HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN COUNCIL 2015/02/04 2014-2016HAWAII COUNTY COUNCIL
51h Session
Hawaii County Building
25 Aupuni Street
Hilo, Hawaii
February 4, 2015
INVOCATION: Reverend Bryan Siebuhr of Honpa Hongwanji Hilo Betsuin gave the morning's
invocation.
CALL TO The regular meeting of the Hawaii County Council was called to order at
ORDER: 9:05 a.m., in the Council Chambers, Hilo, by Mr. Dru Mamo Kanuha, Chair.
ROLL CALL:
Present: Mr.
Dru Mamo Kanuha, Chair
Ms.
Valerie Poindexter, Vice Chair
Mr.
Aaron Chung, Member (came in later)
Ms.
Maile "Medeiros" David, Member
Ms.
Karen Eoff, Member
Mr.
Greggor Eagan, Member
Mr.
Dennis "Fresh" Onishi, Member (came in later)
Mr.
Danny Paleka, Member
Ms.
Margaret Wille, Member
PLEDGE OF The Chair directed the Council to the next order of business, Pledge of
ALLEGIANCE: Allegiance.
(At this time, Mr. Paleka led the Council in the Pledge of
Allegiance.)
CHR KANUHA: Mahalo. I saw Mr. Onishi this morning. So, he should be
down here soon. This morning, we also have a few certificates to present. I
think, first up, we have Ms. Poindexter.
PETITIONS, The Chair directed the Council to the next order of business, Petitions,
MEMORIALS, Memorials, Certificates of Merit, and Expressions of Condolence
CERTIFICATES
OF MERIT, AND
EXPRESSIONS
OF CONT OI TNCF:
Hawaii County Council -5 February 4, 2015
Keith "Bradda Presentation of a Certificate of Merit Sponsored by Council Member
Skibs" Nehls: Valerie T. Poindexter recognizing Keith "Bradda Skibs" Nehls for his devotion
and generosity to the Hamakua community.
Reference: Comm. 97
Motion to Close File: Ms. Poindexter moved to close file on Comm. 97.
Seconded by Ms. Eoff
(Note: At this time, Ms. Poindexter presented the Certificate of Merit to
Mr. Nehls.)
Recess: At 9:14 a.m., the Chair called for a short recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 9:16 a.m.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, we are out of recess. Thank you. Ms. Poindexter, I
think you also had an announcement.
Announcement: CHR. POINDEXTER: Oh, yes. We have some guests in our audience, and
they're exchange students. So, with the local coordinators who always bring in
exchange students and they bring them here to the County Council a lot of times,
so they can understand how government works. The coordinators are Yvette
Yvette, say hi—and Alison. So we have exchange students this morning, Becka
from Kurdistan. And anybody knows where Kurdistan is? It'soh, she knows.
Okay, it's Central Asia. I've never heard of that. She's from Central Asia. Then
we have Linus from Germany; and we also have Deanna from Russia.
CHR KANUHA: Wow.
CHR. POINDEXTER: It's very special to have Deanna, because she is going to
be one of the last students being able to come as an exchange student, because
Russia has now put a stop to the exchange student program. So very special.
Welcome to have all of you hear today. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Poindexter; and welcome. Okay, I did also
want to mention that I had a letter from Council Member Onishi that he will be
arriving later today. He has a dentist appointment this morning, so he will be
coming in approximately 10:00 a.m. Just for the public's information, and the
rest of the Council.
Moving on—oh yeah, we have to vote on the communication. Mr. Clerk, on
Communication 97.
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Hawaii County Council -5
Vote on Motion
to Close File:
Filed
STATEMENTS
FROM THE
PUBLIC ON
AGENDA ITEMS
February 4, 2015
The motion to close file on Comm. 97 was carried by the
following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Onishi — 1.
Excused: None.
The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business,
Statements from the Public on Agenda Items.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, we have a lot here in Hilo. I'm going to check with the
rest of the sites.
The following individuals registered to speak and came forward when called by
the Chair:
Cory Harden:
Craig Shiroma:
(Representing Hawaiian Airlines)
Harry Kim:
Rene Siracusa:
(Representing Malama `O Puna)
Debra Welch:
Richard Abbett:
Bruce Corker:
(Representing the Kona Coffee
Farmer's Association)
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Res. 46-15 (Comm. 75), in support
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), comment.
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Sharon Willeford: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Aelbert C. Aehegma:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
David Cottis:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Carol L. Diericky:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Cynthia Waymegwance:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
John Davis:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Lukas Kambic:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Steve Hirakami:
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support.
Dave Kisor:
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
CHR KANUHA: Mahalo for your testimony. Council Members, I'm going to
take a brief recess for personal—but also, the exchange students would like to
take a picture with the full Council. So just a brief recess and then we can resume
shortly. Recess.
Recess: At 10:14 a.m., the Chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 10:25 a.m.
Bill Bugbee:
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Shannon Rudolph:
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Mary Winter:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Dylan Trumpy:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
CHR KANUHA: Excuse me. Staff, we'll take a brief recess, please. Recess.
Recess: At 10:34 a.m., the Chair called for a short recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 10:37 a.m.
Teri Markovich:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
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Hawaii County Council -5
Tara Trumpy:
Jim Albertini:
(Representing Malu `Aina)
Keoni Silverstrone:
February 4, 2015
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Suzanne Wakelin: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Paul Kuykendall: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Cathleen Gehrhardt:
Wakan Zephier:
Kathy Kurpita:
Hanalei Fergerstrom:
Kent Olsen:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Jeffery Rauch: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Ken Peeler: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Keith Kurpita: Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Will Houts: Comm. 9. 1, in support.
CHR KANUHA: Mahalo for your testimonies. Okay, we're going to come back
to Hilo. Before the next two testifiers, I just want to have a brief recess. Thank
you. Recess.
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Hawaii County Council -5
Recess: At 11:15 a.m. the chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 11:24 a.m.
Point of Order: MS. WILLE: Point of order.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Wille, state your point, please.
February 4, 2015
MS. WILLE: Yes, the next testifier is attorney Marjery Bronster, and she is the
attorney for the other side, opposing the County on this. We are the clients here.
I'm not going to object to her testifying, but I do just want to say that I consider it,
it's questionable ethically for the attorney on the opposing side to, you know,
contact directly, the clients. But I'm not objecting to it. I think best to just go
ahead. We have things in writing. But I want to just point that out in terms of my
personal opinion.
CHR KANUHA: Mahalo. That will be noted, and we'll continue with testimony
here in Hilo.
Grayson Inouye:
(Representing the Pacific Floral
Exchange)
Margery Bronster:
(Representing Bronster Hoshibata
and Plaintiffs)
Comm. 9. 1, in opposition.
Comm. 9. 1, in opposition.
Sophia Wilt: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Joyce Alberta Folena: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 49-15 (Comm. 78), in support;
Res. 50-15 (Comm. 79), in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), comment; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), comment.
April K. Lee: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Todd Andrews: Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Moriah Smith: Comm. 9. 1, in support.
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Hawaii County Council -5
Katherine Pomeroy:
Jana Bogs:
Judith C. Mura:
Lorie Farrell:
(Representing Hawaii Farmers
and Ranchers United)
February 4, 2015
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 11 in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Gregory T. Smith: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 49-15 (Comm. 78), in support;
Res. 50-15 (Comm. 79), in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), comment; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), comment.
Jacu Weber:
Dashiell Kuhr:
(Representing the Kohala
Farmers Union)
John Cole:
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), comment.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
CHR KANUHA: Mahalo for your testimony. Council Members, it's a little
after 12:15. I think it's time for a break. I think we'll take a recess and
reconvene—we have about 30 more here in Hilo, so we can come back around
1:30, if it's okay with everybody. Okay, we'll recess until 1:30.
Recess: At 12:22 p.m., the Chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 1:41 p.m.
Joy Cash: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Moanikeala Akaka: Comm. 9. 1, in support.
(Representing the Aloha `Aina
Education Center)
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
Lisa Andrews: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res.
47-15 (C- 76 ), in support;
Res.
49-15 (Comm. 78), in support;
Res.
50-15 (Comm. 79), in support;
Res.
51-15 (Comm. 84), in support;
Res.
52-15 (Comm. 85), in support;
Res.
53-15 (Comm. 86), in support;
Res.
57-15 (Comm. 90), in support;
Res.
58-15 (Comm. 92), in support;
Res.
59-15 (Comm. 93), in support;
Bill
7 (Comm. 26), in support; and
Bill
19 (Comm. 68), in support.
Tina Floyd: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Blake Watson:
Derek Brewer:
(Representing Eco Hostel Hawaii
and Hawaii Earth Justice)
Bryan Belice:
Alan Bruton:
Jeffrey Popp:
Sissy Galdones:
Keahi Tajon:
William Braham:
(Representing the Malama Ki
Buddha Wisdom Garden)
Robert Petricci:
(Representing Puna Pono
Alliance)
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, comment;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), comment; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), comment.
Kalia Avery: Comm. 9. 1, comment;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), comment; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), comment.
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Hawaii County Council -5
Thomas Yeh:
(Representing Puna Geothermal
Venture)
Mike Kaleikini:
(Representing Puna Geothermal
Venture)
Jessica Andrews:
February 4, 2015
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in opposition; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in opposition.
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in opposition; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in opposition.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Geoff Shaw: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Sally Waitt: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Martin D. Lydgate Driggs
Kim N. Kozuma:
(Representing 2 Girls Farm, LLC)
Fernando Salas:
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support.
Kerri Marks: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 49-15 (Comm. 78), comment;
Res. 50-15 (Comm. 79), comment;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), comment; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), comment.
Donald Wessels:
Chandell Asuncion:
Joycelyn Iyo:
Patricia Wagatsuma Stewart:
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support.
Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 49-15 (Comm. 78), comment;
Res. 50-15 (Comm. 79), comment;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), comment; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), comment.
Comm. 9. 1, in opposition.
Comm. 9. 1, comment.
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Thank you for your testimony, being that was the last one that
I have here, I'm going to ask the audience if there is anybody else wishing to
testify? And the rest of the sites? Okay. Hearing or seeing none, I will close
public testimony we'll take a brief 10 -minute recess. Sorry, Mr. Onishi?
MR. ONISHL No, as soon as you close, then I can make a comment?
CHR KANUHA: Sure. I will close public testimony, and Mr. Onishi you have
a?
MR. ONISHL Yeah, so we have Hawaiian Airlines staff, so as soon as we come
back, we can take them?
CHR KANUHA: Perfect.
MR. ONISHL Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: We'll take a brief 10 -minute recess, and we'll come back in
10 minutes. Recess.
Recess: At 3:32 p.m., the Chair called for a short recess.
The following individuals registered to speak, but were unable to stay until their
name was called:
Serafina Gajate: Comm. 9. 1, in support.
Eric S. Tanouye: Comm. 9. 1, in opposition.
(Representing the Hawaii
Floriculture and Nursery Assn.)
Thomas Lee Travis: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Nancy Wood: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
John Douvris: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
George Douvris: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Shana Ritsema: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Kieba Dailey:
Steve Dailey:
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support.
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support.
Roy Lazano: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Nicollette Douvris: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Steve Sparks: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Stephanie Douvris: Comm. 9. 1, in support;
Res. 58-15 (Comm. 92), in support; and
Res. 59-15 (Comm. 93), in support.
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 3:41 p.m.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, aloha everybody. We are coming out of recess. We are
going to move on to the Order of Resolutions. Mr. Clerk, Resolution 46-15
ORDER OF The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Order of
RESOLUTIONS: Resolutions.
Res. 46-15: URGES THE UNITED STATES DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION
(DOT) TO APPROVE THE APPLICATION OF HAWAIIAN AIRLINES
FOR ALLOCATION OF A NONSTOP ROUTE BETWEEN KONA,
HAWAII, AND TOKYO, JAPAN
Supports Hawaiian Airlines' application for this nonstop route.
Reference: Comm. 75
Intr. by: Mr. Onishi
Waived: GREDC
Page 11
Hawaii County Council -5 February 4, 2015
Motion to Approve: Mr. Onishi moved to adopt Res. 46-15. Seconded by
Mr. Eagan.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Onishi, you have the floor.
MR. ONISHL Can I have Craig Shiroma, you can come up, from Hawaiian Air?
(Note: At this time, Mr. Craig Shiroma, Hawaiian Airlines Sales
Executive, came forward to address the members of the Council.)
I know he did a testimony this morning, but just to kind of brief Council Members
again since this is a long day, and king of refresh you guys on what we are doing.
Okay, thank you.
MR. SHIROMA: Yes, Councilman Fresh Onishi, I want to thank you, especially,
to introduce this resolution for us on our behalf. Council Members, thank you
especially for this resolution on our behalf, and all of the Council Members as
well. Yeah, it's been a long process. I didn't know how that would work out
here, but I want to thank you very much for all of your support. You know, we
look at this application to be very exciting for the Big Island, and you know to
have service once again from Tokyo non-stop into Kona. So thank you so much.
We think that it's going to boost the economy tremendously in the terms of not
only tourism, but again, agriculture, aquaculture and also we need to look at the
Japan students that may come abroad and go to our UH (University of Hawaii)
system as well. So again, thank you so much for your support.
MR. ONISHL You're welcome. And I just went too, and it's just echoing what
Mr. Shiroma had mentioned. It's not just about tourism, it's about the other
businesses, the mom and pop shops that I guess now the Asian market it's been
changing, right, they're not really here to like just buy things. They want to go
and look at—sight see, they like to go look at the water falls, the gardens.
MR. SHIROMA: Right, and you know, they want to experience what the local
people experience. They want a really Hawaiian experience. So when you look
at the repeated visitor, they'll go out on their own and they will eat at the
restaurants and they'll go to the mom and pop stores. So I don't see anybody who
would not benefit from this.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, and then also just to add, I'm hoping that with this
resolution, it would help influence our Federal Government, especially customs
and Border Patrol to grant the permit that the State has applied for. So I'm hoping
that really happens. Council Members, just to let you know about what, two years
ago, or three years ago, you folks tried
MR. SHIROMA: Correct.
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
MR. ONISHL Applied for this route too, and we did do a reso. So, it's just
reinforcing again that Hawaii County believes that we should have this coming to
Kona.
MR. SHIROMA: Yes, thank you.
MR. ONISHL Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Onishi. Ms. Wille.
MS. WILLE: Yeah, I want to thank you, and I really want this to happen. I've
been a very strong proponent of having this island have a very special relationship
with Japan. We do have the Cherry Blossom Festival coming up this Saturday if
you can come, and including the senior bake -off contest that I'm sponsoring. But
beyond that, I really believe we've got the Asia Pacific ohana. We're not just part
of the U.S., we're part of a whole Pacific Region. For example just Waimea, you
know, the Emperor and the Empress coming there and saying that was the special
place for them.
MR. SHIROMA: Yes.
MS. WILLE: And the whole, even bringing back the paniolos to train the
Emperor's helpers there with the stable and designing the stable after ours. I
mean, I can go on. In terms of World War II and the camps and the relationships
between the Japanese people. And just overall their affinity for nature and that
significance, and that's really what I see this island is so special about. You
know, being in touch with nature and the elements. And so, I would like it if, on
your flights coming in, if you get them, you hand something out along those lines.
Not just Hilo Hattie, but really working on what it is being part of this island and
nature. So thank you again.
MR. SHIROMA: Thank you for that.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Wille. Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just want to, first of all, thank you,
Council Member Onishi, for bringing this up. Mr. Shiroma, I wanted to ask if
you had run the numbers on the possibility of the Japanese flyers coming into
Kona and then they would have the other flights to the other islands, not just Big
Island would be their final stay.
MR. SHIROMA: Correct. So currentlyI don't have the current numbers on
what Japanese tourists come in and transfer out. We did a study saying there will
be an additional 39,000 Japanese tourists coming into Hawai'i Island. I would
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
imagine some of them will be transferring and perhaps going on to the Mainland
and so on. But you know, Japanese, their vacation period is not very long. So
they don't take those three-four week vacations. One-two weeks, so when they
come in its destination specific. I think along with our Big Island Visitors Bureau
we will work on keeping the visitors here. And of course, you know, the furthest
from Kona they will venture is hopefully East Hawaii.
MR. ILAGAN: Well, the reason why I brought that up was because Council
Member Onishi is the representative for HSAC (Hawai`i State Association of
Counties), and maybe with those numbers you could convince other counties in
the state to pass a resolution in support of this line, and there would the State of
Hawaii and all the counties in support of this—what is it called? Route, that's
the word I was looking for.
MR. SHIROMA: Yeah, that's an excellent suggestion, and we will take that up
with the different counties.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you for working hard and providing the service for the
people of the Big Island.
MR. KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. Ms. David.
MS. DAVID: First of all, mahalo, Fresh, for introducing this resolution. And
Mr. Shiroma, I would like to thank you and your organization. I believe that the
Japan relationship with Hawaii is very important, especially when it comes to our
cultural tradition with respect to hula. There is a very special close relationship in
that regard, and a direct flight to Kona would definitely help with that
relationship. And I really thank you for doing that. Mahalo.
MR. SHIROMA: Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Mahalo, Ms. David. Any other Council Members? Okay, I
just wanted to say something. I wanted to mahalo Mr. Onishi for submitting this
resolution. I think it's a great resolution and I will fully support it as well. I don't
want to restate everything that everybody said, but this is going to help the whole
island, you know, not just any specific location, but this is an island -wide
initiative for everybody. So, I fully support it, and just a big mahalo for Hawaiian
Airlines. And hopefully we can, when we go to DC (Washington, D.C.), we can
push it as well. So Mr. Clerk, the vote.
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Hawaii County Council -5
Vote on Res. 46-15
(Adopted)
The motion to adopt Res. 46-15 was carried by the
following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha – 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
MR. ONISHL Can we suspend our rules for the holdover?
CHR KANUHA: Are you making a motion?
MR. ONISHL Yes, please. Can I make a motion?
February 4, 2015
Motion to Suspend Mr. Onishi moved to suspend Council Rule 15 to waive the
Council Rules: five-day hold for reconsideration of Res. 46-15. Seconded
by Mr. Eagan and carried by the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ilagan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha – 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, motion passes. Okay, Mr. Clerk—Mr. Onishi?
MR. ONISHL One more thing. Can we have Resolution 54-15?
CHR KANUHA: Yep, I was going to do that one next, for Ms. Kamaka.
Mr. Clerk, can we do Resolution 54-15?
