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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2021-06-15 Game Management Advisory Commission MintuesGame Management Advisory Commission County of Hawai'i Minutes Meeting Date/Time: Tuesday, June 15, 2021 at 6:00 pm Place: Hawaii County Building, and West Hawaii Civic Center, Mayor's Conference Rooms - Via Zoom 1. CALL TO ORDER/ROLL CALL: Meeting was called to order at 6:02pm District 1 - Stanley Mendes, present (in person) District 2 - Kean Umeda, present (in person) District 3 — Rhon Leomana Turalde, present (Zoom) District 4 — Brian Ley — present (in person) District 5 - Abraham Antonio, present (in person) District 6 - Grayson Hashida — Excused District 7 - Vacant District 8 — Cortney Okumura — Excused District 9 - George Donev, present (Zoom) Quorum Established STAFF: Sinclair Salas-Ferguson, Attorney with Corporation Counsel Pomai Bartolome, Executive Assistant to Mayor Roth Barett Otani, Executive Assistant to Mayor Roth Barbara Kossow, Administrative Specialist Mayor's Kona Office 2. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: May 18,2021— Deferred 3. FINANCIAL REPORT: Deferred 4. STATEMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: None at this time. However, Chair Abraham Antonio, welcomes anyone that may want to say something regarding an agenda item may do so anytime throughout the meeting. 5. PRESENTATION: 1 a. Steven Bergfeld, DLNR, Division of Forestry and Wildlife (DOFAW) Branch Manager, Hawai'i Island to discuss land easement for access and land purchase. Steven Bergeld —Aloha everyone, Steven Bergfeld from the Division of Forestry and Wildlife (DOFAW). Abraham asked me to talk about several things, so I'll kind just go through the list that he gave me. One of the questions was the wildlife access coordinator position and what is the status of that, since Dave Pin left for another position. Currently we haven't hired a new coordinator. Admin is currently recruiting two positions, one is program specialist, and the other is a wildlife biologist. Both position is funding 50/50 ...And that position Jason Omick will be supervising. They will be taking on the activities that Dave Pin (sp?) was doing before he left. Several accesses was asked to be talked about. Barbara can you pull up the Honomu slide Barbara- Barrett? On your end. Steven Bergfeld — So this access road, if see the red line on the right side of the screen just before Akaka Falls some white fencing and stuff and this a County homestead road the green outline that goes up to the Kawiki section the Hilo forest reserve and when the landowner just Makai of the forest reserve does the subdivision proposal they were required to provide access to the public. Currently, the status of that access is the landowner is waiting for the State Attorney General and the County Corp Counsel to finalize their Quit Claim agreement of the access road to determine that the County as owner of the road. The new alignment will allocate a broader access corridor from the top of the road to the forest reserve between the gulch to the North and the old zig zag aliment to the south. The road exist pretty much, you can see the outline on the map of the homestead road in the highlighted green area, that hasn't been established yet, so, we working with the County on their MOA to create a trail to the forest, once the AG and Corp Counsel finalize their agreement. Anybody has any questions on that access. Abraham: Where are you guys at, just waiting for them to respond? 2 Steven Bergfeld — Right now we are waiting for the Quit Claim to be given to the County, because we don't have any jurisdiction, below the forest reserve. The county road is a county process. So we working with the County on moving that forward, but I don't have a timeline for it. Abraham- Sinclair, because we are a County entity, is there somewhere we can help them move that along? Sinclair Salas-Ferguson — No -Yeah, so that is going to be like Steven mention that is part of -- I assume... Abraham — I'm just saying, because he is waiting on the County, and we are a county board, is there where we can write a letter to get something moving quickly, because you know how county works, how government works, maybe we can put little more wood into the fire, or something? Sinclair Salas-Ferguson— So, Steven is there currently a fence up there--- a road up there? Steven Bergfeld — There is a road that goes up to the highlighted area. Just below the forest reserve, the green wider area, and but there is nothing that exist on the ground above there. The idea was to create a parking area there and create a pedestrian trail up to the forest reserve, so people can access. Sinclair Salas-Ferguson — To answer your question Abraham, this commission could write a letter in support of that new road that you are talking about Steven, is part of, I'm not sure I fully understand, what you are saying Steve, there is going to be a new road, that is part of being dedicated? Steven Bergfeld — No, it is an existing road, it just a lot of time the homestead roads are paper roads. There not necessarily there on the ground. So, the State AG and County Corp Counsel, are finalizing the agreement with the landowner I believe on the exact route that they are going to take, but this is the map, our trails and access person provided me. When I originally went up there several years ago, the access they picked out, you had to cross a gulch and that wasn't going to work. So we had to redo the alignment and the one you see on the map, working on now with the County. 3 Steven Bergfeld — We are not planning on creating a new road, whatever is there, is there already. Sinclair Salas-Ferguson — okay there is already a road there, and do the public has access on the road? Steven Bergfeld — The last time I drove up there it wasn't gated, but nothing is flagged or cleared or marked off or anything so. Abraham- So, the people did, who would be building the road, and would that be county road or would that be you guys? Steven Bergfeld — Like I mentioned earlier, we are not building a road, we are utilizing existing road, a county road and then, we are going to create a parking area and pedestrian trail to the bottom of the forest reserve. We then have to discuss with the county on their capabilities as well as ours and we probably would do a little bit of it, because they have a lot of roads to maintain too. Stanley — So you saying whatever road is there, forestry will work with the county to make the road real accessible to the public? Steven Bergfeld — It is accessible by 4 wheel drive right now. Stanley- Yeah, you going take out the real bad areas that and stuff like that, is what your guys plan is? Steven Bergfield- Well, we need to discuss that with the county, like I said, the last time I drove up there was no problem with a 4 wheel drive vehicle? We try to maintain all of access across the Island. Stanley —Then the bottom ---Who going take care of the road after that? County or State? Steven