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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMIN EMC 2018/05/21 2016-2018CALL TO ORDER: ROLL CALL: Present: STATEMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: COMMUNI- CATIONS: Committee on Environmental Management 12' Session Hawaii County Building 25 Aupuni Street Hilo, Hawaii May 21, 2018 The regular meeting of the Committee on Environmental Management was called to order at 9:45 a.m., in the Council Chambers, Hilo, by Ms. Eileen O'Hara, Chair. Ms. Eileen O'Hara, Chair Mr. Herbert M. "Tim" Richards, III, Vice Chair Mr. Aaron S. Y. Chung, Member Ms. Maile Medeiros David, Member Ms. Karen Eoff, Member Mr. Dru Mamo Kanuha, Member Ms. Susan L. K. Lee Loy, Member Ms. Valerie T. Poindexter, Member Ms. Jennifer Ruggles, Member The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, Statements from the Public on Agenda Items. The following individuals registered to speak and came forward when called by the Chair. Margaret Stacey: William K. Watkins: Bill 154 (Comm. 941), comment. Bill 154 (Comm. 941), in support. CHR. O'HARA: Clerk, could you read in our first communication on the agenda, Communication 929? The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, Communications. EMC -12 May 21, 2018 Comm. 929: NOMINATION OF JUSTIN PEQUENO TO THE ENVIRONMENTAL MANAGEMENT COMMISSION From Managing Director Wilfred M. Okabe, dated May 2, 2018, submitting for the Council's review and confirmation the above nomination. Requires Council Confirmation by: June 16, 2018 (Section 13-4(1), Hawaii County Charter) Motion to Approve: Ms. Lee Loy moved to recommend confirmation of the appointment of Mr. Justin Pequeno to the Environmental Management Commission. Seconded by Ms. Poindexter. CHR. O'HARA: I need to let the Council know that Mr. Pequeno was unable to make it. We received a communication from the Mayor's Office, he's off island and he will be available for the Council meeting, so, I decided to allow to move forward because three's a due date that has to approved by. Vote on Comm. 929: The motion to recommend confirmation of the appointment (Approved) of Mr. Justin Pequeno to the Environmental Management Commission was carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Eoff, Kanuha, Lee Loy, Poindexter, Richards, Ruggles, and Chair O'Hara — 9. Noes: None. Absent: None. Excused: None. Committee Members spoke in favor of the appointment. CHR.O'HARA: Clerk. ORDER OF The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, RESOLUTIONS: Order of Resolutions. (There were none.) BILLS FOR The Chair directed the Committee to proceed to the next order of business, ORDINANCES: Bills for Ordinances. Page 2 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 Bill 154: AMENDS CHAPTER 20, ARTICLE 3, SECTION 20-31, BY ADDING NEW DEFINITIONS AND SECTION 20-38, OF THE HAWAII COUNTY CODE 1983 (2016 EDITION, AS AMENDED) BY RENAMING, AMENDING AND ADDING NEW SUBSECTIONS AND SUBPARAGRAPHS Would extend the authority of the Department of Environmental Management to remove abandoned vehicles from certain private roadways in the interest of public health and safety. Reference: Comm. 941 Intr. by: Ms. O'Hara Motion to Approve: Ms. Ruggles moved to pass Bill 154 on first reading. Seconded by Mr. Kanuha. CHR. O'HARA: Alright, discussion on Bill 154? And I have Mr. Kucharski, if you could come forward, and officer, I believe you may be here for this as well. No, okay? Then good, I won't call you forward. I wasn't sure, just asking. Council, if anyone has questions? Ms. Ruggles. (Note: At this time, Department of Environmental Management Director William Kucharski came forward to address the members of the Committee.) MS. RUGGLES: Thank you. I actually don't have any questions, I just have an appreciation I would like to express. Thank you, Mr. Kucharski, for being so on it and helping the constituents like Mr. Watkins that came before us. There are a lot of associations that represent the same sentiments that Mr. Watkins shared with us, that they're actually doing really good things for the community. These roads are publicly traveled roads and they're used for emergency access routes like you described. And so, if they're ever blocked with abandoned vehicles, it could serve as a public safety hazard. So, I do believe that this is within the responsibility of the County to help take care of these abandoned vehicles, just like we have been for the past, I'm not sure how many years, 15 years. And that it was very concerning when the policy changed because a lot of constituents were calling us and asking us what to do with these abandoned vehicles now because they can't afford to remove them on their own. Puna actually serves as a bit of a dumping ground for abandoned vehicles, and so, we advised them the only way to get them moved is to take them onto a County roadway. So, that's all we could say and so now people were taking their abandoned