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HomeMy WebLinkAbout2025-07-15 GMAC Minutes Final Draft Game Management Advisory Commission County of Hawai'i Minutes Meeting Date: July 15, 2025 Time: 9:00 am to 11:00 pm Place: Zoom and In-Person 25 Aupuni Ctr., Ste. #1501, Hilo HI Chair Leomana Turalde called the meeting to order at 9.05 am. 1. CALL TO ORDER/ROLL CALL: District 1 - Robert Duerr, Present, in person District 2—Taysen Wong Chong, Present, in person District 3— Rhon Leomana Turalde, Present, in person District 4— Brian Ley— Present, in person District 5 -Vacant District 6—Vacant District 7—Abel Aquino— Present via Zoom District 8—Cortney Okumura — Present via Zoom District 9—Justin Ackerman— Excused Quorum Established with 6 in attendance. STAFF: Kayra Wong, Attorney, Corporation Counsel, in-person Barbara Kossow, Administrative Specialist—via Zoom LT: Aloha, just some housekeeping rules please make sure your cell phone should be turned off or on silent. For all of us attending here in person please remember to speak towards the microphone. The microphone should be right here by our computer. So that all of your statement can be recorded under HRS 92-3, of the Sunshine Laws, GMAC may remove any person, who willfully disrupts a meeting or prevents — and compromise the conduct of the meeting. All people that appear before the GMAC are reminded to conduct themselves in a courtesy manner. For testimony those in person for those who would like to testify please fill out the public registration form right here. For those on Zoom, if you would like to testify on any agenda item, please provide your name and identify which item number you would like to testify on, in the Chat. Question from the public, for those on zoom, if you have a question put in the Chat. 1 Just going back to Question, it's something that we are mandatory to answer, if we have extra time, per the Chair and Vice-Chair of the commission we answer questions if we can, that's not something that we normally do. Protocol All GMAC members are reminded that they will be recognized at the appropriate time for questioning and discussion. Mahalo. 2. STATEMENTS FROM THE PUBLIC ON AGENDA ITEMS: LT: We have a couple of people who want to testify from the public today. First up we have Mr. Steven Araujo from the public, he is representing himself. Agenda item he wishes to testify on. Request to comment after presentation. SA: (Steve Araujo) In other words, because subject is new information on the subject, if I feel I would like to comment or testify after I know what is going on I would be allowed to do it. That is up to the commission. LT: Yes, Sir SA: Justt let you know... LT: Yep, We can. I'm going to start in front of every new agenda item, then SA: You mean after the speaker speaks? LT: Yes, you can SA: Thank you LT: We'II get back to ahhh... if you hear at the end—you like wait till the end the last agenda item? SA: Yeah, up to the commission LT: Okay, thank you Sir. That one is on hold. Next speaker from the public...we have...Do we have any umm... BK: Chair, Claudia is in the Chat, Claudia Rohr she would like to testify on future agenda items. LT: Okay, you can provide testimony right now, before we get in our presentation or you can provide testimony on the next item. Yeah 2 CR: Thank you, can you hear me all right? LT: Yes, ma'am CR: Okay, I don't want you to look at my morning face. I'm testifying I would like to have you consider making it an agenda item for GMAC to approach the mayor to ask the county to enforce the condition in the recorded public access documents for Pepeekeo particularly everybody knows that He Korea has gate off the vehicular access to the shoreline trail just South of the plant. I do have a lawsuit about that, we're in circuit court, but in the document, that's filed it says, the county can remove the gate, and they haven't done so. I would like you to put that on the agenda, now you have the power and the attention of the County and congratulations on the General Plan testimony... LT: Mahalo CR: Anyway they now have removed the fence with the barbwire at your face, we don't have to walk down a 10 foot trail that's all bumpy, but, now they have put these logs in the actual pedestrian entry and they have tied one up and I'm 72 years old and I don't want those logs to fall on me and break my leg or my foot, It's very,very dangerous, if not even, I mean, it's totally illegal. I will send that 82-page document to Bob and I have his email, it's expensive and I bought it from the Bureau of Conveyances and I will show you where you could take that to the Mayor, I'd like to go too, in case there are questions, but, I ask that you give up on this whole trying to get council members help in purchasing the property, I can say more about that later, you're not really purchasing anything we don't already have a right to. But that doesn't appear to be an actual public solution at the moment. The real solution is the mayor saying, okay I'm going to direct the police go and cut the chain on the gate. It's not removing the gate, it's actually just cutting the chain on the gate, so that we can open and close the gate. And I think it's an obvious solution, it is written right there in the document. Thank you. So that would be agenda item on the......, there is more than one problem out in Pepeekeo, but discussing Pepeekeo public access and the lack thereof, thank you. LT: All right, ah yes, can we get feedback from the commissioners on that statement? KW: (Attorney Wong)They can ask questions. LT: Mahalo Ma'am. We have one of our commissioners, who is part of Makahanaloa Fishing Association, and he can give you a little more on that. TWC: Hi Claudia, Tayson Wong-Chong, with District 2. 1 would like to give you notice that I am part of the Makahanaloa Fishing Association I do deal with the FHC (?) as well for Pepeekeo. Are you going be by chance at the July 20t" meeting by chance on Sunday? 