Bergfeld — That would be something the State and the County would have to discuss. Abraham — Anybody else has questions for Steven on this map or access ... okay moving forward. Steven Bergfeld — Barbara would mind putting on the Mauna Kea slide? Okay this is the access to Hamakua section, the Hamakua Forest Reserve Honokohau section which is just west of the Mauna Waile'e Forest Reserve. And it is State 4 DLNR lease from the bottom of the forest reserve down to the highway. We have access language in the lease to allow us to work with the lessee to establish an access, so the yellow line you see on the ground is something our staff went out and work with lessee on identifying a route that can get us to the forest reserve. Stanley- Did you... Steven Bergfeld — Let me finish Stanley and then I'll take your question, I may be able to answer some of them. So, the route still needs to be surveyed and recorded with the lease. We got a lot of overgrowth and iron wood and stuff we got to clear, and we working on trying to schedule heavy equipment to go up there, hopefully this fall. The lessee has requested that we fence the route on both sides and to keep people on the corridor and reduce the interaction with the cattle that they have up there. We need to find funds for that. They are also concern with their cattle getting out on the highway, and being liable for that and we got to work out a cattle guard and gate or a double gate system or something with them, so they are comfortable. But that access is not open yet. Go ahead Stanley... Stanley — Exactly where is this place on the Hamakua Coast? Steven Bergfeld — You know where by the 33 mile marker, when you driving towards Pa'auilo, get the avocado tree, on the mauka side and get the double bridge. Stanley — O'okala trail, Cardoza trail? Steven Bergfeld - Right side of the map, this yellow line is a mile west of that new bridge that they put in. Stanley — Actually on the Paauilo side of the new bridge. Steven Bergfeld- Yes Stanley — And that actually goes up all the way to Umi Koa or whatever like that? Steven Bergfeld — Umi Koa is mauka of Kukai'au Section of the Hamakua Forest Reserve ... and it is also east, the main part of Umi Koa is east of that. Stanley — I'm not so familiar with the names 5 Steven Bergfeld — it's pretty close. When it was cane, before you use to be able drive through the cane and get to the forest reserve from either side. But I know the west side is gated and managed by the lumber company, they were allowing access at one time, but I'm not sure where that's at now. Stanley- That's where they were going to lease to have a dairy? Steven Bergfeld — Yes, this is lease for dairy, they have dairy cattle and beef cattle there. We are in the process of clearing the iron wood trees that came in there, because we are asking for access through their property, we got to put in some work ourselves. Abraham — Anybody else has questions for Steven on this area? Okay Steven you can go forward. Steven Bergfeld — Barbara do you mine doing the Makahanaloa slide. There we go. Excuse me, so this road in red is there is the similar situation with Akaka Falls area. When the private land owner did the subdivision, they were required to put in this trail, or access route that go to the forest reserve. The problem is that it goes to the corner of the forest reserve, because even though on the map it says Hilo Forest Reserve that was a really old layer, when we had forest reserve designation on private land. I will get to that section of the forest later in my presentation, when I talk about this Hawaii Koa Forest purchase that we are working on. So that access corridor actually goes to private property right in the corner of the forest reserve so if you jump diagonal you would be on the Kaiwiki section of the Hilo Forest Reserve. So we had a subdivision plan that was approved in in 2012 and that access corridor is 55 feet wide 805 feet long. The public access plan states that the applicant will clear vegetation in the easement area, there was no parking or maintenance requirement included in the plan. As of March of this year the easement was still not cleared, as required in the plan, and we have been talking with our County counterpart, to enforce that with the private land owner. So, this easement, once it is cleared on the ground then people should be able to use it. Anyone have any question on this one? Abraham — I would just go back to my original question. Sounds like this one is different department for the County, so, my question is pretty much be the same. Is there something we can do to push this one? Because, sounds like this one is ready to go, you just, the landowner just got to clean the area. Maybe, can get 0 some volunteers, maybe and work with the landowner that you can get in touch with us or something? Maybe the landowner is kind of holding back on us, doesn't want it right away or something. I don't know. Steven Bergfeld —Yeah, I'm not sure about that, but I would suggest if you are going to write a letter about the Akaka Falls one, that you just mention this one as well, and you would like to have an update and perhaps you can help in anyway. Abraham — Right ---Is this the same one that was the purchase through Finance Factors or you going to hit that one up in a little bit? Steven Bergfeld — This is actually one of the 4 identified accesses through Finance Factors parcels. That is why we originally started working to purchase the sliver of Makahanaloa so that we could get legal access through the Kawiki section of the forest reserve. That kind of blossom into buying the two big parcels, the 13,000 acres. I kind of say we are into that if no one has any more question. Abraham — You can move forward Steven. Steven Bergfeld — okay - Barbara can you put up, it doesn't matter which one, the CW Koa forest slide, 16 or 17, okay, thank you. This map shows, on the bottom of the map shows 11,000 acre parcel and the one on the top of the map is the Makahanaloa piece and that one is 1,735 acres. Total I think 13,029 acres that the Trust of Public Lands is working to try and purchase from Finance Factors. And the idea is, to add it to the forest reserve system. There is supposed to be 4 different access to through these two parcels and the Makahanaloa one, the one we talking about is the one that is a legal easement on the ground that I'm aware of. So, part of the process is trying to identifying and make sure accesses the other three access on the ground are legal accesses for the public and the State to reach proposed forest reserve addition. So the estimated purchase price is around 9.3 million, so far 4 million in US Forest Service Forest Legacy money, 2.2 million from the state legislation as a CIP purchase that they extended this session. We have $500,000 from National Fish and Wildlife Foundation that has been secured. We have secured so we have 6.5 million secured of the proposed out of the 9.3 million purchase price. The Trust for Public Lands is in negotiation with a private