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Because of the $10 million addition for Build Back Better?
MS. SAKO: Yes, exactly.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I just want to make sure we know our full financial
obligations.
MS. SAKO: Yes, and the 13.69 does include Bill 149, $.5 million; and my
apologies to Parks and Rec. who thought they were getting extra money, but
DPW did bring up some concerns with the dispatch center. So when I added the
$3 million, I accidentally put it on the wrong line item, so that was my mistake.
So I'm just fixing Public Works and Parks and Rec's amount, and I apologize to
Director Messina for that, because he was really bummed when I told him. And
the additional amount is actually for the Build Back Better Grant.
MS. SAKO: Great, and I see on the second page we are amending the exact
amount we're taking the bond out for.
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MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Are any of the directors available to talk us through here?
MS. SAKO: They are all here to go through the project, and they're either here or
on Zoom.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I just want to note that for so much of this, it says repair
and maintenance.
MS. SAKO: They each have a list. One of the reasons it also says repairs and
maintenance is things happen. I'm not saying we need money for it, but for
example, one of us has facilities, they get hit by lightning. So then sometimes, the
part where these change rather quickly, but that's also why it says repairs and
maintenance.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I guess the point I just want to make is we really need to
see a repair and maintenance plan for every one of these departments. We cannot
keep pushing this off. I feel like in a hostage situation right now, because we've
waited so long to make these improvements and just do basic repair and
maintenance on a lot of our facilities. This is not your particular doing, Director
Rodenhurst or any of these directors that have stepped up to lead the County right
now. It's been a long-standing problem. I just want to make sure that we're
understanding that okay, there's this potential to fix what's broken right now, but
I want to see plans to make sure that we're not waiting till the very last minute.
Or when things are broken and we're using duct tape to hold it all together, until
we start getting serious about funding. So with that, I really would like to
understand what we are looking to repair and maintain under your department.
(Note: At this time, Public Works Director Ikaika Rodenhurst came
forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MR. RODENHURST: Ikaika Rodenhurst, Director of Public Works. Yeah,
mahalo for your questions and for your concerns. I agree, it is our responsibility
at DPW to get a repair and maintenance plan. We're working to put that one
together. Really appreciate our new billing project manager, Julann Sonomura,
she's been helpful since the beginning of this year and she's doing a great job.
Again, these projects are moving forward, and organizing how we do the
maintenance and repairs here.
For this one, we have a variety of projects. All of them having to do with health
and safety. We went to the list; we spent a lot of time going through what's the
priority. Because everything here is priority, right? Everything is a hot-ticket
item. As you mentioned, there's been a lot of deferred maintenance over the
years, and so this list gives us what we need immediately based of need.
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So some of it includes fire station improvements. We have the Waiakea Fire
Station Electrical Improvements on the list, we have Komohana Fire Station
Plumbing Improvements on the list. We have Kohala Fire Station on the list, both
for perimeter fence as well as reroofing; as well as HPP (Hawaiian Paradise Park
Subdivision), the addition over there to help their living situation there.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Anything for Central Fire Station–Station 1?
MR. RODENHURST: No, but we are working with Chief Todd as far as what
we're going to be planning, moving forward with that in the future. Right now,
we have been talking with him about what we are moving with that one. It's not
on this list.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. Thank you.
MR. RODENHURST: Beyond Fire, we have some public safety projects as well.
We have Kealakehe Police Station for their air conditioning improvements.
There's issues with the air conditioning over there. We also have the public safety
building flood mitigation. That's using the hazard mitigation funds as well to get
the phase one done on that project. As far as general repairs and things for county
buildings, we have the HVAC (Heating, Ventilation and Air Conditioning), the
exterior lighting, and the security surveillance system for West Hawaii. We also
have the Hawaii County Building lava rock veneer repairs, the Hawaii County
security cameras and gates. Aupuni Center re-roofing and repairs. And we have
on this list—
MS.
istMS. KIERKIEWICZ: And Aupuni Center, that's just the conference room or is
this the situation in Real Property Tax, where I see buckets catching water?
MR. RODENHURST: It's the roof, and those buckets have been moved. We
have done some temporary repairs that have been successful. And if anybody has
been identifying issues, I'm happy to respond to them immediately. But right
now, we're reaching go-time for this Aupuni Center re-roofing. So that's
promising.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thanks.
MR. RODENHURST: We also have Aupuni Center fire protection upgrades as
well as the carpentry shop roof replacement. So overall, we have a good list of
projects that cover a lot of needs of DPW as well as the needs of different
departments in the County and our public safety. Any questions?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. Are you going to be elaborating on any of the
other things listed here?
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FC-29 March 9,2022
MR. RODENHURST: As far as some of those projects?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Well, Parks and Rec., will Mo present for Parks and Rec?
And Administrator Kunz for Housing?
MS. SAKO: Yes.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, great. Thank you. Director Messina?
MS. SAKO: This got taken out of order, so maybe you can talk to Housing while
they find
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Absolutely. Administrator Kunz. And then at some point,
I'd like to hear from the Planning Director, because the Council did adopt a
resolution on, you know,just general asset management, conditions of County
assets, and just a plan for maintenance. So I know you heard my earlier
comments, and I think we would all appreciate your insights on how we are
setting ourselves up for successfully maintaining and budgeting for that
maintenance work. Thank you. Aloha, Administrator. Great to see you.
(Note: At this time, Housing and Community Development Administrator
Susan Kunz came forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MS. KUNZ: Hi. Good morning, everyone. So going through the list of some of
the projects that we have slated for the approximately $10 million that's being
considered here for Housing, in addition—so I do have a list of repairs and
maintenance-type related projects, which include maintenance work to the
wastewater treatment plant at Ulu Wini. We've identified recently a lot of dry rot
especially in the community center area and on, you know, this is a multi-level
complex, so in some of the stairways. So we want to address that and do
repainting which has not been done since the beginning of the project.
There's a lot of work that we want to do also at our Housing project our in
Waimea, the O`uli Ekahi. Repainting, replacing water heaters, appliance
replacement, and some resurfacing to the roadways, internal roadways there.
In addition to some of this type of repair work, and I should also mention
34 Rainbow Drive, which is the old Memorial Hospital, we currently have leases
with Hope Services and BISAC (Big Island Substance Abuse Council), to do
homeless related programs. We want to use some of this money to start an
environmental assessment of the building, and the surrounding 25 acres of the
property, with hopes of developing more housing projects in the future there. The
money is also going to be used for the removal of hazardous materials and begin
work on reroofing of that building.
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We have a smaller project, University Heights. It's been on the books for a few
years now. That is a State property that's located in kind of a cul-de-sac housing
area. We want to—we really need to demolish the home that's existing there
right now. I really want to try a pilot project, actually, with a nonprofit land trust
company, if we can do some work with them. Doing this and other projects like
this in the future.
So we've got a few activities going on here. Oh, and I think we also have an
allocation of money here for the Kukui`ola Emergency Shelter in Kona, which we
hope to get started in the next few months. Any questions?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Administrator, thank you. Just wanting to understand, the
bulk of the work, we're going to contract out; some of this we're going to be
handling internally. Just trying to get a sense of needed capacity-wise from the
County, because we heard Director from HR earlier mention how many positions
we need to sell, and I think the really critical ones are when it comes to design and
engineering. So just want to make sure that we're not saddling existing engineers
with so much work that we are not able to deliver on everything that you're
saying, which is so critically needed.
MS. KUNZ: No, my intention is to contract out.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, thank you.
MS. SAKO: Director Messina is on his way over. I actually do have his list, but
I don't want to throw Director Mansour off. For the solid waste needs, I did add
something to his list. In addition, to planning and design for like the Hilo Reload
Facility and Kealakehe Transfer Station master planning, and the scrap metal
yard. We also put in the Hilo scale replacement. We have somebody currently
identifying whether or not we can repair the current scale or if we just have to
replace it. That actually comes as a significant cost if we have to replace it.
That's like about$1.5 million. So that's actually half of the solid waste amount.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Alright. Then I guess while we wait for Director Messina,
Director Mansour, sorry if you mentioned this earlier, construction emergency
measures for wastewater, is that all related to Hilo, or is this for facilities
island-wide? I mean, the lion's share of this bond is to support one of your
divisions.
(Note: At this time, Environmental Management Director Ramzi Mansour
came forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MR. MANSOUR: That is correct. Thank you. As presented on Fiscal Year
Budget 2022-23, this is actually going to cover multiple wastewater projects as
well as what Director Sako had mentioned as far as the solid waste projects. So
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definitely this is going to cover the Pua Sewage Pump Station; the Hale Halawai
Pump Station; D-19 Pump Station; Kealakehe; also the sand filter as we talked
about earlier in prior presentation, Kulaimano pump replacement; and some of it
there, other replacement, minor repair and replacement at other facilities. So this
money for in particular 2022-23 projects.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. Is it possible for you to send us a copy of that list,
kind of breaking down how much is going to each station? I was working very
quickly to write everything down.
MR. MANSOUR: Actually, you may have it as part of budget that was submitted
by the Mayor's Office for March 1st
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Maybe email us on what page to look at.
MR. MANSOUR: Will do.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. Thank you. I just want to echo the sentiments of
what my colleagues had raised earlier about this really once in a generation
opportunity. For so much free money to be out there, and why we aren't a bit
more aggressive in going after that and why we are choosing to just saddle
ourselves with this debt. So I just have to put that question out there. I just say it
because I know that you and your deputy have really come to the County with a
lot of experience, tremendous experience in successfully securing grants from
State and federal government.
So maybe it's just so overwhelming within DEM that there really is no time to be
securing that kind of funding. But hopefully with the positions that R&D
(Department of Research and Development) is looking to have in terms of grant
writers, grant managers, that they're kind of willing to work with your department
to go after those funding streams.
MR. MANSOUR: Thank you. Yes, we are working with R&D Director Adams
and also chasing that money as well. We have submitted shovel-ready projects as
well, so we're trying. Thank you.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Director. Aloha, Director Messina. Nice shirt.
Good morning.
(Note: At this time, Parks and Recreation Director Maurice Messina came
forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MR. MESSINA: Good morning.
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MS. KIERKIEWICZ: If you could just provide some insight, breakdown into the,
not$13 million, but$10 million all for your department's repair and maintenance.
MS. SAKO: I really apologize. It was my error.
MR. MESSINA: So thank you. Maurice Messina, Director of Parks and
Recreation. I mean,just like the other directors and everyone else in the room,
you know, when you see $10 million your eyes get real big. Then you sit down
and in 30 seconds later, your $10 million is gone. So what we did is we tried to
identify the projects that would affect the most folks, and we also tried to spread
as best we could into separate districts. Because we do have failing infrastructure
because of decades of deferred maintenance throughout our whole island. So
these are the ones that we went for.
The Coconut Island bridge repairs. We are currently working with a consultant to
let us know what our issues are with its falling. It's safe right now, we're doing
the investigation on to see what our weigh limits are. But this is one of our most
important bridges that we have as far as Parks. My understanding is that a few
years back this was taken out of DPW's inventory and put into Parks' inventory,
so we've been working with the DPW director and his team to help us do the
investigation on what is the possible failures of the bridge. Once we identify
those failures, we need to repair it because without this bridge we have zero way
to get to the coconut island. So that's what this one is.
The second one is the La`aloa Park Preservation Plan. This one has been on the
books for four or five years. Everything is ready to go. The preservation plan is
in place, the design is in place, but we just need $900,000 to $1 million to actually
affect the presentation plan of La`aloa. We are going to be starting up our ADA
(Americans with Disabilities Act)project at Magic Sands which is right next
door, and for us to fix one park and then have the preservation plan sitting right
beside of it, and that's not touching that, that's just bad business. So we want to
get both of them taken care of at the same time. We've been working with the
local communities out there. They know that we are going to put this on our list
as well. And they're very happy for that.
Kawananakoa Center repairs. This is the gym in Keaukaha. We're ready with
everything. We're currently in design. We need some more money to actually
finish the design and actually do the repair work at the gym. If you go out and
look at the gym—if you're the Parks Director and you look at that gym, you're
upset that this is one of your facilities. This is another one that's been on the
books for years and years, and the community is jut waiting for us to fix it. It's
heavily used for the local community out there. So this is another one we've got
to take care of.
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The Kohala pool, you can see our original estimate there is $4.5 million. Now
that we know that we're going down to $10 million from the $13 million, we
would like to use a portion of this to at least get our design work done. Once we
get the design work and the consultation work done, we'll have a solid number of
what it's going to take to repair the pool. That phase will probably take us a year
or more on its own so we're committed to working with the Mayor's Office and
the Finance Director to see if we can secure other funding sources to actually do
the repairs of the pool. But we've got to at least get that part done first.
Wai`ohinu Park Comfort Station Replacement, this is one of our parks in Maile's
district that we're spending about$20,000 a year right now on portable toilets out
there. We're cleaning them twice, and within the first half a day of the cleaning
they're full again, and it's becoming a real safety hazard for us and our workers.
So once we get this fixed, I think we'll actually get more usage back at the park as
well. Right now nobody wants to use the pavilion, nobody wants to use anything
because you've got to go use the portable toilets.
The last one is repairs at the Civic. Replacement of the ceiling, the lighting
systems, retractable bleachers, electrical systems upgrade, and a few other things.
Right now when UH plays (University of Hawaii)we're on TV and we're
looking at termite-ridden bleachers, which is unacceptable. The lighting system,
the ceiling, the ceiling is in bad need of repair as well. This is supposed to be the
jewel of our island, the Civic, and we would like to actually finally get this work
done as well. Electrical system upgrades need to happen.
So for our list, these are some of the highest priority ones that we have, and we
tried our best to see if we could put a little bit in each district so that we can
actually concentrate on our other CIP items and work with the Administration to
get those funded.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Director. I appreciate that. My final question
is for Planning Director Kern. I know my colleagues probably have specific
questions for the various directors, but Director, you've been listening very
intently to the priorities that have been articulated by the various directors. You
know, Council Woman Lee Loy and I have been meeting with you and your team
and various departments per the resolution that was adopted on the condition of
County assets. Director Sako has had incredible ideas that I hope we are going to
move forward and explore more.
