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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN CRCOC 2024/08/06 (2022-2024)m• an Lei %114 ROLL CALL: Committee on Communications, Reports, and Council Oversight 32nd Session Hawaii County Building 25 Aupuni Street Hilo, Hawaii August 6, 2024 The regular meeting of the Committee on Communications, Reports, and Council Oversight was called to order at 3:00 p.m., in the Council Chambers, Hilo, by Ms. Jenn Kagiwada, Acting Chair. Present: Ms. Jenn Kagiwada, Acting Chair Ms. Cindy Evans, Member (via videoconference in Kona) Ms. Michelle M. Galimba, Member Ms. Ashley L. Kierkiewicz, Member Ms. Heather L. Kimball, Member Ms. Susan L. K. Lee Loy, Member Absent & Excused: Mr. Holeka Goro Inaba, Member Mr. Matt Kdneali'i-Kleinfelder, Member Ms. Rebecca Villegas, Chair STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, FROM THE Statements from the Public on Agenda Items. PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: (There were none.) COMMUNI- The Acting Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, CATIONS: Communications. Comm. 946: REQUESTS A PRESENTATION BY HAWAIIAN ELECTRIC'S DIRECTOR OF GOVERNMENT AND COMMUNITY AFFAIRS JENNIFER ZELKO- SCHLUETER REGARDING ITS WILDFIRE SAFETY STRATEGY AND PUBLIC SAFETY POWER SHUTOFF PROGRAM From Council Member Heather L. Kimball, dated July 9, 2024. ; and Comm. 946. 1: from Council Member Heather L. Kimball, dated July 29, 2024, transmitting a slide deck from Hawaiian Electric. Motion to Close File: Ms. Kimball moved to close file on Comm. 946. Seconded by Ms. Lee Loy. CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Council Member Kimball. MS. KIMBALL: Wanted to invite our friends from Hawaiian Electric up to the table to give us their presentation with regard to the Public Safety Power Shutoff (PSPS) strategy. Obviously, a really important strategy with respect to wildfire prevention in our County. I know that they're trying to do as much community outreach as possible and happy to provide the opportunity today for them to educate us so we can share with our constituents, but also use our Council hearing as a vehicle to reach even more people about what the plan entails. So, go ahead, introduce yourselves and take it away. (Note: At this time, Hawaiian Electric Light Company's Director of Government and Community Affairs Jennifer Zelko-Schlueter and Director of Hawaii Island Kevin Waltjen came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MS. ZELKO-SCHLUETER: Awesome. Aloha, Jennifer Zelko, Director of Government and Community Affairs for Hawaiian Electric. With me today is Kevin Waltjen, our Director of Hawaii Island. Big mahalo to Chair Kimball for requesting the presentation on our wildfire safety and the Public Safety Power Shutoff program. And of course, mahalo, Chair Kagiwada and members of the Committee, for time on today's agenda. But we also wanted to thank you folks for just the engagement over the last few months. We do know that community has been very concerned about wildfires and then specifically about the Public Safety Power Shutoff program, which is a last line of defense in extreme weather situations, extreme fire weather situations. So, thank you very much because you've been so responsive to your community and forwarding the request and getting responses out. I'm going to go through the beginning of this presentation very quickly because some of this we previewed in March when we were before this Committee in Kona, I believe. Then I'll turn it over to Kevin to talk specifically about Public Safety Power Shutoff. (Note: At this time, Hawaiian Electric Light Company's Director of Government and Community Affairs Jennifer Zelko-Schlueter and Director of Hawaii Island Kevin Waltjen provided a PowerPoint presentation to the members of the Committee. For viewing of the subject presentation, see the DVD copy of the meeting proceedings on file in the Clerk's Office. A copy of the PowerPoint presentation is made a part of the record, see Comm. 946.1.) ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Council Member Kimball, the floor is still yours. Page 2 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 CHR. KIMBALL: Thank you. Thank you both for being here and for providing that explanation. I think for my district and for the folks that have been in touch with me that —which the areas are not in my district but there's still concern, of course, the concerns about just notifying around medical needs. And thank you for highlighting that because I think that's a really important message for us to communicate, is if you have medical requirements that require electricity to make sure that you folks know that is the case so that you can prioritize the communication to those folks. So, thank you for bringing that up. I always use every opportunity I can to encourage people to sign up for Everbridge since those Civil Defense alerts would now include alerts from you guys. So, want to encourage the public to continue to sign up for that. I'll just conclude by thanking David for his contribution with respect to the dunk tank at the Relay for Life. He did get me once, I think. Yeah, but anyway, thank you for that. I'll yield to my colleagues. Thank you. ACTING CHR KAGIWADA: Alright. Anybody else have questions or comments? Council Member Lee Loy. MS. LEE LOY: Thanks, guys, for being here. Here it is the beginning of August, and I know we're all reflecting on Lahaina. So, this is actually such perfect timing. I was just, and maybe if I'm too far down in the weeds, guys, just tell me and we can have an offline conversation. As we were walking through the red flag warnings and some of the new local weather stations that we hope to implement, and then there was this cadence about advisory warning watch or warning advisory watch, it made me start to think about our tsunami warnings. I was just wondering if there's an alignment so that when we're sharing information with the general public, it's similar to that of just like our tsunami warnings or tsunami watches. This is what you guys prepare for if there is a tsunami advisory or warning. Has any thought been given to kind of bridging the same vocabulary so that when we know it's a watch, we're watching, right? Share with me a little bit about kind of that thought process. MR. WALTJEN: Okay, so I'll take a stab at this. We don't set that up. That actually comes from the National Weather Service. That is a good question because I always have the same question. When it comes to fire weather watch and red flag warning, there is a document on the National Weather Service that is called the Fire Operation Plan. It was updated in 2018, I think, but in there, with the way they described it is the fire weather watch will be the first thing that you kind of hear of. Then it will go to a red flag warning, and red warning, similar to like what you're addressing, there's a time frame on the red flag warning. They're saying that it's possible within these 48 hours. So, it kind of follows the same type of logic. Because this is new, we're starting to see how this thing kind of unrolls. I don't know how it looks like or works, but I do know when you read the documentation on the National Weather Service, it does describe this is the set Page 3 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 up; fire weather watch will come first, and red flag warning is within 48 hours. It is imminent or possible. MS. LEE LOY: I think it speaks to the preparation piece, right? So, if we know we have 48 hours, we know what we're going to do with the ice cream in the freezer or for those with special medical needs, what they need to be preparing for. If we could kind of keep a tickler on that as we kind of roll this out over time and how we can kind of communicate that very effectively, that hey guys, you've got 48 hours to get your house in order, whatever that looks like. I was also really —and this keeps me awake at night and my colleagues know this, that after what happened in California and our paradise fires, there was a huge exodus of our