HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN COUNCIL 2023-12-20 2022-2024 Hawaii County Council
28th Session
West Hawaii Civic Center
74-5044 Ane Keohokalole Highway, Building A
Kailua-Kona, Hawaii
December 20, 2023
INVOCATION: Pastor Brian Keiser of Lutheran Church of the Holy Trinity gave the morning's
invocation.
CALL TO The regular meeting of the Hawaii County Council was called to order at
ORDER: 9:03 a.m., in the Council Chambers, Kailua-Kona, by Ms. Heather L. Kimball,
Chair.
ROLL CALL:
Present: Ms. Heather L. Kimball, Chair
Mr. Holeka Goro Inaba, Vice Chair
Ms. Cindy Evans, Member
Ms. Michelle M. Galimba, Member
Ms. Jenn Kagiwada, Member
Mr. Matt Kdneali`i-Kleinfelder, Member (came in later)
Ms. Ashley L. Kierkiewicz, Member(via videoconference from Hilo)
Ms. Susan L. K. Lee Loy, Member (came in later)
Ms. Rebecca Villegas, Member
PLEDGE OF The Chair directed the Council to the next order of business, Pledge of
ALLEGIANCE: Allegiance.
(At this time, County Clerk Jon Henricks led the Council in
the Pledge of Allegiance.)
PETITIONS, The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Petitions,
MEMORIALS, Memorials, Certificates of Merit, and Expressions of Condolence.
CERTIFICATES
OF MERIT, AND (There were none.)
EXPRESSIONS OF
CONDOLENCE:
STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business,
FROM THE Statements from the Public on Agenda Items.
PUBLIC ON
AGENDA ITEMS: The following individuals registered to speak and came forward when called by
the Chair:
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Jon Olson: Bill 82, Draft 3 (Comm. 496.47); and
Bill 107 (Comm. 609), in support.
Timothy Rowan: Bill 82, Draft 3 (Comm. 496.47); and
(representing Black Sands and Bill 107 (Comm. 609), in support.
Malama O Puna)
Carrie Kowalski: Bill 82, Draft 3 (Comm. 496.47); and
Bill 107 (Comm. 609), in support.
Patti Pinto: Bill 82, Draft 3 (Comm. 496.47), in support.
Nako`olani Warrington: Bill 107 (Comm. 609), comment.
(representing Kupuna for the (See Comm. 609.8)
Mo`opuna)
Bridgit Bales: Bill 107 (Comm. 609), in support.
(representing Keauakaha-Panaewa
Farmers Association
Paul Normann: Res. 369-23 (Comm. 617), in support.
(representing Neighborhood Place
of Puna)
Regina Weller: Res. 369-23 (Comm. 617), in support.
(representing 808 Homeless
Task Force)
Susan Aronson: Res. 372-23 (Comm. 620), in opposition.
Cory Harden: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support;
and Res. 372-23 (Comm. 620), in opposition.
Clare Loprinzi: Res. 372-23 (Comm. 620), in opposition.
Zoey Gacayan: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hawaii Island
Youth Academy)
Jennifer Valera: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hawaii Island
Youth Academy)
Kyla Turner: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hawaii County
Youth Commission)
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Janice Palma-Glennie: Res. 372-23 (Comm. 620), in support.
(See Comm. 620.80)
Caleh Carvalho: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hawaii Island
Youth Academy)
Kealoha Madriaga: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hawaii Public
Health Institute)
Jill Tamashiro: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Department of Health) (See Comm. 593.47)
Kilihea Inaba: Res. 372-23 (Comm. 620), in opposition.
Jay Ihara: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hawaii Public (See Comm. 593.42)
Health Institute)
Chuck Flaherty: Res. 372-23 (Comm. 620), in opposition.
(representing Sierra Club —Hawai`i (See Comm. 620.85)
Island Group)
Mitzie Higa: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hawaii State
Teachers Association)
Eileen O'Hara: Res. 376-23 (Comm. 632);
(representing Malama O Puna) Bill 82, Draft 3 (Comm. 496.47); and
Bill 107 (Comm. 609), in support.
Liza Ryan Gill: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Campaign for (See Comm. 593.35)
Tobacco-Free Kids)
Stephanie Bath: Bill 82, Draft 3 (Comm. 496.47); and
Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
Alexa Wohrman: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing American Heart
Association)
Loke Aloua: Res. 372-23 (Comm. 620), in support.
Jasmin Rios: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in opposition.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Kai Carvalho: Bill 102, Draft 2 (Comm. 593.4), in support.
(representing Hamakua-Kohala
Health)
APPROVAL The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Approval
OF MINUTES: of Minutes.
Vote on Approval Ms. Lee Loy moved to approve the Minutes of
of Minutes: November 15, 2023. Seconded by Mr. Inaba and carried
(Approved) by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Galimba, Inaba,
Kagiwada, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Kimball—9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
Change Order As directed by the Chair and with no objection from the Council Members, the
of Business: following items were taken out of order:
GOEAC-86 NOMINATION OF DEAN AU TO THE LEEWARD PLANNING
(Comm. 611): COMMISSION
Requires Council
Confirmation by: December 29, 2023 (Section 13-4(k),
Hawaii County Charter)
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
External Affairs Committee Report No. 86. Seconded by
Ms. Galimba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion? Council Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: Yes. Good morning. I missed the Committee discussion, but I just
had a question for the administration. Mr. Au is here starting a new term and I
was wondering was the previous commissioner not able or willing to serve
another full term?
CHR. KIMBALL: Do we have Executive Assistant to the Mayor Pomai
Bartolome in the Hilo Chambers?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair, she's not in the Hilo Chambers. My understanding
is she'd be participating via Zoom. I can text her.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay.
MR. INABA: That's fine. I'll follow up with her offline. I'll be supporting
Mr. Au's confirmation today. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Vice Chair Inaba. Any further discussion?
Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: I want to thank you, Dean, for being here today and showing your
commitment to the community. I know it's a heavy lift. It's a lot of work and I
know you're going to put your heart and soul into it so I really appreciate it
because we need, you know, we need people who ask the hard questions and
sometimes make the hard decisions, and I think you can. So, thank you very
much. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Any other discussion?
Seeing none, all those in favor,please say "aye."
Vote on GOEAC-86: The motion to adopt Governmental Operations and
(Adopted) External Affairs Committee Report No. 86 was carried by
the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Galimba, Inaba,
Kagiwada, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Kimball—9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Mr. Au, for being here. If we can now go to the
nomination of Jim Beets to the Environmental Management Commission, please.
GOEAC-87 NOMINATION OF JIM BEETS TO THE ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT
(Comm. 612): COMMISSION
Requires Council
Confirmation by: December 29, 2023 (Section 13-4(k),
Hawaii County Charter)
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Vote on GOEAC-87: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
(Adopted) External Affairs Committee Report No. 87. Seconded by
Ms. Galimba and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Galimba, Inaba,
Kagiwada, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Kimball—9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Mr. Beets, for your patience and being in
attendance via Zoom. Congratulations.
MR. BEETS: Mahalo.
CHR. KIMBALL: Moving on to the nomination of James Lee to the Water
Board, please.
GOEAC-88 NOMINATION OF JAMES LEE TO THE WATER BOARD
(Comm. 613):
Requires Council
Confirmation by: December 29, 2023 (Section 13-4(k),
Hawaii County Charter)
Vote on GOEAC-88: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
(Adopted) External Affairs Committee Report No. 88. Seconded by
Ms. Galimba and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Galimba, Inaba,
Kagiwada, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Kimball—9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Congratulations, Mr. Lee, and thank you for your patience
with us this morning. Can we now move to the appointment of Deanna Sako as
Managing Director?
GOEAC-92 APPOINTMENT OF DEANNA S. SAKO AS MANAGING DIRECTOR
(Comm. 621):
Requires Council
Confirmation by: March 1, 2024 (Section 13-8,
Hawaii County Charter)
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
External Affairs Committee Report No. 92. Seconded by
Ms. Galimba.
(Note: At this time, Managing Director Lee Lord and nominee Deanna S.
Sako came forward to address the members of the Council.)
(Council Members spoke in favor of the appointment.)
Vote on GOEAC-92: The motion to adopt Governmental Operations and
(Adopted) External Affairs Committee Report No. 92 was carried by
the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Galimba, Inaba,
Kagiwada, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Kimball—9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: The nomination of Deanna Sako to Managing Director is
affirmed. If we can now go to Communication 622, the appointment of
Diane Nakagawa to Finance Director.
GOEAC-93 APPOINTMENT OF DIANE NAKAGAWA AS FINANCE DIRECTOR
(Comm. 622):
Requires Council
Confirmation by: March 1, 2024 (Section 13-8,
Hawaii County Charter)
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
External Affairs Committee Report No. 93. Seconded by
Mr. Inaba.
(Note: At this time, nominee Diane Nakagawa came forward to address
the members of the Council.)
(Council Members spoke in favor of the appointment.)
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Vote on GOEAC-93: The motion to adopt Governmental Operations and
(Adopted) External Affairs Committee Report No. 93 was carried by
the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Galimba, Inaba,
Kagiwada, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Kimball—9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: The appointment of Diane Nakagawa to the Finance Director
position is affirmed. Congratulations. We look forward to working with you.
Alright,just so that we can plan ahead for our day, I would like to take
Communication 620.1, the request for reconsideration, at this time. To my
colleagues,just in advance, this will be a discussion purely on the reconsideration,
and if we do need to go into Executive Session,just be aware that we can do that
if we need to. Mr. Clerk.
Comm. 620.1: RESOLUTION NO. 372-23 —REQUEST FOR RECONSIDERATION
From Council Member Rebecca Villegas, dated December 13, 2023, requesting that
Resolution No. 372-23 be reconsidered pursuant to Council Rule No. 14.
Res. 372-23: AUTHORIZES: (1) THE HIRING OF SCHLACK ITO, A LIMITED LIABILITY
LAW COMPANY, AS SPECIAL COUNSEL TO REPRESENT THE COUNTY
OF HAWAII IN HUI MALAMA HONOKOHAU V. COUNTY OF HAWAII,
CIVIL NO. 1:23-CV-00393; AND (2) THE PAYMENT OF FUNDS OF A LATER
FISCAL YEAR AND OF MORE THAN ONE FISCAL YEAR FOR A MULTI-
YEAR AGREEMENT WITH SPECIAL COUNSEL FOR THE COUNTY'S
LEGAL DEFENSE IN HUI MALAMA HONOKOHAU V. COUNTY OF
HAWAII, CIVIL NO. 1:23-CV-00393
Authorizes the Mayor to enter into a multi-year agreement with Schlack Ito to
provide legal services, with expenses not to exceed $200,000.
Reference: Comm. 620
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Waived: FC
Adopted: December 6, 2023
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire
membership, pursuant to Section 6-5.5,
Hawaii County Charter
(Note: Comms. 620.89 and 620.90, from Council Member Rebecca Villegas
dated December 20, 2023, transmitting proposed amendments to Res. 372-23,
were circulated.)
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Ms. Villegas moved to reconsider the vote taken on
Reconsider: Res. 372-23 on December 6, 2023. Seconded by
Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: Yes. I'll just try to keep it simple. For the last week I have
worked very closely with community members and different organizations who
are very concerned about the passage of Resolution 372 in the form that it was
passed, and had asked for amendments to be included to the resolution that would
provide more confidence in the intention of the County in moving forward in
hiring legal representation as it relates to the lawsuit. And so I am asking today
for the support of my colleagues and for the opportunity to bring this back to the
floor so we can then have the conversation about the proposed amendments. And
I'm asking for your support. With that, I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Villegas. Anyone else on the
motion to reconsider? Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I just appreciate this level of process from
Council Member Villegas. And in responding to community and concerns
brought up by many of our local nonprofits, this is how we can choose to move if
we want to. And I like that we're using the process to look into the matter. So
thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder. Council
Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: Yeah, I'll be in support of this motion to reconsider. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Mr. Clerk.
MR. HENRICKS: Yeah, I just wanted to provide any clarification for people
who may not be familiar. The motion to reconsider requires five votes of the
Council, and if there are five votes for reconsideration, then we would essentially
bring the resolution back to the floor in the same place that it was just before the
vote was called for its adoption. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you for the explanation of the process. Council
Member Kagiwada.
MS. KAGIWADA: It's just a question for the Clerk or whomever. So, at this
point, we can't discuss the item itself. We're only discussing whether or not to
bring this back. Is that correct?
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MR. HENRICKS: It depends. It's up to the Council and the Chair to determine if
your points are germane to the reconsideration. But I don't think it's totally off
limits to talk about the topic of the resolution itself. It's up to the Council to
determine whether or not it's germane to reconsider.
MS. KAGIWADA: Okay. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: My recommendation would be, for example, it would not be
appropriate at this time to talk about potential amendments but the desire to
amend, right, more broadly,just for the purpose of bringing it forward.
MS. KAGIWADA: What about clarification like asking Corp. (Corporation)
Counsel for clarification on intent of the ?
CHR. KIMBALL: That would be appropriate.
MS. KAGIWADA: Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Chair. Thank you for joining
us, Corporation Counsel. I guess I have one question just to ask which is, is this
request for money to be used to get the County out of our responsibilities for
meeting Federal, State, local standards of appropriately dealing with wastewater?
(Note: At this time, Corporation Counsel Elizabeth Strance came forward
to address the members of the Council.)
MS. STRANCE: Good morning. Elizabeth Strance, Corporation Counsel. No.
MS. KAGIWADA: Thank you. No further questions. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kagiwada. Anyone else?
MS. EVANS: Chair?
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. I'm in support of the reconsideration. I want to thank
the Council Member who's listening to her community and just asking for us to
have further discussion. I think it's a good idea. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Anyone else? Seeing no
further comment, I do want to provide Corporation Counsel the opportunity to
make any additional comments on the matter of the reconsideration before we
take the vote.
MS. STRANCE: Good morning, Chair Kimball, Council. Elizabeth Strance,
Corporation Counsel. With me is Deputy Britt Bailey. I want to thank you for
the opportunity to respond to the motion to reconsider and urge you to reject the
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
motion. I've reviewed the communications accompanying the motion and heard
the testimony regarding this matter, and appreciate the opportunity to address
what I believe to be some public and possibly Council Member misunderstanding
regarding the role of Corporation Counsel, the ethical obligations of lawyers, and
the underlying lawsuit.
Quite simply, the role of Corporation Counsel, under the County Charter, is to
represent the County in all civil legal proceedings. The Charter doesn't give the
Office of Corporation Counsel the choice whether to defend the County. It
doesn't provide that level of discretion. It's one of the prescribed duties under the
Charter. The County Charter also anticipates that the Office of Corporation
Counsel will on occasion require to hire special counsel. That's set forth in
Section 6-5.5: "The council may, by two-thirds vote of its entire membership,
authorize the employment of special counsel for any special matter presenting a
real necessity for such employment. . . ."
When we presented the resolution at the last hearing, we set forth the necessity for
our office to request the appointment of special counsel. So, contrary to some of
the comments that have been made about this motion, this is not a lawsuit that the
County initiated. This is a lawsuit that the County is responding to. The Office of
Corporation Counsel has a Charter obligation to defend it.
We've also described to this Council the necessity for the need to hire outside
counsel. We've described to you the environmental law and litigation.
Environmental litigation is a specialized area of law. In Hawaii, there is a
vibrant yet fairly small community of lawyers practicing in this area, and even
fewer with expertise in the Federal Clean Water Act.
So, when we made this request, the necessity of the request was based both on the
need to have outside resources that have specialized knowledge where our
department is lacking, as well as the lack of resources to defend the County in
such a significant lawsuit. So the Office of Corporation Counsel has advised this
body that its ability to represent the County in this lawsuit is needing help. It is
right that we have a small legal division. It would require at least two lawyers,
out of six, to defend this lawsuit and close to a hundred percent of the only
paralegal that we have. And so the significance of not approving the request for
the assistance of counsel has a real and an immediate impact on our office and its
ability to defend the County in this lawsuit.
There's also been a lot of discussion and it implied—and I think what's behind it
is an implied belief that the County's defense of the lawsuit means that the
County cannot move forward on policy matters to upgrade the Kealakehe
Wastewater Treatment Plant or any other treatment plant on this island. You can
do both. And prior to this lawsuit and prior to the Maui decision, there have been
discussions and there have been long-running discussions about the R-1 upgrade
project at Kealakehe Wastewater Treatment Plant. Those have been policy
decisions that have been made by the Administration, by the Council in approving
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
budgets and priorities. And there's no reason that a lawsuit cannot proceed at the
same time that this body is addressing some of the legal matters. They're not
mutually exclusive.
The Maui case did not prevent, during the course of the lawsuit, did not prevent
the County of Maui from upgrading its wastewater treatment facility. There were
legal issues that were being debated in that case, but the two are not intertwined
with each other. And so the suggestion that the money should be spent on the
upgrades, I have not heard that the County does not have $200,000 to devote to a
wastewater treatment plant, and that would require approval of this body. There
was discussion about distribution centers and systems and the need to develop a
regional park. Those are policy decisions. Those require the approval and
funding by this body. There's nothing in this lawsuit that would prevent those
policy decisions to be made, those projects be funded, and those projects to
proceed.
We purposefully, in bringing this resolution to you, have not sought, and lobbied
for appointment at Council because it's a very specific request of my department.
We have an obligation to defend this lawsuit. We lack the resources to properly
defend it and to do all of the other work that our department is required to do.
I would add one more comment, and this is really coming from my personal
experience and my experience as a judge. So, in over 30-some years of legal
practice, I've been involved in lawsuits as an advocate. I've presided over
settlement discussions and case-resolution discussions as a judge, and I have had
a practice as a mediator. I will tell you that the quality and ability of cases to
resolve well is done better when there are legal representatives on both sides who
have the skillset, the knowledge, and the background to address resolution of the
case.
There are two settlement conferences that have been scheduled in this case. The
ethical obligations of lawyers, no matter who you are, carries with it a number of
responsibilities that I think are sometimes overlooked because lawyers are seen
simply as advocates. I have a niece who, when she was little, said she wanted to
grow up to be a warrior like her aunty—she was two or three. Sometimes, that's
what lawyers do; but most of the time, that's not what they do.
Our department has not been to trial in any significant case for years. When I was
a judge at the circuit court, I could probably count on both hands in ten years the
number of cases that actually went to trial, and that's because, as is stated in the
Preamble of the Rules of Professional Conduct, "as a representative of clients, a
lawyer performs various functions. As advisor, a lawyer provides a client with an
informed understanding of the client's legal rights and obligations and explains
their practical implications. As advocate, a lawyer zealously asserts the client's
position under the rules of the adversary system. As negotiator, a lawyer seeks a
result advantageous to the client but consistent with requirements of honest
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
dealing with others. As intermediary between clients, a lawyer seeks to reconcile
their divergent interests as an advisor and, to a limited extent, as a spokesperson
for each client. As an evaluator, a lawyer acts by examining a client's legal
affairs and reporting about them to the client and others."
Our office, who has this responsibility under the County Charter, is simply asking
this body for the resources to hire outside counsel who has the skills and the
experience necessary to bring this case to conclusion. And within that context,
that special counsel would wear all of those hats. I certainly appreciate the policy
concerns that have been expressed both by this body and by the community. I
would just urge this body to separate out the policy discussions and directions
they would like to see this County take from the obligations of our department
under the County Charter. And for those reasons, I would urge this Council to
reject the motion to reconsider, and allow our department to proceed with the
representation of outside counsel. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion on the matter? Council
Member Galimba.
MS. GALIMBA: Thank you, Judge Strance, for that very careful and complete
description of where you're standing and the resolution. From my perspective,
this is a very simple request for help for your department. And although there are
words like "defend" in it, which some people in the community have called out, I
mean that's just sort of standard language of when you're sued, you do need to
defend yourself. And it doesn't mean that you're going to be attacking anyone. It
simply means that you need to keep to defend the County in its entirety and
such that the County and all the people in it are considered the best outcome for
the entire community and County is reached for.
So that is what I am thinking that you will be doing because I have total faith in
your integrity and competence and as the director of Corporation Counsel. So I
will—although I understand the community's frustration with the wastewater
situation both here and in Hilo and elsewhere, as you say that's different from
giving you the tools that you need to get the best outcome for all of us in this
situation, which is not one that we chose to be in. So I will be voting against the
reconsideration. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Galimba. Council
Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: I want to be very clear that I honor your concerns and authentic
intention to protect and support your team and your staff. And my intentionality
to bring back this resolution is not to cut you off at the knees, but to have the
opportunity to bring back the resolution to include some amendments that provide
clarity for the constituents who are actually the people suing their own county that
they live within.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
And so my intentionality in asking for this is to find that middle ground which
provides the terminology and inclusion of information that the community did not
feel they were given. Whether or not the information is out there or not, I know
how much I struggle here sometimes because I'm not a lawyer; and your common
person out there, that much more on how and where do they find this information,
and how do they piece it together. And unfortunately, we're living in a time
where there is so much chaos in our government and within society, and so much
opportunity for dissension and choosing to believe conspiracy or whatever
thought processes might become available. But my intention for asking for this to
come back is for the opportunity to clarify those things, not to harm Corporation
Counsel.
I've heard from the community as well the acknowledgement that you guys are
stretched to your absolute limits and capacities, and the acknowledgement from
testifiers, including the Sierra Club, that it is in the best interest of the County for
there to be outside special counsel. And this is where I have to do the dance
because I can't really talk about the amendments, but that's where I'm asking for
the support of my colleagues for the opportunity to bring this forward, have the
conversation, ask the questions, and reconsider the resolution with amendments.
And for that I will humbly ask the support of my colleagues for that opportunity.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Villegas. Council
Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. Still in strong support for a couple reasons. One is,
since I've been here, there's been many things we voted on to where we've been
asked to waive it from Committee directly to Council. This was one of those
instances where it came right in front of Council,we made a vote, and then the
community found out about it and the community asking us to have further
discussion. I'm all for that and I'm not afraid of the outcome. I think that you've
been very clear that you need support to be able to help your office. I know you
got the votes last time.
In support of that feeling that you needed to get support for your office, I think
that what I just heard from the introducer, member Villegas, is it's not her intent
to harm your office. What she wants is to have discussion about what she's
hearing from her community, what the concerns are from people across the whole
island about this, and it is the taxpayer dollars. And I think ifI don't think
there's anything to fear. I mean, further discussion I think can hopefully make a
more informed, maybe a better product than what we have before us. And again,
I don't like that it got rushed. It was very rushed that day, and I just feel like there
needs to be more discussion. So I'm in strong support of continuing the
discussion. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Anyone else? Council Member Kagiwada.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. KAGIWADA: Thank you. I agree with the testifier that everybody lost
when this lawsuit was filed. And it's unfortunate because I do see that we're kind
of mixing things that Judge Strance is trying to separate, which is the work we can
do as a policymaking body along with the Administration on working on
solutions. Hopefully, solutions that include circular economy solutions, bridge to
reef, nature-based solutions—we want to work on these things—flood mitigation;
all those things are good. And as a policy body and the Administration, I think
we want to work on those.
Somehow, that has gotten mixed up with the funding you need just to go do the
things that you need to do because this lawsuit was filed. And my understanding,
and please correct me if I'm wrong, is that your office did try to negotiate in good
faith before the lawsuit was filed. Is that correct?
MS. STRANCE: Yes.
MS. KAGIWADA: Yes, okay. So I guess I'm of the mind that I'm not really
sure. I'm okay if we want to discuss this again, but I personally would not I
don't think I'll be changing my mind as far as the support you need to do the job
that you are charged with. So I'm willing to hear what other people say as far as
if you want to discuss further and open this up, but I can say I won't be changing
my support for you to do the job you have to do. Thanks, I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kagiwada.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair?
