Loading...
HomeMy WebLinkAbout2019 09-10 Game Management Advisory Commission Minutes Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 Game Management Advisory Commission County of Hawaii Minutes Meeting Date: September 10, 2019 Time: 6:30 p.m. Place: Hawaii County Building – Council Chambers I. CALL TO ORDER/ROLL CALL: Meeting was called to order at 6:30 pm. Stanley Mendes, District 1 – excused Kean Umeda, District 2 – here James O’Keefe - District 3 – present Naniloa Pogline, District 4 - here Abraham Antonio, District 5 - here Grayson Hashida - District 6 - present Bronsten-Glenn “Kalei” Kossow, District 7 - excused Teresa Nakama, District 8 – here George Donev, District 9 – present Quorum established ALSO PRESENT: Malia Hall, Corporation Counsel Donna Urban-Higuchi, Executive Assistant to Mayor Kim GUESTS: Kanalu Sproat, DOFAW Wildlife Biologist, Hawaii Island Tony Sylvester, Past GMAC Commission member Mark Crivello, 3C Goat Grazing CALL TO ORDER: NP: The meeting will come to order at 6:32p. Donna are you there? GH: This is Grayson. Negative. She stepped out to check her email. NP: What? Who’s gonna do roll call. OK. I guess I’m gonna have to do roll call. I’m standing in for Kalei – he had to change districts so he no longer can be a commissioner or then Chair. So Vice Chair had to come to the rescue. Yeah... OK. Just be patient with me. But I do want to really thank Kalei. I think he did an awesome job and I wish he was here to thank him. He held the torch for 1 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 us, you know, I think he did a really, really great job. And I just wanted to read our charter – just to refresh us all on the Game Management Advisory Commission. It is for the benefit of present and future generations – the Game Management Advisory Commission shall advise county, state and federal agencies on matters relating to the preservation of subsistence hunting and fishing, as well as protecting traditional and cultural gathering rights and we were voted into existence on the ballot thanks to heroes like Tony Sylvester – remember back in the day, huh, Tony? We were holding signs on the roadside to get people to vote for it on the ballot and the public voted it in to existence which I’m thankful for. OK. So, um, let’s do the approval of minutes for July 30. Anybody want to move to approve the minutes? APPROVAL OF MINUTES: TN: This is Teresa in Kona. Move to approve. JO: I’ll second. FINANCIAL REPORT: NP: Abraham Antonio moved for approval of the August 31, 2019 financial report as submitted. Seconded by George Donev and carried unanimously by voice vote. I just want to say something that I’ve always wanted to say – I’m really thankful to the Mayor for giving us a budget – that we have this facility and we have these really great people helping us and working for us -really wonderful ladies – they’re just so perfect and I just want to give thanks for that. So anybody want to move to approve the financial report? NP: Cory would you like to come up and give testimony? State your full name. STATEMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: CH: Cory Harden – just a few comments on the herbicide management on Mauna Kea. I’m hoping that DLNR will consider alternative herbicides. There’s a whole lot of things in my yard – they use a vinegar spray – works great – I’ll just get a bottle of vinegar from KTA and dump it – it works. They have some kind of cinnamon spray that also works – your whole place smells like cinnamon but it worked. You can use goats, you know, if they’re confined to – as you guys know as you’re always pointing out they do keep the grass down. Hot water will work. I hope DLNR will talk about other things besides spraying Roundup – I’m sure we’ve all seen in the news the people suing for having got cancer – we don’t really need our state taxpayers paying out after people get cancer up there, yeah, OK, thank you. 2 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 NP: Thank you very much – those are good points. Doesn’t salt also work? Putting salt on weeds. JO: Yes, invading armies used to do that a lot, yes. PRESENTATION: Kanalu Sproat will be presenting DLNR/DOFAW plans for the expansion and herbicidal management of fire breaks on Mauna Kea NP: We have our West Hawaii Biolgist – Kanalu Sprout – who will be giving us a slide show. MH: He’s gonna put it on to the – he’s gonna put a PowerPoint up so you can see it. KS: I’m gonna open the JPEGs too - There’s been a lot of concern and legitimate concern about potential fuel loads and fire – wild fire potential on Mauna Kea and especially with the reduction in sheep and other things and so we are doing some fire break expansions, I guess, or anyways, we’re mowing the grasses on the fire breaks and if you look at this map – the red was a trial that we did last year where they mowed and then ten feet on either side of the fire break they did use herbicide, um, I think it was Honcho Horgar Roundup and Garlon and taking that vegetation down to bare mineral soil and so that red line – that’s firebreak 4 – and so that was the test that they did and so I’ll show some pictures of the results of that in a minute here, but we intend to do that on the rest of the firebreaks – so those blue lines there are one, firebreak 3, R14 and R13 and so I guess what we just wanted to get input and we got some just now, as well, which we appreciate but some more input from you guys about the amount that we’re cutting back – if it’s acceptable or if it’s too much or whatever and, of course, comments on the types of herbicides we use or how much. So I’m just gonna go scroll through some pictures real quick. ?: Yeah, I just wanted to add that there’s a combination of treatments that we’re looking at doing, um, what we’d really like to do if the terrain allows it is to be able to clear on each side of the roads and then mow it with our tractors so that that would just be a fuels – keep the grass low – that should help the bird hunting as well and then keep the vegetation from encroaching on the roads because if we do get a fire start in there – the condition of the roads presently makes it hard for us to stop it on those roads because they’re so overgrown. TN: Could you tell us what area of Mauna Kea this is – is it above Camp Kilohana? So hunters’ check station above Kilohana? 3 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 KS: Yes, above Kilohana check station. TN: How far does the road go? KS: I’m not sure how much all of the roads are – but I know the treatments that were proposed is 7 ½ miles and so they’ve already done just mowing on 7 ½ miles and then the treatment with herbicide was one mile. So 8 ½ miles total. There’s more roads in that – but that’s the areas that we tend to do the treatments on. KS: So these are all after pictures of what the treatment with the herbicide looks like after we cut back. In the email that I sent earlier – I don’t have one on this, I’m sorry, but there is a before but I don’t have it right now for everybody to see, I apologize, um, but this right here is the Firebreak 4 from the bottom looking up that has been cleared back quite a ways and herbicide down to bare mineral soil, um, and all of these pictures are of that Firebreak 4 of that treatment. Any other questions? Any other concerns? TN: Is this the area you said you was gonna contact me so I can go take a look at what you guys... KS: Yes... I’m sorry we didn’t have time to get up there... TN: Yeah, I never got a call... KS: But we haven’t done anything extra yet, so... We still need to work that out. So this treatment was from a year ago and, but, we haven’t done anything new but I do intend to go up there with you and I’m sorry I haven’t yet. TN: Thank you. Cause I’d love to be up there. KS: So I will give you a call - we haven’t done anything new since I talked to you so we haven’t just gone forward with it, um, so we will get you up there. GH: Grayson from District 6 what kind of environmental impact does the herbicide have versus mowing? KS: I think, you know herbicides – if we can minimize the amount of herbicide that we use up there that’s our preferred method, um, initially we’ll have to do a little bit of mulching of some of the shrubs and vegetation along the roads to open it up but an added benefit of the mowing is that we feel like it’ll improve bird habitat, especially along the roads and then also because of the soils are so fine up there if you continue to herbicide certain areas then you get a lot of dust problems so that’s another reason we’d like to minimize the herbicide and just be able to mow as much as possible. 