funder to come with the other 2.8 million. The State when we expect the purchase to be made can be paid the appraised value of the property. The 9.3 is just an estimate. I've been told that we should know by the end of July that the purchase will go through. Once we have an executed purchase agreement, we can assemble crew, like they ask for and appraisal and also work with our land division to figure out the legality the other three easements. That would require surveys, metes and bound surveys. According to Trust for Public Land they say it's really close to finalizing the purchase they feel good about it and hoping we can close by the end of 2021. So that is, there is a lot of other people that work really hard to put this together and so there is a lot of thanks to be given to these people and the funders. Anybody, has any questions on this Koa forest proposed purchase. Abraham: Steve looks like about 3 years, when we first kind a met each other, looks like you got a lot of things done within the last 3-4 years, that's moving forward. To me that's pretty good — My next - Thanks for your hard work with everybody involved in that. My next thing is like, what is your guy's plans for the area. You guys going to fence all off like you guys do up in Kulana? What are your guy's plans after the purchase? Steven Bergfeld — Kind of too early, but it's not being designated as far as I know the idea is to designate it as forest reserve not natural area reserve. A lot of time when we make these purchases for land, the donors, like forest legacy have certain restriction - like if we give 4 million dollars you have to do certain things. Natural Fish and Wildlife Foundation I'm sure they have an interest in certain things. The State CIP money, I was told the legislature is asking to make sure there is hunting allowed in there, and there will be a hunting component to it. That is our plans right now, but I don't know the area very well. We haven't survey it, to really come Abraham- When the time comes, not only hunting, but gathering too, customary rights and all that. For the people who gather for medicine, anything else that they gather. Steven Bergfeld —Yes, of course Abraham - Anybody else have any questions or comments for Steven? Brian —I have a basic question after we are done with the other ones. Hey Steven, this has been an issue for a long time, we've got all these hunting areas, but, there's nobody knows how to get to them, there is no signage or anything to know when no longer trespassing on private property that we actually hit a hunting area and 91 designated areas. I know I've gone to the DLNR office with a map, how do we get to these hunting areas, and I get, "I don't know" and it is like I have to have somebody take me under their wing and take me to these areas, and show me and okay, this is this area, this is where we can hunt. There is no designation, Area -A, Area -B, Area -C ... this is the access, because a lot of these roads, you know I don't want to be trespassing, going through some of these areas, a good place to get shot, if you are wondering around with a loaded gun looking around if you're not in the right area. So be nice if we could work out some kind of signage you know this is the follow area the hunting area B, and you have reached hunting area B. Is that anything of a possibility to put into the works to make you know a lot of these people hunting from the East side going to the West side to hunt? You know what I'm saying, I always see Hamakua, but I have no idea how to get to the hunting area. By the eucalypts trees, through the cane grass, that's a lot of area to cover. Even the rural south, you have purple fence post, purple paint on the trees to know when you are trespassing. That is something when we are talking easement rights and everything, you know hunters can find these areas, and to make sure there is no issues with the land owners, I've worked a lot of cattle ranches, and nobody like a bunch of yahoos, running around, shooting guns stampeding their cattle, when they think they are on BLNR lands. Abraham — Steven before you get that, let me try and you can correct that as I go along. Brian, that's how I got started in this whole thing, hunter access thing. That's why I brought this topic back up, 3 or 4 years later. There's that guy that he mentioned before David ... Steven what's the guys name? Steven Bergfeld- David ---Jordan Jokiel Abraham — He lost his position, he was in the process of making some kind of map system, right Steven? Steven Bergfeld — I not sure what he was working on, I do know that Jason Omick from Oahu, was working on a smart phone base app called, outer spatial, that you can pull out, and it tells you exactly where you're at in a hunting area unit or not. I recognize that we don't have a lot signs in certain areas. All this is on the hunter, to know where he is at. When I'm in the forest, I have my GPS, I have my map, I make sure I understand where I'm at. Some of the accesses, the other thing Abraham ask me, just to give an updated was our recreation map. So we started E updating our rec map. The last one we had, it kind of went out of date, because it was from Governor Cayatano time, and a lot of the sugar cane access was open, and a lot of that has changed. So we started redoing our recreation map to describe these accesses as you requested and then we lost the Na Ala Hele position that was working on it, due to Covid and everything wasn't funded, so we still have the position on the books, but legislation hasn't funded it, so until we can get that position filled or else the Wildlife access coordinator that is kind of stalled right now. And if you have a particular spot or area that you are concern about access you can call our office and ask for the Forestry manager or Wildlife manager and have them help you the access to those areas or the Na Ala Hele manager. Abraham — And there is also the Na Ala Hele map is basically for the public hiking trails, but also hunting areas. Steven Bergfeld — I don't know if you guys have seen the Kauai recreation map, but it really, well done. What make it difficult for Hawaii Island, we're so much bigger than Kauai, so put the details on to the Hawaii Island map is next to impossible to do it the same size as Kauai map is. We working on something, but we don't have anything to roll out right now. Brian — Couple of years back I went hunting on Molokai. It was like, "I think we're in the area," you know it's kind of iffy. Like I'm saying---- Nobody wants to. I lose my job if I get in trouble on something like that. I have a high clearance thing, so, I pass up a lot of hunting areas, because I don't want to chance it. It's just an issue. I appreciate it. Steven Bergfeld — We understand and we recognized that. Those are the things that you mentioned to me, when we talked on the phone couple weeks ago. So is there anything else along those lines you had questions on? Abraham — No, I think that is pretty good, Steven. If anything please stay on line and you can be part of the discussion when we talk about the trapping. I didn't see Ian on line yet. He was supposed to be here tonight. Actually, I didn't remind him anyway. So if you could stay on line with us for that discussion. Steven Bergfeld —Sure Abraham — Thanks Steven. 