Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN EMC 2017/03/21 2016-2018COMMITTEE ON ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT 3rd Session West Hawaii Civic Center 74-5044 Ane Keohokalole Highway, Building A Kailua-Kona, Hawaii March 21, 2017 CALL TO The regular meeting of the Committee on Finance was called to order at ORDER: 1:37 p.m. in the Council Chambers, Kailua-Kona, by Ms. Eileen O'Hara, Chair. R(1T T CAT r Present: Ms. Eileen O'Hara, Chair Mr. Herbert M. "Tim" Richards, III, Vice Chair Mr. Aaron S. Y. Chung, Member Ms. Maile Medeiros David, Member Ms. Karen Eoff, Member Mr. Dru Mamo Kanuha, Member Ms. Susan L. K. Lee Loy, Member Ms. Valerie T. Poindexter, Member Ms. Jennifer Ruggles, Member CHR. O'HARA: We will be taking testimony first but before we do, I wanted to ask the Council if they would entertain or allow me to switch up the order on the agenda and take Comm. 163 prior to going to Comm. 116. If that's okay? Okay, great. STATEMENTS The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, FROM THE Statements from the Public on Agenda Items. PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: The following individuals registered to speak and came forward when called by the Chair: Margaret Wille: Joyce A. Folena: Gregory T. Smith: Comm. 163, in support; and Comm. 116, in opposition. Comm. 116, in support; and Comm. 163, comment. Comm. 116, in support; and Comm. 163, comment. EMC -3 March 21, 2017 COMMUNI- The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, CATIONS: Communications. Change Order As directed by the Chair and with no objection from the Council Members, the of Business: following item was taken out of order. Comm. 163: REQUESTS DISCUSSION WITH THE DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT'S RECYCLING COORDINATOR TO PROVIDE AN UPDATE OF THE DEPARTMENT'S VARIOUS RECYCLING PROGRAMS From Council Member Eileen O'Hara, dated March 2, 2017 Motion to Close File: Mr. Richards moved to close file on Comm. 163. Seconded by Ms. Eoff CHR. O'HARA: Alright. We have with us today, I believe, our new Recycling Coordinator and I'm going to ask Mr. Kurcharski from the Department of Environmental Management, our Director, to come forward and introduce our new Recycling Coordinator. I see Greg Goodale is here, as well. And so gentlemen, please. (Note: At this time, Environmental Management Director Bruce Kucharski, Solid Waste Division Chief Greg Goodale, and Recycling Coordinator George Hayducsko came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. KURCHARSKL Yes, Council. It's a pleasure to be here and to introduce our new Recycling Coordinator, George Hayducsko. And he isI am going to let him speak for himself and I'm going to have Greg come up with here with much more intimate knowledge, so that any questions you have can be answered with more skill then I can muster. CHR. O'HARA: Thank you and before you leave Bill, can you give us the spelling on that last name. MR. HAYDUCSKO: I definitely can, it's CHR. O'HARA: Oh, you have it there. Okay. We do have it in front of us, I didn't see it yet, but thank you. MR. HAYDUCSKO: Sure. Well, if you don't mind, I can give a brief overview of my background if that's appropriate. CHR. O'HARA: That would be great. Thank you. Page 2 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MR. HAYDUCSKO: Okay, well hopefully you don't hold this against me. I was raised in New Jersey. You're not showing me the door on me already, are you? CHR. O'HARA: I came from Delaware. MR. HAYDUCSKO: Oh, okay. Oh close, very close. Then went to school in Wisconsin, raised our two boys in Wisconsin and while I was in Wisconsin I was offered the opportunity to be a Solid Waste Coordinator or Director for three different counties. I have 28 years in the industry; the first County I was in was Oneida County. First recycling coordinator, actually solid waste coordinator for them. They had a landfill like many municipalities do, like you have here and I had the opportunity to design and manage the first recycling program there. A very successful program, still operating and then my next County was in St. Croix County, which is close to Minneapolis/St. Paul, in Minnesota. So it's right on the border. There we had a Waste to Energy facility for the waste. So I managed that program, but again the County wanted to start up a recycling program and had the opportunity to design and manage that recycling program also. My last County was Dunn County, and was there for approximately 18 years, so most of my Solid Waste recycling career. They already had a recycling program but I was able to come in and improve that program. I had a great working relationship with the policy makers. There it's the County Board of Supervisors. The community as a whole, the industry of business institutions, we had the university there, one of the Wisconsin Universities and we were able to make enormous changes and improvements to the program over those 18 years. But it was because of the community's help and the support of the policy makers. Greg will tell you, it was very difficult for me to leave there. I loved my job, I loved the people I was working with. But we decided to come to Hawaii, and I would retire. Well, wouldn't you know, I show up in Hilo and I still felt as though I have more to give, more to offer and I decided to apply for job of being the Recycling Coordinator. And that's how I'm in front of you today, my fourth day, is because I feel I have something to offer. The people that I've met within the year being here are wonderful people. The aloha spirit is definitely is alive here in Hawaii and I certainly want to be a part of that, if I can be. CHR. O'HARA: Thank you very much for that background. I'll let you decide how you want to proceed. You don't have a PowerPoint that's going to show on the slide? Right? MR. HAYDUCSKO: We should. Page 3 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 CHR. O'HARA: Are we prepped for that? MR. KURCHARSKL Yeah, I believe we gave our PowerPoint to the Clerk. CHR. O'HARA: Do we have that in Hilo? I don'tI'm not. MR. KURCHARSKL There it is. CHR. O'HARA: Okay. There we go, great, great. Thank you. MR. KURCHARSKL Thanks, I already made it past the first slide. (Note: At this time, Mr. Hayducsko proceeded with a PowerPoint presentation on display for the members of the Committee. For viewing of the subject presentation, see the DVD copy of the meeting proceedings on file in the Clerk's office. A copy of the PowerPoint presentation is made a part of the record, see Comm. 163.2.) CHR. O'HARA: Alright, thank you, thank you, George. I'm still struggling with the last name, but if it's okay I'll call you George? Okay, thank you, George. MR. HAYDUCSKO: That is fine. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, with that do you have anything to add, Greg? Before I open it up for questions? MR. GOODALL I'd just like to add, you know, as George said it's been four days on the job for him and he's had a lot material to try and digest in that short amount of time, trying to get out in the field a bit. Fortunately for George, he has been here on the island for over a year now and so he's got a pretty good sense of Hawaii Island. But you know, for us as the Solid Waste Division, we're very happy to have someone like George on board and you know we're looking forward to great things to come. So that's the only thing that I'd like to add at this time. Thanks. CHR. O'HARA: Alright, I'm about to open it up for questions here but have you been able to visit a1121 transfer stations yet, George? MR. HAYDUCSKO: Absolutely not. CHR. O'HARA: Okay. MR. HAYDUCSKO: I look forward to it. CHR. O'HARA: Oh, yeah. Page 4 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MR HAYDUCSKO: Correction, it's 22. CHR. O'HARA: Twenty two, okay. Thank you. Alright. Looking for anyone that has their hand up. Nobody? Okay, Mr. Kanuha. MR. KANUHA: Thank you, and welcome. It's great to see you on staff and I know you have a lot of experience, so really looking forward to how you can bring different ideas from where you came from to what we have here in Hawaii County. I know you just did an overview, a brief overview, about what's really being recycled on Hawaii Island. But the question that we're going to have in the future when we start going through budget is how much does all this cost? And I know you stated within your presentation that you're really looking forward to money generating in certain of these programs, but I know we spend a lot of money on recycling. Just basically, approximately how much are we talking about to do all these programs. I know, you—Greg. MR. GOODALE: So no that's a great question, and you know, unfortunately I didn't bring our budget for the coming year. But when we get into, you know, budget hearings and that, I'll be happy to answer any kind of questions you folks might have. But as you said it is an expensive program. You know, I mean when you look at the two -bin program, I can just tell you it's up over $1 million dollars to run that program per year just for you know, removal of the materials from the various transfer stations. But at the same time, when you look at what the value is in terms of keeping that material out of the landfills, and I think George, you know, pointed out some of these things have a little bit of an intangible, like the used oil. It's, you know, it's hard, I mean I know there are probably attorneys out there that can place dollar values on oil and drinking water, but the same time, you know, for us, we know that there is a value in these kinds of programs to the people on this island. But it all does come down to dollars and cents. But you know, we do all the budget numbers that we can provide. MR. KANUHA: Okay. And it was just a question, I didn't know if you just didn't want to put that in this program right now or we'll going to deal with that later on. Which I know we'll go through it pretty thoroughly during budget session hearing. But that's kind of more in what I probably want to talk about. So, I'll save my questions for our future budget hearings. But mahalo and welcome. You know, I'm really looking forward to it. MR HAYDUCSKO: Thank you. Thank you for the warm greeting. MR. KANUHA: I yield. CHR. O'HARA: Alright. Did I see your hand up? Okay. Go ahead. Page 5 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MS. POINDEXTER: Thank you, Chair. And welcome on board to the most difficult task. Greenwaste, when we talk about transfer stations island -wide that their collecting, when I was looking at our map, I don't see you know the Ka`u district and the Hamakua district is kind of left out of the mix. If you look at greenwaste, Hamakua has a lot of greenwaste. Where is it going right now? You know, most of it probably in gulches, or I've seen some dumped over guardrails and in communities, you know. So I would encourage you to look at the sites, because it's not really island -wide yet. So look at that, I would just ask you, please. MR. HAYDUCSKO: Oh, thank you. I'll be looking at that and yep, hopefully we'll see if it's viable. MR. POINDEXTER: Yeah and the opportunity for recycling at each of our transfer stations in the rural communities, especially yeah. Thank you. CHR. O'HARA: Mr. Richards. MR. RICHARDS: Thank you, Chair. Like everybody else, welcome. I think we're starting a tradition here because I believe Bill was on the job two or three days when he came before us. I think we're traditionally doing that and we're also getting people with names we can't pronounce or even spell. So, thank you, Bill, for bringing that forward to us. With that being said we talk about the Big Island and it's really more like running a little continent rather than a County because we have to deal with shipping in and shipping out and that's a challenge. You know, you highlighted the point, usually, waste metals are profitable, not a liability and we're faced with that. And you know, listening to my other Council Members, when we look at this, we have a finite land mass. Well actually, I think we're only place in the nation that actually are growing our land mass but not at a rate fast enough to deal with our waste problem. Having a comprehensive plan, and I think that's pretty much what we're talking about here going forward, we can do short term planning which will kind of bridge some things and get us there. But my interest is looking at our solid waste management 50 years from now, where we're going to be then. I know we can do some short-term things to deal with that. But and the Director and I had those conversations, trying to figure out what the true plan is and walking towards that, rather than trying to run towards a quick answer. I may be politically positive to have those quick answers, but to get those real answers, that's my concern. You talk about all the recycling thing, you know. I have to admit looking at the oil and all that, that's great. I can see the trends are going up. We have the greenwaste management and that conversation coming forward. I look forward to a very comprehensive retooling or looking at our solid Page 6 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 waste management as a whole, because I think if we don't do that, and start planning it now we're going to have problems 20 years from now. I mean, we can get by for awhile but that's certainly not what I want to do, I want to get this thing resolved so it's all positive going forward. I hear what Councilman Kanuha said concerning the dollars and cents side, that we have to pay attention to that. But anyway, thank you again, for being here. MR. HAYDUCSKO: Well, thank you and great insight. Yeah, I completely agree 100 percent, you have to deal with the short term but we should be looking at the fifty years or even longer what to expect to happen here with the materials. So, excellent points. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, thank you, Councilman Richards. Okay, Councilwoman Lee Loy. MS. LEE LOY: Hi. Thank you, and welcome. I just have a real quick question and it's related to the Solid Waste Management Plan, I know you identified that as part of your future recycling programs. I was just wondering what the timeline was. I know it's required to be updated every 10 years, so I was wondering if you just had a ballpark timeline as far as when you would initiate that. MR. GOODALE: So yeah, the plan would need to be finalized by 2019. So that's why we're in the process now of beginning the selection for consultant to assist the County with getting that plan going but yeah, the last one came out was in 2009. CHR. O'HARA: Alright, that's it? Any other questions from this side? Okay, seeing none. I do have a couple questions myself. And George, so you know, full disclosure, I was the County's first Recycling Coordinator. So, I served in `03 to `06 to stream -sort. They fought me. They said, "Oh, that will never work, you've got to separate everything," and blah, blah. So, I'm glad it's been working. At one point we were making money off our scrap metal but that's when used metal prices were through the roof and China was buying up everything because we did green pricing and tied it to the market and I hope that's still how we're doing our contracts, I don't know. If it's to our advantage anyway. But yeah, we could talk and I hope that you come by and we have a meeting, because I'm really interested in talking with you more. I do have a question and this relates to, I think it's something I read in the paper about your Recycling Coordinator position being grant funded. Was that accurate information? Does anybody, I didn't think that was the case. MR. GOODALE: No, the Recycling Coordinator position is not grant funded. There are two positions, one—well, they're both HI -5 Coordinator positions. The Recycling Specialist Ihne of them is 100 percent grant funded and we're in Page 7 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 recruitment for that; and the other one is, the funding all comes from the State, the HI -5 program, but it's actually a full-time County position. CHR. O'HARA: Alright. Well thank you, I and that recruitment is active, it's not one of the ones that we're sitting on right now. Is it? MR. HAYDUCSKO: It's not out on the—it's in the process of getting it out, so it's being worked on, but yeah. CHR. O'HARA: Okay. Okay. George needs the help. Alright, seeing no other questions. Oh wait, okay. MR. RICHARDS: Go ahead. CHR. O'HARA: Mr. Richards. Councilman Richards. MR. RICHARDS: Yeah. Thank you, Council Chair or Committee Chair. George you've had enough time to look through some of these numbers that what we're doing and relative to your experience, our recycling programs unpar with what you've seen in the past? Are we lagging or we're ahead of the curve? Or are we with that? I realize you're fresh on the job and all that but MR. HAYDUCSKO: Overall I would say that the recycling numbers are positive but doesn't mean that we still can't improve. Well, getting back to the budget issue, you know, I've always been good at designing and managing programs to utilize the funds, the most we can. So, my goal is to, you know, look at the funds and see if we can capture more material with the money we already have. So that is my goal but I have to say yes, the numbers look good. You should feel proud to be a citizen in on the County Council for this program. It's working really well. MR. RICHARDS: Okay, alright. Thanks, appreciate that. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, Ms. Lee Loy, do you have one more question there? MS. LEE LOY: I do. I got to thinking about how, you know, part of the Solid Waste Management Plan also includes the closure of the Hilo facility, and with that closure, there's a closure plan. And then I got to thinking about well, as we start closing that site I'm sure there's going to be some recyclables that are actually in that facility. So following that train of thought, is there a plan or will there be a plan to sort out some of the recyclables that are currently in the East Hawaii Landfill that could be pulled out? Does that make sense? MR. GOODALE: Yeah, it makes sense. So, just to answer that, you know, simply, the State of Hawaii frowns on mining landfills for several reasons: for environmental reasons and also safety reasons. It has been done in other states Page 8 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 but it is a very—it's a hazardous issue that's you know, we're talking about a landfill that began, you know, when a lot of these different regulations weren't around such as Subtitle B which it requires a liner like we have in the West Hawaii Landfill. So very unlikely that we will be going back at into the South Hilo Landfill to do any kind of mining. CHR. O'HARA: Alright, thank you. And one last question. What is our recycling rate, diversion from landfill rate, right now? MR. GOODALE: So the current, as of what we released to the State and our annual operating reports. One of the things that we were able to get when we were doing our diversion incentive programs was, it was getting some of the recyclers such as like, you know, the companies like Walmart that are already shipping a lot of their cardboard off island, it allows us on some of those cases to be able capture some of those numbers that we aren't able to get. So short, the answer to your question is it's a little bit lower than it's been, we're probably down around like 28 percent, we're a little less than 30 percent right now. I believe that number to be higher than that but the problem is we are unable to get that data because there's no real incentive for those folks to provide that to the County. There's