4 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 TN: This is Teresa in Kona – so have you considered using Mark Driveller? Is there with his goat project and have you considered using this control method of using goats? KS: I actually met with Mark this morning and Wil Okabe and we had a discussion about that and, ah, we’re gonna be talking more and seeing where Mark’s capabilities will be beneficial to us. So we’re in discussions about that now. TN: That’s great. So the financial benefit for you folks is it feasible for you folks to use Mark than continued use of herbicide? KS: That’s something that we’re looking into because his method is similar to mowing but it’s not use of herbicides so we would be interested in talking more about – with Mark and seeing how much it costs and those sort of things. TN: Thank you very much. That’s great. NP: I’ve seen the firebreaks in Puuwaawaa and they actually are quite significant when you see ‘em face to face and in Puuwaawaa they seemed heavily herbicide treated to me with all the blue dye, you know, marking where the herbicide has been put so they can see it and, um, it seemed like heavy use of herbicide, in my opinion, so I guess it’s all a matter of opinion of what is heavy use and what is light use of herbicide so that’s... KS: We do document the amount and how often we use it, we are following the labels... NP: Maybe over there it’s more heavily used because it’s rock not dust – would that – maybe they’re doing it go lighter because of the dust issue... KS: Yeah, and mowing is not really an option... so that’s why we have the cattle in the areas as well to reduce the fuels. NP: But cattle – they do more root damage than goat and sheep I would think – to ohia and whatever’s up there? Don’t they – they’re heavy... KS: They’re heavier animals... NP: Yes, pounding on the roots... I think you should use goat and sheep... Anyway, but I do like cattle and I love the wild paniola also so... And the firebreaks that, you know, when you’re using herbicide, I mean, I can’t think how you can possibly avoid affecting some native and also endangered species even like if they’re small, um, what are your concerns there of using herbicide – where there’s native or endangered species in your path? 5 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 KS: I mean, we’re not going to herbicide endangered species – I would say that, as part of this project we’re trying to minimize the amount of herbicide that we would use and ideally we’d be able to mow all of those roads on each side. NP: A combination deal, just recently Germany banned Glyphosate and probably all of the above because they’ve found evidence that those chemicals were killing their pollinators, so they banned it and I know U.S. Fish & Wildlife is – did they already put the 49 more species on the Endangered Species list that they’ve been working on? They had 49 more that they were trying to put on the list... And it was a few years ago and I don’t know where that’s progressed but on that list there were several bees – native bees and I’m just wondering if that’s a concern with areas that are heavily protected like that you’re dealing with... ?: I mean we’re concerned about all species not just endangered species so, I mean, if we can minimize the impact to the ecosystem – that’s our goal. KS: The purpose of the action is to protect the area from... NP: Fire... JO: Would take all species... KS: Right... TN: This is Teresa in Kona. Besides using the possibility of the goats and your mowing method what other alternatives would you folks have in the field of herbicide that is not so detrimental to, you know, humans and animals and our plants and species up there. Have you looked into other areas of alternatives? ?: I think we’re open to suggestions if you have any ideas. TN: Have you experimented with other alternatives? Anything? ?: No. I’m just curious what the other alternatives are that you’re referencing cause these are kind of the tools that we’ve been using so if there’s something else out there we’d like to know about it. TN: Have you used just home remedies like, you know, vinegar and water and Clorox and water and – I don ‘t know what the chemical compounds are of the household use but have you tried experimenting if these items would work on the grassy area in... ?: I have not... 6 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 TN: That target area..Would you consider it? ?: If it works and it accomplishes the same goal – we’d consider anything. NP: Who makes the decisions, ultimately on this? ?: Well, I would... NP: You have the power to make these decisions. TN: So would you consider trying and experimenting with other alternative use. ?: Yeah, I just would like more details on what you’re proposing. KS: We probably would do a literature review as well, cause I’m sure this type of stuff has been tested before. So we would, I mean, could we test it again, maybe, but, I mean, like Steve was saying – a little more details from you guys but at the same time we would do a literature review ourselves of what has been published in peer reviews – scientific papers about this type of action TN: I’m just a homemaker and I make my own herbicides using vinegar, water and Clorax solution and they kill my weeds but, of course, I don’t have the expenses that you have so, I’m not a scientist I just know what works so the little weeds I used to have I no longer have, but, you know, they keep growing back anyway so... It’s what I apply every 3 months, but, you know, it’s something that is on the Internet and it works, but, you may have a different approach because of regulations though. I was just wondering if you could experiment. Thanks. NP: I do have a comment from the public that was sent in to me via email from Richard Hoeflinger – as far as the firebreak expansion activities – he says he hopes it won’t occur during the fall game bird hunting season or the spring turkey hunting season, which occur in November thru January and March thru mid-April respectively. He said, um, Mauna Kea fall season bird hunters have only 50 days of hunting opportunity – half that available to their mainland counterparts. The spring turkey season is 45 days in length – it would be unfortunate to have that limited hunting opportunity further diminished by brush control activities. I bring this matter up because of past hunting interruption activities. I recall planned aerial eradication flights during a past spring turkey season and last year my turkey hunt in Kaohe Restoration Area was interrupted by a convoy of vans transporting tree planters. Such interference is a result of poor planning or no planning. It is hoped DLNR will do a better job of coordinating mutually interfering activities such as large 7 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 scale brush whacking during bird hunting season. So would you take this into consideration in your schedule? SB: We’re not gonna be up there mowing and mulching while people... are trying to hunt NP: During the season... SB: I spoke to him this morning. NP: Wow, he’s doubling up on me. SB: I received that email as well. KS: And the action doesn’t close the mountain to the users the way that aerial eradication does either – but we’ll do as Steve said. NP: I have had a comment from a bird hunter that the mowing of the fire breaks is very preferable for bird hunters because he said that’s where it’s become the better bird hunting – the fire breaks that are mowed. SB: Yes, that’s our hope. NP: Yes. He was concerned. AA: Abraham District 5. I not familiar with the area so what kind of resources is in in that area – like is it just for birds or is there anymore mammals – is it the pallia habitat area? SB: It is in the palila core critical habitat, there are some pigs – still some sheep but the main thing up there is game bird hunting, yeah. AA: My thing would be but you just kinda answered that question that being the palila habitat would be introduce more sheep back in there. ?: Right. AA: You answered your own question in a way. The other one is by looking at these photos – \[unclear\] can do majority of just with the brush mowers – with the lawn mowers – you know, like the County get? SB: We purchased one of those and we can all thank Mr. Hurt helping us with getting the funding for that. Right on Mr. Hurt. But that’s our hope. There’s certain area that the terrain won’t allow mowing but for the most... 8 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 ?: You can see in this one picture – you can see it’s clearly all grass and then you can see like one rock out lava cropping that’s, you know, pretty obvious, you know, you guys cannot do ‘em all, so how much of the area will you guys actually be Rounduping or, well... SB: Like I said our hope is that we can do 95% of it by mowing because we’re accomplishing fuels reductions but we’re also providing habitat for the game birds also. ?: Right. ?: So with that habitat with the game birds – I’m not a game bird hunter but as long as I’ve been on this committee we’ve had – and you guys have been here too – we have quite a few bird hunters that came in and they were complaining that the only best place is near by the road but