MR. ONISHL Yeah. Oh good, because we've got HR (Human Resources) right
there. And then, thank you, Craig. Thank you very much.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Clerk, can we do—thank you. Can we do
Resolution 54-15?
Change Order As directed by the Chair and with no objections from the Council Members, the
Of Business: following items were taken out of order:
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Res. 54-15: AUTHORIZES THE OFFICE OF THE MAYOR TO ENTER INTO AN
AGREEMENT WITH THE STATE OF HAWAII DEPARTMENT OF
HUMAN RESOURCES DEVELOPMENT, PURSUANT TO HAWAII
REVISED STATUTES SECTION 46-7, TO PROVIDE WORKERS'
COMPENSATION ADMINISTRATION SERVICES
Renews a current agreement that expires on March 31, 2015, to provide the above
services to the Parks and Recreation Department and the Police Department.
Vote on Res. 54-15:
(Approved)
Reference: Comm. 87
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Ms. Eoff moved to adopt Res. 54-15. Seconded by
Ms. David and carried by the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha – 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, motion passes. Mr. Eagan?
Vote on motion to
Suspend Council Rules:
(Approved)
Mr. Eagan moved to suspend Council Rule 10 to allow
voice votes for the remainder of the meeting. Seconded by
Mr. Onishi and carried by the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ilagan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha – 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Motion passes. Is it okay with the Council
Members if we take up resolution—Mr. Eagan is it time to take 58-15? Okay.
Rest of the Council Members okay? Mr. Clerk, Resolution 58-15.
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Res. 58-15: REQUESTS PUNA GEOTHERMAL VENTURE (PGV) TO REDUCE THE
NOISE IMPACT TO RESIDENTS DURING THE NIGHT BY COMPLYING
WITH ORDINANCE NO. 12-151
Requests that PGV comply with Ordinance 12-151 by restricting drilling
operations at production well KS -16 to the hours of 7 a.m. to 7 p.m.
Reference: Comm. 92
Intr. by: Mr. Eagan
Waived: AWESC
(Note: Comm. 92. 1, from Council Member Dennis "Fresh" Onishi dated
January 30, 2015, transmitting information regarding Res. 587-15, was
circulated.)
Motion to Approve: Mr. Eagan moved to adopt Res. 58-15. Seconded by
Mr. Paleka.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Eagan, you have the floor.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair. To explain to the community what
happened and the reason why I introduced Resolution 58-15, Council Member
Danny Paleka and I hosted four community meetings in Puna. And as we heard
from the community while we had those meetings, we tallied up all the issues and
one of the main issue that we heard from the community was the geothermal
drilling ban. What I did was, I spoke to our Corporation Counsel and tried to ask
what their stand is regarding this ban. Then I saw the video of the previous
Council of how this ban got initiated, and then I spoke with the Director of
Planning to find out what's the status regarding this ban. So I thought very long
and hard regarding this and tried to figure out where and what I was going to do.
And from what I've learned is that we have currently in our books, if you just
look at it plainly, a ban on the operation of geothermal drilling at night. And is it
my job to interpret that provision? I went back to just a simple basic foundation,
and I started looking into my principles. I even went back further into reading my
Oath of Office. When I got elected to the Council, "I do solemnly swear to
support and defend the Constitution of the United States and the Constitution of
the State of Hawaii to the best of my ability."
When I looked into the Constitution, first I would like to start off with the State
Constitution, and I looked at the first Bill of Rights, there are 20 Bills of Rights.
The first one says that all government authority is given by the people. And when
I started looking into the first three articles of our federal government, the first
article is the legislative power of our Congress and the second is the executive
power is based on the President. Our third is that judicial courts interpret and
apply the laws. So I had the idea of moving forward with first being respectful to
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the current plan, and requested and drafted a resolution and request to comply
with the law.
And the next step was Resolution 59-15. I know it wasn't read into record but
just to point out, is that I wanted to bring this to the judicial and they would
interpret the law and make an action so we can move on, with all the
interpretations out there we can have a final one, and move on. That's what I
would like to see. That's why I did this.
If you have any questions, I can definitely bring up the representative for PGV
(Puna Geothermal Ventures) and would like to formally ask them. I know they
sent their testimony, but maybe if you would like to go on record, if you would.
MR. MAEDA: You have 30 seconds.
MR. ILAGAN: If you would like to support this resolution. If I can call for a
representative from PGV up? If you could state your name and title?
MR. ILAGAN: I just wanted tonot argue with you, but I just wanted to ask you
just to Be It Resolved thatI know you mentioned in your testimony is that you
will comply with all the laws in the County and the State, and I respect that. I just
wanted to ask you, that `Be It Resolved by the Council of the County of Hawaii
that PGV has respectfully requested to reduce the noise impacts to residents
during the night by complying with Ordinance Number 12-151."
(Note: At this time, Mike Kaleikini, Director of Hawaiian Affairs, Puna
Geothermal Ventures and Ormat, came forward to address the members of
the Council.)
MR. KALEIKINL My name is Mike Kaleikini and my title is Director for
Hawaiian Affairs, Puna Geothermal Venture and Ormat. My response to your
request is no.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mike.
MR. KALEIKINL You're welcome.
(Note: At this time, Thomas Yeh, Attorney for Puna Geothermal Venture,
came forward to address the members of the Council.)
MR. YEH: Councilman, with all due respect, my name is Thomas Yeh, Attorney
for PGV. Part of the difficulty and I agree, we shouldn't be here arguing with
you. That's not our purpose. But as we pointed out, it's difficult to practically
comply with the terms of the ordinance, and we understand the request of you to
have them voluntarily comply, but if you take a look at the ordinance it talks
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about all drilling and all drilling operations. And maybe we have not done it as
artfully as possible, but when you talk about drilling operations, even though you
might stop drilling, related to those operations in order to maintain well integrity
and the safety of that well, whatever phase you are in, you need to have hydraulic
pumps running and other activities that are going on so that you do not have
issues that are going to compromise both safety of the plant and the personnel, but
the safety of the community.
So to some extent the ordinance, because it's overbroad, accomplishes a result, if
it was to be followed, that actually compromises public safety without the benefit
of eliminating the noise at night, because you need to have this equipment running
in the evening. So it's not that PGV is refusing to comply, but when you have an
ordinance that is so broad in terms of all the activities that it purports to prohibit,
you can't do it. And so, if you are going to drill and you are going to drill in order
to produce power to more people, this is what you have to do. So that's why, it's
very difficult for PGV to officially say we are going to comply.
On the other hand, I think is what Mr. Kaleikini has said, is that just as with other
kind of activities that are regulated in agricultural districts that have the very same
noise standards, it will comply. It will comply with the standards that the EPA
(Environmental Protection Agency) sets for their injection wells, with DOH
(Department of Health) for injection wells or production wells. Those are the
things that Mr. Kaleikini was talking about, but on the face of the ordinance itself,
it really is something that needs to be taken another look at, because we have this
purpose or intention that has been stated in the previous Council of what it's
trying to accomplish, But when you take a look at the ordinance itself, it doesn't
do that. It doesn't even speak to noise in particular. So that's the basic difficulty
of saying yes, we will. I don't think the question is quite that simple, but
hopefully that provides an explanation of what the position is.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. I think your five minutes were finished. We'll go
through the first round. Mr. Onishi, you are next.
MR. ONISHL Mr. Chair, this is a question to you. I have questions about what
happened back in 2012, because basically I'm the only Council Member that was
on that Council during that time and when this bill passed. So there is, I guess
things I want to say in public, but I don't know if I can do that. So I wanted to go
into executive session to ask Corp. Counsel, and also, I guess, to have Corp.
Counsel explain to members, the new members, of what had happened at that
time during the executive session. Is that possible?
CHR KANUHA: I think it is possible, yes.
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MR. ONISHL I would make a motion to go into Executive Session.
Motion to Enter Mr. Onishi moved to enter into Executive Session in order
Into Executive Session: to hold attorney-client privileged discussion regarding
Res. 58-15, pursuant to Hawaii Revised Statutes
Section 92-5(a)(4). Seconded by Ms. Poindexter.
CHR KANUHA: It's been moved and seconded to go into executive session
regarding discussion with Corp. Counsel
MR. ONISHL Discussion with Corp. Counsel about details that had happened in
2012, when we also went into executive session with them. Because right now
we do not have any records of that, so you folks cannot see that. Okay, so I
would want at least you folks to see what had happened at that time.
CHR KANUHA: Okay. There is a motion on the floor. Any discussion?
Ms. Poindexter.
MS. POINDEXTER: Yes, I would support going into executive session because I
am definitely not familiar what was discussed in a previous executive session that
could be very, very helpful to me as well. So, that is the reason why I'm
supporting this.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I also support going into executive session. I feel that all
information should be made available to the Council Members, and we can decide
as a body how to move forward. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Wille.
MS. WILLE: I don't have a problem with that, but I would like to ask them, the
representatives of PGV some questions that no need to be in—yes, so I would feel
that we should all have a chance to speak just as Council Member Ilagan did
before going into executive session.
CHR KANUHA: The motion on the floor is to go into executive session, so just
regarding the executive session, the motion on the floor.
MS. WILLE: So I'm asking that we don't go into executive right away. I feel
that's cutting off those of us that have things that we want to say that don't
necessarily have to be in executive session. And people can leave, and I—you
know, so I don't think it's fair.
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CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Wille. Mr. Chung.
MR. CHUNG: Thank you. I think that the information that Mr. Onishi is looking
for in the executive session might be more germane to Resolution 59-15 instead
of this one which we are just asking PGV to kindly comply with our ordinance.
They said no. I don't know what the legal issues are in that one, but I think we
should wait until we get to Resolution 59-15 to go into an executive session.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL To first Ms. Wille's one. If we do question PGV, but what about
the public, because we could bring up certain people from the public to ask them
questions too, and what they had said in testimony, right? So then it wouldn't
end. So by going into Executive Session—and I will be answering now,
Mr. Chung's, I guess, concern was that, at that time of—see, I don't know how
far I can go too, but it was discussed on the understanding of what the intent was
when we passed this, okay? So that's what I want to get, and I want Corp.
Counsel to at least explain that part. And I can also find out what I can say
afterwards.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Onishi. Mr. Paleka?
MR. PALEKA: Thank you, Chair. I'm in agreement that we dispose of this
matter first, and if executive session does comes up, it should come up in 59-15.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Ms. Eoff.
MS. EOFF: I was just going to say we can either ask Mr. Onishi to withdraw that
motion at this time, or we would have to vote on it and make a decision that way.
CHR KANUHA: I know Mr. Onishi is uncomfortable about making certain
statements in public regarding executive session matters that happened
previously, and I know there's stuff he wants to say related to what's in
Resolution 58-15. So that's where I think he's going, and I understand
everybody's concern about 59-15. But I want to make that clear.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Eagan?
MR. ILAGAN: Okay, I want to keep moving forward, and from my
understanding from Mike just told me, I feel like even if we pass this reso, he
already gave me an answer. So to move things forward, I'm going to withdraw
this and if we could read Resolution 59-15 and then we can address executive
session and Margaret's concerns about speaking about some questions that need
to be put out in the public. So at this time, I'm going tocan I withdraw the bill
while it's still on the other motion, or does it have to be on the main motion?
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CHR KANUHA: Mr. Clerk is that appropriate?
February 4, 2015
MR. MAEDA: We have Mr. Onishi's motion for executive session. So, that
needs to be taken care of
Withdrawal of MR. ILAGAN: I withdraw 58-15.
Res. 58-15:
MS. POINDEXTER: I withdraw my second.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, Resolution 58-15 has been withdrawn. Thank you,
Mr. Eagan. Mr. Clerk, Resolution 59-15.
Res. 59-15: REQUESTS THE OFFICE OF THE CORPORATION COUNSEL TO
INITIATE A DECLARATORY JUDGEMENT ACTION TO DETERMINE
THE APPLICABILITY OF ORDINANCE NO. 12-151 TO PUNA
GEOTHERMAL VENTURE'S (PGV) DRILLING OPERATIONS UNDER
GEOTHERMAL RESOURCE PERMIT NO. 2, AND/OR TO SEEK
INJUNCTIVE RELIEF
Requests the Office of the Corporation Counsel to re-examine issues relating to
PGV's intent to conduct 24-hour drilling operations at production well KS -16.
Reference: Comm. 93
Intr. by: Mr. Eagan
Waived: AWESC
Motion to Approve: Mr. Eagan moved to adopt Res. 59-15. Seconded by
Mr. Onishi.
MR. ILAGAN: As we spoke previously, I am comfortable either we go into
executive session or talk openly, publicly. And whichever you decide, Chair, I
am comfortable in whichever method you want to take care of this issue.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. I'm going to let Ms. Wille speak
openly and all members openly before—if anybody wants to speak before we go
into executive session. So Ms. Wille, you have the floor.
MS. WILLE: I would like for us to be able to speak openly at first, and then I
have no problem after we each have the opportunity to. I still have some
questions that I wanted to ask PGV representatives. I thinkI won't get into
anything else, but I feel that we should do what we can openly. We are supposed
to be open government. I actually have no problem having Mr. Onishi say what
he felt from 2012 that was in open meeting. I watched it on YouTube. And
saying that publicly and what was the intent and what was discussed. That is one
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issue. It's not certainly the only issue or the decisive issue. I just want to
promote that we all have the opportunity.
CHR KANUHA: You have the opportunity right now.
MS. WILLE: Do I have the opportunity right now?
CHR KANUHA: Yes. We're on Resolution 59-15.
MS. WILLE: Okay, I have one question. What if you were to cut I'm trying to
come to some sort of compromise—not drill over the weekends, or some period.
In other words, instead of going on-off every dayI realize there is practical
issues and greater cost. I think one of the things that's changed from 2012 to right
now is the much higher level of stressors, you know, of whether it's the
hurricanes, and the higher level of vog, and the lava. And when you have
constant stressors, to add one more constant stressor, it's really cataclysmic. I
mean, I think.
So I appreciate what you all are saying. But I think they're equities. It's not
like—we're not talking right and wrong here. And just trying to work out the
same thing, if you had someone drilling in your bedroom all the time, and plus
your fear of the lava's coming and the vog in everybody's eyes. So I just want to
throw that out. I'll will let you comment in a moment. I'd also like
Point of Information: MR. ONISHL Wait, point of information.
CHR KANUHA: Yes, Mr.
MR. ONISHL Mr. Chair, so Resolution 59-15 is requesting Council to reexamine
issues per PGV's 24-hour drilling operations. More questions should be referred
to Corp. Counsel instead of PGV, because were asking, I guess this reso's asking
Corp. Counsel to look into it. And maybe Mr. Ragan can kind of explain better
about what this resolution is all about.
MS. WILLE: And I will—can I respond to him, or his point of order?
CHR KANUHA: Real quickly. The point of information is correct, you know,
that the resolution is to ask Corporation Counsel to initiate a declaratory
judgement action to determine the applicability of this ordinance.
MS. WILLE: I appreciate that, but what I want to say is that anyone, where
you're dealing with a problem, and that's why we would be talking to Corp.
Counsel, the best way is to try to avoid it. So I just want to through that in here.
We're all trying to bring—we have a community, everyone here on both sides,
and just put that other option in the mind, that you want how to settle it.
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So, at first glance, I agree with how you're looking at it, but I really think we're
trying to solve a problem here, and that's all I'm asking. If you said to me, no,
there's no way that we can do it other than constant, then we're up against a black
and white issue. So I'm trying to get this from being black and white. So if you
have any comments you'd like to make, I'd like to.
MR. YEH: Before we respond to that, I was going to ask if you have any other
questions you have, because this is something that implicates some policy
questions for the company, as well as operational. I don't think we've been asked
that question before so maybe something we need to kind of meet and confer
about before we actually respond to that. I think you can understand that, too.
MS. WILLE: Yeah, but you understand what I'm getting at.
MR. YEH: I do. I do, certainly.
MS. WILLE: I have one other question. You have your permit, a DLNR (State
Department of Land and Natural Resources) permit in December 14, in order to
drill this well. That would be a new permit that does talk about compliance with
all existing State, County laws. I think that does raise the issue for me. Okay,
this is now a County law ordinance and whether that applies. And I will tell you
sort of my last point which is related, before you respond.
It's really just in terms of where you discuss vested rights, and vested rights are
correct, and retroactive laws are generally prohibited under the Constitution, etc.,
statutes. But at the same time there can be retroactive laws where it impacts
significantly the health and safety issues, where there's been a chance in
circumstances. I see a change in circumstances from 2014. So I'm just trying to
brainstorm here. I'm not, you know, going at the legal issues. But I just think
there are things that are there are a number of both factual and legal issues. And
I just thought maybe if we could take the constant out and people knew there was
point they would have some relief through this.
MR. MAEDA: You have 30 seconds.
MS. WILLE: Well, since I have 30 seconds, I just have my last point, is just with
all the lava, and actually for you all, the fear what is the lava going to do and what
it is cutting off in power, and whether you might, you know, where you're going,
you know, perhaps you can defer this and wait and really see what, over the next
so many months, the implications of that cutoff, or maybe having a part of your
power cut off, and whether you really need that additional well or not.
Anyway, so I just wanted to throw those thoughts out. I yield.
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CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Wille, for throwing those out. Did you want
to respond to any of
MR. YEH: Question number on is something that I think we need to confer about
before we respond. Question number two, which is the issue of DLNR. So if you
take a look at the DLNR permit for KS -16, it references back to the mining leases
as well as Chapter 113-183, which provides DLNR with the authority to issue
drilling permits, establish safety conditions, all those things that come within the
umbrella of what DLNR is authorized to do. So I think even though you have this
catch-all language about, as with many permits, comply with ordinances, you still
have to go back to the root authority as to who's got authority to issue permits to
do drilling. So when you have a DLNR permit that says you're entitled to drill,
these are the things we place you with, these are the things we place you with, the
real question is where does the Council's authority to regulate drilling stem from
in any part of the statute? It's not the zoning authority, because in the zoning
authority, Chapter 205 vested the Planning Commission, the County's own
agency, to issue the GRP (Gas Removal Permit), which would in and of itself
contain conditions with respect to drilling both at nighttime and in daytime.
So when we talk about home rule, that jurisdiction to regulate nighttime or
daytime came from both DLNR as well as the County Planning Commission. So
by then divesting the permits that have been issued already and the authorizations
that exist already within the GRP as well as the DLNR permits, what we're saying
is that there is no authority that's been preempted by State law, despite this
catch-all provision.