10 Steven Bergfeld —Thank you a. Shooting Range development update: Stanley Mendes will share information from Mayor's Office on Puuanahulu. Stanley — I talked to Mayor Roth two weeks ago. He is very optimistic, about the shooting range. He has been talking to Bob Matsuda and the hotel people and this guy, Roger Ru, he is a famous shooter. He said he's very, very optimistic, that this going to happen. That's all I can put forth, can say. It sounds really, really positive. Abraham — I guess we going be discussing our Trapping program. We have Shayne "Slim" Veriato USDA, Steven Bergfeld from State. Basically they are here to discuss their program of what they get and I know me and Brian been actually trapping ... I have been trapping, the State has a call list, so let say the community calls the department of forestry office. And they say, "These pigs are coming into my yard, what are you going to do?" They are just going to give out this list for them to call. I got few calls, from Sunrise Ridge, Opihi'kau, Paradise Park, and I know Brian Ley, he does the same thing but he is more friend oriented. If anybody from the public that's want to be on this list, that knows how to trap or has trap, all you need to do just call the Forestry department and ask to be put on that list. Am I right or wrong Steven? Steven Bergfeld- Yes that's correct. b. Discuss trapping programs and solutions to address the over population of pigs and goats in areas they are unwanted. Abraham- Since you here, would you like to give us a little bit more insight on you guy's trapping program? Steven Bergfeld — I see Ian on the call and I will defer to him right now. Ian Cole - Can you hear me, I'm on the phone, and I couldn't get in on Zoom. Abraham- We can hear you fine. Ian Cole — We use to have a few traps, but the residential pig trapping got to be too much for our staff. As you guys know we it takes too much time. Right now I got 11 all of our traps on loan to you (Abraham) to Pig Hunter's Hawaii. So the most we have right now, we have to probably fabricating some more. We are getting so many of calls for nuisance pigs. So we give out the list just to give kudo's to the County, the County actually was the first one that generated that list and we just kept it going and passing it on along to residential community members. The most support we are doing now, we are not trapping outside of any State land. We don't do that on residential. Maybe we kokua the hospital, the prison or something. For the most part we, I'm just trying to supply materials to help the trappers, like you folks that are trapping for the public. This kind of giving advice where I can to people have nuisance pig trouble. Us as an agency, we are not trapping on private residences. Abraham —Right, Just to let the public know your guy's program. So, it started from the County, then you guy's basically adopted it and then you have trappers come out to people residence, when they get phone calls. But, is it like every spring, because there's an influx of the babies, or maybe like during the fall or something, that you guys get the high calls? Ian Cole — I feel that this year has lots of calls and there is usually a peak in the spring, or and another one in the fall. I don't know what changed. Maybe more development, in the bigger subdivision maybe some, the pigs are residing in vacant lots. Now you have more residence who are empowering the pigs. We just share the list with the residence and let them work it out. Some of the trappers charge, some of them rent the trap. There are varieties, of things that the trapper list do, that the trapper in the list that some people are upset there is a fee associate with it, but having done before on my own in the past in volcano area, I realize that there is a cost check the traps all the time, baiting the traps and everything. I will say one thing that's been happening, I get a lot of these calls, I got one from the realtor earlier this week, somebody in the one individual — in the neighborhood feed a couple of pigs and before you know it, 20-30 up to a 100 in this area and she is asking me, "is it illegal to feed pigs?" I don't believe there is any statues saying you can't feed pigs in a residential area, even if they were feral, swine. It is kind of a weird thing because it boarder on, if you feed an animal, are you taking ownership? Is it actually domestic livestock? I realize a lot of the root cause, of some of these bigger pig problem in the neighborhood, one resident has started feeding them and now it has gotten out of control. There's definitely influxes just from the vast forest areas that we have, some of the subdivision we 12 have rival our forest reserve system because of acreage. So guarantee there are pigs that will meander into a nicely compose pile, fresh yard, and cause a lot of grief for people. So we are trying to keep people from blasting them and getting themselves in trouble. Informing them in the laws, as much as we know. Like, don't shoot them in a residential area. Call a trapper, a few different options, we're trying to help folks with their pig problems. Abraham- so, I going open up to Slim, open up open conversation to commission and public. Shayne "Slim" Veriato —thanks for inviting us. I also have Trevor Lu, he is on the phone, I'm sorry he is having zoom problems. He is our State Director USDA Wildlife Services, also on the call is Mr. Homer Leong, he is our feral swine coordinator for Hawaii for Wildlife Services. As Ian has said, yes, there has been a large influx of pigs, throughout the Island, including Kona. The dry areas of Kona, this past year. Wildlife services is trapping pigs, when we can, as much as we can in residential area. Please keep in mind, we are a user pay program. Although we are a Federal Agency, we are much different, we are actually contracted by home owners or land owners, to do our services. Although sometimes we do have funding, through our federal swine program, where we can assist at no charge setting traps. We kind of prioritize human health and safety small mom and pop, people that's growing fruits and vegetables and stuff. We prioritize the larger contracts can be subsidize with feral swine funding from the Federal government along cost sharing with the co-operators for larger co-operators fields, mac nut farms , We are out there also pretty busy, we get calls throughout the Island. Like I said, we also did work at Sunrise Ridge, we got a lot of pigs from Sunrise Ridge, association called. We took care of that problem, in Hilo town, Panaewa, human and health and safety. Kids playing and the pigs are wondering around. That is what Ian just said, the neighbors are feeding the pigs, not realizing how dangerous it could be, for the neighbors