what about out in the fields where the dogs go out and run and the grass is so thick and you guys got any plans for that or no just let the grass grow wild... KS: We do some mowing, um... ?: But only by the roads... KS: We do some out into the field – just the terrain is pretty rough to be going galavanting all over the place with a machine to mow and we will be doing a little bit more in the next couple of months before bird season but it’s like trying to empty the ocean... NP: I’m sure of it. ?: It’s kinda like right on you guys doing more – trying to increase the habitat along the roadside but we get guys that coming in here and complaining that that’s all they get. And it’s just like us hunting in the forest – we get all the fences and eradication came in and you know, me, personally, I can see the difference in the game that I \[unclear\] – the resources \[unclear\] be getting smaller and skinnier and I seen this the last couple of years versus before the fence came up and had nice healthy game – and now it’s like going down and, you know, right where the fences are. And I personally see that for myself. So as far as with the game bird guys is like right on you guys, I support the resources next to the road but what about the guys that actually like drift off the road and tae their hunt more into the grasslands and stuff that is too thick for them that, you know, that’s what they’re saying. SB: We do some mowing out into that grassland stuff but the amount is kinda negligible. 9 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 ?: So basically we could go and some way and how we could go and reinvestigate this whole palila thing which probably might not happen in my lifetime because I think I’m the youngest one – no maybe George – right? And maybe we can go and re-sheep back in there and maybe control all our problems because we get researchers from Richard that you guys work with him and stuff like that and say the sheep is a valued resource not only to the hunters and the land but also to the palila bird cause I read ‘em – is like they take the wool and then they make the nest – keeps the eggs warmer and you know, so... Somehow, some way maybe you guys can go and re-look at that or something. SB: That would be a very... ?: A wonderful thing? KS: A reversal of a federal court order so it would take a lot. ?: Maybe we can find some scientist out there somewhere that could re-look at it and then re-evaluate the whole thing. GD: Donev – District 5. Just a quick question. I was wondering if you may be able to look into any types of like specific genetic targeting pesticides if using pesticide is determined to be the solution needed although mowing sounds like a good alternative but I thought I’d bring this up anyway. I know that in some certain rainforests specific pesticides are used on ginger to control it and it can only impact certain species of ginger, um, because of the way it targets the genes, um, if I’m not mistaken I don’t think there’s any mono-cods \[sp?\] plants that are native to this Island – I could be wrong about that – but maybe there’s something like that for grasses that are mono-cods that could control. I’m not sure. SB: They have grass specific herbicides so if there’s areas where it’s just grass then that’s what we would use to target those grasses. TN: Kanalu – the program that allows you folks to mow – is this the protection of the palila bird funding. KS: We use some of that funding for that but we also use Pittman-Robertson Game Grant monies for that so PR – it’s a federal grant and we also use some Wildlife Revolving Funds for it as well. TN: So the guidelines would allow you to use other alternatives like sheep? KS: Probably not but, I’m not sure. But I mean that area is a palila core critical habitat where we’re not allowed to have sheep so... And by a federal court order so and if we’re using federal monies then no... 10 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 TN: What does the determination not to have sheep in the area in the order that was, um, you know, that you had to follow to protect the palila bird – what was this – what was stated that no sheep could be in the area and for what reason? KS: Because of the degradation to the forest over time and the loss of habitat for palila over time by sheep and other ungulates – that’s what – so, I mean, yeah, so they eat the forest down too and the habitat is lost to a point where we got sued – the State got sued and we lost three times, um, and we got rid of the sheep. KU: This is Kean in District 2 – I guess the eradication been going on for forty plus years – the palila habitat as well as the numbers of palila – forty years – has it increased or has it declined – the palila. The numbers are declining... KU: So maybe there’s a point that maybe we gotta look at – maybe something is not correct with what we’re doing – that habitat might be too much, you know, the aeras that you guys are trying to mow – but the places that you mowing is not the where they live – it’s – the mamane trees – am I correct? KS: The places that we mow – they do live in that area and we are taking some of the mamane for a fire break because think fire is the biggest threat. KU: The sheep destroyed the mamane and now we’re taking the mamane to stop the fire... KS: Stop the fire. Just along those fire breaks, yes. The sheep didn’t only live on the fire breaks. KU: Kinda interesting that maybe the biologist that made this find – maybe they’re wrong – maybe we need to bring a few number – maybe we can make a test plot in that area with sheep and control the numbers and see if we control the fire fuels and see if the palila can thrive instead of taking the palila and relocating them – from what I understand. I think, you know, at this point with the number declining I’d like to see the palila, you know, thrive – but I think we’re failing at that and we’re failing at, you know, t his whole fire fuel cause that mountain – I don’t believe you can mow that whole mountain – I truly don’t believe that. SB: Our intention isn’t to mow the whole mountain so there’s – this particular area has the highest fuel loads on the whole mountain and I would say even though the palila hasn’t recovered – the forest has – extensively throughout my career – the last 30 years I’ve seen extensive regrowth of the forest and certain begetation that I never saw before is coming back – so we recognize 11 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 and understand the fact that if you look at the number of palila they’re still going down even though we’ve been doing this for all these decades – we recognize that as well. KU: And what would be the solution – in your opinion? SB: I don’t know – I have people tell me that the recovery of the bird is gonna take time because there’s a time lag between it – I don’t know. JO: This is James. Kanalu you said we couldn’t do a test plot, for instance, up there – because anytime federal monies are involved that’s a restricted to have them there – does that mean that it could be done with State monies? KS: Honestly, I don’t know. SB: We haven’t gotten to that point yet – that’s a discussion I got to have with more people to see if that’s a possibility or not. JO: OK. Thank you. TN: This is Teresa in Kona. Could you describe exactly what do you mean by extensive re-growth of the forest – what has come back that wasn’t’ there in abundance before – particularly the shrubs, the trees... SB: There’s a lot of shrubs, there’s a lot more mamane, um, there’s a lot more ohelo than I ever saw before – geraniums, um, we’ve got silver swords – there’s just a lot of vegetation that I didn’t notice before. TN: So what kind of shrubs have you seen come back? SB: Ohelo, geraniums, the pukiawe aren’t round anymore... TN: Have you folks started a replanting project? SB: We did an extensive reforestation when I first started and then with the reductions in the number of animals the forest has been recovering on its own – but we’re still doing mamane restoration with Kanalu’s program. TN: Is there other trees other than mamane being planted? KS: They do some naio and they do some koa and probably some aalii as well, um, yes. There’s other plants as well... TN: Have you done iliahi and uhi uhi and kawila and, um, maua, I mean those... 