So that's how we think you need to analyze, because otherwise, now you're
messing with the terms of the GRP that they made investments on, that's where
the vested rights issue comes in. Vested rights is an issue where you may have
2012, you may have 2006, but the fact remains it started from 2006 after the
issuance of the amended terms of the GRP. As we know, substantial investments
were made both with respect to the drilling of injection and production wells,
increasing production capacity of the plant to satisfy or work within the 60
megawatts of power that the permit allowed PGV to do. That's the reliance. In
addition to that, after this ordinance was passed, we checked in writing with the
Planning Department as to whether or not this ordinance covered PGV's current
operations. The answer coming back from the Planning Department back then,
and I think it's still the position now, is that the ordinance does not cover PGV's
operations. So when you talk about vested rights and making investment back to
reliance on these expectations that are carved out not only by the discussion of the
Council in 2012, but the written confirmations from the Planning Department,
that's where these vested rights continued. They haven't changed. Those
circumstances have not changed. So those doctrines still apply.
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With respect to the issue of, I think what was your fourth issue now? Oh, and
then one more thing. When we talked about this reliance, the reliance also stems
from the fact that when the council voted it seemed pretty clear to us, as
confirmed by the Planning Department, that when we talk about what the
intention of the ordinance was, you can't really tell by looking at the four corners,
but there are ambiguities as to who it applies to. So when you're dealing with the
issue of retrospect of application, there was no intention to have retrospect of the
application because neither the ordinance itself stated that it would do so, and then
we had the discussion of the Council saying this does not apply.
MS. WILLE: Yeah, let me just, on the point of retroactive—your reliance and
that there was an intent. Whether a law can be applied retroactively isn't
dependent upon whether it was intended to be at the time, okay. That's a separate
issue based on the current circumstances. You know, I would concede that the
Council Members at that time just, you know, I watched the tape, and they did say
it didn't apply, and then Chairman Yagong said other than if there are new
permits would it then apply, would the new rules apply.
But I think in terms of the Planning Department and reliance on what the Planning
Department said, there have been many, there have been several times in my legal
career where the Planning Department stated things that I thought were wrong.
So you have to rely on is that authority versus say our authority to make that
decision. Those are just legal points. Where I'm really going is trying to get it
that can we come together somewhere to take out the constant level. So I just
want to leave that thought. I'm trying to, let's get out of this. If they keep being
under this stress, things are going to get hotter and hotter and more terrible there.
We need to come to some kind of understanding here.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Wille.
MR. YEH: And I think on that other question, Mr. Kaleikini was able to respond.
CHR KANUHA: Oh, you had—he can answer the question.
MR. KALEIKINL So Council Woman Wille, in reference to the lava
approaching, and I believe you said consider waiting to see what happens. We
have been watching the lava very closely because it could definitely affect our
operations. Fortunately for today the lava is not headed physically to the plant,
but the risk that we face today is that the lava could take out the transmission
lines, and if that happens in effect we would shut down. There is no way to
transmit our power.
So we have looked at those risks very closely. Living in Puna has its inherent
risks with the lava for everyone, not just PGV. I like Council Member Ilagan's
mention of moving forward. So if we were to wait for this particular aspect then
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we would perhaps be here discussing this again couple months later after we
watch the lava. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. I want to remind Council Members that we need
to stick to this resolution. So, Ms. Poindexter.
MS. POINDEXTER: On this resolution, we talk about Ordinance 12-151. I just
want to clarify a statement, or you to clarify a statement that you made earlier,
about this ordinance kind of holding you to either totally not drilling and shutting
all operations down. There's no flex in that because of the safety considerations
to the public you had said. So my question to you if you stop just the drilling
portion, if the ordinance was amended at that point and you stopped the drilling
portion, but yet maintained some of the operations to keep it safe but taking out
some of the noise, because I hear about drilling, can you clarify? Maybe I heard
that wrong or?
MR. YEH; Well, what—and maybe Mr. Kaleikini can explain at least the
operational components, but before he does, the ordinance says, "geothermal
resources, exploration, drilling and geothermal production drilling operations."
So there are, in fact, two components to this ordinance which make it very
impractical. Part of these submittals that we provided the Council a couple of
days ago basically says you are trying to accomplish this purpose of reducing
nose at nighttime. Well, you can't really do that because you have these other
operations going on from a safety perspective. Maybe it's not the actual drilling,
but the other safety components that are part and parcel of drilling operations.
What that does for the public is because you're having to kind of take that drill
out of the ground and do these other things that Mike's going to explain, you're
actually doubling and tripling the period of time that you're doing these drilling
operation activities. So from the standpoint of the purps that you're trying to
accomplish, it's kind of self-defeating because you're not only doing that, but
you're not probably doubling the cost of the operations themselves.
MS. POINDEXTER: So just to piggy -back on what you just said. So basically it
is possible to stop the drilling, because of the cost of the operations to keep things
running, to keep it safe, that is what is the problem, because the drilling itself
would reduce some level of noise, is that correct?
MR. KALEIKINL I think the cost is a side, is a result—is an effect of stopping.
Definitely cost is associated with whatever is done. But to stop midway when
you're actually drilling in the shallow parts would be a compromise of the well
itself. With regard to the fluids that we use to keep the integrity of the well buoy
itself intact, and prevent it from collapsing, which means then it would definitely
extend the project duration.
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If one needed to stop every night, it actually would three or four -fold extend the
project. And with regards to noise, I think Mr. Yeh alluded to the equipment. So
the actual drill bit itself can be taken out, which is what would be required in the
event you had to stop nighttime drilling, or even in the daytime, but when you do
that, you still have auxiliary equipment, you have pumps and motors that are
required to circulate fluids, and so the decrease in the noise is a little bit negligible
with the exception of the motors that I used lift and raise the drilling assembly.
So, part of it is that to continue is to get this project completed, number one,
safely for the folks on location which translates to safety for the community;
prevent mechanical integrity loss; and especially prevent an uncontrolled release
that by going in and out when you're close to a geothermal resource, where you
have temperature and pressure. So that is the primary the primary concern for
continuing.
CHR. POINDEXTER: So I guess now, my other questions areI want to wait
until we get into executive session because I want to talk about what was said
before. So thank you. Thank you so much.
MR. YEH: Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Paleka.
MR. PALEKA: Yeah, I just want to—so this, it's true, when we did meet, we had
an outcry from our constituents. So Mr. Greggor did introduce this resolution,
and this was regarding a law that seems to be very clear. It's not ambiguous, it's
very clear. Now we have learned through our diligence that prior actions by the
Council had occurred, understandings, positions from PGV, and the position
because we weren't privy to the conversations of Corporation Counsel in the past,
so it was our understanding to represent our constituents that Mr. Eagan introduce
this measure.
Now, the next step would be to have a finding by the judicial branch to see who is
right or wrong, because we can all have opinions here. But whose opinion
counts? We don't regulate, we legislate. Who determines and interprets the law?
The judicial branch. So I think this measure was meant to do that. That's all I
have to say. Mahalo.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Paleka. Council Members? Oh, Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Now before we talk to Corporation
Counsel, I just want to state is that I did not discuss this with Corporation Counsel
before I wrote it, so I think they're upset with me. And I just want to say I'm
sorry. I just feel that I had to act quickly, and this is as quickly as I could have
acted. And I felt that because the drilling was coming very soon—and right now
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February 4, 2015
it's actually extended or prolonged, not prolonged, delayed, that's the right word.
I want to use the right word nowadays. So, I just want to say, I'm looking for
clarification. That's my agenda. That's what I'm trying to do. I'm hoping the
judicial will make that clarification. But if we could have Corporation Counsel,
and if we could talk in executive session, what do we need to do before that?
CHR KANUHA: Before we do that, I want to have Ms. Eof£
MS. EOFF: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yeah, I've been listening pretty intently all
day to the testifiers and to you folks. When I saw this coming up onto the agenda,
I watched all the tapes from the previous Council. I happened to have been
working for the Council at the time, so I was involved in the meetings but I
couldn't really remember exactly how it went down. So I watched the first
committee meeting, I watched the first reading, I watched the second reading, I
watched the call for the public hearing, and I watched the final reading. During
that time, the validity of the language of this law wasn't really questioned as
much as whether it would be applied retroactively. I remember one thing that
really struck me was if it wasn't applied to Puna Geothermal Venture, but a new
company came in that wanted to do geothermal exploration, it would apply to
them, and then that would be very unfair because you folks could continue to drill
up to the 60 megawatts under the existing permit day and night, whereas anybody
new coming in would have to abide by this new law.
So that was concerning, and now we're at a point where I feel like I want to
protect the health and wellbeing of a community that's suffering from nighttime
drilling noises, and yet I realize that there are some vested rights and in some way
I understood the previous Council to say that this law couldn't, because of the
vested rights that you have under a County Planning Commission permit to drill
up to 60 megawatts, that we couldn't take that away, or they couldn't take that
away. So I'm hopefully going to get some answers before long about whether
there is some way we can solve this or answer the questions. Because I too think
that --or you know, I'm not so savvy about the law. I'm trying to understand that
the County Planning Commission is the overarching permit, and yet there is a new
permit here from DLNR, so now I'm wondering whether the new law would
apply to you.
So I'm trying to understand, but I'm not a lawyer. So I'm going to have to rely on
the attorneys, and I'm sure that there's going to be difference of opinions
depending on who you ask, forever. Because that's just how contentious issues
are.
But overall, I wish as Ms. Wille stated earlier, that there was somewhere we could
just agree to do something that would help out this community. I don't know
what it is, I don't know if it's better noise abatement. If there's some meetings
that you could have before proceeding with the current operations that could help
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Motion to Enter
into Executive
Session:
February 4, 2015
this community to feel secure that they wouldn't be disrupted for a month or two
or five. I don't know how many months this is going to take. Because I don't
think we should be doing that either.
So that's where I'm at, and I guess maybe the executive session will help clarify
some of the things that I've spoke about.
MR. YEH: Council Woman Eoff, you know, we didn't really get a chance to
explain it fully, but you know, Mr. Kaleikini had indicated of course that there
were some—they listened this last time around, in 2012. The well that was drilled
in 2012 was unfortunately at a little bit of a higher elevation, closer to a pu`u.
The location of the current new site is at a lower elevation. The additional sound
attenuation devices that they're implementing that they're implementing based on
their sound expert's advice will, in fact, help to keep mitigation of that noise at
what we believe is going to be more than an acceptable level. So, I mean from
that standpoint, abatement purposes is as best available control technology is
being implemented. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Eoff Ms. David.
MS DAVID: Yes, with all due respect to Ms. Eoff, yes, I agree. I did listen to the
tapes also. But I think right now we're treading on some really thin ice as far as
what we can discuss about the legalities of this. So I'd appreciate it if we could
come back later, and go into executive session right now. Because really, it's a
legal issue, and I don't think we're—we've got some attorneys, but our job is to
make some informed decisions, and until we do that, we need to talk to our
attorney. So I move to go into executive session.
Ms. David moved to enter into Executive Session in order
to hold attorney-client privileged discussion regarding
Res. 59-15, pursuant to Section 92-5(a)(4), of the Hawaii
Revised Statutes. Seconded by Ms. Poindexter
CHR KANUHA: On the motion to go into executive session, Mr. Chung.
MR. CHUNG: Thank you. As I normally do, I'm going to be speaking against
the motion to go into executive session. I think what's being asked for is to be
able to find out what occurred in the previous executive session. But I think, and
I could be wrong, that those issues which came up in that session were probably
related to the enactment of the legislation. Right now, all we're looking at is the
validity of the legislation as well as its applicability to PGV. I would go into
executive session for only one reason, and that's to see what affect the Planning
Director's letter to PGV has on us in terms of liability. You know, are there
some reliance issues? But other than that, I don't see any reason to go into an
executive session quite frankly.
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February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Ms. David. Yeah, and I agree, and that's one of
the—if that's the only legal point that we need to address than certainly I agree
that's why we should go into executive session.
MR. CHUNG: Yeah, and again, there may be other things that come up, but I
think we should handle them as they come up. Otherwise, let's just do it in open
meeting.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I just want to voice out that I support which manner this issue
gets resolved. If the majority wants to go to executive session, let's go into
executive session. If not, then we don't. But let's move on.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, and that's why I'm ask—you know, I'm supporting the
executive session, because each Council Member might have different concerns.
Because when we go into that, each Council Member, whatever concerns they
have, can bring them up to our legal attorneys to let them give us the answers.
Right, because I have a letter dated back in 2012 which I cannot make public,
okay. It was sent to me during that time. So, you know, I need to ask them.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, motion on the floor is to go into executive session for
the purpose of consulting with Council's attorney on questions and answers
pertaining to the Council's powers, duties, privileges, immunities and liabilities.
Mr. Clerk.
Vote on Motion
The motion to enter into Executive Session in order
to enter into
to hold attorney-client privileged discussion regarding
Executive Session:
Res. 59-15, pursuant to Section 92-5(a)(4), of the Hawaii
(Approved)
Revised Statutes was carried by the following roll call vote:
Ayes: Council Members David, Eoff, Ilagan, Onishi,
Paleka, Poindexter, and Chair Kanuha – 7.
Noes: Council Members Chung and Wille – 2.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
Recess: At 4:40 p.m., the Chair called for a recess.
Reconvene: The meeting was reconvened at 5:49 p.m.
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February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Aloha everybody. We're out of executive session, and I'd like
to give the floor to Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair; and thank you everybody, for being
patient. I just wanted to say that I am glad that we did go to executive session,
because Council Members got a chance to talk, and without any hesitation and an
honest conversation. I want to voice out why I even did this. And before I
drafted Resolution 59actually, yeah, 59-15, it brought me back to the first time
I was running. I was going through public funding so I had to walk around the
district, and one area I walked was a mile within the PGV site. And I saw a
family going out, they just finished grocery shopping and they were unloading
their groceries. And I was talking to the husband, and when we talked, he was
sharing a story with me that because of the noise with PGV, they had to think
about potentially moving out of their home. They weren't trying to use the
relocation, they just needed some way to settle their family. I visited Aurora's
house. I visited another person's house that night. Roughly around 8:00 o'clock,
he showed me his home, and I got to hear what he heard.
I like to understand from people and really see what they have to go through.
Because being up here and representing 20,000 people, I've got to make sure that
I am making the best decision. What made me do this was because I felt there is
this law in our books, and what authority—what can I do, to help the people that I
represent? And this is what I am doing. Now if the Council Members and
Corporation Counsel have other suggestions, I am open to that. I am looking for
solutions. And I am looking to move forward. So I want to share with everyone
why and how this all started. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. Ms. Wille.
MS. WILLE: Okay, I am going to be asking Council Member Ilagan to withdraw
his resolution. We want to move forward, we don't want to spend a lot of time
going to court and waiting for long answers and continuing this being in an
adversarial situation or having the well going on, and people getting more upset
and more physically and emotionally and spiritually upset. What I would like to
see, and I think it's by another resolution, would really be trying to ask for more
of a mediated solution. Now I think I sort of would like to see the Planning
Director, who is the person in charge maybe take the lead with the Corporation
Counsel and try to work as neighbors. You know, PGV is here for the long-term.
This is your community, and what can we do.
My aim would be to pursue the mitigation measures that the Planning Director
has already requested of PGV, and if someone would like to discuss some of
those, they can. But just so you know, they are putting on additional requirements
of PGV as well as pursue at least on weekends to not have this going on. To take
and make it so it's not constant and go from there. But I don't think our
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requesting the Corporation Counsel to consider going to court on this is really a
solution. We have a big problem. It's a problem for all of us. We all have
different, all nine of us have a different opinion on what is valid and what is not
valid, you know, and what way and where to go. But I think sometimes just, you
know how lawyers are, set them aside, and try to work it. This is how to figure
out how to live together.
This is Well 16, out of a potential 60. We've got to come together on this. Out of
a potential 30, whatever. But you know, I want to say to PGV, we've got to work
with them. In my mind we have to take word "constant" out, at least some way
and to some extent, and you said you hadn't had time to talk about it. Maybe not
every day, but people have to know. Even if there is a Weedeater next door to
me, I am waiting for when is that sound or chain saw going to end, or that, even
mower or something. And you just have to come to grips with that, or else there's
continue to be war, and this situation and anger is just going to escalate. So, I'm
just asking, we need a little calm here. None of us are saying let's pull back and
not do anything. Every one of us are, something has to be done. And there is no
one here saying nothing needs to be done.
So I would now like to ask if someone would like to make a comment. But I want
everyone to be aware, whether I make the motion or not. I don't want to
undermine anyone else's opportunity to speak. Should I go ahead and make the
motion?
CHR KANUHA: There is a motion on the floor already.
MS. WILLE: Okay.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Poindexter.
MS. POINDEXTER: I would like to support Council Member Wille's
suggestion. And saw a glimmer of hope, when the attorney leaned over and said
it's something that we need to go back and talk about. I like the idea of working
together, because that's a healthy solution. I think there may be good things that
can come out of this. You know, and I am hoping that through time and talking
that there will be some perks for our community. I am hoping that happens. I can
see that may happen. I see your heads nodding, so that's a good thing.
So really dig down deep and look at how we can be a partner with our community
and be good neighbors. I encourage that because we have many communities
along the coastline that are going to be affected by this, too. Because we have
Industrial zoned areas. I have about maybe one, two, maybe three or four in my
district. So I want to make sure that we all work together. So that we come up
with solutions that can build safe and healthy communities. Thank you for the
willingness to partner with the community and work on a solution. So I'm
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February 4, 2015
supporting the idea and I am encouraging Council Member Eagan to withdraw
this, and be one of the leaders that works with the community. And with the
geothermal company to pull this altogether. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Poindexter. Ms. David.