children just two houses down the road. We went there, removed the pigs, all pigs that we removed, is tested for diseased and also genetics. We take ear sample that is to test genetic of the animal, to say if it is a Polynesian pigs, feral swine pig, also we test for brucellosis, pseudorabies, feral swine fever and along with all other disease, I got it in a hand out for you guys. Every pig caught is tested and ethnized. The ethnized pig is property of the owner, so the property owner can disposed of it, give it away or keep it for themselves. That's pretty much in a nutshell of what we do much more, our 13 program is nationwide, and not only feral swine, we do bird airstrike hazards at airports, beavers, and coyote control is a very large one, protecting cattle, you know those cattle states in the mainland. So we do lot of stuff outside of feral swine. It's just one aspect of what we do. Homer do you want to add anything, if you're there. Homer Leong: You pretty much covered it. My name is Homer Leong, Federal swine coordinator for Hawaii. As Slim mentioned earlier, a lot of their funding comes from co-operators. For me mines comes from National Federal Swine Program and that is why I'm working statewide. A little bit of history maybe, for the Federal Swine Program, back in 2014 congress saw a need for feral swine control all over the US. In particular Texas, North and South Carolina, Oklahoma, and all those states. Congress appropriated 20 million dollars to the USDA animal plant health inspection services. The Animal Plant and Health and Inspection services created the National Feral Swine Program and the split up the 20 mill with the whole bunch of States, and we were able to get a little bit of money and that's how my position got funded. You can stop me if you have any questions. I think something you guy's might be interested in fiscal year 22, if you guys have local project request, just on feral swine damage, crop, or whatever it is, natural resources, this might be something you guys can look at. I can probably email you the application form, look at it to see if this is something you would entertain. Just recently the farm bill, National Resource Conservation services awarded 2 projects, grant money went out, one was on Oahu one was in up county Maui all involved feral swine control. Oahu project was accepted, Jason Musaki and his gang is putting together a package to help reduce the feral swine damage up the North Shore of Oahu. When you look at local project funding, you probably want to look at that. That might be able to help you guys out in Kona and Hilo. You have any questions. ????. — We once had a contract with the County. Mr. Andy Levin back in the day, asked for assistance. Went to Mayor Kim, one of Mayor Kim terms, I can't remember exactly, full blown project to help communities and small farmers to help tackle the pig problem. We were contracted to do it, we had two crews, and one crew went to Kona - West Hawaii, one crew stayed East Hawaii. Yielded 500 pigs, just from doing very small land owners, couple acres little farms, vegetable farms. We had to prioritize because the list was so large, we had to prioritize again, human health and safety. Pigs attacking people, pigs attacking livestock, so that 14 was go to right away, set traps. Many different methods, cage trap, leg snares, corral traps, all depending on what we saw when we got there. The intensity of the amount of pigs in the area trying to help. It was a total success, final report went out, submitted to the County Council, back in the day. I believe right after that, we lost funding it was close to 9-11 time when we lost funding, it was hard to justify, doing what we were doing. Teachers and everybody else was having a hard time. Getting funding, securing funding, because the Federal Government - especially for Wildlife services and everybody else, was redirected to our Military. At that time back in the day. It was a very successful story for Hawaii Island. Stanley — You guys do, in Kona, you guys do goats too? ????? We do goats in Kona to tell you the truth, the goats at Kona that we do is at Kona Airport because the pose a direct threat to our aviation, in case they get ingress into the airfield. We do trapping only at the Kona Airport. We have not gotten any calls - goat problem call assistance as of yet. I believe the goats are becoming a problem also in the Kona area especially, West Hawaii side. Brian: I think the main problem is when the Humane Society made snares illegal. That was one of our biggest boom, once we couldn't use the snares anymore. The bigger pigs are usually trap shy. That has a lot to do with it, we are no longer able to use snares, except 20 acres or higher in agriculture we can use snares, but not in residential area, where the pigs are a real problem. Just off the top of my head you were talking about grants and funds. Is there some way we could work with trade schools, or one of these schools, where we buy the raw material, and we get these kids to weld up traps, and you know what I'm saying. I mean we have the traps, and we get the people out there, some food banks. Like in Texas they do helicopter shoots and they have people come behind and gather the pigs and give them to hungry people. You know I've got a list of people. You know, as soon as my freezer is full, I call, and I got a pig, I go do it and drop it off at their door steps. I've got a list of people. ???? So we purchase our traps locally, we spread it among local welding companies. Average cost, just off the top of my head, is around, 500 to 600 dollars for a really good pig traps. Brian — that is what I'm saying ... if we get one of these trade schools or high school kids, that they need some projects. So they learn to become certified welder, weld 15 them for free and we work out some system. Granted the pigs, they are also an important food source and culturally, food to table. ???? - As far as leg snares, I believe the leg snares, in the residential area, what raised the flag, impact of non -target species is what their called. You might catch the neighbor's cat, dog, and it depends on what type of snares. The majority of snares we use, Wildlife Services, is devised by ourselves, we created it, it's a leg snare, and it just catches their leg. So you can go there euthanized and/or release. In case you have a non -target, like a dog, you can go there, hold the dog down and release him unharmed. A lot of people were using neck snares, will choke a pig and will choke a dog. So that is what raised the red flag as far as leg snares or any type of snares, being used in residential areas. Abraham- Hey Dexter you have a comment. Dexter- Yeah. I just thought of saying something. As far as this trapping thing goes, this started by Dominic Yagong. Way back then. Abraham - That's correct, including Mr. Andy Levin Dexter — He started that, he started the list, running through the County. So we all volunteered, we were on the list that he distributed among the people in the County. That time there were a lot of hunters, trappers, and dog hunters and everybody volunteered. Then we ran into problems with the community, they did not admire what we were doing as far as dispatching of the animals. So, I'm saying right now, Brian is saying about snaring stuff like that. One of the biggest problem with snaring, when you are getting close to residential area, that pig will scream for a while and that became one of our biggest problem. We had to get them out, midnight, 2:00 o'clock in the morning. All that commotion will get people all wild up. So, I been in this trapping from since from the beginning, and right now my biggest concern, is that I think this is a question for Ian, you said that State took over the list from the County? Is that right? Can you guys hear me? Abraham — We hear you. Ian Cole- I can, we just adopted the list, and we distribute it, and basically it that was the same list, that came from Dominic Yagong, efforts, we updated. 