3 CR: I'm not working with the Pepeekeo Makahanaloa Fishing Association period. My position is all along for all these years since 2003, 1 fought for these public access and the community has tried to make these private agreements over and over and over and it has undermined my ability to make these permanent public access and I'm asking that, we come together and realize that the only way we can actually achieve this, is by standing together, not trying to go behind each other's backs and negotiating with council people, etcetera, but just to ask the county to fulfill their obligation in this easement agreement, that's recorded at the bureau and stand together and get these as permanent public access. Your children may not live in Pepeekeo, you know, so the fishing association is always tending to try to work around, get some kind of control over the access, which leaves people like me out, it undermines the main cause. We want these access, which we have earned and won in a series of legal entitlements. We want this to be preserved for the children of the big Island whether they live in Pepeekeo, whether they belong to the fishing association. So please honor the fact that I respect that you guys are there and you always, ?????inaudible... when I ask you to. I am trying to work towards your needs, but I choose to do it as trying to get the public needs. I re-registered PASH, I'm looking for someone on the Kona side to be on the board, I forgot, I would like you to put something on there about that too, if you could on your agenda, looking for someone, but we fight for public access, but I want to say,you guys came out,when I had my hearing at the board of appeals, and it made a big difference. So you can't do that in court, but the solution is merely to show the new mayor this provision in the documents and if anyone tries to tell you, oh we're blocking it because it's unsafe, it's none of their business, we earned this, it was an entitlement, and we are responsible for our own safety, when we're walking on the trail along the cliffs. I think you're going to hear this, but just say, no that was a consideration at the time that we earn these entitlements, so.. TWC: Claudia, Claudia... CR: I'll end...I'll stop...I'm not going to go to a meeting... TWC: Claudia, if you can by chance just take my information and I'll touch bases with you. I understand where you are coming from, I just don't work with just the fishing association, I do work with the Pepeekeo Association as well for public access, I just want to put that out there, to give you awareness.. CR: I have been invited, before and to be honest, I'm scared of you guys, because of the way you worked against the public right before, I'm just scared of getting involved that.... TWC: Claudia if you want to take my information... LT: Claudia, we'll put his information inside of the Chat, and if you want to reach out to him you can .... 4 CR: Okay, I'm going to put my email in there, and I would like everybody who wants to be on a group chat to send me their emails. LT: Yes, ma'am, we will do... thank you very much for that. It's very important Pepeekeo. Moving on to our next testimony, public testimony. Do we have anyone else? CF: Mr. Chair this is Chuck Flaherty, I'd like to make a short comment... LT: Yes, sir you got the com, all you... CF: Thank you very much. Although it's not specifically on the agenda, I do believe it will fall under commissioners' reports, with regards to the county council committee meeting. I also would like to acknowledge the excellent work that the game management commission did in advocating for the commission and for the purpose of the commission and I would also like to acknowledge the corporation council ...inaudible.... for her assistance and the good work, you all did, you'd to be congratulated and keep up the good work. Take care Mahalo. LT: Mahalo nui Mr. Flaherty. We appreciate all of your help and support and leadership on that issue. Okay, next from the public do we have any more public testimony before we get into our agenda item. Going once,going twice, none seen. Moving forward to agenda item number 3. 3. APPROVAL OF MINUTES: LT: We didn't have the minutes printed out. BK: Chair, it's not completed. LT: Okay... We can table that...We'll get back to it, on our next meeting. Moving forward to agenda item 4 4. COMMISSIONER REPORT BY DISTRICT: a. Each Commissioner will provide updates and share concerns about their respective districts;Commissioners to decide on whether to add those topics at the next meeting and to invite the public to provide testimonies and presentations at their meeting. Permitted Interaction Groups may be created at this time. There will otherwise be no discussion or voting, which will be reserved for when it is itemized on a future agenda. 5 LT: Right before we start this, couple of meetings ago we told that we needed to put our commissioners report on the agenda and the subjects. On the back of our agenda, we got a couple of items that would actually go into the district report in our next meeting. Anyway, we can start with our district 1 report. Mr. Robert Duerr RD: District 1—Hilo Trollers ran their shootout/troller tournament. Basically, Ono were spotty one at time kine. Mahi Mahi were really small, you know 5 Ibs, they were pretty much scattered throughout Kumukahi to Ninoole. The record levels of flying fish, small flying fish are everywhere in launching in little schools, like 10 to 20 fish. For small Ahi,Ahi have been coming up around a 100 Ibs. mostly males, so whether it's a little unusual for the season, one marlin came up, and that was about a 100 Ibs. There's fish out there, but there are a lot of baits. You know, traditional so that's basically. The other thing, I testified on the General Plan as a citizen, and the County of very supportive. The County was very supportive. The next part, is how we go to actually partn items, and how do we actually you know, shape it up. Likely there's going to be give and take, and maybe some things still need to be added. One other thing too is East Hawaii fisheries group, there's evidently a parasite that is