MS. DAVID: Yes, hi. I'd also like to mirror my support for Margaret's
suggestion. And I was very glad that we went into executive session, not only
because of the legal issues, which I'm glad it was clarified for us. But I think I
came out of the executive session, exactly what Ms. Poindexter is alluding to, I
think we all hear you. We all want to do something for the community because
we really feel for what you are going through. And having litigated the County
myself as a community member; that is a long drawn-out process. And in the
meantime you still will have these issues. And I think that the solution that
Margaret is suggesting, that we work together, is a better way to face this. And
help each other. So I would love to request that Council Member Ilagan consider
withdrawing this and then we come up with a solution and an assurance from
PGV that they will. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. David. Any other? Okay. Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Since there is only three who are requesting me to withdraw, I
am not going to accept the withdrawal. At this time I am still open to discussion
with the Council Members.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Eoff
MS. EOFF: Thank you. Well, after listening to Corporation Counsel, I realize
this particular resolution may not be able to accomplish what the community
needs anyways. And the manner in which it's asked of Corporation Counsel may
not be exactly the correct process. So as Ms. David said, I was also involved in
litigation against the County as a community citizen and that is a long drawn-out
process, but sometimes it's warranted. I don't know if—you know, as people
have stated the law is the law. But there is also sometimes some gray areas, and
as in the past Pilago case or the Kohanaiki case, there is instances of vested rights
and property rights and all of that. And we went through all of that. And in the
end, you know, even Mayor Kim was helpful, at the very end getting a settlement
between the community and the people with vested rights.
So sometimes it takes that, and it's a lot of work. It's harder than asking for a
lawsuit. And then you wait and the court takes forever. And you wait, I don't
know whether while you are waiting, Puna Geothermal Venture can just go
forward anyway, I don't know. But I learned a lot through experiencing that
process. And I would say if we have a chance to mediate something or hear from
our Planning Director what kinds of sound abatement requirements will be in
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February 4, 2015
enforced this time around with the new drilling that will occur, the community
may be in a lot better shape for handling the drilling, which I know they have
vested rights to go forward with.
So, I'm not sure if I can explain that better, but I still hope that we can bring
something else forward as we kind of discussed a little bit that would ensure that
as drilling goes forward, the community does not endure the kinds of issues that it
has in the past. That there will be some measures taken that will assure that. And
that's what we have to do here now. And I think we are all willing to. So I hope
the community is and Puna Geothermal Venture is also, thank you.
And Mr. Eagan, I think there may be a better chance in us finding a good, solid
resolution that we can all work with and that can accomplish what you want to do
to protect the community. Because we all want to protect the community as well.
So thank you for considering Ms. Wille's request.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Poindexter.
MS. POINDEXTER: I want to say my opinion and the reason why I am not
going to support this resolution. The resolution, real clearly so you know that,
and most of you know, the resolution is just a recommendation for someone to do
something. It's not the ordinance or law that says they've got to. So for me, I
cannot in myI can compromise on the issues, I will not compromise on my
values. I'm not going to vote on this just because I want to make somebody feel
good, and then throw it over to Corporation Counsel and say, "Hey, now you guys
have to deal with the public. Note me, because I voted for it." When I know
what the legal implications and what we discussed in executive session is, and I
see a win-win situation if this is withdrawn and we work together on this on a
better resolution, and work with the company as well, and of course definitely the
community. But for my values I will not vote on this just because, that I am
going to punt this to someone else to make a decision because I wasn't brave
enough to make it on my own for the betterment of, I think, our people and the
County of Hawaii. So, I represent the County of Hawaii also, so I am thinking,
you know, I represent all of you as well.
So I'm not going to compromise on my values. I going to be honest with you, I
don't support this the way it is, because of the implications. But I will work with
you, and hopefully something can be brought up. And I take us to think back on
back on the GMO (Genetically Modified Organisms) stuff when Margaret
withdrew her GMO, her initial. Everybody was going, "Whoa, why, what
happened." You know, and something came better out of it, where there were
compromises and people to work better together. We are still dealing with those
issues, but I want to make you remember that withdrawing it is not the end, okay,
it's just the beginning. So thank you very much.
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February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Poindexter. Council Members, any other
discussion? Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Since that's only four people, I have a recommendation. The
option to withdraw, I am still not convinced, and I need reassurance. Maybe
postponing this to the next Council and then that resolution comes up, then I
would feel secure. But at this point, just because you're relating this issue to
another issue, and just because you're fancy with your words saying that this is a
feel -good thing, this is not a feel -good thing. I took action, I showed direction.
And I am requesting, I'm not forcing. It's up to Corporation Counsel, it's up to
the courts. That's my decision. And unlessI can't think of any other solution.
MS. WILLE: Move to postpone?
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. I wanted to say something, you know,
I personally wasn't going to support this resolution based off of what we talked
about during executive session and liabilities that we could face. I don't think
that this resolution is the right way of doing it as was stated earlier. I know that,
you know, I think the best way is to find a really good resolution that we all can
agree upon and the community can agree upon. It would be like, "Yeah, that's an
awesome way to do it," and everyone can be happy about it. But with this one, I
don't feel it's the right way. That's why I wouldn't be able to support it as it is.
And you know, I don't think postponing it would do the public any good, would
do us good. I think we need to do something right now on it. So, you know,
seeing that there iswe will just, I will let other Council Members talk on that.
Mr. Chung.
MR. CHUNG: I certainly respect Ms. Wille for her intention to try to
compromise. I mean, I think that's always good, and I'm always for compromise.
But I take exception to the suggestion, particularly by Ms. Poindexter, that anyone
who votes or supports this resolution is not brave. On the contrary, maybe
practically it might not work, because Corp. Counsel has taken a contrary opinion
already. But there is no other vehicle for the people on this body to voice their
opinion that the ordinance is very clear. It can't be any more clear than that. Of
course we are talking about vested rights. I disagree with both Mr. YehI mean,
no offense to Mr. Yeh—with our Corp. Counsel. I believe that the vested rights
don't apply here. And the reason for that is there is nothing in either the
geothermal resource permit, the drilling permit, the noise permit, that talks about
24-hour drilling.
Now I'll give an example, and I mentioned it to Ms. Eoff earlier. If I have a
driver's license, and they change the law regarding speeds, traffic regulations or
whatever, I've got to abide by that, sure I've got a license, but can I say that
because I got the license at a certain time before these laws were enacted I have a
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February 4, 2015
vested right to disobey the law, uh-uh. So I believe that what occurred before
when Mr. Ikeda, Council Member Ikeda and I think Mr. Onishi tried to at least
clarify the application of this ordinance, I think that was the right thing to do. I
look at this, it's poorly drafted. I mean it's just—that's why we're here. And I
really apologize to the people, you know, who had to sit here. But I will back up
my colleagues from Puna, I don't know about Mr. Paleka because he didn't say
anything yet, but I will back up Mr. Eagan on this, all the way, 100 percent. And
maybe, it might have no practical application whatsoever, but at least it allows
me, this is the only way I can give me position to the public that this law applies.
We have to at least hold up the validity of our laws.
And I want to explain one thing, there is a difference between this one and the
GMO law, which I voted against the appeal. I felt that the GMO law was
preempted by either state or federal law. This one, the county is specifically, by
state law, allowed to enact noise control ordinances, so it's not preempted. And
that's why I feel that we should fight for the validity of the laws. Even if II
may or may not agree with it. I've got to give deference to the people who at
least passed it. You know, they digested all of the information. We don't want to
go through all of that. But, you know, I've got to at least defer to them. So, I'm
with Mr. Ilagan on this.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL Okay, I need to put this other scenario to Council Members. You
know, like say you got your building permit last year, okay, and you started
your—or you didn't even start the building of your home or whatever you wanted
to build, your structure. And come this year Council passes a more stricter
Building Code. You don't revert back and go back and tell, "Okay, since you had
your permit and didn't do it, then you've got to come back and you've got to be
more restrictive." You vested already. I looked at this, and like I told members
before, I was there, and like—through executive session, I told them if two
Council Members had listened to Mr. Ikeda about having the amendment in, it
would have been totally clear. But if you look at the minutes, the transcript of the
meeting, two Council Members, says that PGV is vested. They don't have to
follow. It's anything new. So that's why the rest the Council Members agreed,
and that's why we passed it. Because they had agreed upon that.
But I agree with the Council Members. We should have, at that time, had the
amendment. To see it in black and white that they're exempt. But they didn't
want it, because they said, it's anything new. Anybody else who comes in
because I think at that time, HELCO (Hawaiian Electric Light Company) was
coming up with one RFP (Request for Proposals) for 50 more megawatts. So
what they wanted to make sure is to protect the communities about that next one.
And so that's where the confusion is, and I'll bet you now they must be thinking,
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February 4, 2015
"Let this new Council deal with it." Right? "Let them go through what would
happen."
But we went through it. I see the same faces that were there in 2012 is here today.
And I heard you guy's testimony from before, right. And that's what we did, we
had the understanding. And you can look at the transcripts of what happened.
And so, that's why I can't understand. It was clearly stated, and all Council
members agreed. So I don't know why we are here today. If anything we should
move forward, like Ms. Wille said, maybe there is a possibility that there can be
maybe some partnerships or some—you know, you guys can work together as a
community to kind of help out. And I think PGV is willing to kind of help. They
are not going to be like just, "Hi, no," they're going to go like, "No, we don't care
about you guys." Because they're part of the community. Their workers are part
of the community. So they're going to see people out there. I don't know what's
the problem. Right. And Bill, like, would you want to comment on anything? I
mean, correct me if I am wrong, back in 2012, right—
MS. WILLE: What does it matter what was?
(Note: At this time, Assistant Corporation Counsel William Brilhante
came forward to address the members of the Council.)
MR. BRILHANTE: You know, what happened in 2012, I mean it's clear that
there was discussion regarding whether or not passage of this bill, or the
ordinance at that time, the bill at the time would have a retroactive effect on the
current permits that PGV held. And you know, I think it's clear, we stated that
there is this evidence on the videotape of the proceedings, as well as evidence
within the documented transcripts of the proceedings. There was some discussion
and elusion to the fact that, that specific item was considered, and your majority
determined that's how they were proceeding as that matter moved forward.
That's not the reason why I stepped up here. The primary reason is to be clear on
the record. You know, a comment was made that neither the permit nor theI'm
not sure, the permit and something else, didn't afford PGV the option for
nighttime drilling. But Condition 22 of the permit did specifically reference the
nighttime drilling as it related to geothermal operations. It set specific decibel
noise levels, among their Section A, it said, "the average hourly noise levels shall
not exceed 55 dba during the day (7:00 a.m. to 10:00 p.m.), and 45 dba at night,
(10:00 p.m. to 7:00 a.m.) more than 10 percent of the time, with the day and night
hours separately considered. You know, and in respect to that, what the permit
called for was the imposition and the effectuation of what was commonly called
in the industry as "best available control technology," as it related to noise
abatement and light abatement, and that's the requirement.
As this reso was brought to my attention and our attention, it seemed—to me it
seemed almost ironic, because just two weeks before, you know, the introduction
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of this resolution I was called to a meeting with the Planning Director, because
I'm the attorney who represents the Planning Department on behalf of the County;
and the Planning Director was having a meeting with directors of PGV. It was the
plant manager, it was Mike Keleikini, and there were two other individuals from
the plant as well; and on the County side it was myself and Daryn Arai, who's the
supervisor in charge of the Planning Commission; and the Planning Director.
And the discussion and the dialogue we had at the time was the imposition and
the understanding that the best-known control technology was going to be in
place, pursuant to the recommendations of the sound and noise consultant as well
as, as it related to ambient light. And I think we had that discussion, and there
was dialogue back and forth, and it was the determination of the Planning
Director during that meeting, at the end of the meeting, that there was some
again, I hate to use this word, but ambiguity as to whether or not that indeed that
was—you know, that the best-known technologies were applied.
So, we requested that PGV provide us, the department and county, additional
information as it related our concerns. And there was a plan for PGV to initiate
drilling on January 29. But because our concerns weren't addressed properly or
satisfactorily at that time, there was some discussion and then there was a
voluntary agreement by PGV to move the onset of the drilling back to February 5.
This all stems from and it harkens all the way back to 2012. You know, at the
time that the bill was passed and the ordinance was signed by the Mayor, I wasn't
confident that the Mayor was going to sign the bill. I request that everybody take
a look back and read what the press release was, that the Mayor attach to his
execution, you know, memo. In that he said the reason he is signing the bill is
that he is tired of the communities fighting. He is tired of the division and the
negative animosity, neighbors are having with each other. And he said, his hope
was that by signing this bill, we would be able to come together as a community
and we would be able to move forward and address these types of issues, the
concerns related to the drilling, in a civil manner. In a manner in which neighbors
are respective of each other.
And today what really hurt me is when I was sitting in the back of the room and
there was that argument, that disagreement that broke out between three of the
people here in the audience. That is exactly what we're going back to, that's
exactly what filing a lawsuit will take us back to. And I think if we go back and
read that message, and as Ms. Wille said and as Valerie stated and as Ms. Eoff has
said, and as Ms. David stated, we need to come together as a community and we
need to solve this. We need to find the middle ground. And when mediate and
it's my experience, when you find the middle ground. And when you mediate
or, it's been my experience when you do find the middle ground, not everybody is
100 percent happy. Everybody will still have some level of dissatisfaction, or
disagreement. But it's insignificant and it's enough that you can live with and we
can go forward.
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And since the Mayor signed this ordinance there has been significant steps. And
there's even members of this audience who have engaged and who have
participated in the community group that got together, and recommended that a
health and wellness study be commissioned by the County. That request went
through the Planning Commission, and the Planning Commission authorized
nearly half a million dollars to move forward with that health study to determine
the effects, potential effects, of the sulfur emissions from PGV's operations. And
you know, the Planning Director has taken it upon himself to take a more active
role in ensuring that the terms and conditions of PGV Permit 2 is satisfactorily
complied with to his satisfaction, which is a heightened based on the position of
the administration. And I think if we can continue to move down that path and
continue to look for solutions along those lines. I think as a community, we'll be
much better off We'll be much happier, and that's whatI just wanted to make
that statement.
MR. ONISHL So if Mr. Eagan does withdraw this, would it be possible for him
to work with you and the Director of Planning in, I guess, coming up with
something where you guys can maybe propose it to PGV?
MR. BRILHANTE: No, I think that would be a wonderful solution, and I would
offer my assistance, and I have no doubt in my mind that the Planning Director
would be able to offer his assistance as well.
MR. ONISHL Okay, thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Onishi. Ms. Wille.
MS. WILLE: Yeah. You know, I don't have a problem with Mr. Eagan
postponing this. I can totally understand why he is saying that. He wants it to be
very clear that he wants to—that he is going to take action in one form or another,
and then we put together something alternative instead of there be nothing there.
I also, in fact, don't mind if we support this, even though I know that it won't
you know, Corporation Counsel's not going to do anything. But it's going to give
some false hopes and put everyone in an adversarial position.
Okay, so I really agree with everyone. And I want to say that I agree with
Council Member Chung that I don't completely agree that these vested rights are
solid regardless of what the intent was in 2012. You decide whether something
can be applied retroactively at the time that decision is made under current facts
and current law. But I don't want the public to think we vote on this and
Oh, here the great Council supports the people," and nothing happens or they
even do file something, and it's three years from now, and you all are suffering in
the meantime.
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February 4, 2015
I just want to say, if Council Member Ragan wants to postpone this, I would
support that. Just because it's so easy for people to hear, oh, it's withdrawn, and
it's dead, and get the wrong sense. But I don't want—if we go ahead and vote on
this and go to court and stand up for the people. I am just telling you, it's a long,
long way, and it's a lot better. Once you get in that position, you are no longer,
you are losing some of that goodwill. And I think that we're asking publicly PGV
to be a part of this, and I would really like to see at least the weekends. There has
to be some point in time this isn't going on. And there has to be, because
otherwise it will be all the time. And we'll be in court. And so what? You know,
that's the reality.
So I am just saying regardless of whether we vote for or against this, or postpone
it, I am going to work on something alternative. Okay. So that's sort of where I
am. I would rather do that, we got to put together the pieces of the puzzle.
Everybody, we are here for the long-term, and that's my commitment. I am open,
frankly, whatever way. But don't, if this goes forward and voted that you all get a
false sense of hope. That's what I don't want. And I also don't want PGV to
think that we're backing down and, "We're free to do whatever we want,"
because that's not the case either. So anyway, that's where I stand. I'm really
open. I think—I appreciate that Council Member Eagan took the lead on it, and I
am supportive of how he wants to proceed. But making it clear to the public that I
don't want there to be false hopes. And that's why I think that doing maybe a
postponement or the withdrawal is preferable. So I yield and ready to vote any
time.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. I think Ms. Eoff You had your light on, or no?
No? Oh.
MS. EOFF: I was going to just ask Ms. Wille to make that motion.
MS. WILLE: A motion to postpone? Sure. Motion to postpone.
MS. EOFF: And I'll second it.
MS. WILLE: To the call of the Chair, not to a certain date.
Motion to Postpone: Ms. Wille moved to postpone Res. 59-15 to the call of the
Chair. Seconded by Ms. Eoff
MR. ILAGAN: Could you clarify the postponement? To the next Council?
CHR KANUHA: It's been moved to postpone to the call of the Chair.
MS. WILLE: To the call of the Chair.
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CHR KANUHA: So on the postponement, Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Could you consider it being postponed to the next Council
meeting?
MS. WILLE: I'd consider it being the second, not the next one that we already
have things scheduled. But to—it would be 3/3, 3/4. I think we need to do this
correctly and not rushed. And we're already past these deadlines. So that's what
my motionI mean, that's what I think is real.
CHR KANUHA: The motion on the floor is postpone to the call of the Chair.
That's the motion on the floor.
MR. ILAGAN: Is it okay if I speak?
CHR KANUHA: Yes.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Since you are postponing, I would like to
do a request. And that's to the next Council meeting, I want to work on this as
soon as possible.
MS. WILLE: I don't know when—we're already
MS. EOFF: Well Mr. Ilagan, it would have to be the next possible Council
meeting. I mean, like she said, agenda deadlines have passed for the very next
Council meeting.
MR. ILAGAN: And we can't breach that deadline at all?
CHR KANUHA: No, we could postpone to the next Council meeting, but I don't
think the next Council meeting would be the best choice.
MS. EOFF: Can she amend her motion to what she said? To March 3ra�
CHR KANUHA: Let's speak to the motion on the floor, postpone to the call of
the Chair, any discussion on the motion that we currently have? Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I will support a postponement to the next Council meeting.
Other than that I won't support a postponement. I want to work on this as soon as
possible.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. Ms. Poindexter.
MS. POINDEXTER: The call of the Chair is Dru, so you guys work with them
on which Council meeting it can get on. If there is time to work with Corp.
