Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN PCENRM 2025/10/21 (2024-2026)Policy Committee on Environmental and Natural Resource Management 61 Session West Hawaii Civic Center 74-5044 Ane Keohokalole Highway, Building A Kailua-Kona, Hawaii October 21, 2025 CALL TO The regular meeting of the Policy Committee on Environmental and Natural ORDER: Resource Management was called to order at 2:30 p.m., in the Council Chambers, Kailua-Kona, by Ms. Jenn Kagiwada, Acting Chair. ROLL CALL: Present: Ms. Rebecca Villegas, Chair Ms. Jenn Kagiwada, Vice Chair Ms. Michelle M. Galimba, Member Mr. Holeka Goro Inaba, Member Mr. James E. Hustace, Member Mr. Matt Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Member (via videoconference from Hilo) Ms. Heather L. Kimball, Member Mr. Dennis "Fresh" Onishi, Member Absent & Excused: Ms. Ashley L. Kierkiewicz, Member STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, FROM THE Statements from the Public on Agenda Items. PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: The following individuals registered to speak on Bill 83, Draft 2 (Comm. 482.10), and came forward when called by the Chair: Stephen Uyeda: (representing Suisan) Jason Higa: (representing Zippy's) Derek Kurisu: (representing KTA Stores) In opposition. (See Comm. 482.127) Comment. (See Comm. 482.125) Comment. (See Comm. 482.123) Alexis Chapman: Comment. (representing Hawaii Food Industry Association) PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 John Elkjer: In support. (representing Sustainable Island Products) Sarah Warr: In support. (See Comm. 482.128) BILLS FOR The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, ORDINANCES: Bills for Ordinances. Bill 83: AMENDS CHAPTER 20 OF THE HAWAI`I COUNTY CODE 1983 (2016 (Draft 2) EDITION, AS AMENDED), RELATING TO PLASTIC AND POLYSTYRENE Seeks to reduce disposable plastic or polystyrene foodware and serviceware in alignment with the County of Hawai`i's Zero Waste Plan and the State of Hawai`i's Aloha+ Challenge Solid Waste Reduction Goals. Reference: Comm. 482.10 Intr. by: Council Members Galimba and Villegas Referred to the Environmental Management Director and Environmental Management Commission: October 15, 2025 Postponed: September 16 and October 8, 2025 (Note: There is a motion by Council Member Villegas, seconded by Council Member Galimba, to recommend passage of Bill 83, as amended, on first reading.) ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Either of the Council Members that introduced the bill, do you want to? Council Member Villegas, please go ahead. MS. VILLEGAS: Yeah. Thank you. A lot of work was put in between the last committee meeting and this one. And we do have the updated and amended version of Draft 2 of this legislation, which clarified and provided solutions for many of the things that had been brought up prior. I am confident that this is a clean and viable version to be moved forward. It's my understanding from the Clerk's Office and Corporation Counsel that the obligation for us to provide a clean copy of a draft, which is Draft 2, to the Environmental Management Commission and the Department of Environmental Management, in which gives them 45 days in order to provide us with any comments or suggested amendments or whatnot. So that clock has already started. It is also my understanding from the advice and Council from the Clerk's Office and Corporation Counsel that we can, according to our Code, continue to move this Page 2 IZyc "Wert October 21, 2025 legislation forward. We just wouldn't be able to vote it through in second and final reading without the expiration of those 45 days. So I just wanted to clarify for your guys understanding because I know I needed that clarification for mine. In response to some of the testifiers. I was just sitting here, and I looked up the definition in Hawaii of what a small business is, and I've heard claims about small businesses being negatively affected. But written testimony has come from Zippy's, 7-Eleven, and Suisan, just to name a few. And when I look up for the State of Hawaii the definition of a small business, they have fewer than 100 employees. And I don't think that is the case for the organizations and companies that are coming before us_ today. So I find it kind of ironic that that testimony is coming from these groups because that historically has been where the greatest opposition to any single -use disposable serviceware legislation has come, both on Oahu and Maui. What I see in my day to day life is our authentically small businesses choosing to make the change already, navigating the products that are already available. And the other new ones that are coming forward that continue to get better and better. It's not ruining their business motto and those tend to be the hand to mouth smaller restaurants. I also, I guess I would honestly say I resent the implication that this legislation is a symbolic gesture. This is not a symbolic gesture. This is a viable, certified step forward in authentically aligning the legislation of the County of Hawaii to what we have claimed are the visions, values, and priorities of our County, which is to be in alignment with the goals set forth by our County's zero waste plan as well as the State of Hawai`i's Aloha+ Challenge solid waste reduction goals. So this is not a symbolic gesture. This is a viable and specific move forward, and it is a practical solution. When we talk about living on an island, yes, we live on an island, and we must return to a more circular economy. If we could transition tomorrow to all reusable, boy, that would be kind of like returning to my hanabata days, right? We didn't have the luxury and the privilege of everything being able to be disposed and just to get more. We know too much now. Our future generations know too much now. What we face and all the challenges we're looking at in the County of Hawaii with our wastewater, with our rapidly filling solid waste facilities, are the consequences and repercussions of the decisions that were made by generations before us, who at the same time I listened to the disclaimers, I'll quickly close, that it just wasn't ready, it just wasn't good enough so we didn't do anything. And we're paying the consequences for that now and it'll only be more expensive to future generations if we don't have the courage and take the initiative and move forward. I ask my colleagues support of Bill 83. I yield. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Council Member Galimba. Thank you, Council Member. Page 3 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 MS. GALIMBA: Thank you, Chair. Yeah, I think that there's always many sides to an argument. And, you know, I'm really sensitive to this idea of cost. I know a lot of families here are struggling to make it and even small, you know, amounts of increase can impact them. However, I do think that the price difference between regular containers and compostable containers is really quite tiny at this point and not something that is going to impact folks unduly. As far as the sort of usability part, I can see how there might be some recipes that would push the boundaries of reusable—l'm sorry, I'm having a hard time talking today, compostable containers. However, having those same recipes in plastic is probably pretty bad for your health because that same heat is degrading the plastic and getting, you know, nanoparticles of plastic shedding off of those containers. So as Council Member Villegas pointed out, we didn't always just assume that we were going to have recipes that were hot and oily and that we could just take out. So there's no question that we're going to have to have some adaptation to using compostable containers in the recipes that folks use. But the compostable containers are also getting better all the time. We talked about this two years ago and we actually didn't bring it forward until now and I think it's good. I think the timing is good because there's been progress in those two years to get us closer to the point where it's a minimal impact and we do continue to make steps towards a less harmful way of living here in this County. So I hope my fellow Council Members will support Bill 83, Draft 2. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Council Member Galimba. Anybody else wants to say something, weigh in on this at this time? MR.INABA: Chair? ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Go ahead, Council Member Inaba. MR. INABA: Yes, just briefly. I remain in support of this. And I know there's been testimony from some businesses, and I would continue to encourage these businesses to engage with the introducers if there are further amendments that need to be considered. If there's going to be additional drafts, we're still at committee right now, heading out of committee it sounds like today. But to be very specific with the amendments that you're providing and recommending so that we can end up with the best bill possible. Also it just makes me think back about the legislation we passed about regarding the mineral sunscreen here in our County. It was such a drawn out difficult process and when you go out and about in community on this island today, we know what is available is only what is best for our environment and for our keiki and for the wildlife here. So just kind of reflecting back on that and applying the same logic and the same principles to this legislation. I'm in strong support. So thank you very much. Page 4 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member Onishi. MR. ONISHI: Thank you, Madam Chair. If I call up some of the testifiers to answer some questions because my questions at the last meeting were about the cost, right? How much will it affect the vendors and then the consumers, right? But we talked about composting, which is great, but it was mentioned that right now we don't have any. We do have a contractor that's doing our mulching and also the contract was supposed to be for composting. But with this research that they did, they didn't have enough products to do the composting for food waste and so forth. So if this can be proven that we're using these products is going to help increase that tonnage that they need then I can foresee something like this moving forward. But if they still tell us that it's not enough, then everything goes back into the landfill, right. So I just wanted to say that. So can I get Mr. Ueda, can you come forward? And then, is Mr. Higa from Zippy's, are you still online? And then also, Alicia. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Alexis, I think. Alexis. Alexis Chapman. MR. ONISHI: So first my question is going to be towards Mr. Higa. So you mentioned in your testimony that Zippy's has tried, I guess, to use compostable materials. (Note: At this time, Jason Higa of Zippy's came forward to address the members of the Committee) MR. HIGA: That's correct. We have tested compostable materials about every six months for the last five years to test the viability. We are hopeful that there will be a future that we can switch to these containers. However, that time is not now. And one of the things about composting facilities, the reality is you do need a lot of push -through materials for the composting facility to be financially viable. So you do have these facilities in LA County for example and what these facilities require are populations of millions and millions of consumers. So even the facility in LA County actually imports materials from other states because the requirements of the materials