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead, Council Member Kierkiewicz.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. I'll be supporting the motion to reconsider the
resolution. I think the issue we're trying to solve for is very complex, but what
we have before us is very simple: Reconsider the resolution, and as Council
Member Villegas noted,just provide a bit more clarity as to what we are tasking
Corporation Counsel to do. I think we all struggled at the last Council meeting
with what their scope of work was; really concerned about how this may stretch
on and essentially be a blank check to fight legal battles. I think we just want a
few more checkpoints and guardrails so that we are all comfortable and on the
same page as to what Corporation Counsel is doing. And so I would ask that we
give the Council Member of that district the support to reconsider this matter and
to ensure that there is enough clarity and guardrails in resolution language so that
everybody on the Council and in the community is very clear about what we're
trying to do here. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Anyone else?
Council Member Lee Loy.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you. I'm going to be supporting the motion for
reconsideration. I don't think my position has changed. My concern is there's a
lot of conflating of information out there about what this does, and at the end of
the day, somebody filed a lawsuit against us. And we have Corporation Counsel
saying, "Hey, we need to reply and respond. We need technical expertise in this
area." It's that simple.
We can still run parallel tracks and put money and funding and resources to solve
these larger problems, but this lawsuit doesn't go away. And basically, I
appreciate the edits for clarity. We just need them to move forward so everybody
can run in parallel tracks. It will give us an opportunity to take a look at next
year's budget and start to put in things to solve these problems or even find other
sources of funding, but I need Judge Strance to get the staff that she needs, have
the tools in her tool belt that she needs so she can do the very best job. That's
what they ask of us here up on the dais, and we owe it to Corporation Counsel to
give them the tools to do the very best job that they can do. So, if you don't mind
and there's no more discussion, can we please call for the question, move this
along, and get to some other things that a lot of people in our community are
waiting to hear. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. I think you're correct.
I think we know where the votes are on this, but I am going to ask our Clerk for a
roll call,please.
Vote on Motion to The motion to reconsider the vote taken on Res. 372-23 on
Reconsider: December 6, 2023, was carried by the following roll call vote:
(Approved)
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
MR. HENRICKS: Resolution 372 is on the floor,with Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder
making the motion to adopt, seconded by Mr. Inaba.
Vote on Motion to Ms. Villegas moved to table Res. 372-23. Seconded by
Table: Ms. Lee Loy and carried by the following voice vote:
(Approved)
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Galimba, Inaba,
Kagiwada, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz,
Lee Loy, Villegas, and Chair Kimball—9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Let's at this time take up Bill 102, please, when you have a
chance.
STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business,
FROM THE Statements from the Public.
PUBLIC ON
BILL 102 The following individual registered to speak and came forward when called by
(DRAFT 2) the Chair:
(COMM. 593.4):
Cyd Hoffeld: In support.
(representing Hawaii Island Community
Health Center)
Bill 102: AMENDS CHAPTER 14 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983
(Draft 2) (2016 EDITION, AS AMENDED), BY ADDING A NEW ARTICLE RELATING
TO THE PROHIBITION OF FLAVORED TOBACCO PRODUCTS
Prohibits retailers from selling, offering to sell, marketing, displaying, or
advertising for sale any product made of or derived from tobacco or nicotine that
imparts a taste or smell other than the taste or smell of tobacco. Includes a
prospective effective date of 42 days after the day that State law governing the sale
of tobacco products is either repealed or suspended.
Reference: Comm. 593.4
Intr. by: Ms. Lee Loy
Approve: PCHSW-7
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to pass Bill 102, Draft 2, on first
reading and adopt Policy Committee on Health, Safety, and
Well-Being Committee Report No. 7. Seconded by
Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, thank you. I just want to take a minute to thank all the
testifiers. Council Member Kimball mentioned that it is the holidays, and you
guys came out in force. So thank you so much for being here.
We hear a lot of information, and there was a piece of information that Ms. Valera
delivered today that just truly resonated with me. When we talk about health
disparities, and we talk about equity issues in this community in which the
tapestry of all of our ethnicities are so intertwined, and it really is that DNA
(deoxyribonucleic acid) link to the pigmentation of the skin. And when you look
at Hawaii, everybody has some connection to an ethnicity that puts them at
higher risk. And if everything else fell away, that's what this bill does, it gives us
of diverse ethnicities a hand up, which is why I'm going to continue to urge my
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
colleagues to please support this bill. It's for the future of our entire local
community. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. Anyone else? Council
Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Yes. First of all, your testimonies have been absolutely fabulous.
And thank you for coming. I learned something today that I didn't know which is
what our Council Member Lee Loy just said, is pigmentation, health disparities,
looking at our ethnicity; it's more than just youth, and I wouldn't have known
that. So I do think that in your conversation, thank you so much for focusing on
menthol because I brought that up last time because people were just talking
about flavored products. And I said, well, how about just carve out menthol
because you've got a lot of adults—it's been around for 50, 60 years. Menthol's
always been around, right.
So, today, talking about menthol was just like, whoa. I mean, that was a different
conversation than the one we had last time. And so, I think that awareness
campaign that you talked about, it's so important. And look what you taught me
today. And so that's so important to get the message out to people. And so I
applaud you for, again, your testimonies today and raising awareness and wish
you the best as you continue. I'm assuming this is a huge commitment that you
will stay with, and hopefully, you have a state legislator in the audience today that
I think is listening. And an important part to that is, what is the State Legislature
going to do in terms of granting us the ability to control our own destiny on this
island?
I remember people that were talking on cell phones, and driving and talking on
cell phones. The State was never willing to take up that cause, and so they gave
the authority to the counties. It was each individual county said you can't drive
and hold cell phones. We took care of our own destiny. We're asking for that
again. So I encourage you. Keep the testimonies going. Keep learning how to
meet those deadlines at the State Legislature, assuming we're going to have a bill
in front of us. I don't know who's going to introduce it. But I applaud you and
encourage you to continue this good work. Thank you. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council
Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you. I am in complete support of this bill. And I also
thank each and every one of you for being here today. You've gotten to
participate in, witness, and endure a glimpse of what we navigate here on the
Council, which I think is really empowering for our whole community. But thank
you for sitting here with us.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
I'm also brought back to a story my daughter told me. When vaping was kind of
hitting the more popular accessibility and then, all of a sudden, we have vape
shops and we have all these different things. I remember seeing in the news, a
study, it was kind of assumed that vaping was better then because there's no heat
in the smoke from cigarettes, and maybe it wouldn't turn your lungs black the
way cigarettes did. It was kind of that confusion. And I remember seeing a small
article about one of the first studies coming out of Stanford that was showing that
vaping actually puts small bubbles in your lungs that are unable to be removed.
They are permanent. And a few years later, hearing from my daughter of a
student at SDSU(San Diego State University)who had been vaping chronically
and who had to have her lungs scraped out, and the level of pain that she had to
endure to try and save her life was just astronomical. And how much that
impacted my daughter at the time and all of her friends and how damn addictive it
is, how flippin' tasty those little things are. It's like offering people a lollipop that
also gives you a little head buzz, but it goes away really fast. So you're not all
hamajang. But just the cycle of chronic addiction and how it's hit our youth as
this just ideal little nugget of temptation.
No matter how the stores would like to say that this will hurt their business and da
da da da da, those stores weren't in existence before. This is a whole new
industry that can come and go as it's discovered what is healthy for our
community. So I'm in complete support of this bill. I also look forward to
decisions being made at the State level, which would return home rule to our
County to be able to make these decisions. And thank you again for all being
here. Thank you for your graciousness.
I ran into our friend here when I was in Oahu last week and admitted my kind of,
"Oh, God, I just way overshared the other week in admitting my own personal
struggles." But I know that our keiki have family members that have their own
struggles. So I'd rather be that person that is being that honest and be standing
right beside the kids who face these challenges, and the kupuna, and everyone in
between. I also went home and talked to a member of the family who had a vape
in hand, and he said, "Please make them illegal. I will admit I don't have the
willpower. So please take this away as even an option." And that just really
touched me. So thank you, guys, for standing up and navigating this challenging
issue. And I'm really honored and proud to be able to be in this role and support
you today. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Anyone else? Council Member
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I have a question for our Corporation
Counsel. Sorry, Betsy.
(Note: At this time, Corporation Counsel Elizabeth Strance came forward
to address the members of the Council.)
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. STRANCE: Elizabeth Strance, Corporation Counsel.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. I came away from the last
hearing, and I like the bill, I like the intent, but the lingering question on my mind
is around the preemption. There's a clause within the bill, there's a 42-day period
stated. I was looking at some of the history of the bills and the allowing counties
to have more stringent ordinances if we so choose. But what is the preemption
policy right now, and how does it pertain to this bill?
MS. STRANCE: Well, this bill is effective only upon repeal of a State law. And
so it recognizes that, without a change in State law, there is a preemption issue.
And so passage of the bill would not result in it immediately becoming effective.
But in hopes that the Legislature gives counties the authority to enact more
stringent laws, and so that would be the permission that the County would be
looking for to allow the bill to come into effect. But basically, the idea is to have
this in place. If the Legislature acts, then they don't have to start over and come
back before this body to enact a bill. It's already there and it will become self-
executing.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So, in a sense, we're actually preempting
State laws and being ready to take advantage if they do so.
MS. STRANCE: Preempting the preemption.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: We're preempting the preemption.
CHR. KIMBALL: It's pre-inception.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: It's pre yeah, I don't even know how to
say that word. Okay.
MS. STRANCE: Either that or hopeful thinking.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So, we pass the law; it actually can't
go into effect?
MS. STRANCE: Correct.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: That's funny. Well, that makes me a little
bit more comfortable. Because, I was thinking about this, and I'm talking to
people and they're vaping in front of me. And I'm looking at them like, "Do you
know that we're about to ban that thing that you're smoking? Not that I agree or
disagree with what you're doing, but you are an adult and this is your decision,
but do you know there's a law that's being considered right now?" But so, unless
the State does something, we're stuck where we stand.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. STRANCE: Correct. But if that person was a minor, you could say that
already. So there's already laws regarding minors. Go ahead and scold
depending on their age.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, very helpful. I was looking through
some of the State bills that have been proposed and tracking. And very
interesting history as they move their way through and then fail to get agendized.
That really speaks poorly to the representatives or the senators who failed to
agendize something. But I hope that it's highlighted by this group as you get
ready for the new session for our State Legislature. But anyone who fails to
agendize something basically just crapped on it and didn't want to put so much
time and energy into something like this. But I wish you guys the best. Thank
you very much, Ms. Strance.
And to the maker, I was thinking about this. I was pulling from my resources, my
infiltrators, and what I was hearing was really disheartening: 75 to 90 percent of
the kids in high schools have them, smoke them, use them. That bugs me because
these are kids who are under 21 (years old), who are getting them from
somewhere, someone, without any kind of consequence, and that bugs me. I
mean, that's really what I'm getting from you folks, is we don't want high school
kids doing it or kids younger, middle school. Can we, as part of a more stringent
policy, crack down on anyone who sells to minors, or minors selling to minors,
within our legal ability? That's where I'd like to see if can really nail down some
new laws. That would be interesting because I'm not happy with what I heard.
That bugged me. I yield, Chair.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder. Council
Member Lee Loy, if you want to quickly respond to that?
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, I think we can do some work offline in that area. I think
the law actually exists. And what we've learned is that often aunty or tutu or
someone else is actually buying for the youth. Because of the colorful packaging,
they don't actually see it as a bad thing. They see it as candy, right. And we're
seeing that seep into now liquor. We see a lot of hard seltzers. It's this attractive
packaging. And so it is a more broad education and awareness that is being kind
of pushed out to the bigger community about this is not candy. But we can do
some work offline on that.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. Council
Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: Yeah. Just wanted to circle back on the proposed changes I made
last time, if we would be able to see that at next reading or if not my office can
prepare.
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead and respond, Council Member Lee Loy.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. LEE LOY: Yes. It slipped my mind. I'll definitely have that at second and
final reading, that adjustment.
MR. INABA: Okay. Thank you so much. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Council Member Kagiwada.
MS. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Chair. I'll be supporting. I was really just so
happy to see the health community, the teachers, our Youth Commission come
out and support. That's the first actual action that the Youth Commission has
done. They're a newly formed commission. And I do want to highlight their ask
around making sure, and this kind of goes to the point that Council Member
Lee Loy was just making, that education is really important in this. And so I
know you all know your work is not done. Once we pass this, you've got to work
with the State, and you're all going to be talking to Rep. (Representative)
(Greggor) Ilagan over there right after we're done, right, and then also work with
the public to really educate them. So, yes, of course I'm happy to support. And
thank you all for really stepping up for our community. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kagiwada. Council
Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Sorry, real quick. It really makes a difference to State legislators
when the youth shows up to testify, and I do have a lot of extra Hawaiian Air
miles I'd be willing to share to cover any costs to get over there. But hearing the
story from the youth does capture the hearts of the older State legislators. But
anyway, it's a good thing so I encourage you to figure out a way to get some of
your youth to Honolulu. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Anyone else? Alright,
with that, the teacher and scientist in me wants to take a moment to do a teaching
moment with you folks. In the last conversation we had about this, the comment
was made about the pigmentation and the increased addiction with the menthol
and I said, "I've never heard that before. I'm going to check the data."
And so I encourage all you young folks, when you have something that comes up
that you hear like that, I went to Google Scholar,which is not your regular
Google search engine but it's a Google search engine that particularly directs you
to scientific publications, and sure enough, there were several publications that
indicated that there's a distinct reaction between melanin and menthol that
increases the probability of addiction. I of course checked those sources and
made sure those were legitimate scientific magazines or articles.
But as you guys are involved in political discourse,political debate, never take
anything for granted. If there's something that you're not certain is true or not,
look it up. Look at the data, make sure those sources are verified, look at their
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
methods, and then you will have a clearer answer. And so, yeah, I am happy to
say—well, not happy to say, but I can say that based on my research that
statement was factually correct and something I certainly didn't know before. So
I appreciate you bringing it to our attention as Council Member Evans said. With
that, I will proceed with the vote on this matter. All those in favor of approving
Bill 102, Draft 2, at first reading, please say "aye."
Vote on Bill 102: The motion to pass Bill 102, Draft 2, on first reading and
Draft 2 adopt Policy Committee on Health, Safety, and Well-Being
(Approved) Committee Report No. 7 was carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball–8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba– 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Bill 102, Draft 2, is approved at first reading. If we could
quickly go to Bill 107, and then we're going to take a little recess.
STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business,
FROM THE Statements from the Public.
PUBLIC ON
BILL 107 The following individual registered to speak and came forward when called by
(DRAFT 2) the Chair:
(COMM. 593.4):
Representative Greggor Ilagan: In support.
(representing Hawaii House of Representatives)
Bill 107: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 23-51, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO PUBLIC
IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
JULY 1, 2023 TO JUNE 30, 2024
Adds the Public Works Puna Makai Alternate Route Study –County Project
($500,000) and the Puna Makai Alternate Route Study –State Project($1,000,000)
to the Capital Budget. Funds for this project shall be provided from General
Obligation Bonds, Capital Projects Fund–Fund Balance and/or other Sources
($500,000) and State Grants Receivable ($1,000,000), to identify an alternate route
to relieve traffic congestion and increase evacuation capacity, if needed.
Reference: Comm. 609
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Approve: FC-119
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire
membership to amend,pursuant to
Section 10-6(e), Hawai`i County Charter
Page 23
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
(Note: Comm. 609.1, from Council Members Susan L. K. Lee Loy and Ashley L.
Kierkiewicz dated December 20, 2023, stating that the Puna Makai Alternate
Route study shall not include proposals to by-pass traffic through the existing
Pana`ewa homestead community for daily transportation use, was circulated.)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to pass Bill 107 on first
reading and adopt Finance Committee Report No. 119.
Seconded by Ms. Villegas.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: It was really nice to have Mr. Ilagan here
this morning. Thank you for being here. Honorable Representative Ilagan.
There's been a lot of discussion about I think the biggest issue is where does the
route land? And I saw a note come in from some of my fellow Council Members
this morning. Maybe you can speak to the route being proposed that's not even
a good word, speak to the route and how the study is going to look at the layout.
That's a good generic place to start, I think, in your eyes because this is
something that you made and brought forward, you got the funding. I have some
other questions, but to speak to the route. I think that's the biggest one that we're
looking at here.
(Note: At this time, Representative Greggor Ilagan came forward to
address the members of the Council.)
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Of course. Honorable Council Member, I want
to state the fact that this was brought up in the state level because we needed to
figure out how to even start up an alternate route in Puna. As you're aware, in
your district there is an official alternate route in Ainaola and it goes all the way
down to, is it in Kea`au, it's not 137, is it?
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: No. Highway 11.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Highway 11. That's the official alternate route
in Puna. When an accident happens on Highway 130, using that official alternate
route, it doesn't really work as well. So, when I was in the County Council, I led
a study to do a taskforce to look into alternate routes in upper Puna, and we
looked into improving that alternate route. However, we wanted to take a step
back and actually look into Puna Makai, and that's what it originated, trying to
figure out with a current study that's in place, which is the 2005 Puna
Connectivity Study that looked into additional funding to determine I think,
Director (Stephen) Pause mentioned, aligning of existing routes.
Right at this moment, we don't have an alternate route officially in Puna Makai.
So, what this study does is to ensure that we consider all the current information
that's available and look at all the different positions of community such as
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Leilani Estates all the way down to DHHL (Department of Hawaiian Home
Lands) in Pana`ewa and ensure that we consider everybody's perspective and
create a route that everybody can work with. And when we went to the state, we
made sure that we don't impact the homestead in Pana`ewa because sometimes
we create these community development plans and we forget that our community
development plan shouldn't trump over another community development plan.
The Pana`ewa Homestead has created their own community development plan,
and we want to use the information that's in that plan and ensure that we respect
their plan as well as our plan, and come up with a compromise that everybody in
the community can work with. And that's going to be very hard. So, that's why
we're here, and that's why we need $1.5 million to even create such a study. It's
one of the largest amount of funds in a study and I think it's going to take quite a
long time to figure out what the pros and cons are, and as well as having the
engineers decide what that alternate routes are going to be.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So, you wrote the bill with someone
or this is sponsored by your office?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: It's only myself.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Sponsored by you?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Yes.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And brought forward, good job. I meant to
ask this last time and I may have. I don't know if Steve (Pause) knew the answer,
our Director of Public Works. One million dollars from the state, $500,000
required county match for this?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Correct. I personally could have worked on
funding the whole project, but I felt that this is a project that needs collaboration
with the county, not just a state led project. So, I made sure working with Mayor
Roth to see what we could do to make sure the county has skin in the game as
well. And that's why there's $500,000 from the county and one million (dollars)
from the state. And I really want to recognize Mayor Roth for his effort because
it was thanks to him that we got this far.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. I appreciate that. So, my only
comment, maybe this would help. Define makai,Puna Makai.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Of course. Puna Makai is below Highway 130.
So, anything below Highway 130 is Puna Makai.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So this really only affects, like you
said, your district?
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Correct.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And that would be Districts 3 and 4 now,
correct? Okay. Not that(District) 5 couldn't use it the same way that 3 and 4 use
5 to get out, but I'm going to bring this all back to one issue, and I hope that we
can figure out this as part of this study because this is probably the most important
piece. We all end up on Pana`ewa stretch no matter what route you take, and
that's everyone coming from Ka`u, Volcano, Pahoa, Mt. View, we all end up at
the Shipman Intersection together. And that happens on a daily basis, and we
know that we come from the area. So, as part of this study, understanding Puna
Makai means below (Highway) 130, great.
Puna is one district. We all use one road to get in and out of Hilo and we all get
one road to get to and from Hilo to our homes. So, this study, to me, really has to
wrap this whole issue and look at the one road that brings us all in and out of town
every day. If we bring everybody just faster, and I said this to our DOT
(Department of Transportation) Director Ed Sniffen, if you bring everybody
quicker to the Kea`au Intersection, it just makes traffic more worse at the
Highway 11, Highway 130 bypass intersection.
So if this study says, hey we're going to bring an alternate route and we're going
to bring them right to the back of the intersection. Okay, we know what's going
to happen. So, that's my comments. I appreciate the funding, I really do. But I
see Puna as a whole because we all come back to the same point and we're all
neighbors.
So, with that in mind, I wanted to highlight some of the things I've mentioned
today. Puna Makai being below Highway 130, the $500,000 match required by
the county, and we all end up on Highway 11 together in the morning, in the
night, and during emergencies. And that is our pinch point. So, thank you for
listening to me. Again, appreciate you being here today. Any response?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: I agree with you. We can't create a plan that's
going to cause the problem that we have right now in the future. We need to
figure out the best route that will elevate traffic and also be used for an alternate
route during an emergency. So, those things that you've mentioned needs to be
considered in the scoping and ensure that we don't just funnel everybody onto one
road.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I'd even go one step further and, thank you
for the latitude, Chair. It may be worthwhile to look at routes above Highway 130
as part of an alternate access plan because ultimately, we all get stuck in Puna if
Highway 11 gets shut off. If there's no alternate route to Hilo, we're all stuck.
And we've seen that before, we've been through it.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: And between you and I, and the rest of the
Council, I want to say that I would love to expand routes all the way down to
Saddle Road; connect Puna to Saddle. There's a lot of possibility what we could
do. But I think we need to take a step forward on this issue because this issue
hasn't been worked on for the last two or three decades. This is the first time in a
very long time that we're moving forward on an issue that we really need to work
on in Puna.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Could this funding be applied to other areas
within Puna or is it specific to below Highway 130?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: It's specific to below Highway 130.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Thank you. I yield, Chair.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. Having being involved in an alternative route study,
Kawaihae Road from Waimea to Kawaihae Harbor. What's important to me is
does Department of Transportation have it on their STIP (Statewide
Transportation Improvement Program)?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Yes. It's in their STIP. I'm not sure what the
price tag is but it's over hundreds of millions of dollars and that's why this study
is going to help at least identify what that route is because there's multiple routes
proposed at the moment. In hopes, once this study is done then we're breaking it
down in phases and try to work on those phases, figuring out federal funds, as
well as STIP funding to build that road.
MS. EVANS: You're calling it an alternate route and putting the word makai in
it, but is your language matching what the state is asking for so that you're in
alignment.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Yes.
MS. EVANS: It's with them and they like this called alternative route?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Puna Makai alternate route is the terminology
used in the community development plan, in the connectivity study. It's the name
that's been labeled as the alternate route.
MS. EVANS: I just had to, you know, Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder
mentioned you had the word makai on it. So, you're not looking at like a regional
alternate route that begins in one area and ends in another and it's very broad.
But you threw the word in makai, which is kind of limiting. Is that okay? I guess
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
a decision has already been made by Department of Transportation that they
wanted makai?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Councilwoman, as your district is also large,
Puna is large itself. And just the makai side is close to half of Oahu and it's
rather a large area. So, we're talking about, the reason why it's $1.5 million is
because we're looking at over 10 miles of road that we're covering.
MS. EVANS: It was similar to us.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Yeah.
MS. EVANS: So just so you know, I don't think $1.5 million is going to do it
because of the length of the road. But it's a good start and it will get you in front
of your colleagues to have that conversation. But based on my experience it's not
going to be near enough to do your study. And the other thing is, what they've
found, they ended up with five or six routes, but in the end the federal government
said they only wanted to fund the least expensive route. So, it didn't matter where
the community wanted it. They were focused on what the bottom-line dollar
amount was. So, yes, it's going to be community input. Yes, you're going to get
three or four or five. But in the end, the cost sometimes just drives the final
decision. It's a long road, a long haul, but one step at a time. So, good for you.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Yes. On top of that I do want to state that we
already have those four or five routes but what we really need right at this
moment is for someone to make a decision of what that route is, so we work
MS. EVANS: Yeah. And that's a recorded decision. Here's the other thing that
I've just heads up. They won't decide on any route if you can't guarantee that
Ed Sniffen and his staff is willing to commit for the next ten years, the build out
of it. And if they say we're not going to put it on STIP and we're going to
commit it, you'll never get the recorded decision because they have decided you
don't decide unless you plan on building it. So that's unfortunate, because we had
it ready to go but they said no, we've got other priorities. And so, they wouldn't
decide. So, good luck.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Thank you.