16 Dexter— Great at that point, we worked with Slim, the USDA people. They built the traps, we showed them how to do the snare, and they did their own snare. We worked closely with Slim, and his people. Last week I got a call from a lady, she claim she is from the County, I'm sorry I didn't get her name that she made a claim if we are going to be charging for pig removal doing trapping, we need to get a GE license. Is that true, can anybody answer that? Abraham- I guest, we have to get back to you on that Dexter Dexter — But that was strange, after all of these years of doing this, not of this was mentioned, when we first started on this list, and I am one of the few, my partner Barry and I. 1 think we're, I can't think of anybody else, as far as regular people. We are still doing it, we got Kulani, and we got Paradise Park, Leilani Estate, Papaikou, and Pepekeo. It's crazy, but it doesn't seem there are more people out there trapping. But there is a lot of pigs around. But my biggest concern is that, why all of a sudden do I need a GE license, to be on the list, she said she is going to remove our name from that list, because we don't have a GE license. Please somebody get back to me on that? Abraham — Yeah, I guest Dexter we have to get back to you on that, because this is the first time we hear about that. If forestry has the list, we should contact Ian or Steven or somebody from Forestry I suppose, to try get off that list. It's more of a positive thing, than a negative thing. Even for me I trap also. You got to put gas, dispatch -um, cost you a bullet, or sharpening stone to sharpen your knives or whatever. Dexter — Right, its' like, I've been doing this from the beginning. Right Slim, so you can vouch for us. We have been doing this from the very beginning. Shayne "Slim" Veriato — They really efficient in what they do, Dexter and Barry, Yes, they are very good trappers. Dexter — We have being doing this. I can't really do much right now, because I'm disable. But anyway, we still keep it going. So, I mean there is, that was a shock to me. I checked, I was thinking, the County or someone was going to discuss the trapping program. So I was wondering, it just popped to my head, the request for that GE license. Is the county going to go, get the call, sub the job out, and get a 17 1099 form to report the tax? You know what I'm saying right, why would that all of sudden come up? That grab me. Ian Cole - Was this from county parks? Were they put out a solicitation? Cause county parks called me about a broader trapping program in their parks. She might have tried solicited for the parks, were this different. Because what you do with your time among your people, is your tax business, nobody taking you off the list if you don't have a GE that is not a requirement, it's more of a service. The fee is not exorbitant, it not like you making tons of money. It kind of off set your cost. So it doesn't, I can look into that. It doesn't make sense to me ... If you're running a business, you're suppose have a GE, but this is easy on the down low. As far as I can see on the monetary exchange. Dexter— This is not profitable. If you could find out why or what department. Abraham — Dexter, maybe just going off of what Ian said, maybe she was just looking for someone to contract to take away the pigs and Sinclair can correct me if I'm wrong. You need GE license to actually have a contract with the county. I think if it is in that stance, I think that kind of make more sense. Of why she asked you that. Dexter — That would be good. What got me is that we got calls from Forestry department, division of State, Troy DeMello, when they were overloaded, we get calls to help them out. There was no mention of that, we would deal directly with the landowner. I don't know, I was wondering about the question and the phone call and if someone could give some clarification. I like what you just said, that it makes sense. It is probably the park department, has a park that is getting beat up. We not going to charge that kind of money that would need a GE license. Sinclair Salas-Ferguson — Dexter, Sinclair here, Corporation Counsel for the commission and I can advise the commission on certain things, I can comment, Abraham asked me, Yeah when the County does contracts they require certain things, certain information 1099 forms and stuff like that, that they issue. I would suggest like Ian that Ian mentioned that, that you should follow up with what that person that called you, it sounds kind of vague what you telling us. It seems like a solicitation for your service, I would say Barbara: Barbara, Abraham Barbara•• • Barbara: Okay we did hear from council woman Kimball. She did share that she was going to reach out to all the pig hunters. And start updating the list... Abraham: Represents what district? Barbara: She is Hamakua, she replaced Valerie Pointdexter. She sent me an email that her staff will work on the list. Whether there is funding we might need down the road, this is something she is thinking of, helping with, because she is hearing from her community, her constituents about the pig problem. I'll share that with you chair and the rest of the committee. Dexter, we will follow up on that. I don't know who called you. Usually with the county, as a vendor, you would complete a vendor form if you will be doing some work for the county. We'll work with you, off line, on that, Thank you. Abraham — Anybody else have any comments for Forestry- or USDA? Dexter - It says Goats? Where is the problem with the goats? Do you know off hand? Abraham- I know Southside, the resorts they have problems. South side has problems, south Kona they have problems... I know this guy who traps down in that area. He kind of have a corral trap and he kind of pushes them, and disperse out through the community. In Orchid Land this other guy was supposed to be here tonight, but he couldn't make it. Pretty much like the pigs, a previous owner was living at the property, taking care of his goats, somewhere, somehow he lost his property