But we want to have confidence that going forward we're not going to be in the
state of disrepair that we're in now. So your thoughts, your grand master plan on
what that could look like for us.
(Note: At this time, Planning Director Zendo Kern came forward to
address the members of the Committee.)
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MR. KERN: Sure. Good morning, Mr. Chair, members of the Committee.
Zendo Kern, Planning Director. Thank you for the opportunity to speak to this.
I'd say, you know, we've taken a look at the CIP process, the repairs and
maintenance, we've been working with both Council Woman Lee Loy and
yourself on this matter and the one word that comes to mind is overwhelming.
There's a lot to do. So what we've been doing is really trying to work together to
model it out and design a program that would actually capture these elements,
whether it be repair and maintenance, CIP, and put that into a format that we can
see and understand and then have a logical pragmatic and systematic approach to
how we'd attack those.
In our CIP process, we did—we are very assertive in question asking, verifying,
you know, what the need was, do they have enough timeframe to get the capital
projects done, is it just A&E, we put together some various just kind of ranking to
it to try to begin to put together a system, and the deeper you dive into it the more
complicated it gets. So the certainty is that we're not going to back down from it,
that we'll keep pushing on it. I believe we have a good framework. Now it's how
we plug that in and continue to gather that data. It's one thing to gather the data
and have it, but it's how do we have it be ongoing and not take a tremendous
amount of bandwidth, that we can actually through our moves be able to plug in
the information that we need and would then actually come out in some type of
computer program or whatnot.
So we're in discussion with the rest of the department, Deanna, etcetera, on how
to put that together. One of the challenges that we face in the Planning
Department, and same with the other departments, is bandwidth. In order to take
this on in its entirety the way that I think we'd all like to, it's going to require
additional bandwidth. I have my team working on it. We've worked on it with
you too to the extent that we can at this moment to say, okay here's what we have.
Design-wise, here's what we have. Some good ideas, here's what we've been
able to capture, here's what we're doing in our current CIP process, and then
here's how we can move forward with repairs and maintenance, so we don't get
back to this type of situation.
So I'd love to say that we have it all solved, and we can plug and play next year;
we're getting closer. But I think understanding it and looking at design of it is
really, really critical. And something I see in a lot of areas now, looking back into
other things that we've taken over is that attention at the beginning to designing
something that actually makes sense, and that will work moving forward. I
believe we're at a pretty good place with that and now it's what tools can we use
to plug into that. But it's serious, and just even with the bandwidth alone withing
the department is so tricky.
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MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Very complex situation. Hear you, and I think the team
that's been assembled is really the right one at the perfect time to really design
something that is not just meaningful, but something that we can realistically
continue to use, because it's not going to be overwhelming to kind of plug in
regularly the state of the conditions of our assets. Because then it will be useful.
The system is not useful if it's not continually updated with new information.
MR. KERN: Correct, and relatively easy to update, relatively easy to track. If
we're not going to do that, I don't think we should do it anymore. We're just
wasting our time to create something that'll be another "plan"that sits on the
shelf. We don't want to put together a program that sits on a shelf when we
capture it if this is an ongoing endeavor.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: You don't feel we're wasting our time?
MR. KERN: I believe if we can push forward with it now, with that mindset,
we're not wasting our time.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Great. Thank you.
MR. KERN: I know we're not wasting our time.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair I really appreciate the latitude. I have more
questions, but I certainly want to hear what my colleagues have to say. Thank
you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Kierkiewicz. Just a
reminder, keep the discussion to the bond. Mr. Richards, go ahead.
MR. RICHARDS: Thank you, Chair. Deanna? Okay, so we're reserving the
conversation from the previous bill to this bill, and we're going to address the
ceiling as far as the bond limit, our bond rating. Just to reiterate, we have
potential for about 13 percent, but we've only actually spent 8 percent. I'm
recalling numbers that you were saying. Can you just explain that to the public?
MS. SAKO: Sure. So when we submitted the budget, the debt service in the
various funds, so there's been an excise tax, General Fund, or Vehicle Disposal,
adds up to 8 1/2 percent of our total budget, and then with the bond ordinances that
may have been approved previously, any SRF funding that has come to the
Council and been approved but not yet actually borrowed, even the SRF loans, we
draw down as needed. So any of that debt that we haven't actually issued yet, if
we were to issue it let's say all today, then we'd be at 13.69 percent of the budget.
MR. RICHARDS: And you and I have had this conversation before, but what is
the—we have to maintain below a certain debt level to maintain bond rating.
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MS. SAKO: We try our best to keep below 15 percent of our total expenditures.
And obviously, like let's say the current situation with our wastewater treatment
facilities, if we needed to exceed that and we had a good explanation for that, then
hopefully the bond rating agencies would not look upon that unfavorably.
MR. RICHARDS: Okay, and what I don't see accounted for is theI don't know
if the term is right, but the expiring of bonding meaning that you're satisfying the
debt. So as we're paying down debt over the next,pick a number, three to five
years, what's your expectation of the debt incurred, where would we end up with
that?
MS. SAKO: So in the next few years we have several bonds coming due. We try
to do it kind of even debt service over the next several years. So our debt service
right now is right at about$50 million I think, when you take in all of it. So over
$40 million of that is actual principal amount being repaid each year.
MR. RICHARDS: Okay, so currently right now that eight percent equates to
about$40 million of debt and then the next few years will add on the interest, is
that correct?
MS. SAKO: Yeah, so while we keep paying back about$40 annually, $30 to
$40 million, it's going to depend on when the projects are ready to go, and the
funding is paid out. So even not to pick on anyone but just to use as an
example, P&R (Department of Parks and Recreation) is actively working on their
ADA compliance projects, so they have a couple bond authorizations. So right
now a lot of the money has gone towards planning and design but recently many
of those construction contracts have been signed. So we do anticipate the cash
flowing a little more quickly.
But we still do have some cash remaining from our last bond authorization. And
then our goal would be to use BANS or Bond Anticipation Notes first, so that we
don't borrow too early. Because we do tax exempt bonds, if we borrow too early,
IRS doesn't like that, and we have to pay back interest and things like that. So we
want to make sure that we're following all the rules. So we're probably a year or
two away from issuing our next bond, our actual bond and borrowing more
funding.
MR. RICHARDS: Okay. Alright, so and I think it's important that the public
then understands that we're not up against the wall and we're at our borrowing
limit. The fact that we're just authorizing the ability to borrow.
MS. SAKO: We're being very transparent and saying if all of the debt authorized
was issued, that's where we would be at.
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MR. RICHARDS: Okay, so I appreciate that, Deanna. Chair, I listened very
carefully, because what we're talking about is the bond itself. I have lots of
questions for directors, but I'm mindful of that going forward. So I think in the
interest of time, I'll let that go and we'll figure out another way to ask those
questions. Deanna, is there any other comment you want to make about the bonds
and what we're headed? From my perspective, I think we're very comfortable
about setting ourselves up for bonding to get some of this stuff done.
MS. SAKO: Yes, and so you know, we do, and we talk about it when we're with
the bond rating agencies. They know what we have coming out, you know.
They've been very aware for a long time that we have the Parks and Rec. ADA
compliance issue and different things. And now they're aware that we have
wastewater. But you know, we're also trying to use whatever sources we have
available to us. You know, whether it's the infrastructure ask, the WIFIA loan
program, SRF, State, you know, we're trying to have a complete package, but we
need to show that we're willing to put our share of the support in as well.
MR. RICHARDS: Okay, then final question. A lot of this revolves going
forward, and you've heard about the capacity concerns, and you've heard about
being able to operate quickly. Part of that is about having the matching funds
available. Like for instance in my district, Waikoloa Road, that's under the STIP
program (State Transportation Improvement Program), but we have to have the
matching funds available now if we're going to jump on that. And where we have
been successful is in having those shovel-ready projects set to go, and I know
that's why we're doing the planning.
But that being said, for all of our shovel-ready projects, are we comfortable and
set to do that because we don't have the match. We do have it available for all of
the road projects in that bond and then the General Excise Tax Fund. For some of
like the wastewater, that's, you know, we tried to include money here. It's
possible we would need to come back for additional authorization depending on
what happens. It's just, you know, each time we do like a recovery kind of
package like the Infrastructure Act coming down,we don't know exactly what the
match requirements are going to be yet. So we have tried to set funding aside, it's
just I can't guarantee we have enough right now.
MR. RICHARDS: Okay, but this is part of the planning. That you are planning
on having cash ready to match.
MS. SAKO: Okay, alright. Thanks, Chair. I appreciate that. Thanks, Deanna. I
yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Deanna,just given the conversation, I
know each department has a list of projects has a list of projects they've outlined.
Director Mansour mentioned it, where it could be found, but I think it would be
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good to have a solid list in front of all the Council Members for each one of these
asks, if it hasn't been done already.
MS. SAKO: I do have the lists, and I might scale it back and send a summarized
list. This has more details than others.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I think that would help. So if we could get
that, please, to Council Members through communications, so that we can all see
it before the next reading, that would be good.
MS. SAKO: Okay.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you.
MS. VILLEGAS: Chair?
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Ms. Villegas, go ahead. Thank you.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you. Aloha, Deanna. Thank you for being here today.
In light of the conversations we've had over the last couple of years relating our
debilitating infrastructure in many of these different departments, I want to thank
you and thank Mayor Roth for taking the initiative to bring forward this
courageous ask, and I think it's something we've talked about a little bit in taking
a look at okay, we're A-plus, but if we need to go to a B in order to get the
resources necessary to keep our departments functioning in the highest capacity
and mitigate any future major disasters.
So I want to thank you for lining us up for these kinds of resources and doing the
heavy lifting that I'm sure it took in order to come up with these numbers and get
us where we need to be, to be—so that they'd pick us for these bond ratings. It's
definitely a testimony to your leadership in our Finance Department that we are in
a place to be able to do this.
I also want to thank Director Ramzi Mansour. I had some time last week before I
got sick, with Senator Kai Kahele and he and I talked about our sewer systems
and our wastewater treatment facilities, and it is high on his list to offer whatever
support possible. So I'm really heartened and hopeful that as we continue to
approach opportunities for infrastructure funding from the federal government,
that we have the eyes and ears of the appropriate people in points of leadership to
direct those resources to our County for infrastructure projects, and that we also
have the capacities within our own leadership teams for self-sufficiency when it
comes to going out for bonds as necessary, and for matching funds.
So thank you for taking that initiative and utilizing that courage and putting us in
a position where we will be ready and financially capable of making the
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improvements that are so necessary to many of our severely depleted
infrastructure projects. So I just wanted to say that. And thank you again,
Deanna, and all the department heads who have had to dig deep and come up with
the specifics. It's one thing to broadly say "Aaaah, things are falling apart," and
it's another thing to have to really come up with where specifically there are
problems and how to fix them. So thank you again, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay Council. Just as gentle reminder, we
have a fairly large order of business to go through still before we get to Council
today. So keep it brief and short, to the point. Thank you, Council Members.
And Ms. Lee Loy, go ahead.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you, Chair. I'm mindful of the time, but this is
$139 million; $149, and I think the questions are pertinent. So Deanna, you
know, we just did (Bill 131), the one before, sorry.
MS. SAKO: Yeah, for the additional design work for Hilo Wastewater Treatment
Plant.
MS. LEE LOY: Right, so is that reflective in Communication 654.1? Because I
think there's that—
MS.
hatMS. SAKO: Yeah, so I thought I heard $12 million. It's actually $13. They can
just take it out of the $62 1/2 million. So part—the WIFIA loan match, the
$25.5 million that is you know, we do need to show that for our WIFIA
projects. But if it's actually $13, but I thought I had heard $12. They may have
just gone a little higher in case they need change orders on the appropriation.
MS. LEE LOY: Okay, so when we're doing this math, right, the $12 plus the $25
plus the $62
MS. SAKO: It should be $100 million for wastewater.
MS. LEE LOY: $100 million for wastewater, right. But how does that impact
Bill 131? It's okay because we can still move the money around. Or is that—
MS.
hatMS. SAKO: Bill 131 is actually the appropriation or the bucket to hold the
money, and then they will do an allotment based on this bond authorization,
should it pass, to put the money actually in there.
MS. LEE LOY: Also on this list, Deanna, is the $2.5 (million) for the Animal
Control. Completely support.
MS. SAKO: And that's not the entire that amount is not just for the purchase.
It's also to help with the West Hawaii facility, to do some interim repairs while
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they assess the situation. If possible, we may need to build a new facility in West
Hawai`i, but right now there are issues that we need to deal with so we can
continue to use it for animals.
MS. LEE LOY: So I ask things, right? This is under Police. Can we pull some
of that funding out of Fair Share Contributions? Again, this is a lot of money, and
we're talking about creative funding. Right? Blending and braiding a whole
bunch of funding together. So I was just wondering if
MS. SAKO: So we're going to do our best. You know, the Puna Region is not an
area that has a lot of fair share contributions. But all of that will help to facilitate
and hopefully allow us to borrow less. But yeah, there's not enough to do the
whole project, I can tell you that. So we still need additional funding.
MS. LEE LOY: Okay, so is this one for the Puna one or for the West Hawaii
one.
MS. SAKO: So in the bond itself, it's for both. It's to buy the Puna, then to
repair West Hawaii in the meantime.
MS. LEE LOY: So there might be some Fair Share funds from West Hawaii that
could possibly ?
MS. SAKO: Because I'm not sure we're going to expand capacity at West
Hawaii right now, those funds may help us when it comes time to build new
facility in West Hawaii. But you know, we continue to work with Planning and
let them interpret their rules.