no requirement for them to give us the numbers on what their shipping off island. So, we know that there's some of these retailers that are sending large volumes of recyclables to the mainland but we're not getting those numbers just because they are not inclined to want to release them to us. So, like I said the number as of right now is about 28 percent. CHR. O'HARA: Alright. And that is including what information you are getting from the retailers that are back -shipping card board and things like that? That 28 percent? MR. HAYDUCSKO: That's just including the numbers for the programs that the County has. CHR. O'HARA: Oh, okay. MR. HAYDUCSKO: Looking at the overall waste stream and looking at the programs the County has. So like I said, if we were able capture some of those numbers and know specifically what they were, my belief is that diversion number would be higher than 28 percent. CHR. O'HARA: Correct but that gives me a benchmark to look back, you know, 10 years, 11 years. I know, when I left the position in 2006, we were at 27-28 percent diversion from landfill. So we seem to be on static path right now and I think we can do better. But I'm glad you're on board, George. Okay, I think Ms. Lee Loy has one last question. Page 9 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MS. LEE LOY: Hi. Thank you. I just had one follow-up question. Mr. Goodale mentioned that about the mining. Does that also apply to the transfer stations? So people who are just throwing at the transfer and then getting hauled? Cause my question was related to the East Hawaii. In closing, does mining also apply to what we're throwing at some place like Honoka`a transfer station? MR. HAYDUCSKO: Okay, so big difference between going back into the landfill and removing materials out of that and sorting through the materials it might be coming into something like a transfer station or the sort station in Hilo. So, you know, we do intend to scale up our sorting capabilities in East Hawaii because we want to be able to try and only send the things to the landfill that really belong in the landfill. So you know, our goal is going to be trying to ramp up our efforts to do more sorting. So when you look at what George talked about is far as things like the—you know, all these things, and you know, these are discussions George and I have had, is there are all efforts to try to divert things away from the landfill. If you look at everything that's in common with all the things that were on list, it's all an effort to try to keep these things out of the landfill. So for us it makes economic sense obviously, to not be hauling material to the landfill that don't need to go there. So we're going to be, you know, increasing our efforts to try and sort through those and remove the materials that we can. CHR. O'HARA: Alright. Thank you. Council Woman David. MS. DAVID: Thank you, Chair. Welcome, George. I'm not going to attempt your last name either; and Greg, thanks for being here. I just wanted to clarify one thing, or two things. On the greenwaste collection at transfer stations, didn't we not have collection at Waiohinu and Ke`ei and those were transferred to yeah Pu`uanahulu. MR. GOODALL Yeah, and that's correct, that Ke`ei site did get omitted from our list. Waiohinu has not yet begun collecting greenwaste. That is one our sites we've identified that we'd like to start getting greenwaste collected. Two sites that were added to the list was Volcano and Waimea. So those are two sites that had not had greenwaste collection in the past, but Waiohinu is one that we're intending to add for greenwaste collection. MS. DAVID: And what would be the timeline on the Waiohinu Station? MR. GOODALL It's probably going to coincide with when we rebuild that site. Which should be happening over the course of this next year. MS. DAVID: Okay, so, the Ke`ei, is there any reason why it was discontinued, I know that spot was very Page 10 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MR. GOODALL It's not discontinued, it just got left off the list. So, we do collect at Ke`ei now. MS. DAVID: Okay. MR. GOODALL It was just omitted from the list MS. DAVID: Oh, is it just a typo? MR. GOODALL Yeah, yeah. MS. DAVID: Okay. MR. GOODALL Ke`ei should be. Yeah, I know, four days, we'll give him a MR. HAYDUCSKO: My mistake. MS. DAVID: I'll give him that. Thank you. I mean it's a typo. MR. GOODALL Yeah. MS. DAVID: Okay, great. Thank you very much. MR. HAYDUCSKO: I'll take full blame. MS. DAVID: Alright. Okay, so Ke`ei is still open. MR. GOODALL Yes, it is. MS. DAVID: Perfect, thank you. Thanks a lot. Aloha. I yield. CHR. O'HARA: Alright, anymore questions? Seeing none, I'm going to thank you for coming over. This has been great and I look forward to working with you in the future, and great things can happen when we all work together and set our minds to it. And we need to increase that diversion rate with or without the additional numbers from the retailers. We do need to keep pushing that number up. Okay, with that said I will ask—seeing no more questions, can we please have all in favor of filing this communication. Say "aye." Page 11 EMC -3 Vote on Comm. 163 March 21, 2017 The motion to close file on Comm. 163 was carried by the Filed following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Eoff, Kanuha, Lee Loy, Poindexter, Richards, Ruggles, and Chair O'Hara — 9. Noes: None. Absent: None. Excused: None. CHR. O'HARA: We're now going to continue on an item that was recessed from the last Environmental Management Committee, and that's Communication 116. Return to Order The Chair directed the Committee to return to the order of business. Of Business: Comm. 116 Recess: Reconvene: REQUEST DISCUSSION REGARDING MAYOR HARRY KIM'S POSSIBLE CANCELLATION/TERMINATION OF THE CONTRACT FOR THE COUNTY COMPOSTING FACILITY, AS REPORTED IN THE FEBRUARY 5. 