MS. EVANS: But good work. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council Member
Kierkiewicz.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. I'm just thinking how fortunate we are
to have, you know, our current Puna Representative Gregor Ilagan joining us in
Kona but to also hear the perspective of a former legislator, now Council
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Member, Cindy Evans, and just the dynamic of what happens in the state
legislature. So, thank you for that feedback, Cindy.
Rep. Ilagan, I was just thinking about how when you were on the Council, and
you convened the taskforce with former Council Member Danny Paleka to really
take a look at how we might alleviate some of the traffic issues in the Puna
region. I absolutely support your efforts to consider what an alternate route looks
like. But I don't want to lose sight over the fact that that is not going to solve all
of our problems and what we really need to be focused on is more infrastructure
that supports economic development in the region so that we're getting vehicles
off of the road because we continue to be that bedroom community for other
communities.
I just wanted to get crystal clear on what exactly we are tasking the Department of
Public Works to do here. We have our Deputy Malia Kekai. Malia, if I could just
call you forward? Because there's been like a lot of conversations happening
during this meeting, prior to this meeting, around the scope of this project. So,
just want to make sure the department is clear on what the expectations are with
this funding. So, Malia, if you could share with us, what exactly is Public Works
going to do with this funding?
(Note: At this time, Public Works Deputy Director Malia Kekai came
forward to address the members of the Council.)
MS. KEKAL I think our objections at this point are kind of what Greggor had
said. It's like basically looking for the alternate route that's below Highway 130.
That's the scope as I understand it now but we're open to, you know, whatever
the Council and the community think is best.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. So, the scope is pretty clear. We're going to do a
study that identifies options. And each of those options are going to have a
different price tag, different pros and cons, and from there you'll identify, doesn't
matter about cost per se, but you'll identify what is the most appropriate and best
solution for the community.
MS. KEKAL Yeah. Looking at health and safety basically as our main concern
and just seeing, you know, what's the safest route, and then kind of, you know,
weighing pros and cons like you said.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. And I know it's probably going to cost tens of
millions of dollars, so there will be consideration given to how we might phase in
implementing this work. Okay.
One of the things that, you know, came up during Committee, and we've been
trying to resolve with an update to the bill today. But I just don't know if today
we're going to be ready to come up with language that, you know, eases concern
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
of, and rightfully so, members of our community. But there were conversations at
the state legislature and Rep. Ilagan, maybe you can elaborate on this as well
because I've also been in conversations with Representative Chris Todd, who
does have connection and represents the Pana`ewa community. But it's a deal
breaker to have any of this alternate route traffic get funneled into the Pana`ewa
and Keaukaha Homesteads. And so, we're trying to land on language that ensures
that when you come up with your scope of work, that that particular option is off
the table. And I think that would alleviate a lot of concern the community has in
their mind about being the dumping ground of additional traffic. Is that
something you can support of us being very clear about what we want the scope
of this study and options to look like?
MS. KEKAL Yeah. I mean, I think DPW's main concern is you point us in the
right direction and we're the tool to kind of get the study done. So, if it is the
Council's pleasure and the community's pleasure as well, to limit it to a specific
area and exclude other areas, we do not have a problem with that.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay, great. Council Member Lee Loy and I have been
working on amendments to the bill. But I want to give us a little bit more time to
refine the language and make sure that everybody that is potentially impacted by
this is made aware, can weigh in, you know, I certainly want to make sure that the
president of the Pana`ewa/Keaukaha Homestead, Aunty Maile Lu`uwai, is
properly consulted, and that we've also shared this with Kali Watson over at
DHHL. So, I know that there have been communications that have been
transmitted but we are not going to be considering that today. Again, want to
make sure that we're working in partnership with the community as well as our
state representatives to make sure everyone's clear on what exactly we're going to
be doing with this study.
Okay, great. Rep. Ilagan, do you want to chime in at all about this particular issue
we're trying to solve for related to ensuring that traffic does not impact the
Homestead communities of Pana`ewa and Keaukaha?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Of course. Thank you, Council Woman
Kierkiewicz. I want to add in too, the Deputy Director. The main goal is to
decide on the option because of the fact we already have options through our Puna
Connectivity study, what really need is, which I'm not making any decision that's
going to be a particular route. We need the experts to decide at the end of this
study what that route is going to be. And that's going to be taking you into
consideration that we don't impact Pana`ewa Homestead.
And I want to caution this body with regarding your amendment, to exclude all of
DHH Land. The reason why is, I think what we should look into is make sure
DHHL is a partner on the table because we could also look at this opportunity to
create the infrastructure like roads for the housing that's needed in DHHL. We
could look into other benefits that could happen that doesn't drive a road into the
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
community. But excluding and making it black and white limits the
communication and the discussion that we could potentially have during this
study. And I think what we really need to make sure, and I commit to, is that I'm
not driving a road straight into the heart of Pana`ewa Homestead. That's not the
purpose of this study. I went through the state hearings, and I made that pledge to
Pana`ewa Homestead, and I make that same pledge to this body, and that's where
I stand and that's what I will honor. I do want DHHL to be part of the
stakeholders and be part of the discussion because often times when I was in the
Council, we look at only the Council related jurisdiction and we forget that there's
a state entity in this whole matter. This is a great opportunity to bring in the state
infrastructure and properties and everything else the state has. The resources that
they can offer. And we need to take this opportunity to do that with DHHL.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Rep. Ilagan. Seeing that you have tasked the
county with carrying out this plan and this work, I think it is now within our court
to prescribe the scope of this particular study based on the confines you have
described in the bill that the legislature adopted. And so, we absolutely will have
DHHL as a partner at the seat at the table. But they've also made it abundantly
clear during numerous legislative sessions around what they will not stand for.
And so, I'll be collaborating with the council member of that district, Council
Member Lee Loy, on an amendment. And I'll be sure to loop you in as well as
other district colleagues on the state level, as well as DHHL. And so, I'm going
to suggest because this route, this plan, this study, mostly impacts the District 4
community, I encourage my colleagues to move this bill forward to second
reading at which point we will introduce amendments to ensure that everybody is
on the same page with what we are going to do with this study. Thank you, Chair.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Council Member
Evans,just quickly please.
MS. EVANS: Yes. I support Member Kierkiewicz's recommendation. I do
think that DHHL, if the community's already spoken up, we should be very aware
that there was an alternative route study and a lot of money spent to try to do an
alternative route in Waimea. It was going to go through Hawaiian Home Lands.
The Hawaiian Home Lands, they looked to their homesteaders to vote and talk
about what's acceptable to them. They decided they didn't want to have the
alternative route. So, we don't have an alternative route in Waimea. So, you
know, DHHL has its own process of making decisions and I respect that. So, I'm
very supportive of this conversation to amend it so that we get clarity on scope.
But I also encourage Member Kierkiewicz to consider what Member Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder said about when they do study, they should look at the end points and
where it ends up, it's more than just the alternative. It's where do you dump the
people, right, when they come. And this idea, when you do the study, you also
have to look at the intersections and look at where it intersects with your
highways. That has to be, to me,part of the study. And for me, if I was doing
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
this, you know, there's no language in here about building capacity. But that's
kind of the buzzword that the State Department of Transportation loves to use the
word building capacity. So, I think if there's some way you could put that
language in there, they really like to spend money on building capacity instead of
just building new roads. So, anyway, thank you very much. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council Member Lee
Loy, would you wrap us up on this?
MS. LEE LOY: Absolutely. I really appreciate everyone's discussion and
especially for having our distinguished gentlemen from Puna and vice speaker
here. I think you've heard loud and clear; I'm going to continue to signal to this
bill only because I recognize that there's still more work to do. You know, the
focus of this money is for the study. And I think therein lies some of the concern,
right, it's to put traffic on the road to get to Hilo. When the real alternative study
should be what would it look like to put goods and services in Puna so that they
can have education and hospitals and do their shopping in Puna, so all of that
traffic is not headed to Hilo. Like that's the real big opportunity to crack this nut.
You know, and I'm just going to leave it here. We hear testimony all the time but
what continues to resonate with me was something that happened at our last
meeting from 'Ainaaloha Ioane. DHHL, we hapai, we carry everything. We
carry the traffic, we carry the port, we carry the rubbish, we carry the commercial
uses. We hapai all of those things. And this is a call to action that the community
needs to start carrying those responsibilities in their community too. So, for those
reasons I'm going to continue to vote no.
All on board with Council Member Kierkiewicz, I think DHHL has to be at the
table, and I really actually do appreciate the way that vice speaker Ilagan has
dovetailed the money. With this, county actually has skin in the game which
gives us the whole rule to architect what that contract will look like because that's
what our community wants. They want to be able to architect how this rolls out
and it really provides them an opportunity at the seat at the table. So, again,
encouraging my colleagues to continue to move this forward. I will be
respectfully saying no at this time, but I think there will be some place we land at
second reading that'll make everybody happy. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you very much. Very quickly.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yup.
CHR. KIMBALL: Please. I'd like to move on.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Speaking to the landing point for the road,
and I completely understand Council Member Lee Loy because if someone put a
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
road into my community and funneled 20,000 vehicles a day through it, it'd piss
me off. I was reading to the history of the bill for 1403, that's the one that created
the funding for this, correct? Was there not language in that bill that excluded
DHHL, maybe DLNR, I can't remember. Can you speak to that? I thought it was
very clear in that bill how it was laid out.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Of course. So, for those who are not aware, the
bill actually died. So, 1403 went all the way to WAM (Committee on Ways and
Means), so it passed through the house and then went to WAM without the
language included. However, it died.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Why did it die?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Why?
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yeah.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Because as you know, the legislative process is
very hard. It's not easy to pass any sort of bills.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Was it agendized?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: No. It died.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Just died.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Just died.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay.
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: There's no vote. How it dies is it didn't have a
hearing, it wasn't agendized. On this particular matter, it wasn't agendized. So, I
had to figure out a way to still allocate the money. At that time, I was able to
work with our Finance Chair, Sylvia Luke, who helped me insert this language
into the budget. So, the only restriction with this bill is the budget bill. And with
the budget bill, it's below Highway 130, is the language. However, as I stated
before, I'm committed to ensure that this road doesn't impact Pana`ewa. And
what we have before us right now is pretty much part of that funding process in
allocating that$500,000.
I still firmly believe, as Councilwoman Lee Loy said, the County Council is the
closest body in government to the people, and I wanted to ensure we have this
discussion here because bringing a road, even in my community, is not a hundred
percent. You have Hawaiian Paradise Park(HPP), who don't want it to go
through HPP. But you know what I told them, I said I also represent Leilani.
Leilani Estates wants to go through HPP, Nanawale, Kalapana, and all the other
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
communities. So, what I'm asking all the stakeholders regarding this route is let's
come to the table and when it's time to come to these meetings to talk about what
this route is going to be, let's really hash it down and figure out what you want
and what you don't want and let's decide this route finally.
So, we don't know where the endpoint is, Council Member. We don't know
where the beginning point is. But what we do know is we needed another route,
not just to add in another highway on 130, even though we need that too. We just
need to start. And this bill is just saying that this is the portion to start. What we
need to really possibly do to finetune is maybe create a resolution directed to
DPW (Department of Public Works)that before you finish your scoping, come
before the County Council and tell us what the scoping looks like. But this bill
right now is just part of the process of accepting the money and that's what that is.
The scooping is going to be key. And I think that's when we can really have that
robust discussion. That's when we can add in the exclusions. We can bring it
back to the County Council and make sure that we have that conversation. I want
to make sure we do this project right.
I passed this appropriation in 2021 and it's 2023. It's been two years. I'm here
with you to make sure that we go through this process right. That's why I'm
saying this bill right now is just the appropriation of the $500,000. I think what
I'm hearing from everybody here is really what the scope is going to be, and
that's key to making sure this study is successful, and I'd rather spend six months
figuring that out. Whatever time it may be until we get the scope right. But
please don't schedule it during legislative session.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Ilagan. I'm going to
say no today. I think $1.5 million is way too much money to spend on this study.
I really do. And if it's six months and divided $1.5 million by six months, that's a
tremendous amount of dollars per month to be spending on a study. We have
studies, we've done studies, we have a tremendous amount of information built in
our PCDP's (Puna Community Development Plan) connectivity, you name it.
Puna Regional Circulation Plan (PROP), we've been doing studies for 30 years.
It is time for action. I'm not sold that$500,000 required from the County as a
million-dollar match is necessary. And I'm really not sold on this only below
Puna Makai because that bugs me. That's basically drawing a line in the sand in
Puna. And that's not right.
District 4 and District 5 rely on District 3 to get in and out of town. While we
wait for economy building to happen in Kea`au, Mountain View, Pahoa, we're
still all stuck and the only roads in and out are state highways; Highway 11,
Highway 130. I'm going to vote no today for those reasons. I fully support what
you're doing, but as soon as you draw the line and you say, Puna Makai only, that
draws a line for me saying, District 5 is out of the bucket, only District 4. And if
we're doing this to better the whole district of Puna and the whole size of Oahu
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
district, that's been so hard hit in the past few years, that we don't draw lines, we
put everybody together at the same table.
So, I'm going to vote together with Council Member Lee Loy and I'm going to
say no to this. I fully support what you're doing, but I need to make it clear that
District 4 and District 5 are one, and we all use the same road in and out. And
until we address some of those major issues that exist that we haven't touched in a
long, long time, I can't say yes. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder. Council
Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: Thank you. Rep. Ilagan, thank you for being here today. Just on
the definition you gave of Puna Makai, is that a set definition that the state is
using?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: Yes. It's below Highway 130.
MR. INABA: Okay. And where is that defined or how is that being used?
REPRESENTATIVE ILAGAN: It's in the Puna Community Development Plan,
it's in the Puna Connectivity
MR. INABA: Okay. Got it. I'll be in support. Hearing Council Member
Kaneali`i-KI einfelder's concerns, figuring out how we can best help everyone.
But thank you for bringing these funds home. And like you said, first step in
getting these conversations going and spending that time. So, thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Inaba. With that I would like to
proceed to the vote at this time. Reminder that this is a funding bill, so it requires
2/3 majority to pass. Mr. Clerk, can you please do a roll call.
Vote on Bill 107: The motion to pass Bill 107 on first reading and adopt
Failed Finance Committee Report No. 119 failed by the following
roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Inaba, Kagiwada, Kierkiewicz,
and Chair Kimball —4.
Noes: Council Members Evans, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder,
Lee Loy, and Villegas —4.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
(Note: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder and Ms. Villegas voted
"kanalua"then "no.")
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Mr. Clerk. With that, I would suggest that we
take a ten-minute recess. It's now 12:12 p.m. We will reconvene at 12:20 p.m.
Recess: At 12:12 p.m., the Chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 12:27 p.m.
CHR. KIMBALL: Aloha everyone. We are back in session. The time is
12:27 p.m. Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, you have a motion?
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Chair.
Motion to Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to reconsider the vote
Reconsider: taken on Bill 107. Seconded by Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: On the motion to reconsider, Council Member Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. You know, my feelings haven't
changed but there is a need in our community. I'm hoping that what was said
today was heard but I also don't want to jeopardize state funding for such an
important issue. So, with that, thank you for the ability to bring this back to vote.
Yeah, I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder. Council
Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: I'll be supporting this motion to reconsider. You beat me to it.
I appreciate the conversation here. I also have a special appreciation for the
pickle we are often in, in trying to make a statement. But we don't want to bite
off the hand that feeds us. And so, for that reason, I'll be supporting the motion to
reconsider.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion, again, on the motion to
reconsider exclusively. Council Member Kierkiewicz, is your light on? I can't
tell.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: It is on, Chair.
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. I was so disappointed with how the vote went
so I do appreciate this opportunity to have folks to reconsider. This also sends a
message to the State on the County's willingness to collaborate on shared
challenges. And so, please keep in mind with future votes the serious
implications that we have as a County when we vote this way. Thank you.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Any further
discussion on the motion to reconsider? Okay, Mr. Clerk, we will again do a roll
call on this please. Again, we need 2/3 or six out of nine votessorry, motion to
reconsider is a simple majority. Thank you. Go ahead, Mr. Clerk, on the motion
to reconsider.
Vote on Motion to The motion to reconsider the vote taken on Bill 107 was
Reconsider: carried by the following roll call vote:
(Approved)
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. And the motion on the floor is to approve
Bill 107 at first reading. Council Member Lee Loy, I was looking your way, so
you get to go first.
MS. LEE LOY: Well, thank you. I am going to continue to vote against this bill.
I think there's ways to architect a future for us. I'm also reflecting on yesterday's
question to Deanna Sako about our fuel tax money that we have in fund balance.
The money is there, we need to spend it down. Again, I think us having some of
the funds graded in helps us determine that future for us. I just think that there's
ways that I have to provide assurances and guardrails for the community that
continues to carry a lot of this traffic. Again, urging my Council Members to
support this funding while we work out some amendments that really provide
those guardrails for second and final reading. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. Council Member
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. Yeah, I believe what I said was
pretty clear. I'm going to vote yes to this to make sure it moves forward. I know
that the funding is needed. I know that we need alternate routes out of Puna. I am
still absolutely clear in making my point that there's no boundaries in aloha, but
we get plenty boundaries being discussed in what we're talking about today. We
have to encompass, and we have to view Puna wholistically as we all have one
way in and out. As soon as we say "my, only this, only one area,"we start to
specify down, we start to draw lines. When we draw lines, we start to segregate
community. That's not useful. So, I'll vote yes to keep this moving. I hope to
see some amendments and some ways to make this all inclusive of the entire area
of Puna, not just one side. Thank you.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder. Council
Member Evans and then Council Member Villegas.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. I'm going to be supporting this because the colleagues
who represent that area of Hawaii Island believe that this is really the right thing
to do for them, and I assume sometime in the future I may have something in my
district dealing with transportation, highways, and mass transit, and ask for
support. But I will say this, I believe this discussion was really healthy, and I'm
looking forward also to the amendments. I think they sound like really good ideas
to amend it, to have more clarity to the County. And I do strongly urge a
conversation with the congressional delegation, Jill Tokuda, Ed Sniffen, the
Public Works Director, and our new Managing Director about what they expect
from the federal government and the state government in supporting even funding
the building of a road like this and what that process is because, you know, having
more studies and more plans and building expectation, and then not being able to
deliver is really tough on the community also. So, I encourage you,please have
those conversations. Thank you. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council Member
Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: I share the sentiments of my colleague, Mr. Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder, and the separation of and asking for the unification of, and the
consideration of a more wholistic approach, and terminology utilized. I will be
voting in support of this with the intentionality of moving things forward and with
the belief that the opportunity to work collaboratively with the State and get this
project moving, literally, and to provide the safe roads, routes, access, evacuation,
everything that's needed in that portion of the island suffering under a number of
different traffic constraints and backups myself in District 7.
But I also want to state for the record my unwavering support of the people in
Keaukaha and their decades of enduring environmental racism and environmental
injustice in the amount of issues that have been laid at their feet, or on their
shoulders, or dumped on their heads, or right into their waters, or whatever the
case may be. And so, asking for an equitable designation of this route that
authentically takes into consideration everyone affected and defines the highest,
greatest outcome with the least amount of damage, and taking into consideration
the community that has shouldered that historically. And it's unjust, unfair, and
unacceptable. And with that, I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Alright, with that we'll proceed
to the vote. Mr. Clerk, roll call please.
Page 38
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Vote on Bill 107: The motion to pass Bill 107 on first reading and adopt
(Approved) Finance Committee Report No. 119 was carried by the
following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Villegas,
and Chair Kimball —7.
Noes: Council Member Lee Loy — 1.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
Relinquish Chair: At this time, Chair Kimball relinquished the chair to Acting
Chair Inaba.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Let the record reflect at 12:37 p.m., I have assumed the
Chair, and we will take Resolution 369 first.
STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business,
FROM THE Statements from the Public.
PUBLIC ON
RES. 369-23 The following individuals registered to speak and came forward when called by
(COMM. 617): the Chair:
Ryan Naka: In support.
Les Estrella: In support.
(representing Going Home Hawaii)
Res. 369-23: AUTHORIZES THE OFFICE OF HOUSING AND COMMUNITY
DEVELOPMENT TO AWARD FUNDS TO VARIOUS NONPROFIT
ORGANIZATIONS FOR PROGRAMS ADDRESSING HOUSING AND
HOMELESSNESS
Proposes 22 grant awards to 13 different nonprofit organizations for a total of
$9,794,459.33 in funding that was derived from Tier Two property tax revenues.
Reference: Comm. 617
Intr. by: Mr. Inaba(B/R)
Approve: LAAC-45
(Note: Comm. 617.3, from Housing Administrator Susan Kunz dated
December 11, 2023, transmitting an updated summary of proposals selected for
funding from the Homelessness and Housing fund, was circulated.)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to adopt Res. 369-23 and
Legislative Approvals and Acquisitions Committee Report
No. 45. Seconded by Ms. Villegas.
Page 39
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
ACTING CHR. INABA: We do have Specialist Hirota here in Kona Chambers.
Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, go ahead.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you for being here today, Ms. Hirota.
I do have one question from someone who is perturbed in our community about
one of our awards. I'll ask you the question that came in from them. One of our
organizations who received funding is in charge of doing a study or taking a count
of numbers and things like that of the programs themselves, it sounds like. It was
directed at the Neighborhood Place of Puna and the coordination of. Did you
receive that email from Ms. Regina Weller?
(Note: At this time, Housing and Community Development Specialist VI
Sharon Hirota came forward to address the members of the Council.)
MS. HIROTA: I've received it. Yes.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yes.
MS. HIROTA: Our office received it.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Can you speak to that a little bit? I
mean, she was saying something along the lines of conflict of interest, but I
wanted to ask your department, you know, how you guys felt about that.
MS. HIROTA: Okay. Sharon Hirota. I work for the Office of Housing and
Community Development(OHCD). I'm the Division Manager for the
Community Engagement Division. So, I believe what you're asking me is about
the data management system that we've set up. There's currently, under contract
work, the County's under contract with Neighborhood Place of Puna to manage
their data collection system for two programs: the Homeless and Housing Fund
and the Emergency Rent Assistance Program. We've been using Streak, which is
the software to track data for multiple programs since various natural disasters.
Initially our office had intentions of using the homeless information services
system that the state and federal government uses to track their data. As we did
more research, what we found was the system wasn't flexible enough to make
changes based on our funding and the organizations were funded. So, we went
back and looked at our options. Streak, the software, has worked well in the
delivery and collection of data. And so, we currently, it's on contract, as I've
said, we need Neighborhood Place of Puna to help the county design, to allow a
seamless and easy way for the funded organizations to report their outcomes.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Okay, that's helpful. Thank you.
Okay, Chair, I yield.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Council Member Evans. And I also want
to point out that the Office of Housing and Community Development did submit
an additional communication in our pinkies, (Comm.) 617.3, that shows how the
awarded projects and organizations line up with the plan that was presented to the
Council, I believe last year. So, the right-side column shows the priority within
the plan. Go ahead, Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: I have a question. You have that system that's going to be able to
track outcomes. Will it break down by the regions or the districts, so we know?
And the only reason I'm asking that is my community has asked me, can you
determine how much comes to our area because so much of this is island wide. I
mean, it's like a lumpsum that's an island wide. So, how do we know that it gets
out into our region of the island?
MS. HIROTA: So, part of the collection data is if the individual receiving
services is willing to share the zip code in which they are either unsheltered in or
unstably housed in.
MS. EVANS: So, you have transitional housing, Salvation Army, $213,000,
island wide? So, there's no way to know how it's impacting people that live
around the island?
MS. HIROTA: So, we'll know by the—we're tracking outcomes for the
individuals' receiving services.