MS. LEE LOY: I actually think this is expanding police capacity, right? It's not
so much the footprint of the particular facility, we're taking on new work, which
in my book checks the box on using fair share contributions. We heard a list of
projects, and I would appreciate seeing that list. But I don't know why I continue
to have so much heartburn around this. Because these projects are absolutely
necessary, but some of it—actually all of it—is long bead. And I'm concerned
that a lot of these projects will be realized in year three, five, or six. We won't be
able to expend the money. And I'm just wondering if we've identified projects
that are actually quicker and can be realized faster so in these lists there's projects
that are good for 18 to 24 months, yes, we can get it done; 24 to 36 months, yes.
Design—and I'm sorry I'm wearing my planning hat, but I'm also trying to
manage
MS. SAKO: There are other lists that have already been submitted to the State in
terms of projects that are shovel ready. And the last time when we had the ARRA
funding (American Recovery and Reinvestment Act), many of those did not
require a match so we're waiting to hear what the match requirements are. So
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yes, are we going to have to come back? Yes, we may have to come back
specifically for matches, but we have already supplied a list of shovel-ready
proj ects.
So some of these are shovel ready even on these lists. Whether it's the Aupuni
Center roof replacement or whatnot, some of those already do have completed
designs and they're ready to bid out. So we definitely have projects that are ready
to go, and there's other projects on the shovel ready list. And I'm sorry, I didn't
think to bring that list down.
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, and that actually raises my comfort level, right? If I saw
the list and knew, like that roof repair could happen within six months and
contracted and ready to go, then we could actually kind of check the box out of
the 36 items on this list, that this funding is looking to utilize. We can say, okay,
we got through five in your one. Yeah, I think that would help me a lot, Deanna.
I do want to circle back around on Director Kern a little bit,just because I think
that needs assessment. And some of the work that we're doing in that small
working group I think is absolutely important right now. Because I'm bracing for
just thinking globally. I'm bracing for every single one of these projects, going
need more money. Just because of our global climate right now. So I almost
want to see the list, and acknowledge, hey, some of these, we're not going to be
able to get to it, because we're just not going to have the funding for it.
Those are my thoughts, Deanna. So if you could help provide that list, that would
be very helpful for me. I yield at this time.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Lee Loy. Mr. Chung, go
ahead.
MR. CHUNG: Yeah, Deanna. Just as a matter of clarification, you said that
when all of the bonds are issued and we're going to be both to 13 percent, right,
you included this one as well, right?
MS. SAKO: Yes, including this one $49.5 (million), yes, correct.
MR. CHUNG: Alright. I just had to get that off the table. Like Ms. Villegas, I
really wanted to thank the Administration for moving ahead with this. I think you
know that I was in the process of preparing a bond ordinance as well, and then,
you know, we heard that you guys had submitted something. Because a number
of the members of this Council have actually been waiting for this. I think
someone, maybe me, asked you guys during the last budget process what kind of
aggressive strategy do we have for addressing our wastewater situation. So I'm
glad it's coming to pass now. I fully support it.
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And you know, my vote in favor of this is really partially a function of my trust in
you. I think over the years, you have truly proven yourself as a skillful navigator
when it comes to bond monies, and of course other things. But you've really been
good at moving things around and then, you know, getting us in better positions
than we would normally be. So thank you very much for all of that good work
over the years.
My question with regard to the wastewater, and I like it too, because you know,
with WIFIA and whatever is at the Legislature, I don't know if it's going to pass
really. But we did get the Intel back from the Legislature that at least one or two
very critical pieces over there were asking: what's the County doing? Where is
their buy in to all of this? Where is their buy-in. This will enable us to leverage
more monies, whether it's federal or State. I don't think that's going to happen.
So this is the impetus. But with regard to wastewater, as you well know, I have
not been supportive of this whole concept of the public-private partnership, you
know, with the wastewater system that's been floating around, advanced by the
administration for two straight years. It's not to say—and I'm going to use the
word privatization, because if it walks like a duck,talks like a duck, you know, it
is privatization. That's what was being advanced. And you know, I've stated
many, many times, I'm not against privatization in certain circumstances. That,
of course, raises the hackles of the unions. But that's okay because there are
applications for privatization. But not for stuff that involves public infrastructure.
And particularly now, if we're going to advance monies to improve this, what is
going to be the County's Administration's position on this matter? Are they
going to continue pursuing that or not? Because we're going to throw in a big
investment into this thing. Are you able to say?
MS. SAKO: I cannot speak entirely to it, but based on the part I've been privy to,
I believe that discussion has been for new facilities. So where new facilities come
online, that there could be another vendor potentially to carry on the operations of
that. But I'm just saying, you know, Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant, the
investment we're making will continue to be operated by the County. But yeah,
I'm not the one to talk about the rest of that.
MR. CHUNG: That's not my reading of the two bills. But still, nonetheless
though, as long as we have assurances that when we're going to be investing
monies into these things, we're not going to be really helping out a private vendor
to do something that they could have, or
MS. SAKO: No, this would continue to be run by the County. We have an
awesome crew out there at the Hilo Wastewater Treatment Plant. I think this is a
good chance to acknowledge them and all the work they've done to keep that
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facility operating all these years. And it's time we made an investment in them
and help to make their job easier.
MR. CHUNG: I've been thoroughly impressed with their devotion to their job,
and I'm glad you mentioned that, Deanna. Okay, then I have to echo what
Ms. Lee Loy said, you know, this is not going to be enough. But it's a start.
MS. SAKO: Yes. That's right. It probably isn't going to be enough. Some of
the departments do have the COVID factor, and so they did try to up it a little bit.
But when push comes to shove, and like you said, it's everybody's trying to get
the same materials, yes, what the final outcome's going to be we're not sure. And
we know for wastewater, depending what happens at the federal level and others,
we'll probably be back for more. But we want to at least, you know, start and
have money so that they can be designing, and they can be working on these
projects to move them forward.
MR. CHUNG: My last question is only going to take one minute of your time,
and you're the best person to ask this. What's going to be borrowing capacity
going forward?
MS. SAKO: We still have additional borrowing capacity. We also being a
conservative nature, we also estimate a higher interest rate when we're calculating
these percentages. So depending on what the market is when we go out,
hopefully we'll get a better rate and that will open up additional borrowing
capacity.
MR. CHUNG: We still can borrow, right, in the future?
MS. SAKO: Yes.
MR. CHUNG: We're not capped?
MS. SAKO: We're not capped.
MR. CHUNG: We're not going to be hamstrung.
MS. SAKO: Correct.
MR. CHUNG: Okay. Thank you, Deanna.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Chung. Ms. Kimball, go
ahead.
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MS. KIMBALL: Thank you, Chair. I have some technical questions. I'm glad
Council Member Chung asked if you were including this bond float in that
percentage. I was worried about that too.
MS. SAKO: Yes, I always do.
MS. KIMBALL: And then that 15 percent ceiling, that we can go beyond that. I
actually kind of want to understand what is the feeling. Is it just a policy? Has
the ?
MS. SAKO: It's a policy. And definitely it's something we discussed with the
bond rating agencies. But you know, we've never been in a situation where—I
think we've been fully aware of the critical nature of all of our wastewater
treatment facilities. So as we have that plan and as we design and know and have
a better idea of about actual cost and all of that, once we know how much we're
getting from the federal government and we can lay out the exact needs, that
would also allow us to, you know, with everyone's decision obviously, because
we'd have to come in for additional borrowing capacity. It's something that we
would talk about with the bond rating agencies, and I do believe they would
understand.
MS. KIMBALL: So at this 13.9, I think it was
MS. SAKO: Thirteen point six.
MS. KIMBALL: Okay, I don't want to have too much extra there. So our bond
rating is not going to be affected at this point?
MS. SAKO: No, we go through annual monitoring or discussions and follow up.
So, so far we're doing good. And part of that is because our actual borrowing
again is up at eight and a half percent.
MS. KIMBALL: Can you expand a little bit on how this investment is going to
interact with the CIP requests. And from what I understand, with the exception of
wastewater, it's all going to repairs and maintenance and not CIP at all.
MS. SAKO: It's repairs and maintenance, but it's large repair and maintenance
jobs. So like a re-roofing. So it still flows through the Capital Projects Budget, if
that's what you're asking. So most of the departments either have appropriations
they can use already, or as you noticed in that bill right before this DEM
(Department of Environmental Management) didn't have enough. So they did
come in for the additional appropriation.
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MS. KIMBALL: I guess my interest was about anything we need to think about
in terms of the ability for us to go after CII'project funding by taking on so much
debt for this type of activity.
MS. SAKO: Oh, of their projects, yes. So you know, I think you've heard me
say before that much of our borrowing in the next few years is going to be for our
wastewater facilities. So that's still going to be the primary focus, but obviously
as you can tell by this bond ordinance, we still do need funding to make sure that,
you know, everything, our current facilities are taken care of. And as part of the
whole plan to move forward and have a better plan for all of the R&M projects
(Repair and Maintenance). I think if this administration and the department heads
are much better at communicating those needs and we all have a great working
relationship, I would say.
MS. KIMBALL: I think, I know multiple folks here on the board have asked for
the list, and
MS. SAKO: Yeah, I did write it down, and we'll transmit that.
MS. KIMBALL: And I'd like to request as part of those lists a statement from the
Director on what they're using to prioritize. Like what are their criteria for setting
that list. And so Sue's point, I would hate to invest a lot in design and then have
it sit on the shelf. So I do want to have sort of a status indication on these things,
if they're already designed or if it's the kind of thing that we can see all the way
through. Does that request kind of make sense, what I'm asking for? I'm looking
back at Ikaika, because I know that's going to be a lot. And Mo, you too, Mo.
MS. SAKO: So are they nodding at you?
MS. KIMBALL: Yes.
MS. SAKO: Okay.
MS. KIMBALL: What is ourI'm sure each of these different divisions that
you've got here will probably easily use the full amount, but what is our ability
once we've passed this, to move things around if we need to? Do you have to
come back to us?
MS. SAKO: Well the hope is no; we wouldn't have to come back. Because as I
mentioned earlier, the idea was to leave it broad because if any of these projects
that the departments have talked about today, if we can get federal money or any
other grant funding, whatever it is, we're going to use that first. And then go
basically to probably like their next list, you know, next item on the list. Because
they all have much longer lists than what they've presented today.
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MS. KIMBALL: And that actually leads to my next question point. We've
talked about this a little bit, keeping it a little bit broad so that if these are things
where we need to match funds or we can utilize the federal infrastructure package
money, we have that. And so that's why I'm supporting this, is I think this is a
once in a lifetime opportunity to take advantage of these federal funds. And what
this bond actually does is give us the revenue source to provide those matching
funds if we need to. So we're like positioned. Like, we're ready.
MS. SAKO: Yes, right, right.
MS. KIMBALL: And I think that's something that all of us is super concerned
about is that we're ready, not just from the planning of project side, but also from
the financial side, to take advantages of as much as that federal funding as
possible. So I really appreciate that about this.
One more question, Chair, if I may? When we had done the DEM budget review
and had conversations with Ramzi, really, really want to emphasize and
island-wide wastewater management strategy, a plan. And I don't see that in the
budget.
MS. SAKO: In the new budget that you got, I believe it is in there.
MS. KIMBALL: Is it? Okay. If it is, wonderful. I would just—I've always just
said—wonderful. Thank you.
MS. SAKO: Yes, I'm pretty sure it's there. I don't remember the exact language
of what it was called, but I will find it for you.
MS. KIMBALL: Thank you very much. Wonderful. That's music to my ears
because I think that's going to be critical in terms of the planning processes for
moving on. Thank you, Chair. I yield. Appreciate the extra time.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Kimball. Ms. David, go
ahead.
MS. DAVID: Thank you, Chair. And thank you, Director Sako, for all your
work. It's just—so it amazes me, your abilities to handle the budget for this
County the way you do. I just want to thank you and your staff and your
department, as well as the directors.
Speaking about wastewater, Mr. Mansour? Thank you, Director Mansour. The
plan for Pahala and Na`alehu, I know that's probably in your island-wide plan for
those two sites, but I am just wanting to confirm that you are working on
something that would basically save us the money with respect to those
wastewater treatment conversions. And I don't want to know any details, but I
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just wanted to confirm that's going to be the path that DEM is going to be taking
with respect to those two facilities.
(Note: At this time, Environmental Management Director Ramzi Mansour
came forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MR. MANSOUR: That is correct.
MS. DAVID: Thank you. I just wanted to make that, you know, it's been such a
contentious issue for years, and I'm very, very happy. And I know that you had a
lot of help in trying to come up with that and work under the federal rules and
stuff. So I really appreciate that. Very excited to actually sit down with you guys
and go over that.
I think everybody has already asked the questions of you, Deanna, and I thank
them for that. I hope that Director Messina, your list, the top six, I hope you have
enough money for that, and if you don't then I hope we can balance that out so
that these top priorities for Parks and Rec can be
MS. SAKO: Yeah, or we'll be back for more.
MS. DAVID: Yeah, yeah. Thank you. And that's my last question, any changes
to the list and what's going to be used with this bond, will you be coming back to
us? You said know, but how would we know that there would be issues, let's say,
if you move along with these projects, the department moves along with the
projects? How would we know that we're doing good, we're going to have to
adjust some funding, or that sort of thing? Would you just come and tell us, or
do ?
MS. SAKO: I think we're probably not going to have a real firm footing on that
till after the infrastructure bill comes down, but we can try and work on updating
that. Or maybe the annual budget would be a good time to discuss some of that,
too.
MS. DAVID: Okay, good. During that process. That's great. That's all I have,
and thank you, everybody.
MS. SAKO: And if I could just remind the Council that I would really appreciate
if someone could move to amend with Communication 654.1. Thank you.
MS. DAVID: Alright, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Deanna. Thank you,
Ms. David. Yeah, take that motion. Thank you, Ms. Lee Loy.