12 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 KS: There’s a lot – iliahi yes. I don’t think we’re doing maua and kawila or anything like that on the mountain but iliahi, yes... TN: Is there any, gosh, it eludes me, I’m sorry. When it comes back to me I’ll ask you... NP: Well, the point is is that at one time the sheep were unmanaged and their populations – because they were unmanaged and the hunters weren’t allowed to hunt as much as the population and they did get way out of control and they did – at one point – ravage the whole mountain – but it was because they’re weren’t managed and so, that’s the whole point, I mean, for the sheep to be so incriminated because they weren’t properly managed at one time to this day seems extreme punishment for all interest groups so, not – that’s just a comment on the mandate – not on you guys, of course, yeah, so – to be noted – to be fair – that needs to be taken into consideration, I feel... All right if there’s any other questions. ? One last one just to kinda break the ice – so if the sheep and stuff is the main problem – can we look into like – because now I seeing more and more llamas – maybe we can introduce another type of grazer. NP: The mandate is not against malama... ?: Maybe we can release some alpacas or something – just to break the ice, you know, maybe there’s something else – some other – that’s another resource, right... NP: That’s a great idea. ?: Yeah, you learn the sheep is problem is look for another doing game management. Thank you. NP: I have just one more thing I wanted to say. So you’re trying to use herbicide, glyphosate Garlon at a minimal, um, according to your interpretation of minimal but, yet, there – herbicides are being used along the fences – correct? To keep the grasses down on the fences. I’m just saying that herbicides are being used for other purposes on the mountain besides fire breaks such as around plantings or? Are they not? SB: We don’t use too much herbicides - the only other thing that we would be using herbicides up here is to help control the fountain grass that’s spreading in the area. NP: I’m just saying that herbicides are a tool that is being used for multiple purposes on the mountain. True? Not true? 13 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 SB: We use herbicides for some of our work. NP: OK. TN: The name of the plant came to me... So if I go down my list then Kanalu – you folks have tried replanting kawila, uhi, lama, maua, ohai ula, halapepe and the aalii? KS: I don’t think we’ve done any maua, any lama up there. Uhi uhi I don’t think so. Halapepe up there? No... That stuff has been done in Puuwaawaa but on Mauna Kea – no. TN: Would you consider planting it up there again? SB: It’s outside of their range. KS: That’s not where they naturally occur... TN: They occur at different elevations? Is that too high? KS: I don’t know if it’s because it’s too high, too cold or what, but it’s just not where they occur so... TN: Thank you. Tony Sylvester will discuss the relationship between herbicide use and soil biology. NP: I really appreciate you guiys making yourselves available to us. Seriously, I really appreciate it and thank you so much for helping us out – to helping us to understand – really appreciate you guys helping us to understand and giving us information and your willingness. Thank you so much. All right, so, um, our next guest speaker is our favorite – Tony Sylvester, yes, I’m sorry. TS: Aloha. Thank you for having me. NP: But he’s going to discuss soil biology research related to herbicide use. Correct? TS: I have a few questions first off, though, if I can ask them some questions? NP: Please. TS: Some of the herbicides that they listed is a broad spectrum so I was wondering how you target a specific species of weed if you’re using broad spectrum – that would be one question. And then what are you guys doing for 14 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 herbicide drip – cause I think that’s the biggest thing in herbicide use especially in agricultural industry and stuff so if’ you’re up there on the mountain and it’s, you know, most farms it’s ten miles an hour or greater – the machine’s automatically deactivate and only water start spraying out and so forth – I was wondering if any of those type of things – are you guys doing mechanical? Hand spraying? So some of the techniques, I think more, I mean, if there’s more general information – I would be interested to know how you guys are gonna be doing these kind of things – and if you monitor for that – because herbicide drift is the bad one cause of what’s gonna happen is you’re gonna get lot overspray into other areas and so forth and it seems to be a lot more breezy up in the mountains too and then also mowing – are you guys gonna be widening the road and is any permits or impact study need to be done when you guys are doing this type of work – as a pretty sensitive area right now and then, of course, what are the target species that you are actually gonna try to treat – I would like to know that and then then the type of mowing equipment – and I think you answered what percent will be mowed versus herbicide – I think that’s a good number to know and as far as hunting – you can can’t hunt along the roadways – I mean it’s nice when you can see birds, I guess, along the roadway, but I think it’s 50 yards from a roadway, yeah, so, I mean, even though the grass is nice along the roadway – you can’t hunt there anyway and then they go into the thicker grass so for me it doesn’t really make much a difference other than seeing wildlife is nice but I don’t think it really benefits hunting in that sense, unless the birds really hang out and feed along those areas – so just some of those questions, I mean, if you guys can answer that then I’ll talk a little bit about what I wanted to talk about – about soil biology. NP: Did one of your want to answer those questions for Tony? KS: I thought we were done. NP: Sorry... KS: Kanalu Sproat, DLNR, DOFAW, we use a broad targeting herbicide because it gets everything and we’re treating it for firebreaks so we want little or no vegetation so that there’s no fuel to carry a fire – so that’s why we’re using the broad spectrum herbicides, um, as far as, yeah, if it’s – I don’t know – do we say less than 10 miles an hour – I know we do – if it’s too windy we don’t spray at all, um, we use backpack sprayers – we have a spray rig attached to the back of the truck with a tank and, but, yeah, if it’s too windy so – like a lot of times we do spare roads in Puuanahulu and we pretty much can only spray in them morning because by lunch it’s blowing and it’s a one – you know, one trip out there but I don’t know if it’s specifically ten miles an hour or not but it’s, well, that’s gonna go too far – so we don’t spray, um, what else did you have on there – that was a lot of questions. 15 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 TS: One percent is mowed versus herbicide – \[unclear\] 90 or 95% or something like that? KS: It’s what we’re shooting for... TS: And then the target species you said basically whatever is there so it doesn’t... KS: We don’t want vegetation or at least we don’t want high vegetation cause we’re trying to stop a fire from moving through... TS: And then widening the road in any way or is that any impact or anything – you guys have... Is that something... KS: We’re not widening the road... TS: Any fire breaks when they do that, I mean, you just go in there and you doze – what if there’s cultural sites and things like that, I mean, the grasses and brush is tall. I’ve often wondered that so – I mean not putting it on you guys because of this particular thing you guys are doing but just in general, I mean... KS: Yeah, we’re not doing any machines to push and widen the road – so we’re just using the mower and attachment to take the vegetation down and you know, the mulching – but we’re not widening any roads or anything like that. And then you question about hunting along the road – that’s from a public highway or road – so the roads within the hunting area – you can hunt right off of the road. KS: But that’s from, a public highway or a county road or something like that – you cannot hunt within \[unclear\] feet of that. ?: So, if you say, and we get one DLNR officer come by and... KS: This is recorded? You know what – let me sit down and go look at the road and \[unclear\] I’ll come back and correct myself. ?: So if I was a hunter and if anybody else \[unclear\] you know – get Steve over there and the DLNR guy going come and he going say, eh, you cannot do that over there... SH: Steve Hurt with Big Island Bird Hunters. OK. The hunting from a road I helped Ron Bachman and Joey Mello when this came up originally – it came out where they wanted the buffer on all roads. No. Cause any fire break would fall under that category. The word “paved” was inserted and that’s the law – that 16 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 passed. There’s everything right here and there otherwise nothing – it would just been about eliminated on Mauna Kea. One word did it all. Any questions? NP: Thank you for clarifying. KS: Anything else? TS: No, I think that’s it as far as that. What I have is just something I wanted to share and it was a presentation at the University – back in April. And I’m just gonna read it – it’s a little bit of notes but I posted it for I think if you saw this and all that – I just thought it was really interesting and it’s – the topic of that night was what is