vehicles, dropping them at a County roadway because that's all that they can afford, which also serves as a public safety hazard, which is why I think legislation like this is so important, and I'll be urging my colleagues to support it. Thank you. Page 3 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 CHR. O'HARA: Thank you, Ms. Ruggles. Ms. David. MS. DAVID: Yes, thank you, Chair. And I'd also like to say thank you for something that I think has been a real issue and problem not only in Puna but in the other well -dumped area, if you might consider that, which is Ocean View. I think we've had many discussions about that and whether—and it became a real issue when we were advised that the County could not enter upon private roadways. And for that, I want to thank Ms. O'Hara for bringing this forward. l have a question. So, this only applies to roadways, right? Private roadways in subdivisions? MR. KUCHARSKI: Bill Kucharski. Yes, roadways, and within 10 feet of the roadway, yes. MS. DAVID: I see. Okay, and I know we talked about the start of this or the period this bill takes effect and whether there would be a reason or a need for an amnesty period. Was that further considered? MR. KUCHARSKI: Yes. What we have done isamnesty is really for a single owner who has registration and who owns a vehicle. We have allowed them to notify us and then we can take that vehicle for disposal. What we have done as far as—for example, it was indicated that if they will tow the vehicle to the scrap dealers that we have contracted, the County will pay for the disposal cost, which is right now about $680 per vehicle, for disposal. Just for a little bit of clarity, the original bill that we have was based on section 290 from the HRS (Hawai`i Revised Statutes), and it gives two things, it gives a definition of where you can tow, according to this ordinance. In there it's very specific that it is for public property, public lands with setbacks, et cetera. It says if the County does not adopt this section with their own definition, then that definition has to hold. So, what this is doing is defining, under the authority of 290, for each county to define where they can tow to include the public roads. And I would say since everything is going nice, I'm never happy with what we're doing, I always like to do better. The reason this is happening is because we have so many communities that are not County roads. They're private because they have not built the roads to Code and we won't take them for that and that is what is the basic cause. If they were all County roads, we wouldn't have this problem, but since we don't, we are now going in and we can tow from those, once this ordinance, should you and your collective wisdom pass this, then we would be able to go back to them. What we had done previously was we didn't have the authority to tow from those. That's why it wasn't really a policy change, it was just taking a look at what the Code said and saying it doesn't give us that authority. Page 4 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 But, to go to the question, what we're doing now is if these private communities, they can either wait for this bill to pass then we can tow, or if they will tow them to the facilities, we will pay for the disposal. MS. DAVID: And they would pay for the towing? MR. KUCHARSKI: Yes. MS. DAVID: The owner would pay for the towing but the County, during this amnesty period, would pay for the disposal fee, the 600 some odd dollars? MR. KUCHARSKI: Yes. MS. DAVID: And once this this bill takes effect, if it's approved, then the amnesty period is over? MR. KUCHARSKI: Yes, and we would go in. Once the vehicle is left somewhere and abandoned, we still have an obligation to try and find the owner, to look at the VIN (Vehicle Identification Number), see who the last registered owner was and ensure that this vehicle is in fact abandoned and wasn't stolen, which is one of the reasons the police come in and check it and ticket initially to make that verification. Once that is done, yes, we will be able to go in and tow the way we have towed in the past and what we do on public highways. MS. DAVID: I see. And how does the recent State law regarding the 10 -day turn around period, how does that affect us here? Because I know it was a difficult thing because that 10 -day should not even apply to us given our geographic area, and distance, and timing wise, right? So how does that affect us? MR. KUCHARSKI: Well actually, it doesn't affect us much at all because the definition of abandoned means that the police have noticed, ticketed, waited the 24 hours, and then once we get notice that it's abandoned, we usually tow within five or six days. But if people thought that abandonment meant from the time the vehicle was left to the time it was towed, that's impossible to do that in 10 days. MS. DAVID: I see. Thank you for clarifying that. MR. KUCHARSKI: It has to be noted as