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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN GOEAC 2023/06/20 (2022-2024) Committee on Governmental Operations and External Affairs 11th Session West Hawaii Civic.Center 74-5044 Ane Keohokalole Highway, Building A Kailua-Kona, Hawai`i June 20, 2023 CALL TO The regular meeting of the Committee on Governmental Operations and ORDER: External Affairs was called to order at 10:03 a.m., in the Council Chambers, Kailua-Kona, by Ms. Cindy Evans, Chair. ROLL CALL: Present: Ms. Cindy Evans, Chair Ms. Susan L. K. Lee Loy, Vice Chair (via videoconference from Hilo) Ms. Michelle M. Galimba, Member Mr. Holeka Goro Inaba, Member Ms. Jenn Kagiwada, Member Ms. Ashley L. Kierkiewicz, Member Ms. Heather L. Kimball, Member(via yideoconference from Hilo) Ms. Rebecca Villegas, Member Absent& Excused: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Member STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, FROM THE Statements from the Public on Agenda Items. PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: (There were none.) COMMUNICATIONS Comm. 317: NOMINATION OF AELANI KEOLANUI TO THE YOUTH COMMISSION From Council Member Jennifer Kagiwada, dated May 26, 2023. Motion to Close File: Ms. Kagiwada moved to close file on Comm. 317. Seconded by Ms. Villegas. CHR. EVANS: Member Kagiwada. MS. KAGIWADA: Yes. Relley, do we have Aelani on zoom? GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 MR. ARACELEY: Sony, Council Member I just checked, and we do not at this time. Motion to Table: Ms. Kagiwada moved to table Comm. 317 until the nominee arrives. Seconded by Mr. Inaba and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Galimba, Inaba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Evans— 8. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Member Kaneali`i—Kleinfelder— 1. Excused: None. Comm. 318: NOMINATION OF KEITH UNGER TO THE WATER BOARD From Mayor Mitchell D. Roth, dated June 1, 2023, requesting the Council's review and confirmation. Requires Council Confirmation by: July 15, 2023 (Section 13-4(k) Hawai`i County Charter) Vote on Comm. 318: Ms. Galimba moved to recommend confirmation of the (Approved) nomination of Mr. Keith Unger to the Water Board. Seconded by Ms. Kierkiewicz and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Galimba, Inaba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Evans— 8. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Member Kaneali i—Kleinfelder— 1. Excused: None. Executive Assistant to the Mayor Pomaika`i Bartolome came forward and provided a brief narrative of the nominee's background and experience. Committee Members spoke in favor of the appointment. Page 2 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 Comm. 319: NOMINATION OF SAMUEL PLUNKETT, JR. TO THE PUBLIC ACCESS, OPEN SPACE, AND NATURAL PRESERVATION COMMISSION From Mayor Mitchell D. Roth, dated June 1, 2023, requesting the Council's review and confirmation. Requires Council Confirmation by: July 15, 2023 (Section 13-4(k) Hawai`i County Charter) Vote on Comm. 319: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend confirmation of the (Approved) nomination of Mr. Samuel Plunkett Jr. to the Public Access, Open Space, and Natural Preservation Commission. Seconded by Ms. Kierkiewicz and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Galimba, Inaba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Evans—8. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Member Kaneali`i—Kleinfelder— 1. Excused: None. Executive Assistant to the Mayor Pomaika`i Bartolome came forward and provided a brief narrative of the nominee's background and experience. Committee Members spoke in favor of the appointment. CHR. EVANS: So my understanding is that we have Aelani Keolanui for the Youth Commission she is present by zoom, is that correct? Okay. Motion to Remove Ms. Kagiwada moved to remove Comm. 317 from the from Table: table. Seconded by Mr. Inaba and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Galimba, Inaba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Evans— 8. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Member Kaneali`i—Kleinfelder— 1. Excused: None. Page 3 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 Vote on Comm. 317: The motion to close file on Comm. 317 was (Filed) carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Galimba, Inaba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Evans— 8. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Member Kaneali`i—Kleinfelder— 1. Excused: None. Comm. 327: NOMINATION OF JEREMY BUTTERFIELD TO THE FIRE BOARD OF APPEALS From Mayor Mitchell D. Roth, dated June 1, 2023, requesting the Council's review and confirmation. Requires Council Confirmation by: July 15, 2023 (Section 13-4(k) Hawai`i County Charter) Vote on Comm. 327: Mr. Inaba moved to recommend confirmation of the (Approved) nomination of Mr. Jeremy Butterfield to the Fire Board of Appeals. Second by Ms. Kagiwada and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Galimba, Inaba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Evans— 8. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Member Kaneali`i—Kleinfelder— 1. Excused: None. Executive Assistant to the Mayor Pomaika`i Bartolome came forward and provided a brief narrative of the nominee's background and experience. Committee Members spoke in favor of the appointment. CHR. EVANS: Council Members, I'm going to recommend a five minutes break. We will reconvene at 11:13, thank you. We're in recess. Recess: At 11:08 a.m., the Chair called for a recess. Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 11:13 a.m. Page 4 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 CHR. EVANS: Thank you everyone. We're reconvening the Governmental Operations and External Affairs Committee. It is 11:13 on June 20, 2023, and I am going to be turning over the Chair to Member Inaba. Clerk, please note. Relinquish Chair: At this time, the Chair relinquished the chair to Mr. Inaba. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Let the record reflect that I've assumed the chair at 11:12 a.m. And I believe we can read in Bill 49 MR. HENRICKS: Sure just before we do so, I just want to note that per the Rules, typically Ms. Lee Loy would assume the chair at this time, though she's participating remotely, so Mr. Inaba has graciously agreed to perform this duty. And prior to reading this in, I would note that we do have a testifier here in the Kona Chambers for Bill 49. Ms. Pellett if you could please come forward and provide your testimony at this point in time. You'll have three minutes when you start. STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, FROM THE Statements from the Public on Agenda Items. PUBLIC ON BILL 49 The following individual registered to speak and came forward when called (COMM. 305): by the Chair: Carolyn Pellett: Comment. Bill 49: INITIATES AN AMENDMENT TO ARTICLE III, SECTION 3-4 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CHARTER(2022 EDITION), RELATING TO VACANCY IN OFFICE Proposes reducing the time allotted for the County Council to appoint a successor to a vacant County Council district seat, establishing restrictions on official candidates being appointed to a vacant County Council district seat, and that a person who has been duly elected to serve the upcoming Council term shall automatically fill a vacancy that occurs for that County Council district seat. Reference: Comm. 305 Intr. by: Ms. Evans Postponed: June 6, 2023 (Note: There is a motion by Ms. Evans, seconded by Mr. Inaba to recommend passage of Bill 49 on first reading.) and Comm. 305.1: From Council Member Cindy Evans, dated May 24, 2023, transmitting a proposed amendment to Bill 49. Page 5 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 (Note: Comm. 305.3, from County Clerk Henricks dated June16, 2023, transmitting a cost estimate to conduct a special election to fill a vacancy within the Hawai`i County Council, was circulated.) (Note: Comms. 305.4 and 305.5, from Council Member Evans dated June 19, 2023, transmitting proposed amendments to Bill 49, were circulated) ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Member Evans if you would like to start us off, Bill 49. MS. EVANS: I would like to make a motion to replace Bill 49 with the contents of Communication 305.5. Motion to Amend: Ms. Evans moved to amend Bill 49 with the contents of Comm. 305.5. Seconded by Ms. Kierkiewicz. ACTING CHR. INABA: Mahalo, Mr. Clerk. Council Member Evans. MS. EVANS: Thank you, Members and thank you, to the public. This amended version, it really gets into the details of how to run a special election. When we had the conversation the last time we met, there was this discussion about should we have special election or not. Currently in our Charter Amendment if there's a vacancy it does not allow for special election. So what I did is I looked at Kauai, Oahu, and Maui to see how they fill vacancies. We looked at vacancies for Prosecuting Attorney, we looked at vacancies for Mayor's, and we kind of kicked it around what might be something that we would like in our county. There will be another communication coming from our Clerk later, that will indicate to you what the cost is that we would incur as taxpayers if we ran a special election. So that information about it is a cost what are we proposing in this amendment is that if the unexpired term is more than eighteen months. So what that would mean, is if someone got elected to the Council and within the first six months, they either died, they had something happen where they needed toquit, whatever it is that created their vacancy, the belief beingthat it's less than Y six months, and if this kicked in the way it's written and the wayyou have to follow Hawai`i Revised Statute State Law, is that the election itself best case scenario it would happen within probably 40 to 45 days of the vacancy that occurs. So given that by the idea being that if someone got elected in a special election, they would probably be serving the unexpired term, which would probably be about 13 or 14 months they would be serving, and they would be elected by the public if it went by special election. Again, currently we do not have that option. So if someone leaves office in the first six months it would be by the Council taking action to appoint a person. And if the Council cannot reach an agreement Page 6 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 within x amount of days, that appointment will be done by the Council Chair. And so what we're trying to do is recommend amendments to our Charter amendment and bring it to what I believe is more current. We haven't touched this Charter Amendment on vacancies since around 1980. So, I believe based on the experience that I had with a former Councilman leaving office, I think it brought to light this would be a good time to revisit and update. So with that Chair, I open it for questions or discussion. Thank you. (Note: At this time, County Clerk Jon Henricks came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. HENRICKS: Thank you, Chair Inaba. Before we proceed, can I just interject real quick? Council Member Evans referenced the communication that will be coming forward, actually it should be in your pinkie folder, Communication 305.3. I'd like to thank our Elections Program Administrator for putting together an itemization of estimated cost for what it would take to conduct a Special Election for a vacant Council seat. I would note that at the previous meeting of this committee, I recall indicating that I don't think cost would be that much of a factor. I would like to rescind that comment, because I think that the total of$350,000 is a significant cost. I don't want the public to think that in any way I would find $350,000 of taxpayer funds to be not a substantial sum. I just wanted to bring that to everyone's attention. And thank Ms. Saiki for taking the time to research this, talk to other counties that have conducted special elections and also with the State of what it would take. I just wanted to note to you that a special election would require all of the elements of a normal election, there wouldn't be a regular election. I should say, there wouldn't be any substitutions or any reduction of services. We would have voter service center, we would have drop boxes, all the other elements that people have become accustomed to over the last four elections. For elections by mail would be part of a special elections, and that is reflected in the back part of page 305.3 with an itemization of estimated costs. And Ms. Saiki we were talking about, this she relayed to me that she feels this is a conservative estimate rather than an estimate that would essentially be on the money so to speak or maybe below or higher than we would anticipate. I want to add should this pass and then, you know, we would, and should the Charter amendment pass but through the voters, we would be looking at budgeting for this every other fiscal year, not knowing whether or not that a vacancy would occur. And certainly if it did, if this became a cost factor this is not money that we would be able to locate from other sources. So we would need to fund for this every other fiscal year, given the time table that's provided currently in this amendment. If there are any questions about this communication, I'll be happy to try to answer and if not, if I'm unable to, Ms. Saiki is in the Hilo Chambers. Thank you for that opportunity. Page 7 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Mr. Clerk. And thank you to our Election's folks. Opening it up to discussion we're on the amendment in Communication 305.5. MS. EVANS: Chair? I just wanted to follow-up to his statement. ACTING CHR. INABA: Go ahead, Council Member Evans. MS. EVANS: Thank you. We are bound by the Hawai`i Revised Statute when we run a special election. And so, what's really driving part of it is we have to mail ballots overseas to people that are in the military. So, that timeframe that adds on to the whole process of calling and preparing for this special election, that is why I put in within the first six months. Because by the time you jump through all the hoops, you would have the person fill in vacancy probably only serving about 12- or 13-months max. So I think that's why I made it in the first six months, because of the cost associated and the timing. The other thing is I do have another communication that has all the other language minus the special election that if we vote this down, I have another communication that we can address the other things we talked about, but they mirror each other. Two communications; one has the special election in it the other one does not. Thank you, Chair. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Opening it up to discussion. MS. KIMBALL: Chair Inaba. ACTING CHR. INABA: Yes, Council Chair Kimball. MS. KIMBALL:_ Thank you, very much. And thank you, Council Member Evans for being responsive to the comments that we had in our discussion last time about this piece of legislation, and Mr. Clerk, for putting together the estimate along with our Elections Administrator, appreciate both of you as well. Wanted to just quickly follow-up on that last comment made by Council Member Evans with respect to the timing. What is your estimate, either Mr. Clerk, or Elections Administrator, as to the turnaround time it would take from the initial request for s special election to when you could get ballots? I'm assuming that it is around the 120-day mark, based on that being the content of the amendment right now. But can you perhaps expand on that, is that a conservative estimate, do you feel it could it be done in 90 days? If either of you could respond to that. MR. HENRICKS: I'll start and then I'll ask Ms. Saiki to interject or either fill in blanks or corrections when I'm completed. Could it be done quicker? Perhaps. When you look at this provision, essentially because of the timeframe if this vacancy were to happen within this first six months of the Council term, we Page 8 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 would essentially be coming off of a general election, and then immediately preparing for another election which again is a full election from our eyes. Less candidates obviously and only one office but a full election. I'll speak for Cori and say we're like in the 120 days if this is going to happen, as opposed to the 90. But if it was 90, then we would have to find a way to get it done. There's many, many components to this. A candidate filing period, there's opportunities for candidates to withdraw, there's opportunities for people to challenge a person's candidacy. So all of those things that are part of a regular election that you are generally aware of as candidates, would all be in place. So, the four-month window from the point of time where we declare through a proclamation that a special election would occur, to the point and time where somebody is declared the winner of that election is reasonable. And we would ensure that it gets done. I would note too that there are components to this that somethings would be more challenging than others. Essentially finding a place to count the ballots, you know, unlike Maui, and Kauai, and City and County of Honolulu they have dedicated places. We're tasked with finding a location each election and that could be proved to be problematic as we wouldn't maintain the place that we use for the general election not anticipating a special election. So, I think that's something that would be challenging and require time. So that would be a concern I would have if it was reduced to 90 days. It's things of that nature,just making sure that if this should occur, unfortunately there is a vacancy so soon after the Council term starts, we would immediately start to look at when the proclamation would be made pursuant to the Charter, and then kind of back tracking with a timeframe based upon the time we're allotted. And I believe that would be one our first things that we would do and say okay, this is real,.we need to find a place where we feel comfortable, has enough sufficient square footage, security, community located to be able to deliver the voted ballots that are deemed to be eligible and be able to then assemble a team additionally, and observers and watchers that are critical to this to count those ballots. So it is a significant event requiring a lot of planning and preparation and coordination. So yeah, that's my long way of saying 120 days definitely is more appealing than 90. MS. KIMBALL: Thank you, Mr. Clerk. And we have the Elections Administrator coming up. (Note: At this time, Elections Program Administrator Cori Saiki came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MS. SAIKI: Hi, Cork Saiki, Elections Program Administrator. I agree with everything Jon has said. But I just wanted to add one more thing in, and it would deal with the voting system. You know, right now our contract is the State, you know, does the contract for all the counties. If we had to conduct a special election for our County, it's 100 percent the counties cost, and we would need to Page 9 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 do all the procurement for all of that; getting the voting system, and I'm not sure if we have to go out for bids. I really don't know what the process would be at that point, so that would be a concern for me. I know the other counties have done it; I know there's probably a way to do it. But as of right now I don't know how we would do that; we would need to look into that. And to get it done within that 120 days. MS. KIMBALL: Okay, thank you. Yeah, I'd be curious to know if the other counties perhaps have like an existing contract, like it's triggered if their— perhaps they've negotiated it in advance even before there's known to be a requirement for a special election. I believe our Deputy Clerk has a comment to make on that. (Note: At this time, Deputy County Clerk Aaron Brown came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. BROWN: Yeah, if you don't mind, Madam Chair. I think I can speak a little bit to that with elections being, you know, especially a special election being very unique. Then with elections now moving to all mail, because there's a lot of moving parts, I do not believe any of the counties have like a standing contract with any vendor, because they wouldn't know a lot of the parameters that would have to be specified in the procurement. To follow up on what our Elections Administrator said, I believe, and we would work closelywith theprocurement office with Finance. But we would very likely have to go out and bid, create the specs for the bid, and go out to bid. And that's a separate process that does take some time to make sure we follow the procurement laws of the State. MS. KIMBALL: Thank you, Deputy Clerk. So to the maker of this amendment and the bill itself, Council Member Evans, have you had any initial conversations with Director Sako at Finance about the ability for us to budget for this in the legislative budget going forward? MS. EVANS: No, I have not asked her, like if we passed it if something happen. Well we're pass six months anyway. But if we passed it, it would really come into effect the next election cycle. But I will say this, that Kauai had to kick in their special election for the Office of the Prosecuting Attorney, and they didn't have a time limit on it. And so there was only like eight months remaining on the Prosecuting Attorney's term, because of their Charter they had no choice, they had to run the special election, the public was so upset that they removed it from the Charter this last November. So the timing of a special election and the cost really is a factor that whatever we do, we'd have to show the public that there's nexus between being very democratic and giving the public the right to pick who's going to represent them versus what is the cost to run a special election with what little remaining or Page 10 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 maybe a lot of remaining time left. And that's why it's going to be really important, I think, that we have this discussion and make this informed decision which is, this is going to be costly and timely to run a special election. MS. KIMBALL: Yeah, thank you, Council Member Evans. And I like the fact that because this is a Charter amendment, ultimately the voters will have the opportunity to weigh in on that question. Personally, I would think all the counties are different in terms on how the representation is set up. You know, we're by district representation and for me that makes the argument stronger to have a special election, because it's certain voters that are representing a certain seat, rather than like Kauai's countywide arrangement. So I'm going to be supporting this amendment today, as I think it is the better approach and I like the other corrections that you have made. The one comment I would make is I would actually be willing to consider this for a shorter duration of time remaining, as much as maybe 15 to 13 months, even with a 120-day turnaround time until the election, because I think there would still be enough time left on the term for it to be meaningful to have the special election. I do think this is still a rare scenario where that would actually be triggered, but I would be willing to consider a shorter duration for the remainder of the term. There are a couple of minor editorials changes I would make with the inclusion of the clause, qualifications required by Section 3-3 in various parts of this. I think there just needs to be a couple of commas or some things moved around, so that it flows and reads a little better. I appreciate the addition of that language, but just for the next iteration, I think just for clarity, there might be some additional punctuation needed. Thank you, Chair. I yield. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Bringing it back here to Kona, Council Member Kagiwada. MS. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Chair. And thank you to the maker for listening to what we had to say. I'm going to just ask the Clerk once again to explain the funding, and what happens if we budget for a special election, and we don't use that funding. Where does that funding go? MR. HENRICKS: Right. So typically, anything of that nature would go back into the fund balance. MS. KAGIWADA: So it's just going back into the fund balance even if, you say you passed that six months or whatever barrier at that point? Whatever we end up putting it once it goes past that term, it could be added back in the fund balance? MR. HENRICKS: Well if it's not encumbered prior to the fiscal year expiring, it would go into the fund balance. I hope Deanna is not ringing her hands right now listening to my explanations on these things. And as you stated, there would Page 11 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 become a point and time where it would be funds that could not be used, pursuant to the Charter. There'd be a certain portion of time in the fiscal year it would be moot. So there's other things that could possibly be done, it could be transferred out for another cause or purpose within the branch or even within another department, if it's needed. Although generally when you budget for these types of very specific events or items and it's not used for that, then it would revert or just back to the fund balance. And it wouldn't be each fiscal year, it would only be those fiscal years where there's a potential for this to occur. MS. KAGIWADA: Right, so every other year. MR. HENRICKS: It depends on the timeframe, if it overlaps two fiscal.years, then we would need to consider that. But if that timeframe of when it could occur because of the vacancy occurs within that window, then we might only have to budget this amount in that particular fiscal year in case it's needed. MS. KAGIWADA: Okay. So, it almost seems like it's just a chunk of money that would sit there unusable for anything else. MR. HENRICKS: I would think that would turn out to be a good result by and large because a vacancythat earlyin the term is certainly not ideal and probably g not what the voters want, nor what the candidate that won the office would have wanted, so. MS. KAGIWADA: Yeah, certainly. I'm trying to understand financially for the County what that means, it means putting aside this chunk of money that we're not able to use for other things. MR. HENRICKS: Right. I think it would be irresponsible to not include it in the proper budget with the anticipation that either it won't occur because it's as Ms. Kimball said, it's hopefully, you know, knock on wood if there's any around here unlikely. And then, it would also be irresponsible to not budget for it, and should it occur to try to find the money. It's a significant sum of money, it's not something that I believe we would have an easy time in locating those funds in order to do what we need to do. MS. KAGIWADA: Okay, thank you. I have a better understanding of that. So with that I just would say that I also think a slightly longer maybe not as long as Council Member Kimball said, but I was thinking more like if there's, you know, if we do eight months and then it takes four months for the special election at least then there's another year left in the term. Something like that. Eight or nine months in that range. But I do think letting the public elect their own representative is really important. And hopefully you never have to do this, but good discussion, and thank you for bringing this forward. Page 12 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Kagiwada. Heading over to Hilo, Council Member Lee Loy. MS. LEE LOY: Thank you, Mr. Inaba. I'm not sure if this question is for our