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February 4, 2015
Counsel, and I know Margaret wanted to work with this and PGV, then you can
meet with Dru to see if you have all of your ducks in line to be able to have it and
breach. So, it's working with the Council Chair. So, I agree with the call of the
Chair, because I don't think—you may or may not have things ready for it. I am
not saying you will not. I am sure you will move real quick on this. And if you
do, I'm sure that the Chair will be open to that.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. PoindexterSorry, Mr. Chung, you had your light on.
MR. CHUNG: Yeah, I'm just going to state to Mr. Eagan that if it's at the next
meeting, I'm not going to be around because I have to catch a 7 o'clock flight and
we're in Kona. I'm intending to finish up in Kona, drive back to Hilo, and catch a
7 o'clock flight out. And it's already 7 o'clock, and I'm not going to be around
and you'd be losing an ally over there. I just wanted to let you know.
Second, I just wanted to know what the purpose of the postponement would be
for. I don't know who I should ask, Ms. Wille orI mean, is it going to
piggy -back with some kind of compromise, or? Okay.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, any other on the postponement. Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I would like to have as many allies as I possibly can, but I feel
like I can work something as soon as possible. And has the agenda been out for
the next Council meeting? We can still put in the agenda. I'm just saying, I want
to work on this as soon as possible. I mean you're already dictating how this is
going to be running. At least allow me the flexibility to work on it.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. Okay, seeing no other discussion,
Mr. Clerk, on the postponement to the call of the Chair.
Vote on Motion The motion to postpone Res. 59-15 to the call of the Chair
to Postpone: failed by the following voice vote:
Failed
Ayes: Council Members Eoff, Poindexter,
and Wille – 3.
Noes: Council Members Chung, David, Eagan, Onishi,
Paleka, and Chair Kanuha – 6.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, moving on, I think we've had enough discussion on this
agenda item. And we're going to go to the vote. Oh, Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I adopted a new core value, and that's finding a common ground.
I want to know, Council Member Wille, what is this resolution that you see?
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February 4, 2015
What is this answer that's is in your mind? What is this vision that you hold?
Please explain what reso am I drafting. What am I going to be writing? What
may I ask? I am just asking your insight. Seems like you are directing me to
foreign territory. You seem like a real pioneer on this, could you please explain
to me?
MS. WILLE: Okay. I mean I'd be willing to do it myself, if you want. And
basically I see getting the parties together under the direction of the Planning
Director with the help of Corporation Counsel, and my vision would be to come
out with solidifying and supporting and reinforcing the Planning Director's
mitigation items. But not just that. I'm not okay with just that. I would like to
see some breaks, and I would prefer it to be such as weekends, so there is not the
constant noise. And that it's removing that word "constant" that's critical to me.
And I think it needs to be through mediation, it might bePGV said, had some
idea how to form it so it's least detrimental to them, but that it would be my key, I
want to get rid of that word "constant" and work together and mediate on those
grounds.
So that's where I am trying to come from, and you know, I support all of what
you are doing. I support the community. And I just want something that's real. I
don't want something that looks good. Okay. I want to something that is real.
And that you have, and that also helps to work on getting this settled sooner than
later. And once you go to court and do all of that, you are saying I am putting this
dispute in a third party's hand, and it's going to be like 100 percent for this one or
100 percent for that one; and the whole time it's fighting. So anyway, those are
where I am at, and it's not the greatest solution, but I really feel that it's the best
direction to go.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Mr. Eagan? Mr. Paleka, you had your light on.
MR. PALEKA: This issue, I find it when we argue the vested rights. And I can
only think of one analogy, and there was a good one about driving, and also one
about construction, building a home. There is a fire code that comes up. You are
damn sure you will stay with that fire code no matter when instituted. Now the
same, I believe holds true, and we're going to disagree on opinion, and I have
disagreed with my attorneys before. And work with the union, they have had
their opinions and I've disagreed with them too, okay. The hard part I have here
is I support geothermal, but the law is the law. It's clear. So for Mr. Eagan to
hold true to his integrity, I think it takes a lot of courage. I really do. You know.
To hold true to your principles is something that few men or women can hold to.
That's all I got to say.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you very much. Mr. Chung.
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February 4, 2015
MR. CHUNG: I can see the writing on the wall, and I certainly respect the
positions of each of the Council people. As far as I can tell, it looks like three
people are going to be voting for this resolution, but no matter how it comes out.
If a compromise is struck by Ms. Wille or others, this never would have emerged
had Mr. Eagan not brought this resolution up. So I think something at least
constructive hopefully will come out from all of this. It's not just a feel -good
measure, it's really quite constructive in my opinion, regardless of how this turns
out.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Chung. Okay, seeing no other discussion.
Mr. Clerk, on Resolution 59-15.
Vote on Res. 59-15: The motion to adopt Res. 59-15 failed by the following
Failed voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, Ilagan, Paleka, and
Wille — 4.
Noes: Council Members David, Eoff, Onishi,
Poindexter, Eagan, and Chair Kanuha — 5.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
(For informational purposes, Ms. Eoff voted "kanalua,"
then "no.")
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, motion fails. Okay, members, we are going to
take a brief recess. Recess for 10 minutes.
Recess: At 6:38 p.m., the Chair called for a short recess
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 6:50 p.m.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, now we are coming out of recess. Council Members if
okay with all of you, I think we have a really important agenda item, Referrals for
Executive Session. I think the public has waited a long enough for this one as
well. So, if it's okay, I would like to read in both Executive Session items so that
we can discuss them at the same time. Mr. Clerk, Communication 9.1 and
Communication 80.
REFERRALS The Chair directed the Council to proceed to Referrals for Executive Session.
FOR EXECUTIVE
SESSION:
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February 4, 2015
Comm. 9.1: SPECIAL COUNSEL REQUEST FOR APPEAL OF HAWAII
FLORICULTURE AND NURSERY ASSOCIATION, ET AL. VS. COUNTY OF
HAWAII; CIVIL NO. 14-00267 BMK (FEDERAL DISTRICT COURT OF THE
DISTRICT OF HAWAII) TO THE UNITED STATES COURT OF APPEALS
FOR THE NINTH CIRCUIT, CASE NO. 14-17538
From Deputy Corporation Counsel Katherine A. Garson, dated January 15, 2015,
requesting an attorney-client confidential discussion to consult with the Council
regarding the above -entitled matter, including a request for special counsel with
approval of payment of costs not to exceed $10,000.
Comm. 80: CLAIM REGARDING MAKANA FERNANDEZ (MINOR)
From Deputy Corporation Counsel Christopher P. Schlueter, dated January 14,
2015, requesting an attorney-client confidential discussion to consult with the
Council on a personal injury incident occurring on January 2, 2013.
Motion to Enter
Into Executive Session:
Ms. Eoff moved to enter into Executive Session in order
to hold attorney-client privileged discussion regarding
Comms. 9.1 and 80, as authorized by Section 92-5(a)(4),
Hawaii Revised Statutes. Seconded by Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Chung.
MR. CHUNG: Again I going to have to vote against this Executive Session. It
looks like based on the testimony that we heard today, everybody knows what this
thing is all about. And they know the parties and the different, you know, the
proposals, they even talked about the cost today. That was kind of strange, I don't
know how all of that information got out. But nonetheless, I really don't see a
need for Executive Session. If something comes up, then we can into an
Executive Session, but it's a matter of saying yay or nay on this, in my opinion.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I going to respect my ally on the Council and I'm also going to
go against this Executive Session.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, thank you. Okay, I see where this might go, but maybe
we should have the motion for Executive Session, read it inI mean say the
motion separately for both communications.
Withdraw Motion MS. EOFF: I will withdraw that motion.
to Enter into
Executive Session: CHR KANUHA: Then we'll just start with Communication 9.1.
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Motion to Enter
Into Executive Session:
February 4, 2015
Ms. Eoff moved to enter into Executive Session in order
to hold attorney-client privileged discussion regarding
Comm. 9. 1, as authorized by Section 92-5(a)(4). Seconded
by Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: We're heard Mr. Chung and Mr. Eagan speak about this,
another discussion, Council Members? Ms. Poindexter.
MS. EOFF: Could I ask Ms. Garson if we can discuss this in open?
CHR KANUHA: Yeah.
(Note: At this time, Deputy Corporation Counsel Katherine Garson came
forward to address the members of the Council.)
MS. GARSON: Deputy Corporation Counsel Katherine Garson. I think there are
some things you can speak about in open, but it does depend upon the questions
that arise. So if you ask for my legal opinion or my legal analysis, then I would
request that you go into Executive Session for that. But there are some things that
you can discussion in open session.
MS. EOFF: I guess, I was wondering just because if it's listed under Executive
Session items, can we begin a discussion—well, would I have to withdraw that
motion and then can we actually discuss the item outside, I mean in public?
MS. GARSON: You want to start in public and when you ask something that
goes beyond public, and move into executive session? I think you can.
MS. EOFF: So, should I withdraw that motion at this time, or?
MS. GARSON: Sure, because you think that if it's not, then you won't be able to
move in when you need to. Is that correct?
MS. EOFF: No, it's just that the motion on the floor is to go into Executive
Session, so we'd have to vote on that.
MS. GARSON: Let me make sure it's consistent with the advice you have been
given thus far, okay? Hold on. Yeah, you can start in open, and then if
something comes up, a question that I am uncomfortable answering in public
MS. EOFF: Oh, so it's okay to leave the motion on floor?
MS GARSON: You can withdraw and start in open if you would like to do that.
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Withdraw Motion
to Enter into
Executive Session
MS. EOFF: Okay, then I'll withdraw the motion at this time.
February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, the motion is withdrawn, so I think we're going to
have to have another motion so that we can discuss this.
MS. POINDEXTER: I move to open discussion on Communication 9.1.
CHR KANUHA: Is that a proper motion? I don't think that's a proper motion.
MS. POINDEXTER: Or move this out of Referrals for Executive Session.
CHR KANUHA: I think the motion is going to have to be—can I have a motion
to approve special counsel—to hire special counsel.
Motion to Approve Ms. Wille moved to approve the request for Special Counsel as described
Special Counsel: in Comm. 9.1. Seconded by Ms. Poindexter.
CHR KANUHA: Discussion? Ms. Wille.
MS. WILLE: Okay, I think this should be a no-brainer. I think this is, even for
those that have questions in term of GMO, this is about our authority as a county.
And would be—the opinion is very broad. I also think in terms of if this—what
are the consequences? We go forward, we hire expert assistance, we are trying to
win. By voting against it, I see it wanting to decrease the likelihood that we are
going to win on this, which to me is, following those consequences, is sort of
afraid. What does it mean for those who support a lot of the biotech operations?
And want to address that fear for a moment. I actually go back, I think that
Mr. Paleka's statement about case-by-case was pertinent to this. And as I see it, it
isn't just black and white issues, we have exceptions and grandfathers, and we
also were going to move forward. One point I think is relevant, and that is such
as the floral industry that some representatives came here to testify. Actually I
agree and Corporation Counsel agreed and represented to the court that what
they're doing, their GMO operations in the greenhouses is not contrary to the bill.
So, it isn't all black and white. And if the law is upheld, we aren't at the end of
the line and there's more to do.
So again, I just certainly hope that Council Members don't want to relinquish
their—sort of the importance of county governance. We are there are no cities,
there are no towns here. We are—the county is the first layer of government. As
has been stressed, the importance of that local government. And what I always
say is, you know, you are not going to put an ocean between the people and the
first layer of government. And that's really what this is all about. And with the
bill that we have here, contrary to even the Kauai bill, is focused on property and
land use, which is the area that is most close to sort of the local government and
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February 4, 2015
jurisdiction. And I do think that we have—it's a challenging case really because
the law is so complex. And even though the focus on this is preemption, the
whole issue ties together with complex administrative law, contract law such as
through permits, and patent law, and how all of these things overlap. And as I
think Ms. Garson or I talking, is just getting used to these numbers.
Ms. Bronster, this is all she does. I mean, she has a high level of expertise. So do
you want to send someone in? As great as Kathy is, and wonderful, with many
other responsibilities, where she could have someone pro bono coming in here
and helping.
Really it's important to take it out of argue pro-GMO or pro -Geo, and stand up for
our own self -governance, and the importance of this body that we're a part of, you
know, unless you want to just move on to State government, you know. But I
think that's where it is, and I think it's important to no just say, "Oh, this is just,
I'm for GMO," or "I'm on that," and just support. I think it should be a
no-brainer. I guess that's where I stand. And I hope you all will support this and
we can move on.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Wille, I know Mr. Chung had his light on in
the beginning. Oh, no? Did you want to go? Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL Kathy Garson, please come up.
(Note: At this time, Deputy Corporation Counsel Katherine Garson and
Assistant Corporation Counsel Laurine Martin came forward to address
the members of the Council.)
MS. GARSON: Once again, Kathy Garson, Deputy Corporation Counsel, and
Laurine Martin's our Litigation Supervisor and Assistant Corporation Counsel.
MR. ONISHL I've never really been involved in appealing a decision and so
forth, and I need information. So the judge ruled, he made a decision, and so the
appeal is on his decision, or like what Ms. Wille mentioned about patent rights
and land use and this kind of stuff? Because what I understand is you only can
argue on what was the decision, right? There is nothing new you can bring in, is
that correct?
MS. GARSON: Basically you can't bring in any new argument in, it's what you
argued below. So what you authorized was the appeal of the court's decision and
that's what will be argued, that the decision is incorrect for the same reasons that
we argued below, that it shouldn't have been entered as an order to begin with.
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February 4, 2015
MR. ONISHL Okay, so whatever you had argued in the defense for Hawaii
County, the judge didn't feel that you had proven enough burden of proof, or what
happened?
MS. GARSON: It was a motion for summary judgment, so he felt that the law,
that there was no genuine issue of fact and that the law supported his decision to
find that it was State preempted and partially federal preempted. And that's what
we're appealing. And just so you know, the plaintiffs cross -appealed. So they're
appealing also, the judge's decision that he was wrong in not granting all the
relief that they asked.
MR. ONISHL Okay, so that part is new. Will that be part of their arguments
when they go to court, or that's a separate issue?
MS. GARSON: The appeal and cross-appeal are
MR. ONISHL Separate issues, or it's all the same one?
MS. GARSON: It becomes all of the same appeal.
MR. ONISHL Then they have to prepare for both sides, for two different
arguments?
MS. MARTIN: Basically it's adding another issue for the 9th Circuit to decide.
But really, all of the issues are combined. So the County moved for summary
judgment, the plaintiff moved for summary judgment, so it's the same issues that
are coming up in both of the decisions.
MR. ONISHL Okay, so to my understanding, so they won't be bringing anything
new to the table?
MS. MARTIN: Generally that's the rule. Sometimes people will try to make new
arguments. But generally the rule is if you did not argue it below, then it's
waived.
MR. ONISHL Okay. Then so, it that's the case, why can't Corp. Counsel still
represent us?
MS. GARSON: It's not a matter can't represent you, it's that both Earth Justice
and Center for Food Safety have expertise in this area. They have litigated these
cases, cases involving GMO, cases involving the Plant Protection Act. They have
litigated in the 9th Circuit.
MR. ONISHL Okay, wait now. So was there anything about the Protection Act
in this judgment?
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MS. GARSON: Was there what?
MR. ONISHL Anything about the Protection Act.
MS. GARSON: The Plant Protection, yes.
MR. ONISHL There was a judgment.
February 4, 2015
MS. GARSON: Yes. I'm just saying, they have the expertise in the area of
GMO, and they have argued cases in the 9th Circuit, cases that we relied on. This
is what they do similar tothat's what Ms. Bronster does.
MR. ONISHL Were they at that first level like how you went to Federal Court,
and then they lost, so they appealed? Or have they like jumped in, into
different
MS. GARSON: They are involved in it the Kauai case, and that appeal is
pending. In this case, they were allowed to argue during the motion for summary
judgement. They weren't a party, the judge allowed them to argue.
MR. ONISHL On behalf of the Hawaii County.
MS. GARSON: On behalf of other clients.
MR. ONISHL Like who?
MS. GARSON: The Center for Food Safety, and then three other individuals,
Nancy Redfeather and two other individuals. That was like a Friend of the Court
Brief, sometimes they allow people that have certain expertise to file briefs to
help the judge make a decision. And Center for Food Safety and Earth Justice
were allowed to do that. They too were part of that argument at the lower court,
and they assisted greatly.
MR. ONISHL So why can't they just move forward on their own?
MS. GARSON: Because they weren't a party. They were a friend of the court.
MR. ONISHL But they're part of a party.
MS. GARSON: No. They were not allowed intervener status in our case. So it
was only
MR. ONISHL But they could give briefs.
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February 4, 2015
MS. GARSON: They could brief and they could argue because the judge let
them, and that is not a guarantee in any way at that 9th Circuit.
MR. ONISHL Okay, they got to argue, but then the judge still ruled against them.
MS. GARSON: Against us.
MR. ONISHL Well yeah, but they gave briefs, right.
MS. GARSON: Correct.
MR. ONISHL So they are like trying to convince the judge that he should not
favor plaintiff.
MS. GARSON: Right, we argued for the validity of the bill that you passed.
MR. ONISHI: Right.
MS. GARSON: So we were on the same side. We argued that it was valid.
MR. ONISHL That's what I was saying—what I said earlier. Okay, thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Onishi. Ms. Eoff
MS. EOFF: Yes, I want to support that we do hire special counsel, and although
not all of us supported a prior motion to appeal this, I would urge though that all
of us do support hiring special counsel, because now that we are engaged, I think
we should do the better best we can and with the expertise that is offered.
Especially because we have the—well, let me go back a little bit. I think it was
2008, actually Ms. David and I both worked with Councilman Pilago to introduce
the protection of taro and coffee and to ban GMO experimentation with taro and
coffee. So I've been concerned that we need the best that we can get to protect
that part of our Code, because that is not only important financially, but culturally
to many, many people here on the island. So I am supporting hiring a special
counsel, and I would hope that most of us will do that so we can go forward.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Eoff Ms. David.
MS. DAVID: Yes, I do support the hiring of counsel. I realize that when you
have a very contentious and complicated issue like this, you just don't stop
because one judge says you are wrong. If you believe this, and I think the
testifiers today expressed that. And for me having to do that kind of work,
writing Friends of the Court brief is hard work. And you have been given a gift
by Earth Justice when they offered to pay for this litigation. And this is not the
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end, because I know that there are several levels of litigation before it's the end.
So I support this 100 percent and hope my colleagues do the same. Mahalo.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. David. Ms. Poindexter.