and left the goats there. Then the goats caused havoc to the community. He came in and actually corralled and trapped goats, at least the majority of the goats. So there is problems here and there with goats. Dexter— I know about the ones at the golf course in Waikoloa and all of them, that's crazy. Abraham — I think the problem with the Kona side with pigs and goats, there is not enough trappers I suppose, in that district. Our chair, people should really reach out to hunters and gathers out in that area. 19 Brian — I wondered, why private homeowners go to the government, that's not the government responsibility to what is going on their private property. They private property owners, should be contacting the hunters and things like that. Nothing against the Federal government or USDA, I can see on Ag land that is important resources. Golf courses and stuff that is making money and shouldn't be the government responsibility to remove the goats. They should be contracting out to private individuals with a GE license. To take care of that issue, in my personal opinion. I don't know why the State and the Federal government is wasting resources on other stuff that should be handled by the property owner itself. Granted we can give out a list of people who are willing to do that. I think that is a nice thing. But I don't see why the State should be spending money taking care of problems on private property, when they are too lazy to put up a fence. My personal opinion on that subject. Abraham —Thanks Brian. I have a couple more questions. What is your cost, when you go out and help the public? Shayne "Slim" Veriato — Currently now? It all depends, we are subsidizing the cost. We are prioritizing, we are subsidizing the cost, Charles Wain funding, which we currently have. But it all depends, the size, how long we have to be there. We actually make arrangements, where we have traps, we do trapping and we try to cut cost, we set the trap, everything we ask the homeowner or landowner to call us, sif there is something inside. We only have to go there or to bait, save money and stretch it longer. Help more people in the long run. Again that is a unique situation with our agency, we are a user pay. So like you're saying, the golf course would call us. We would then have a cooperative service agreement, it's called. We'll say it will cost this much, over this much time, to capture the goats and pigs. And one of the reason why they use our Wildlife service is for liability. We are totally covered, whenever we are on the property as far as liability wise, we are covered and the homeowner is covered, when we are working there. That is one of the main reason, they call our services for assistance, because of our liability factor. Business, farms, etc. We are totally covered in what we do, and while we are doing it. Abraham — Yeah, out in the public there are people that will allow you to dispatch the animals on site and there's people don't want you to dispatch the animals on 20 site. So, it's like what do you do? You figure it out, and I have a system, you guys have a system, Brian has a system, and I'm talking about just taking them out alive. That is a very dangerous thing, to takeout a wild animal from a trap. You guys can look it up in YouTube, there some guys get really mangled in those traps. That kind of a big thing, it's just my fear regarding liability. It's a very dangerous. Dexter— I can vouch for that ... to the emergency room -it wasn't funny to get stiches. Abraham- It varies, it can be one, a small baby pig to a big pig, and they all vicious, you trying to be protective of themselves, whatever. And I personally caught 7 the most in one trap. How do you get out 7 pigs without dispatching them? Dexter — Ha Ha, I can tell you how... Abraham — Like I said, I get my way, you get yours, and he got his .... for the general public, they go catch 7, what they going do? Let's say Brian's wife doesn't want him to dispatch them on property or whatever. What is Brian going to do? Oh my God. You got to call somebody. That is pretty much why we brought up this topic up today. Just so the public know each program. Ian if you can share the forestry number, Slim if you can share your information so the public can get hold of you guys that would be great. Dexter — Abraham, Just to throw it out there. I don't know if someone thought about this before, but if you know the hunters that are doing the trapping. You can get 7 in this trap today, and in the afternoon you get 5 more in another trap, so on and so forth you can only give away so many . I was thinking if you do it like the mainland, where the hunters goes out during the season or whatever, and they can take it to a processor, and the State or somebody can give it out to the homeless people or sell it. Has anything that this can be discuss and we could use radio or something to do that, for the State or the county? Abraham — Right Dexter, at our next meeting, I'm not sure I can share this with you guys right now. I know you guys, or majority of you guys know about the butcher truck and whatever, I'm going to be reaching out to them and they going be coming to our next meeting hopefully and do a presentation and maybe even Shane guys can come back because that is all part of a different finger of part of their program and that is kind like we are moving down the road towards, we can kind of come to some kind of solution or something. 21 Shayne "Slim" Veriato - We tried that Shane from USDA, we tried through a County program years ago and the main roadblock was, all meat that was to be taken, had to be certified by a meat inspector. Dexter — Every Wednesday? Shayne "Slim" Veriato — Yeah --- We wanted that to happen back in the day... Abraham —Sorry Slim, we go hold that for our next meeting. Bumby we got nothing to talk about at our next meeting. Shayne "Slim" Veriato - I guess I'm coming back. Abraham — Yes, you coming back, Dexter somehow, get me you contact information and I'll ask Barbara can send you minds. Share my information to you and we go talk story later on. Dexter — I appreciate that, sounds good. Abraham —Just the last thing I want to say about the pigs and stuff like that. I know in the mainland it's a big problem, over here it's a big problem, but for us on the Island it's also and all you guys know it's a resource. To keep on downgrading them, and stuff like that. You guys also still remember that was our main resource from way back. The way the world is going, right now, no one really knows. And everybody knows, you guys heard this many times ---we live on an Island everything we get is by ship and planes and if anything stops, what we get? Starvation!!! And you guys all see it, from before Covid, our shelves are going bare you can go Walmart — Target and whatever, even though we have food, our shelves in our stores are going bare. So keep on, I know all the things even the goats are over populated, but that's why we are going to go back in the future to talk about the game management plan