are not even enough for a population of 12 million. So one of the challenges with our island community is the viability of a true compostable facility that can handle food service compostable containers. And that's just unfortunately a reality of our smaller population here in the State of Hawaii and especially when you talk about a county like Hawaii Island. Thank you. MR. ONISHI: Okay. And you've heard comments about how the products have been improving. Like you said, you've been testing it and have you found a product that was mentioned that it's much better? Page 5 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 MR. HIGA: No. We truly haven't for the everyday usage. You heard testimony by Mr. Kurisu. I mean, and I think all of you might have experienced the difference between products that are held in a reusable container versus a compostable container. There truly is a quality difference and there's a safety difference between those two containers. MR. ONISHI: Okay. Thank you. Mr. Uyeda, so you're a supplier. You bring in products, correct? (Note: At this time, Stephen Ueda of Suisan came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. UEDA: Correct. MR. ONISHI: So what kind of cost do you think would be added upon the vendors? MR. UEDA: Yeah, sorry I didn't bring specific cost examples with me, but I just referenced in my testimony that when we did the analysis, the compostable containers would cost 40 percent more. You know, when you look at it in terms of dollars, it's not a big dollar amount. You're talking, you know, fractions of a dollar, let's say 50 cents per container or maybe, depending on the size of container. But, you know, you're talking about several containers by that business, used per day, so that impact on the business is magnified by the amount of customers they have. On the other hand for the consumer, you know, adding another 50 cents to the cost could add to the actual purchase price of the container; a markup on top of that. So you're talking and it then comes out to a dollar impact, you know, hypothetically for a plate lunch, and that adds up, you know. I'm just seeing the cost —yeah, sorry. MR. ONISHI: And then being like Hawaii County having to be labeled compared to the other counties, the goods have to be like BPI (Biodegradable Products Institute) and so forth. That going affect what you folks can bring in or the cost again? MR. UEDA: The actual laboring I think, depending on the supplier, so I don't think it will affect cost to have the BPI. It's just whether that BPI is present, I think, and whether the supplier actually meets that spec. MR. ONISHI: Okay. Thank you. And then, Alicia. (Note: At this time, Alexis Chapman of Hawaii Food Industry Association came forward to address the members of the Committee.) ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Alexis. Page 6 PCENRM-6 October 21,2025 MR. ONISHI: Oh Alexis. I'm sorry. So you mentioned about the BPI labeling. You said some products are not, and we heard a testimony that all of them, except maybe straws, are not labeled or —yes. MS. CHAPMAN: Yes. What we have heard is that, like I've checked with our members who are operating on multiple islands. And so first of all, sorry, back up a little bit. I did, I've failed to say this in my first round, but we did really want to thank the authors of the legislation and the committee for the changes that have been made for draft two. I know that we have requested some amendments and those did make it into the second draft, and we really do appreciate all that work that went into that. One of our big goals for this is to just make sure that our members that are operating on multiple islands are not having to purchase different products for each island because we do already have that a little bit with the certain things that have to be different on, for Honolulu County and Maui County because definitions are slightly different. So we're just trying to make sure that businesses aren't having to purchase three different types of products. So what I was informed was that some of the utensils, in addition to straws, are BPI certified but the mark is on the case rather than on the utensil itself. And I think the supplies are the ones that are like individually wrapped. And I am emailing them right now to get a sort of images of that and get some more information about it. Just because, so that they don't have to change the type of silverware that they're purchasing, if it is in fact, compostable, which it is. To be purchasing something, one type of stuff for Honolulu, one type for Maui, one type for Big Island. MR. ONISHI: Okay. Thank you. And then, so even like for the drinks at the soda fountain, right, those cups. MS. CHAPMAN: Yeah. MR. ONISHI: So for Oahu and Maui County is not, I guess, required. But if this bill passes, it will be required for Hawaii County to have those cups, paper or plastic cups to be certified, correct? MS. CHAPMAN: Yes. And the thing is, the bills are structured very differently, especially Honolulu County and this bill. And again, it will be drastically, you know, just reduce administrative costs for businesses if there was a little bit more alignment. But they're just structured really differently. But even that said, because the Honolulu bill specifically requires things that are not petroleum based, most of the containers that fall into that category are compostable and are —most of the containers that are compostable, as one of the previous testifiers mentioned, are either CMA (Compost Manufacturing Alliance) certified or Page 7 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 BPI certified. So most of the compostables that they're already buying meet those criteria. There's just a few that are not labeled specifically