insurance policies, right? So, what I've tried to push really hard as far as conversations is what type of pieces like this are we, as a State and as a County, beginning to fall forward on so that we can demonstrate back to our policy holders that we actually have Firewise programs, which then limit the risk of fire which I'm hoping will translate to our insurance policy holders that we're mindful and we're investing in key programs like this that actually make us low risk compared to other areas. Talk to me a little bit about that and how we can share bigger messages to the commercial industries that this might seem like something we're doing locally, but it has a long impact to what we do when we're talking about finances for our community. MS. ZELKO-SHLUETER: Thanks, Council Member Lee Loy. I think you raised such a good point. I think the hope is through mitigation measures such as this one and then the coordination with landowners, talking to communities — Kevin and I met recently with a community in North Kohala who's really trying to keep fuel down in their neighborhoods. So, I think as you start to see communities and different folks getting together to reduce different things that would make your wildfire risk elevated, that there could be a message that is sent to those insurance agencies. I think that there was some hope that even at the State level there would be some discussion from maybe a policy standpoint that may be able to help. MS. LEE LOY: Yeah, and one of the lessons we learned with our friends from California was this Firewise program where they would take on cutting back a lot of the dry brush around the perimeter of their property to begin to mitigate and minimize some of that stuff, in addition to what does all the policies look like across the home, car, motorcycle. I just want to be able, for us as a State and as a community, to say look, Nationwide, Allstate, we can go on and on but have that conversation with our insurance companies that we're incredibly mindful, one, but two, investing dollars in preparedness. When you talk about that stakeholder conversation, when you talk about your key partners, not only first responders but that water companies and others, I think there's that next layer that we should begin to approach. Page 4 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 MS. ZELKO-SHLUETER: You reminded me of something else because I failed to mention them when I talked about those stakeholders that will be attending August 19. But Hawaii Wildfire Management Organization, which has been an incredible partner, and they started here on Hawaii Island, they're really helpful with the fire wise communities we see here on this island. I think it's a model actually for other communities. I think as you see that program grow and increase, I think it's going to be helpful for everyone. But really, they started it here and they've been very focused on this for some time, and I think it's gaining a lot of traction now given what happened last August. MS. LEE LOY: Great. Well, thanks friends, for being here, always so fun to see you folks. Thank you, Ms. Kimball, for advancing this conversation. I look forward to the things that we can start to, policy wise, start to address, but also throw out indicators to other areas like our insurances that let them know we're making key investments. Thank you, Chair, I yield. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Council. Member Lee Loy. I want to go over to Kona see if there are any questions or comments. Nobody's there. Okay. Alright. Anybody here? Council Member Galimba. MS. GALIMBA: Thank you. Just a very quick question, I think. I am gathering that the public safety turning off, does that have a mechanical element to it or is it entirely a decision policy tool? MR. WALTJEN: Okay so, let me try to capture that one. First and foremost, thank you for the question. It is a policy, right, but it is a tool. It takes the equipment that is there for us to go ahead and implement and say we're going to do it. The reason why it becomes more like a policy is because from our stant, right, we are responsible for operation of the electricity. So, it falls within our purview to go ahead and say, yes, with this case and scenario, there is a hazard therefore, we can turn it off. So, it falls into our incident management structure to go ahead and activate. Again, like I said, when we start this process, we'll stand up that incident management team that actually puts designated positions from the company in key roles so that we can manage the event. That's very important because the company still operates on a normal basis to go ahead and manage everything else that is happening. So, by standing up the incident management team is almost like how you got Civil Defense and Civil Defense is kind of coordinating. This creates that organizational structure within our company to go ahead and respond. That decision to turn off the power for the circuit that is affected by PSPS is made by an executive level position that sits in the role of the incident commander. So, with all that being said, policy, but yet it's a tool that we're using to go ahead and Page 5 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 make sure that last line of defense. We look at the information coming in and we make the decision to go ahead and say ok, we're going to turn it off. MS. GALIMBA: Thank you for that. That is really helpful in understanding and there are, obviously, a lot to think about in those moments and to make sure that you get that decision right. Thanks. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Alright. Council Member Kierkiewicz. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. Excellent presentation and just a shout out for being so supportive of all of the events that we host in Puna. You've come to some pretty interesting town halls and many of our Revitalize Puna Activation, so thank you for being out in every single one of our communities. I'm real big on the communication piece, and so when I'm going through this matrix of what happens before, during, and after the PSPS, the soonest possible moment that people will be notified is 24-48 hours before you pull the trigger on a PSPS. MR. WALTJEN: Possibly. The only reason why we say possibly is because — I'll try to paint it in a scenario because for me to understand, I've got to paint pictures. That way I see something. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Here's a blank canvas. MR. WALTJEN: Yeah. So, let's just say you get into a condition like what happened in 1984 where you get a high -wind event that blows through and there was no warning whatsoever for that wind event. That could constitute us saying the winds are exceeding this condition, we already had a drought condition, the KBDI (Keetch-Byram Drought Index) index was greater than 600, our fuels are there prepped and primed, the relative humidity in these areas had been less than 45 percent, and the winds kick up and blow. We could in that case say our best interest is to turn off the circuits because we don't know what the —I cannot get people out there fast enough. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Right now, right? MR. WALTJEN: Yeah. I cannot get them out there fast enough. So, that's why if you look at our documentation, it always says we are going to try to get that warning out as soon as we can. And what we lay it out as logically, is we're watching for fire weather watch, red flag warning, because those are the triggers that we're getting from the National Weather Service. And they do these fire products every day at 5:30 a.m., so, watch for that. Once you get that, that stands us up. Then, once we stand up, we deploy spotters. And because it's not exactly happening now, that's what triggers what Jen was talking about. Again, very grateful to Civil Defense because they could have said Everbridge is just mainly for things that happen that we control but they actually worked with us and said, Page 6 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 "Yeah, if you send to us, and because it is public safety, we will get it out to them." MS. KIERKIEWICZ: So potentially, there could be a prewarning? These conditions that we're monitoring, it could trigger a PSPS. MR. WALTJEN: It could. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I mean the only reason why I'm saying that is absent of information, there's a lot of chaos and fear. Information is power and it helps to ensure there's calm in community. So, as much warning as possible, even if PSPS trigger is not pulled, but letting folks know be ready, have your go bag, know where you're supposed to go, I think that's really, really important. So, it's great to hear that the communication is just going to adapt based on circumstances and environment. MS. ZELKO-SCHLUETER: Council Member Kierkiewicz, just to add to that, I think we've been hearing that quite a bit. I think the community is very concerned. That notification is such a big piece. So, one of the things we've been saying is as you hear Guy Hagi and others start talking about the red flag fire weather type situation, you would kind of want to start to at least preparing. And it doesn't mean you would ever have a public safety power safety shut off. It may never reach those criteria Kevin went over. Because again, red flag warnings are, I think, only 20 miles per hour and to really institute a PSPS, we're looking at something higher than that. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: So, not everybody watches Guy Hagi, right? So, I appreciate here where you talk about how you may hear from us and all the different platforms that are available. One question I had about communications, the map, which is also available online if anybody is interested; hawaiianelectric.com/pspsmaps for each one of the islands you identify these orange potential outage areas. Any of these areas, do they have communication systems where if you're going to cut off power, does it impact the communication system that would then provide information to the community that is in orange and also surrounding communities, or like radio towers compromise for instance? MS. ZELKO-SCHLUETER: I think that goes back to that coordination that we've been doing with these different telecommunication companies and other utilities because some of them may have back-up power for that unit. Some may not, but I think that's something that we've been coordinating with them. MR. WALTJEN: Just to add, the other thing you've got to remember is that communications can be impacted at any given time, right? So, most of these Page 7 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 places, they're used to it, they understand it, they actually have either a generator or they have battery backup power supplies, right? The interesting part is when you ask that question on the orange, because every circuit is in a unique geographical location, more, than likely they're going to be communication towers. They're going to be water companies. They're going to be all these different things because it's geographic, right? So, the answer to that is there are, and the good thing is we will continue to work with Civil Defense and partners to make sure that we can deal with it. Because if you look at even when we go through and outage, right, and Civil Defense is stood up, one of the things that comes up in long-term outages is the comets (Telecommunications equipment) that usually say, "We're down, our batteries or our generation is going lower and lower, is it at any time that you can get us back?" So, Civil Defense would then raise that through the process of the IMT (International Mobile Telecommunications) that comes back to us, and then we start to try look at is there a way we can put back power to that site. In PSPS it's a little different because we cannot put back the power until the conditions change or until we come up with a way to know that we're not going to ignite something. So again, going back to Jen's original statement, and she did a good job on her slides, all those groups of people that are part of that stakeholders are key because they'll raise that. DWS (Department of Water Supply), Keith folks will raise their hand and say, "Hey, are you going to outage this pump?" "Well yeah, it's on that circuit." "Is there anything else you guys can to do to ensure that we don't outage that pump? So, those are the kinds of conversations. DWS has been very engaged, not only because of the water that they provide to the customer, but also because they also provide water sources for the Fire Department and all that. So, we're very lucky that our stakeholders and partners are engaged and very much advocate. I've got to say this; when we did our stakeholder plan, our first get together, our tabletop, our executives that came to participate, they said they actually liked how each of the partners were very engaged and very tied in with each other. So, that speaks volumes for Hawaii Island, right? So, I can say this, I'm very fortunate to live here that we have these connections that we can talk to each other, we can actually lay things on the table and say this is what it is. No fluff or stuff, this is what it is. Then that way, we all can come up with the best answer. So, answering your question in the end, yes, and we will continue to work with them. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: And this update comes at a really great time because per our Code, Civil Defense is supposed to provide an annual update to the Council regarding the Community Emergency Management Plan, the CEMP. So, I'm always really curious about how we are building redundancy across our systems because if one thing goes down how do we make sure that there's continuity of Page 8 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 service of utilities especially in times of disaster. And you guys are also probably engaging various community groups and leaders. I think about resilience hubs, neighbor watch teams, CERT (Community Emergency Response Team) teams, who actually know all of the folks in their particular neighborhoods who might be vulnerable in the event of a power outage or PSPS. So, thank you very much for being here and this will continue to be an ongoing conversation about how we can ensure our communities stays informed blue-sky times and in emergency situations. So, thanks for being here. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Council Member Kierkiewicz. MS. EVANS: Chair? ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Council Member Evans. Yes, we've had a long discussion, maybe keep it kind of brief. Go ahead. MS. EVANS: Thank you. So, you know we have power outages all the time, but when I look at your map it looks like this really huge area. So, the question I have is impacts when you turn the power on, power surging and given that you're shutting down an entire system and then you're going to power it back up, that I know there's a lot of concern about things burning up or things crashing because they can't take the power surge. I know that you have an ability for people to apply for potential reimbursement. What can we anticipate? Should we be talking to people about power surge protectors and whatever? Because I was just thinking we all have power outages, and it get turned back on but a lot of people tell me stories about losing their computers and their televisions and their refrigerators because of power surging. Can you give us a quick comment on that or provide something in writing later whatever you prefer? MS. ZELKO-SCHLUETER: Thanks, Council Member Evans. I'll let Kevin take the technical part but part of that flyer that I mentioned earlier on our website is information about what to do for residential and commercial customers. And part of that kind of walks you through what you should be doing with plugs or protection on your system. And actually, that information I think is just on the website in general when there has been a power outage. So, we can make sure that your offices get that information to make sure that the community has that as well. MR. WALTJEN: Okay, since