slowing forest restoration at Hakalau Forest National Wildlife Refuge and this was by Dr. Evans from the University of California, Santa Barbara, and the project – it started nearly 30 years ago and the managers at Hakalau Forest National Wildlife Refuge planted 400,000 acacia koa trees in abandoned pastures to facilitate forest regeneration. Their goal was to restore native forests in order to increase native bird populations at an altitude where avian malaria is rare. While planting trees – the planted trees seems to grow well – there have been very little natural recruitment of native understory plants, you know, pilo and so forth and in this talk Dr. Evan will discuss the various barriers that inhibited the development of native forest. So, ah, some of the key notes I got out of it is – the barriers that inhibit the native forest development was the lack of seed dispersal – cause there’s no birds – competition with grasses – lack of plant establishment sites – that’s a really interesting one there, you know, and then the harsh micro-climate which is all the same in the palila habitat and then altered nutrient dynamics and the lack of fungal communities. So it’s a couple of things on here that really interested me was the lack of plant establishment sites and the altered nutrients dynamics and the lack of the fungal communities and the reason why that is – cause they found out that the best recruitment for other native species was the trees that had a good basal structure – which means lichen and mosses and things like that – and I guess that area in the rocky areas where the cattle didn’t go cause it was grazed for, you know, a hundred plus years, that the few remaining ohia trees and stuff – their structure seems to have a lot more native plants there and all the koa trees that they’ve planted over all the years they haven’t been able to establish any native plants in those areas – so it’s one of two things that was brought up is that because of all the kikuyu grass that chokes everything out and they’re using a lot of herbicide to keep it down – how is that affecting the soil biology – so it turns out that the two things do, you know, invasive plants and things do alter soil and there’s no definitive data on herbicide use so it’s neither here or there but there’s not proof whether it is or isn’t that, that also affects the biology of the soil and that’s just something I wanted to mention tonight here because we’re using more and more of this stuff worldwide, ah, we’re using this in our watersheds and now, you know, fire breaks and so 17 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 forth, which I support the fire break part, but, I mean, this really is a – I think something we have to really consider as we move forward in the future because we just start using more and more of this stuff and it is altering - both the invasive species and the use herbicides – potentially it’s altering the soil structure and what happens is when that soil structure starts changing than native species can’t grow anyway and, you know, eventually, it just causes more fire hazards as far as I’m concerned cause we just have only invasive plants keep growing, growing, growing and you could be doing this in perpetuity, so, um, this is from forest ecology and management now – this was a part for – see understanding the effects of herbicides and all ecosystem components is important as they are applied to large areas of forest annually. So the key aspect of forest certification and of sustainable management is that there are limited long-term effects from herbicides – so even a tree farms and places in cattle – the places I gotta have to make sure that what they’re doing is they’re not just pumping tons of herbicides in there or whatever – so they’re suspect in some of the uses of this stuff and lichens are an important component for forest ecosystems – their functions include contributing to nutrient cycling, stabilizing the soil and providing food and nesting materials for vertebrates and invertebrates. Herbicides applied force ecosystems can reach non-target organisms and many of these non-target effects are not well understood including those on lichens and so forth. That’s all scientific papers and stuff so I’m not quoting somebody’s blog and they’ve noticed that the use of certain herbicides reduced the abundance 40-60% of the species of these type of lichens and mosses and things like so, ah, that, and then one other statement here is herbicide use is increasing worldwide both agriculture and private gardens, however, our knowledge of potential side effects on non-target soil organisms is still very scare. So nobody really knows but I just hope that people consider that in the future and if they can mow and things like that – I know it’s more labor intensive but that’s probably a better for the environment anyway – the composting and the mulching and stuff. All right. Thank you. NP: Thank you so much – that’s very interesting. TN: Hakalau Forest area in their program – have they created and expanded their forest area of native plants or are you telling us that it has not been successful? TS: That the upper section was once ranch land and they were trying to create corridors for the birds so they planted all these koa trees and so forth – they figured the birds would visit up in there and, you know, they’d take seeds from native berries and so forth and they’d poop it out and they can grown but that’s not been happening and the birds don’t seem to visit those areas but they do visit where the old ohia trees, you know, even if they’re just single trees and where small clusters here and there and there was like seven to eight different species of native understory that would grow on all the mosses 18 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 and everything that is under the ohia tree – but all these mosses and everything are absent under the koa trees – so they’re wondering, you know, if there’s no moss and if the birds do poop there the seeds don’t have any chance of growing and then they come in and herbicide to get rid of the grass, so it’s kind of a cycle of the grass choking it out and you herbicide the grass so one thing or the other it’s not letting the native species understory grow or recover and they do have parcels that they plant and everything but they have to also still herbicide those areas – they cover ‘em in plastic, they mulch it and they plant some of the native understory in there and it’s kind of mixed review – the problem is they need to plants ohia but you can’t really do that right now cause you can’t move ohia around so they would have to build a grow facility up there and that’s time and money and everything so – it all comes down to funding. But if they could plant ohia instead of koa that probably would be a much more beneficial for forest restoration. TN: They’ve not thought about making it a mixed forest and not just a single tree forest? Because up at Mauna Loa Bishop Estate did a single koa tree forest program back in 1975 and they found out it wasn’t conducive to a forest environment and so they did another area and they had mixed forest and not only did they plant koa, they planted other native species along with hapuu and you know you need to start where the forest is and expand from the existing forest going out and not in an open area that used to be a forest so maybe the idea is to take the existing forest and expand from there because if you have the existing lichen moss in one area couldn’t you expand from that forest – older forest area – and expand out into the open area. I’m not sure what it looks like so I’m – just my thoughts, sharing... TS: That’s kind of what they’ve done – so, I mean, It’s been successful in that bordering area with the intact forest but as soon as you branch out from there with the kikuyu grass and everything it really, the habitat changes quite abruptly. TN: You mean to say they’re how far away from the existing forest? Are they 500 yards, five hundred feet, I mean, are they next to the forest or are they out in the open? I’m not understanding. TS: It’s a lot of acreage so, yeah, I don’t have the specifics on the exact locations of their corridors and everything, but you can see some of it if you drive on Mana Road – you’ll be able to see some of the areas there and I think the idea is they planted the koa because they would kinda help to try to shade things out and get a canopy in there and then they can work underneath there but I – the birds just aren’t coming in the area to help with natural recruitment, yeah? I think that was goal of it. So they have to re-think this now. The point I was trying to make is that the – to get to that point – I think if they constantly have invasive grass or they’re constantly herbiciding – either way – the native understory is not going to recover. 