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Vote on Motion Ms. Lee Loy moved to amend Bill 132 with the contents of
to Amend: of Comm. 654.1. Seconded by Mr. Richards and carried by
(Approved) the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Inaba,
Kimball, Lee Loy, Richards, Villegas, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder–8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Member Kierkiewicz– 1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. Now back to the main motion,
Council Members any further discussion on Bill 132 as amended? Okay, I have
one follow-up question. Ms. Sako, Bill 132, it says right on the front for
$139,500. So we amended with the contents of the Communication 654.1, but—
MS.
utMS. SAKO: So on page two of that communication, I believe we do have the
bracketed amount being changed in both Section 1 and Section 2.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So the bill, Bill 132, does that need
to change as well, or we've done that by amending with the communication?
MS. SAKO: I thought we just did that by amending with this communication.
Am I correct? Okay.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, okay good. That was my only
question. Very much appreciate the conversation today and all the directors being
here to help us kind of walk through what the funding will be used toward. Please
provide the list so we can see what's going on per department. I really like
what
MS. SAKO: I have list. It's the other criteria and whatnot that I don't have
exactly. So that could take a little longer. But we'll work on that.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. I like you know, I was waiting for
it, what was the criteria and the metrics used to come up with picking the projects.
And I think that just denotes equitable kind of movement forward with the use of
the bonds. Like it. Thank you. Okay Council Members, so we have the motion
on the floor to forward Bill 132, as amended with the contents of Communication
654.1, to Council with a favorable recommendation. Mr. Clerk, roll call vote,
please.
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Vote on Bill 132: The motion to recommend passage of Bill 131,
Draft 2 as amended to Draft 2, on first reading was carried by
(Approved) the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Richards,
Villegas, and Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder–9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
Comm. 639: REQUESTS AN UPDATE FROM THE OFFICE OF HOUSING AND
COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT REGARDING THE ESTABLISHMENT
OF THE HAWAII COUNTY HOUSING COALITION AND THE
COMPREHENSIVE STRATEGIC HOUSING ROADMAP
From Council Member Ashley L. Kierkiewicz, dated February 15, 2022.
(Note: Comm. 639.1, from Housing Administrator Susan Kunz dated
March 8, 2022, was circulated.)
Motion to Close File: Ms. Kierkiewicz moved to close file on Comm. 639.
Seconded by Mr. Inaba.
(Note: At this time, Housing and Community Development Administrator
Susan Kunz came forward to address the members of the Committee.)
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Aloha, Administrator Kunz. Thank you for your patience
and just being available to provide us an update. As you know, last term this
body adopted a resolution calling for the Office of Housing and Community
Development to develop a strategic housing roadmap, this term, Council Woman
Lee Loy and I put forward a resolution, again adopted by this body, urging
acceleration of said roadmap. And also—and so that's what kind of brings us
here today, is getting a senseoh, it also included, sorry one more thing,just an
analysis of our inclusionary zoning policy for the County and the potential impact
it has had on our housing inventory.
So just looking to get a very high-level overview today; and thank you, seeing a
communication here now from you that sketches out what you think is going to be
included in the roadmap. So if you could kind of just walk us through that and
just be available for questions, it would be appreciated. Thank you.
MS. KUNZ: Sure, no problem. Thank you so much for this time today to give
you some updates on these activities that we've been working on. So yes, I do
recognize the resolution that urged the Office of Housing to—couple of things,
right? Do a comprehensive review of our Chapter 11, which is the inclusionary
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zoning policy, and the development of a strategic roadmap for housing
development.
So regarding the progress of the work on Chapter 11, we utilized a professional
services process to select Keyser Marston Associates. This is a company out of
Northern California. They're a real estate advisory firm actually. Their principles
have about 20 to 40 years of experience on staff. They do a lot of work in
affordable and market-rate affordable housing development, transit-oriented
developments, infrastructure finance, public finance, and land use. So we're very
excited to be able to work with them.
You know, I don't want to just read off a list of bulleted items, but I'm kind of
forced to because I really want to make sure that I share with you some of the
components of the contract that we have in place with them, give you a flavor of
what we're doing.
So we have contracted with them to do work on the review of residential market
conditions and trends and the need for affordable housing on this island. They
will be doing a financial feasibility analysis that will evaluate the ability of the
market-rate residential development to sustain the existing Chapter 11
requirements and to test potential alternatives. They will also be doing an
analysis of economics of increased density as a tool, and I'm hoping that actually
this component will help feed the data from this element will feed the Planning
Department in some of the work and collaboration that we're doing with them as
well.
They will also be analyzing compliance costs for developers and incentives that
we might consider under Chapter 11. Evaluate the system of the excess credits, I
think this is really critical. Do a summary of inclusionary requirements that all of
the other counties are doing so that we can see what's going on out there as a
comparison. They will participate with the Office of Housing to do public
meetings to not only take in information, but also to discuss the study as it starts
to roll out. And of course then they will prepare a report to present the analysis,
findings, and recommendations.
We will be coming back to the County Council to present this report upon the
completion of this study. I am anticipating based on the timeline it will be
somewhere around August through October. During that period is when we
would like to come back to the Council to final report.
Regarding our progress on the strategic roadmap, we've actually engaged quite a
bit on this item. Not only with the community but also with our other
departments who I am collaborating with on this strategy. We do recognize that
there's a need for change in action on this front, and the development of this
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roadmap will be kind of a fluid ongoing process for me. We will evaluate and
take in considerations as we consider to work with the consultant Keyser Marston.
So the initial roadmap that we have in place right now or what we are considering,
there's five different strategies that we want to present, and I've outlined it for
you in the communication (see Comm. 639.1). So the first one of course is a
comprehensive study and review of Chapter 11. I'll say here that, you know, the
purpose of the review and the update is to ensure that the County's policy is
working as efficiently and as effectively as possible while avoiding possible
unintended impacts and constraints on the production of market-rate housing.
And I want to remind all of us that Chapter 11 can only work if there is a good,
vibrant market-rate housing development going on. So we need to ensure that is
happening.
The second strategy is to consider changes to Chapter 23, the Subdivision Code
and Chapter 25, the Zoning Code. The Planning Department is currently working
on their General Plan and Community Development Plans while doing this
comprehensive review of two of these chapters. I know that Director Kern is in
the room and I'm wondering if maybe he can kind of talk us through a couple of
those components. Thanks, Zendo.
(Note: At this time, Planning Director Zendo Kern came forward to
address the members of the Committee.)
MR. KERN: Thank you, Susan. Zendo Kern, Planning Director. Yeah, the
timing of this is quite advantageous, because we are, again as Susan said, we're
going through the GP update (General Plan), but also, we're doing the deep dive
into Chapter 23 and Chapter 25 to do a comprehensive update. We're going out
for professional services on that and are currently doing a request for information
right now. So I think the timing of getting this information through to their
consultant and our work will link up really, really well together. And I think a lot
of it will confirm some of the thoughts that we know, and I think it will also shed
some light on some areas that we don't know yet.
So we're really excited to be working together on this, you know, things that we
know that we're going to be working on, or how our subdivision streets are built,
right. So right-of-way widths; curb, gutter, sidewalks, et cetera. Not only does
that affect our climate change, but it also affects cost. Density, we see other areas
where they have much greater density in the areas that, you know, are in our
urban growth areas. So it's another area I know we'll be looking for as well.
When density bonuses for affordable housing, especially things that we see
consistently in 201H applications or PUD's (Planned Unit Development), where
they're basically requesting types of variances to effectuate these projects.
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To me, and I felt the sentiment for a lot of us will be that if it makes sense and it
meets certain criteria, there should be a pathway for people to be able to be able to
follow. To do that and not have to go through alternate levels of challenges. I
was just on a presentation for the Statewide TOD (Transit Oriented Development)
Council a few weeks ago, and there were a couple of projects done by the UH
(University of Hawaii) for student housing. Very critical. So they did a big RFP
(Request for Proposals) for developers to come in and do that. And there were
two very large developers that came in that got the projects. One of them is Hunt.
So I asked them at the end of it, I said, "What's your biggest challenge you folks
face with getting these projects to where they need to be?" And it was certainty.
The lack of certainty is so challenging in the amount of time it could take and are
you going to get this, are you going to get that, what's this going to do, makes it, I
think, harder for smaller organizations as well, where these folks can float
millions of dollars for a few years waiting, and even with this being a UH project,
State backed, you know, backed by everybody, they still have that challenge. So
something that we want to do is bring in that level of certainty for these types of
projects. And between working with Susan and our update, I think we can do
that, and I think hopefully we'll attract the right folks doing the right types of
projects. That's the goal, and many other things as well.
MS. KUNZ: Thank you very much. Okay, moving along on the roadmap. So
Strategy 3 has to do with the establishment of an affordable housing fund. So this
fund will be dedicated of course to providing resources to increase housing, and
housing preservation as well. We see so often that projects are just about ready to
go. They have a lot of their pieces in place, but they just are lacking that gap
financing. I think this type of fund will help to secure that and free up and move
these projects along. The key will be to evaluate potential options for generating
these funds, and I think that's something that we're continuously working on. I
will say that putting this fund in place and securing it to make a difference in
affordable housing development will be that we can depend on a consistent supply
of this resource and a committed base amount. I think it's going to be really
critical to ensure that I can provide the property staffing to support this work, and
all of the things that come along with it.
So there are some eligible uses of course that we are looking at to provide grants
and loans to private developers to provide that gap financing. Costs associated
with the development of County and State-owned lands is something that we're
really focused on. It is kind of tied into another one of my the next strategy
actually to do some offsite infrastructure work. Land acquisition potentially,
assist with any qualified land trust on funding and development, and to leverage
funds of other federal, State, and non-County entities.
Strategy 4, the use of County and State-owned lands for affordable housing
development. So this is actually an activity that we've already started to engage.
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My office has about eight parcels island-wide that we've already submitted to
DLNR (State Department of Land and Natural Resources), and we have a couple
of County parcels. And we're still waiting to hear back. I'm very excited about
some of these parcels that we've identified. I think it will provide the perfect
opportunity for us to partner with developers, especially because land costs would
become so minimal, right, in this partnership. And I think sometimes with the
lack of funding, you know, our ability to provide the land for the development of
a project is pretty significant.
The last strategy that we have on the list is to consider planning and permitting
processes for 100 percent affordable housing projects to fast track them. I have
been working with Director Rodenhurst on this. We're still kind of at the
beginning stages of this conversation, but we want to consider a process to
expedite permitting for 100 percent affordable projects, consider a list of standard
waivers perhaps, and exemptions that would not be subject to departmental
reviews. You know, this really will take some work, to work through and
identify. I think Director Kern had mentioned a little bit about a lot of the 201H's
come through have pretty repetitive types of requests and waivers that come
through, and maybe that might be a starting place for us to look.
Consider acceptable pre-approved construction design exemptions that would not
be subject to departmental review. You know, I might be dreaming a little bit, but
Director Rodenhurst seems to think that it's doable and that if we come to the
table, you know, we could kind of try to work out. And even if we could identify
just a couple to get started on, I think it'll make a huge difference.
So those are the five major strategies that we've identified right now. Like I said,
you know, this is a collaboration, getting input, and I'm curious to see some of the
data that Keyser Marston Associates will pull out. I think it may or may not have
an effect on some of the things that we've already made out. We do have a few
other strategies that I've listed on your communication that we want to look at.
We haven't really dug into this yet, but definitely infrastructure is something
we've got to look at, and how we could strategize to develop that better. Because
that is the reason for some of our larger projects being on hold and not being able
to move forward.
Vacation rental regulations, additional financing tools, Building Code
considerations, and fees and exactions are some of the other things on the list.
Thank you for letting me present this to you. I can answer any questions if you
have any.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I think when we adopted this resolution, we thought a lot
of the work was going to be happening in-house. So thank you for finding the
funding to engage Keyser Marston. I just did a quick search on them. They are a
nice boutique firm that has a very good reputation in this arena of work. So really
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appreciate all the analyses and data that's being compiled and done in order to
kind of support how we move forward in a very surgical way.
When you mentioned the August-October kind of report back to the Council, that
report, is that the roadmap?
MS. KUNZ: It will include the roadmap.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: It will include the roadmap.
MS. KUNZ: Okay.
MS. KUNZ: So that timeline is really for the Chapter 11 review and the report
back on Chapter 11, but part of the scope of work is to assist us with the review.
And I have to say, because I've got to give kudos to my staff, a lot of these
strategies that we're presenting did not come from Keyser Marston, they came out
of my office. We presented it to the firm and kind of talked through it. And we
did, you know, a lot of people asked me about the Maui plan and if we planned to
consider something like that. So obviously, we took the plan and took a look at it.
And it was interesting to see that a lot of what my staff had developed was
aligning very similarly. Not in all cases, because we're not in the same
marketplace that they are, but they do align. So there was a lot of comfort with
that.
So when we submitted it to the consultant, you know, they were very supportive
with the work. But like I said, I think that as they start to dig in, with their
research on Chapter 11, it may start to affect or provide more input to the
strategies we've already developed.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: It's heartening to know that your staff is so involved in
kind of designing these strategies. Many of them have been there for years and
years, so they have incredible ideas and I think now they have a platform and
support to really explore what that means.
That's a very ambitious timeline to do everything that you said plus these
strategies. Please let us know when there are moments to be engaging critical
stakeholders in the community so that we can build education around what Office
of Housing is trying to do. Director Kern, on the code updates, you said, RFI
(Request for Information)? I thought I heard RFI so I wrote it down. I just
wanted to clarify because last budget cycle we provided you some funding to
contract out for that.
MR. KERN: Yeah, so a combination of both. We're sending out a quick RFI to
get some additional information from a few of these firms that we followed up
then by professional services. All of that is happening within the next six weeks.
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MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, RFI to refine scope of services, then you can go out
with your RFQ (Request for Questions).
MR. KERN: Yes.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, thank you for the clarification.
MR. KERN: No problem.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: And then there's the coordination with housing, because
obviously you're going to be impacted by these changes.
MS. KUNZ: Yes, very much.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay great. Ballpark figure for the affordable housing
fund? Glad to know that it's being considered as a line item in the annual budget.