2017_ ARTICLE IN THE HAWAII TRIBUNE From Council Members Aaron S. Y. Chung and Susan L. K. Lee Loy, dated February 13, 2017. Postponed: March 7, 2017 (Note: There is a motion by Mr. Chung, seconded by Mr. Kanuha, to close file on Comm. 116. CHR. O'HARA: As we enter into this discussion, it may be necessary for us to enter in to an Executive Session. I'm just forewarning folks that are here that means we have to, you know, shutter the meeting. So if that happens forgive us, but we will get back into public session. And I want to also tell everyone that we had some extra communications that were presented to you around lunch time. Some of them are marked confidential and they're only forI mean they are for Executive Session purposes. So I want to take a very short recess of 10 minutes just so everybody can make sure that they've looked through all the materials that we're going to be discussing in this communication. Alright. We're in recess. At 2:40 p.m. the Chair called for a recess. The meeting reconvened at 2:48 p.m. CHR. O'HARA: After our recess, I hope everybody had the opportunity to review the communications that just came in front of them, because these are going to be somewhat important. And I'm going to see if there's any discussion Page 12 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 on this communication in front of us that we can have here in public session. Does anybody have any questions before no? I don't know where Jen is. No? Okay. MR. KANUHA: I mean, yes. CHR. O'HARA: Okay. MR. KANUHA: Just for our attention, you know there was septa letter was sent, and the public's attention by Kai Kahele and Chris Todd, and I'm sure the public knows about that and everybody knows about that. So as long that everybody got that letter, I'm all good. CHR. O'HARA: Yes, I think that was numbered—communication number. Senator Kahele and Representative Chris Todd. (Note: At this time, Corporation Counsel Joseph Kamelamela came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. KAMELAMELA: Oh, okay. Thank you. CHR. O'HARA: And with that, Mr. Chung. MR. CHUNG: Yes, thank you, Madam Chairman and I'm going to have to seek guidance from you and others on this body. But we received—well the last time we had this discussion, Mayor Kim said that we had to take a look at the memo from Bill Kurcharski who is our DEM (Department of Environmental Management) Director. That would fully explain his reasons, his general reasons. I'm even going to go even as far as saying cryptic reasons for cancelling this. MR. KAMELAMELA: At this time— MR. CHUNG: Joe. Hold it. MR. KAMELAMELA: Excuse me. No, no, no, wait. MR. CHUNG: Madam Chairman. MR. KAMELAMELA: What was given to you was the attorney-client privilege CHR. O'HARA: Excuse me. MR. KAMELAMELA: —and you're not to state anything. No, I am sorry. CHR. O'HARA: Mr. Kamelamela, I am Chairing, so let me take back the Page 13 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MR. KAMELAMELA: I understand. CHR. O'HARA: But I will give you the right to speak. But let's just— MR. KAMELAMELA: But let's just get it to Executive Session. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, well let's not rush things. MR. CHUNG: Madam Chairman? CHR. O'HARA: Yes. MR. CHUNG: You know, Joe, you have a really bad habit of interrupting people, okay. So, will you please cut it out? You are the people's attorney but that does not give you license MR. KAMELAMELA: No, no. MR. CHUNG: to interrupt us. MR. KAMELAMELA: No, no I am MR. CHUNG: Again, here you go interrupting. MR. KAMELAMELA: May I speak? CHR. O'HARA: When he has completed what he wanted to say. MR. KAMELAMELA: I don't because— CHR. O'HARA: No, Joe. Mr. Kamelamela. MR. CHUNG: Madam Chairman, I have the floor right? CHR. O'HARA: Yes, I have given him the floor, so let him complete. I will let you respond. Okay. Thank you. MR. CHUNG: Mayor Kim made reference to a memo from Bill Kucharski to him which would explain everything. We've received it. CHR. O'HARA: Yes. MR. CHUNG: It's stamped or typed "Privileged and Confidential," and it doesn't—it also includes other communications. Page 14 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 CHR. O'HARA: Correct. MR. CHUNG: My question is, why is it privileged, why is it confidential? CHR. O'HARA: If you're asking me for the answer, I can't give it to you. But I can turn the floor over to Mr. Kamelamela and perhaps he can respond. MR. KAMELAMELA: I'm sorry that I interrupted you. But you know, I've always believed, you know, when I see a process that's wrong, it's my duty to state something. So, I apologize to you, Mr. Chung. Now, in order for me to actually explain, it's better to do it in Executive Session, because in the Executive Session, although you might feel that something is cryptic, I can explain it. I have something else to show the Council too. So give me the opportunity to talk to each one of the Council, because this contract is a big contract. There is no question in my mind of the importance of this contract. You know, and there's no question in my mind from the testimonies that I hear that the mulching is good, that we're going to do the composting. There's no question in my mind in that. But the communication itself, you know, say let's have a discussion. Part of what I know about the communication, let's talk about the legal issues. This is something of critical importance, it's significant. And so it's up to the Council, if they do not want to go into Executive Session, that's fine with me. Whatever material that I've given to the County Clerk to give to this Council to look and deliberate it, that's okay too. Because you know why, if you vote not to go into Executive Session, I'm going to leave. And that's how it is. But I'm sure that the County Council Members want to hear what I have to say, because I hear a lot of thing in public and it's wrong. I read a lot of things in public and it's wrong. So a lot of people, you know, have their own opinions. Well, let's go into Executive Session, let me provide a perspective. But I cannot stand grandstanding when it's such an important issue for this County. Cannot stand it. I represent the County, and I apologize to you again, Mr. Chung. I believe that you are my friend, so let's keep it that way. Sometimes when I talk loud because it's just the way I am. It's not to, you know, disparage or make people scared, you know. But you know, so I apologize to that too, because sounds like I'm getting loud, you know, but I'm not angry. Okay, I think if people really want to know why it's the way it is right now, I can talk to each one of you, answer every single question you have. You may disagree with me, that's fine, because that's how we have always respected each other. And I share the same respect to you, Chair. CHR. O'HARA: Okay. Well thank you, Mr. Kamelamela. I appreciate the response. I am going to call for a motion if someone was—what you have another response? Mr. Chung. Page 15 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MR. CHUNG: Yeah, Madam Chairman. Look, I have no problem with an Executive Session. CHR. O'HARA: Okay. MR. CHUNG: That's not the question I asked. But in as much as the people's attorney is going to be leaving if we don't go into Executive Session. I'm certainly