19 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 NP: Thank you Tony. Because the complexity of their survival has to do with the soil as well and herbicide can change that. TS: And the invasive grasses and plant stem alter the soil as well. You know, they’re not from here so they alter the soil as well, so... It’s kinda like... NP: Right. It’s a complex, delicate, survival issue – that’s a very good point – thank you so much Tony. All right. Moving right along. Our next speaker is Mark Crivello of 3C Goat Grazing – my talk to Parks and Rec’s Maurice Messina and he’s been using 3C Goat Grazing for land management and he considers Mark’s work with them to be 100 successful and they’re planning on the County level to reduce herbicide and pesticide use by 90% and explore alternatives like goat and sheep grazing. So on that – and also – I just wanted to mention that Maurice Messina will be coming to our next meeting to talk more about it. So there are plans for the future with it. All right, Mark, thank you so much for coming and just tell us what you have been doing – update us on what you’re doing. Mark Crivello of 3C Goat Grazing will be giving us an update on the eco- friendly use of goats and sheep for land management. MC: Thank you so much for having me here tonight – my name’s Mark Crivello with 3C Goat Grazing. With the County Parks and Rec we did hit a home run, thankfully, very, very positive results from the community and the County themselves. On that project – what we did – they don’t have to herbicide at all – that would actually be our herbicide free zone right there due to the animals grazing. Hopefully, we can get out there a little bit to do a little bit more g razing – it’s gonna help benefit with fire breaks, dropping herbicide use and even promoting better soils, due to the manure and... NP: Does it grow lichen – what were they called Tony? Mosses and lichen that make native species happy, yeah, soil structure. MC: I got to say I can’t answer on the mulches part – never did do the research on that of course cause the goats and sheep don’t eat that moss – but it will help promote better soils and help stabilize soils so we have less erosions – so I see this as being very beneficial for the State and Count purposes. NP: Right. There’s an erosion issue. Right. Cause goat and sheep will take it down but they won’t cause it to be bare like an herbicide because of bareness which might cause erosion. MC: Yes. NP: Is that what you’re saying? 20 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 MC: Correct. Cause we control the animals in a very professional way and we don’t – we’ll take everything down but we won’t cause damage to the land. So we control and watch every step of the way so we have the best results – cause our Island is so unique – we have so much different vegetation, so much different land, um, environments, I should say, on this Island. Different places we go we always have to work a different way to adapt to that area. So I got to admit – we really lucked out on our part cause we get to see a whole different ball game than most goat grazers out there in America – due to our different environments. We’ve get to strategize and workings in so much different ways – it’s very unique. NP: So tell us about the last project you did with the County? MC: So with the last project that was a hill that they only used herbicides that was an acre and a half that we cleared – it took us slightly over a week – we tried a couple different methods. First I tried just a baby thing cause we’re in a County park. We tried to just bring them there daytime hours. I didn’t really like that approach to it. The goats and sheep will actually eat all through the night – all day all night – so by taking them out of there during the evenings we actually slowed down the process which we could have done it faster. So it actually took us, I believe it was ten days to do that – due to some trial and errors and I only had – I took a herd size of 89 to that job. But we did very successful. Like I said the County and 3 C got a lot a calls from the community on how this is a wonderful method and hopefully it can be seen more around the communities. JO: Mark, this is James. What park was this? I think you told us last time you visited where you were going to do it but my memory’s not so good so. MC: Sorry about that. This was right down here at the Bayfront \[unclear\] the Bayfields, OK. Right behind Ben Franklin and Goodyear. Yes. Which was, um, there was different types of vegetation in that area so it was really nice that everybody could see how the goats and sheep united together to finish this job in the best way we could. JO: Yes, very good. MC: And there was, sorry, there was one area we actually did in the middle of the soccer field – they could not mow it due to the last flooding – when they cleaned up everything – that was their clean-up pile so there were some rocks leftover and they couldn’t see where the rocks was. We took the animals there – within five hours we had that completed – moving on to the 21 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 next piece and the next day the County mower came in – picked up the rocks that was in that area and he mowed it and it’s actually being utilized by the soccer players. NP: So it’s really efficient where there’s rocks... MC: A very good part about the animals – utilizing the animals – we can go where tractors can’t. Rocky terrains, gulches, so – you can – by utilizing goats and sheep you can actually lessen the herbicide use even more by using – than using tractors and herbicides – cause where the tractor can’t go they’ll herbicide – we’ll just come through with animals – so I’m hoping I can prove more that the animals are worthwhile having around and utilizing them in a professional manner. Any questions anybody? Come on? Somebody got to get questions, yeah... JO: I’m only allotted one a night. TN: This is Teresa in Kona. What’s your next project with the County – have they talked further with you and contacted you to do more areas since this project was successful? MC: We’ve been in touch, um, they are working on different sites around the whole Island – so they are looking at putting 3C goat grazing at County parks around the whole Island. So they’re sitting down and gathering where would be the best to utilize us. GH: Grayson from District 6 – are you in conversations with the State? MC: Not at this time and moment, um, I will be in contact with them to do more on the side of highways – in-between medians – and whatever land they can – they would like to clean up in an environmentally friendly way. TN: Are you in touch with the Department of Transportation both County and State? Are you in touch with the – now that you’ve met Kanalu I hope something will come to fruition for you here – but, um, have you come in contact with other departments that could use your services – both State and County? MC: Not at this time and moment, um, I’m – how can I put it – I don’t want to bite off more than I can chew at this time and moment. I see a green light going – starting with the County at the parks and hopefully we control stepping stones so we can be as efficient as we can and professional as we can to get the job done a 100%. So we’re gonna take small little stepping stones and get up there. 22 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 TN: What about the pilot program for the gathering of goats and the uses of them for Public Works? MC: What is that again, Teresa? TN: Do you have a pilot program in the works for the gathering of the goats in using them for the Public Works Department? MC: No, no, I do not. TN: Do you plan to get in touch with the Public Works Department and do a proposal for them? MC: Yes. I would love to and I will be in contact with them. NP: Thank you. MC: Thank you so much. NP: While I was talking to Tulsi Gabbard’s campaign officers and they mentioned 3C Goat Grazing and Parks and Rec – and so his fame is growing! Yeah, OK, if there aren’t any other questions – thank you so much. MC: Just to finish off everything – just a quick one – I want to thank Steve for meeting up with me and having the conversation about utilizing goats and sheep. I’m hoping that I can prove to everybody that this is a great way to reduce fire loads and reduce herbicides. So 3C Goat Grazing will try our best to prove that we can do it – cause there’s so much different vegetations around this Island – we are actually going to be doing a little bit more studying and researching on some of the vegetations the animals don’t eat – I’m gonna try spruce it up a little so it becomes candy and they want to eat it. And these vegetations I’m talking about is actually some of our biggest fire producers that we have – so I’m gonna try see how I can sweeten it up a little for the animals – I love doing this research – it’s fun. NP: Yeah. Hands on knowledge. MC: It’s a lot of trial and errors cause like I mentioned before I did run into vegetations that are toxic to the animals – they might not be toxic all year round but during the spring – like that – they actually let off toxins so they can keep on producing – so it’s all this kind of stuff we have to watch out for and it’s really, really – you get down to the scientific terms with some of this stuff that happens – it’s amazing. NP: But generally well-managed goats and sheep can be very beneficial to ecosystems, environment and native species. 