MS. KUNZ: You're asking me if I have a ballpark?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yes.
MS. KUNZ: I do not at this time.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Is there a wish?
MS. KUNZ: I think some of the discussion was that—you know, I always want
to make sure that whatever funding I can get my hands on, I can spend it. So I
think if we can start with something like $4 to $5 million,just to test the waters, I
think that would be good. I think the need is much greater than that, but we're
really going to have to see when the budget rolls out and what's available. Now
as I stated in the strategy, I think part of this work is not just counting on the
budget. We have to look for other options and other sources of funding and that's
part of the work. So we'll see how that rolls out.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, strategy for use of County and State-owned lands
for affordable housing. Recognizing that this body with its non-legislative hat
also serves as Housing Agency, can one of your strategies be to explore how—are
we the right people to be filling those roles? Because oftentimes what is being
put forward to Housing Agency, we again hear in Finance and at Council. And I
just think that there are folks in the Housing arena that truly understand this
industry that should have a seat at the table and help plan for how do we make use
of this land to build up our housing inventory. Just something I want to put out
there and for you to consider. Again, not trying to shirk responsibilities, we have
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a lot to do as Council Members, and I think we would welcome the insights of
people that are in the business of building housing.
MS. KUNZ: Okay, will do.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you for taking that into consideration. Final
strategy on the planning, permitting, did you also say some adjustments to 201H
rules?
MS. KUNZ: I did not.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: You did not. But is that something we can ?
MS. KUNZ: But it is something that we are talking about, or maybe
incorporating it into Chapter 11, to kind of do a localized 201H process. Does
that make sense?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yes. I like what I'm hearing.
MS. KUNZ: Because the process that we're engaging right now is a State HRS
(Hawai`i Revised Statutes), and it does trigger prevailing wage, which increases
the cost of projects. So it is something that we are discussing.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: And Keyser Marston will explore that? Because I know
the tool is used at varying levels of success across counties.
MS. KUNZ: Yes.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: And then the inclusionary zoning piece, you mentioned
looking at impact across other counties in Hawaii. Can we expand the search
nationwide? And I just say that because I think Harvard also did a study on
inclusionary zoning, looking at policies and the impacts across the nation.
MS. KUNZ: Okay.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I am out of time. Thank you so much, Administrator,
Director, for being here, and for this really excellent report.
MS. KUNZ: Thank you.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Kierkiewicz.
Mr. Richards, I'm going to go to you. I'm just going to—reminder to the
Council, we have Council at 1:00 o'clock, and we cannot avoid that time. So
anything we don't get to, either we postpone until after the Council meeting, or
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postpone until the next Council meeting. So if you can, be mindful of your time,
and Mr. Richards, go ahead.
MR. RICHARDS: I will be. Thank you. Thanks, Susan, for being here. You
already touched on Strategy 3. I was going to ask the ballpark number. I think
you gave us one, $4 to $5 million, which tests the waters. I think that's a number
that we could start thinking about going forward. I'm very mindful of the fact
that you need to be able to spend it, which comes back to the whole 201H project
and the ineffectiveness of how we're able to administer that because we throw up
a lot of roadblocks and I don't get it because it's not supposed to be that way.
So I do like this idea of having some sort of local 201H addendum or however we
want to characterize it, so we can make this happen. The paradox is, yeah, we
talk about affordable housing, yet we keep blocking it. So we need to get these
roadblocks out of the way.
I agree with using our own land inventory. I'm a little bit jaded on the State side
and the acquisition of lands because again, I think we run into roadblocks there.
But I do recognize the potential value of that. However, I think we need to visit
that a little bit harder. Because once again, if we true own affordable housing, we
have to get the roadblocks out of the way. And we create so many roadblocks at
all levels of government. We can build big mansions no problem. Affordable
housing, there is always a reason why we can't do it.
So I'm very supportive of that and I'd like to visit a little bit further on that
acquisition and this regional 201H, I think that's masterful. How do we put
something in that we can just get so there's a program? And I think what you said
was we need to have that program, meaning if someone wants to build housing
you go through a, b, c, d, e, f, g, done, and then they can move forward and not be
subject to review and re-review and re- re- re-review.
MS. KUNZ: Exactly.
MR. RICHARDS: So I think that's what we have to get done. So I'm very
curious about having a further conversation on that. So I will come visit you
about and talk story on that because we've got to get this stuff out of the way.
I also, you know, Zendo, you were talking about the 201H, we get away from the
street and gutters necessarily, but we have more regional type of buildouts that
make more sense for us, and I like that as well because again, they're less costly.
So if we can put all that together so there's a package so if someone wants to do
this, we can actually do it and not have to come back before us and get an
exemption on this, and whatever. So I'm very, very interested in taking this
forward, because if we don't do this, we'll be here in two years doing the same
thing and talking about what we want to do and not actually get it done.
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So again, Chair, I want to be mindful of the time, and I will come, and we'll talk
story. Actually, we've got to talk story about exactly this in Waimea right now.
So I'll call you when we're pau.
MS. KUNZ: Okay, thank you.
MR. RICHARDS: Thanks, Chair. I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Richards. Ms. Lee Loy,
go ahead.
MS. LEE LOY: Love this. Thank you so much, Susan. And the work that
you're planning across with Director Kern just pitch perfect. I did want to take a
little bit of a deeper dive on Strategy 4, when you mention the use of County and
State-owned lands for affordables. So I have to couch this a little differently
because everybody knows I don't speak about affordable housing. I speak about
attainable housing, right, across all the price points because we know we have a
housing shortage. But has any exploration been given to private lands? And
here's why I ask this question: Oftentimes, the use of County or State lands is
automatically saddled with 343 requirements, funding from State or County
government, and I'm curious to know that although this is a great strategy of
cheap land, right, and somebody can come in, if there's been any exploration
around just unleashing private landowners to take advantage of what they might
already have as resources. Give them some of the exceptions and exemptions, or
regional exceptions and exemptions and just provide them that certainty and they
can go do it. Has any thought been given to that?
MS. KUNZ: We've been meeting very often with a lot of developers who have
private land. But the coordination and infusion of some of these other initiatives
of course has not been discussed because we're just starting to create these things.
But I think that if we came to the table with some of the private developers with
some of these strategies that we're starting to think about, I can't imagine what
might happen. And the thing to remember is again, I keep saying this, but
Chapter 11 is only going to work if we have the development of the private
market units. So I think that's a key piece that we really need to look at. I'm sure
Zendo's got something to say.
MR. KERN: Yeah, I agree. My thought process through this is that what we've
set up would work for private landowners as well as land that was government
owned that was going out for a process too, to attract a developer. Again, we
want to be able to provide as many tools there with the right framework to keep it
in the direction that we want. But yeah, that's why when we get into, you know,
we saw in the last 201H come through, that was all private. So a lot of private
folks are utilizing these processed, so we should make all of these changes
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available to them so they can know what they're getting into. And as Council
Member Richards says, you know, "a, b, c, d, e, f, g, you're good to go."
Certainty.
MS. KUNZ: Right.
MS. LEE LOY: Certainty, and then infrastructure cost. Because we know all of
this really hinges on either government providing those infrastructure so that they
can be unleashed, or—and I had conversation asking out loud, why do we need
sidewalks? Like why do we need it? And I know it sounds like a hokey question
and like almost kind of, I hear the screeching tires, right.
MR. KERN: One of the questions is why we need sidewalks the way that we
currently do, that were done back in 1983, right. So I was just in Las Vegas
recently—Chair I'll be really quick they're doing cluster developments. They
have a sidewalk, it's offset. It's a 30-food right-of-way, paved streets, simple.
Offset sidewalk on one side. Their infrastructure cost just went way down.
You're still creating that safety, that community that you don't want to lose, but
there's other ways to do it then the way that it has been being done.
MS. LEE LOY: Right, Complete Streets. Dovetailing Complete Streets. I also
had a note, because you just mentioned like five different times right now,
developer, developer, developer. And unfortunately over time, developer has
become a filthy word. I really want to reframe them to be called Housing
Contributors, because they come in kind of with this judgement already about,
you're going to do something horrible because you're a developer, when really
they're trying to help and provide housing. So housing contributor. Maybe that's
an area in Chapter 23 or 25 "If you're a housing contributor, you go down this
path." Just saying.
And lastly, I wanted to offer Director Kern and Kunz, I have joined an
organization called "Up for Growth." Up for Growth actually has a lot of this
data and has been collecting it across the United States. Even when we talk about
inclusionary zoning and some of the studies that have already been done. I just
want to offer that for you folks to look at. It's been an incredible valuable tool for
me to just read a lot of the reports talking about infrastructure and sidewalk and
cluster development and you know,just going more vertical rather than
horizontal. How that saves in infrastructure costs.
But yeah, that was my offer. If you guys need more information to help refine the
areas of Chapter 11, yay, 23, 25, awesome. Then I want to tackle 16 after that,
Zendo.
MR. KERN: We'll take all the information and help we can get.
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MS. LEE LOY: Okay. Ms. Kierkiewicz, thanks for advancing this conversation.
Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Lee Loy. Ms. Kimball.
MS. KIMBALL: Thank you. Thank you, Administrator, for being here. I will be
brief. One, we were in a session at the NACo Conference (National Organization
of County Officials) on Tourism Community Housing Issues, and one of the
discussions that was brought up, and I did some further research on it, is the
InDEED program that they're doing in Vail, Colorado. And what I really liked
about it is it's a deed restriction program for workforce housing. Their county
was purchasing a deed restriction on affordable units, or workforce housing units
and required in perpetuity that housing be sold to someone that worked within a
30-mile radius at a cost that just went up with the cost of living. And they've
been able to get 162 units in Vail where the median sales price is about
$2.5 million.
So I was really intrigued by that. I think under your financial strategies, that
might be another item to consider. The other thing I just wanted to chat about
was do you have concerns you know, I want to build all the housing that we
need, right, for all levels, all price points. Just don't want to get too far deep into
being landlords. I really want to emphasize our partnerships with nonprofits that
will ultimately take those units. So want to look at resale restrictions maybe, so
that we can pass some of these units to nonprofit land trusts to manage after
we've done our bit.
MS. KUNZ: Yes, yes.
MS. KIMBALL: Good, okay. So we're on the safe side on that one. Because
you know, ultimately if you guys do your job really well, you've worked yourself
out of jobs, right.
MS. KUNZ: Right, and I really am not in the business of property managing and
things like that.
MS. KIMBALL: Right, and I don't think the County should be. And so as much
as we can as we're looking at these novel approaches, make sure we're including
those pathways to essentially offload these products to nonprofits that can run
them for us. I'm really hoping that's considered.
You know I'm very curious to see the evaluation of Chapter 11 and the
inclusionary zoning. In particular, my question—in terms of the review, so
they're going to evaluate how well it has worked in Hawaii County based on
what criteria? Just number of units developed?
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MS. KUNZ: The number of units, the feasibility study on the cost of these
developments, what the market is producing. I think their intent is to create a
database, or a base to go from and then to determine the affordability piece after
that.
MS. KIMBALL: I will continue to reiterate my office's examination of
inclusionary zoning. Sort of a broad review of what's done in other
municipalities. It doesn't always work. It may not work here. But one of the key
things to making it work is providing multiple pathways for satisfying any kind of
requirement.
MS. KUNZ: I think it'll be interesting to see. You know, Chapter 11 has evolved
over the years. We've taken things out, we've put things in, you know, the
Housing Office does have a database, but it hasn't been a strong database because
it wasn't electronic back in the day. It was all kind of a manual thing. So we
have spreadsheets, we have things, and we're going to be dusting that off and
digging everything out because the consultant's going to want to see that.
And I want to see how the production of affordable housing has been affected by
some of these changes. And one of the things that is being considered is do we
even need an inclusionary zoning policy. I mean,we've even discussed that. So
that is on the table. So I'm very excited to go through this process with them.
MS. KIMBALL: Yeah, I think the more information, more data, is always going
to be valuable for good decision making. But again, I think as we consider what
the outcomes are, really want to look at some other alternatives. And you and I
have talked excessively about being able to restore existing dwellings that could
be made usable for housing, and that actually brings me to assist the question
about our Section 8 issue.
Is it a policy or rule that all of the permits have to be okay for Section 8? I mean,
I understand that's a new decision?
MS. KUNZ: No, it's not a new decision. So the Office of Housing has
Administrative Rules for running Section 8,and the requirement for permitted
structure is something that's in that ruling. I've had a lot of discussion lately,
especially because inventory is so limited. I need to get people housed. I need to
spend my money. So the discussion is very active right now. So I'm glad you're
bringing this up, actually.
HUD (U.S. Department of Housing and Urban Development) made it very, very
clear to me that Section 8 or HUD does not require a unit to be permitted in order
for me to house someone or use the voucher; very clear. He said, "That's not our
role, that's your role." And I think for us, it's worked in the past, but we're in a
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new day and age. We've got a totally different inventory situation. So we are
reevaluating that.
MS. KIMBALL: I'm glad to hear that.
MS. KUNZ: Yes.
MS. KIMBALL: I think that's an appropriate step.
MS. KUNZ: I've met several times already with Director Rodenhurst, so he's
very much on the same page with me. The thing that bothers me is when I deny a
potential client the use of a unit because it's not permitted, that landlord goes
away. They go into a black hole. I never see them again. The tenant doesn't get
housed. Where if you consider another scenario where I'm engaging the
landlord you know, and please know that HUD rules require me to determine
that the units are safe and healthy for individuals to be housed in.
So there's very strict criteria of inspections that I have to go through in order to
put a family in a house. So that is not going to change. HUD reminds me that the
County remains liable if anything should happen to the family, right, if I allow
them to be in a house. So there's all of that, that we have to navigate and be
careful about. So you know, I'm very conscious of that and responsible about
that. But I think there's a win-win situation that we can get to if we engage.