more to listen to what he has to say because what he says is he has something in addition to this that he would like to tell us. So, I'm kind of curious as to what he has to say. So, I have no problem with going into Executive Session. But that's really not the question that I asked. CHR. O'HARA: No, it is not. I understand that, thank you. And I unfortunately I have no ability to answer to answer that question because it's not my communication. MR. CHUNG: Right, right. So, I'll be supporting that but I really take exception to any kind of inferences or insinuation that's there grandstanding going on over here. CHR. O'HARA: No, I understand. MR. CHUNG: Thank you. CHR. O'HARA: And I will go back to askingoh, you have a question? Okay, Ms. Lee Loy. MS. LEE LOY: Mr. Kamelamela and maybe for my other colleagues, because we have received a number of communications. Some were not marked confidential, and I'm specifically speaking to Communication 116.3. It's addressed to our Chair dated March 17, and it was the contract for the EA (Environmental Assessment). And I have a question to that, and I don't know if I ask it now, or we're going to ask those questions in CHR. O'HARA: It's not a confidential document, so if you want to go ahead and ask the question that seems. MR. KAMELAMELA: But I'm going to refer to it in the discussion, because it's kind of important. I'll try to see if I can field the question MS. LEE LOY: Okay, let me go ahead and ask the question. In that communication in a letter from PBR Hawaii, it's the proposal to provide planning services, in the second paragraph, it states, "Although the minimum scope of the EA is subject for the four parcels" Page 16 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MR. KAMELAMELA: Sorry, which page you're on? MS. LEE LOY: This is looks like page five, it's the attached Exhibit A. MR. KAMELAMELA: Oh, scope of work. Thank you. MS. LEE LOY: The scope of work. We're on paragraph two. It says, "Although the maximum scope of the EA is for four subject parcels." I read a lot, and I don't know how they came up with the four parcels. MR. KAMELAMELA: And that's a good question because all of that parcels is in Hawaiian Homes' lands. MS. LEE LOY: And what was the evaluation for those four parcels? MR. KAMELAMELA: Let me see if Mr. Goodale could answer that one. (Note: At this time, Solid Waste Division Chief Greg Goodale came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MR. GOODALE: Greg Goodale, Solid Waste Division Chief. The question is about the four parcels? MS. LEE LOY: Yes, so I guess to bring it into context a little bit, I understand there was this large contract. There were two parts: Phase I, mulching piece; and Phase 2, in -vessel composting facility. The in -vessel composting facility required the preparation and processing of environmental assessment. So then you guys sent out an RFP (Request for Proposals), correct me if I'm wrong, to have someone do the Environmental assessment. When I read the scope from PBR, four subject parcels were already identified. I wanted to understand how those four parcels were evaluated and proposed to be the sites to be evaluated? MR. GOODALE: So, okay. So backing up. First of all, the selection for the company that do the EA, PBR was done through a professional services selection process, not an RFP, but similar. So the parcels, the primary subject parcel is immediately adjacent to the existing South Hilo Sanitary Landfill. As a matter of fact, it was a site that was originally selected as potential landfill expansion. There were three parcels to the south of that parcel. So all of the land out there is all done through executive order through the State. The parcel, the primary parcel that was being looked at is a parcel that has already been EO'd (Executive Ordered) to the County and at was the one that was being looked at as part of the future potential expansion for South Hilo. The other three parcels were parcels that we have been in discussion with DLNR (State Department of Land and Natural Resources) that are available, that the County expressed interest in getting an EO for the three parcels. As a matter of Page 17 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 fact, we've got an action in before DNLR which would consolidate all the EO's under one EO for the whole—that would cover all the parcels which includes the Hilo Transfer Station, I mean it's a pretty expansive area. But it just simplified it for the County to have all those parcels. And those three parcels that I was talking about were available at the time. So, right now what we have with those parcels is just a construction right of entry in case somebody needed to go in there and take a look at the land, is all that allows for. But the primary reason for the subject parcel that PBR was focusing on was because of its proximity to the existing landfill and that it had been in long-term planning documents as to that use. The one reason why that's no longer being evaluated for an expansion to the landfill is due to the proximity to the airport. And in the discussions we had with the State Department of Transportation, due to the potential for vector attractant, that's no longer being considered as a landfill space. But because it had been within the overall waste management for the County is why that was focused on for the EA. So, sorry for the long, drawn out MS. LEE LOY: So, I just want to make this clear that the primary factor that this site was picked was because of proximity. MR. GOODALL Proximity is one reason. It also is because it had been in other evaluations. It had been part of that overall planning for the County. So not only proximity, but also in terms of the services expected to be provided by the County. So, it was within that matrix. MS. LEE LOY: Okay so in the evaluation steps, location or proximity to the existing East Hawaii facility, surrounding uses, and then at what point was the adjacent residents given consideration in this matrix or checklist of picking a site? MR. GOODALL I guess what I can speak to is the land uses that are in existence right now. We also knew one of the things that had occurred prior to the EA that the County did for that site was the Mass Transit had just had an EA done for that site, which met with a FONSI (Finding Of No Significant Impact). So looking at all of these things, you know, we felt there had been adequate consideration given for the land uses. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, thank you. Any other questions you want to put forth before I call for a motion for Executive Session? MR. KAMELAMELA: Chair, can I make one more statement? CHR. O'HARA: Yes, Mr. Kamelamela. MR. KAMELAMELA: It's my bad that I used the word "grandstanding." So you know, I'm really sorry for saying that. Page 18 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 CHR. O'HARA: Okay, okay. And Mr. Goodale with regards to these four parcels, I understand the three that were not considered were not it would still have to go through Executive Order, whereas the one site that was considered has already been awarded to the County through Executive Orders, is that correct? Did I understand that correctly? MR. GOODALL Yes, that is correct. The three parcels had not been EO'd to us at this time. One of the things that we were waiting on to do the whole consolidation was the completion of the EA. But at this time there is no requirement from DLNR that you do an EA to the EO. CHR. O'HARA: An EA to EO. MR. GOODALL The EA to EO, so there's no requirement to get an EA done just to do an Executive Order. CHR. O'HARA: And these three other parcels have been in previous uses such as quarries or other things like that? MR. GOODALL Correct, there were all parcels that had been quarried out through leases that DLNR had with the local aggregate companies. CHR. O'HARA: I just wanted to clarify that. Thank you. Okay, with that I would like to call for a motion to go into Executive Session. MR. HENRICKS: Pardon me, I'm so sorry. I know you're ready to go but I know this is a postponed session. CHR. O'HARA: Okay. MR. HENRICKS: We just don't really have a lot of context for why the motion is about to be made. I know there's a lot of communication stuff, and an Executive Session is totally viable, but only for the record and to kind of let the public know why the Council can't talk in open session. So, I didn't hear anything yet. So sorry, pardon me. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, and I'll try to summarize that. In our last meeting in Hilo, we were addressed by Mayor Kim, regarding his reasons for terminating the greenwaste organics diversion contract. And he kept referring to a document that was a report from the Director of DEM, Mr. Kucharski, and when we asked for that report, we were told we would receive it, which everyone on Council did but it was presented to us as a confidential document, and this is one of the reasons Councilman Chung has been asking the question as to why that is labeled as a confidential document? It was an analysis that was done by Mr. Kucharski in February, early February, before the Mayor met with the company that is Page 19 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 currently under contract. It was in addition to Mr. Kucharski's cost comparison analysis, there is also an analysis by Deputy Corporation Counsel Belinda Hall, and that refers to the conditions under which the County could possibility consider a termination. So, when that was presented to us as a confidential document, in order for us to have a discussion with Mr. Kamelamela, it will be necessary under our rules to go into Executive Session. Alright, so thank you. Okay, Councilman Chung. MR. CHUNG: Just a point of clarification, not just confidential, but it's also labeled "privileged," separate concepts. And also Mr. Kamelamela referenced in open session that there is actually something in addition to all of this that he is going to be telling us. CHR. O'HARA: That's correct. MR. CHUNG: That he's going to really elaborate on. CHR. O'HARA: And we have also received additional information that is labeled "confidential," and that came from the attorney for the company that is currently under contract. MR. CHUNG: Thank you. CHR. O'HARA: Thank you. Alright, Ms. Eoff Council Woman Eoff MS. EOFF: Well thank you Madam Chair, and if there is no further discussion here in open session, and in order to further our discussion, it seems necessary to go into Executive Session. Vote on Motion Ms. Eoff moved to enter into Executive Session in order to to Enter into hold attorney-client privilege discussion regarding Executive Session: Comm. 116, as authorized by Section 92-5(a)(4), Hawaii (Approved) Revised Statutes. Seconded by Ms. Poindexter and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Eoff, Kanuha, Lee Loy, Poindexter, Richards, Ruggles and Chair O'Hara — 9. Noes: None. Absent: None. Excused: None. CHR. O'HARA: Thank you. Seeing no objections, we'll go into Executive Session and I'm going to have to give the recorder here a few seconds to switch over the tapes. So we're in a short recess until that is done. Thank you. Page 20 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 Page 21 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 Recess: At 3:12 p.m., the Chair called for a recess. Reconvene: The meeting reconvened at 5:43 p.m. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, coming out of our Executive Session. It is I think 5:45, 5:43 p.m. Okay, and for the public's information, the Executive Session was regarding some information that had been provided to us through Corporation Counsel which was a the basis for—the Mayor claimed to be the basis for his decision to terminate the greenwaste organic diversion composting contract for termination for convenience. So, we had a pretty vigorous discussion, and the Council is considering its future direction in regard to this contract. But right now we are going to take a vote to close the communication. The motion is on the floor, so any more discussion on this? Okay, Mr. Richards. MR. RICHARDS: Yeah, coming out of Executive Session, and Mr. Clerk, I'd like to have a little bit of help on this one. Through our discussion and conversations, I understand the need for confidentiality, but I'd like to propose a motion that we make the discussion of our Executive Session public, so people understand the conversation and I don't know if I can do that motion in this? Mr. Clerk? MR. HENRICKS: You can probably make whatever motion you want to. But as far as waiving your, essentially, your attorney-client privilege, which is what we are talking about when you go into Executive Session, we would probably need to have something in front of us, such as minutes or something, that then you could act upon that in a material way, as opposed to some kind of a because we didn't record it on video. MR. RICHARDS: Right. MR. HENRICKS: You know, the transcript is pretty much the only record of the discussion that will be available which will be minutes as part of this overall meeting that we're having. So, we could look