23 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 MC: And it’s all just working them correctly and utilizing the right animals in the right places. NP: It’s all about careful management. MC: Yes. Correct. And that’s what we do at 3C Goat Grazing. NP: Yup. More power to you. Thank you so much. MC: Thank you guys for having me this evening. I appreciate it. NP: All right – so Old Business OLD BUSINESS Legislative Agenda Discussion NP: Legislative Agenda discussion – which is actually New Business in that if we get on it right now we’re ahead of the game – deciding what we want to do at the Legislature this year. We’ve done some really powerful things there in the past – we’ve banged our heads against the wall a lot there also in the past – we still need to give it our best shot so, um, I have a couple ideas of bills that by popular demand and also bills that I would be really interested in and I want to throw them out for discussion with the commissioners. So the first bill – I just wanted to give a little background information that just refresher information. In the early 80s there were thousands of sheep on Mauna Kea – the palila population was 6,000. Over 22,000 sheep were removed over 40 years. Mamane – the palila food and habitat resource has since flourished but regardless the palila population is down to 1,000. The cause of palila decline has to be something else – so the original argument presented to the federal courts that won the mandate to eradicate the sheep was wrong. So the facts are in – the cause is something else – the mandate is based on wrong information – sheep harming palila by browsing on mamane is false – so I wanted to and this is not any kind of final wording – but I wanted to work on a bill that would enforce the DLNR to re-evaluate whether sheep are the primary cause of the decline of palila on Mauna Kea and report the failed result of 40 years of game animal eradication to State and Federal courts. And I don’t know what obstacles there would be in that – I do know that they do know reports – but it would be more of an compiling of information to change the mandate and, um, the second bill I would be interested in is a bill that would order the DLNR to complete the ten-year old unfinished Habitat Conservation Plan. That would be a start if they finished that plan it would be a start in allowing coexistence of game resources with native ecosystems in west side Puuwaawaa/Puuanahulu. So, ah, those are two bills and I have people working on how that would be written up and so I’m wondering if any 24 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 of you have thoughts on those ideas and also if anyone has another idea for a bill – we’d like to introduce. Any thoughts? Any other ideas on legislature plans? You guys like those two bills. TN: Those two bills, I support those two bills and we should work on it and I want to know what happened to the game management plan. NP: Well, actually, they’re needing, sorry, right – they need a little more time – they’re running into some real difficulties with getting a draft done. They just need a little more time – correct Kanalu? Yeah. So they’ve asked for a little more time with that so – that’s gonna happen but, ah, I understand it’s a difficult thing they’re working on so... TN: Thank you... NP: Well, it’ll be about who’s gonna be on the Legislative Committee. That’s the new committee. We’re gonna have a committee to follow the State Commission, yes... NP: Ryan Kohatsu, we should definitely do that – next meeting. Thank you, Tony. GD: Before we finish with Old Business – I was wondering do we have any updates on the shooting range? NP: That would come from committee. That’s gonna come from committee reports – that’s coming up. JO: But circling back to the request for bills for the Legislature – one thing we might want to consider is asking for some funding for an EA completion or an EIS completion for the proposed Puuanahulu Shooting Facility. NP: OK. JO: Right now the EA is pretty much done but has not been finalized and published and we would need to have funding to make that happen to have our consultant hired to finish that process up and I think that – I don’t know what the funding amount would be required for that but we can find out from a couple of consultants we’ve used in the past to see what it might entail to see if we could get some money for that. NP: Jim could you possibly write that up for us and read it to us how you would like it to be written for our next meeting? JO: Certainly. 25 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 NP: If you could be the composer that would be awesome. That would be great. TN: Up in the upcoming legislative session I think we should send two of our GMAC commission members who’s never gone and make it a point for them to experience the lobbying of our bills \[unclear\] legislation. NP: I agree 100%. TN: And so whoever has not gone yet please contact Nani and say, you know, let Nani help you make the arrangements to go over there. NP It’s gonna be about who’s on the Legislative Committee which we’re gonna talk about next. So also Abraham got news about a class to understand the Legislature and that process – could you announce to us that class Abraham? AA: Abraham – District 5 – so apparently there are these legislative classes that happens from time to time – there’s a couple that already passed for like you Teresa there was one in Kona on Monday. There’s one in Ocean View that’s done already – but I’m gonna go to this one in Pahoa which is tomorrow – it’s 6:00-7:00p. Basically, they teach you all the steps about the whole legislative system within an hour. There’s also one in Waimea on Thursday 6:00-7:00p and then another one in Hilo on Friday and it’s also 6:00 – 7:00p. The one in Waimea is at Thelma Parker Memorial Library... NP: Where in Hilo? AA: Hilo’s one is the Aging and Disability Resource Center – the training on Kinoole Street, yeah, and that one is at on Friday 6-7p, Waimea Thelma Parker 6-7p and Pahoa Neighborhood Facility 6-7p on Wednesday, which is tomorrow. NP: All right, thank you. That’s great. Hope some of you can make it. All right, so, um, moving on to New Business: NEW BUSINESS Election of Chair NP: We need to elect a Chair. I’m standing in for Kalei. I would be willing to continue as Chair but are there any other nominations or anyone interested in being Chair for GMAC? JO: James O’Keefe moved for a recommendation to elect Nani Pogline as the new Chair for GMAC by acclimation. Seconded by Abraham Antonio and carried unanimously by voice vote. 26 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 NP: Nani Pogline moved for Abraham Antonio for Vice Chair. Seconded by James O’Keefe and carried unanimously by voice vote. Discussion of Committees NP: The next thing then would be b. Discussion on Committees. So I had an idea that I actually would like to change the committees all around. Right now the committees we have are: Government Relations, Traditional and Customary Practice, Public Relations, Shooting Range Working Group, Communications Committee, Mauna Kea Information Sheep Task Force and Committee on Game Wildlife. I would like to scratch Government Relations, scratch Public Relations, scratch Communication Committee, scratch Mauna Kea Information Sheep Task Force and scratch Committee on Wild Game and instead I would like to have it Government Relations/Legislative Committee, then Traditional Customary Practices/Coastal and Fishing – which it has kind of evolved into already, the Shooting Range Working Group – keep that just like that – the Game Management Plan – the Game Management Area and Public Hunting Lands Committee following mainly the Game Management Plan and then a committee that would track the State GMAC – which Tony was asking about – we need a committee to track the State GMAC and report and keep in communication – we have no idea what’s going on there and we need to work with them – we would be way more efficient if we could and then I thought a committee on following hunting access issues – which Teresa had brought up this last week – I feel that that would be a worthy committee. So start with the Government – would any would you all be in favor of – can I - how would I do this Teresa – would I make a motion to change the committees or just take a vote on it. MH: This is Malia – I would suggest maybe if you wrote all of that out and sent it out to everybody and then next meeting we can actually go through and then people can think about which ones they would like to be put into. NP: OK. MH: Well that’s if, I mean, unless there’s any objections to committees that you guys don’t want... NP: Well, so the Traditional Customary Practices would stay the same, Teresa – who’s on that? TN: Yes. Nani this is Teresa. 