MS. EVANS: Okay.
MS. HIROTA: So we ask them information in regards to their housing
composition including zip code in terms of areas that you frequent. So, what
areas, so we would be able to report that.
MS. EVANS: Okay.
MS. HIROTA: So, for example, if you mention Salvation Army and the work
with their youth. If the youth calls Kohala home, then they would enter that
particular zip code, and that's how we would be able to extrapolate should
someone want that information.
MS. EVANS: Okay. So I would love to have that information. So, I don't know
offline, how I could come in your office, but clearly my community wants to
know when we give out this money how does it impact people that live in their
community.
MS. HIROTA: Correct. So, for the initial funding that started in May of this
year, we're starting to collect that information and we will bring back to the
Council our results. So, we're still trying to massage and get the reports out.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. EVANS: Excellent. And just one quick question. Was there quite a few
people disqualified? I'm assuming some people didn't make the cut because they
didn't maybe fill out the form right, they didn't meet your criteria, was there
people that did not qualify or what would you call it, disqualified?
ACTING CHR. INABA: I believe she's speaking to the applicants for the
funding.
MS. HIROTA: So, there were 31 responses to our request for proposal (RFP).
We had $10 million total to expand. So, there was a committee of six individuals
that ranked a rate. Of the 31, none of the proposals were deemed ineligible. So,
they were all in the pool of rank and rating, and based on the rank and rating we
were able to fund the 22 that we're presenting today until we run out of money.
So, yes, there are nine responses received that are not going to get funded.
MS. EVANS: Okay. I have more questions, but I'll talk to you offline. Thank
you.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Council Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you for being here, Ms. Hirota. And thank you to my
colleague, Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, for starting the line of questioning tackling
the elephant in the room. My first question is when was the contract awarded to
Mr. Norman and the Neighborhood Place of Puna to be the data contractor?
MS. HIROTA: That was awarded in September 2023.
MS. VILLEGAS: So, I saw you looking at it. That's included then, here, and
considered the coordinated center program and the pathways to exons and
practice?
MS. HIROTA: That's separate. The data collections building up their data
collection system, it's a separate contract.
MS. VILLEGAS: Separate contract. Was an RFP put out for that contract?
MS. HIROTA: We were able to get approval from the Governor's office because
the contract started in September, and it was to help us collect data for contracts
that started back in May. So, there was this urgency to get this start up and
running, yes.
MS. VILLEGAS: Are you aware of the challenges being raised by the way that's
being managed by this contractor for potential HIPAA (Health Insurance
Portability and Accountability Act)violations and what is being required for
participants or recipients of these other grants?
Page 42
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. HIROTA: It's been brought to our attention, and we are working with our
contractor and those that have concerns to address those, yes.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Member Villegas, and then I just want to point
out that Deputy Sylvia Wan is in our Hilo Chambers if there's any housing legal
related questions.
MS. VILLEGAS: Okay, great. Thank you, Chair. Well, unfortunately I don't
feel confident that they're going to get through these HIPAA violations.
(Note: At this time, Deputy Corporation Counsel Sylvia Wan came
forward to address the members of the Council.)
MS. WAN: I'm sorry. I do kind of want to kind of interject because the contract
wasn't for them to collect the data. The contract was for them to develop the data
management system.
MS. VILLEGAS: Then why are they in fact asking the awardees of the grants for
that data and requiring them to provide it.
MS. WAN: They're not the ones requiring the input of data. It's Housing that's
requiring the grantees to input the data. The Office of Housing is the owner of the
data. I do have Susan Kunz here who could actually answer this question more
directly. The questions that were put forward in the email, which I do not believe
Sharon was 100 percent prepared to answer. But we do understand, and we've
looked through those particular concerns, and Neighborhood Place of Puna is not
managing anybody else's data. The only data that they input into that system is
their own.
MS. VILLEGAS: Well, that is not the way it's being communicated to grantees,
and I have been notified by a number of grantees that that's what they're being
asked for, and that's their concern. But I'm going to move on because I have a
couple more questions. I just need these questions to be public and out on the
record.
MS. WAN: I understand. I just don't want you to be misinformed because there
are some assumptions that were made in those questions that were not correct. I
believe there's some misunderstanding, rather some misinformation that are
predicating those particular questions. And so, I'd really rather this Council give
the opportunity to Ms. Kunz to explain what is actually be required from the
grantees and who is actually managing that data that the county is collecting, that
Housing is collecting.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Hang on. Council Member Villegas,
would you like Administrator Kunz to share a response to these concerns that
were sent through the email?
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. VILLEGAS: Sure.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Alright. Administrator Kunz.
(Note: At this time, Housing Administrator Susan Kunz came forward to
address the members of the Council.)
MS. KUNZ: Hi, good morning, everyone. My name is Susan Kunz. I'm the
Housing Administrator for the Office of Housing. So, thank you very much for
giving me this opportunity to try and share a little bit more information to make
sure that there is a clear understanding about what we are contracting, who we are
contracting, and what we're asking them to do.
You know, the County Council was very clear that they wanted the Office of
Housing to create a data management system to report the performance of these
funds that we are administering and awarding to service providers. We have
contracted with the Neighborhood Place of Puna to create a data system and a
public facing dashboard so that anyone can enter the system and take a look at
any time, real time, information about the performance of the work that we're
doing.
The Neighborhood Place of Puna, in their efforts, right, created a system. They
have been offering assistance to those service providers who are having trouble
entering the data into the system themselves. So, I've been informed of this. But
it is not a requirement for them to turn in the data to the Neighborhood Place of
Puna. In fact, they are trying to actually train the service providers to enter the
data themselves. That is the best-case scenario. Neighborhood Place of Puna, as
an awardee, is also entering their own performance data into the system.
Paul Norman does not have access to this data. He cannot manipulate the data.
There are very strict firewalls that are created within the system to make sure that
this doesn't happen. We're very aware of this, you know, but they've done,
they've shown a lot of experience in the work that they've done to run the
Emergency Rent Assistance Program, which is still up and running. And they've
also done really good work in collecting the data for all of the disaster recovery
efforts that Hawaii County has done starting way back in 2014 with Iselle, 2018
lava, right, COVID (Coronavirus Disease). So, there's a lot of experience there
that we wanted to take advantage of.
I hope I'm answering your questions and trying to provide you with information
to clarify the misinformation.
MS. WAN: Deputy Corporation Counsel Sylvia Wan. I'll just note for Council
that the data management contract that was previously awarded, which created
that system, is not on the resolution today. That was a contract that had already
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
been awarded and I believe for all intents and purposes is pretty much done. The
only portion of that contract that is still left is that additional training that
Neighborhood Place of Puna is providing to other service providers in order to
show them how to correctly input the data into the system. It's not about the
management side at all. All of that data is owned by the County, and they have
nothing to do with collecting or otherwise managing that data. So, I just wanted
to make that clear that that contract is not on this resolution. And I understand
that that email made it seem like it was because it misconstrued what is on the
resolution today, which is the Pathways to Excellence and Practice, which is a
completely different program. It has nothing to do with data at all.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Council Member Villegas, you have the
floor.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you for your attempt to clarify those things. The
definitions listed under the summary of the projects. Listed for Neighborhood
Place of Puna, as their coordination center and Pathways to Excellence and
Practice, the terminology utilized definitely lends to confusion and questioning.
Unfortunately, the constituents in my district continually look at the millions of
dollars being allocated to help those that are encountering homelessness,
houselessness. We see that money being allocated disproportionately to
organizations that have a history of not fulfilling authentic obligations to helping
solve the issues. We see forerunners, condos, and people falling through the
cracks.
I continue to say for the number of people that we report are houseless on this
island, the amount of money we're spending, it's ridiculous. It does not add up.
I'm consistently frustrated. I don't understand how an organization can get a
contract to manage a data program and then also be awardees for the grants that
that information is going in to. That just feels like double dipping and it feels like
an unwise alignment, especially when that organization has a history of calling
the ACLU (American Civil Liberties Union) specifically on our county for
outreaches that happened to help mitigate the issues happening in the parks in my
district, making false accusations and bringing under state scrutiny,potential
national scrutiny, by the ACLU, which thwarted efforts and months of work
between community policing, and our houseless outreach programs there.
I wish we could find a way just a little more leeway, I'll finish here. I wish I
could find a way to feeling comfortable with this but there are too many red flags
streaming. One of them being also something that's in the contract that's a
requirement for grantees to participate in three meetings a month all under the
direction of Mr. Paul Norman. And I consistently see an inadequate, influential,
and disproportionate allocation of resources, authority and perceived
accountability by other grantees to certain organizations that tend to monopolize
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
the millions of dollars that we are providing to help rectify an issue that is close to
my heart. And with that, I yield.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Villegas. Heading over to
Hilo. Council Member Kierkiewicz, anything at this time?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair, in light of Council Member Villegas' comments, I
did want to provide an opportunity to Housing to respond. And I just want to
remind the body, while this is very important information for us to be dissecting,
what we have before us is the resolution to award funds for certain programs
relating to dealing with houseless individuals on our island, which is separate
from a contract to build a data management system and a dashboard that we asked
for, which I think is very important. It's very important because we want to know
the return on our investment because this is a program that we set out that sunsets
within five years. So, the data, the impact, what we're seeing on the ground, very
important. But, you know, there was a lot that was said there, and Administrator
Kunz, I do want to provide you the opportunity to respond.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Briefly please. Thank you.
MS. KUNZ: Thank you very much. So, let me get my head straight about
because there was a lot that was said there. First, I want to point out to the
Council Members that the Office of Housing has been administering federal grant
programs for many, many years successfully. We have a lot of track record in
doing contracts and keeping service providers accountable to the work that is laid
out in the scope of services in those contracts and for the money that we're
awarding. We use the same protocols when we're administering the county's
program. We issue contracts with scopes of work and dollar amounts that match
up to a budget that was presented by the service provider. We do fiscal
monitoring of all of the expenditures in the award, and we also do programmatic
monitoring annually in addition to all of this performance reporting.
So, I can only speak to contracts that I have awarded to these service providers. I
cannot speak to awards that they have received from other federal, state, or
private donors. What they are doing with those funds or how those are being
administered or managed, I cannot speak to. But I can definitely assure you that
the monies we are awarding are being spent for the purpose that's laid out in these
contracts. We will make sure of that.
So, the other comment about these required meetings that were listed in the draft
grant agreement. So, what we recently did, because of the timing of today's
meeting, getting approval, and needing to get contracts in place for January 1st, we
sent out drafts of the agreement to the service providers so that they can get a
head start on reading through some of the things that we were proposing. And we
did. We asked for feedback.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
I believe the particular program that Council Member Villegas is referring to is
called Pathways to Excellence. This particular program is definitely listed in this
resolution so I would like to address that. This program was originally presented
by the state, DHS (Department of Human Services), Homeless Programs Office,
and it was to a statewide group of providers that they were presenting it a national
best practice. So, there was a lot of discussion about the success of running a
program like this. And my understanding is that Neighborhood Place of Puna
took the lead on this to create a program for Hawaii County. This program, you
know, in very simple terms is a convening of service providers who provide
services and address homelessness. It's meant to be a support group for these
providers who are doing this work in Hawaii County, and it also has workforce
development components. I've said this before, but this work is really, really
hard. It's very hard, and we lose staff often and we can't replace them. People
get burnt out. But the focus of this group and convening is to support each other,
tell other what's going on, are there other resources, can we share? And that is
really the purpose of this.
At the moment, it is listed in the grant agreement as a requirement because we
really want to make sure that we're sharing information with each other. I think
it's difficult to be out there with this pot of money doing this work, operating by
yourself. So, we're encouraging people to participate in this.
There are several other meetings that we also listed in the grant agreement. We
are highly encouraging folks to participate in the Community Alliance Partners
group, the CAP. It is not a requirement, but we highly encourage that, and that's
what the grant agreement says. Currently, Paul Norman is the Chair of this group,
and he was voted in by the group members. So, it is an elected position. It is a
requirement by HUD (Housing and Urban Development) that the Hawai`i County
has this group, but it's not required by the homeless and housing fund that you
have to be a partner in it. But I think it's great for sharing again, and sharing
supporting each other.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. If you would please summarize.
MS. KUNZ: Yes. Thank you. Thank you for your time.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Member Kierkiewicz.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. I'm going to be supporting this
resolution. You know, you mentioned earlier, Administrator Kunz, that this work
in the field, it's hard work. There's a lot of burn out. There's a lot of folks that
are coming in and out of this work because of just the emotional toll that it has on
someone. And so, I want to extend our partners in the community that are willing
to go out into the field and to do this work, a little bit of grace. I also understand
that this is a new program. You've had about a year now to implement, we're in
implementing the second round of funding.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Really want to see that dashboard set up so we can see performance because, you
know, Council Member Villegas is right, we're seeing a growing problem in
community, and we're throwing a lot of now County's money at the situation, and
we've been patient. But we really need to see results, right? Because at some
point we need to make a decision, are we going to continue to spend county
dollars on a situation that really the state and our federal partners need to be
dedicating more funding to. Thank you for being here. Chair, I yield.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Bringing it back here to Kona. Council
Member Kagiwada.
MS. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Chair. I'll be supporting this resolution. And
thank you so much for all your hard work at the Office of Housing and
Community Development. You know, I don't agree necessarily with the
strategies of every single one of these groups particularly, but that's okay. I think
that, you know, the office is doing the best they can and they're allocating money
across the county in the best way they see fit.
What I really do like, and which seems to be very much what is talked about
nationally, is being a successful strategy is this coordinated systems approach.
And I think it's so important that that's going to give us a bigger bang for our
buck. Even though it's not direct service, it's so important to keep people talking,
moving from I'll just quote here from the National Programs to End Homeless,
"that moving from a collection of individual programs to a community wide
response that is strategic, and data driven." But that's where we need to be going.
We've been doing the kind of scatter shot, you know, trying to address in many
different ways, but the coordinated approach really is very important, I think, for
tackling this very difficult issue that has not been tackled successfully in very
many places around the world. Places like Houston where they are having
success and Austin, they are doing a more coordinated approach. And I think we
need to learn from these strategies and do the best we can, and I think you are
doing that. So, thank you. And thank you for funding some of this work that is
so important for us to see success. I yield.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: So, I'm going to assume it's going to pass. Will you be writing a
lumpsum check in the amount that I'm seeing? Is that what happens? And when
would they get the check, and what is the year they have to expend it? Usually,
these you have to spend the "x" amount and then they give you their receipts.
How are you going to—how's this money going to go out the door?
MS. HIROTA: So, the proposed agreement allows for 40 percent payment
upfront. For those that are starting new programs, there's personnel costs that
need to be fronted and paid upfront. So, we allow 40 percent upfront, and
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
thereafter a reimbursement after they show proof that they spent down the initial
allocation. And then thereafter, it's monthly reimbursements.
MS. EVANS: Okay. And when do they have to have it spent by?
MS. HIROTA: So, there's two contract periods. There are ten proposals that
have a start date of January 1st and run for twelve months. And there are contracts
that will start May 1, 2024, and run through the end of the calendar year.
MS. EVANS: Okay. Thank you. I yield.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Alright. Council Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: And first off, I want to point out in some comments made from
the Hilo Chambers, you know, the difference between encouraging and requiring.
Encouraging people to attend the meeting and participate is very different than
requiring. And I'm hearing different versions being reflected in different
components of this contract. To me, that's concerning.
Community Alliance Partners, from when I first got into office, unfortunately, has
a reputation of historic nepotism, and that is what I continually hear from my
community. It's widely believed that at this point, serving the houseless
community is an industry that people have based careers on. It's questionable
whether or not people really want to work themselves out of a career. And the
competition to protect their own funding for their own organization often times
borderline unethical.
In this particular circumstance, I'll put on my big girl panties and have the
courage to say that Mr. Norman has too much power. And we're putting too
much power in specific organizations, and it allows for colonialism and nepotism
in an arena that we can't afford to have that in. I also want to state the reminder
that while data is really helpful, the organizations that work from a human driven
standpoint with data being the follow up, versus let's sit in offices at computers
and follow the data and create reports. While all that has to be done, the primary
focal point needs to be the human element, meeting the people where they're at in
the streets or in our parks.
The taxpayers are funding these programs. It's our taxpayers' dollars being
allocated to housing and then allocated to grantees and awardees. I would like to
believe that everybody's doing the best that they can and if that is the case, it's
not good enough. There are too many loopholes in this, and I'm just really
frustrated. I support the work of the organizations. I've sat with a number of
them and heard their challenges. You know, as you've stated earlier, Ms. Hirota,
nobody was denied, but only a certain number were funding based on a numerical
system of judgement, I question who the six people were that were included in
this group because it is human nature to prioritize and give—it just is. People do
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
business with people they know and like, and they understand and have
relationships with. And I hear from a number of organizations on the island that
don't feel like they're getting their fair shake because there is so much incestuous
happening.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Council Member Villegas, I do want to move us along
and take the vote, however it may be.
MS. VILLEGAS: Okay.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you.
MS. VILLEGAS: I'm going to protest vote on this today,just for the sake of I
don't think that we areI think we need to do better. And so, I understand my
colleagues will be voting in support, and I'm grateful for that because it allows
me the opportunity to have a protest vote here. And so, with that, I yield.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Thank you. Council Member Kimball.
MS. KIMBALL: Thank you, Vice Chair Inaba. We started off this meeting
today and I think Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder talked about being glad
that we had a process and a protocol, and it is important that we have a process
and a protocol. And what I would like to remind my colleagues is we need to be
careful with making accusations that we are not certain of, especially with respect
to certain members of the public. And so, I would suggest that we have tools and
protocols at our disposal to get to the veracity of any of these particular claims,
particularly the audit process, and would encourage my colleagues to utilize that
tool, you know, if there are genuine concerns about misuse of funds. That is a
procedural tool that we have in our toolbox and would recommend that rather
than deliberation of that particular nature in front of the body.
That said, I did want to actually weigh in specifically on the matter of the
meetings and the collaboration, and I would share Council Member Kagiwada's
position that the coordinated effort is something that has been proven to be critical
to success in other areas, and she gave the examples of Houston and Austin, and
it's just so important that there's not a duplication of services. And so, having
everybody talk to each other I think is really important to success. So,just
wanted to make those two comments. I will be supporting the measure moving
forward. Thank you. I yield.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Any further discussion? If not, I know that these
awards right now, some run the full calendar year, some run half the year next
year. Do we plan to get it on a fiscal year operation, Administrator Kunz?
MS. KUNZ: Our plan is to get it on a calendar year actually. So, the first round
of funds were awarded in May of 2023, and that contract goes all the way through
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
to April. So, with this second round of funds, if an organization is getting a
second-round award, their contracts will go from May 2024 to December 2024. If
they are a new awardee, we're hoping to start contracts in January of 2024 and
run it through the end of the year. So by next year, we will have all of the service
providers in a calendar year term. That's our goal.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Is there a reason why we did it on a calendar year
instead of a fiscal year with our budget? I'm only asking this now because I'm
reviewing this communication we got and I'm then seeing the terms of the
contract.
MS. KUNZ: Right, the reason why we decided to do the calendar is because the
fiscal year starts in July; that's when we get the awards so we can start the RFP
(Request for Proposal)process at that time. And because it takes us several
months to do the RFP, give people time to respond, give our teams time to rank
and rate, it really is towards the end of the year when we can make these awards.
And that's the timing that you're seeing right now. And that's the reason why we
wanted to start the contracts in January. The main this is that we get all of them
on the same term. It's really difficult to have some of them sporadically, you
know, with sporadic terms. It's very hard to manage performance.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Yeah, okay. I did have a quick conversation with, I
guess is she still Deputy Director Nakagawa, about—
MS.
boutMS. KIERKIEWICZ: Kona, we cannot hear you.
ACTING CHR. INABA: We have some issues. We're back. Okay. Hilo, you
can hear us?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yes, we can.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Alright. Yeah, I did share some concern about that. I
mean we do have our own grant program here in the Council and we operate on a
fiscal year, and it helps at least when we review the budget, keeping funds from
within one fiscal year, well I guess within one contract within one fiscal year. So,
I will circle back with you folks on that offline. And then for these meetings, the
participation community of practice events, is that something that was provided
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Kona, you are frozen.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Testing, testing.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: We can hear you now.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Yeah. So, is that something that was provided as part
of the RFP so that those applying knew that they'd be having to commit, you
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
know, three days a month for all of these things listed in Number 9 of their draft
contract.
MS. KUNZ: Hi, this is Susan. So, my understanding and I might ask Sharon to
chime in to correct me if I'm wrong. But the Committee of Practice convenings
are quarterly meetings. The Pathways to Excellence, I believe, are monthly
meetings.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Sorry, we're going to be on a quick recess. We have
audio problems. Okay, we're going to just continue as fast and best as we can.
So, yes, was it provided in the RFP so that organizations knew they'd be having
to engage in these practice events?
MS. KUNZ: If Sharon can answer that question. I don't have the RFP in front of
me, so I am not exactly sure to be honest.
MS. HIROTA: So, we'll talk about the Committee of Practice and the Committee
of Engagement. So, there's I think in the draft agreement, as Administrator Kunz
said, it was put out to the 10. We had sent it out in anticipation of hopefully
positive optimism that the resolution was going to pass. So,people had the
opportunity to review it and give us feedback. So, the first one that's on the list is
a County-hosted quarterly Committee of Practice. I think when we initially talked
about this grant, I talked about bringing all of the grantees together to share about
their work through a collaborative event so we could figure out who was doing
what in what neighborhoods, and we weren't duplicating. Those meetings
ACTING CHR. INABA: I just wanted to restate the question? Was it in the RFP
when they applied so that they knew they would have to be engaging in these
things listed under number 9?
MS. HIROTA: So, the only one that was listed was the Committee of Practice.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Okay. So, I just want to state being that we all just got
to see the agreement today, when we do put out RFP's if we can let them know
any kind of meetings because it's been pointed out that for some organizations,
who have maybe bigger staff, they're able to send someone. But if they're a
smaller organization, they might not have the human resources to be allocating so
many days a month to attend some of these meetings. I would just make that
statement for future RFP's.
And then, can we please get a copy of each of the agreements and Exhibit B, I'm
assuming based on the copy we got, which shows the scope of work for each of
these organizations we're giving funding. Because we know what the summary
of the project is, but we don't really have a clue here as to what the outcomes are
going to be for the amount of money that they're getting here. Is that something
we can get after they're finalized?
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. WAN: Deputy Corporation Counsel Sylvia Wan. I just want to clarify.
You're asking for a copy of the agreements after they're finalized?
ACTING CHR. INABA: The agreement is what I mean, I'm looking at a draft
agreement here that has all of the amounts as well as the exhibit that shows the
scope. So I'm seeing the agreement, but if there's another document that can be
provided that gives us an idea of what we're getting for the amount of money that
we're sending out then that would be fine.
MS. WAN: Yes. So, unfortunately what was circulated was not ready for prime
time because it was literally a draft. It was circulated to give the organizations an
opportunity to have their legal staff, if they have legal staff, review, and provide
comments. So, it could be adjusted and changed. But yes, it's a form agreement
so if you want the finalized agreement once everything has been put together and
finalized and everybody's signed off, then yes. We can provide a copy of the
agreements after they're finalized.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Yes, either that or the scope by itself is fine. You folks
are in charge of the contracting but at least we can have a clear understanding of
what we're getting for the amount of funding that we're approving via this
resolution. And then lastly, Corporation Counsel Strance, for these awards, we're
approving a resolution because they're an excess of$25,000 for nonprofits. But
I'm wondering because we're doing funding across fiscal years, does the
resolution need to be amended to include a contract that extends over multiple
fiscal years?
(Note: At this time, Corporation Counsel Elizabeth Strance came forward
to address the members of the Council.)
MS. STRANCE: Good afternoon. Elizabeth Strance, Corporation Counsel. I
have not specifically looked at that particular issue and whether the resolution,
would it be deemed to have addressed that regardless.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Okay. Deputy Wan, do you have any insight there? I
guess that's kind of my concern with the funding going on the calendar year.