MS. POINDEXTER: I was kind of offended by Bronster coming here and trying
to give us legal advice. I have a lot of respect for Earth Justice, because when
they sent the letter, they sent it to our attorneys, which is Corp. Counsel. They did
the right thing. Ms. Bronster and their law firm addressed us as Counsel not only
here but in a formal letter twice. You know, in response to a letter that Earth
Justice to our attorneys. So like them we don't address their clients, yet to me that
was very disrespectful of them.
And they are desperate right now. Why? Something doesn't smell right here, you
know. And here, you know some of the statements they eluded to that they
cannot, Earth Justice cannot or shouldn't represent us, they have represented other
municipalities, I think it was New York. So they have. When I go to court, if I
have a criminal case against me, I am not going to a family court lawyer to go ask
them to represent me. You know, so with no disrespect for you, you are a great
attorney, but that's not your expertise. So I agree that we should definitely, and I
am supporting this, that we need to.
And what harm will it do? It's going to be either a yay or nay, so nobody—you
know, that's the decision the court. And the last vote came that the majority said,
"Hey, let's start this." So now we have this opportunity to do it with the experts.
Why not? Why not. We are not going to pay anything else extra. We going to
pay what we're paying. So it is like Council Member Wille said, it's a no-brainer.
So thank you, and I am supporting this.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Mr. Paleka.
MR. PALEKA: Thank you, Chair. I really have a problem with this, and it's
because of the conflict of interest, I think. I know a lot of testimony and views of
my fellow colleagues is that there is no conflict. But then I have to come up with
another analogy in my head. If we were to, it's a hypothetical, pass a firearms
ordinance, would we then be asking the NRA (National Rifle Association) to
come to our rescue, or come and help us litigate because we lost? Would we do
that? It is the same thing. It is.
Point of Order: MR. ONISHL Mr. Chair, point of order.
MR. ONISHL Ms. Poindexter, you cannot be making face comments when
CHR KANUHA: No, no, no, no. Hold on. Hold on. Thank you.
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MR. ONISHL You know, she's got to control herself.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you for your point. We need to keep the comments so
that no one can hear them, keep them to yourself, and we'll go.
MR. PALEKA: I don't mind, not a problem. But I'm just trying to make that
point. And I'm an organic farmer myself, but I have a real difficult time with this
issue, because I think it opens the door. And I will leave it at that, thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Paleka. Before I get to Mr. Onishi, I just want
to make sure everybody has a first round to talk. Okay, Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL Okay, I'll talk to you guys again. So, if we lose the appeal, what
happens next?
MS. GARSON: You can appeal to the United States Supreme Court.
MR. ONISHL We continue going on?
MS. GARSON: You can.
MR. ONISHL Because?
MS. GARSON: Because—
MR. ONISHL We're going to get free counsel, that's why.
MS. GARSON: No
MR. ONISHL What, that's the bottom line.
MS. GARSON: You can. You could also choose not to.
MR. ONISHL That's the bottom line. That's what—you were here right now.
MS. GARSON: Right, and you already decided to appeal.
MR. ONISHI: Right.
MS. GARSON: So we already going forward. I filed a notice of appeal, we have
a cross appeal against us. I mean, so we're already there.
MR. ONISHL Right, and then so if we lose the appeal, then we are just going to
move forward.
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MS. GARSON: If you lose the appeal, then I might come back and ask you to
take it one step further.
MR. ONISHL But then you could also be Corp. Counsel just telling us, "Okay,
that's it."
MS. GARSON: It's your decision as a client. And you're the client.
MR. ONISHL But then as Mr. Chung had mentioned earlier about the testimony
that we had got and the information that they had given, it was like a slam-dunk
deal that everyone knew what was going to happen. Or who was involved. The
parties that were involved. I know that it was in the papers, and it kind of
mentioned, I think was there money mentioned in the papers, the amount we are
going to be spending?
MS. GARSON: What? The $10,000.
MR. ONISHL Ten thousand? It was $100,000, or $10,000 was it?
MS. GARSON: No, it's only $10,000. And I asked for that in my open letter for
cost, and Mr. Atchitoff made the offer to represent the County for free in open
session, when you guys were voting on the appeal.
MR. ONISHL No, but just recently. Wasn't there an article recently in the
papers? No?
MS. GARSON: Like the last couple of days that you were going to take this up
today?
MR. ONISHL Yeah.
MS. GARSON: Yes, but that information was public already.
MR. ONISHL But wasn't there an amount that was mentioned in the papers in
that article?
MS. GARSON: If anything, if it was an amount we gave, it was this $10,000 for
cost. And I put that in there, not knowing whether or not we would be asked to
reimburse the cost or not.
MR. ONISHL Okay, so if we do lose the appeal, then we are looking at moving
forward?
CHR KANUHA: We are get into hypotheticals.
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MR. ONISHL I know—okay.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Paleka.
MR. PALEKA: Just a brief question. So the solicitation for the attorney services
was from them? I recall at the meeting we had when we decided to go to appeal
they did offer on the floor, but did they follow-up with a letter to the Corporation
Counsel?
MS. GARSON: Yes.
MR. PALEKA: After the decision to appeal?
MS. GARSON: Yes.
MR. PALEKA: Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Any other discussion? Mr. Chung.
MR. CHUNG: Again, maybe this is something that Fresh asked, but when you
guys go on appeal—this is Ninth Circuit, right to the Ninth Circuit Court of
Appeals, you guys will be limited to the arguments that were made at the lower
court?
MS. GARSON: Generally yes. No new evidence, right? You are not going to
file new affidavits. You're not going to file—you know.
MR. CHUNG: Right, it's just arguing with what you have there.
MS. GARSON: Correct.
MR. CHUNG: Okay.
MS. GARSON: And that brings up a good point. Let's say we go to Supreme
Court. People hire attorneys who have the kind of the expertise in front of the
U.S. Supreme Court, just to argue in front of the Supreme Court. I mean, I guess
I kind of feel like we are at that stage. These attorneys are very familiar with the
issues, not only because of their work on work Kauai, but their work on this case,
and they've argued extensively cases in front of Ninth Circuit.
MR. CHUNG: In order to get special counsel, what kind of vote do you need on
this part?
MS. MARTIN: Two-thirds.
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MR. CHUNG: What?
MS. MARTIN: Two-thirds. Six.
CHR KANUHA: Okay. Thank you, Mr. Chung. Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair. I don't think I can say anything that has
not already been said. And regarding the merits of this bill, you know, that wiser
is even an exemption, and wiser even an emergency provision to put up GMO.
So everyone knows that I support GMO, and I can vote to support the special
counsel. I looked at our justice and respect their environmental principles, and I
like the fact that they fought to preserve the salmons on the west side, the western
side of the United States. And you know, I am glad that you guys are looking into
this and looking for options. I just can't support your option. I appreciate the
hard work you do. Good luck and God speed.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, any other discussion? Okay, I'm going toOh,
Mr. Chung.
MR. CHUNG: What is the motion anyway, to approve? Okay, thank I'll tell you
my feelings on all of this. First of all there may be some conflict issues. Possibly,
I don't know. But I think it's really not for us to decide. It would be incumbent
upon maybe Ms. Bronster to bring them up with the court and see what happens.
This is how I look at it. You guys know I'm against this ordinance, right? And I
stand committed to try to find more, some kind of ordinance that would allow
both sides to coexist. I don't know if it's possible, I really don't know. But I
shall continue to do that. This issue has driven a wedge through our community,
unfortunately. We talk about compromise, and I know there was some
compromises made when I was reading the newspaper. But there are still some
people that are put off by all of this.
But this is how I look at this issue. We got the appeal has already been
approved, right? I was on the losing end of that one, 5-4. It's either you guys,
Earth Justice, or somebody else, right? Earth Justice is offering to do this thing
for free. If they take on the matter, and I will hold them to doing it for free, then
it frees you guys up to do other things. So we've got opportunity costs with it
right? What I am really concerned about is if you guys take this thing on, we put
you guys in a real untenable situation. Because if you guys lose, you guys are
going to be criticized. We're going to be criticized. Although I believe, Kathy,
you guys can do a really good job on this appeal. As good as Earth Justice,
probably, because it's just a review before the Ninth Circuit Court of Appeal.
But having said all of that, I going to be supporting this request, okay. I think it's
the best way to go, quite frankly. I'm still against the ordinance, but I don't want
to see you guys in a bad position.
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MS. GARSON: Thank you.
February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Chung. Seeing no other discussion, I'll end
discussion and just say, it seemed pretty simple to me. You guys have a lot
Mr. Chung couldn't have explained it any better. So I am not going to repeat all
of that. But you know, either we have help with Earth Justice representing, or we
have Corporation Counsel doing it all. And you know, I will take the help any
way we can. So that was—you know, the appeal is already going to happen, so it
just makes sense in my opinion. Okay, thank you. Mr. Clerk, on the motion.
Vote on Motion
The motion to approve Special Counsel as described in
to Approve
Comm. 9.1 was carried by the following roll call vote:
Special Counsel:
(Approved)
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Poindexter, Wille, and Chair Kanuha – 6.
Noes: Council Members Ragan, Onishi, and Paleka – 3.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, motion passes.
MS. GARSON: Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Kathy. Okay, now we will move on to—yeah,
Communication 80.
Motion to Enter Ms. Eoff moved to enter into Executive Session in order
Into Executive Session: to hold attorney-client privileged discussion regarding
Comm. 80, as authorized by Section 92-5(a)(4), Hawaii
Revised Statutes. Seconded by Ms. David.
Recess: At 7:24 p.m., the Chair called for a recess
Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 7:45 p.m.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, we are out of Executive Session. May I have a motion
to concur with the recommendations of Corporation Counsel?
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Vote on Motion
to Concur:
Ms. David moved to concur with the recommendation of
Corporation Counsel regarding Comm. 80. Seconded by
Mr. Onishi and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha — 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Thank you, Chris.
February 4, 2015
Return to Order The Chair directed the Council to return to the order of business.
Of Business:
Res. 47-15: TRANSFERS/APPROPRIATES AN APPROPRIATION OUT AND FROM
THE DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT AND CREDITS SAME TO A
DESIGNATED FUND ACCOUNT TO PROVIDE A GRANT TO
BIG ISLAND WAVE RIDERS AGAINST DRUGS FOR THE 2015
WEST HAWAI`I'S COMMUNITY BEACH CLEAN-UP
Transfers/appropriates $3,000 out and from the Clerk -Council Services —
Contingency Relief account (Council District 8); and credits the same to the
Department of Liquor Control, Public Programs, Miscellaneous Contract
Services account (Big Island Wave Riders Against Drugs). Funds would be used
to pay for activities, advertising, transportation, and other expenses for this event
to be held on March 7, 2015.
Reference: Comm. 76
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Motion to Approve: Ms. Eoff moved to adopt Res. 47-15. Seconded by
Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Eoff, you have the floor.
MS. EOFF: I ask for your support. This is a great event and these guys having
doing it for quite a number of years now, so a lot of people turn out to help with
this.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Ms. David? No, I just wanted to say quickly that I
go to this event as well, and it's a great event. So mahalo, Ms. Eoff and the
district, for sponsoring this.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Clerk. No, all in favor of Resolution 47-15, say "aye."
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Vote on Res. 47-15:
(Adopted)
The motion to adopt Res. 47-15 was carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha – 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes.
February 4, 2015
Res. 48-15: AMENDS THE RULES OF PROCEDURE AND ORGANIZATION OF THE
COUNCIL OF THE COUNTY OF HAWAII BY AMENDING RULE NO. 13,
PUBLIC STATEMENTS AND TESTIMONY
Amends Council Rule 13 by removing the option of submitting video testimony.
Reference: Comm. 77
Intr. by: Ms. Wille
Motion to Approve: Ms. Wille moved to adopt Res. 48-15. Seconded by
Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Wille, you have the floor.
MS. WILLE: I thought this was worth discussing, I try on the rules, even one
way or another if I think we should discuss it. The video testimony is something
that's never been used. It's administratively cumbersome and challenging. So
just as I was trying to look through what rules we should discuss and talking to
staff, I brought it forward. I think if someone comes forward, presentation, had a
video, they can, but it just means you can't be sending in videos. Again, this is
not something—there are pros and cons, I am not trying to keep people from
speaking. I'm just trying to, where can we become a little bit more
administratively efficient. I'd rather Jeanette and others spending their time on
other things than dealing with the spam mail we're getting in this. And again, just
opening it up for discussion, if people feel strongly the other way, I have no
problem.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, Kerri, can you please come up? You can introduce
yourself.
MS. MARKS: Aloha Council, I am Kerri Marks.
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February 4, 2015
MR. ONISHL You have interesting comments about, like you were saying now
with technology, and then doing away with paper, right. Can you explain more,
or do you have more information to give us?
MS. MARKS: Well, understanding that this was a very under-utilized service, I
asked about it. So what's the problem? It doesn't seem a problem if nobody uses
it. And was it taking up too much room on the agenda or what? But the answer I
was given, every time someone presents testimony, you have to generate a piece
of paper for all nine of you, so that it was creating but if no one is submitting
testimony in video form, I'm not sure how that creates a problem, paper trail
problem for Jeanette and the—but, I think it's pretty easy to store videos and store
links, and you now have a website that hosts live web conferencing of your
meetings.
MR. ONISHL Right, so you made a comment about that, too. Like you said, had
the agenda one side, and had, I guess the video—because I've never seen it, that's
why.
MS. MARKS: It's beautiful, your new live stream is running right now, and on
one box, one window in the screen, you see what's happening here, the mix from
the other satellite sites and all that. And the other side of the screen, there's a
viewer that hosts the actual agenda. And beyond that. It's not just the agenda,
even communication and reso and all that are clickable links. So it's a really great
system. It's really, really cool; and I'm very, very happy that you all put it there.
MR. ONISHL So, but people cannot respond back?
MS. MARKS: No, you can't, it's a one-way situation. They can watch and look
up documents and they can educate themselves. But there's no testimony, you
can't testify via the live feed. And there's no permanent record of it until they
archive it and it posts as a different link on the website.
MR. ONISHL Okay. And then, I know you were here for awhile, and I think you
Mrs. Ford had introduced this, right?
MS. MARKS: I think it was Mr. Hoffmann.
MR. ONISHL Oh, it was Mr. Hoffmann, he did it. I'm trying to remember how
that happened. Was it to help out people if they couldn't, like be here at all or
something? Then they would be able to give us this video so we could look at it,
and then they would be like, I guess, live instead of reading one piece of paper.
MS. MARKS: I it wasn't my idea.
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MR. ONISHL No, no, no, I know.
MS. MARKS: Although some people have asked me that. It was
Mr. Hoffmann's idea, and I think it was a very forward thinking way for people
to present testimony. There are other municipalities across the nation and other
places where you can submit video testimony. Written testimony can also be sent
ahead of time. But you may have noticed you have never received written
testimony from me either. I'm not a writer. I don't like to write. So that would
be one reason I would like to do video testimony versus that. Plus it's easier for
me to turn on my cell phone and grab three minutes. Beyond that, I think you get
a lot of the feeling, and you get more of a sense of the person when you see them
on video than when they just send in written testimony.
MR. ONISHL No, that's true. And you know, I don't think that we really have a
problem, and I guess that would be a question to the Clerk or Deputy Clerk.
(Note: At this time, County Clerk Stewart Maeda came forward to
address the members of the Council.)
MR. MAEDA: What was the question?
MR. ONISHL Like if there is any problems that by having this offered to the
public, are we having problems? Orif there is not, then maybe we should
continue it, because it's just another avenue for people to give testimony.
MR. MAEDA: Well, Ms. Marks is correct, we don't receive video testimony.
MR. ONISHL So there is no problem then, you folks receiving aren't receiving
any problem because—or you guys aren't having—like overwhelmed with video
testimony?
MR. MAEDA: We don't receive any. Mr. Henricks maybe wants to add to that,
though.
(Note: At this time, Deputy County Clerk Jon Henricks came forward to
address the members of the Council.)
MR. HENRICKS: Jon Henricks, Deputy County Clerk. Part of the reason why
there's no problems is that we are not receiving anything. One of the issues is,
you know, archiving things as well. In the rule when it was written by
Mr. Hoffmann and approved by the Council, there were no specifications for how
this is supposed to work. As such we have tried to come up with some and it's
difficult because there are so many different varieties of media. If somebody
brings a VHS tape, we probably would have to accept it. How do we disseminate
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February 4, 2015
that to everybody? How do we archive that? There is probably answers for these
things, but quite frankly because the demand to do something like this—
MR. ONISHL Okay, so my question is, so is there any problems? Yes or no?
MR. HENRICKS: There is a problem if we start to receive them and the one time
we did receive one, it was an issue.
MR. ONISHL Okay, so your recommendation is it would be better to take it out?
Or do we still continue and try to get some legislation in to make it where you
folks can somehow get it stored. Because, like Kerri was going to raise her hand
because you mentioned VCR's.
MS. MARKS: It states very clearly on every single agenda that you send out the
format that it has to be. And it has to be a down-loadable link, a hosted URL. So
you can't bring in a videotape and drop it off
MR. HENRICKS: You could.
MS. MARKS: You cannot.
MR. ONISHL It's debatable now.
MR. HENRICKS: With all due respect to your position, that's not something that
the rule states. So if someone brought something in like that, we would probably
have to accept it, even though it states that on our agenda. That's a policy that we
created to try to make sure it was something that could be utilized by the Council.
With all due respect we probably would have to take anything and do our best to
make sure that we follow the spirit of the rule.
MR. ONISHL Okay, so my question is again, so is it better to remove this, as
Ms. Wille put in, or should we keep it and try to make better legislation.
MR. HENRICKS: I think you should listen to everything that Ms. Marks has
said, I think you should listen to everything that Margaret has said and that
everybody else has said, and make your decision based upon how you feel.
MR. ONISHL No, but I want to hear from the Clerk's Office to see if it's—you
know, you guys are the ones dealing with it. We don't want to put burden upon
you guys if you guys are having a hard time.
MR. HENRICKS: If it was just a matter of being a burden, I think that would be
hard to say, you know, don't do it, because we are here to serve the public as well
you.
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February 4, 2015
MR. ONISHL Okay, that's okay. I'll just keep it. I'm going to support. I'm not
going to vote for this down, I am going to support what Kerri mentioned. Thank
you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Paleka.