27 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 NP: You’ve been doing a great job and who’s on your committee – do you remember? TN: Terri Napeahi... NP: Oh, Commissioners... TN: Yeah, that’s not commissioners – no I’m the only one in the Commission. NP: OK, that’s fine. If somebody wants to be on your committee that... TN: Right. NP: ....would be great. For Government Relationships/Legislative Committee Stanley says he wants to be on that. I believe Abraham Antonio wants to be on that and, um, I think they would be a great team to go to the Legislature. They both have showed interest in that – so, um, and whoever else might want to be on that Committee. The Shooting Range Working Group should stay the same... JO: Yes. NP: Yes, absolutely, and... TN: Excuse me, Nani, Teresa... My suggestion was that for those who’ve never gone to legislation be the ones to go that GMAC can represent, I mean, we can also go, but for GMAC to pay for those that have never gone – that would be a great thing. NP: That’s exactly what I’m thinking too, and then who wants – whoever – you can think about it for next meeting – who would like to really track the Game Management Plan with Kanalu and Ian and Steve Bergfield and follow that and tagging the State GMAC – I was kinda thinking George you might be so good at that. Would you consider it? GD: I would consider, yeah. NP: You just go on the State website and read their minutes, find their minutes and that kind of thing and report of what they’re up to. You would consider that? OK. So we won’t make anything for – we’ll just throwing it out there. And as far as hunting access issues, um, I don’t know who would have an interest. I suppose somebody who would run into problems with access is... But, ah, that might be one too many. Anyway, so OK, we’ll work on that, um, and iron it all out on the next meeting and I’ll send 28 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 out a copy. OK, is there any other new business anybody wants to talk about? All right then, Committee reports. COMMITTEE REPORTS TN: This is Teresa and I went to the CZM and it was an interesting meeting that they now – since 2006 have incorporated the ahupuaa system – they now take care from mountain to ocean and the CZM group is an overseer of State and County. So whatever development comes up – they’re mandated to oversee any State and County management plans and it’s a process that they oversee to make sure the mandates of taking care of our ocean to mountain resources is that here to on any development – from mountain to ocean – I just thought it was wonderful that since 2006, which I didn’t know that they have incorporated the ahupuaa system. So I had gotten brochures and fliers and I’ve given it to Donna to send to Nora and to give it to you so you can pass that out and I’d like everyone to look at it and at our next meeting we can discuss anything that you review on it and see, ah, in their brochures if there’s anything affecting GMAC – fishing issues all the way hunting issues up at the Mauna since now they’re an overseer of State of County planning departments. NP: Yeah, interesting. TN: And after you receive it Nani pass it out to the members and they can look at it and see where we can, um, look at their process and review process to see if we can incorporate any of their suggestion into our game management plan. Thank you. NP: OK. Thank you, Teresa. AA: Abraham – District 5. Teresa – what is that company name again? TN: Excuse me, this is Teresa – it’s CZM Ocean Resources Management Plan and they oversee the State and County. So it’s Hawaii CZM Program Coastal Zone Management – Hawaii State Office of Planning. AA: So how would this affect DOFAW – you guys working with them already or? TN: Their partners is NOAA, EPA, US Navy, US CG, Fish & Wildlife, West Hawaii Fisheries and under the State and County they include their partners like DBEDT, DOD, DOH, DLNR, DOT, DHHL, OHA, I mean, you know, I didn’t know that CZM oversees all of their partners as what’s coming down onto the table in the way of planning and so this is a mandated, federal law that they’re funded by the State and Federal to oversee the County and State planning program. So... You know, they have federal consistency, they have SMA areas to look at, Ocean Resource Management Plan and... 29 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 AA: Teresa so when are we getting this flier? Cause instead of... TN: I did give it to Donna so she’s gonna... NP: For the next meeting... TN: You’ll have it before the next meeting. AA: So that means you can print ‘em out or something? NA: Well, it’s brochures. AA: I like ‘em a good time before the next meeting so – can really look into that... TN: It should take about 2 days to get there so Nora if you can contact Nani and Nani contact the members. It’s this brochure here and, you know, there are fliers and information. It’s an overall briefing of what they do and what they oversee and they’re also on the Internet – it tells you how to get onto their dashboard and they have county partners and their county partners and DLNR and DOFAW – so I just found that interesting that we’re a part of them now. Thank you. COMMISSIONERS REPORT BY DISTRICT NP: Thank you. Any other committee reports? Commissioners Report by District – anybody want to say anything about their districts – oh, wait – let me back up one second. Jim? Was there anything to update us about the Shooting Range Working Group – that was it? JO: Nah, I’m gonna make a presentation... JO: ....it did not get on the agenda and I didn’t catch it until this morning when I looked at it. NP: But you’re gonna work on a bill? JO: Well, that I’m gonna work on too, but I also am gonna make a presentation so I need to get on the meeting agenda so I can do that. NP: Perfect. Let’s do that. OK. All right, then, so our next meeting has been changed from October 8 to October 22 – so you got a little more time and, oh, Nora? I thought it was nd 22? 30 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 NP: The next meeting is October 29 – you guys got that – mark that on your calendar. All right so if there’s no other business, any further business... GD: I think maybe this is appropriate for a Commissioner Report – I’ve been driving the Saddle Road a lot recently and I’ve noticed more and more that – I’m not sure if our Commission deals with the purview of road kill per se – but, um, a lot of road kills recently hasn’t been like picked up or dealt this at all like to the point where like it’s getting very noticeable and like every week I do the Hilo to Waimea trip and it’s like more and more so I thought I would just bring it up if there’s anything that we could consider about that. NP: Who does clean up road kill anyway? Humane Society? JO: I think that’s State Department of Transportation. GH: County roads... AA: Still, yet, Grayson depends what road. If it’s a State road then State highways and if a County road then County roads they going deal with ‘em. Sometimes you can, sometimes the Humane Society get dispatch but I guess depends what it is – still yet too. NP: Dog, cat, goat... TN: Can we get a map of the road as to who’s jurisdiction on the highways is where so then, you know, we can put out information... JO: This is James – that entire highway is State highway. TN: Are you talking about from Hilo Town to Kona? GD: Saddle Road... JO: Saddle Road – the Daniel K. Inouye Highway – that’s a State highway. GD: Yeah, yeah, and then through Old Saddle, too, all that – there’s a lot over there. I just... JO: That would be County. GD: That would be County, OK. NP: So you would like it cleaned up more often is what you’re saying? GD: I was just curious to the fact of a problem.... 31 Hawaii Game Management Advisory Commission Meeting Minutes – September 10, 2019 TN: So we have to decide the boundaries of Hilo District or Kona District. Is that the way it works – there’s different crews – Department of Transportation – State Highway Division... There’s a Waimea side and there’s a Hilo side... JO: Actually, it’s, ah, Hamakua – good part of the Old Saddle Road is Hamakua District and, yes, they do have separate baseyards that respond to their area of responsibility. NP: Thank you, Jim, that’s your kuleana. JO: I drive that road a lot. ADJOURNMENT NP: George Donev moved to adjourn the meeting at 8:16pm. Seconded by Jim O’Keefe. Motion carried unanimously by voice vote. Meeting adjourned. Respectfully submitted by: Donna Urban-Higuchi Secretary ATTEST: Nani Pogline, Vice Chairperson 32