Should these resolutions be also authorizing a contract of funds for more than one
fiscal year?
MS. WAN: If I were to answer that today I would be going purely off of my gut
feeling, and I'd much rather look at the Code again. But my understanding is I
think the goal was to have most of these contracts spend down all of their monies
by June, or rather encumber all of their monies by the end of the fiscal year. So,
that was my understanding of the general intent. But I can definitely look into
that. My understanding also is that they're not multi-year contracts so the funds
would be coming from one fiscal year.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
ACTING CHR. INABA: Administrator Kunz, can you share, I mean, are they for
more than one fiscal year? Perhaps I should ask that question first.
MS. KUNZ: No. So, I agree with what Corporation Counsel Wan is saying.
ACTING CHR. INABA: So, the six-month contracts before us in this resolution
are 2024-2025 fiscal year funds? And then anything that's a contract that starts in
January but ends in December of next year, we are sectioning out.
MS. KUNZ: So, what we're awarding today through this resolution is a fiscal
year 2024 funds. We received these funds July lst
ACTING CHR. INABA: But the contract extends past July 1st of next year. I just
want to make sure I'm understanding.
MS. WAN: Yes. But the funds are only coming from this year. It's not
borrowing from next year.
ACTING CHR. INABA: So we're not spending everything then,prior to June
30th? The plan is to have a carry over, put the fund balance into the next fiscal
year then we put—
MS.
utMS. WAN: I believe what purchasing usually requires is that they encumber. I
can work out those details with Finance on that. But my understanding is that for
these particular contracts the funds that OHCD (Office of Housing and
Community Development) would be encumbering would be only from the present
fiscal year.
ACTING CHR. INABA: Alright. With that, then I'll just say, reaffirming my
point, that I'd rather have it in a fiscal year because it gets confusing for us to
keep track. So, I'll follow up with you folks and Ms. Nakagawa offline. And
thank you again for being here today in chambers, Ms. Hirota and Administrator
Kunz, Deputy Wan. Any further discussion? If not, there's a motion on the floor
to approve Resolution 369-23. All those in favor? Yes, sorry. Roll call vote
please, Mr. Clerk.
Vote on Res. 369-23: The motion to adopt Res. 369-23 and Legislative
(Adopted) Approvals and Acquisitions Committee Report No. 45 was
carried by the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Kimball,
Lee Loy, and Acting Chair Inaba–7.
Noes: Council Member Villegas – 1.
Absent: Council Member Galimba– 1.
Excused: None.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Relinquish Chair: At this time, Acting Chair Inaba relinquished the chair to
Chair Kimball.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Please let the record reflect that I've reassumed
the Chair at the time of 1:33 p.m. With that, Mr. Clerk, let's just start and go
down in order from here.
Return to Order The Chair directed the Council to return to the order of business.
of Business:
ORDER OF The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Order of
RESOLUTIONS: Resolutions.
(Note: Items in this category were taken up previously, out of order.)
Res. 358-23: AWARDS A PUBLIC ACCESS, OPEN SPACE, AND NATURAL RESOURCES
PRESERVATION MAINTENANCE FUND STEWARDSHIP GRANT TO
NA MAMO O KAWA
Approves a grant of$123,788 to Na Mamo O Kawa, a 501(c)(3)nonprofit
organization, to continue providing land stewardship and cultural education for
properties in Kawa, Hilea Nui, and Ka`alaiki (Tax Map Keys: 9-5-016:006, 025
and 9-5-017:005, 007),pursuant to Section 10-16(h) of the Hawaii County Charter.
Reference: Comm. 592
Intr. by: Ms. Galimba
Approve: LAAC-44
Vote on Res. 358-23: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Res. 358-23 and Legislative
(Adopted) Approvals and Acquisitions Committee Report No. 44.
Seconded by Mr. Inaba and carried by the following voice
vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Page 55
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Res. 373-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO NORTH KOHALA
COMMUNITY RESOURCE CENTER TO ASSIST WITH EXPENSES
RELATED TO THE MAINTENANCE OF EXERCISE EQUIPMENT AT THE
IKUO HISAOKA GYMNASIUM IN KAPA`AU
Transfers $4,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 9); and credits to the Department of Parks and Recreation,
Administration Other Current Expenses account.
Reference: Comm. 629
Intr. by: Ms. Evans
Motion to Approve: Ms. Evans moved to adopt Res. 373-23. Seconded by
Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: I ask for your support of health and wellness.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Any further discussion?
Seeing none, all those in favor please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 373-23: The motion to adopt Res. 373-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 374-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT FOR THE 2024 SUMMER FUN PROGRAM AT THE
NA`ALEHU COMMUNITY CENTER
Transfers $4,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 6); and credits to the Department of Parks and Recreation,
Summer/Intersession Class/Activities account.
Reference: Comm. 630
Intr. by: Ms. Galimba
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Vote on Res. 374-23: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Res. 374-23. Seconded by
(Adopted) Mr. Inaba and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 375-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT FOR THE 2024 SUMMER FUN PROGRAM AT THE
PAHALA COMMUNITY CENTER
Transfers $4,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 6); and credits to the Department of Parks and Recreation,
Summer/Intersession Class/Activities account.
Reference: Comm. 631
Intr. by: Ms. Galimba
Vote on Res. 375-23: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Res. 375-23. Seconded by
(Adopted) Mr. Inaba and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 376-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO MALAMA O PUNA TO
ASSIST WITH FUNDING YOUTH ENGAGEMENT EVENTS FOR KEA`AU
MIDDLE SCHOOL IN THE 2023-2024 SCHOOL YEAR
Transfers $1,500 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 5); and credits to the Department of Liquor Control, Public
Programs account.
Reference: Comm. 632
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Approve: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to adopt Res. 376-23.
Seconded by Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member.
MR. KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: Very briefly,just mahalo Ms. Eileen O'Hara
for being here this morning and providing positive testimony. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in
favor please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 376-23: The motion to adopt Res. 376-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 377-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO THE HAWAII ISLAND
VETERANS MEMORIAL INC. TO ASSIST WITH EXPENSES TO DISPLAY
THE WALL THAT HEALS, A MOBILE REPLICA OF THE VIETNAM
VETERANS MEMORIAL LOCATED IN WASHINGTON, D.C.
Transfers $2,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 8); and credits to the Department of Parks and Recreation,
Administration Other Current Expenses account.
Reference: Comm. 633
Intr. by: Mr. Inaba
Motion to Approve: Mr. Inaba moved to adopt Res. 377-23. Seconded by
Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Vice Chair Inaba.
MR. INABA: I know many of you are also submitting resolutions and happy that
we are able to contribute as a Council. Thank you. Asking for your support.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in
favor please say "aye."
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Vote on Res. 377-23: The motion to adopt Res. 377-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 378-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO BIG ISLAND
WAVE RIDERS AGAINST DRUGS TO ASSIST WITH EXPENSES
ASSOCIATED WITH THE WEST HAWAII COMMUNITY BEACH
CLEANUP
Transfers $5,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 8); and credits to the Department of Liquor Control, Public
Programs account.
Reference: Comm. 634
Intr. by: Mr. Inaba
Motion to Approve: Mr. Inaba moved to adopt Res. 378-23. Seconded by
Ms. Kagiwada.
CHR. KIMBALL: Vice Chair Inaba.
MR. INABA: Yes. Just want to mahalo the Big Island Wave Riders Against
Drugs for putting on this annual beach clean-up that spans I believe way up towards
Kohala down to South Kona, and ask for my colleagues' support. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in
favor please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 378-23: The motion to adopt Res. 378-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
Page 59
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 379-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO HAWAII ISLAND
VETERANS MEMORIAL INC. TO DISPLAY THE WALL THAT HEALS
Transfers $2,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 2); and credits to the Department of Parks and Recreation,
Administration Other Current Expenses account.
Reference: Comm. 635
Intr. by: Ms. Kagiwada
Motion to Approve: Ms. Kagiwada moved to adopt Res. 379-23. Seconded by
Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Kagiwada.
MS. KAGIWADA: Just looking for your support. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. All those in favor,please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 379-23: The motion to adopt Res. 379-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 380-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO THE DAUGHTERS OF
HAWAII TO ASSIST WITH IRRIGATION SYSTEM REPAIRS TO PRESERVE
THE ROYAL BANYAN TREE AT HULIHE`E PALACE
Transfers $4,800 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 7); and credits to the Department of Liquor Control, Public
Programs account.
Reference: Comm. 636
Intr. by: Ms. Villegas
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Approve: Ms. Villegas moved to adopt Res. 380-23. Seconded by
Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: Just asking for my colleagues' support on this important
project to improve and return this area back to how it was prior to a very large
storm.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in
favor please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 380-23: The motion to adopt Res. 380-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 381-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO THE HAWAII ISLAND
VETERANS MEMORIAL INC. FOR EXPENSES RELATED TO THE WALL
THAT HEALS EXHIBIT
Transfers $2,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 4); and credits to the Department of Parks and Recreation,
Administration Other Current Expenses account.
Reference: Comm. 637
Intr. by: Ms. Kierkiewicz
Motion to Approve: Ms. Kierkiewicz moved to adopt Res. 381-23. Seconded
by Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Kierkiewicz.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. Just honored to be joining my
colleagues in supporting this really important healing and educational exhibit
that's coming to the island. I yield.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Anyone else?
Seeing none, all those in favor please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 381-23: The motion to adopt Res. 381-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 382-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO HAWAII ISLAND
VETERANS MEMORIAL INC. FOR THE WALL THAT HEALS EXHIBIT
Transfers $2,000 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 1); and credits to the Department of Parks and Recreation,
Administration Other Current Expenses account.
Reference: Comm. 638
Intr. by: Ms. Kimball
Vote on Res. 382-23: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Res. 382-23. Seconded by
(Adopted) Mr. Inaba and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 386-23: AUTHORIZES THE ACCEPTANCE OF A DONATION OF BIOASTIN
SUPPLEMENTS TO THE HAWAII FIRE DEPARTMENT
The donation from Cyanotech Corporation, with an estimated value of$18,208,
would be utilized by firefighters to support their physical fitness and health.
Reference: Comm. 644
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Waived: FC
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Approve: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to adopt Res. 386-23.
Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Mahalo for the donation to the company.
Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair?
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Kierkiewicz.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. A couple things. We have Chief(Darwin)
Okinaka in Hilo Chambers in case anybody has questions. But I did want to
disclose that my partner is a firefighter, and he did come home with a couple of
bottles of BioAstin. And so, I just want to make that disclosure and I'll leave it to
you to determine if I need to recuse myself from this vote. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: I think the question is did you also use the BioAstin? If not,
we're good, if you did.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I actually take AGI (Athletic Greens). So, no, I did not.
CHR. KIMBALL: Alright, as Chair I'm comfortable with Council Member
Kierkiewicz voting on this resolution just by the disclosure. Anyone else have
concerns about that? I'm not seeing anything here. Any further discussion on
this item? All those in favor,please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 386-23: The motion to adopt Res. 386-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you for being here, Chief, and happy holidays to you
and all the folks at the department. Mahalo. Next item please.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Res. 387-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO FRIENDS OF THE FUTURE
TO ASSIST WITH EXPENSES RELATED TO THE FRIENDLY FRIDGE
RESCUE FOOD PROGRAM IN KAMUELA
Transfers $3,900 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 9); and credits to the Department of Liquor Control, Public
Programs account.
Reference: Comm. 645
Intr. by: Ms. Evans
Motion to Approve: Ms. Evans moved to adopt Res. 387-23. Seconded by
Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. I ask for your support. This is one of those
community driven programs to help the homeless; it's very successful, and I ask
for your full support. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Any further discussion?
Seeing none, all those in favor please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 387-23: The motion to adopt Res. 387-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Res. 388-23: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A DESIGNATED
FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO HAWAII WILDFIRE
MANAGEMENT ORGANIZATION TO ASSIST WITH EXPENSES RELATING
TO ITS WILDFIRE HOME RISK ASSESSMENT PROGRAM
Transfers $5,500 from the Clerk-Council Services —Contingency Relief account
(Council District 9); and credits to the Hawaii Fire Department, Fire Operations
Other Current Expenses account.
Reference: Comm. 646
Intr. by: Ms. Evans
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Approve: Ms. Evans moved to adopt Res. 388-23. Seconded by
Ms. Kagiwada.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Thank you, Members. I ask for your support. My district is prone
to wildfires, a very drought area. And these wildfire home risk assessments;
anybody in the community can ask, they'll come out, they'll look at your home,
your land, assess the fire risk. And the people that do this, they get paid a
hundred dollars each time, the people that go and do the assessment. So, this will
encourage and help a lot of people to get their homes assessed and do some
mitigation. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evan. Any further discussion?
Seeing none, all those in favor please say "aye."
Vote on Res. 388-23: The motion to adopt Res. 388-23 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
BILLS FOR The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Bills for
ORDINANCES Ordinances (First Reading).
(FIRST READING):
(Note: Items in this category were taken up previously, out of order.)
Bill 82: AMENDS CHAPTER 2, ARTICLE 9, SECTION 2-40 AND ADDS A NEW
(Draft 3) ARTICLE TO CHAPTER 14 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983
(2016 EDITION, AS AMENDED), RELATING TO IMPROVING, GRADING,
REPAIRING, OR CONSTRUCTION WORK UPON PRIVATE,
NONDEDICATED, AND NON-SURRENDERED ROADS
Allows for entities who are authorized to make legal decisions regarding private,
nondedicated, and non-surrendered roads that are open to the general public and
necessary for public transportation to request that the County improve, grade,
repair, or perform other construction work upon such roads.
Reference: Comm. 496.47
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder
Approve: PCHSW-6
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
(Note: Comm. 496.48, from Council Member Matt Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder dated
December 13, 2023, and Comm. 496.49, from Council Member Holeka Goro
Inaba dated December 20, 2023, transmitting proposed amendments to Bill 82,
Draft 3, were circulated.)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to pass Bill 82, Draft 3,
on first reading and adopt Policy Committee on Health,
Safety, and Well-Being Committee Report No. 6.
Seconded by Ms. Villegas.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you very much. Before we begin, I
do have a communication. It's a minor housekeeping bill.
Motion to Amend: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to amend Bill 82, Draft 3,
with the contents of Comm. 496.48. Seconded by
Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member, on the amendment.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. Very simple amendment
removing the "or"before the semi-colon and moving it to after the semi-colon
position. Look for everyone's support.
CHR. KIMBALL: Is there also on the back, an amendment as well?
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: You're right. I'm sorry.
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay. Any further discussion?
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Sorry. I apologize for that. No, this is a
little more than it looks to be, and I am thinking back on this. I believe this is
after our last discussion and seeing how long we've taken to get here, and we're
waiting for this being a process that we're moving this ordinance, taking effect
one year after approval. We have been in discussions on this bill from this
summer. So, we're about six months in. So, I think the original intention was to
give it a year, putting it in mid-year next year. But, at this point, given the length
of time it's taken us to get to today and still being on first reading. Open to
discussion on this, not stuck to this, but looking to make this bill a reality for our
community. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Before we move onto
discussion on the amendment, I want to check with the Clerk that this is actually
properly written. We have in this Section 4, on the back here, the proposed
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
amendment, it suggests amending Section 4 and then renumbering it to Section 5.
I just want to confirm that's correct?
MR. HENRICKS: What is your concern?
CHR. KIMBALL: My concern is we are possibly getting things out of proper
order on the final bill. But if LRB (Legislative Research Branch) has reviewed
this, I will rely on them.
MR. HENRICKS: Yes. And we've signed off on this. So, what's happening is
Section 4 of the bill is now being used to add a Ramseyer format clause that is
necessary but not included in the original bill. And then Section 4 that is
currently the effective date is just being renumbered to Section 5.
CHR. KIMBALL: Wouldn't it be required to move Section 4 to 5 first before,
instead of amending it before moving it? I apologize for the, I just want to make
sure got this right.
MR. HENRICKS: There's no need to move it to Section 5 unless it's amended,
unless Section 4 is used for something else first. So, I see these things as
sequentially accurate.
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay. Thank you.
MR. HENRICKS: Yup.
CHR. KIMBALL: Alright. Any further discussion on the amendment? Council
Member Inaba, first.
MR. INABA: So if there is no take effect date
MR. HENRICKS: I'm sorry, there is. And I'm sorry, I thought this was very
cleverly done. All this does is take the effective date that is currently in
Section 4 and move it to Section 5. It has not changed. It's just showing that
Section 4 was removed to create the new Ramseyer format clause. Perhaps we
won't try to be so economical in the future. It did not work apparently.
MR. INABA: Alright. So, Section 4 of the bill is amended, and it says that
material in Section 1 is to be repealed as bracketed and stricken. New material in
Section 1 is underscored.
MR. HENRICKS: The only part of the bill that includes Ramseyer format is
Section 1. That is why it's delineated that only in Section 1. The rest of the bill is
not underscored because it adds an entire new article to Chapter 14. That's why
that is that specific. I understand your confusion. I looks like it's removing the
effective date entirely. That is not the intent. So, if this is approved, there will be
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
a Ramseyer format clause that explains why material is bracketed and stricken in
Section 1, and there will be a new Section 5 that will say this ordnance will take
effect one year after approval.
CHR. KIMBALL: Yeah, I think this is incorrect sequentially because you're first
amending it and then moving it. And I would suggest to the maker that this be
withdrawn and resubmitted.
MR. INABA: I can't support this because I can't understand it for number 2, and
it's probably because of number 3. But I'll just say I don't support things I don't
understand right now. So, I can't support this. Thank you.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Could I?
CHR. KIMBALL: You may.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So, I'm thinking back, Jon. I'm trying to
figure out this amendment, and I thought it was straight forward but, in the
back
MR. HENRICKS: It's really not. We apologize. Matt had nothing to do with
this. We asked Matt to make some changes to the bill to correct it. Matt dutifully
approved our changes, and they're clearly not sufficient. LRB apologizes.
Corporation Counsel apologizes.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I do apologize as well for not catching that.
I'll be withdrawing the motion. Thank you.
Withdraw Motion Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder withdrew his motion to amend
to Amend: Bill 82, Draft 3, with the contents of Comm. 496.48.
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay. So, we are back to the main motion.
MS. KAGIWADA: Well, alright. I'll just tell you.
CHR. KIMBALL: It's been withdrawn. You can take it off the record. I would
say that quickly, the editorial changed. The movement of the "or"to the other
side of the semi-colon that was proposed in the amendment, can we just do that on
the floor since it's a minor editorial change and not substantive to the—does that
matter.
MR. HENRICKS: No.
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay. Back to you with the main motion then.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I apologize for that. Okay, back to the main
motion. There is another amendment. I'll let the maker of the other amendment
go ahead. Thank you.
Motion to Amend: Mr. Inaba moved to amend Bill 82, Draft 3, with the
contents of Comm. 496.49. Seconded by Mr. Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder.
MR. INABA: Thank you. Section 2 of this amendment just removes the term
"council authorization" since we did remove that via the last amendment at the
last reading. And then, the next section is clearly stating that the installation of
signs, markings, and lighting. It really actually lives in the following section, but
for consistency throughout, I added it there because that's the first time that
we're speaking about the type of work that can be done. So, that's
improvements, grading, repairing, or construction work by remedial patching,
resurfacing, paving, or installation of signs, marking, and lighting.
And then, on page 2 of the amendment, we are also adding the terms installation
of signs, marking, and lighting to the allowable work on both paved and
unpaved, private, nondedicated, and non-surrendered roads. And finally, we just
removed in that last subsection C, what kind of was perhaps a confusing
language. So, we're just saying where, what we can do, and that is installation of
signs, marking, and lighting as we discussed in previous hearings. So, I ask for
my colleagues' support on this amendment. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you. To the maker, when we're talking about lighting,
the street lighting, right, is that what you're speaking of?
MR. INABA: Yes.
MS. LEE LOY: Is someone from Public Works available?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yes, Council Member. We have Deputy Director(Mafia)
Kekai.
MS. LEE LOY: Great. Deputy Kekai, around the lighting, there's a process that
requires notification or request to install lighting on the telephone pole. Does
this not float into that process?
(Note: At this time, Public Works Deputy Director Malia Kekai came
forward to address the members of the Council.)
MS. KEKAL Thank you. Malia Kekai, Deputy Director of Public Works. So,
the way that I'm understanding this bill is that we wouldn't be installing new
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
lighting, that we would just be, you know, if we had to remove lighting, we
would put it back to where it is. If we're installing new lighting, then yes, that
would be a whole different process that I haven't contemplated as of yet.
MS. LEE LOY: I'm willing to support but, Deputy, if we could circle back
around and make sure that, you know, chutes and ladders, right? We're shooting
people into the right chute and then sending them up the right ladder. Great.
Thank you. In support.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Council Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: Yes. And to Council Member Lee Loy's point. I mean, I think
they still have the steps required in this bill. Installing brand new lights on a
street might not be feasible as we use it in the bill. So, yes,just wanted to
provide the option though if something is removed it could be replaced and that
the department has the option to install should they choose. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. A few meetings back, we had this conversation and I
believe that we had agreement on it. So, I'm glad that I'm seeing the language in
here because I think we had already had that discussion like, I don't know, a
month ago or so. So, it's good to see it. The other thing is I can't wait to have
you redo the amendment that you've withdrawn because now that he's added
language and whatever you need to have that paragraph put in your build. You
do need to bring that amendment back, so it fits the right format because we're
missing that now. Thank you. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council Member
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yeah. Thank you, Chair. To Mr. Inaba,
thank you for bringing this forward. This was a back and forth to the
department. Yes, no, yes, no, yes, no, and finally was this is a policy deal and if
we want to make this a part of this bill then we can, and it's going to need some
work, and of course, the feasibility and criteria being met being of the utmost
importance. And that falls back to the departments as it wants to. So, I'll be
supporting this amendment today. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion on the amendment?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair.
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead, Council Member Kierkiewicz.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. I'll be supporting this amendment. I think it
was something that I brought up in the first committee meeting maybe about six
months ago. So, glad that it's finally being included. Deputy Kekai, I do hope
that between now and the next reading, we'll just get a little bit more clarity from
the department around how this process works with existing processes for lights
to be installed in different communities. It seems like there's a couple of
different pathways and just want to make sure there's clarity on how they might
be merged. Okay.
MS. KEKAL Yeah, we can definitely have those conversations because it does,
I mean, its road width, it's how much shoulder there is, is there existing poles
there to add on to or not. There's a lot of factors to be taking into place, yeah.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. Again,just want to make sure that does this
ordinance trump existing Code? So, I'll have you spend some time reviewing
that and letting us know what pathway we can expect. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Any further
discussion on the amendment? Seeing none, all those in favor of amending
Bill 82, Draft 3, with the contents of Communication 496.49, please say "aye."
Vote on Motion to The motion to amend Bill 82, Draft 3, with the contents of
Amend: Comm. 496.49 was carried by the following voice vote:
(Approved)
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Bill 82 is amended to Draft 4. Discussion on the main
motion? Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. I wanted to mahalo everyone
for their mana`o and for their support to this juncture. It's been a process and I
really appreciate Ms. Leslie Chow for helping us get here as well. She has since
retired, to our loss, I believe. She was an amazing asset. But I really am proud
to be on a Council that's taking the initiative to take steps to create process on an
issue that has been present since the 1960's, and this is a huge stride for our
community. I got a lot of texts and calls this morning, "I'm sick, I can't make it.
I support this. I'm not able to be there, I'm with family." So, the community is
watching. They're very supportive. They're very appreciative of our efforts to
date, and I just wanted to pass that on to those who are in the position to vote
today. But mahalo everyone for their time and attention to this along the way.