abandoned before the 10 day start. That's my read, at least. MS. DAVID: Right, and I thinkI might have further questions, but you know what? I think I'm so happy about this because it's reallyI mean I've taken rides up in Ocean View, and I'm sure it's the same in Puna, cars appear overnight and it's a really dangerous situation too, especially on those skinny roads where they Page 5 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 just drop it, in fact on the roads sometimes, especially—that's what I'm hearing in Ocean View. So, I really commend you for being very cooperative and like the gentleman testified, you know, a can do. And I think people really appreciate the fact that it's not why we can't do it, but how can we work together to get something done to address a really dangerous and important issue for community safety. There's still the other issues about cars that's being pulled and dumped into other people's property. So, that's a separate issue in itself, but I think we got to tackle this in little bits. I think this is a huge small bite that I have to thank you and your department for working with all of us to address this really urgent matter. So, my congratulations and mahalos to you. I yield. MR. KUCHARSKI: Thank you. CHR. O'HARA: Thank you, Ms. David. Mr. Kanuha. MR. KANUHA: Thank you, Madam Chair. Aloha, Bill, thank you for bringing this up. As a testifier stated earlier, we have a serious problem with illegal dumping on Hawaii Island, and especially abandoned vehicles. Hopefully, this can help out the communities in the private neighborhoods, but can you give me kind of a background of the department and how they've been dealing with abandoned vehicles in these private subdivisions prior to this bill? Because I heard previously that the County was taking cars out of private subdivisions before and then stopped, and now this bill comes up. So, can you just give me a background of how the County was operating on that premise previously? MR. KUCHARSKI: Again, Bill Kucharski, DEM. My understanding is that when the bill first came out and was done, a decision was made, an administrative decision was made to tow everywhere. When we came in, we took a look at the law and said, we can't, we should not be violating the law as an agency, and the law did not give us the authority. The fact that we did not have authority before was overlooked. MR. KANUHA: So, how long was that going on as you stated? MR. KUCHARSKI: A lot of years. Long before. MR. KANUHA: So, we were violating the law, for the 15 years previously? MR. KUCHARSKI: I would just say we were extending our authority beyond what the law gave us. Page 6 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 MR. KANUHA: Okay. Interesting. I mean I'm just happy that there's an opportunity to correct, within the Code, at least a stateaccording to the State law, it gives us the option to go onto private roadways, subdivisions, and deal with this serious issue, hopefully. Am I'm correct in saying that the State gives us this ability to do this? MR. KUCHARSKI: Yes, sir. 290.1 says, "For the purposes of this section ... if it is defined to be abandoned by an ordinance of the county in which the vehicle is located." And then it says absence of such ordinance, the other ordinance—the language of limiting to public roadways exist. So, they give us their explicit and unambiguous authority to tow wherever the County wishes to tow. MR. KANUHA: Okay, I'm happy about that and I support this bill. Thank you for bringing this up. The only concern I have, and it's not about the bill, it's the actual department and their capacity to tow this additional, I don't even know how many abandoned vehicles there could possibly be in a lot of these areas that we haven't been servicing, but currently—how well does the department deal with abandoned vehicles currently and their capacity to tow them on public roadways? The problem I have isI mean like I said earlier, the big problem is the illegal dumping, period. But, the response by both the Department of Environmental Management and how fast maybe the Police Department can get to these cars and check them out to make sure that they're actually abandoned and not stolen or all of that. Because even in my community, on all of these public roads, it's just that I get complaints all the time about these cars being there forever, and they get noticed and it just takes a while. You say sometimes that the department may, after the police have marked them as abandoned, pick them up between five or six days, or I forget the number you used, but sometimes it's a lot longer than that. MR. KUCHARSKI: We are also taking a look at the process. Right now, the process is the Police Department gets a call. They go to the vehicle, they tag it, and then they have to come back within 24 hours to determine that the vehicle is still there so that it meets the definition of abandonment. Now, the police have a lot