further into that, as far as the ability to make the discussion available by way of minutes, and what that would entail, as far as the Council having the ability to do that and how they would do that. MR. RICHARDS: And I would like to make a motion to explore that and see if we can come up with a way of communicating what was discussed. Is that possible? MR. HENRICKS: I think that the Chair could take recommendation and then, you know, we can just do that if the Chair, you know CHR. O'HARA: This would be as a recommendation to the Chair, not as a motion. Page 22 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 MR. HENRICKS: Yeah, yeah. I don't think you need to make a formal motion if the request is for the Clerk's Office to essentially produce the transcripts of this meeting in the form of minutes and then to provide you with information for as for how you would go about essentially making the discussion in the Executive Session available to the public, we can certainly look into that. MR. RICHARDS: Okay, I would like to ask the Chair that we explore this so there's an understanding. And I totally respect that our Corp. Counsel is saying about confidentiality, but I think it's important. So Chair, I yield. CHR. O'HARA: Thank you and I will definitely take that under consideration. I think we will see more actions related to—the Council may see more actions in the Environmental Management Committee upcoming regarding this particular decision by the Mayor to terminate the contact and so at that point we can address your concerns as well. Okay, Mr. Chung. MR. CHUNG: Before I make a second. Is that a motion? CHR. O'HARA: No, he is asking, urging me to find a way to it public, and I am offering to come back to the Council with a resolution, at least one resolution, at our next Environmental Management Committee meeting. The Chair just informed me, the County Council Chair, just informed me that she may be willing to waive the deadline requirements so that we can get this done as soon as possible. Okay, sure. Okay, any more discussion? Ms. Lee Loy. MS. LEE LOY: I do just want to offer this. This particular issue has already been explored by the Office of Information Practices about executive transcripts and the minutes and when they can be made available. So if I could just urge the Chair to go and ask OIP, how they handled it, I believe it was for City and County of Honolulu. There's actually a mechanism already available and maybe we can move this along. I'd also like to put some push behind the transcripts or the transcribing of those minutes and if we could get this done. I know it is challenging for staff, but if they could put that in front of the meeting minutes that would be excellent. CHR. O'HARA: Alright, thank you. Mr. Chung. MR. CHUNG: Madam Chairman. I'm wondering if you could just give the Council's position on this whole matter in like five sentences, at least the viewing public knows, they may not know exactly what went on in Executive Session but at least I think they'll get a flavor for what the Council feels, because I believe the Council is unified on this matter based on what I've heard. Page 23 EMC -3 March 21, 2017 CHR. O'HARA: I think the Council is fairly unified. Thank you. Yeah, and I will do that. In our session we discussed what the Mayor referred to as a bad contract. And the two reasons that he gave for referring to it, or characterizing as a bad contract was that the cost of the contract was excessive and it did not meet the solid waste management goals as adopted by the County of Hawaii last in 2009. In our discussion, many of the Council Members had questions about the way the cost comparison was done, the evaluation or analysis and whether it was potentially flawed and didn't really represent a true comparison of cost for mulching. Some of the other points that were brought up involved whether or not this contract met the solid waste management goals, which to our knowledge as a Council, it does. We clearly have a difference of opinion as to how the Council views the action by the Mayor; the cancellation of the contract under the termination for convenience clause the Mayor does in his analysis with the help of the Director of Environmental Management and Corporation Counsel. So, it's going to lead to future actions by this Council. I will be presenting as I said resolution at the next meeting but what we did learn in our Executive Session is that to our knowledge at this point and time the Council itself cannot reverse the termination notice. We as a body do not appear to have the ability to rescind the termination notice. So that is something that we did discuss during our Executive Session. There are other actions we may be able to take and I hope that the information that's been sent to the Mayor by parties out there, including our Senator Kai Kahele and our Representative Chris Todd, who encouraged the Mayor to reconsider his decision. His also been contacted or being contacted by members of the University College of Ag. So in our hope that he will reconsider we're maybe being as forceful as we possibly can, because we have visited with the Mayor. I personally have visited with the Mayor and let him know what my concerns are with his termination. So, in short there is a difference of opinion between the County Council and the administration on this particular cancellation of contract. And that was what we determined in our Executive Session. So, we're still a bit at odds. Thank you. Now moving on, can we call for the vote and put this motion, put this discussion to bed? All those in favor say "aye." Page 24 EMC-3 March 21, 2017 Vote on Comm. 116: The motion to close file on Comm. 116 was carried by the (Filed) following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Eoff, Kanuha, Lee Loy, Poindexter, Richards, Ruggles, and Chair O'Hara—9. Noes: None. Absent: None. Excused: None. ORDER OF The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, RESOLUTIONS: Order of Resolutions. (There were none.) BILLS FOR The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, ORDINANCE: Bills for Ordinances. (There were none.) ADJOURN- There being no further business, at 5:55 p.m., Mr. Richards moved to adjourn the MENT: meeting. Seconded by Ms. David and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Eoff, Kanuha, Lee Loy, Poindexter, Richards, Ruggles, and Chair O'Hara—9. Noes: None. Absent: None. Excused: None. CHR. O'HARA: We are adjourned. Approved: Ow de x12.7 11(47 Ms. Eileen O'Hara, Chair (Date) Environmental Management Committee EO/vc Page 24