MS. KIMBALL: Yeah, I agree. And I think, you know, this may be more
relevant in the context of Bill 111, but you know, looking at getting people off the
streets and into housing, getting over that hurdle of being able to get houses that
pass the section, but not maybe have a garage that they didn't permit. Like, we've
got to make those available. Like you said, we lose the landlords.
MS. KUNZ: Yes, I agree.
MS. KIMBALL: I think that was it. I feel like there's one more thing, but I know
we're being sensitive on time. Thank you, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Mr. Inaba.
MR. INABA: Thank you. Good afternoon. Just a recap of where we are so I
know this is a progress on the strategic roadmap. I know the resolution that we
approved last year
MS. KUNZ: In November?
MR. INABA: November, asked for the roadmap I think by January. I know it's a
work in progress, but when do you think you'll have your completed roadmap?
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MS. KUNZ: So I want you to know that the strategies that I'm putting forth, I'm
actively moving forward on. So it's not as if that, as I'm saying to you it's a work
in progress, it's not like I'm not doing work on it because I need some kind of
start date. So it is something that I'm actively using. But my thought was
because Keyser Marston Associates was going to continue to work with the
Housing Office, and I'm really curious to see the data coming out of the study,
my thought is when I present the Chapter I I results, that we would finalize the
roadmap at that time.
MR. INABA: At the same time?
MS. KUNZ: The same time.
MR. INABA: Okay. I know that the resolution while nonbinding asked for the
report in April and you've secured—is it your expectation that they have their
product to you by June or July, and then you're going to come you know, take
that and do what you want with your office and present to us later, and that's the
reason for the few months.
MS. KUNZ: Yes, I understand. Their timeline I believe says that they should
have at least a draft of the report by the ending of July. I believe it's on the
timeline that we would be ready to come back to Council somewhere during
August to October. Giving myself a little leeway.
MR. INABA: Okay. Alrighty, thank you so much. Yeah, very much excited too,
and you know, I don't want toI think we've had discussion here that's policy
related, which wasn't the point of this. So I think,you know, the more we get
into that, you know, we should have these conversations with OHCD (Office of
Housing and Community Development) individually.
And one last question. I know Council Member Kierkiewicz brought up bringing
up some suggestions to the consultant. Is the contract amendable or fluid, or is it
kind of set already?
MS. KUNZ: Like most contracts, I mean, we've negotiated, there's a price with a
scope of work. So depending on what type of inclusions you would want, need to
consider with them, it might—you know, I might have to consider more funding.
MR. INABA: Okay.
MS. KUNZ: But talk to me. Let me know what you're thinking.
MR. INABA: Oh, no. I'm not thinking anything. She's just proposed, and you
said it might be possible. But I just wanted to know contract-wise if that is
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possible or if it would require more funding. So with that, I think we're on tract
then, and thank you for bringing an outside perspective what we have going on.
Thank you, Chair. I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. Ms. Villegas,
anything to add? Okay, nothing right now. Thank you. Okay, I think we've had
a good discussion on this. If you want to reach out to the Director, thank you for
your time today. I'm going to ask that everyone reach out independently and kind
of have that conversation offline. Thank you.
MS. KUNZ: Yes.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, with that we have the motion on the
floor. Mr. Clerk, I need a roll call. Then, Ms. Sako, I'm going to take
(Res.) 333-22.
Vote on Comm. 639: The motion to close file on Comm. 639 was carried
Filed by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Richards,
and Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Member Villegas — 1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Clerk. Appreciate it. Now
please, Resolution 333.
Res. 333-22: AUTHORIZES THE PAYMENT OF FUNDS OF A LATER FISCAL YEAR AND
OF MORE THAN ONE FISCAL YEAR FOR A MULTI-YEAR AGREEMENT
WITH MARSHALL AND SWIFT FOR APPRAISAL SOFTWARE AND DATA
Authorizes the Mayor to enter into a five-year agreement with a total cost of
$295,235.48 to renew software licenses for the Real Property Tax Division.
Reference: Comm. 651
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
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Vote on Res. 333-22: Ms. Lee Loy moved to recommend adoption of
(Approved) Res. 333-22. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following roll call vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David,
Inaba, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Villegas,
and Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder–7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Kimball and Richards –2.
Excused: None.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you very much, Mr. Clerk. So
given our time constraints today, we're going to go ahead and
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair? I'm so sorry. I'm wondering if I could humbly a
request that one of the items be taken out of order. Resolution 328-22. Fire Chief
Darwin Okinaka isn't here but he's been waiting patiently, and he has a time
constraint where he can't stay. And I really want to make sure that I'm able to get
Fire's perspective, part of the conversation and to be available with Council
Member questions.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I appreciate the request. I was actually
asked by the Clerk's Office that we need to cut and then we need to roll the tape
so we can get ready for the Council Meeting and give everyone a break. So I will
not be doing that request at this time. I apologize.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, thank you for your consideration.
MR. HENRICKS: I do apologize because we didn't give enough time for this
meeting, but we do need some between—some time before Council for people to
reset. So I hope that we could reconvene Finance after Council adjourns, take it
from there. I apologize to anybody who's inconvenienced by that.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Clerk.
Recess: At 12:32 p.m., the Chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 4:00 p.m.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Aloha. I am taking us out of recess for the
Finance Committee. We are going to start off, Mr. Clerk, with Resolution 328
please.
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Res. 328-22 : TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT IN THE GEOTHERMAL RELOCATION AND
COMMUNITY BENEFITS FUND TO PURCHASE EQUIPMENT FOR THE
HAWAII FIRE DEPARTMENT'S STATION 10 IN PAHOA
Transfers $300,500 from the Geothermal Other Current Expenses account; and
credits to the Geothermal Fire Equipment account.
Reference: Comm. 641
Intr. by: Ms. Kierkiewicz (B/R)
Motion to Approve: Ms. Kierkiewicz moved to recommend adoption of
Res. 328-22. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Ms. Kierkiewicz, take us away.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair, thank you so much for taking this out of order. I
have with us Assistant Chief Darren Okinaka. This is the Community Benefits
Fund that's funded by royalties from Puna Geothermal. That's really governed by
a section in our Code as well as rules within the Planning Department. So there's
a process to apply for this. Very specific instructions to apply for Community
Benefit as well as Geothermal Relocation. We are looking to leverage some of
the funding from the community benefit fund. Really the purpose here is to
ensure that our firefighters in Pahoa Station 10 have all the necessary PPE, that's
Personal Protective Equipment, in the event of responding to a hazardous material
event or other fire related incidences that really affects the respiratory system.
So there are a few items that we are looking to purchase through this resolution.
The first is a mobile self-contained breathing apparatus, SCBA compressor (Self-
Contained Compressed Breathing Apparatus), which we are all aware of because
we moved in an amendment last budget cycle to acquire another one for your
department; 20 SCBA bottles, these are the tanks that are full of air, clean air that
our firefighters are using when they're responding to these events; and then
having a vehicle in order to tow and transport the SCBA onsite in the event of a
fire or any other incident. Should there be an emission outbreak at PGV(Puna
Geothermal Venture), we would then be able to take this critical life-saving
equipment to the site and refill these air bottles there.
I just want to stress that right now we have—and Chief correct me if I'm wrong
two working, kind of working, SCPA compressors that service our entire island.
And when we had the fire on Mana Road, it really elevated the need to ensure that
our firefighters had breathing apparatuses readily available. So the fact that this
one is mobile, it can be deployed to any site within Puna in the event of a fire.
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I just want to share a statistic that Chief was able to pull for me. Between 2016
and 2021, there were approximately 1,650 fire-related calls in the lower Puna
District. That's nearly 35 percent of all fire-related calls on the island. So this is
really critical equipment for Lower Puna. Chief, I want to turn it over to you to
just kind of talk a little but more specifically about why it's needed and how it
would be supporting Station 10 and the Puna District as a whole.
(Note: At this time, Assistant Fire Chief Darwin Okinaka came forward to
address the members of the Committee.)
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Okay, thanks. Good afternoon, everybody. Darwin
Okinaka, Assistant Fire Chief with Hawaii Fire Department, Operations
Division. As actually mentioned, this is a much-needed piece of equipment. It's
to fill our self-contained breathing apparatus, which we utilize to provide clean,
safe air for our personnel to breathe when they enter into IDLH atmospheres
(Immediately Dangerous to Life and Health). So whether it's a structure fire or
any kind of chemical release, Hazmat(Hazardous Materials), or like was
mentioned, PGV.
So it's very important to have. Our current units, we had three initially, one is
totally out of commission, two are limping along. We are frequently repairing
them and keeping them in service. They were purchased in the early 2000s I
believe. I don't have the exact year, 2004 or 2005 maybe. So it's time that they
do get replaced. Unfortunately we never had a replacement plan, so when we
found out about this you know, we started this endeavor a few years back,
actually when I first started in this position. We found out about the opportunity
with the PGV fund, and you know, it fit the criteria because of the amount of fires
and related incidents in the Puna District.
So that was one of the things, and then like you mentioned, you know, you folks
are gracious enough to provide us the funding to purchase another with County
budget. We just got that unit on island last week. We're waiting to get it all
registered and placed in service. So we're hoping to get it I think it's scheduled
to go registration because, you know, the backlog with DMV (Vehicle and
Licensing Division), on the 20 if I'm not mistaken. And once that's taken care
of, we're going to take it out. That's going to be covering the West Hawaii side
of the island, then we have this unit. It'll be a while because we've got to procure
it yet, but you know, it will cover at least the Puna District. And like you
mentioned, it is mobile, so in the event we need it,we can take it elsewhere.
So you know, it's good to have a mobile unit. It costs more, but it's beneficial to
have, because we can take it to the scene and fill bottles with faster, more
regularly, to maintain the safety for our personnel.
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Aside from the compressor, like you mentioned the 20 SCBA bottles, that's just
to have redundancy and then backup units, because you know, our SCBA units,
the typical tank runs about half and hour to 45 minutes, depending on how
difficult the fire is and how hard the firefighters have to work. So the amount of
bottles we have to refill and the amount of spares we have isn't much because we
got it with a grant. And a lot of those bottles right now with the current bottles
need to go back for hydro testing. Every five years we have to send them back for
retesting.
And just having more redundancy is going to be beneficial so we can have more
staged at the station at least in the Puna District and we can have that area covered
instead of having to pull bottles from Hilo or the Training Division where our
typical spare bottles are located.
So that, and then of course a tow vehicle so we can pull it. We have a reliable
unit, this tow vehicle, to two the trailer around whether it's to PGV or anywhere
in the Puna District.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chief. I have a couple of follow-up questions.
The first is related to the F-450. Is it going to be an off-the-shelf type truck or are
you going to take a look of what the needs of HFD (Hawai`i Fire Department) are
in totality so that we can ensure that this truck can be deployed in the event
firefighters needed elsewhere within Puna. I just want to make sure that it's not
sitting idle and only going to be used to tow out the SOBA, that there are other
uses that firefighters in Station 10, you know, they can use that vehicle to respond
to calls.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Definitely, yeah. We're going to outfit it with
emergency lighting so we can respond to it. A lot of the properties in Puna, and
elsewhere on our island, are so remote. So having offroad or four-wheel drive
vehicles is really beneficial. So it's not only going to be used for that. Primarily
it's for the SCBA compressor, but it's going to be utilized for other uses also.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, great. And then going forward, the maintenance of
the SCBA compressor, the bottles, everything else that's included here, you guys
are going to be able to put into maintenance package within your budget.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Yes.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay,perfect.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: The maintenance doesn't cost much. So it's just
once it gets so old, then you know, you start getting breakdown. And that's where
we're at right now with the old ones.
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MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Sure. So right now the SCBA compressors that we have
on island are in Station 2, Waiakea which is in Keaukaha; and then Station 12,
Keauhou.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Correct, yes.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, and so mid-incident if folks need to refill because
they're not mobile, they're stationary, if you're fighting a fire in Pahoa, you need
to drive all the way to the Waiakea station to refill.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Actually, those are mobile units.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Those are mobile units, okay.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: The ones we have are mobile units.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay,perfect. But they are clearly antiquated, yeah, from
the 2000s.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Correct, yes.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Alright. Thank you so much for your patience and for
being here. I really appreciate it. Chief is here to answer any questions, as is our
Finance Director if anybody has questions about the fund. Just looking for
everyone's favorable support of this resolution. Thank you. Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Ms. Lee Loy, go ahead.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you, Chair. Of course, I'll be supporting this. I just had a
question around the F-150 and Ms. Kierkiewicz touched upon it a little bit. But
you mentioned outfitting it, and because we've had other departments come
asking for us to purchase, but there is a long lead time, right? So I was just
wondering what the timing is about purchase and actually getting this into the
department so it can be utilized.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: You know right now because it's so volatile, the
market, we never know. I mean, we're starting to spec out another one, so I
reached out to a local vendor here to see what the timeline is, and we never got to
discuss it yet, but yeah, I'm not sure what it is exactly. Sorry, but we're hoping to
get something. But even if we did get the compressor, which even that will
probably be delayed with the manufacturing, you know, how everything's being
pushed back. Hopefully with the civilization of COVID now, things will speed
up.
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But yeah, Pahoa does have a current pick-up truck that they have that it's
primarily for our incident response trailer that we have assigned there. So when
this new one comes in, we're going to reassign that vehicle probably. But they
have one. So in the event we get the trailer without the truck, we can tow the unit
right now.
MS. LEE LOY: Okay, those contingency are always great. Yeah, and thank you
for elevating that, because I'm seeing a pattern here, right. We have so many
things that we want to purchase, we put funding towards it, we contract to get it,
but it's months before it actually gets realized into the equipment. So I'm just
being really mindful of that. Thank you for being here. Chair, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Ms. Lee Loy. Anyone else?
Okay, seeing none, I have a question. This actually specifically says an F-450.