your question is technical and Jen said I have to answer it, let me try to break it down in several different ways. One, when you get into a situation and the customers have damage to their equipment, filing the claim as soon as possible is very important. The reason why that's important is because it allows us to go ahead and investigate if there's any condition that existed that was due to us, and that we should be paying the claim and making sure that they held hope. Page 9 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 With that being said, if you think about what our breaker at the substation does, it's similar to like how you go to your light switch and you turn off your light switch and you turn on your light switch. The difference is in magnitude of size and the speed in which that light switch gets turned on and off. So, if you go to your light switch and turn it on and off, basically, everything should work properly, right? Unfortunately, the part of the investigation that has to happen is we have to make sure that there's nothing else within the system that can cause damage. So, we go through a rigorous type of analysis. We actually do voltage recordings at the local site; we do voltage recordings at adjacent sites; we check everything to see if there's any condition that exists that would cause. So, I would say there is no real this is why, and this is what's going to happen. My expectation as an electrical engineer would be I turn it off, I turn it back on. There is no damage with turning something off and on using the protection devices the way it's used. There is possibility if there is something in the system that is broken, and this can go either side. This can be at the utility side, but this can also be on the customer side because you've got to remember the utility goes up to the meter socket. Wiring happens internal to the customer to whatever devices they have. So, we run that investigation, we put up the equipment, we monitor, and we capture the information so that way we can prove, one way or the other, where it occurs. So, I would say there is no anticipation for, and I'll use your words, but trust me, I don't see the word as the right word, surges. We don't anticipate those things to happen, but I would say file a claim and let us make sure that we do our due diligence to make sure that we didn't create any situation. Does that answer your question? MS. EVANS: Just a follow-up, will this be the first time you shut everything down in such a large area and turn it back up? Will this be your first experience doing it? MR. WALTJEN: No. This happens on a daily basis in protection. The reason why is, and I kind of explained this in the very beginning, is in order for us to run the system, and you've got to remember now, we run things at a higher voltage than what you have in your house. I run them at 69,000 volts, 12,470 volts, 4,160 volts or 34,500 volts. In order to protect that electrical circuits, our protection is monitoring that continuously and will open the circuit anytime something happens. So, example, I can outage a full transmission system with a fault on the transmission line and take out multiple subs and multiple circuits at the same time. When we talk about PSPS, we're opening a single circuit at one time, and that's opening at the circuit breaker level. So again, I wouldn't say that something wouldn't happen, but I would say give us the opportunity to go through the investigation and do the right things to analyze and make sure that we weren't the cause of anything that happened. Page 10 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 MS. EVANS: Thank you, thank you very much. Thank you, Chair, I yield. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Council Member Evans. Alright. I was just going to say one thing, which is first of all, thank you and thank you for the information about how people can get more information and stay in touch. I would just suggest or hope you could share with us, kind of maybe more simplified information like around the medical needs communication, maybe like one post just on that, that's very targeted for that and maybe something else on where to sign up for general information, what people should do. Those two things, I think, are super important and that we can all help get the word out on. MS. ZELKO-SCHLUETER: Chair Kagiwada, we will absolutely make sure you folks have that. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Great. Thank you so much and thank you for being here, great presentation. We really appreciate this. Alright. MS. ZELKO-SCHLUETER: Thank you. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: With that, all those in favor of closing file on Communication 946 please say "aye." Vote on Comm. 946: The motion to close file on Comm. 946 was carried by the Filed) following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Evans, Galimba, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, and Acting Chair Kagiwada — 5. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Members Inaba, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Lee Loy, and Villegas — 4. Excused: None. STATEMENTS The Acting Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, FROM THE Statements from the Public. PUBLIC ON COMM. 960: The following individuals registered to speak and came forward when called by the Chair. Neal Herbert: comment. Michael Konowicz comment. Page I CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 Comm. 960: REQUESTS AN UPDATE FROM THE ADMINSTRATION REGARDING THE IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS PROPOSED BY THE 2022 COST OF GOVERNMENT COMMISSION REPORT From Council Member Jennifer Kagiwada, dated June 24, 2024. Motion to Close File: Ms. Kimball moved to close file on Comm. 960. Seconded by Ms. Galimba. (Note: Comm. 960. 1, from Council Member Jenn Kagiwada dated August 6, 2024, transmitting proposed amendments to Comm. 960, was circulated.) ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Alright. I hope you bear with me here, we're kind of a thin crew right now, but I just want to invite the administration, Deanna Sako, to come and tell us a little bit about what progress has been made. And I just want to thank you for being willing to be here and we did kind of change times up on you a couple of times. So, I do appreciate your flexibility and yeah, looking forward to hearing how things have been going. Thank you. (Note: At this time, Managing Director Deanna Sako came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MS. SAKO: Thank you and thank you for the opportunity. First of all, we do want to thank the Cost of Government Commission. It's a lot of work whenever they get together to learn about all the departments and everything that they do. So, greatjob in putting the report together. So, we're happy to present our to date so to speak, whatever we've accomplished so far. Then there are a couple things where a couple departments were like this probably isn't going to work, but at least you'll have all of that. There are several departments here and there should be others online. They were asked to be here because there are some things — Bobby Command should be in Kona. He helped put the report together as well. So, we'll just go through it and save some time for questions at the end. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, please just pull that a little closer so the folks over in Kona and online can hear you as well. (Note: At this time, Managing Director Deanna Sako came forward and provided a PowerPoint presentation to the members of the Committee. For viewing of the subject presentation, see the DVD copy of the meeting proceedings on file in the Clerk's Office. A copy of the PowerPoint presentation is made a part of the record, see Comm. 960. 1.) Recess: At 4:24 p.m., the Acting Chair called for a recess. Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 4:26 p.m. Page 12 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Alright. So, I want to thank our Administration, all our departments who are here and online at the ready to answer any questions or provide comments or other information. Do we have any questions or comments from Council Members? Council Member Kimball. Sorry, we'll come to you next, Council Member Evans. MS. KIMBALL Yeah, thank you. First, want to thank the members of the Commission that are here and also those that participated. Obviously, a lot of work and time and energy went into making these recommendations. Then of course thank you to Managing Director Sako and the rest of the Administration for being here and filling us in. I had a couple things I just wanted to dive into. Under the wastewater comment, there was the suggestion that there are challenges that have to do with the population size. Is that generally —you're referring to the ability to create new wastewater systems and have a sufficient population to support it, or what is that—? MS. SAKO: Well, government is the only one that's willing to spend a lot of money when they know they're not going to be a lot of revenue collected from it. So, to do a public -private partnership, that's just one of the challenges. Normally, if we were to work with a private entity, they would like to at least break even. If not, have some revenue and make money on it. So, that's just one of the challenges that we have just based on the size of our island and where our population bases are. So definitely, we want to grow the connectivity in our Hilo and Kona areas where we have our larger wastewater treatment plants, and then it's where we want to add new facilities. Those would be the easiest to probably have a public -private partnership, but just would there be enough connectivity because some of those areas are also very spread out. Our island is unique. MS. KEABALL: Okay. Thank you for clarifying that. Then, this is maybe a question for —when we moved the PONC (Public Access, Open Space, and Natural Resources Preservation Commission) activities from P&R (Parks and Recreation) to Finance, there was discussion about, at the time, about another person to be hired and the recommendation at the time was hold off until we see how it goes in Finance. It says here you're looking at hiring additional staff, so is that clerical staff or is that somebody to run the PONC program? MS. SAKO: Diane maybe can better answer that, but there has been a position that we've been trying to get going in that property management section, but it got held up at Human Resources (HR) due to not being able to have multiple positions of the same title. So, that was one piece of it but now, as they've been going through all the duties, I think Diane can answer the rest of it. (Note: At this time, Finance Director Diane Nakagawa came forward to address the members of the Committee.) Page 13 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 MS. NAKAGAWA: Good afternoon, Council Members, Diane Nakagawa, Finance. Thank you for the question. We have spent a lot of time over the last few months evaluating the PONC program, specifically the stewardship grants as well as our process and applications. We appreciate the time to thoroughly go through how we do what we do and how we're able to catch up and make things better. So, we are in the process of looking at the appropriate staff person for this position. We do recognize that there is a definite need to have someone to help manage these contracts as well as additional support just to manage the administration part of the Commission as well. So, there is a great need, we understand that. We're working with HR right now on the appropriate position, which would probably be a higher -level position that would really be able to look at the contracts and work with each of the stewards and follow-up and monitor appropriately. So, we are still in catch up. We do have more work to do, but we are actively engaging in getting caught up and making it better. MS. KIMBALL Great, thank you. Yeah, I think just having observed where we are and we're acquiring more properties, we're having more stewards, this is a growing program, so I think we're at the place where we do really need a dedicated person that is responsible for those activities. MS. NAKAGAWA: We wholeheartedly agree, and we are aggressively pushing for the right person, and we would like to get them in there as soon as possible. MS. KIMBALL: Thank you. Then, since you're up here, not in here but just generally, I wanted to touch base. We are also working on somebody to do a project like a CIP (Capital Improvement Project) person, right? This is not — you'll give it to me, right? MS. NAKAGAWA: Yes, so in the budget, we did approve a CIP manager. So, that position as well is a priority for us to work through the HR processing and posted as quickly as possible. So, we're looking at the position description. Fortunately, there are similar positions in another county so we're hoping that would expedite the process and really get someone onboard to be able to manage CIP and look at status, dashboards, and a lot of the things that we're constantly wanting to know and being asked for. So, that is on our agenda for this year. MS. KB4BALL: Perfect. Great. Thank you for that. Then, just one question, I think this is actually for any of the folks that are still around that were on the Commission. I was looking at the revenue generation ideas and there was this $6 per year proposal with a vehicle importation. The Managing Director identified we have this fee in our registration process, but I'm wondering if that was intended a little bit differently from the Commission. Was it meant to be like a producer responsibility type thing where with like the electronic suspenders, Page 14 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 they pay into a fund that helps us dispose when they bring electronics in? Is it meant like a tire disposal fee that you pay upfront and then when it's time to return your vehicle or deal with it properly, you get that back? Can you just maybe —thank you for being here, can you maybe expand what the Commission was thinking about that particular recommendation? (Note: At this time, former Chair of the Cost of Government Commission Michael Konowicz came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. KONOWICZ: Sure. Michael Konowicz, former Chair of the Cost of Government Commission. The thought process was in line to some of the ideas you had referenced like tire and battery collection fees. The intent was it's likely an older car coming to the island would be more likely to be abandoned because of its age than a newer car. So, the spirit was if you import a 10-year car, you'd get 10 times $6, not knowing what the State statutes called for. So, the intent there was to increase revenue there because at the time of the recommendation, we saw a very significant outlay to dealing with abandoned vehicles on the island and the cost tied to that. So, the Commission was just looking for a creative way to recoup some of those costs, so the cost wasn't completely borne by the taxpayer. MS. KIMBALL: Okay, thank you for that response. That was kind of what I was anticipating. It wasn't meant to be —oh, I'm sorry, Director. MS. SAKO: No, I think that's what I tried to say is I know there was supposed to be like a cumulative fee but the State law doesn't allow for it right now so we would have to amend that before we could move forward with something like that. MS. KIMBALL: Yeah. I bring it up in particular because I've had some constituents make a similar recommendation recently where there should be kind of like a deposit when vehicles are purchased that you get back if you responsibly dispose of or resale that vehicle. I'm not sure how that would work, but it would probably require a state law change — MS. SAKO: I can picture all the paperwork every time a vehicle on our island changes hands and gets a new owner, but the thought is good. MS. KIMBALL: That's your polite way of saying, "No way, Heather, forget it." I'm just teasing, but I wanted clarification on the recommendation. Thank you, I yield my time. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you so much. Council Member Evans, go ahead. Page 15 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 MS. EVANS: Thank you. I know how much work this took, a lot of hours and a lot of it. So, thanks to all the volunteers. But my question, when the Cost of Government Commission is formed again, would it be beneficial to give some areas to look at? For example, public outreach, fee schedules, maybe customer kind of —responding to customers, maybe websites, you know, how our websites could be using more of IT (Information Technology) versus people. Would it help the Cost of Government Commission if we knew that there were areas that we wanted to get some public input? Would that help guide it? Because this is a lot that you had to look at, and I'm sure it was lots of hours. So, this is for the Cost of Government Commission, Michael. MS. SAKO: While he's coming up, I would just share that over the many Cost of Government Commissions that I've worked with over the years, they've all done it differently and had different focuses. So, we've definitely shared a lot of that information with them, especially fee schedules and things like that. So, each one kind of decides what they're going to focus on. (Note: At this time, former Chair of the Cost of Government Commission Michael Konowicz came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. KONOWICZ: Michael Konowicz, former Chair of the Cost of Government Commission. Early on in the process, we didn't know what to focus on, which is why we invited Mayor Roth and Councilperson Kierkiewicz to come to our first meeting to share some insight and what they hoped we would accomplish while also giving us insight and what former commissions had done. Our first several meetings, well, all of our meetings were open to the public, but our agenda for the first several meetings did specifically call out requests of the public to give us guidance and direction on areas to focus on. And where we ended up netting out, creating the Permitted Interaction. Groups as well as putting some focus on a report is based on those interactions from the public. So, while we didn't have much of a rudder in the first couple of weeks based on the interaction with the commissioners and the interaction with the public, we felt comfortable in the general direction we took. And it was a tremendous amount of work and a tremendous amount of time, and the public was involved throughout the whole process. We had people testifying or submitting testifying at most of our meetings. So, there was good community input, and I think the, I think I was 80-page report reflected those insights. MS. EVANS: That's a lot of work, so very grateful for that. I hope after you got the answers today and kind of an update of the response and how it's been incorporated by the County, I'd be curious how —is your Cost of Government Commission going to meet one mor time so that they can kind of give us like an evaluation of how they feel about the effectiveness of this? Page 16 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 MR. KONOWICZ: No, we're officially disbanded, so there is none. That could be an idea for the next Cost of Government Commission to recommend when they do convene. Speaking as a personal taxpayer, I'm pleased to see that this effort was done and pleased to see the follow-up from the administration on what has been accomplished or not. I did hear from some other commissioners offline who shared that pleasure that some of the recommendations did come to fruition. MS. EVANS: Great, thank you. MS. SAKO: Council Member Evans, I think in the past, it was frequently —a lot of the Cost of Government Commissions, their first action was actually to take the previous Commission's report and send it out for current status of each one. That was actually a starting point for many of the Commissions in the past. MS. EVANS: Good to know, thank you. Thank you, Chair, I yield. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you. Council Member Kierkiewicz. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you, Chair. Thank you, Managing Director for the update. There seems to be a lot in alignment with what the Commission had suggested and what the administration was working on. So, thank you for that. I just had three questions. First wanted to clarify Permitting/Construction number 3, "separating out permits into different scopes." By scopes, what did you mean? MS. SAKO: So — MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Was this about like the complexity of the project? MS. SAKO: Wait, sorry, I'm in the wrong one, I was looking at ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Number 3. MS. SAKO: Yeah sorry, I looked at number 5 instead. But in different scopes to expedite approval. I think that was to kind of separate them out and I think Public Works took it as we're doing residential, commercial, or solar and whatnot. We'd have to clarify with the Commission if that was what they meant. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Is that what you meant, Michael? MR. KONOWICZ: I believe so. I know one of the concerns was, at the time, EV (Electric Vehicle) permitting was in the same queue as residential construction permitting. So, doing something as quick as an EV install, or not an EV, a photovoltaic install, was stuck in the queue. So, I believe separating out those types of permits was done and there is some expedition in there today. Page 17 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Thank you. Since I have you up there, also within permitting and construction, "Minimize unpermitted structures by reviewing/modifying current policies." The recommendation was unclear to the administration. Do you want to elaborate what the Commission was thinking at the time? MR. KONOWICZ: I don't recall the Conu-nission conversations, and it would be unfair for me to represent that at this time. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Okay. I think people build unpermitted because it's just too costly for materials and actually to move through the process. So, I think that there's something here, but I'd like to maybe explore that a little bit deeper with you folks. I see your Chair has his hand raised, Vice -Chair. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Would you like to comment on that? Do you remember what the situation was there with that bullet point? (Note: At this time, former Vice -Chair of the Cost of Government Commission Neal Herbert came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. HERBERT: —reducing the number of unpermitted structures in the County. Nobody went into great specifics on it, but we did come up in our investigations and discussions with people that it's unfair that most people have to go through the regular permitting process of the payments and everything, and you still have these other people that are building without the proper authority and so on. So — discussions that —a little bit of a thorn on the side of some of the taxpayers and that's why we mentioned that. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, thank you so much, that helps clarify. Council Member Kierkiewicz, do you have some more? MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Yes, I have just one final question, and I see our friends from Environmental Management here. I'm just curious if you folks could elaborate on what it means to be in progress with potentially renegotiating the Hawai'i Earth Recycling contract? Hi Deputy. (Note: At this time, Deputy Director Brenda lokepa-Moses came forward to address the members of the Cominittee.) MS. IOKEPA-MOSES: Good afternoon, I'm Brenda lokepa-Moses, Deputy Director with Environmental Management. I may have to turn over this to Diana because it does have some legal ramifications, as you guys are aware. When we first came on board, we tried to look at the highest amount of monies we're spending at the County to see if we're spending them wisely, and this is one of the Page 18 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 contracts that came up that we needed to evaluate. So, we have done so, and we try to renegotiate this as a willing renegotiation that didn't go over so now, we're kind of just trying to see legally, is this the best way to spend taxpayers' money? Is it the biggest bang for our buck currently, and are we doing what the contract set out to do? Is there some room for us to look at have we strayed away from the original contract so much that it's an opportune time to renegotiate something that could still provide a product at maybe a different cost? If there's any questions, you may have to — (Note: At this time, Managing Director Deanna Sako came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MS. SAKO: We prefer not to speak about this anymore publicly. Thank you. They're doing the best they can with the confines that they have. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: I guess it's just kind of frustrating because there's a contract, not all the deliverables are being met. This is an issue that I recall having to learn about during my first term. I've been here for three terms now going on six years. Perhaps an executive session in the future, but I think it's really incumbent upon us to figure this out. I think on both sides, there's potentially some, well you promised this, and you promised that, and it's good to maybe let's just get it all on the table and find the solution so that our taxpayers are benefitting because people are lining up three, four o'clock in the morning. I know first Saturdays in Hilo to get the mulch, people want it closer to their communities; people want access to compost. I think we have a contract and let's figure out a way where we can refine it so that it's a win -win, not just for the County and the provider, but more importantly, for the community. MS. SAKO: Yeah, we totally agree. MS. KIERKIEWICZ: Wonderful. Thank you. I yield. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you. Council Member Galimba. MS. GALIMBA: Thank you. Maybe possibly stay up because it's the next one and it's the wastewater. It's just a question about the last sentence of the response, if you could just elaborate a little bit more or explain it to me. It's "Further, the administration sees Konno as a roadmap which directs the county to where it must grow." If you could just tell me what that means a little bit more. MS. IOKEPA-MOSES: We try to do things like Oahu does because they have a lot more resources available. We don't have the customer base and so, what we're trying to do in this 2050 cesspool conversion will kind of help us get there actually, but we're going to have a lot more customers that'll be servicing our plants, which will make us more sustainable, which will bring in more income Page 19 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 and be able to do the things that we need to do for the wastewater community. We have challenges here that some of the other islands don't have. We have communities that are so remote that's hooking up to connectivity to our current wastewater plants won't be feasible so we're going to be probably depending on some of the smaller plants being privately run. We also have challenges with staff, trying to get Wastewater operators. I don't know why, nobody wants to work as wastewater operators, but we have staff challenges as well. So, all of those things are things that we're looking at and trying to be creative to get better eyes out there in the community to help us with staffing, get people interested in working for a wastewater community. I think having a new plant might be good to incentivize some of our younger folks to come on board and work their way up in these new plants. But yeah, customer base is right now our challenge. We don't have that many customers to support our wastewater infrastructure. MS. SAKO: So, some of the words did get cutoff. So, we must grow our workforce to innovate in areas not historically and customarily performed by our civil service employees. So, my apologies, sorry. MS. GALIMBA: Yes, that helps. Okay. So, just to follow-up then, so, there is a place for these public -private partnerships in your vision of wastewater going forward, is that right? MS. SAKO: We've definitely have been trying to look at some and we do believe that if there's a new area where we expand wastewater service to, that would be the easiest way or the easiest places to implement those. But we still have to work with them within the confines of the law, unfortunately. MS. GALIMBA: Thank you. Or fortunately. Sometimes fortunately. MS. SAKO: I'd say we do work within there, but I mean sometimes we want to do the easy thing, and it doesn't always work that way. MS. IOKEPA-MOSES: Deanna was thinking that unfortunately, but it came out verbally so, sorry about that, Betsy. MS. GALIMBA: Alright, thank you. I yield. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you. Alright, I just have a few things here to follow-up on, one is under the what's called the Information Technology/Automation/Electronic Records/Digital Payments. It wasn't actually an item in here about digital payments, however, looking back at the report, it looks like there was a big discussion from the group, from the Commission, about this. They said that they were not able to really suggest going forward because Page 20 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 DIT (Department of Information Technology Administration) is already at capacity with the inability to increase head count because of budget constraints. So, I do want to bring this forward because I think this is really important and this is both a DIT but maybe also a Finance thing, which is paying online, paying digitally. I've gotten recent messages saying people are really upset because they think that's the way we should go and yet they get charged a lot of extra money when they try to pay digitally. Do we know what's happening there, and do we have any plans to try to make that better? MS. SAKO: So, Diane might have other things to add but right now, each department basically set up their own online payment system as things kind of came aboard over the last many, many years. So, definitely, if you go online it is much cheaper, in some cases free, to pay by like a digital check versus paying by credit card, because the County is not going to pay the credit card fees for some people and not everyone. So, some of it is just being fair to everybody. In addition, we waived this year, Council approved in the budget the convenience fee for your online vehicle registration, and if you renew our vehicle registration at the kiosk, the County is absorbing those fees. We use service providers to do all of this, and so, they do cost money. So, that's the fee we're trying to collect back as well. But we are looking at new ways, and I think Diane has more to add to that. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, thank you. (Note: At this time, Finance Director Diane Nakagawa came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MS. NAKAGAWA: Thank you for the question. We are definitely looking at ways to make payments easier. VRL (Vehicle Registration and Licensing) for example, I don't want to get too ahead of myself, but we are very close to being able to allow credit card payments in our VRL offices, and that's something that the community has wanted for a really long time. It's coming really soon, in months. So, we're looking at the technology now in the offices and getting trained and being able to do that. One of the other things that we are really beginning between IT and Finance as well to look at is —so each of the departments, as Deanna explained, has cashiering systems that are different. But what we want to do is look at those creative, innovative platforms that become a one stop shop for payment that's done in other municipalities across the country. We do need to go out for procurement but working with our IT Director, we do see this as a possibility for us. We just need to start looking at what that involves, the scopes and how it needs to be integrated into our system. For example, this is a place where anyone in our community would go on to just our hawaiicounty.gov, maybe set up a login Page 21 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 and then all of the other systems become the back end. So, they don't need to know where to go to each of the separate sites, but it's one site one login. So, that is something that we are excited about exploring and right now, looking into what those specs would have to be. And again, IT is very supportive of that, and we're excited to do that. But as far as credit cards, you know, where we can do that, we are definitely evaluating that and there are fees. So, there are things that we need to consider when we develop the budget as well, but agree that is a customer service improvement that we need to have. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: If more people or most people pay by credit card as opposed to bringing in checks that I assume can bounce, can have problems, wouldn't that save us some money in some ways? I just feel like we're discouraging people right now, heavily discouraging people from paying, for instance, their property taxes online. MS. NAKAGAWA: So, yes, that is the analysis we'd have to take a look at to see what that would result in. But I don't think there is any disagreement that providing other options and the convenience of credit cards is something that we are a bit behind in and that we need to figure out how to do. So, there's just been things that we've considered over the past and I think this, we are looking at that now. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, so I guess I'm just underlining the point that it's great to consider that people can do it, but if they have to pay large fees to do it, it's not really a very good option for most people. MS. NAKAGAWA: Yeah, definitely taking that into consideration but there will be fees though. I think that's the understanding we all have to be aware of that when we enter into this agreement, there will be a fee that's charged. So, we have to look at whether that's an increase in our budget or that's something that's passed on and how that works. So, that is part of the evaluation. MS. SAKO: But going to the one stop shop, kind of like what Diane's talking about, we may be able to consolidate and reduce overall fees. So, if that happens, that might work, but in addition, really encouraging people to use electronic check whenever possible because that does save a lot. But then also remembering that sometimes we collect fees that are not ours, such as the vehicle registration. Two- thirds of that payment goes to the State, and they are unwilling to pitch in on some of the credit card fees and other things because it has been something we've considered over the years. But does the County really want to absorb all of the credit card payments for the State? That's part of it. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, thank you. The other, I guess thing I just want to highlight was another thing that was not necessarily in a specific Page 22 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 recommendation but in the evaluations and findings, under Revenue Generation Ideas, and I think Council Member Kimball mentioned some of them around the vehicle fees and things like that. But there were other things there like collecting fees for community pools, parks, zoo administration, I know that's in the works, selling advertising on mass transit asset such as buses and bus shelters. Is any of that still, as far as revenue generating, are we working hard on trying to get some of that going? MS. SAKO: I think the fees and things like that, we have been looking at. Obviously, it's going to start at the zoo later this year, beginning January 1 st. But like advertising on the busses, I believe we looked at that and I think because we get federal money, I don't think it's allowed. I could be misstating that, but I think that's what the final conclusion was. There was a reason we couldn't do it. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, and bus stops as well? MS. SAKO: Anything that's supported by federal dollars, I believe, we cannot advertise on. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay. Alright. Thank you for that. Then I had the one, I wanted to just highlight and follow-up on the support for our boards and commissions. I think you said it's in the works, you're supposed to be —the Mayor's office was hiring somebody. You said you were working on a scope of work or something. MS. SAKO: Finalizing the position description so that we can do the final hiring. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay. Yeah, I really hope we do that soon because I know we're still struggling with really doing a good job supporting these amazing volunteers who are stepping up and making them feel like their time and their efforts are valued. I don't think it's across the board that we are doing a very good job about that. MS. SAKO: Understood. ACTING CHR KAGIWADA: Finally, question with the volunteers because you said that you are continuing to use volunteers whenever possible. Do we have any information about that, or could we maybe get it at a later point with a little more data about how many volunteers and where and when we're using them? Could we get that maybe as a follow-up? MS. SAKO: We can. I don't know how much of that is collected, but the report did have a lot of places where we utilize them. We use RSVP volunteers all the time; we have different groups. I would even say the stewards of our PONC lands are volunteers, you know, the grants are not allowed to pay people. So, the Page 23 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 people who show up to do all that work are definitely volunteers. So, I'm not sure how easy it would be to collect that, but definitely happy to try and see if we can collect some of that information. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Right, and I know some of the departments have more, maybe more potential volunteers than others. But it would, I think, help us and everybody to think about where there might be a good place for volunteers if we knew what was already happening. MS. SAKO: So, in the report, they did this many of them, which is what I was remembering and obviously, we have our volunteer fire departments, our RSVP program, and by Parks and Rec, so as we need things we do call on them whether it's for answering phones, running the reception booth, putting events together. Boy scouts and other groups help with gym or other clean ups especially graffiti and special projects actually, as they do their Eagle Scout and other projects. Then there are many summer interns, and assistants, and art volunteers, and just a variety. So, we can try and gather all of that. I know at any point in time, we do get calls from different organizations if we would take volunteers, and more and more students are volunteering as they have to complete senior projects and other things like that. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, great. Alright finally, I just want to ask, one of the testifiers asked that we file this report in the Cost of Government folder on the website. Can you do that? MS. SAKO: I'll see what we can do, yes. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Okay, great. That would be very helpful. Alright, any other comments? I don't see any so with that, all those in favor of closing file on Communication 960 please say "aye." Vote on Comm. 960: The motion to close file on Comm. 960 was carried by (Filed) the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Evans, Galimba, Kierkiewicz, Kimball, and Acting Chair Kagiwada — 5. Noes: None. Absent: Committee Members Inaba, Kdneali'i-Kleinfelder, Lee Loy, and Villegas — 4. Excused: None. Page 24 CRCOC-32 August 6, 2024 ADJOURN- There being no further business, at 5:00 p.m. Acting Chair Kagiwada adjourned the MENT: meeting. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you all so much. Approved: Ms. Rebecca VillegX, Chair Communications, Reports, and Council Oversight Committee RV/jm f AM 7 (Date) Page 25