Thank you.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you. I'm going to be voting in support of this but I'm
going to make it very clear. After our conversation last meeting, I specifically
asked Director (Deanna) Sako if we could do even the study, with any of our
taxes, and she made it clear she doesn't think so. And I'm in support of the
community having a process but I am concerned that we are probably looking at
an unfunded process until we can crack the nut at the state level to use tax dollars
on private roads. So, I don't mind having this here as a placeholder, but I think
larger communication about managing the public's expectation in Puna, that
even if they submit to put this into a process it might just be shelved until there
can be a bright line of understanding on the use of the funds. Happy to support
this at this time. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. I believe I see your
light on, Council Member Kierkiewicz?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yes, Chair. You know, again, going to be supporting
this. I think this is a tremendous opportunity for various communities around the
island. I don't know if Corporation Counsel has had time since our last meeting
to dig into how exactly we might finance a program like this. You know, one of
the comments that I have stuck replaying in my head is Director Sako saying,
"Well, you can't use GET (General Excise Tax) funds, you can't use Highway
funds, and we cannot use public dollars or real property taxes to do any work to
even stand up this program." So, again,just wondering if any additional research
has been done to make the determination on how we finance this program
because a lot of folks are really counting on this. You know, they have this
expectation that we pass this bill, and we're going to create a program. I still
haven't even seen the fiscal impact analysis on, you know, what it's going to cost
to stand up a program like this. So, a lot of questions still need to be answered
and I'm hoping that we can get some of those answers between now and second
and final reading.
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead, Judge Strance, if you have a response.
(Note: At this time, Corporation Counsel Elizabeth Strance came forward
to address the members of the Council.)
MS. STRANCE: Sort of. Elizabeth Strance, Corporation Counsel. What we
have determined is that the scope of available funds isn't clear and that we'll
need to request an attorney general's opinion regarding specific state funds. As
to county funds, without our determining anything further, funding would be
solely from the general fund and to the extent that DPW (Department of Public
Works) employees', their salaries come from highway funds. The county would
be reimbursing for their hours from the general fund. General fund monies
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
would be required to pay for materials and supplies. We don't think it would be
a violation of any law to use DPW equipment to do the work.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: That's very helpful. Thank you, Judge Strance. Who is
in charge of preparing the fiscal impact analysis?
MS. STRANCE: Not me.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I sure did, but I'm assuming that Corporation Counsel is
going to review the fiscal impact analysis that needs to be prepared by the
Council. And I think there were really important pieces of information that
Judge Strance shared that should be included in that analysis to the Council. Is
that something that—this isn't my bill. So, I didn't order, request that Finance
do the fiscal impact analysis, so just wondering if that is in the works and
something we can expect at next reading.
MS. STRANCE: I guess, I would need some clarity on that request because
there isn't a budget before the Council on the hope for or expected work to be
done pursuant to this bill. So, it's a little difficult to assess the impact without
knowing the scope of work that is anticipated.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: The scope seems pretty clear. Set up this program, and
there's clearly personnel that are going to be required to set up the process and
the applications. And so, I'd like to know what that is because that is something
Director (Stephen) Pause did say would be a strain on their already stretched
department. And again, we want this program to be successful, so we want to
see what it's going to take to stand it up.
MS. STRANCE: Okay. I guess
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I'm sorry, Judge Strance. I don't even know who I'm
supposed to be directing these questions to because I don't know if Finance is in
chambers or on Zoom.
MS. STRANCE: I can work offline with Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder
and the Department of Finance. My concern is that it may not be very
satisfactory because the program itself isn't described in the bill. And so, usually
when we're looking at fiscal impact, we have a scope and so as you know, like
with grants-in-aid (Waiwai Grant Program), submitted with the grant application
is a program description with expenses. So, I just, you know, I'm worried that
we're going to get you something and it's not going to be adequate because a
decision hasn't and is not really being made about the scope of it. The bill is
identifying a process that might be available. And so, I would normally see kind
of a budget impact if the department were to come forward with their budget for
next fiscal year, for example, or if this body was going to provide some direction
about what it would like to see spent on the program, and then it would be a little
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
easier to like then go and look at what the resource impact would be. But, if
you're looking more towards a formula, for example, I think that might be more
doable.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Any information is better than like the no information that
we have right now. Again,just trying to understand. Should we pass this
ordinance, there is a process to implement. What resources are needed on
DPW's side to implement that process and what pots of money are we going to
leverage to implement that process. I hope that's clear. Look forward to more
information at second reading. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Following up on Member Kierkiewicz's question. I'm reading
the bill the way it's written, and it says, "Upon request and subject to council
authorization. . ." It's under Section 14-26-3. But it also, in Section 14-26-4, it's
saying the department"may"which means there's a lot of discretion. I do think
that Council Member Kierkiewicz is right in maybe asking the Public Works
Director to find out. I'm assuming he will not do rulemaking but clearly, he's
going to have to have some internal process, and will that result in him
submitting to the Mayor a proposal as he's developing his draft budget on how
much maybe to set aside for this program. You know, how will he process this
and come up with a decision on how much money to set aside. Would that be
something that he would initiate or would that come from the Mayor and the
Managing Director working with the department to come up with some number.
I mean, clearly a number will have to be generated. Who's going to generate it,
and how does it get generated, and get proposed to the Council? I think we need
to have a little more, it'll be nice to hear a little bit more about that process. But
thank you for bringing that up, Member Kierkiewicz. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council Member
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you. Good comments. And thank
you, Ms. Strance, for trying to summarize. You and I discussed briefly, as well
as with Ms. Sako, she's on her way back to Hilo with Diane Nakagawa. I did
text her to see if she was available. So, to the question for funding sources.
What we've come down to now is general funds would be available. Not
available, general funds would be acceptable for use. Our tax sources, fuel tax,
GE (General Excise) tax, and this time, because it's not allowed specifically by
state, will not be sources of funding for the Bill 82, as it stands. We do hope to
seek the Attorney General's opinion as Ms. Strance stated. And I would even be
more hopeful that the state can start to look at amending some of those tax
sources that maybe we can use these for private roads that have a public purpose
in the future. So, thank you. Thank you, though, for trying to kind of summarize
what we had talked about in previous discussions and make it more clear for
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
everyone so we're not sitting on real expectations. As far as expectations, the
think that the best way I can say this is, the Council is going to budget for
expectations. And I've heard that said before on this Council. If we don't put
money aside for this and we don't work with the department, nothing's going to
happen. So, the community has been very clear, this is going to be very helpful
for us in whatever regards, whether it's $5,000 for gravel, whether it's a few
hundred thousand dollars for paving, whatever that might be. The Council
budgets, and we budget for the expectation. So, the community's expectations
are then back on us as a Council. That's how I view this.
To the point for the fiscal impact statement. I will do my best to get information
back to this body. I say that for one reason. The way this bill is designed, I'm
thinking back to our real property discussion we had yesterday. I'm thinking
back to a few bills we've had in the past couple months. It's hard to know what
roads will be brought in and requested by the community for us to address. It's
hard to know which ones will be chosen after meeting the criteria we've
established, and it's hard to know ultimately what then we can then fund on the
back end. Those criteria and the way this bill is, where the bill is crafted, make it
extremely difficult, as Ms. Strance said, to provide a for certain fiscal impact
statement because we really don't know. And I hate to give that answer, but I
would reference yesterday as a perfect example. How many people will take
advantage of Bill 104? We don't know. We really don't know. We can just
guess that"x" amount of people would. In this case, there's a number of criteria
and guidelines requestors have to meet to be able to participate in the program
and it's also dependent on the amount of funding we put in.
So, I will under Ms. Kimball's guidance, come back with some sort of a cost
break down of existing roadways with a gravel,paved, resurfacing, whatever it
might be,just to provide some clarification, and I do hope that Mr. Pause can
make it next time to help us. Without Deanna being here, I don't want to put
words in her mouth as far as funding sources, dollar amounts. She really is
ideally the person to help us along with that given her tremendous expertise on
the matter. So, I hope that helps. Open to further discussion. And appreciate the
support so far. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Any further discussion?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair, one more thing. Sorry.
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead, Council Member.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: You know, representations were made in the past that this
bill was based off of other county ordinances. And so, in the effort to get as
much information as possible, it would be helpful to get concrete examples of
how similar ordinances were adopted in other counties, what funds were used to
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
make improvements on private roadways, and how often those programs are
leveraged. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Any further
discission? Seeing none, all those in favor of approving Bill 82, Draft 3, as
amended, at first reading please say "aye."
Vote on Bill 82: The motion to pass Bill 82, Draft 3, as amended to Draft 4,
Draft 4 on first reading and adopt Policy Committee on Health,
(Approved) Safety, and Well-Being Committee Report No. 6 was
carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
and Chair Kimball —7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Villegas —2.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: I believe that takes us to Bill 103.
Bill 103: AMENDS THE PARKS AND RECREATIONAL FACILITY SCHEDULE,
(Draft 2) CHAPTER 15, ARTICLE 8, SECTION 15-68.1, OF THE HAWAII COUNTY
CODE 1983 (2016 EDITION, AS AMENDED), BY NAMING THE
BALLFIELD AT THE DR. FRANCIS F. C. WONG STADIUM IN THE
HO`OLULU COMPLEX THE "JAMES "JIMMY" CORREA BALLFIELD" IN
HONOR OF JAMES "JIMMY" CORREA
Reference: Comm. 599.15
Intr. by: Ms. Kierkiewicz and Ms. Lee Loy
Approve: PCHSW-8
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to pass Bill 103, Draft 2, on first
reading and adopt Policy Committee on Health, Safety, and
Well-Being Committee Report No. 8. Seconded by
Ms. Kierkiewicz.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Yes. Thank you, Chair. First of all, I really want to thank my
colleagues. We were going very late that evening. And community came out in
support, and they were incredibly appreciative. And over the course of the last
two weeks, so many of them have run into me whether it's, you know, at the store
or at the ballfield, and just really grateful for the work that our Council is doing to
honor such a pilar of our baseball community. You know, moving this forward is
one thing but as a reminder this does take effect in June, on Uncle Jimmy's
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
birthday, and so a little bit of a bigger celebration, some cake, and some other
things will happen in June. So, urging my colleagues' support.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. Council Member
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you, Chair. You know, I really was
impressed by the community turnout as well as some of the stories that I heard.
And I didn't know any of the history, so it was really nice to hear that and
understand the depth of history for our baseball folks here in the community.
Someone reached out to me between here and then and I recognized him, but I
didn't recognize the length of time he's been in our community participating.
That was Ms. Kagiwada's, Legislative Aide
CHR. KIMBALL: Legislative Aide's husband.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Legislative Aide's husband, Mr. Jon
Matson. You know, they said he should be recognized too. And I was like, well
it wasn't really about Jon, it was about Mr. Correa. So, I just wanted to mention
that because it was nice. I didn't realize he's been an umpire and done so much in
the community as well. So, I just wanted to say that very nice thing. But I'll be
supporting the ordinance today. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Anyone else? Seeing none, all
those in favor of approving Bill 103, Draft 2, at first reading please say "aye."
Vote on Bill 103: The motion to pass Bill 103, Draft 2, on first reading and
Draft 2 adopt Policy Committee on Health, Safety, and Well-Being
(Approved) Committee Report No. 8 was carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
and Chair Kimball —7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Villegas —2.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Bill 105: AMENDS CHAPTER 24, ARTICLE 10, DIVISION 5, SECTION 24-280,
SCHEDULE 28, AND SECTION 24-281, SCHEDULE 29 OF THE HAWAII
COUNTY CODE 1983 (2016 EDITION, AS AMENDED), RELATING TO NO
PARKING AT ANYTIME UPON CERTAIN STREETS OR PORTION OF
STREETS AND PARKING PROHIBITED DURING CERTAIN HOURS ON
CERTAIN STREETS
Adds a provision to prohibit parking at anytime and provisions to prohibit parking
between the hours of 8:00 p.m. and 5:00 a.m. for portions of Alii Drive that front
Pahoehoe Beach Park.
Reference: Comm. 607
Intr. by: Ms. Lee Loy (B/R)
Approve: PCIA-4
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to pass Bill 105 on first reading and
adopt Policy Committee on Infrastructure and Assets
Committee Report No. 4. Seconded by Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Thank you. This is I believe in Council Member Villegas
district, but we did have unanimous support and Council and look forward to that
continued support. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. Any other discussion
on this item? Seeing none, all those in favor,please say "aye."
Vote on Bill 105: The motion to pass Bill 105 on first reading and adopt
(Approved) Policy Committee on Infrastructure and Assets Committee
Report No. 4 was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
and Chair Kimball —7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Villegas —2.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Bill 106: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 23-51, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO PUBLIC
IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
JULY 1, 2023 TO JUNE 30, 2024
Adds the Public Works Federal Highway Administration Mamalahoa Highway
Rehabilitation Part 2—Kamalani Street to Kalamauka Road—Federal Project
($3,000,000) to the Capital Budget. Funds for this project shall be provided from
the Federal Grants Receivable Fund, and would be used for paving and resurfacing.
Reference: Comm. 608
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
Approve: FC-118
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire
membership to amend,pursuant to
Section 10-6(e), Hawai`i County Charter
Vote on Bill 106: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to pass Bill 106 on first
(Approved) reading and adopt Finance Committee Report No. 118.
Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy and carried by the following
voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: If we can go now to Bill 100 for second and final reading,
please.
ORDER OF The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Order of
THE DAY the Day (Second or Final Reading).
(SECOND OR
FINAL READING):
Bill 100: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 23-50, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
ENDING JUNE 30, 2024
Appropriates revenues in Federal Grants —Fiscal Year 2023 Volunteers in Service
to America Support Grant account($50,000); and appropriates the same to the
Fiscal Year 2023 Volunteers in Service to America Support Grant account. Funds
would be used to provide community-based training and regional education to
VISTA personnel.
Reference: Comm. 579
Intr. by: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder(B/R)
First Reading: December 6, 2023
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Approve: Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder moved to pass Bill 100 on
second and final reading. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion? No comment that it's a cool number,
Council Member?
MR. KANEALII-KLEINFELDER: It is a cool number, and I appreciate that.
So, is the next one too.
CHR. KIMBALL: Alright. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in
favor please say "aye."
Vote on Bill 100: The motion to pass Bill 100 on second and final reading
(Adopted) was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
Bill 101: AMENDS SECTION 25-8-33 (CITY OF HILO DISTRICT ZONE MAP),
(Draft 2) ARTICLE 8, CHAPTER 25 (ZONING) OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983
(2016 EDITION, AS AMENDED), BY CHANGING THE DISTRICT
CLASSIFICATION FROM AGRICULTURAL—3 ACRES (A-3a) TO SINGLE-
FAMILY RESIDENTIAL—20,000 SQUARE FEET (RS-20) AT HILO,
HAWAII, COVERED BY TAX MAP KEY: 2-4-079:002
(Applicant: Constance Imamura) (Area: 23,012 square feet)
The Windward Planning Commission forwards its favorable recommendation for
this change of zone request, which would allow the applicant to subdivide the
property into two lots to accommodate an existing dwelling. The property is
located at 1212 West Kawailani Street, Waiakea Homesteads, South Hilo.
Reference: Comm. 590.2
Intr. by: Mr. Inaba(B/R)
First Reading: December 6, 2023
Motion to Approve: Mr. Inaba moved to pass Bill 101, Draft 2, on second and
final reading. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion on this matter?
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair, I just want to note that the representative for the
applicant has been here since 9:00 a.m., so if there are any questions, I'm sure she
is more than willing to answer them. Thank you. I will be supporting this very
straightforward request.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. And I apologize to
the applicant's representative. I had no idea you were over there waiting for us all
this time. Next time, please let Mr. (Relley) Araceley know, and he can get in
touch with us and let us know you're waiting. With that, any further discussion
on Bill 101? Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Yes. Since the applicant's here, I do have a question.
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay. There's a question from Council Member Evans for
the applicant, if you wouldn't mind coming to the testifier's table?
MS. EVANS: So, correct me if I'm wrong but there was a building that was on
this property, there was a couple buildings on this property, and this is to try to
separate those two buildings so you're creating this separate TMK (Tax Map Key)
so that you can separate them?
(Note: At this time, Project Manager Kimberly Chiodo, Land Planning
Hawaii, came forward to address the members of the Council.)
MS. CHIODO: Good morning. I'm Kim Chiodo. I'm standing in as
representative for the application as part of Land Planning Hawaii. John Pipan
had previously spoken to you guys about this. He's on vacation. But yes, that's
correct. There's one building on the property. It's the applicant's residence. And
so, the request is to rezone just approximately 23,000 square foot portion of the
property so that she can subdivide just that portion of the larger lot as her
residence, and then sell off the rest of the parcel, which won't be rezoned, which
will stay in the A-3a zoning. And that will remain as a bulk lot. There's no
structure on that back part right now.
MS. EVANS: So,just curious, an evaluation of the current lot on the 23,000
acres, I'm assuming it's meeting all current code requirements?
MS. CHIODO: Yes. The dwelling there was built in the 1960's. It's a
permanent dwelling. There are no further improvements proposed right now. She
just wants to keep her home as it is and sell the rest of the parcel.
MS. EVANS: Okay. Alright. For me this is a learning curve because I think I
have many people in my district that would love to do the same thing. I have
never seen this done before. So, thank you very much. I yield.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Any further discussion
on this item? Seeing none, all those in favor of adopting Bill 101, Draft 2, at
second and final reading,please say "aye."
Vote on Bill 101: The motion to pass Bill 101, Draft 2, on second and final
Draft 2 reading was carried by the following voice vote:
(Adopted) Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you again to the applicant's representative, and my
apologies for not addressing your matter sooner in the day. Next item, to the
remaining reports.
REPORTS: The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Reports.
(Note: Items in this category were taken up previously, out of order.)
GOEAC-85 REAPPOINTMENT OF JUSTIN ACKERMAN TO THE GAME
(Comm. 610): MANAGEMENT ADVISORY COMMISSION
Requires Council
Confirmation by: December 30, 2023 (Section 13-4(k),
Hawaii County Charter)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Inaba moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
External Affairs Committee Report No. 85. Seconded by
Ms. Lee Loy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion on this item? Council Member Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Sorry, briefly. As a reappointment, I
remember when he came in front of us the first time, I liked him a lot. So, I'll be
supporting the nomination. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in
favor please say "aye."
Page 82
Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Vote on GOEAC-85: The motion to adopt Governmental Operations and
(Adopted) External Affairs Committee Report No. 85 was carried by
the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
GOEAC-89 NOMINATION OF ALAN OKINAKA TO THE BANYAN DRIVE HAWAII
(Comm. 614): REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and External
Affairs Committee Report No. 89. Seconded by Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion on this item? Seeing none, all those in favor
please say "aye."
Vote on The motion to adopt Governmental Operations and External Affairs
GOEAC-89: Committee Report No. 89 was carried by the following voice vote:
(Adopted)
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Next item please.
GOEAC-90 NOMINATION OF NONA WILSON TO THE BANYAN DRIVE HAWAII
(Comm. 615): REDEVELOPMENT AGENCY
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
External Affairs Committee Report No. 90. Seconded by
Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion on this?
MS. LEE LOY: Yes, Chair.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Lee Loy.
MS. LEE LOY: Yes, please. I'm going to be making a motion to postpone this
communication to our January 10th meeting. This applicant has been traveling on
a cruise. I think we all wish we could join her. She's not back yet and so I would
just love an opportunity for her to visit with the Council.
Motion to Postpone: Ms. Lee Loy moved to postpone Governmental Operations
and External Affairs Committee Report No. 90 to
January 10, 2024. Seconded by Ms. Kagiwada.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion on the postponement?
MS. LEE LOY: On postponement, Chair?
CHR. KIMBALL: Yes.
MS. LEE LOY: I'm just going to, for the record, alert Pomaika`i Bartolome in
the Mayor's Office, if she could collaborate with the Clerk's Office just to make
sure that the paperwork continues to be in order for this applicant because we've
been postponing this matter, and just leave it there. Thank you, Chair.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Lee Loy. Anyone else? Seeing
none, on the postponement, all those in favor please say "aye."
Vote on Motion to The motion to postpone Governmental Operations and
Postpone: External Affairs Committee Report No. 90 to January 10,
(Approved) 2024, was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Alright, last report there.
GOEAC-91 REAPPOINTMENT OF PAUL "SCOTTY"PAIVA TO THE BOARD OF
(Comm. 616): ETHICS
Requires Council
Confirmation by: December 30, 2023 (Section 13-4(k),
Hawaii County Charter)
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to adopt Governmental Operations and
External Affairs Committee Report No. 91. Seconded by
Mr. Inaba.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion on this item? Nobody wants to say, "Go
Vikings?" Okay, there you go. Any further discussion? Seeing none, all those in
favor please say "aye."
Vote on GOEAC-91: The motion to adopt Governmental Operations and
(Adopted) External Affairs Committee Report No. 91 was carried by
the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
Vote on Motion to Ms. Lee Loy moved to remove Res. 372-23 from the table.
Remove from Table: Seconded by Mr. Inaba and carried by the following voice
(Approved) vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Lee Loy,
Villegas, and Chair Kimball—8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Galimba— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: I do want to check in right now with Council Member
Villegas. I know she was preparing some amendments. Okay, thank you. All
right, we have a motion on the floor with respect to Resolution 372-23 for
approval. We'll begin the deliberation on that now while we're waiting for these
amendments. If we need to take a recess, we will. Council Member Lee Loy, go
ahead.
MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, maybe a short recess so we can think of some strategy.
CHR. KIMBALL: Let's recess until 2:45. That gives us 10 minutes. We are in
recess.
Recess: At 2:37 p.m., the Chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 3:40 p.m.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Just to get everybody reoriented, there is a motion on the floor
after the vote was successful to reconsider Resolution 372-23. So there is a
motion on the floor to adopt Resolution 372-23, and at this time, we will continue
to deliberate on this matter as if the previous vote did not occur. And so I can
mention at this point that Council Member Villegas as well as Corporation
Counsel are working on the final tweaks to some proposed amendments. But in
the interim, the rest of us can reinitiate the deliberation on the matter at hand,
which is Resolution 372-23. So opening the floor to my colleagues for any
discussion on the matter at hand. Apologies; Corporation Counsel is, like you
said, negotiating with Council Member Villegas on some amendment language,
so they're not here to answer specific questions, but I can respond with any
procedural questions. Any comments from the body? Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Okay. On the language of the resolution, deliberating that, is that
okay?
CHR. KIMBALL: Yes.
MS. EVANS: Okay. So one of the concerns I had was that it just kind of felt like
we were doing a multi-year contract without—well, it didn't feel like we had kind
of any side bars or any framework or any directions on how we thought kind of
the money was being spent. And I remember when I asked the question of
Corporation Counsel Strance, I said, "Does this mean if they decide they want to
order some studies and go out and look at water quality, or they want to reach out
to Department of Health and get water quality reports, like all this fact-finding,
are we kind of signing up for that?" And my understanding, you can correct me if
I'm wrong, was, yes, they may have to do all this fact-finding and research and
whatever. And so it just kind of felt like, wow, this is going to be a really big
could be a huge expense.
And so there was no language in there like about reporting back to the Council,
like "We're okay with this but we need you to keep checking back in with us. If
you're going to go beyond a certain amount, you need to come back and talk to us
about it." It just kind of felt like there wasn't enough, for me, enough
conversation about what we were really agreeing to. So that was one concern I
had.
I think the other concern is there was my feeling that, if in fact, could we at the
same time that we agree to having them work on this, could there also be some
discussion in the reso (resolution) about our preferred priority would be to try to
reach a negotiation and some type of settlement. There was no discussion about
our preferences as policymakers is for them to reach an agreement versus just
defending us. It seems like just saying "defend us"was too broad of a statement.
And I felt that the small amount of community input that we have had, because
again this came in front of us really quick without a lot of community
engagement, a lot of community input, it just kind of felt like we were just
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
agreeing to something, not knowing exactly what we were actually agreeing to. I
just felt we didn't have enough discussion, for me, and that is why I voted"no" on
it because I just didn't think there was enough clarity.