So do we have to leave that open so it can be any truck comparable to that or are
we specifying a Ford.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: No, it's 450 or similar. So it's any manufacturer that
can meet the spec. We built the spec to meet the GPW that is required to tow the
weight of the compressor. So we just identified in there the 450 because we just
used that as a baseline. Most of our bids that are won are actually Fords, but it's
open to any manufacturer.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: That's good. I drive a Dodge, that's why.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: It's open. We're very mindful of that. We don't
want to break the rules, for sure.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I've got to ask, because I do towing, what
is theI mean, how big is this SCBA unit?
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Oh gosh. I don't have the weight of the trailer itself
off the top of my head, but I just went off of the recommendations from our
mechanic shop. And the weight of our current Mako units, which is the brand
name of our compressors now, those things are fairly heavy. You know, there's
an electrical motor, there's a diesel engine that—both, because they can run off of
sure line power, electrical power, three phase, and the diesel, when we take it
mobile. So it's a pretty heavy unit. Plus the compressor unit and then the tanks to
fill, the (inaudible) tanks that are located in the trailer unit, and then the steel
frame. So it's a fairly heavy unit, and it's a tandem-axle unit. I don't have the
total weight but that was the recommendations from our mechanic shop, so that's
what we went with.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. I'm just checking. The reason I'm
asking, I mean I've towed mini-excavators, I've towed skid skiers, so if I can tow
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those on a trailer, I'm pretty sureI mean I think a smaller vehicle could do you
guys just as similar and good as an F-450.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: We currently have 350s, in most of our vehicles, and
they're proving not to be too reliable on the back end. Our shop recommended a
450 which is more durable, and we don't have to tax the suspension or the power
train as much. So that was based off of their recommendation basically.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And we do go out to bid though. And put
out to all of the vendors? It doesn't have to be Ford, then?
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: No, it doesn't.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I'm a little hesitant on the truck. If it's
needed for Puna, okay. If you already have aI mean, I'm questioning because
you already have a vehicle that could be used, albeit it may be old, but it's
something you're actually going to send it somewhere else, and it will be service,
so still usable. But I like what you're doing Ashley and we're getting stuff for
Puna. And I'll give you that.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Yeah, and that other stuff is going to be reassigned
once the new one comes in, so it's not going to be two pick-up trucks right there.
So we're going to continue to use it. A lot of our vehicles were purchased back in
the early 2000s, so even those, I don't want to go offtrack, but those trucks also
need replacement. So we'll get there when we get there.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Thank you, sir. Appreciate it. And
thank you for being here today.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Not a problem.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So we have a motion on the floor to
forward Resolution 328-22 to Council with a favorable recommendation. All in
favor?
Vote on Res. 328-22: The motion to recommend adoption of Res. 328-22
(Approved) was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
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CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Clerk, can we do Communication 57.6,
please?
Comm. 57.6: REPORT OF DONATIONS RECEIVED FROM THE DANIEL R. SAYRE
MEMORIAL FOUNDATION ON JANUARY 21, 2022
From Finance Director Deanna Sako, dated February 17, 2022, transmitting the
above report pursuant to Resolution 468-20.
Motion to Close File: Mr. Inaba moved to close file on Comm. 57.6.
Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Since we have you here Assistance Chief,
go ahead.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: Okay, yeah. This is just one item that was a recent
brush truck donation through the Sayre Foundation. We just received it earlier
this year, I think some time in January. But it'll be assigned to the Waiki`i Ranch
Volunteer Company 9 Alpha. They just had the blessing I think this weekend. I
wasn't able to go. But yeah, so we just had the blessing. We're going to also be
registering that vehicle soon so it can be placed in service. It hasn't been placed
in service because of the registration and installing our radio.
But awesome looking truck. It's a Navistar International-based chasse, with a
slip-in pump. So it's not a Ford. But it was donated. We accepted graciously
like every other donation that we receive from the Sayre Foundation. It's just
amazing what they do for us, and the donors out there who do donate through the
Sayre Foundation. We can't express our gratitude enough.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you very much, Mr. Okinaka.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: No problem.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Council Members, discussion? Ms. Lee
Loy, go ahead.
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, of course, thank you to the Sayres. I actually had the
honor of going over, and it's really actually kind of cute to listen to AC (Assistant
Chief), kind of fan boy, over these pieces of equipment. Because everybody who
was at that dedication was just oohing and awing over these beautiful pieces of
equipment. You know, Mr. Richards was unable to make it but was scheduled,
and he knows a lot about the need for Waiki`i and the remoteness. And these are
just amazing pieces of equipment. And really, thank you not only to the Sayre
Foundation, but our philanthropic partner who also helped bring it to the residents
of Waiki`i. So thank you to the Sayres, and thank you, AC for being here.
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MR. RICHARDS: I'll just follow up with a big shout out to the Sayre Foundation
because they have stood up and supported our Fire Department. And for
District 9, that's the area we're going to range fires. And the importance of quick
response cannot be overstated. Quick question. Why are they red and not yellow
like all the rest? Do you know?
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: No, it was purchased by the donor and donated to us,
so we're not
MR. RICHARDS: Good to go.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: But what works out well for that, and we discussed it
with the Chiefs, is that the two red units the brush truck is actually for 9 Alpha
Waiki`i; the tanker what was up there is actually 9 Bravo Kanehoa. So it's also
nice to see that we finally are starting to outfit our volunteer companies with
brand new apparatus, which they never go to see much. So that's an also amazing
thing, because they also work very hard, especially for the wildland fires out in
those districts.
MR. RICHARDS: Yeah, and also a comment was made that now they can show
up to the fire at 50 miles an hour not 25 miles an hour.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: And shining.
MR. RICHARDS: And shining. And that was tongue and cheek, but to the point,
they're using old military equipment, but they showed up and they got it. And if
it wasn't for our volunteers supporting our regular rank and fileI mean, the need
cannot be overstated. Sue Lee Loy had a comment about the color.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Richards. Ms. Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, to respond to Mr. Richards. It actually was just purchased
right off the storeroom floor by this donor. So there's the saying, "You don't look
a gift horse in the mouth," so we'll take red. But what's also really great is our
Finance Department, Licensing Division was able to get the licenses onto the
vehicles so that they could drive it up, which is always very important.
But yeah, absolutely. And I just want to highlight to the blessing of these vehicles
was done by Danny Akaka and his wife. And it was amazing. So it really is a
wonderful two pieces of equipment that's coming in to help the area residents of
Waiki`i. So thank you, Chair, for letting me share. Aloha, I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Aloha. Okay, so I don't see any further
lights on for this one. But just to say it, it was a 2020 International 5500 BME
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Extreme Truck, approximate cost$235,000. That's not a small give to the
County. So mahalo to the Sayres and thank you for helping us get this done.
ASST. CHIEF OKINAKA: No problem. My pleasure.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, so seeing no further discussion, we
have a motion to close file on 57.6. All in favor?
Vote on Comm. 57.6: The motion to close file on Comm. 57.6 was carried by
Filed the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
Return to Order The Chair directed the Committee to return to the order of business.
of Business:
COMMUNI- The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business,
CATIONS: Communications.
(Note: Items in this category were taken up previously,
out of order.)
Comm. 30.22: REPORT OF FUND TRANSFERS AUTHORIZED: JANUARY 16 —31, 2022
From Controller Kay Oshiro, dated February 3, 2022.
Vote on Comm. 30.22: Mr. Inaba moved to close file on Comm. 30.22.
Filed Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy and carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
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Comm. 32.14: MONTHLY BUDGET STATUS REPORT FOR THE MONTH ENDED
JULY 31, 2021
From Finance Director Deanna Sako, dated February 9, 2022, transmitting the
above report pursuant to Hawaii County Charter Section 6-6.3(h).
Motion to Close File: Mr. Inaba moved to close file on Comm. 32.14.
Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Council Members, discussion? Seeing
none, I do want to appreciate the Finance Department for providing five budget
status reports to us and catching us up to, what is it, November, December?
Okay, beautiful. Thank you for keeping up. Okay, we have a motion on the floor
to close file on Communication 32.14, all in favor.
Vote on Comm. 32.14: The motion to close file on Comm. 32.14 was carried by
(Approved) the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
Comm. 32.15: MONTHLY BUDGET STATUS REPORT FOR THE MONTH ENDED
AUGUST 31, 2021
From Finance Director Deanna Sako, dated February 9, 2022, transmitting the
above report pursuant to Hawaii County Charter Section 6-6.3(h).
Vote on Comm. 32.15: Mr. Inaba moved to close file on Comm. 32.15.
Filed Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy and carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
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Comm. 32.16: MONTHLY BUDGET STATUS REPORT FOR THE MONTH ENDED
SEPTEMBER 30, 2021
From Finance Director Deanna Sako, dated February 11, 2022, transmitting the
above report pursuant to Hawaii County Charter Section 6-6.3(h).
Vote on Comm. 32.16: Mr. Inaba moved to close file on Comm. 32.16.
Filed Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy and carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Inaba, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Richards, and Chair Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder—5.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, David, Kimball,
and Villegas —4.
Excused: None.
Comm. 32.17: MONTHLY BUDGET STATUS REPORT FOR THE MONTH ENDED
OCTOBER 31, 2021
From Finance Director Deanna Sako, dated February 11, 2022, transmitting the
above report pursuant to Hawaii County Charter Section 6-6.3(h).
Vote on Comm. 32.17: Mr. Inaba moved to close file on Comm. 32.17.
Filed Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy and carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members Inaba, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Richards, and Chair Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder—5.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, David, Kimball,
and Villegas —4.
Excused: None.
Comm. 32.18: MONTHLY BUDGET STATUS REPORT FOR THE MONTH ENDED
NOVEMBER 30, 2021
From Finance Director Deanna Sako, dated February 15, 2022, transmitting the
above report pursuant to Hawaii County Charter Section 6-6.3(h).
Motion to Close File: Mr. Inaba moved to close file on Comm. 32.18.
Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Any discussion Council Members?
MR. INABA: Chair?
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CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Mr. Inaba.
MR. INABA: Yeah, thank you. Being that this is our most up-to-date report,
Director Sako, if you could just come and give us an overview. I know we have a
lot before us today, but it's our most recent, so just give us what you think we
need to know.
MS. SAKO: So we actually prepare each month, and the departments are able to
go in even before you guys get the Monthly Budget Status Report, to see where
they're at. So the goldenrod pages are actually the revenue and how we're doing.
So you know, obviously the larges being real property tax and it goes on from
there. But we primarily have two collection cycles.
Then the white pages have all of our budgetary-level tracking so we can see the
adjusted appropriation, any expenditures, as well as incumbrances on the other
remaining balance. So most of them are pretty much on track. We've been
working with the departments that might not be, and recently we've come in to
amend some accounts, appropriating Fund Balance to some of the accounts that
weren't going to make it due to unforeseen expenditures in the current year.
Then our balance sheet for each is actually in the yellow pages at the very back.
So we do review our account balances on a regular basis and work with the
departments to ensure we're going to finish the year within budget.
MR. INABA: Mahalo Director Sako. I don't have any further questions, Chair.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. Just a question
process-wise. Can we close file on all of those at once when we have these given
there's no questions from the Council or concerns from the Council?
MR. BROWN: I would recommend taking one each one separately in a separate
motion.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, and then why is this done through
the Council, Ms. Sako? The budget status reports.
MS. SAKO: I believe it's in the Charter that we'll submit it to the Council. So
it's just a report. That's why it goes to Finance Committee.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair? Thank you,just a quick question for Director. I
don't know if you know, but these are so important to us in our ability to make
sound decisions, especially as it relates to our County's bottom line. We
appreciate catching up. Just really curious to understand what goes into
developing these summaries. Because this is Novembers, we're in March, and I
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know there's so much that's happening in Finance, and I know it's more than just
push a button, report's generated, and sent to the Machine Room. So I'm curious
about what it really takes to build this, and what's needed from all the different
departments to make sure that they're accounts are up to date, so you can run this.
MS. SAKO: So why some of their day-to-day activity is very routine, there's
other things like allocating fuel charges, phone charges, different things, that do
take processing. But primarily we have to close the books from the previous year
so that the balances forward will be correct. So that does take some time. Each
department has to get in their grant balances and different things. Normally we
would have started right after we finished that, like you know, we submitted our
Fund Balance back in October. But with all of the different, CARES Act, ARPA
funding, various FEMA disasters. FEMA has been working with us and HIEMA
(Hawai`i State Emergency Management Agency) to close out many of our older
disasters, that's a lot on the plate of our team, as well as some departments are
missing their accounting staff, so we've been pitching in to help them out as well.
So it's partly the extra entries that have to go into it, and this year, we just had a
lot on our staff's plate.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you for sharing that, Director. Everyone's stretched
really thin. But I just wanted everybody to be aware of, there's so much on our
plates right now. Everybody's pitching in to help, which is why there's a little bit
of lag time. But again, really appreciate these reports being run. Thank you,
Chair. I yield.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Ms. Sako, one question. I think Ms.
Kimball touched on this earlier in her tenure here. But she was kind of like just
concerned about the amount of paper we go through. Do we have to be provided
an actual physical document, or could these be done vial know we have to have
it available to the public, but could we do it via email on a pdf form versus the
hard copy?
MS. SAKO: Could the Council's record system take electronic software?
MR. BROWN: So this could be a bigger conversation. As of right now, our
systems or procedures are having physical boards. I can't speak too much into
some of the plans going forward, but there are things we're looking at, and have
been looking at, in making things more electronic. Being more efficient with our
paper use and things like that. So that is under consideration and being looked at
right now. I think that's what I can share.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: We talk about supply chain disruption, cost
of goods, everything going up and it applies to everything. And I have those on
file back to when I started. It's like a whole drawer.
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MS. SAKO: So we can produce it electronically and we're happy to submit that,
but I think the system just doesn't allow it right now.
MR. BROWN: Yeah, to be a little more clear, the way we have to present the
boards, as required, is in the physical form right now. But that's being looked at.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I actually like it physical form because I
can actually open each page and mark it up and do my thing. It's not so easy on
the computer, but just wondering in the effort of being more efficient to any paper
and blah, blah, blah. Being responsible. Okay, thank you.