Clerk or for Corporation Counsel. I'm trying to walk through the mechanics and maybe even our Elections Administrator can help us. When a candidate—when an election occurs and we all listen to the results, there actually is a window to certify those election results. And I also believe an opportunity for a protest, is that correct? MR. HENRICKS: I'll do my best to answer your relatively simple question, and then Ms. Saiki will either add in or correct. There is no difference in this election. There would be a period of time to certify the election and also a challenge period, which I'm not sure if that factors into the 120 days total that we would need to include on the backend after the County would declare a winner. And then we would need to factor in some of that 120 days for the purpose of certifying the election and also the challenge period. We would need to look into whether or not that's outside of the 120 days or would be within the 120 days. MS. LEE LOY: Thank you for that, Jon. I'm trying to ask two questions here because the vacancy occurs, right. And then in a particular most recent case were looking at, is when a Council Member was elected to the Senate Office. I'm just concerned because my understanding is there is a window of a challenge and a time for when both election results or the entire election results would have to be certified. And my concern is some of the mechanics contained within this bill would maybe trump,that certification and or challenge period where a Council Chair could actually seat an individual. Maybe this is a better question to take offline with our Clerk and our Elections Administrator. This body knows that when we're passing policy, I'm trying to put it into practice. And so my concern is, would we presumably be placing someone in office to early because we haven't satisfied the election result and the challenge period, which I know to be 10 days, and so I'm looking at everybody and everybody's thinking really hard around here. Chair, I'm going to yield at this time and take this conversation offline with our Elections Administrator and Clerk, and maybe we can work out the mechanics of it without taking up too much of the Council's time. I yield. MR. HENRICKS: Ms. Lee Loy, I'll just say at this point and time as it's written it says that the special election is to be held within 120 days. I'll talk to Judge Strance about this and also my counter parts in the other counties that have conducted special elections. Whether or not when it says to be held, does to be held mean, you know, including those components that are critical to the process, and require as far as certifications and challenges. And then actually being able to swear somebody in, which is the last part of everything. I'll make it simple when I Page 13 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 ask the question when I work with our Corporation Counsel and our colleagues that have done this is, does those 120 days, you know, does that person who won the seat need to be sworn in on or before that 120th day. I'll keep it that simple, and if this passes and moves forward then I'll report back on that. MS. LEE LOY: Thank you. And the area I've actually really focused on is under Subsection B in which it notes, qualification requirements Section 3-3 shall be appointed by the Council Chairperson to fill the vacancy until a successor is duly elected. I think that's the—I just want to make sure we're providing ourselves enough clearing house days to make sure we're okay. But I also just kind of working in the mechanics if it were to occur. Thank you. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. Bringing it back here to Kona, Council Member Evans. MS. EVANS: Okay, can I have Elizabeth Strance please, Corporation Counsel. It says the special election shall be held in accordance with election laws of the state, and so as far applicable. Within five days of the election proclamation, a temporary successor with qualifications required by section shall be appointed by the Council Chair to fill the vacancy until a successor is duly elected. So I think duly elected and the other statement about doing it in accordance with election laws they don't conflict with each other, I don't think. And so this question about certifying election, I think it's kind of covered by this. I don't think it's within the 120 days, but I'm looking forward to your response. (Note: At this time, Corporation Counsel Elizabeth Strance came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MS. STRANCE: Thank you, Council Member. Elizabeth Strance, Corporation Counsel. I think one of the things that you might want to do between now and the next hearing is actually put together like a timeline, to see how it lines up. One of the things that we tried to do with this bill and let me just step back. You know there's the county law part, but elections are highly regulated by the state. And so we wanted to craft a bill that was generally enough not to conflict with the state law, and refer back to the state law when we could. And so the questions that are being raised today, are concerns about whether there are conflicts, and they appear to be timing issues. And so I think we can put our heads together, between now and next hearing. The second point just doesn't matter of drafting because Charter amendments are so special, you know, they have to be voted on by the public. And we're changing the law and our Charter is too specific,then we run the risk of having charter provisions that then run up against state law. And so from a drafting standpoint, we think it's important to place the sentiments of this body in a proposed amendment, and enough kind of procedural detail to provide guidance. Page 14 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 But not so much that if there's a change in state law, that our County Charter then runs afoul of the new state law. And so that's when some of the challenge in trying to put these things together. I think we're a little more comfortable with the special election language with the question that Council Member Lee Loy raised, and less comfortable with the appointment in that very short window, where state law requires state elected officials to take office immediately. Whereas County Council Members don't take office until the first week of December, so there's that puka of time. You know, I agree with Clerk that we need to put our heads together a little bit and maybe we can put together a timeline. And when we do that, I think we'll see pretty clearly whether we're bumping up against something that requires a further amendment. ACTING CHR. INABA: You still have the floor, Council Member Evans. MS. EVANS: Thank you. I think the exercises well worth it, because if this goes to the public for vote were going to have that information, I think to show the public what the timeline is going to be. So it would be very beneficial, if it passes. The body decides, you know, we want to hold special elections if the vacancy occurs within, could be within 15 months versus 18 months, you know, shorten it. That's what I'm hearing today. I think people would want to know how that would roll out, you know, if there is a vacancy. MS. STRANCE: I agree, and the other thing to keep in mind is that there would be nothing to prevent this body from enacting ordinances that further support the sentiment stated in the Charter. And so where there are some procedural issues, the passing of the code change will give this body a little more flexibility to respond to changes in state law as well. MS. EVANS: Okay, thank you. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council Member Kierkiewicz. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. And thank you, Judge Strance, for sharing that. That was one of the questions I was going to ask was related to the language that we have in the Charter can any of it actually rest in our County Code or even Council Rules, where we have a little bit of flexibility, to make changes in real time with Charter amendments. I get a little bit hesitant because of this of this specificity and the ability to make changes only every two years when election goes around. So, I support having a special election. I do want to think about the timeframe, but I wonder if as you say, the process and procedures can be something that we further articulate within our Code. Page 15 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 MS. STRANCE: Thankou Council Member. If this bodywants to have a Y special election, there needs to be an amendment to the County Charter because the County Charter as written, places the appointment authority maybe with the Council or the Council Chair. And so if you want this special election then we have to do a Charter change. Also if you would like to have that appointment in that puka of time there needs to be a change, because the timing that's laid out and the Charter that's currently written, really doesn't give this body time to act before the new electee would be taking office. And so, right now there's some timing issues for both situations. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I'm curious. So is it enough to say, right, hypothetically in the Charter amendment if the unexpired term is more than eighteen months, the vacancy shall be filled by special election period. And then more specifics, live in the County Code. MS. STRANCE: You're talking about for an amendment to the Charter? MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yes. I'm wondering how specific we need to be, only because we just don't know how this will unfold. We may want to make changes based on lived experiences. And again, amendments to Charter can only occur every two years. I'm just adding to the conversation because there's no going back really on this. And, you know, I think about the section of code related to PONC (Public Access, Open Space, and Natural Resources Preservation Commission), and how incredibly specific we've become, where it's actually tied the hands of the County in our community to fulfill the intention of the program, so. MS. STRANCE: I would think you would want a little bit more detail than you've described, because you probably don't want to have a special election if your already into an election cycle. And so that 18 months or whatever you decide upon is to really kind of have an election outside of the normal elections cycle. And so, I would think you'd need a little bit more than what you're describing, and if you want to address the timing issue that we ran into is now Senator Richards, you know, having to resign after Council Member Evans had been elected. But there was really no time within which this body could have acted. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Judge Strance in this situation of now Senator Richards being elected to the State Senate that's happened twice now. First with now, Senator Kanuha and then Tim Richards. The language in Subsection C, if an individual had been elected out right in August a member of this body now moves to the House or Senate, would they be able to be sworn in after election results on the state side have been certified to fulfill the remaining—or to be present and a Page 16 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 voting member in the remaining council meetings. I think it's like one Council meeting, is that your interpretation of this language? MS. STRANCE: Yes. Either, if that person was it would happen after the general election because if a Council Member is voted in outright, you still somebody that has a number of months left on their term. So, you're really only addressing that one month. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Over one meeting. MS. STRANCE: Yeah, one meeting. So I mean, I think in City and County of Honolulu. Some Council's don't meet during the interim between the election and being sworn in. Other counties give the authority to the Mayor and in the Federal offices there's, I think, a 60-day period for either presidential or gubernatorial appointment. And so I think you folks just need to decide as a matter of policy what pukas you want to fill and how. My recommendation would be to generally state yet in a Charter amendment, and then let the clerks do their work according to state law. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Council Member Evans, I appreciate the opportunity for this discussion. The concern I have about a 120-day potential special election processes, you came to the table with this legislation saying that you would like a district to have a representative. A voice, a voting member of this body. During a special election, that district would be without a voice for four months. It would be without a voice for four months, so I do like the ability of this body to be able to appoint someone. And similar to how this body conducted interviews for the County Auditor, having a similar very public process but a quick process, because we want to make sure that every district of the Island is represented at the dais, especially come budget period. So, I just wanted you to have that in mind as we continue to refine this very important measure. Thank you, Chair. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Going back to Council Member Evans. MS. EVANS: Thank you. I just wanted to point out that there is a sentence in here about a temporary successor with qualifications shall be appointed by the Council. Chairperson to fill the vacancy until a successor is duly elected. So there is something in there, I think, to make sure that people are represented. I wanted to talk about just for a moment, Member Lee Loy's comment about certification. I do know that when you're elected as a state representative at that night at midnight with the final results you do take that seat of office. However, you cannot vote on anything that's officially done by the legislature, unless you're sworn in by the Chief Justice. Normally that occurs the third Wednesday in January, but if there was a special session called by the Governor or by Members Page 17 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 of the Senator, the Speaker of the house; before you could vote you would have to be sworn in. That is true, you would have to be sworn in. So, I'm not sure Corporation Counsel I'm not sure about how you address the fact that you have to be officially sworn in to do official business, but that's really how it's done at the State Legislature. But you're still duly elected and you're sitting in the office that night of election. It's your office you're in, you're duly elected, but you can't do the official vote of Council's legislative business without being sworn in. So I don't know how you would even put that in there, but there may be something in the Hawai`i Revised Statutes (HRS) that addresses that. And I've never read it, but there might be something in the HRS that does say that you are duly elected, but no official business can be taken until you're sworn in. That might I don't know if that language would have to be in here or not, but it's really good we're having this discussion because it's these details that we have to work out. So I appreciate the comments, thank you. I yield. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Any other discussion at this time? MS. KIMBALL: Chair. ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Chair Kimball, go ahead. MS. KIMBALL: Thank you, Chair Inaba. I just wanted to on behalf of Council Member Lee Loy, she had to rush so she could get over there to be with you folks in Kona. She asked me to just mention, you know, referring to this scenario we had where Council Members get elected to State Office and subsequent appointment. That timing issue not only pertains in terms of the possible contest of an election to the Council Member that might be appointed to that seat but also to the State House or Senate Representative. So if we're looking at the now Senator Richards scenario, with respect to the Council appointing a successor we'd have to account for the possibility of a contest, and the certification of the results that time period needs to be accounted for as well. In addition, I want to reflect on what Judge Strance has said about maybe stepping back some of the specificity in this proposed Charter amendment. You know, I'm just thinking with respect to our conversation here even it's a little bit confusing, and I think it would be confusing on the ballot. And I think we need to pull back some of the language, so it is more succinct and also a little bit more clear. I do have concerns also around what Council Member Kierkiewicz mentioned, you know, there is that clause in there that would allow the Council Chair to appoint a temporary successor. I just wonder about the possibility of having within a term, three different Council Members representing in a district. And Page 18 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 while that's important and it's important with respect to representation of the community, I think there might also be challenges with just that level of inconsistency of the possibility for three different people in a single term. So we'll continue to support this amendment, I guess as it is. But I'm almost thinking Council Member Evans, we have tons of time on this Charter amendment still. I almost recommend withdrawing what you've got proposed, in spending a little more time on the crafting and revisiting it after conversation is done today. Thank you. ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Member Villegas. MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you, Council Chair Kimball. I have some hesitation about Chair being able to appoint somebody or council being able to appoint somebody, because as was mentioned before, each of our districts elect us. Unfortunately, historically there's been pilikia(trouble; problem; nuisance; difficulty) around different members of the council supporting other members of the council or not supporting them. And I think we open up a pandora's box for potential gerrymandering. And when we assign somebody, we're making a statement for the voters of a district, whoever that person is, we don't represent that district, we represent the County as a whole on the Council, but I see the opportunity for just a potential, really intensive challenges both legally and just morally. So those are my hesitations that are having been one of the people, you know, who my predecessor on the Council, you know Dru Kanuha was elected to State Office and did take office immediately. And so, the seat representing District 7 was vacant for a few months before, thankfully, I was elected in the General Election. And I really—thankfully at the time there was great staff here that was very able bodied. But I didn't get any negative flack or serious negative repercussions of not having somebody on the Council for those couple of months in the interim time. So I suppose from my personal experience, I didn't see it as overly challenging or negatively impacting my district, bBut I do see some potential challenges for us in opening up the opportunity for us to then assign somebody to sit in the seat. I also share the concern about the potential of three people representing a district, yeah, it's a real challenging one. Because this really looks at in my mind death. Being the most dangerous or threatening option, that would bring forth this kind of scenario. And I don't know how much we plan for or can get out ahead of that or how much we handle it as it happens, so not sure I'm cart horse on that. But from my personal experience, having my predecessor being elected to the State Senate and then not coming in myself, I didn't see major negative repercussions. I have seen, unfortunately, community and constituent's faith in Government in general. It's challenged enough, but to open future council's up to be vulnerable to being judged by who they appoint or don't appoint. How well I'd like to think Page 19 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 the majority would be pono (to think deeply; to reflect; to gain insight), it's a can of worms, it's a pandora box. I'm really hesitant on those things. So, thank you for taking into consideration my mana`o on this, and for your tenacity in trying to tackle this issue. Appreciate it, I yield. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. I just want to point out we are a little behind schedule, so let's keep our comments brief and we can figure out where the introducer wants to go with this. Council Member Galimba. MS. GALIMBA: Yeah, so briefly I do appreciate the—I do think that Section 3-4 just needs some updating. And I think some of the updating that you proposed is excellent-but I guess I would echo Council Member Kimball in that, I think we need to keep it simpler because of the Charter amendment factor. So I would sort of echo that of wanting to do some changes but keep them pretty simple, and then putting the detail into ordinance. And I really like Council Member Kierkiewicz's concept of sort of a more public way of bringing in a new Council Member, so it isn't some of the nightmarish possibilities of—yeah insider politics. Those are my thoughts, thanks. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Heading back, Council Member Evans. MS. EVANS: I'm just so impressed by the questions and the comments. We've been turning on this for a while now. Other counties let the Mayor appoint, but then you can get into all that; the Mayor appointing versus the Council. I mean you know, eventually the question is how long do you allow a seat to sit vacant? That's the big question, right? If you don't want to sit vacant for two, three, four months, how do you make sure the people—there's one option that has not yet been discussed and we could put it in Code, I think. And that is, if someone is duly elected to a different seat and has to resign between November and December, basically the Council can't vote on anything. You take away their right to vote. And the reason I'm saying that is recently we just had a bill we've passed; it passed five, four. In this scenario, you kept doing legislation, between November and December. You had Committee meetings, you were voting on ordinances, and that seat did not have a vote. And that was my irk or my ire. What made me upset is that 29,000 people; their vote was not counted when the Council was voting on those ordinances. Now mind you people get sick, people go on vacation, people have reasons they don't show up, but the reality is that's an excused absence. In this instance, it's a vacant seat. And so you could just say between that date if this scenario happens, they can't vote. You could do that as another option. So I think it's important that we think about this, because there's a lot of moving parts, but the bigger question is how long do you let a seat sit vacant when there is Council action being taken. That's Page 20 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 the bigger question. So I really love this, I'm going to withdraw it, and come back with another amendment. That's what I'd like to do, but I also want to offer it to you since I believe maybe Deanna Sako is going to be here for Finance Committee this afternoon. We could also table this until then and ask her our questions. No, you don't want to ask her questions. ACTING CHR. INABA: It's a different committee. MS. EVANS: No need, okay. ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Member Evans if you'd like to ask Director Sako you can do that outside of this meeting, but you cannot take this up in the Finance Committee later. MS. EVANS: Okay. ACTING CHR. INABA: So is it your intention to withdraw? MS. EVANS: Yes. I'll withdraw and come back with another amendment. ACTING CHR. INABA: So let the record reflect that Council Member Evans, has withdrawn her motion to amend. And we're back on the main motion now, which is to forward Bill 49 to Council with a favorable recommendation. Wanting to check how we'd like to proceed here. I do think with future amendments are you wanting to hold this here in committee? MS. EVANS: I want to move this forward; I want to come up with something. I know, I will be proposing amendments based on today's discussion. If people are comfortable, we can move it to first reading with amendments at first reading. And if not then we'll just postpone this until is it July 5th, and then I'll have a communication with another amendment. ACTING CHR. INABA: I'm thinking it's probably the committee's idea to hold this here at committee. Just so we can have a lot of conversation, which is where this kind of happens in committee. MS. EVANS: Okay. ACTING CHR. INABA: So can I get a motion please Ms. Evans to postpone Bill 49 to our July 5th committee meeting. Motion to Postpone: Ms. Evans moved to postpone Bill 49 to July 5, 2023. Seconded by Ms. Kagiwada. Page 21 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 ACTING CHR. INABA: Any discussion? Council Member Kierkiewicz on the postponement. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. A little bit of latitude, but it's related to the postponement. Please take into consideration all of the great mana`o that we have been sharing with you today. I will be supporting keeping this in committee, because it is heavy kuleana to be advancing a Charter amendment. And I want to make sure that it is language we get right, and that there's unanimous support for whatever we are putting forward because that sends a very strong and important message to our voter base. I do want to address something that you mentioned earlier, about stopping votes or Council meetings until all seats are filled. That's something that I cannot support, so I hope is not part of your amendment package. And I also do want to note that there were several Charter amendments that Council Member Aaron Chung at the time put forward, related to the director positions for various departments like Public Works and Environmental Management. In the Council's wisdom, they actually carried those bills forward to discussion in January when a full and new Council was seated. So I want to let the public know that we made sure that very important discussions, and business decisions were made at the appropriate time. But I do not, and I don't think Director Sako would support pausing County Government, because we have bills to pay and a lot of the discussions that we do have, have island-wide impact. And we're often seen as being obstructionists within government and having a lot of bureaucracy, so I just want to make sure we're handling people's business. Thank you, Chair, for the latitude. I yield. ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. All in favor of postponing Bill 49 to the July 5, committee meeting say "aye." Vote on Motion to The motion to postpone Bill 49 to July 5, 2023, was carried Postpone: by the following voice vote: (Approved) Ayes: Committee Members Evans, Galimba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Villegas, and Acting Chair Inaba—7. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Members Kaneali`i—Kleinfelder and Lee Loy-2. Excused: None. Page 22 GOEAC-11 June 20,2023 ADJOURN- There being no further business, at 12:14 p.m., Ms. Kierkiewicz moved to MENT: adjourn the meeting. Seconded by Ms. Galimba and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Evans, Galimba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, Villegas, and Acting Chair Inaba—7. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Members Kaneali`i—Kleinfelder and Lee Loy-2. Excused: None. ACTING CHR. INABA: This meeting is adjourned at 12:14 (p.m.) Approved,, J g (96 Ms. Cindy Evan:, Cham (nate) Committee on Governmental Operations and External Affairs CE/rk Page 23