I do know that some people, the community, when they looked at this resolution
was thinking is there something else? Could we have conversations with the
people that filed the lawsuit saying, "Hey, there is an issue here"? Do we
acknowledge that there is an issue, that the County has recognized an issue; we
just haven't come up with a proposed solution; that if we work on finding a
proposed solution, should that be at the same time looking at a proposed solution
while we're trying to work with the people that filed the lawsuit saying, "Hey,
we're working on a proposed solution. Are you open to having that
conversation?"
And again, I think the reason it gets confusing is because everybody refers back to
what happened, and they keep bringing up that there was a lawsuit in Maui.
Recently, I saw another correspondence that said they thought there was a lawsuit
even on Oahu, similar to kind of wastewater treatment and how it was entering
the ocean, our marine environment. So there's been other lawsuits, and we didn't
spend really any time talking about other lawsuits and what the impacts of those
lawsuits were. I mean we never got into that conversation, and maybe it would
have been nice to know a little bit more about those other two lawsuits.
But you asked about deliberation. Just some thoughts that I've had since we
passed this, and of course, we're here today because a lot of the community, after
the fact, has raised some concerns about maybe we didn't have enough
community dialogue on this before we passed it. So there's my thoughts. Thank
you.
CHR. KIMBALL: If the body will permit me since we don't have Corporation
Counsel, the Deputy has joined in, I'll respond to a couple of things there just for
the purpose of clarifying. One, this was actually not waived from Committee.
Because it required the potential for an Executive Session, it went to Council
rather than being in Committee first. So that was just an (inaudible)to clarify that
with respect to timing. With respect to the nature of the resolution, this is not
atypical for a format of a resolution that we would support for any department that
requests funding. If I were to give an example, the Planning Department may
request funds to hire a consultant to help with a portion of the General Plan
because they need some expertise in that particular area that they don't have in-
house.
It would not be typical of the Council in that particular example to sort of
micromanage that contract step by step in terms of what would be covered. It is
presumed that the department has kind of an understanding of what their needs
are and would establish that in terms of the scope of work in the contract. The
matter of what we would like to see with regard to wastewater as a policy matter
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
would not necessarily typically become a component of a financing resolution but
of some other vehicle, be it an ordinance or a resolution, that stated a policy
position.
There's one other point you had made that I wanted to respond to. I'm sorry to
forget it at this time, but we have Corporation Counsel now back. Would folks
like to come up to the testifier's table and be prepared to make a statement on how
we are looking to proceed at this time?
(Note: At this time, Corporation Counsel Elizabeth Strance and Deputy
Corporation Counsel Elizabeth Bailey came forward to address the
members of the Council.)
MS. STRANCE: Good afternoon. Elizabeth Strance, Corporation Counsel, and
with me is Deputy Corporation Counsel Britt Bailey. We're just finishing up
some amendments to the resolution, which we hope will address some of the
concerns stated both by this body and members of the community. This was a
resolution that was prepared and submitted by our office, making a request that
we believe that we need. The Council seems concerned that both the resolution
provide some information to the public about how the case is set up and also
contain an expression of its concern around the development of R-1 water at the
Kealakehe Wastewater Treatment Plant, and an expression that the County
engage in alternative dispute resolution as part of any representation. And so the
resolution has been amended to essentially have what we requested
Point of Order: MR. INABA: Chair,point of order. I just want to make sure we're not getting
previewed on things we don't have in front of us yet.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you for that reminder, Mr. Inaba. Yeah, we're in a
sticky situation where we can't quite talk about the proposed amendment, but
okay, Council Member Inaba has some questions. So, perhaps if that's
appropriate, we can go there first while we continue to wait to have the
amendment language in front of us. Vice Chair Inaba.
MR. INABA: Thank you. Could you just refresh us on who made up that
selection committee? Was it just people from within the department, the Office of
Corporation Counsel?
MS. STRANCE: That's correct. By rule, I cannot participate in it, and so we had
Britt, Diana Mellon-Lacey—
MR. INABA: Okay,perfect. No, I just wanted to know if it was just people from
within the department.
MS. STRANCE: Yeah.
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MR. INABA: Okay. And then I'm just going to discuss what's on the resolution
in front of us right now. So, the fifth to the last"WHEREAS" says, "due to the
complexity and scope of the issues raised in the Lawsuit, the Lawsuit has the
potential to last years." And then the next"WHEREAS" states that"a multi-year
agreement will allow the County to employ Special Counsel who can provide
services on a continuing and consistent basis for the Lawsuit's duration." So do
you folks have an idea as to the contract that's going to be signed with special
counsel if the resolution is passed as to duration? because, right now, what's
before us is 200,000. That could not be duration. So where does that—?
MS. STRANCE: So the agreement would be crafted for representation, and it
would require us to monitor their fees. And should we start to come close to the
$200,000, it would require us to come back to Council to request authorization for
additional funding.
MR. INABA: Realistically, how long do we expect 200,000 to last us in terms
of—is it half a year?
MS. STRANCE: It kind of depends. A lawsuit kind of has a lot—can have a
little bit of a life of its own, and we can't predict what the plaintiffs are going to
do. So part of it is responsive. So, if motions are filed, we would need to respond
to them. So I don't want to guess how long that would be because we're very
early into the case. It's not clear how it's going to take shape. So I think I
mentioned last time we're in what's called the discovery phase of trial where
parties gather information from each other, and so we're in the midst of
responding to a discovery request from them. So I would hate to pen it out.
There are various deadlines in the trial setting order that include naming of
witnesses, naming of expert witnesses, exchanging of expert reports, all of those
kinds of deadlines. And as the responding parry in the lawsuit, we'll get
information from them. And if we need to retain services, we'll get people on
board to be able to respond to some of the things that they're alleging. So we
would expect to have to need to file—hire an expert. I'd love to be able to say
that it gets mapped out and we can say, but we really can't.
MR. INABA: So the $200,000 that would be authorized through this resolution is
strictly for the cost of special counsel. It couldn't be used, for example, for
testing of the waters or anything like that. It's specific to the legal fees.
MS. STRANCE: It's our budget. And so, if, for example, we had in our
departmental budget funds for things like testing, then we would draw off of that,
but we don't have funds for that. So we would most likely come back to this
body should those sorts of things be required.
MR. INABA: Okay. And then last question for now is, if additional funds were
needed, what does that look like in terms of a resolution? It's just a resolution
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seeking additional funding? Because it wouldn't be a new agreement, right, since
this agreement is supposed to live the duration of the lawsuit.
MS. STRANCE: Correct. So there have been a couple of other contracts from
other departments that have come before this body requesting amendments to
resolutions that would call for more funding. Because we put the number in there,
I would expect we would need to come back and ask for something by resolution
because we placed a number in the resolution already.
MR. INABA: Okay. And then, in preparing the budget for the next fiscal year,
are we looking at a status quo for this line? Or do we have any idea, and if we
prefer not to answer at this point?
MS. STRANCE: I think, as things shape up, we'll know better. If the case is
being litigated, the fees run up fairly quickly. If the case is being negotiated, it
takes a different track in terms of the increment of fees. So the scheduling order
in the case sets an early settlement conference in February, and I would say by
then we would have a good idea of the trajectory of the case at least at that time.
MR. INABA: Sorry, one last question. I promise this is the last one; I said that
twice already. In the B-52, it specifies that special counsel will be responsible for
representing the County in, and defending the County against, a lawsuit, including
but not limited to; and then we have some bullet points: appearing in court, the
drafting and preparation, filing, all of that. And I believe I asked this question the
last time we met, but how much of your own County attorneys will be working
alongside or assisting with these responsibilities listed here?
MS. STRANCE: We won't step totally out of the picture. We would generally
serve the role as the intermediary between the law firm and the departments to the
extent that our office may already have information. We would be consulting
with—we don't expect to be involved in kind of the daily maintenance in
responding to cases, but we do expect that we'll be receiving copies of documents
and that we would be consulting with them. This is an unusual case because, as
we've talked about before, there's a lot of policy considerations involved in it.
And so it's not a case we can operate in a vacuum because the business of the
County proceeds and the development of policy within the Department of
Environmental Management proceeds, and then we're going to be going through
budgeting. So it's an unusual case both because of the citizen lawsuit and then,
secondly, it involves ongoing operations of the County.
MR. INABA: Okay, thank you so much. Chair, I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Vice Chair Inaba. Council Member Kaneali`i-
Kleinfelder, and then I'll return to you, Council Member Evans.
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MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay, so we passed it and then we
reconsidered it. Now, we're back kind of at the beginning. I'm just thinking
more common sense. So where we stand right now is it's either going to pass or
it's going to fail. So I'm just going to go on that train of thought. If we don't
pass this, then nothing happens. I feel like we're in a very interesting place. We
are the County. We are elected to protect, make the decisions for our
constituents. We're being sued as the County of Hawaii by an outside entity for
not protecting our constituents. To protect ourselves, we would need to have
some kind of lawyer body protect us from the lawsuit, but our constituents are
saying don't do that. So I'm just going to start from there. If we don't take on
legal counsel, what happens? Lawsuit persists. We don't take on legal counsel.
We don't provide any form of funding for outside legal counsel; what happens?
MS. STRANCE: Then our office is tasked under the Charter to represent the
County in the lawsuit.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. And right now, Strance's stance is
we can't take that on right now; we don't have the expertise.
MS. STRANCE: Well, we're not in a position to say no because we have an
obligation under the Charter. And so if the Council said no, then we would have
to find a way to reallocate resources in our office to defend this lawsuit. And it
would have a pretty significant if not I don't want to say "devastating"because I
don't want to
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: There would be a significant impact.
MS. STRANCE: (Inaudible) overstated. But essentially, we have six lawyers in
our litigation division. We would have to probably take two lawyers and assign
them full-time or almost full-time responsibility for this case. So that would mean
reassignment of all of those cases to the remaining four lawyers who already are
carrying a very heavy workload. It might—and I haven't thought this all the way
through yet, but litigation is not like some of the other advising work. We get a
lot of work requests. We put them in the queue. We figure out what is the most
important and then try to negotiate with departments in this body about how and
when we can respond to their work request.
Litigation isn't like that. It's governed by very strict deadlines. You have a
certain amount of time to respond to something. And if you don't respond to it,
there are consequences and whether that is you don't get to raise certain defenses,
whether that is you're deemed to have admitted certain facts, all of those kinds of
things are deadline-driven. You miss a deadline to name an expert witness or an
important witness, you may not be able to call that witness or use that witness in
trial.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
So, because of the deadlines associated with litigation work, if we were required
to absorb this case into our office, it would probably involve a reallocation of
some of the resources that we have, and pull them from other divisions. It's not
something where we can put this case on hold while we try to reorganize our
office and bring in other attorneys who might assist. I can tell you that in the last
couple of months, this case has occupied a significant amount of my time. It's
occupied a significant amount of Lerisa's time and a decent amount of Britt's
time. And so,just in that short period of time, that's been a lot to juggle. So the
request to come before this body was a thoughtful request and a very candid
assessment both of what our skillset is and what our resources are.
And there's this just to kind of give you a snapshot of some of the issues in this
case, it's an evolving area of law. In November, the EPA (Environmental
Protection Agency) issued new guidelines related to NPDES (National Pollutant
Discharge Elimination System)permits related to groundwater. And so there are
things happening both at the Federal rulemaking level. The Maui decision is a
new decision and trying to figure out how that works in with other case law and
other things that might be happening throughout the country. It's evolving.
We understand that the State Department of Health haven't issued new rules yet
in response to the Maui decision. They keep saying that they're going to. When
that happens, they'll go through the State rulemaking process, which, in defense
of this lawsuit, would require keeping abreast of those kinds of developments in
the law. And having somebody who has a deep understanding of the Federal
Clean Water Act just for that piece would be incredibly helpful. And so there are
other areas of law that are kind of static, and you can look it up. You can read it.
It's something that we've worked on all the time.
With this case, we're smart and we're learning but we don't have, I guess, the
wisdom that comes with experience. And this is an important case. And
(inaudible) of the people are and whether the County should have done something
five, ten, twenty years ago is kind of, in some ways, beside the point in terms of
representing the County in this lawsuit. This lawsuit is here. The County made
decisions along the way, and then the Maui decision happened. And before the
Maui decision, groundwater was not considered to be an access to navigable
waters. So it was an incredible shift in how the EPA was evaluating the Clean
Water Act, how the State Department of Health was viewing the Clean Water
Act. And so our regulators, who we respond to, were responding to a sea tide
change. So that complicates a representation. And as you know, infrastructure
and the wastewater treatment infrastructure on this island is a big deal.
And this case is more than about just this case. This case could have implications
in other areas in the County. And having a really thoughtful approach to it and
having a team onboard that knows the law, understands the ramifications to it, I
really don't think could be any more important. And as the legal advisor to the
County, I think the County would be better served by having somebody that has
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that expertise. And I don't think that just for protecting a single wastewater
treatment plant. I'm talking about in terms of the broad approach this County
takes to wastewater, and it could have that big of an impact on this County.
And I think—well, I owe it to myself to tell you that I think the County would be
better served with people that have more expertise in this area, to the extent that
people may feel frustrated with how the direction of the County has gone to date.
I would say to them: "Then please applaud our effort to get other counsel with
more expertise onboard to respond and evaluate this." So I see it as kind of a win-
win, no matter what your position is, unless what you really want to see happen is
the County fail in this lawsuit and all of the ramifications that come along with
that where you have something against just philosophically the County not doing
everything.
But I've sat in meetings with you folks for three years now, and it's not
uncommon for departments to come before this body to ask for help when they
don't—to hire outside services when they either don't have the expertise to do it
or the resources to handle it. And I haven't seen this body take the position that,
"Well, because you didn't do something before, or the County didn't do
something before, we're not going to provide you with the resources you need to
do your job today."
And so I would just hope that this body can separate out the prior decisions that
were made, the policy decisions that have to be made or you want made
regardless of this lawsuit, and the lawsuit and the legal needs of the County. And
that's really a very long-winded answer to what would happen, but it would not
be insignificant.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you for that. And I think what I'm
taking away from that right now, from your answer, is the community is saying,
"We don't want to spend money on a lawsuit or legal counsel. We want the
money to be spent on the remedy." I understand that. But what you just said is,
"If we don't put funding towards it, fine. We're still going to have to address the
lawsuit. We're just going to address it with existing resources." So we're still
going to spend resources to go to bat with this lawsuit with legal counsel,
regardless of whether we put funding towards it or not. That's what I just heard.
Okay.
And then can I come back to—and I think you said this is the last hearing. The
implications of this Maui ruling I think are going to turn into a statewide, if not
federal-wide or nationwide, implications, right. That's what I'm hearing right
now.
MS. STRANCE: Yes. The Maui decision was significant. It resulted in a much-
broader reading of the Clean Water Act. So it used to be that if you could there
was like a pipe draining into a river. That was kind of what they were looking at.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
And so the groundwater the connection of groundwater to pollution into
navigable waters was greatly expanded.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: The reason I'm saying that is if it becomes
an issue that's affecting our entire County, but more so it starts to affect every
other county in our State, the State should be looking at this and saying, "Hey, we
might as well jump in because this is actually going to affect every single
county."
MS. STRANCE: The State is obligated to jump in through the Department of
Health. The Department of Health is the body assigned by the EPA to evaluate
and process NPDES permits. We have our own State clean water legislation, and
so everybody is looking at it. And as I've mentioned a few minutes ago, the EPA,
in November, issued updated guidelines on groundwater and NPDES permits and
set a deadline for a public response to that for later this month.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Are they offering to assist with legal counsel
at all or finances for legal counsel?
MS. STRANCE: I'm sorry?
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Is the State offering to provide funding or
legal counsel or anything? Or is it just they're going to leave that to every county
along the way that's going to get hit with different cases like this as we go
forward?
MS. STRANCE: A little bit of both. Where the public doesn't feel that
regulatory bodies or parties are living up to the requirements of the law, the laws,
especially environmental laws, allow for citizen lawsuits. And that's what this is.
That was what the Maui case was. It was because the county had the wastewater
treatment plant, it's identified as the polluter.
And because the State and the Federal government weren't coming in and saying,
"Maui, you guys need to change how you run your wastewater treatment plant,"
the citizen lawsuit was what brought that to the attention of the court. The court
then went to the Federal District Court. The Federal District Court made one
ruling. Then it went up to the Ninth Circuit Court, then the Ninth Circuit Court
adopted a different ruling and a different standard for how you decide whether the
Clean Water Act applied. And then when it went up to the Supreme Court, the
Supreme Court entered a different decision than either the Ninth Circuit or the
District Court did. And then, on top of that, they didn't provide a bright line test
for how you determine. They described factors.
There's language in the opinion that I just have. They said the difficulty with this
approach, the approach that they were ruling on, is that it does not, on its own,
clearly explain how to deal with middle instances. So it was a direct(inaudible) a
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few feet. That's clear that the law applies. And a hundred miles away, that's too
far; that doesn't apply. And so there's these middle instances, and it leads both to
regulatory agencies and citizen lawsuits to tease out those standards as they go
along. So it's not uncommon in new developments and areas of law you do a
broader pronouncement, and then as fact-specific cases come before the court, it
takes greater shape.
So we're in that period where it's not altogether clear. And so this lawsuit is
about pushing this County to adopt a certain interpretation of the law, or in hopes
that the Department of Health or the EPA adopts other standards that would
clearly apply, or to argue that the facts in our wastewater treatment plant are
similar enough to the facts in the Maui case that the Maui rationale should govern
this case. And so that's really how this law is developing.
And again, having people that have experience in this area—not just know it, but
experience where you have that piece of wisdom to kind of walk through with the
CountyI think would be tremendously helpful.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: What was Maui's response after the ruling?
Did they redo all their infrastructure and move a wastewater treatment facility?
What was their immediate response?
MS. STRANCE: I don't know what the immediate response was. My
understanding is that Maui has agreed to do an R-1 upgrade to their wastewater
treatment plant, but I don't know the details of what happened (inaudible).
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: They were sued in like manner?
MS. STRANCE: Yeah.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And then their response was to say, "Okay,
we'll upgrade to `x' wastewater treatment status."
MS. STRANCE: After all was said and done and it came back from the Supreme
Court, because the Supreme Court just made a ruling that their treatment plant fell
under the jurisdiction of the Clean Water Act, and the county needed to file for an
NPDES permit. And so it's through the filing of the NPDES permit that the
parameters of the wastewater treatment plant's operations gets teased out. So I
don't know exactly where things are in that lawsuit, whether there are anything
that is still pending or whether there was a negotiated resolution that allowed the
lawsuit to—well, supervision over the lawsuit to close.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Was the lawsuit brought forward by the
same entity? Earthjustice?
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MS. STRANCE: Earthjustice is the same law firm. The actual parties in that
case were Maui residents, and the actual parties in this case are Hawaii County
residents.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Okay, that's helpful. I hear our
community but it's an interesting spot. Usually, we have to approve a sum that
you folks are going to have to go to battle, but it's because of I guess a different
reason. I'm not saying this correctly. But in this case, it's like we're being asked
not to provide the funding to provide legal counsel against a lawsuit. That's a
weird place to be in from my end. I'm listening to—hearing the community and
understanding, and pollution and everything else and the Maui ruling, but also
being here to make sure we take care of the County and our constituents in the
same manner, that's just a strange kind of a conundrum, I guess, to be in.
MS. STRANCE: That's a nice way of putting it.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I yield. Thank you, Ms. Strance.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. You know when we had the line of fires, it kind of
brought everybody together to look at now everybody's talking about possible
solutions and changing things, and lots of ideas floating. So, when this came in
front of us, it kind of felt like "Boom!" a flash point again. The community's
talking about it; they're like "What can we do to move forward?" And I
wondered, can we have a multipronged approach where we say to Ramzi,
Environmental Management Commission, "We want you to move forward to plan
some water recycling effort, and we want to see you come back to us with a
proposed plan for water recycling"? We could do that.
We could say we'll hire someone to help us in this lawsuit, and then we could say
we want you to, in this upcoming budget, to ask for a couple more staff. The
reason being is environmental law—in this conversation, we're talking about how
things are coming. Environment is a new area of law that is expanding. More
and more people want us to focus on the environment. Should we get you more
mitigation staff or just other staff to beef up your department? I mean, again, it's
a multipronged approach, knowing that this kind of all of a sudden turned our
eyes to this issue,just like the line of fire did. There's going to be a lot of
changes with Codes and zoning. I mean, I could see all kinds of stuff coming out
over the next year because of the line of fire. Is there more that we should be
talking about than just do this lawsuit; get you help to defend us?
MS. STRANCE: I don't want to step out of my lane. Our department is about
providing legal counsel and representation. What I can say is that what you just
described was a list of policy priorities and that those are priorities that you folks
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
work on every day, and that you have multiple meetings with department heads,
and you have a budget process.
And so teasing out what the needs of the County are and whether we're
appropriately staffed, that may be a project for the new OSCER (Office of
Sustainability, Climate, Equity, and Resilience) coordinator. That position is
part of it is to take a bird's-eye view of the County from an environmental
perspective. And so one of the tasks that that person could take on or
observations that person could make is the County isn't properly staffed to
address the climate change needs, the environmental needs; and then start talking
about what that would look like. My perspective tends to be fairly narrow, and it
requires a much broader approach.
When I was in college, you could major in political science or history, and then
there were two majors in my college that were interdisciplinary. They were
environmental studies and public policy. I majored in public policy. It required
taking classes in economics, classes in environmental science, all those kinds of
things. But it kind of highlights maybe your roles as policymakers and the
County's role the Administration's role in addressing and planning for other
environmental issues and climate change, you know, really come together. And
you folks have made some progress on that last year with the creation of the
OSCER office.
MS. EVANS: If we do the multipronged approach, does that impact at all the
lawsuit?
MS. STRANCE: Yes and no. I mean, the Department of Environmental
Management has already filed with the Department of Health a permit for an R-I
upgrade to the Kealakehe Wastewater Treatment Plant. And so, if issues that are
raised in the lawsuit are no longer issues in the lawsuit, they go away or they
morph to something different. And so what I was saying earlier today about the
lawsuit is only one piece, but there's nothing that would prevent the County from
moving forward on a number of these other initiatives. And this body should not
look at this lawsuit as a stop to its other initiatives.
MS. EVANS: I'm glad to hear that because I see this as an opportunity to maybe
shift a little bit what we're doing in our environmental area on the island, but
thank you. Thank you, Chair. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Council
Member Villegas, you're ready?
MS. VILLEGAS: As ready as I'm going to be. Yes. First off, I want to thank
my colleagues for your patience with me and learning in this process, and for your
trust and understanding that my truest intention is to get us where we need to be,
which doesn't jeopardize Corp. Counsel, nor does it jeopardize the continued
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
health and safety of our oceans and our waters, and that it essentially gets us to
where we want to be.
So what I am bringing forth—is it okay if I do that now?
MR. HENRICKS: You can. And then while we have this time, we can briefly
just talk procedurally about something that we don't do often, while we're waiting
for the communication to come through in a numbered format. So,please. And
then when you're ready, I'll be happy to fill in a little bit about what we can
MS. VILLEGAS: I'm sorry, can you speak up a little bit?
MR. HENRICKS: Sure, I'm sorry. Yes, this is a good time to talk about it. But
then we can talk procedurally, too, about something we don't do very often,
which is you're going to be making a motion to amend by substitution. At least
that is what you anticipate doing.
MS. VILLEGAS: Yes. Yeah, learning new things every day. Apparently,
something that is possible is when there are these many amendments and versions
and complications, that it is possible to amend a resolution by substitution. So
what I handed to you now, as the Clerk's office, under the time constraint and the
seriousness of this issue and the desire to provide Corp. Counsel with the support
they need in order to move forward with the contracts that already exist and the
need for legal counsel in that capacity, I've been advised that I have the
opportunity to amend by substitution. Is that something you might—could you
share a little bit about that?