on the item itself, but rather on the case. MR. ONISHI: Okay. Thank you. And my last thing is, Mr. Ueda. So I was on the Council back then when we banned plastic bags. And basically the argument was about littering and all the bags flying around. And I had brought it up all the time. And Mr. Kurisu reminds me that it's not the bag's fault, it's the people's fault; they were the ones littering the bags, they're the ones who weren't taking care of disposing of the bags. Now it got passed, would you know, what was the difference of cost having the plastic bag compared to now, everybody has those paper bags? MR. UEDA: Yeah, I don't sorry, I don't have the exact cost, but those plastic bags were really cheap. They were pennies. The paper bags are more in the fringe of 25 cents and up, of course, depending on size. MR. ONISHI: And now, these businesses assist the consumer the cost for that paper bag too, right? MR. UYEDA: Sorry, I didn't understand the question. MR. ONISHI: So like now, like the paper bags that we're using now, so when we go say to a store, right, and you want a paper bag, they charge you so much to help offset that cost for them, right. And so for me right now, unless we can maybe do some changes and as Chair Inaba had mentioned, maybe the food industries, you know; the businesses, can maybe work with the makers and see if you folks can try come up with some amendments or provide some amendments that you folks feel that would help. Kind of limit the amount of, I guess, could be confusion between the different counties, right. And, you know, working together and see how we can make this a better bill. I'll yield at this time. Thank you. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you so much, Council Member. Thank you. Alright, anybody else have any comments before I say something and we wrap up? MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Chair. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Council Member, Kaneali`i-Meinfelder do you have anything? MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Yes please. Thank you. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Go ahead. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So we have DEM (Department of Environmental Management) here, Environmental Management. Do you have Page 8 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 anything you want to add to the conversation today? Could you come up to the front, I have one question for you. If not, two or three. And please introduce yourself for the record. (Note: At this time, Alex White, Recycling Specialist of Environmental Management, came forward to address the members of the Committee) MR. WHITE: Alex White of Department of Environmental Management, Recycling Specialist. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Beautiful. How many Recycling Specialist positions do we have? MR. WHITE: We currently have three Recycling Specialists on payroll but I'm not sure, sorry about the total positions. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: I think we have six total if I remember right. Okay. Anyway. The landfill. Can you speak to the landfill? MR. WHITE: Yeah. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So landfill that we have in Pu`uanahulu is, well when I started was ready for 100 years, then it turned into 50 years, and I think the last I heard is more like 25 years of the lifespan on that landfill. Is that correct? MR. WHITE: Current estimates are closer to 50 or sorry current estimates are closer to 18 years. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: 18 years? MR. WHITE: Yes. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: That's amazing. We lost 70 years in seven years, from when I started. So I'm just making a point. Okay, so diversion then, in any form, really is in our benefit, unless we're going to extend the contract, take on a bigger space, and work with —who does our — MR. WHITE: Waste Management manages the landfill. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Work with Waste Management to have a longer or larger contract and pay more for a facility use, basically. Correct? MR. WHITE: Yeah. Page 9 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So do we know what percentage of goods going into our landfill is recyclable? MR. WHITE: We can provide specific numbers later. But as far as your —you're trying to isolate it down to the plastic containers, yeah, that's where we're getting at. So one of the things that we're doing right now is we're conducting a waste characterization study in Spring 2026. That will provide us substantial amount of data, as far as breaking down some of these categories. But we think it's somewhere around 25 percent of what's going in the landfill is recyclable. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Recyclable. Meaning glass. MR. WHITE: It's such a broad category, and obviously some of these categories, there's pros and cons to the recycling of it. And it just gets quite complicated, you know, the plastic water bottles as an example. You know, these things are not so straight forward all the time. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Can you speak to the contract with Hawaii Earth Recycling? MR. WHITE: Maybe. What's your question? MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Is their contract currently —are they contracted to handle biodegradable materials within their mulching, existing mulch program? MR. WHITE: Currently, we're only allowed to accept green waste. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Green waste only? MR. WHITE: Yeah, so compostable food containers, your fiber egg cartons, brown plastic bag, you know, brown paper bags. Those types of things are not allowed. So currently yard waste, branches. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: It doesn't seem too big of a step in my commonsense man brain to add in paper goods to that cause paper and composting kind of breakdown similarly. MR. WHITE: Yeah. So composting is all about the ratio between carbon and nitrogen. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So is composting the right word or are we using the wrong word? MR. WHITE: Our vendor makes mulch. Page 10 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. MR. WHITE: Yeah. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So it's called mulching. MR. WHITE: Yeah. Technically we call it enhanced mulch because they do cure it, and they do the process to eliminate invasive species and all that. So you get something that's not strict mulch. It's partially on the way of being broken down, and so it's somewhere in between a little bit. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: So within the mulching program currently with HER (Hawaiian Earth Recycling), they couldn't take biodegradable ware? MR. WHITE: Yeah, that's my understanding. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Or compostable ware. Correct? Because we need a separate composting facility for that. MR. WHITE: And the Department of Health regulates all that, and so there's a permit processing for that, to be able to accept food waste because, you know, there's vector transmission risk with, for instance, you have food and bacteria and pathogens and things like that. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: During the last administration, there was renewed speak of the composting facility. Has anything ever happened? MR. WHITE: Nothing that we can really talk about right now. But no, there's nothing. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Thank you. That was helpful. MR. WHITE: Yep. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: To the maker, as listening to the conversation earlier and what I'm hearing is restaurants, which I happen to work closely with a restaurant, restaurants will be here maybe with an extended cost for the product and the difference and the type of product being used. But to the maker, what I'm hearing is the companies that are speaking today are speaking about the inability to use another type of product, but specifically around biodegradable ware. So to Ms. Villegas or Ms. Galimba, when I go get Thai food, it doesn't come in a plastic container, it comes in a paper pail with a biodegradable lid. Is that not able to be used if this bill passes? Page 11 KNONWIRUTIN October 21, 2025 MS. VILLEGAS: No. It would be used. Those are restaurants that have already transitioned. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. So I guess it's important. I'm hearing that we can't. What I'm trying to understand is, if it's hot food that we're using a heavy dense plastic on because that's the only way we can do business, but I'm seeing businesses take up paper materials and the conversation isn't so much about whether it's a "plastic like" material that is compostable. It's that there already all are alternatives made out of paper or different products that may not look the same as plastic but are readily available. And being in the restaurant world and paying the bills for the restaurant world, I do have to offer that the comment that price increases for biodegradable ware might be 40 percent higher seems a bit high when I look over the bills that I have for the goods that I'm currently bringing in that are biodegradable. Mr. Ueda, would you like to speak to that at all? MR. UEDA: Ili. You know it really depends on the sizes you're using and, you know, there's so many factors on cost. So it's hard to isolate to your specific situation. So, yeah, I can't really answer why 40 percent, the number I got 40 percent, may not apply to your specific business. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Who are you with sir? MR. UEDA: Pardon me. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Which company are you representing or are you testifying? MR. UEDA: Oh ok. Sorry. I'm with Suisan. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Suisan? MR. UEDA: Yeah. MR. KANEALI`I-KLEINFELDER: Okay. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Ueda. I was just thinking about that. That number 40 percent is, I mean usually 10 to 15 percent is an increase you might see for a biodegradable ware versus what you're paying for a plastic container, but 40 percent seems like, seems pretty substantial. Maybe we should think about that, that number a little bit before we put it on the record. Okay. Thank you, Mr. Ueda. So to the maker then, I guess I'm just trying to reconfigure in my brain, so we can't use this because it's more expensive, but I think the reality is there's other materials out there that are similar that can do the same job that might be compostable or Page 12 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 biodegradable and that are very rarely accessible. I am just speaking to the intent of the bill to eliminate plastics in our landfill, which is over, kind of bulging at the seams already and beginning to move in the direction that is good for our keiki and not break businesses back and I'm one of those businesses. But we've —we and our business have moved towards transitioning to biodegradable ware since the first bill that went into effect five years ago. So just putting that out there for the public and continuing to support the bill. Thank you. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you so much. Council Member, Hustace. MR. HUSTACE: Thank you, Chair. This question is to the makers. Some of the testimonies asked us to look at the alignment between some of the counties in some regard. And just looking at Ordinance 19-30 from City and County of Honolulu, they call specifically out the healthcare sector, some of the exemptions and those sorts of things. So I'm curious if there's —if any conversations with healthcare providers, whether nursing facilities, assistance care facilities, if any of these proposed changes may impact those facilities. It's just one of things that I kind of see that's specifically called out in their bill, so I don't know if that kind of crossed your mind at all. MS. VILLEGAS: First off, I would say, trying to align everything between counties in any capacity as far as our codes, our administrations, our councils, I would love for that to be the case. But I think it would be nigh to impossible. However, I will say we wholeheartedly put our best efforts for this piece of legislation to —it was basically drafted off of City and County of Honolulu's legislation and with the best counsel that I've received, both from Corporation Counsel and LRB (Legislative Research Branch), it was to keep the legislation simple. City and County of Honolulu legislation is 11 pages long. They also received the same opposition, the same testimonies, and I'm sorry, I'll digress here if I keep going. But your question about healthcare facilities, no I have not reached out to them or talked to them. MR. HUSTACE: It was just kind of curious how that's called out specifically in their legislation, so anyway, okay. I'll leave that there. The other question that I had is, I don't know if Mr. White is still there in Hilo. I don't know if you can answer this one specifically, because it does pertain to the director, more or less the department on the exemptions side and the way that the —what we're amending from, with the polystyrene and plastic, I don't know if Mr. White's there. But it's really a question on the exemption side of things and curious how that one has been used in the past. And if we have seen providers, vendors make that adjustment within those 180 days and/or found some sort of loopholes within those 180 days. So I don't know, and I'm just kind of curious on that side or that is still in there to provide some leeway for undue hardship, but I don't know if I've seen any sort of transition or use of that exemption within DEM for that purpose. Within those 180 days, then they go reapply another 180 days, I don't know. So I'm just kind of Page 13 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 curious how that —I don't think we have DEM to answer that specifically. So thank you, Chair. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Alright. Council Member, Kimball. MS. KIMBALL: Just speaking along the lines of what Council Member Hustace was just asking with regards to the medical facilities, and I'm not sure if your question was particularly —this only has to do with food distribution, so it wouldn't include any sort of medical equipment that is often plastic and not recyclable. But not medical professional, professions but, you know, somebody's at the hospital they're being served food if they're, you know, staying for some length of time and I'm reading this and I'm not sure because this pertains to folks providing food to the public, if because of that, as soon as its available to the public rather than a patient, that might actually exclude, by default, but I think that's maybe something visit with Corporation Counsel, based on what you actually prefer. If you'd like to see the medical facilities using compostables out of their kitchens when serving to their patients, I think that's something that needs to be a conversation. But then that's medically reasonable, but I wonder if they're not already excluded because of that reference to food being served to the public, in that particular case. The other thing that I just wanted to weigh in on, I do hear and empathize with this need to have some standardization across the counties for what is the right type of product, and now it obviously we can't do anything from this lens here, but I wouldn't suggest perhaps we either introduce a resolution from the Council to the Legislature saying, hey, three of the four of us have done this in some form or another, I think it's time for a statewide uniform legislation, or to propose that through the State Association Counties. We look at introducing something that will represent a uniform structure that could be part of our HSAC (Hawai`i State Association of Counties), package, because I do think if you get to the point where three out of four counties have some sort of legislation around this, it is the time to bring some uniformity across the state. I think that I do hear that, and I think that makes sense. Thank you. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Council Member. Council Member, Galimba, and then I want to kind of move us along we have at least two more readings of this bill going forward. So go ahead, Council Member Galimba. MS. GALIMBA: Yeah, just for very briefly and very anecdotally. I just happened to be in Hilo Medical Center, and I noticed they actually are using compostable products, so there might not be even an issue for them. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you so much. Okay. I just want to add a couple things here. MS. VILLEGAS: Sorry. Chair. I did have one more thing to add. Page 14 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Oh ok. Go ahead. MS. VILLEGAS: Yeah. I just would like to add that, yes, the intention of this would be that healthcare facilities would transition to compostables or a reusable protocol or program. I see an alignment with people being in a medical facility for health -related issues, that it would make the most sense for them to be eating off of and with a healthier option than single -use disposable plastics. I also just have to throw out there, you know, it's tiresome to sit here as Council Members and Public Servants, and some call Politicians, and for years people make assumptions that we've got our pockets lined, right. I mean, that's the old school paradigm. Well having worked in the beer industry for years, which worked very closely with the Hawaii Restaurant Association, very closely with a lot of major businesses that bought our products, pockets get lined in the private sector. And, you know, I sit and listen to the perpetual, the same story, and it's an outdated false narrative, and I question the source of the data and the statistics and the percentages that get quoted and get misrepresented and confuse people and get manipulated to be utilized to just keep doing what we've always done because we don't have a perfect solution yet. And that's really frustrating. It's really frustrating for me and my generation. It's incredibly frustrating for younger generations now, which are looking to us to lead and to choose to be bold and courageous and maybe make a bit of a sacrifice now in order for them to have a clean, healthy, and safe environment, eco-system and future. I also want to point out the economies of scale. Somehow that keeps getting missed in the price point is that when more of a product gets ordered and the cost goes down. And so, I see this as a way to move forward. I struggle with myself for remaining diplomatic in the face of what I perceive as deceptive tactics, and they're the same stories that have been used for decades. And we as a County have not only survived, but continue to thrive as we've transitioned away from styrofoam and single -use plastic bags. And when it comes to amendments and working and making compromises or deferring to the suggested amendments, historically what that has allowed for is loopholes and its weakened legislation, and it's allowed for vendors, large businesses claiming small business status, that then utilize. They just call it "oh it's a reusable plastic bag." Still gets thrown away, but that's even more plastic. Sol want to point back to the root of the story, and the false narrative is coming from the plastics industry with billions of dollars to convince people, who it's their job, to try and benefit the bottom line of their company. But we have to hold ourselves accountable to a higher standard. With the triple to quadruple bottom line, the profit margins are not the only goal. With that, I yield. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you. Page 15 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 MS. KIMBALL: I'm going to just make a very brief statement. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Alright. Council Member, Kimball. MS. KIMBALL: To the makers of this bill. I am completely in alignment with the intent with this. I do feel we kind of are creeping up to the line of debating facts versus debating intention. I would suggest that, you know, some numbers been put forth today that may seem like they're not exactly accurate, that it's probably better to come back with some accurate numbers than to speak to anyone's intention. Just to keep us within the decorum of `Roberts Rules,' I think we need to make sure we focus on the facts. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you, Council Member. Alright, just a couple things I want to add. One, to some of the testifiers today, understand that you know, some of this change is hard and we have to work through it together. We don't want to cause undue hardship, but we do want to move our County forward. I hope that you'd be willing to work with the reusable Hilo foodware project to see about if some of those prospective reusable foodware items might be better suited for some of the food that you're serving at your establishment. That might be that hot or oily kind of stuff and obviously for the, you know, seven - pound barrel of hot chili, I think something like that probably can be something that can get an exception, if needed at this time. So, those kinds of things. And then just to the issue about, you know, all of the counties aligning, you know, City and County bills written in 2019, we've learned quite a lot from them. Our bill, I believe, is better, and I think they may need to do some updating to catch up with us now. So I think, for us to try to align with either Maui or City and County for bills that are six or seven years old, doesn't make a lot of sense. We are doing what's based on current knowledge and practice and what's out there. So, they actually need to probably catch up to us, and hopefully if we can work either through this state legislation or HSAC we can try to get everybody on the same page. But I don't believe it will be going backwards; it should be going forward. So with that, I think we have a motion on the floor to vote on this measure, so all those in favor on sending Bill 83 to Council with a favorable recommendation, please say "aye." Any opposed? Page 16 PCENRM-6 October 21, 2025 Vote on Bill 83: The motion to recommend passage of Bill 83, Draft 2, on Draft 2 first reading was carried by the following roll call vote: (Approved) Ayes: Committee Members Galimba, Hustace, Inaba, Kaneali`i-Kleinfelder, Kimball, Villegas, and Acting Chair Kagiwada — 7. Noes: Committee Member Onishi —1. Absent: Committee Member Kierkiewicz — 1. Excused: None. ACTING CHR. KAGIWADA: Thank you very much, Clerk, and thank you, everybody. That's the final item of our agenda. The time is 3:34 (p.m.), and we are adjourned. Thank you. ADJOURN- There being no further business, Acting Chair Kagiwada adjourned the MENT: meeting at 3:34 p.m. Approved: Ms. Rebecca Villegas, Chair Policy Committee on Environmental and Natural Resource Management RV/tk 401d (Date) Page 17