MS. LEE LOY: Chair?
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yes, Ms. Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you. Deanna, we're at November. Any estimate as to
when we'll get, like December, January?
MS. SAKO: I know I've signed additional ones, and I think they're on the next
Committee meeting. I know it was December. I can't remember if it was also
January. But it's just about time to close February. So they're getting really close
to being caught up.
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, I guess I'm just thinking ahead. You know, we're going
to get into departmental review, and it would be really nice to have that
side-by-side as we go and get into this first iteration of the budget and then into
the second one.
MS. SAKO: So I think the February one will be the most current you have.
Because it usually takes us 10 business days to close after the end of the month.
So based on the timing of the budget reviews, I don't think we'll have much quite
done yet. But you should have February.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, seeing no further discussion, we
have a motion to close file on Comm. 32.18. All in favor?
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Vote on Comm. 32.18: The motion to close file on Comm. 32.18 was carried
Filed by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
ORDER OF- The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business,
RESOLUTIONS: Order of Resolutions.
(Note: Items in this category were taken up previously, out of order.)
Res. 330-22: AUTHORIZES THE PAYMENT OF FUNDS OF A LATER FISCAL YEAR AND
OF MORE THAN ONE FISCAL YEAR FOR MULTI-YEAR LEASES FOR
THREE WASHERS AND THREE DRYERS FOR THE OFFICE OF HOUSING
AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT
Authorizes the Mayor to enter into a seven-year lease agreement with an estimated
monthly cost of$250 for laundry equipment for the Kulaimano Elderly Housing
proj ect.
Reference: Comm. 646
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Vote on Res. 330-22: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend adoption of Res. 330-22.
(Approved) Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
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Res. 331-22: AUTHORIZES THE OFFICE OF THE MAYOR TO ENTER INTO AN
AGREEMENT WITH THE STATE OF HAWAII, DEPARTMENT OF BUDGET
AND FINANCE
Federally-derived funds of$5 million would be used to assist Hawaii County
households that directly or indirectly experienced financial hardship due to the
COVID-19 pandemic and can demonstrate a risk of experiencing homelessness or
housing instability.
Reference: Comm. 648
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend adoption of Res. 331-22.
Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Council Members, discussion? Mr. Inaba,
go ahead.
MR. INABA: Thank you, Chair. Is anybody still with us from Housing?
Administrator Kunz, thank you for being here. If you could just cover what this is
and how people might go about accessing these funds if they're in need of help?
(Note: At this time, Housing Administrator Susan Kunz came forward to
address the members of the Committee.)
MS. KUNZ: So this is the rent assistance program that we kicked off last year.
I'll just tell you this, it was a slow start to be very honest. I think the challenges
of COVID and all of that challenged the program. But we currently have about
$13.9 million spent and almost 3,600 applications that have come in for the
program. It's moving very well. So these are additional allocations from the
State to continue running this program.
People can apply. We have vendors, six locations or six nonprofits who are
helping us deliver these programs. HOPE Services, Neighborhood Place of Puna,
Hawaii First Federal Credit Union, Habitat for Humanity, the Salvation Army,
and HCEOC (Hawai`i County Economic Opportunity Council). So people can
access this program by contacting any one of these nonprofits or locations for
services.
MR. INABA: Thank you very much, for that overview. And yes, recommend
anybody needing assistance to reach out to those organizations. Thank you,
Chair. I yield.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. Anyone else?
Seeing none, yeah, this is a great program. What is the expiration date for these
funds in this program?
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MS. KUNZ: I think there's a five-year expiration date on it. So it's got some
time.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Oh wow. Okay, so there's not a fear of
losing the funds or having the program have to end. We have this pretty much till
the funds are gone then.
MS. KUNZ: Well there are different pots of money that came in. There might be
a pot of money that might be due for expenditure through the end of this year.
But we're almost through that pot of money. This is a new set of funds coming
in. So we're going to have some time with this new pot coming in.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And this is for rental only, or is this applied
towards people who have mortgages?
MS. KUNZ: This is rental only.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: There was a program for the mortgages,
yeah?
MS. KUNZ: Yes. We do have the Housing Assistance Program that's run
separately from this.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And how's the funding for that?
MS. KUNZ: I don't know what the balance is, but we have a good amount of
funding there. Hawaii County and Kauai County were the pilot for the State, so
the program's doing really well. I'm sorry I don't have any specifics for you. I
can get the information if you would like.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yeah, if you could. Just a quick one. You
know, what we have left in each one. I want to make sure we use the funds, but
also want to make sure the information's (inaudible) to the public. I think for
some people it's just starting to get real, or they're having trouble finding work or
COVID is still affecting their family. It's just kind of a weird—we're kind of in a
weird role right now between being open and looking at some more future
hardship.
MS. KUNZ: Okay, I'll send the program information in to all of the Council
Members.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, thank you very much, Ms. Kunz.
Appreciate it. Council Members seeing no discussion beyond that, we have a
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motion to forward Resolution 331-22 to the Council with a favorable
recommendation. All in favor?
Vote on Res. 331-22: The motion to recommend adoption of Res. 331-22
(Approved) was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
Change Order As directed by the Chair and with no objection from Council Members, the
of Business: following items were taken out of order:
BILLS FOR The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business,
ORDINANCES: Bills for Ordinances.
(Note: Items in this category were taken up previously, out of order.)
Bill 128: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 21-38, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
ENDING JUNE 30, 2022
Decreases the County of Hawaii—Tenant Based Rental Assistance Program
account($2,035,200) and the University Heights Home Reconstruction account
($289,800); and appropriates the funds to the Hale Na Koa O Hanakahi
Independent Senior Housing account($2,325,000).
Reference: Comm. 647
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Vote on Bill 128: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend passage of Bill 128
(Approved) on first reading. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy and carried
by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
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Bill 129: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 21-38, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
ENDING JUNE 30, 2022
Appropriates revenues in the Federal - Emergency Rental Assist Program
COVID-19 (ERA2 PT) account($5 million); and appropriates the same to
the Emergency Rental Assistance Program COVID-19 (ERA2 PT) account
($4.5 million) and the Emergency Rental Assistance Program COVID-19
(ERA2 PT) —Administration account($500,000). Funds would be used to
assist Hawaii County households that directly or indirectly experienced
financial hardship due to the COVID-19 pandemic and can demonstrate a risk
of experiencing homelessness or housing instability.
Reference: Comm. 648
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Vote on Bill 129: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend passage of Bill 129
(Approved) on first reading. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy and carried
by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas —3.
Excused: None.
Bill 130: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 21-38, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
JUNE 30, 2022
Increases revenues in the Office of Housing and Community Development's
Community Development Block Grant(CDBG) Program Income account
($200,000); and appropriates the same to the Ulu Wini Low Income Housing
Wastewater Treatment Plant—Repairs account, bringing the total appropriation
to $350,000.
Reference: Comm. 649
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend passage of Bill 130
on first reading. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Council Members, discussion? Mr. Inaba,
go ahead.
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MR. INABA: Thank you, Chair. Administrator Kunz, I was missing for part of
the discussion earlier for the bond, and I believe however there was a portion
related to the Ulu Wini Wastewater Treatment Plant. How does this item before
us right now work with or interact with those funds in terms of that project there?
MS. KUNZ: It is to support the same project, so these monies here are program
income from the CDBG program that we want to put towards the wastewater
treatment plant. A previous allocation of CDBG funds, after going out to bid, and
design and bidding out this process, found that there was insufficient funds to
carry out the program. So we are moving monies around to make sure that we
can finish this project.
MR. INABA: Okay, and then I know based on theI came in late to the
discussion and we might be short or need more funding. Is this one of the items
with putting together these two funds that you think you'll be able to get job
accomplished?
MS. KUNZ: Yes, definitely.
MR. INABA: Okay. Thank you so much. Chair, that's it.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. Ms. Kunz, while
we've got you, for the wastewater treatment for the Ulu Wini project, is like other
projects we've discussed, like a full treatment wastewater plant that we have at
this location?
MS. KUNZ: Is it a full-treatment processing plant, is that what you're asking?
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yeah, we've had different bills come up
talking about the larger developers and they have a full wastewater treatment
facility. Is that what we're talking about in this?
MS. KUNZ: That's what we're talking about. And this system only serves these
96 units at Ulu Wini.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, I've got kind of a weird question.
Do we use any of that—are we reclaiming any of that water and using it for
irrigation on our own properties?
MS. KUNZ: No we're not. Not at this time.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, are we using potable water to do
irrigation?
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MS. KUNZ: I don't believe there's any irrigation system at the site.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, I'm just thinking about what we're
asking others to do and what we do ourselves.
MS. KUNZ: Making sure that the County's doing the same.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Can we move in that—? Well, would you
look into and see what's happening at this site and see if there's the possibility
that we could do, if there is irrigation needed if we could use reclaimed water for
that? You know, if there's a use for that water or if we could do that if this
funding would allow for us to get to that level of sustainability.
MS. KUNZ: Okay, will do.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Thank you. Appreciate it. Seeing
no further discussion, we have a motion on the floor to forward Bill 130 to
Council with a favorable recommendation. All in favor?
Vote on Bill 130: The motion to recommend passage of Bill 130 on
(Approved) first reading was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder–6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas –3.
Excused: None.
Return to Order The Chair directed the Committee to return to the order of business.
of Business:
Res. 334-22: COMMITS TO FUNDING THE COST ITEMS AGREED UPON BY THE
EMPLOYERS AND THE UNITED PUBLIC WORKERS UNIT O1 AND
EMPLOYEES EXCLUDED FROM BARGAINING UNIT O1 FOR THE
CONTRACT PERIOD JULY 1, 2021 THROUGH JUNE 30, 2025
The estimated costs over the four years of the new contract resulting from
across-the-board increases and one-time bonuses would be $13,915,027.
Reference: Comm. 652
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend adoption of Res. 334-22.
Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
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CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Council Members, discussion? We do
have Ms. Sako here to—it might be better if you just want to kind of start us off
here, Ms. Sako.
MS. SAKO: Sure. I think this is the first one. All of the bargaining unit
contracts expired on June 30, 2021, and five of the eight reached agreement just
for one year with reopeners. Also basically all eight bargaining are going through
some form of negotiation or arbitration. So this is the first one to come before
you.
So we did—and when I say "we," it's the larger employer group. We have to
negotiate Statewide, all the counties and the State. So they were able to reach
agreement with UPW and it was ratified by their members, and so we are given
10 calendar days to submit this to Council. So what you have before you is the
costing and that's on the attachment. That shows that over the entire contract
period, so it is for four years. And this one actually did go back and actually
change Fiscal Year 2022, which is the fiscal year we're in right now and we were
not anticipating that. But the cost over the four years is $13.7 million with the
fringe benefits.
So the cost for the current year is $625,600, which we did not budget for because
we thought everyone had agreed to zero, that was our misunderstanding. So we
have forwarded a bill to amend the budget to Council, and we tried to hit last
week Friday's deadline, hoping that this would be approved. So right now we
don't have the money, but we did submit a budget amendment to take care of it.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Council Members, discussion? Yeah, this
is kind of the unnecessary cost of government. I mean not unnecessary but
unavoidable cost of government. Mr. Richards, go ahead.
MR. RICHARDS: I think Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder raised the point. This is
contractual and there's not a lot of discussion to have on this, because it's
contractual by the State. So I think the public should realize that it's not that we
are for or against it, it's just, it is.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Mr. Richards. I have one
question for you, Ms. Sako. I was having this discussion with someone, and I
didn't know where the correct answer would be and I'm hoping that you do. If
the State were to actually raise the minimum wage, does that affect union
agreementsI'm sorry not union, bargaining unit agreements and would it affect
retroactively. Like if we had a raise this year, would it affect our base rate of
pay?
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MS. SAKO: Yeah, so we would go back and compare all of the collective
bargaining unit agreements against the minimum wage. Right now, the current
minimum wage, all of them are above. But if it was to be amended, we probably
would have to go back and renegotiate with the union to make the base pay for
every category of work at least minimum wage.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Wow, so that decision by the State has a
huge bearing on both the public, I mean everyone wants a raise, correct? But it
also is going to have a huge impact on the budget and for any of our
municipalities.
MS. SAKO: Yes.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Wow, okay. Thank you for that. Maybe
that's good for us to understand, and I'm sure the State understands that too, but
it's good for us to feel that out when we look at how it would affect government.
MS. SAKO: I think they have been trying to amend some of the lower pay
categories of work over the years, and they've been trying to raise those lower
levels and drop off the lower steps so that hopefully by the time everything
passes, and everything's implemented we would be close. But I can't guarantee
we're going to be above minimum at that time.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yeah, there's actually something coming
forward regarding that. And that's good. I mean the cost of living goes up, we
have to adjust.
MS. SAKO: Right, right.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: But on the backend if they look at a huge
step in minimum wages, that has a huge bearing on us in the County.
MS. SAKO: Correct.
CHR KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, thank you. Okay, that's all I have.
Okay, seeing no further discussion, thank you, Ms. Sako, for sticking around
today and for balancing the schedule with us. We have a motion on the floor to
forward Resolution 334 to Council with a favorable recommendation. All in
favor?
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Vote on Res. 334-22: The motion to recommend adoption of Res. 334-22 was
(Approved) carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas—3.
Excused: None.
CHR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I think we got
everything on our list today?
MR. BROWN: I believe that we are at the end of the agenda, Chair.
CHR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: This is an exciting moment for all of us.
ADJOURN- There being no further business, at 4:52 p.m., Mr. Inaba moved to adjourn
MENT: the meeting. Seconded by Ms. Kierkiewicz and carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Committee Members David, Inaba,
Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy, Richards, and
Chair Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder—6.
Noes: None.
Absent: Committee Members Chung, Kimball, and
Villegas—3.
Excused: None.
CHR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: This meeting is pau.
Approved:
Mr. Matt Kaneali`i- (leinfel e er, Chair (Date)
Finance Committee
MK/na
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