MR. HENRICKS: Again, because it doesn't happen too often on the Council, but
it has happened before. Robert's Rules provides that"a motion to amend by
striking out an entire paragraph, section, or article—or a complete main motion or
resolution—and inserting a different paragraph or other unit in its place is called a
motion to substitute, and the paragraph or resolution to be inserted is said to be
offered(or proposed) as `a substitute."' Robert's further provides that the motion
to substitute often provides a convenient and time-saving method for handling a
poorly framed resolution, not in this instance, or for producing a different and
better approach to the real question raised by a main motion.
So, because of the constraints we're under and the volume of amendments that
Ms. Villegas would like to put before the Council, there will not be any Ramseyer
format applied. It will just be essentially taking the attached resolution that is
coming forward, or that you're looking at now that will be numbered and come
forward, and replacing what is in 372 with the attachment. So, again, that's why
she's providing it now, to encourage ample time to fully review the contents at
this point in time.
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MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you, Mr. Clerk. So I understand and follow protocol as
much as possible, even though that doesn't seem to be in my nature today, can we
then talk about what each of the Council Members are looking at? Or do we need
to wait for Draft 2 of Resolution 372 to come forth numbered and whatnot?
MR. HENRICKS: Ideally, you would wait for the numbered item because it
would be the official document. However, I wouldn't restrict you folks from
beginning to discuss what's in front of you right now since it will be identical to
what you'll be proposing as a substitute.
MS. VILLEGAS: Okay. In that case, I will start by thanking Corp. Counsel
for
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Villegas, what I would suggest procedurally
at this time is that we do get a motion on the floor, even though we don't have this
numbered. I think that's probably more proper in terms of procedure.
MR. HENRICKS: Hard to do without a number and then I
CHR. KIMBALL: It is. I'm trying to think of an appropriate motion.
MR. INABA: I have a question.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: So, when we do get whatever document's coming, it doesn't look
like an amendment. It's just a brand new clean resolution. Is that right?
MS. VILLEGAS: Yes. However, there is an opportunity, and I'd like to think,
because of the succinctness and the compatibility of the two documents, it doesn't
take more than two minutes but to look through and see where there have been
additions or changes. And I'm happy to go through that with everybody because
it's not so cumbersome as to be unliftable.
MR. INABA: So there's two additional documents coming. One's a clean copy
of the resolution that would replace
MS. VILLEGAS: No. What you have in front of you, while not numbered, is the
clean copy of the resolution that would be considered Draft 2 of
Resolution 372-23 and replacing it.
CHR. KIMBALL: So if I may
Point of Order: MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair, point of order. I do not have the documents that are
being referenced in the present discussion. All I have before me is
Communication 620.89.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MR. HENRICKS: I think we should wait.
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: So, if we could recess until I have all of the documents that
everybody is looking at, that would be really helpful. Thank you.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. My apologies.
CHR. KIMBALL: Okay, we'll take another recess here until 4:45. But before we
take that recess, the thing that I want to be cautious of is that we do not delay in
such a way that there's an appearance that we're trying to force an outcome, right.
So we need to be succinct and move quickly on this when we come back into
order because if there's any perception that the timing is intended to manipulate
the vote, then I think that that's problematic. So, with that, I will recess us until
4:45, then we will come back. Hopefully, we will have the documents in hand at
that time.
Recess: At 4:37 p.m., the Chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 4:45 p.m.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Villegas, you have the floor, and I believe
we now have, officially, the numbered document in front of us. So if you'd like
to start with a motion, please.
Motion to Amend: Ms. Villegas moved to amend Res. 372-23 by substitution
with the contents of Comm. 620.90. Seconded by
Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
CHR. KIMBALL: Council Member Villegas, you have the floor. If you would
please walk us through the changes between the two versions of the resolution.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you. First off, I want to acknowledge Council
Member Kierkiewicz and ensure that she has the documents. Okay, great. Okay,
thank you. Okay, so in order to do this as expeditiously as possible and to honor
and humbly apologize to the public for not having this in front of them and it not
being in Ramseyer format, but I hope that everyone will understand the
extenuating circumstances, and doing the best I can under these circumstances.
Okay, so if you look at page 1, there are no changes to the whereases. If you go
to page 2, there are no changes until you get to "WHEREAS"No. 14, which
changes to instead of stating, "a multi-year agreement will allow the County to
employ Special Counsel who can provide services on a continuing and consistent
basis for the lawsuit's duration,"we took out"for the lawsuit's duration." And
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
instead it reads, "A multi-year agreement will allow the County to employ Special
Counsel who can provide services on a continuing and consistent basis."
"WHEREAS"No. 15: We have done essentially the same thing. Instead of
reading, "pursuant to Charter 6-5.5, Corporation Counsel wishes to enter into a
multi-year agreement with Schlack Ito to provide the County's legal defense in
the Lawsuit for the Lawsuit's duration," instead it says, "pursuant to
Charter 6-5.5, Corporation Counsel wishes to enter into a multi-year agreement
with Schlack Ito to represent the County in the Lawsuit."
Number 16 "WHEREAS": No changes. Seventeenth "WHEREAS": We have
added new whereases and they read as such: "WHEREAS, the Council supports a
negotiated resolution of the Lawsuit and a County commitment and timeline to
upgrade the Kealakehe Wastewater Treatment Plant to R-1 quality water." And
adding another "WHEREAS": "The Council urges the County to prioritize
alternative dispute resolution to resolve the Lawsuit."
And a 19d' "WHEREAS": "The Council understands a negotiated resolution of a
dispute requires the willingness of all parties to participate in that process and to
reach agreement on settlement terms and conditions." And the addition of a
20d' "WHEREAS": "On November 20, 2023, United States District Court for the
District of Hawaii (`the Court'), the County, and Hui Malama Honokohau agreed
to split the trial into two phases, the liability phase, and the remedies phase."
And No. 21 "WHEREAS": "The Court entered a Rule 16 Scheduling Order that
set dates for the liability phase and Settlement Conferences." And the
22nd "WHEREAS": "The Court set the start date for a non jury trial for the
liability phase on November 5, 2024." And the 23rd "WHEREAS": "The Court
will schedule dates for the remedies phase of the Lawsuit if necessary, after
conclusion of the liability phase." And the 24h "WHEREAS": "The Council
may withhold future funding authorization should it determine alternative dispute
resolution was not prioritized by the County and/or the administration fails to
expeditiously move forward on a Kealakehe Wastewater Treatment Plant R-1
upgrade." And a final "WHEREAS,"the 25h "WHEREAS": "The agreement is
anticipated to cover the Lawsuit commencing on or about December 11, 2023."
Going into the `BE IT RESOLVED": There are no changes to the first and the
second or the third "WHEREAS." I'm sorry, the third "WHEREAS" has been
edited to read instead of saying, "The Mayor is hereby authorized to enter into a
multi-year agreement with Schlack Ito for the legal professional services for the
duration of the Lawsuit as described above," it now says, "The Mayor is hereby
authorized to enter into a multi-year agreement with Schlack Ito for the legal
professional services for the Lawsuit as described above."
And so the fourth `BE IT RESOLVED" has been amended to read instead of
"that sufficient funds be budgeted in future fiscal years to cover the anticipated
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
obligations of the County under the terms of the agreement," instead it reads,
"that sufficient funds be budgeted in future fiscal years to cover the anticipated
obligations of the County for the Lawsuit under the terms of the agreement."
Those are the changes that we have made in collaborative effort in order to
remedy the issues highlighted by community as pertains to this resolution. I
yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Do you want to give a point of order or point of information?
Point of Order: MS. KAGIWADA: Yeah, a point of order. I think there was one more under the
"BE IT RESOLVED"No. 1. I think you struck "and defend the County against."
MS. VILLEGAS: Yes. My apologies. Great eye.
MS. KAGIWADA: Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Inaba will set
you off on the discussion.
MR. INABA: Thank you, Council Member Villegas, for the work. Just in this
not being standard practice with the Ramseyer format, I'd rather see this
postponed if we're going to take an amendment to the resolution this late in the
day. And then only if people were watching the video and have access to
Laserfiche were they going to be able to get a new copy of the resolution, and at
this point it's too late for them to testify. So I just don't think the Council should
take action at this point with what we have before us in the interest of
transparency. So I'll leave it at that, and will have to vote "no" on these matters if
I need to vote. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Inaba. Further discussion?
Council Member Evans.
MS. EVANS: First of all, I love how it's been changed to really be transparent on
what this lawsuit is about. And it really has clarity in terms of more of a policy
direction from the Council, which I really like. Yeah, I just had one question, and
it had to do about Administration failing to expeditiously move forward. How
would you interpret"expeditiously"?
MS. STRANCE: Elizabeth Strance, Corporation Counsel. That would be up to
each individual Council Member to make that decision.
MS. EVANS: So we would make kind of a subjective decision if we feel the
County was expeditious or not.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MS. STRANCE: Yes. I mean, the way that this would happen is our office
needing to come in for additional funds for the lawsuit. And it's an expression of
the Council's sentiment that if they're not seeing progress in these areas, that it's
reserving the right to withhold funds. And so it's an expression of what this
Council may look at if we were to come in for additional funding for
representation.
MS. EVANS: Okay. The other thing is I hear what our Council Member Inaba is
saying about having transparency. One of the things that I kind of felt like when
you brought this in front of us, it's like we need to do it and we need to do it right
now. And yet, it's been in front of the County since September. When did you
first hear about this lawsuit? I mean, obviously, you've been working on it, and
you've been making decisions internally how you're going to move forward on it.
How long have you known about the lawsuit?
MS. STRANCE: We learned that the lawsuit was filed either the day or the day
after.
MS. EVANS: So that's in September, the end of September. Okay. Well, I think
that's important. And I appreciate the fact that you worked—if you learned about
it on September 25h, I would say good for you because you had to make a lot of
decisions and a lot of movement, and talking to a lot of folks to get this in front of
us when you did. So I appreciate the expeditiousness that you and your staff has
done, but I do understand where Member Inaba is saying this is in front of us and
the public isn't seeing it. They're hearing us talk about it tonight, but they're not
really seeing it to know what we're considering. I do not know if Member Inaba
is going to make a motion to postpone or what, but I hear his concern. But I have
to tell you I really like, Member Villegas, I like what I see. And so thank you so
much. I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Anyone else?
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Chair?
CHR. KIMBALL: Checking in in Hilo. Go ahead, Council
Member Kierkiewicz.
MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. I just want to thank and commend Council
Member Villegas for these very comprehensive amendments to the resolution. I
think it showcases our commitment to having the highest standards of
environmental protection and compliance for our systems within the County.
In reflecting and reviewing all of the testimony that's come in related to
reconsideration, I really do think that these amendments capture what the
community was looking for in terms of more clarity in what exactly was taking
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place with the Council authorizing special counsel. I'm going to be supporting
the resolution and hope that we are able to move this forward today.
I just want to especially highlight where we talk about alternate dispute resolution
mechanisms. I know that that was something that was stated at Council, but to
see it represented here makes me feel really comfortable because it means that we
are looking for every single way to be a bit more efficient, cost-effective, and
collaborative in finding solutions. And I also like that we've identified potential
time lines for implementing alternate solutions. So I'm going to be supporting
this and encourage my colleagues to do so as well,that way Corp. Counsel is able
to get the dedicated legal counsel it needs in this special area of environmental
matters. Thank you, Chair, I yield.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. Council
Member Kagiwada.
MS. KAGIWADA: Thank you. Thank you to my colleague for doing this and
doing this under a very quick time line. I would be happy to support this as is. I
also agree that I think you've really addressed the issues that we've heard from
the public here. I understand Council Member Inaba wanting to have more input,
but I feel like we've gotten a lot of input, and these things really address that. I
think this doesn't really go against anything we were talking about before. This is
really in line. It just gives some level of comfort I think to the public to lay it out
a little more in detail and understand that, yeah, where they maybe felt
uncomfortable with government not laying out as much detail in the past, that this
is just a way to lay out our intentions in the document itself.
I just want to ask Corporation Counsel: I'm assuming that you're okay with this.
Are you okay with it?
MS. STRANCE: Yes.
MS. KAGIWADA: Okay. Sorry. Okay, I just was assuming. Because, like I
said, I don't think it was really anything different than you intended anyway. So,
yeah, I would be happy to support today and go with the body if you really feel
if everybody else really wants to postpone. As Council Member Inaba said, if
everybody else feels strongly that we need to wait to have more people weigh in, I
would be okay with that, but I'm also perfectly happy to support it today.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Kagiwada. Council Member
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Which part of the resolution guides your
abilities? Is it the `BE IT RESOLVED" or is it the "WHEREAS"?
MS. STRANCE: I'm sorry?
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Which portion of the resolution guides what
you folks do? Is it the `BE IT RESOLVED" or is it the "WHEREAS"? Is it the
entire document?
MS. STRANCE: The `BE IT RESOLVED"provisions are the authorizing
provisions. So that's where the Council has authorized our office to go ahead and
retain counsel for the lawsuit. The "WHEREAS"clauses are the reasons given
for the authorization. And so the resolution is now kind of constructed in two
parts. The first part is what we asked for. The second part addresses the concerns
raised by this body and the community. And so it provides helpful information, I
think, in terms of a guidance document about what you folks would be looking at
should our office come back before you. That would be communicated to
Schlack Ito as well.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. I appreciated the amount of time that
went into creating this and the collaboration with Ms. Villegas. I hear Mr. Inaba.
My feeling is this needs to move forward, and I might get hated for that comment
by some of the community members who testified against it. They wanted this
back on the table. They wanted the discussion and I completely understand that.
I'm not against it. But I also feel like this needs to happen. And so I'm going to
support the substitution today. It's very much—it's similar enough but creates
more context of what we're asking for and what the community is asking for, and
it provides the same abilities to your department to move forward.
The main reason is, given what you said earlier, you're going to do this one way
or the other. Either there's going to be outside counsel, or it's going to be our
office that's doing it. That kind of sums it up for me. So I'll be supporting this
today. Thank you. And to the maker, thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Evans,
briefly.
MS. EVANS: Thank you. Just a clarifying question. In the last`BE IT
RESOLVED,"which is No. 4, it says, "sufficient funds be budgeted in future
fiscal years to cover the anticipated obligations of the County for the Lawsuit
under the terms of the agreement." Can you tell me "under the terms of the
agreement,"what agreement?
MS. STRANCE: It would be
MS. EVANS: Is it the agreement with the special counsel, or is it the
agreement I mean, I just don't know what agreement is that referring to.
MS. STRANCE: I hear what you're saying, and that might have been crafted
better. But it would be the expectation that a budget be developed in
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collaboration with the Schlack Ito firm, and that that get reflected in any future
requests.
MS. EVANS: So,just playing it out into the future, so if there is a future fiscal
year and you have terms of agreement with them what the anticipated cost may be
in future fiscal years, you still have to come back to the Council and ask that it be
appropriated. And if the Council doesn't agree with the dollar amount, you can
go back and renegotiate the agreement? I mean, I'm just—the cart before the
horse or whatever they say.
MS. STRANCE: Yes, it's probably not like that. Most litigation expenses are
going to be fixed costs. So we can't negotiate how much it costs for a transcript.
We can't negotiate with experts as to their hourly fees. And the hourly fee for
Schlack Ito will be set in the agreement. The issue is that there's a budgeted
amount of$200,000 that's stated in the resolution. And so that's the current
budget that's being authorized. And so if we were to go beyond that budget, we
would need to put something before you to explain the rationale for further
expenses.
MS. EVANS: So, to alleviate any concerns, this is not assigning a blank check
because there's going to be plenty opportunities to have a check and balance on
this. Even though we don't know what the terms of agreement are right now,
there will be a check and balance because you have to come back to the future
Council to ask for more money if there is a need. Is that a correct way to say that?
MS. STRANCE: Yes.
MS. EVANS: Okay. All right. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Evans.
MS. VILLEGAS: One last comment, Chair?
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead.
MS. VILLEGAS: I would be remiss to not say thank you to my staff who have
endured a heck of a day chasing rabbit holes for me and enduring a constantly
changing of direction. So thank you to Candy Alnas and Davelyn Barido, to LRB
(Legislative Research Branch) who also endured quite a day, and to the Clerk's
office. And thank you to our County Clerk for his guidance in providing even the
option of something I did not know was possible. And I honor and completely
understand Council Member Inaba's hesitation to support this based on
extenuating circumstances, and it not being in alignment with an ideal format.
But I want to thank my colleagues also for their support in moving this forward. I
yield.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Villegas. Council
Member Inaba, briefly.
MR. INABA: Is it possible to make a motion to postpone with an amendment on
the floor? Noting everyone wanting to move it forward, I will make the motion to
postpone this to the January 10h Council meeting.
Motion to Postpone: Mr. Inaba moved to postpone Res. 372-23 to January 10,
2024. Seconded by Mr. Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any discussion? Council Member Inaba.
MR. INABA: Just, again, I do think that we should have a Ramseyer format.
And everything Council Member Villegas pointed out and the changes, I don't
think anyone has a problem with. But to track it in the way that we usually do
and the process that we do, I'm not ready. But happy to take the vote on the
postponement and we can move forward. Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead. I'm not sure who was first over here. Fight it out.
MS. VILLEGAS: He was first. Go ahead.
CHR. KIMBALL: Go ahead, Council Member Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Ms. Strance,the case began December I Ph,
correct?
MS. STRANCE: No, the case was filed on September 25h.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Sorry, what began December I Vh? because I
know there's a time-sensitive nature to this resolution.
MS. STRANCE: The backdate to December 10' is to correspond with the prior
passage of this resolution. And because of the unprecedented nature of a motion
to reconsider a resolution, we assumed that the resolution had passed; we signed
an agreement with Schlack Ito. They entered an appearance in the case and our
counsel of record. And so the December 10' is really to address our confidence
in the original vote. And so the concern I have is that I don't want to put them or
my office in kind of an ethics issue of their authority to be acting on our behalf
and having to go through the (inaudible)process and the appearance process with
the court. So that's where that date came from.
We're currently in the process of responding to discovery requests, and they have
jumped in to take the lead on that, and there's deadlines associated with those.
And so we would be in a difficult situation if we had to jump back in and take
over on the response to those because we're not as up to speed. And I don't
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
know, Britt, if you have anything to add onto that piece of it, but that's really the
case is proceeding, and we'll proceed. I think if it was postponed again, we'd
have to discuss with them whether we felt comfortable with them continuing to be
counsel of record without this authorization, or if we should withdraw. We would
have to make that decision and so would they.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: It would put us about three-and-a-half weeks
from now if we postponed it and then heard it then in the January date, and then it
was approved. What would happen in the meantime? Would that set you back?
Would you be stuck? Would we just fall apart?
MS. STRANCE: Well, if it's approved, it's backdated to December 11. It's just
that I don't want to count on the resolution passing later. I'm not comfortable,
really, with continuing to have somebody represent us without your authorization.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Sorry, maybe a better question: What
happens between now and then if we postpone?
MS. STRANCE: There's work to be done and there's ongoing work in the case.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: And they'd be doing it without an
agreement in place.
MS. STRANCE: Well, they'd be doing with an agreement that wasn't
authorized. And so I was comfortable with a little bit of cushion, but it's not the
way we're supposed to be doing things.
MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Thank you.
CHR. KIMBALL: Any further comments? Council Member Villegas.
MS. VILLEGAS: Thank you for sharing and clarifying that. And for my
colleagues' knowledge, we went through. It would have been a much shorter day
had it been communicated that we thought that postponing this was a viable
option without threatening negative outcomes and jeopardizing the things that are
happening or putting anyone in potential for a questionable representation or
whatnot. Believe me, I would have brought a request to postpone. So I do ask for
the support of my colleagues in not passing a postponement, and instead moving
this forward today.
I'm also told by our Clerk that there is opportunity afterwards to bring forth the
Ramseyer format, and I will be working with him to do that with the hope that
that assuages concerns by my colleagues and any by the public, that they be able
to see it formatted in a way we're more accustomed to seeing amendments. So,
with that, I leave this here with my request and intention that we do not pass a
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postponement, and we instead vote on moving this forward today. I want to say
"amen" for some reason.
CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you, Council Member Villegas. With that, I'll just
make a brief comment. I share Council Member Kierkiewicz' opinion as well as
Council Member Villegas' that there was extensive public comment,public
testimony, on this piece of legislation. And I think the amendments derived were
primarily from those comments and that feedback. And I know that Council
Member Villegas looked closely at some suggested language from a few people.
And so I don't feel like we're pulling any kind of bait and switch here. We are
actually just incorporating the language that we were asked to incorporate. And
so, because of that, I am not concerned about a need to hold this over.
I think we've responded to the requests that were made in public testimony, which
is, one would argue, essentially how this is all supposed to work. So, with that, I
will proceed with the motion, requesting a roll call from Clerk on the motion to
postpone.
Vote on Motion to The motion to postpone Res. 372-23 to January 10, 2024,
Postpone: failed by the following roll call vote:
Failed
Ayes: Council Member Inaba— 1.
Noes: Council Members Evans, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Villegas,
and Chair Kimball —6.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Lee Loy —2.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Now, we are back to the amendment. Any further discussion
on the amendment of Resolution 372-23? I think we've had pretty good dialogue.
All right, moving forward with that, Mr. Clerk, again a roll call on the motion to
amend by substitution.
Vote on Motion to The motion to amend Res. 372-23 by substitution with the
Amend: contents of Comm. 620.90 was carried by the following roll
(Approved) call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Villegas,
and Chair Kimball —6.
Noes: Council Member Inaba— 1.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Lee Loy —2.
Excused: None.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
Vote on Motion to Mr. Inaba moved to suspend Council Rule 23 to waive the
Suspend Council holdover for the substantive amendment of Res. 372-23.
Rules: Seconded by Ms. Kagiwada and carried by the following
(Approved) voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Villegas,
and Chair Kimball —7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Lee Loy —2.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: Now, we are back to the main motion on approval of
Resolution 372, as amended by substitution. Council Member Evans. No, we're
good? Okay. Anyone else, conversation about the main motion? Seeing none,
Mr. Clerk, roll call again, please.
Vote on Res. 372-23: The motion to adopt Res. 372-23, as amended to Draft 2,
Draft 2 was carried by the following roll call vote:
(Adopted)
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Kagiwada,
Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Villegas,
and Chair Kimball —6.
Noes: Council Member Inaba— 1.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Lee Loy —2.
Excused: None.
(Note: Mr. Inaba voted "kanalua"then "no.")
OTHER The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Other
BUSINESS: Business.
(Note: Items in this category were taken up previously, out of order.)
ANNOUNCE- The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business,
MENTS: Announcements.
(There were none.)
ADJOURN- The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business,
MENT: Adjournment.
Motion to There being no further business, at 5:21 p.m., Mr. Inaba moved to adjourn the
Adjourn: meeting. Seconded by Ms. Kagiwada.
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Hawaii County Council-28 December 20,2023
CHR. KIMBALL: Before we adjourn, I want to mahalo my entire board here at
this Council. I want to just say what an excellent body of bright people that work
hard to get things done. I'm so impressed with the variety of deliberations that
happened today. So congratulations,team. And here's to a wonderful year with
you all. Happy holidays to everyone. Merry Christmas and we will see you all in
the new year. With that, all those in favor of adjournment please say "aye."
Vote on Motion to The motion to adjourn was carried by the following voice
Adjourn: vote:
(Approved)
Ayes: Council Members Evans, Inaba, Kagiwada,
Kanealii-Kleinfelder, Kierkiewicz, Villegas,
and Chair Kimball —7.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Members Galimba and Lee Loy—2.
Excused: None.
CHR. KIMBALL: It is 5:21. We are adjourned. Mahalo and happy holidays.
Council Approval:
FEB 2 1 2024
COTY C
J-I/dg
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