MR. PALEKA: I think I have to side on Kerri's side, because I want to keep it
open. And with the kids, the youth now, they submit—everything's Instagram or
to video, and by keeping that option open to individuals. And if I want to make
testimony, and I'm somewhere, Thailand, Germany, wherever I might be in this
beautiful world of ours and I so decide, "Hey, you know what," or if someone
calls me, "Hey, there's an item, and I want to testify." That opportunity is
available, and probably the only one besides e-mail and stuff Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair. Yes, I would like to support Kerri on this
too. And maybe we could work something out to where the problematic videos
maybe let's do a white list of what we can accept that's video testimony, and
maybe a process to make it easier for everyone.
MR. HENRICKS
May I?
CHR KANUHA: Go ahead.
MR. HENRICKS: That's kind of how we came up with what is on the agenda is
through a pretty heavy-duty analysis and thinking how to work it best, because
those details weren't provided in the actual rule. And I don't, you know,
personally I don't want to come across as opposed to expanding opportunities for
people to participate in our Council meetings. But, you know, I do understand
and appreciate Ms. Wille's position that quite frankly it hasn't been utilized. And
if it was something that I think was valued in the last, I don't know, three -and -a -
half, four years—or at least two -and -a -half to three years that it's been in place,
you know, we would have seen that occur.
So you know, it's a difficult one, in some ways. I that think it's hard to take a
position that you want to limit people's opportunities, and we've kind of opened
this Pandora's Box. But quite frankly, the box is open and hasn't been receiving
anything for that matter. And we do have general concerns about, you know,
when we receive testimony, it's easy to deal with. We make copies for you folks,
we number it, it becomes part of the permanent record. We keep these things, we
retain them. They're part of the record. Not so simple obviously when it comes
to a medium like video and things of that nature. So, that's where we are on that
issue.
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February 4, 2015
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you for that Mr. Henricks. So I just want to say that I
support our 10th Council Member, Kerri Marks, and I expect you to be the first
one to use this video testimony. I would like to watch you on video.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. I am okay either way on this one.
Ms. Eoff, I know you had your light on.
MS. EOFF: I was going to say if it does state here, I am reading here on the
agenda the proper way to submit it, I am sure the staff, if we ever start to get
them, can figure out a way to store it and then forward it to us by e-mail. I guess
that is what you're are supposed to do so we get a copy. I don't see it as a
problem, so I'm just wondering why we, until it becomes a problem, we should
just offer this, or leave it here as an option.
MR. HENRICKS: I don't want to leave Margaret hanging on an island either.
Like, she came up with this idea. I think she was just trying to support, you
know, the staff here, of our concerns of what happens if we do receive a plethora
of them on any particular issue and we don't know how to deal with it. So, you
know, I thank Margaret for listening to the some of the staff here and some of
their concerns and putting this forth. So I just want to let you know that, you
knowI don't want to just leave you hanging off to
MS. EOFF: Now we're more high-tech, right? Now that we can do this video
streaming. Somebody should be able to store these things.
MR. HENRICKS: I am not high-tech personally, so in my personal opinion, I
feel like there's, you know, ample opportunities to participate in many other
ways. Especially viewing, at least, if not, you know what have you. But so be
it.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Eoff. Ms. Wille, I know you have heard from
many Council Members, I think the best thing would just be to withdraw.
Withdraw MS. WILLE: Yeah, and again I just felt it was worth discussing since it was a
Res. 48-15: staff concern. So I will withdraw it.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Resolution 48-15 has been withdrawn.
MS. MARKS: Mahalo, Council.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Kerri. Mr. Clerk, Resolution 49-15.
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Res. 49-15: AMENDS THE RULES OF PROCEDURE AND ORGANIZATION OF THE
COUNCIL OF THE COUNTY OF HAWAII BY AMENDING RULE NO. 14,
MOTIONS
Amends Council Rule 14 by providing that the Chair may only recognize a
motion to end debate if each Council Member was provided the opportunity to
speak prior to the making of the motion.
Reference: Comm. 78
Intr. by: Ms. Wille
Motion to Approve: Ms. Wille moved to adopt Res. 49-15. Seconded by
Mr. Paleka.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Wille.
MS. WILLE: This is one is one that I do feel is important. I'm not just raising it
tobecause I feel it's worthy of at least some discussion. And it's just for the
public to be clear, you can make a call for the question, and when you call for the
question, that means there is no further debate. It cuts off the debate. And I think
this is a very useful tool, and I think we did use it very well a lot, many times.
But I do think it's important for every Council Member, meaning every
constituency of the nine groups to have at least one opportunity to speak. One.
And so this is whether the Chair would recognize that.
So I think it's very simple and it's just a matter of fairness. And it's the kind of
thing that probably, if it hadn't been an issue last time and where it really was
who gets to ask the Chair to speak first. Because we know who would cutting off
debate and who wouldn't. I mean, I just think it's a lot simpler to know that
everyone has one chance to speak before debate's cut off So, I urge you to
approve it quickly.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Wille. I don't think it will be quickly.
Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL Thank you, Chair. You know, in one way I support it, but in
another way I don't. Because then we start going away from what the Robert's
Rules are, right? And then like, for example, calling for the question. If the
debate had lasted so long, and it's going on and on and on and on, and the same
things are coming up. Yeah, we've got to end it. And by this rule then, if you
want to end it then you're going to have to have everybody if they want to talk,
then they're going to have to speak.
Yeah, but one time, but they already talked maybe five times already, so that's
why we're calling for the question. No, but that's when you call for the question.
When you call for the question. What I'm saying is that—okay, let me ask this
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question to Ms. Wille. Okay, so we have an issue, okay, so we're discussing an
issue, right, and then people are talking multiple times, okay, so now say I decide
I want to call for the question. I get a second, and then we vote then. So there is
no where we will be asked, like having one round of people talking, why we're
going to support calling for the question.
MS. WILLE: No, just that you had
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Wille you are off record.
MS. WILLE: Yeah, okay. So can I answer him?
CHR KANUHA: Yes.
MS. WILLE: As long as everyone has had the opportunity
MR. ONISHL No, no, no. No wait. See, you didn't answer my—my question
was, if there were multiple discussions, everyone got to talk, I called for the
question, you second, we vote right there.
MS. WILLE: That's right.
MR. ONISHL Okay, so now what about this scenario: Say maybe Greggor—
Mr. Eagan gets to talk, then Ms. Poindexter gets to talk, and then we're like on the
second reading. And then people want tonow I am going to call for the
question, Mr. Chung seconds me, do we vote? Do we vote, Ms. Wille?
MS. WILLE: Everyone has a chance to speak once.
MR. ONISHL So that means, then that's why I said, then do we have to go,
everybody gets to speak one time. But to me that's not good. That's not part of
what the Robert's Rules are, right?
MS. WILLE: I'm not wedded to Robert's Rules, if it works, it's appropriate for
us.
Relinquish Chair: At this time, Chair Kanuha relinquished the chair to Vice Chair Poindexter.
MR. ONISHL So that part I don't like, yeah. Because then, when that happens,
in that scenario I just said, the person is going to explain, right, to my knowledge,
how you want it, to explain why they want to support for the call of the question,
right? Or they're going to discuss about the issue? That's what it is about?
ACTING CHR. POINDEXTER: So okay, let the record show I have assumed the
Chair. And now I am giving it back, he is back.
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Relinquish Chair: At this time, Acting Chair Poindexter relinquished the chair to Chair Kanuha.
MR. ONISHL I am still asking her a question, that's why.
MS. WILLE: He's still asking me a question, so I'm asking permission to
respond to his further questions.
CHR KANUHA: Yes.
MS. WILLE: Okay so you don't it's that the Chair doesn't recognize the call
for the question until everyone who has their light on then has the opportunity to
speak.
MR. ONISHL But that's our right. That's our right.
MS. WILLE: What is your right?
MR. ONISHL To call for the question at any time. Like I could call for the
question right now. Right? That's my right. And if I get the votes, we vote. It's
like calling for public hearing, that's my right.
But what the Council did when we did that one, I hate to kind of defer from what
we do, but they made it that we had to do it within a certain period of time, and
that was wrong to me.
MS. WILLE: Let me just say, I expect us all to treat each other civilly and to
provide for the opportunity at least to speak once. And in factI want to raise
this, whether we vote for it or not, I tell you I expect to be able do that, including
from my buddy over here. But it was a problem last term and I felt it was worth
discussing.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Onishi and Ms. Wille. Mr. Eagan, I think you
were next.
MR. ILAGAN: Thank you, Mr. Chair. I just want to say as a second term, and
that's where the issue was. But I have high hopes for this new Council and I
don't see it being a problem in the next two years. I look at it as a way to have
some respect to Council Members. Do you want to also tie my hands while we
discuss? Do you want to sit a certain manner? Do you want me to alsoI don't
know, I feel like you are the hallway teacher with your stick. "You must obey,"
this or that. I just feel like right now I have a lot of respect for this current body,
and I don't feel like we need this. What I've seen with all the controversial
issues, we discussed it more than once. So I just want to say, could you withdraw
this? And let's just move on, and not even consider such a trivial thing.
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CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan.
MS. WILLE: But I don't want to cut anybody off.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, at this point, Ms. Poindexter.
MS. POINDEXTER: I just wanted to support what fresh is saying, because I
think his main point is that we do a lot of discussion in Committee. And when it
comes to Council, that whole thing—and I agree with Council Member Eagan,
that it's a respect for each other. And a lot of times as we've called for the
question, a lot of times it didn't pass. So if you feel that, "Wow, Mr. Eagan called
for the question and Mr. Paleka wanted to speak, and that was kind of rude, so
I'm going to support Mr. Paleka being able to speak," or something, "So that's
my choice." So, if it's not a good time to cut off conversation, we have a chance
to vote on it as a body. So yeah, I would encourage you to just withdraw it.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Poindexter. Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I just want to say, there are two inherent things that Puna Council
Member are able to do, one is we're able to throw pencils. That's already in the
rules. And two, is to be able to call the question at any time. No, I am just
playing.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Eagan. Before I give it back to Ms. Wille, I
did want to say, you know, I really think this is important for the Council as a
body, this is part of the democratic process, this is part of Robert's Rules. The
requirement of having two-thirds vote to order the call for the question. In
Robert's Rules it says that's really important in protecting the democratic process.
So, that's kind of a safeguard with this call of the question. So I appreciate the
discussion on this, but I think, you knowI don't think it's necessary, and when
we need to start changing Robert's Rules to fit certain circumstances
Withdraw MS. WILLE: Yeah, and I would be happy to withdraw it, and let me just
Res. 49-15: explain. All of these rules I thought we were going to be addressing them in our
Organizational meeting, and just things that I had down to discuss. So it sort of
puts it in a little different context here. Anyway, I will withdraw this. Am sure
that Fresh will respect me when I want to speak.
MR. ONISHL Of course, Ms. Wille.
CHR KANUHA: Resolution 49-15 is withdrawn. Okay, Mr. Clerk,
Resolution 50-15.
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Res. 50-15: AMENDS THE RULES OF PROCEDURE AND ORGANIZATION OF THE
COUNCIL OF THE COUNTY OF HAWAII BY AMENDING RULE NO. 2,
MEETINGS
Amends Council Rule 2 by decreasing the number of votes required to allow a
Committee or Council meeting to go beyond 6 p.m., requiring the Council's prior
approval for any request of a presentation not related to a pending bill or
resolution, and requiring equal time be allowed for and against the subject matter
of any presentation relating to a pending bill or resolution.
Reference: Comm. 79
Intr. by: Ms. Wille
Motion to Approve: Ms. Wille moved to adopt Res. 50-15. Seconded by
Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Wille, you have the floor.
MS. WILLE: Okay, so the first one I'm going to take up—there are really two
things in here. One is the 6:00 p.m. rule. When we had the first Council meeting
of this session, we had that slip where we had something in there, and something
there, Chair. And it turns out another change that slid through undenounced to
everyone, and that is looking to (c). So whereas we were looking with our rules,
the copy we had from last term, in fact those were inaccurate, and there was this
rule that said that we shall conclude at 6:00, absent two-thirds of the Council
Members. I felt that since this is something that we never discussed, I wanted to
make some way to get it on the agenda, so we make a decision, whether we do
want to have this 6:00 p.m. rule and if we do, whether two-thirds vote or a
majority. I felt if we have a 6:00 p.m. rule, which I am not sure we need, that at
least it should be a majority, because if there are five people voting for it, it means
we could still could have quorum, even if the members want to leave. So that's
the first one, and I'll just—
On the second one, is again I just wanted to discuss how we handle presentations.
I'm not saying I just want it to be discussed. There was when I brought up the
Racing to Zero movie, it should be this is a request, we need to vote on it. I just
want to get it straight. So I wrote something. Again there are pros and cons
either way. Yes, Fresh, I'll hurry up.
MR. ONISHL No, no, no. Take your time.
MS. WILLE: Okay, so what it says is, "Any request for a referral of a
presentation that's not related to something pending," a bill or resolution, "Shall
approved in advanced by the Council," which is basically what we did with the
Racing to Zero, even though I didn't like that. Just so we get it clear. But that if
we have something that's pending, a pending bill, and someone says, "Oh, I want
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to have all of my anti-GMO people and set up a presentation. I think they should
be coming in here for testimony or at least we should be doing it one side or other,
that they have equal time.
So on this one, if there's a pending bill, in other words you have something with a
number, then if you want to do a—well, if you have something, let's start with
where there's no pending bill, and you want to do a presentation to advance our
knowledge on whatever subject, solar power or whatever, that it first comes
before a request to the Council for open. And then we vote on it, yes we all want
to hear about this. And again, I feel there are pros and cons either way, I'm not
wedded to that.
And the second one is where there is a pending bill or resolution, that there should
be equal time given if you're going to do presentations, and you get the approval
of the Council Chair. So I'm throwing this open for discussion, I think we ought
to know how we're handling presentations and I thought this was a good way to
move that forward.
CHR KANUHA: Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHL Okay, thank you, Mr. Chair. I have a question to the Clerk, I think
you met with me one day, explaining that this was a mistake, about the time.
MR. MAEDA: Yes. We actually discovered that an error was made.
MR. ONISHL Okay, go ahead. I'm sorry.
MR. MAEDA: We discovered an error was made when Ms. Wille was looking at
Council Rule Number 2, and inadvertently, when we were at the first Council
meeting trying to fix the rules so that they went back to the original rules from last
term, there was a clerical error and that was added in by mistake. So when we
discovered that, I went to each Council Member and explained this was an error
that had occurred, and that the Clerk's Office would be instituting better checks
and balances to be sure this didn't happen in the future.
MR. ONISHL But because we didn't know that and voted on it, like how we did
the original one, right, when we first met, right, in December, and then that's how
it reverted back to the original, correct?
MR. MAEDA: Yes.
MR. ONISHL Okay, and then so but then when we passed that original, there
was still a mistake in our rules.
MR. MAEDA: That's correct.
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MR. ONISHL So why didn't we at the next meeting correct it?
MR. MAEDA: This is the next meeting. We didn't discover the rule, that there
was an error, until it was brought up that Ms. Wille wanted to amend.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, but then that was a mistake. So we should at least take it
out first, and then if she wants to put something in about the hours, then we vote
for it.
MR. MAEDA: Yeah, an amendment can be made to remove it.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, because I think that would be the cleanest way. Right
because I don't think we all knew we voted for it.
MS. WILLE: We didn't. Can I have?
MR. ONISHL And it wasn't in the original bill anyway—the original rules,
right? So how can it be in there?
MS. WILLE: Because we voted on it. And nobody caught it.
MR. ONISHL No, but nobody knowing.
MS. WILLE: Nobody caught it.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, I know, but then we caught it afterwards.
MR. MAEDA: It was still voted on and approved to the form.
MR. ONISHL No, I understand. But then nobody knew about it until after
Margaret caught it and seen it, right? But then the original rules we had last term
never had it in there, correct?
MR. MAEDA: That's correct.
MR. ONISHL So really not supposed to be in there from the start.
MR. MAEDA: Correct. But it was voted on.
MR. ONISHL I understand that, but that's why, is it—was it by a mistake?
MR. MAEDA: Yeah. It was a mistake. That's correct.
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MR. ONISHL It was a mistake, right? But see, I remember because the first
well, a lot of members who was here now second term, on their first term
Ms. Wille wanted to put this in, and she got --okay, but you wanted to put a time
limit like, right? We end at a certain time, and she got voted down on that.
Because I supported what she wanted, because I think like testifiers mentioned in
the past we used to go like 11:00 o'clock, 2:00 o'clock in the morning on the
budget, it was like unreal. And the Council Members are so drained that they
don't even kind of like stay focused, and they just vote already, because they like
go home, right? So there should be a time. Like tonight. Look, we're going to be
going to
CHR KANUHA: Two o'clock in the morning.
MR. ONISHL No, but at least maybe till like maybe 9:30-10:00 o'clock maybe,
depending on how much we talk, or how much I talk. But you know, I kind of
support this, but I think the cleanest way would be, because we never knew about
it, and we voted thinking it was the original from last year.
MR. MAEDA: That's correct, and I think via an amendment it can be removed.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, so I think that would be—if that is possible. And then on
your second one, I do like what you have, but I feel like maybe the Council
should vote on any presentations, no matter if it's a bill or pending, or whatever.
If there is a presentation the Council should vote on it, no matter what. Instead of
you making it only certain ones. That's my comments. Thank you.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Mr. Onishi. Any other discussion? Ms. Wille.
MS. WILLE: Okay, I did consult with the Clerk and Jon Henricks and LRB, and
they felt that this was really the best way to deal with this (c). And that if people
don't want it on here, we do whatever. But I'm open to if somebody wants to
make an amendment, I'm happy to postpone that and allow you to make an
amendment. I have no problem with that. And as far as (d) is concerned, I am
also open to postpone that and allow for any friendly or unfriendly amendment to
come forward.
MR. ONISHL I will do a friendly amendment.
MS. WILLE: Okay, so I will make a motion to postpone.
Motion to Postpone: Ms. Wille moved to postpone Res. 50-15 to February 18,
2015. Seconded by Mr. Onishi.
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Vote on Motion
to Postpone:
(Approved)
February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Motion to postpone Resolution 50-15 to February 18, you
said?
MR. MAEDA: That's correct.
CHR KANUHA: Seconded by Mr. Onishi. Any discussion on the
postponement? In favor say "aye."
The motion to postpone Res. 50-15 to February 18, 2016
was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha — 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
MR. KANUHA: Motion passes. Thank you guys. Okay Resolution 51-15.