and we going to have forestry back and maybe we can get Shane guys back on that future meeting. Does anybody have any more comments or suggestion on the tracking discussion? If not, we going move forward. Brian — I get one question -May I get the contact number Abraham — Ian or Slim Division of Forestry and Wildlife Hilo office 974-4221 Waimea 887-6061 22 Shayne "Slim" Veriato - USDA personal Cell 217-1141 cell ��i•I��i�Il��►�ii•IX►�►� a. Discussion on the DOFAW plan to expand firebreaks in State Game Management Areas. Abraham — Last meeting we got the maps and stuff with the fire breaks, DOFAW want to expand the Fire Breaks, did all the commissioners get chance to look over the email? Brian you had chance, Kean, Stanley, Leomana, George did you get a chance? Courtney you still here. Commissioners what are your thoughts? If anything we can write a letter in support. I still think we have Ian, and Steven may still be here. And if anybody in the public have any comments on this they can speak also? Brian — How come, we don't go back to who was that came in and talk about the fire hazards and stuff, who came last time? Abraham — I think it was Kanalu Sprout, but he couldn't be here. Brian - Kanalu have your cake and eat it. We have been over this thing, with the sheep and the fire hazard and everything else, why don't we open up the sheep ... put holes in the fence let the sheep back on, we've proven the facts that the sheep can keep the grass down, manageable level, cause even putting in new fire breaks, I mean everyone who has been on Mauna Kea, there are plenty of time that is winds whipping 40 -50 miles an hour. And a 100 foot wind break, is not going to do anything when that grass is whipping. I did a little bit of research the rule of thumb on a calm weather, is 3 times the height of your fire load. So if you have a 10 foot tree, you need a 30 foot wide firebreak. You know, it's kind of discouraging when these firebreaks that totally take out 100% of the native forest and native growth. For, you what I'm saying, it's a good management tool, but I think we need to look at the root of the problem, the root problem is the dead trees, and the 5 foot tall grass that is just a massive fire load, with the fire bug we got running around this Island. It is only a matter of time, we've seen Australia, and we've seen California numerous times. That it is just a matter of time, when we have this massive fire load up there, and it's going to take off, and that's going to be it, for the Palila bird. Cause that's, everyone says it's going to be one good fire away. We need to be to using all of our resources. Which would also include the Mouflon 23 Sheep, in a manageable level, we don't need 10,000 sheep on the mountain, but we need more than 10, to keep a firebreak. I can see adding firebreaks, adding Mouflon sheep, and patrolling the area. The place I'm hunting goats now, where we had that fire, 3 years ago and all the Ohia are all dead. And it wasn't from the goats, it was from the fire, the D-9 knocking down the trees to make a new firebreak, and the trees are getting fire damage and now they are all dead from rot. We need to look at the long term. We need to open it up for the sheep again. To control the grass, that is the biggest problem, the dry grass is such a high tinder thing, somebody with fireworks, somebody smoking weed, somebody throwing a cigarettes out, and that's going to be it for the Palila bird and half the mountain. That's my opinion on it. I agree that we could use better firebreaks, the roads cleaned up, we've got grass growing all across it, which defeats the purpose. 30- 40 foot wide firebreaks, are just an eyesore and I see all the dead native trees, 10% brows, verse a 100% gone. It's a no brainer for me. I would rather have a few trees with few brows lines on them, then no trees at all. That's just my opinion on that subject, thank you. Abraham —Thanks Brian. We going table this discussion again, sorry, or if everyone took a look at the paper work, and if everyone is in support of it, if not you vote how you want to vote. Can I get a motion to vote, because everybody took a look at it? Sinclair Salas-Ferguson — the motion is to- someone would have to put a motion to table and then the next motion. Stanley — Steven. When is this suppose take place? Steven Bergfeld — Once we get approval. Stanley — Are you guys, waiting for an approval from us? Steven Bergfeld — We're asking for letters of support, or comments on the letter, before we presented to our board. Stanley — So we have time then? Steven Bergfeld — Well, the timeline to do the work, or the best time of the year, when you don't have to deal with bird season, Palila nesting season, hunting season, game bird season, is September 15 to November 11t. That is kind of our 24 time, our window of opportunity. So the sooner we get a letter in support, or comments, or whatever you have to say, we would appreciate the sooner the better. Abraham — With that said, we'll table this till next meeting -seems like we have a little bit of time. Maybe we can address what Brian said. Brian — I make a motion bring it up at our next meeting — Abraham — Barbara can we just table this? Barbara —Yes you can, what I would suggest, is that you have a working committee, come up with a draft form with what you want to say and you can present it at the next meeting to vote on it. Steven Bergfeld — We sent a support letter in for that project - it's long overdue. So that way — it would be absolutely wonderful not just the idea that they are clearing things, but the idea fire control opening those areas up is beneficial for everybody Abraham — Thanks Steven, we have got to move ahead, just be, please present on next month's meeting. The discussion - disclosure of the Pittman Robertson Fund, the discussion of the mongoose and cat traps, supposedly up at Mauna Kea and we have public written comment so that is also tabled and also Announcements till next meeting. E:�_�i•li•[�1�Ii•[�I� �ii�i•� ��I a. The Makahanaloa State Hunting trail restoration plans. 9. COMMISSIONERS REPORT BY DISTRICT: Kean —The 16 marker range now, does not requires hunting license. The sign in the Kiosk on the right side, there is a mail box that you are required to sign in when you use the Range. Just for the public to know. 25 Abraham — So Kean is that a positive thing? Is that the kind of thing moving forward like the 16 mile marker? Kean —Yes, and no. Now anyone can shoot, not sure if there is any liability issues in place now. Dexter — Guy's, I spoke to one of the game wardens, they let me know about that, You're right Kean, you just got to sign in, by signing in on that form, it enables you to enter the watershed area, by doing that, it allows you to shoot, so no hunting license required anymore. 10.COMMITTEE REPORTS: None 11.Adjournment: (7:30pm) Action: Stanley Mendes moved to adjourn. Seconded by Kean Umeda. Motion passed unanimously. Next Meeting: July 20, 2021 at 6:OOpm. Respectfully submitted by, Barbara Kossow Secretary 26