of things to do, as we all know, that they're under staffed, we have a big island and we have few police per square mile. For them to go back and do that, sometimes they can't get back for a day or two days or some period of time, and until we get the report from the police that it is certified abandoned, we cannot tow. So, we're taking a look at modifying that in some way and we're in discussion with the Police Department as far as going in and saying if you can ticket, can we go back in 24 hours after you've issued the ticket and verify it's there and then move to the towing. That's in discussion for process. I'm not sure if there's Page 7 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 anything that would have to be changed in the Police Code for this ticketing, but the only people that have the ability to issue the citations are the police. MR. KANUHA: Yeah and I don't want to make that as like top priority of the Police Department because there's so many things that the department does that I wouldn't want—yeah, we have to figure out how to work that angle. But, also currently, there aren't any rules and procedures for the removal, or are you guys it says with this provision, one of the sections (c), or in (c), it says that you're going to promulgate rules and procedures for the removal of abandoned vehicles. MR. KUCHARSKI: Well we're going to have to, and I will express my ignorance as to whether we have procedures that are listed. Formal rules, I don't believe we have, however, the abandoned vehicle bill that was just passed on, I don't know whether the governor has signed or what the status of that is, but that requires that each county prepare the rules by which you notify the owner of the vehicle that it's been towed. The bill that was in the State removed any notification requirements to the owner, but it says that they have 20 days to recover the vehicle. But, they removed all the notifications requirements to notify them that their vehicle was taken, and that was one of the comments that we made to them. So, they said okay, the bill now says that each county is going to have to create their own regulations for notification. So, we're going to have to come out with rules once that bill is active in any case. So, this would just be—can be an add on to that. MR. KANUHA: Okay. I think at this time I'll yield, but I support this bill and again, thanks for bringing it forward. MS. O'HARA: Thank you, Mr. Kanuha. Mr. Chung. MR. CHUNG: Bill, so let me get this straight. Your department has been removing vehicles all of these years and what we're doing is now just codifying what your department has been doing beyond the scope of its authority? MR. KUCHARSKI: Yes, sir. MR. CHUNG: Okay. You know, I have no problem with this. I mean I have some concerns about going on private property, but as the gentleman who spoke here earlier said, it was a collaborative effort and he was so encouraged by what he had seen. In deference to that, I'll support this. Quite frankly, realistically and practically speaking, I don't think anyone will call us on it even if it is improper. That would mean somebody would have to file some kind of derivative lawsuit against the county for misuse of public funds, if it ever got that far. So again, realistically, I think it addresses a very pressing need in some of those outlying Page 8 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 areas. But what I would like to see is, I need a copy of that act that you referenced. What is it? MR. KUCHARSKI: 290-1. MR. CHUNG: And it was passed this year? MR. KUCHARSKI: No, this was the original bill and I'm not sure when that was passed. MR. CHUNG: Okay, if I could get a copy of that. MR. KUCHARSKI: I can provide it for you as soon as I'm off the table. MR. CHUNG: Thank you. Thank you very much. MR. KUCHARSKI: One thing I might add that—one of the questions was why it said in the bill, designated—it says left unattended, certain private roadways in the amendment in the beginning in the descriptor in Section 1 and that's primarily because if you have a gated community, that's private roadways, and I don't think it's appropriate that we go into a gated community, only those private roadways that have access from the general public. And that's to answer that question. In my mind, I didn't draft this, but in my mind, the certain private roadways is a reference to—there are private roadways that are not covered by this. MS. O'HARA: Okay, any other questions or comments? Seeing none, I'd like to wrap up with some comments. I have some personal background here with this bill. So you asked, Mr. Kanuha, you asked Mr. Kucharski some questions that he did his best to provide the answers, but I was in the Department of Environmental Management when we made that decision to do private roads. It was at that time, a discretionary policy by the director, in 2002 or 2003, and the attorneys seemed to feel it was within the