Res. 51-15: AUTHORIZES THE ACCEPTANCE OF A DONATION OF A FLAT SCREEN
TELEVISION WITH ACCESSORIES, A DVD PLAYER, AND VOLLEYBALL
NETS TO THE DEPARTMENT OF PARKS AND RECREATION
Donated by the Queen Lili`uokalani Children's Center with a total value of $4,000
for use at the Kawananakoa Gym in Keaukaha to assist with the implementation of
video -based athletic training.
Reference: Comm. 84
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Motion to Approve: Ms. Eoff moved to adopt Res. 51-15. Seconded by Mr. Paleka.
MS. EOFF: I would like to say thank you to Queen Lili`uokalani Children's
Center for this gift.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, any other discussion? Seeing or hearing none, all
in favor, say "aye."
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Vote on Res. 51-15
(Adopted)
The motion to adopt Res. 51-15 was carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha — 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. 52-15.
February 4, 2015
Res. 52-15: AUTHORIZES THE ACCEPTANCE OF A DONATION OF A SELF-
CONTAINED ICE MACHINE TO THE DEPARTMENT OF PARKS AND
RECREATION
Donated by the Queen Lili`uokalani Children's Center and valued at $3,050 for
use at the Kawananakoa Gym in Keaukaha to implement concessions, fundraising,
and other activities associated with Keaukaha-based athletics.
Motion to Approve:
Vote on Res. 52-15
(Adopted)
Reference: Comm. 85
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Ms. Eoff moved to adopt Res. 52-15. Seconded by Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Eoff you have the floor.
MS. EOFF: I want to say thank you again, they are very generous to donate these
items.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Eoff Any other discussion? Hearing or
seeing none, all favor say aye.
The motion to adopt Res. 52-15 was carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter, Wille,
and Chair Kanuha — 9.
Noes: None.
Absent: None.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Resolution 53-15.
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Res. 53-15: AUTHORIZES THE ACCEPTANCE OF A MONETARY DONATION OF
$5,000 TO THE DEPARTMENT OF PARKS AND RECREATION
Donated by Carol Ann Crocket for the beautification of the West Hawaii
Veterans Cemetery.
Reference: Comm. 86
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Motion to Approve: Ms. Eoff moved to adopt Res. 53-15. Seconded by Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Eoff
MS. EOFF: Thank you very much. I want to thank Carol Crocket. We found out
that she doesn't live on the island, but she just made this donation to beautify the
West Hawaii Veterans Cemetery.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Eoff Any other discussion? Hearing or
seeing none, all in favor, say "aye."
Vote on Res. 53-15: The motion to adopt Res. 53-15 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: That's eight ayes. I just wanted to note to the rest of the
Council Members that Ms. Wille had to leave. Yes, Ms. Wille had to leave for
the night. Okay, moving on, Mr. Clerk, Resolution 56-15.
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February 4, 2015
Res. 56-15: AUTHORIZES THE OFFICE OF THE MAYOR TO ENTER INTO AN
AGREEMENT WITH THE STATE OF HAWAII DEPARTMENT OF THE
ATTORNEY GENERAL, PURSUANT TO HAWAII REVISED STATUTES
SECTION 46-7, FOR A WRONGFUL CONVICTION DEMONSTRATION
PROJECT GRANT TO THE HAWAII COUNTY POLICE DEPARTMENT
Provides $52,072 from the State's Department of the Attorney General's Crime
Prevention and Justice Assistance Division to purchase recording equipment and
related technology to record custodial interrogations of individuals by law
enforcement personnel.
Reference: Comm. 89
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Motion to Approve: Ms. Eoff moved to adopt Res. 56-15. Seconded by
Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Eoff
MS. EOFF: I'd just like to say that I'm sure that this grant will help the police
with—this equipment will help the police, and it's a grant for $52,000. So I urge
your support.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Any other discussion? Hearing or seeing none, all
in favor say "aye."
Vote on Res. 56-15: The motion to adopt Res. 56-15 was carried by the
(Adopted) following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ilagan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha – 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille –1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motions passes. Mr. Clerk, Resolution 57-15.
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February 4, 2015
Res. 57-15: AUTHORIZES THE OFFICE OF THE MAYOR TO ENTER INTO AN
AGREEMENT WITH THE STATE OF HAWAII DEPARTMENT OF THE
ATTORNEY GENERAL, PURSUANT TO HAWAII REVISED STATUTES
SECTION 46-7, FOR THE IMPROVE FORENSIC SERVICES GRANT TO
THE HAWAII COUNTY POLICE DEPARTMENT
Provides $25,641 from the State's Department of the Attorney General's Crime
Prevention and Justice Assistance Division to pay for costs associated with
keeping personnel updated in forensic science training and to purchase updated
forensic science equipment.
Reference: Comm. 90
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Vote on Res. 57-15: Ms. Eoff moved to adopt Res. 57-15. Seconded by
(Adopted) Ms. David and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Resolution 58-15. Oh, that was 58-15? My
bad. I apologize. Yeah, we won't go there again. Okay, Bills for Ordinances,
Mr. Clerk; Bill 21.
BILLS FOR The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, Bills
FOR ORDINANCES for Ordinances (First Reading).
(FIRST READING):
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Bill 21: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-82, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO
PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE
FISCAL YEAR JULY 1, 2014, TO JUNE 30, 2015
Adds the Public Works Highway Administration Office Building Improvements
project for $500,000 to the Capital Budget. Funds for the project shall be
provided from General Obligation Bonds, Capital Projects Fund — Fund Balance
and/or Other Sources. Funds would be used to expand and improve office space
at the Highways Administration building.
Reference: Comm. 83
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire membership
to amend, pursuant to Section 10-6(e),
Hawaii County Charter
Motion to Approve: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 21 on first reading. Seconded
by Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Any discussion?
MR. ONISHL Does anybody have information about this? I mean, it's good that
they are going to improve the Highways' office, I guess? It's the office building,
yeah?
CHR KANUHA: Hold on. Maybe Ms. Eoff has
MR. ONISHL Okay, because that's on the Shultz Siding's baseyard, right?
MS. EOFF: In the background, it is to reappropriate this money from a lapsed
appropriation.
MR. ONISHL Okay, well, it's at the Shultz Siding baseyard, down on, what is
that, the Kanoelehua Industrial Area. You know, what they really need is, they
need more, I guess, warehouse there, like to have their mechanics and so forth.
That's what they need too, so hopefully they can come in for more money.
CHR KANUHA: Yeah, Public Works will be happy with Mr. Onishi. Okay,
seeing no other discussion, all in favor, say "aye."
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Vote on Bill 21
(Approved)
The motion to pass Bill 21 on first reading was carried by
the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Bill 22.
February 4, 2015
Bill 22: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-81, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
ENDING JUNE 30, 2015
Appropriates revenues in the Federal Grants - Wrongful Conviction
Demonstration Project account ($52,072); and appropriates the same to the
Wrongful Conviction Demonstration Project account. Funds would be used to
purchase recording equipment and related technology to record custodial
interrogations of individuals by law enforcement personnel.
Reference: Comm. 89
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Vote on Bill 22: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 22 on first reading. Seconded
(Adopted) by Ms. David and carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Mr. Clerk, Bill 23.
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
Bill 23: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-81, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
ENDING JUNE 30, 2015
Appropriates revenues in the Federal Grants - Improve Forensic Services account
($25,641); and appropriates the same to the Improve Forensic Services account.
Funds would be used to pay for costs associated with keeping personnel updated
in forensic science training and to purchase updated forensic science equipment.
Reference: Comm. 90
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
Waived: FC
Motion to Approve: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 23 on first reading. Seconded
by Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Eoff
MS. EOFF: This one and the last one are just the actual appropriations for the
two resolutions that we discussed earlier.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you. Mr. Onishi.
MR. ONISHI: No.
CHR KANUHA: Any other discussion? Hearing or seeing none, all in favor,
aye.
Vote on Bill 23: The motion to pass Bill 23 on first reading was carried
(Approved) by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
MR. ONISHL Now, Mr. Chair?
CHR KANUHA: Yes.
CHR KANUHA: I just was wondering, because I know, Ms. Wille always does
this to me, yeah. Did she have a letter of excuse?
CHR KANUHA: She did not have a letter of excuse.
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Hawaii County Council -5
ORDER OF
THE DAY
SECOND OR
FINAL READING:
February 4, 2015
MR. ONISHL Okay, then so do we know where she is or where she went?
Because she always asks about me, right? So I just wanted to go kind of like on
record where, I wanted to bring it up, because she always brings that up about me.
But I don't care, I'm okay that she had to leave. It must have been very
important, so I support her 100 percent.
CHR KANUHA: Mahalo. That will be noted.
MR. ONISHL Yeah, and she doesn't need a letter.
MR. ILAGAN: Mr. Chair?
CHR KANUHA: Yes, Mr. Eagan.
MR. ILAGAN: I just want to say, if you want to get the sergeant of arms and
drag her back?
CHR KANUHA: Okay, thank you for those comments. Mr. Paleka
MR. PALEKA: Just to add a little levity, please remind me not to leave.
CHR KANUHA: Yeah, or at least have a letter. Okay, Mr. Clerk, I have no
idea where we are right now, so can we move on to the next?
The Chair directed the Council to proceed to the next order of business, Order of
the Day (Second or Final Reading).
Bill 266: AMENDS CHAPTER 23, ARTICLE 4, SECTION 23-58 AND ARTICLE 5,
(2012-2014) SECTION 23-68 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983 (2005 EDITION,
AS AMENDED), RELATING TO SUBMISSION OF THE PRELIMINARY
PLAT AND FINAL PLAT FOR AN APPLICATION FOR SUBDIVISION
Requires the preliminary plat and final plat of a proposed subdivision be
prepared, stamped, and signed by a surveyor.
Reference: Comm. 937
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Motion to Approve: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 266 on second and final
reading. Seconded by Ms. David.
CHR KANUHA: Ms. Eoff
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
MS. EOFF: Just quickly. This one was my bill that went—came from the
Planning Committee but had gone through both planning commissions with
positive recommendations, and I believe that everybody was in full support of it
when we discussed it previously, and I'd just like to ask for your continued
support. It gives more accuracy and verification of plat maps, that they be
submitted by a licensed surveyor.
CHR KANUHA: Thank you, Ms. Eoff Any other discussion? Hearing or
seeing none, all in favor, "aye."
Vote on Bill 266: The motion to pass Bill 266 on second and final reading
(Adopted) was carried by the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha – 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille –1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Bill 1.
Bill 1: AMENDS CHAPTER 24, ARTICLE 10, DIVISION 1, SECTION 24-254,
SCHEDULE 2 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983 (2005 EDITION, AS
AMENDED)_ RELATING TO 20 MILE PER HOUR SPEED LIMIT
Adds portions of Mahi`ai Road to Subsection (g), Puna
Reference: Comm. 12
Intr. by: Ms. Poindexter
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Vote on Bill 1: Ms. Poindexter moved to pass Bill 1 on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Mr. Paleka and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha – 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille –1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Mr. Clerk, Bill 2, Draft 2.
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Hawaii County Council -5
February 4, 2015
Bill 2 AMENDS CHAPTER 24, ARTICLE 10, DIVISION 1, SECTION 24-255,
(Draft 2): SCHEDULE 3 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983 (2005 EDITION, AS
AMENDED), RELATING TO 25 MILE PER HOUR SPEED LIMIT
Amends Subsection (g), Puna, to revise existing provision for a portion of
Wright Road and to add Amaumau Road and portions of Mahi`ai and Wright
Road.
Reference: Comm. 13.1
Intr. by: Ms. Poindexter
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Vote on Bill 2: Ms. Poindexter moved to pass Bill 2, Draft 2, on second
Draft 2 and final reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by
(Adopted) the following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Mr. Clerk, Bill 3.
Bill 3: AMENDS CHAPTER 24, ARTICLE 10, DIVISION 3, SECTION 24-275.1,
SCHEDULE 23.1 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983 (2005 EDITION,
AS AMENDED), RELATING TO NEW PUBLIC ROAD TAXI STAND
LOCATION
Adds portion of Alii Drive to Subsection (f), Kona, to provide taxi parking
between 10 p.m. and 8 a.m. daily.
Reference: Comm. 14
Intr. by: Ms. Poindexter
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Vote on Bill 3: Ms. Poindexter moved to pass Bill 3 on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
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Hawaii County Council -5 February 4, 2015
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Mr. Clerk, Bill 7.
Bill 7: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-82, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO
PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE
FISCAL YEAR JULY 1. 2014_ TO JUNE 30. 2015
Establishes the following program appropriations to the Capital Budget:
Roadway Projects (Engineering) ($1,750,000); Bridge Inspection, Repair and
Replacement Program (Engineering) ($1,500,000); and Local Road
Improvements (Highways) ($3,250,000), for a total of $6.5 million. Funds for
the program appropriations shall be provided from the portion of the Highway
Fund which is designated as the Fuel Tax Increase Account No. 3104.06, and
which consists of the increase fuel tax revenues created pursuant to
Resolution No. 504-08. Exhibit A, attached to the bill, lists the specific projects
in each category.
Reference: Comm. 26
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire membership
to amend, pursuant to Section 10-6(e),
Hawaii County Charter
Vote on Bill 7: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Mr. Clerk, Bill 10.
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Hawaii County Council -5 February 4, 2015
Bill 10: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-82, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO
PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE
FISCAL YEAR JULY 1, 2014, TO JUNE 30, 2015
Adds the Public Works Mauna Kea Visitor Information Station Access Road and
Parking - Private project for $55,000 to the Capital Budget. Funds for the
project shall be provided from Private Contributions. Funds would be used to
resurface the parking lot, pave a diagonal parking shoulder, install speed humps,
and install lane and traffic -calming markings.
Reference: Comm. 45
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire membership
to amend, pursuant to Section 10-6(e),
Hawaii County Charter
Vote on Bill 10: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 10 on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Mr. Clerk, Bill 11.
Bill 11: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-82, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO
PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE
FISCAL YEAR JULY 1. 2014_ TO JUNE 30. 2015
Adds the Public Works Mass Transit Maintenance and Baseyard Facility -
project for $10 million to the Capital Budget. Funds for the project shall be
provided from Federal Grants Receivable ($4 million) and General Obligation
Bonds, Capital Projects Fund — Fund Balance and/or Other Sources ($6 million)
Funds would be used to design and construct a new baseyard and administrative
facility for the Mass Transit Agency.
Reference: Comm. 46
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire membership
to amend, pursuant to Section 10-6(e),
Hawaii County Charter
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Hawaii County Council -5 February 4, 2015
Vote on Bill 11: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 11 on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Bill 12.
Bill 12: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-82, AS AMENDED, RELATING TO
PUBLIC IMPROVEMENTS AND FINANCING THEREOF FOR THE
FISCAL YEAR JULY 1, 2014, TO JUNE 30, 2015
Establishes the following program appropriations to the Capital Budget:
North Kona Engineering Projects ($13,847.15); Roadway Projects (Engineering)
($2,879,576.15); Bridge Inspection, Repair and Replacement Program
($10,588.21); Americans with Disabilities Act Curb Cut & Accessible Route
Program ($370,644.65); Local Road Improvement — North Hilo ($109,019.82);
and Local Road Improvement - North Kona ($2,112.65), for a total of
$3,385,788.63. Funds for the program appropriations shall be provided from the
lapsed Fuel Tax Increase funds in the Capital Projects Fund ($3,385,788.63).
Exhibit A, attached to the bill, lists the specific projects in each category.
Reference: Comm. 47
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Note: Requires 2/3 vote of the entire membership
to amend, pursuant to Section 10-6(e),
Hawaii County Charter
Vote on Bill 12: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 12 on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Mr. Paleka and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
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Hawaii County Council -5
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Bill 13, please
February 4, 2015
Bill 13: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-81, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
ENDING JUNE 30, 2015
Appropriates revenues in the Fund Balance From Previous Year - Reserve
account ($54,000.40); and appropriates the same to the Transfer to Capital
Projects Fund - Highway account. These fiscal year 2013-2014 excess fuel tax
revenues would be expended by the Public Works Department.
Reference: Comm. 48
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Vote on Bill 13: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 13 on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Mr. Clerk, Bill 14
Bill 14: AMENDS CHAPTER 24, ARTICLE 10, DIVISION 1, SECTION 24-257,
SCHEDULE 5 OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983 (2005 EDITION, AS
AMENDED), RELATING TO 35 MILE PER HOUR SPEED LIMIT
Adds a portion of Wright Road to Subsection (g), Puna.
Reference: Comm. 50
Intr. by: Ms. Poindexter
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Hawaii County Council -5
Vote on Bill 14
(Adopted)
Ms. Poindexter moved to pass Bill 14 on second and final
reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Bill 19.
February 4, 2015
Bill 19: AMENDS ORDINANCE NO. 14-81, AS AMENDED, THE OPERATING
BUDGET FOR THE COUNTY OF HAWAII FOR THE FISCAL YEAR
ENDING JUNE 30, 2015
Appropriates revenues in the State Grants — Little Fire Ant (LFA) Control —
Hawai`i Tourism Authority (HTA) account ($50,000); and appropriates the same
to the LFA Control — HTA account. Funds would be used to hire up to three staff
members and to provide them with equipment and necessities such as bait for the
LFA Control Program.
Reference: Comm. 68
Intr. by: Ms. Eoff
First Reading: January 23, 2015
Vote on Bill 19: Ms. Eoff moved to pass Bill 19 on second and final
(Adopted) reading. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the
following voice vote:
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ragan, Onishi, Paleka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille —1.
Excused: None.
CHR KANUHA: Motion passes. Wait, Mr. Clerk, just real quickly make sure
we got through everything. Hopefully we didn't skip anything before we adjourn.
MR. MAEDA: All agenda items have been addressed.
CHR KANUHA: Okay, may I have a motion to adjourn?
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I lawai`i County Council -5
February 4, 2015
ADJOURNMEN"f: There being no further business, at 8:47 p.m. Mr. Paleka moved to adjourn the
meeting. Seconded by Mr. Onishi and carried by the following voice vote
Ayes: Council Members Chung, David, Eoff,
Ilagan, Onishi, Palcka, Poindexter,
and Chair Kanuha — 8.
Noes: None.
Absent: Council Member Wille— 1.
Excused: None.
CHR. KANUHA: We are adjourned.
Council Approved: June 3, 2016
COU 'Y CLERK
SM/ja
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