scope of the State law at the time, and so, we now have a different legal opinion on that and the need to codify it. But, we have been doing it for 15 years. We received the communication, I believe around March 1 that the department was going to cease to remove abandoned vehicles from private roads because they had looked at the law again. I think what brought that up is there were changes to the State law requiring the shorter time notification and that made them look at it very closely. They realized that it was more appropriate that we codify how we wish to remove vehicles on this island, under the abandoned vehicle program, which, by the way, is well funded through and addition to your car registration. So, it's one of those few programs we have that is well funded. Page 9 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 So, we can continue to do what we had been doing for 15 years once we get this codified. It will go from here to the Environmental Management Commission and will may have some further tweaks before it comes back to us. One of the things that we've been under discussion with the department and their attorneys is how to properly sign on private roads. At first, it was thought we would need a schedule somewhat like the schedule that we have in our Code for traffic signals, which is onerous and difficult, and hard to keep up. I didn't think that approach would be necessary, but we need to hash that out a little bit. You bring up the fact of gated communities and we have a testimony from someone who, I don't know if she lives in the gated community, but she identified one where the gates are left open during the day and shut only at night. So, not all gated communities have gates that are 24 hours. So, we need to look at that in either the amendments or the promulgation of rules as we move forward with this bill. But, this is a very much needed bill and we're already getting problems in my district, Ms. Ruggles' district, and you heard from Ms. David, and we have quite a few testimonies from Ocean View. So, we really need to move forward with this and get it on its path. Thank you. MR. KANUHA: Madam Chair? CHR. O'HARA: Sure, go ahead. MR. KANUHA: Thank you. Just real quickly. I know the testifier brought up and you brought up and Mr. Kucharski brought up that in the language, section one, to remove abandoned vehicles from certain private roadways, I think the question was, will the departmentI know you stated that certain roadways means open to the public, or I mean that you'll go on to these roadways that are open to the public, but it would exclude those that are gated. I mean I know is that a discretionary type of thing from the department? Because certain private roadways within the definition could mean a lot of different things. I think the testifier asked that because they don't want to have that discretion to say we're going to exclude Ocean View or something because there's the discretionary language inside here. So, I think that's kind of where that testifier was coming from. It's a good question to bring up. So, how do you deal with that discretionary language? Or is there a definition? MR. KUCHARSKI: Bill Kucharski. Yeah, actually in the definition it does state that it's an ungated community with roadways available to the public. So, that's in that definition, but we also have some areas, like for instance, let's say Waipi`o Valley with a 10 -degree slope that you can hardly drive a vehicle up, never mind towing a vehicle. It may be that is an area that we cannot get to. So, there's discretion in there for the manager of the AV (Abandoned Vehicle) to say, look, this isn't safe, we can't tow from here. Page 10 EMC -12 May 21, 2018 MR. KANUHA: Could that maybe be put into the rules? MR. KUCHARSKI: Yes, sir. The intent would be really to flush this out when the rules come out. MR. KANUHA: Thank you, Madam Chair. CHR. O'HARA: Alright, seeing any more discussion? Go ahead, Ms. David. Vote on Motion to Ms. David moved to refer Bill 154 to the Environmental Refer: Management Director and Environmental Management (Approved) Commission. Seconded by Ms. Ruggles and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Eoff, Kanuha, Lee Loy, Poindexter, Richards, Ruggles, and Chair O'Hara — 9. Noes: None. Absent: None. Excused: None. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, I think that completes all the items on the Environmental Management Committee agenda for today. Can I have a motion to adjourn? ADJOURN- There being no further business, at 10:29 a.m., Ms. Poindexter moved to adjourn MENT: the meeting. Seconded by Ms. Eoff and carried by the following voice vote: Ayes: Committee Members Chung, David, Kanuha, Lee Loy, O'Hara, Poindexter, Richards, Ruggles, and Chair Eoff — 9. Noes: None. Absent: None. Excused: None. CHR. O'HARA: Okay, we're adjourned. Approved: Ms. Eileen O'Hara, Chair. Environmental Management Committee EO/j m (Date) Page 11