affecting Ahi, and essentially the parasite, what happens the parasite is alive, but when the fish dies, the parasite then becomes alive and starts eating the flesh. So, they're looking at Suisan and others are looking into that. That's all I have commissioners. Thank you very much. LT: Thank you for that update. This parasite thing let's track that a little more... RD: Next month Ryan Okano DAR guy, he knows that and he's going to give an update on his fishpond, but he can update us on other issues that are important Island wide. LT: Yes, sir,Thank you very much. That was District 1. We're moving forward to District 2 Mr. Taysen Wong-Chong TWC: Morning, District 2 Taysen Wong-Chong with my report. Basically, we had a lot of talk, reaching out from the public regarding bill 51, with the feral cats with the commission and everything with that, what they are setting what to do. I can tell you one fact that more people reached out to me in regard to support, than the folks that actually showed up in the commission...in the council meeting. We do need and one advantage to that... one public person reported seeing 9 buried devasted sick cats at the park, so I do not know what disease, infectious, I do not know what's going on with that. But that is something to take a look into. As far as for hunting, I've heard good and bad, typical movement on Mauna Kea is kind of slow right, pigs,though,there is a lot of pigs still going on, on Hamakua Coast, even though it is out of the district for me. But ummm, I work on that side. A lot of pigs coming in, but not big like normal, few hundred pounds and over, not the normal of what we see, like close to 200 hundred. On my farm that I work at, a lot of pigs but averaging 60 to 80 pounds. So, tome like, where the big guys going at. But ah...and that's all I have to say for this report...oh yeah one more thing actually, and for 6 ...inaudible.....org, she suppose to.... inaudible...just basically saying trying key in support to where,....got get the date... I forgot the date in my other folder. But possible showing up to the county council for that bill 51. Making a stand for that and that's ... Looking forward to the Palila report. LT: Thank you, sir, that was District 2 Mr. Taysen Wong Chong. Moving forward to District 3-that's myself. A couple of updates for District 3 ... In Keaukaha along our beach and shoreline access, we have new paved parking lots and roads going in, starting with Onekahakaha Beach, that's the roads. Then another update is our camping situation at Puhi Bay, we don't got any camping going on this summer. I don't know where Department of Hawaiian Homelands stand on the camping issue. I know for last year the permits just to camp down Keaukaha was $600 to $800 dollars per camp site. And it was mandatory that you have two port a potty per a camp site if you wanted to camp down Keaukaha. They were trying to mitigate that excess waste that was going to the bathroom over there, from the campgrounds. Other than that, it's the same thing, same issues with the pigs, if you guys go to the dump you guys will see pigs on the way in. They put up new fencing where the recycling used to be, on the right side as you head in right by the back of the rock quarry. If you go to the airport,you'll also see a big group of pigs, maybe about 20 1 counted last week just driving through the airport coming out of the back from Kings Landing. That was for that. Again, I did reach out to the mayor, I went up to the mayor's office, to support my idea of moving the exhaust pipe from Puhi Bay to the back of Kings Landing by the drop off in the back of Mauna Loa Macadamia Nuts. I think that's going to be one of my long-term goals, trying to get our exhaust pipe for all of the sewage and waste waters system from Hilo, Keaukaha, Hilo Bay, which is our Fishing Village, it is the only reef that we have on this side of our Island. Our big fishing village, our fishing reef and putting the pollution from our sewer system, only pollutes our aquifers (An aquifer is an underground geological layer of rock, sediment, or soil that holds and transmits groundwater in usable quantities.) our fishing grounds. Last year Hawaii News Now put out a report that the wastewater system it has a bacteria from Covid 19, the flu virus, all of the human ailments can be found in the exhaust our Puhi Bay. That kind of goes right back into Keaukaha and gives us things like scabies, if you guys ever got scabies growing up and you got impetigo, (Impetigo is a highly contagious bacterial skin infection causing red sores that break open, ooze and form a thick, honey-colored crust, most often on the face, arms, and legs of young children.) or Herpes virus 1, skin allergies from Keaukaha, just out of reason, because our poop, our human waste goes into the water, and that's how it spread amongst our community. So that's our pipe exhaust in Keaukaha. Moving forward recently there was an emergency bill passed about energy in America, and that led to more drilling for oil, that gave power to our Geothermal plant by Hawaiian Homelands, they packed a couple of wells, geothermal sites on every Island and using this energy crises bill.They're going to be able to go forward with the 20 million, or how much every money they are asking for to continue the data collection on the sites, which most of the sites across the Hawaii Island chain all fall into Hawaiian Homelands property, so they kind of take the lead with that. And right now, the same energy crises bill is being used to push and open up the power 7 plant in Pepeekeo. Right...Pu'u Honua, so their doing the re-negotiation. I didn't get too deep into the story, it just came out yesterday or the day before, about Pu'uhonua, part of that was the energy crisis and has to do with Pu'uhonua, and our geothermal plants, which on Big Island we have three (3). We...did a test well in Kawaihae in Hawaiian Homes, one up on Mauna Kea, and then we have the one in Puna. That's going, so we have three (3) on this Island and every other Island has about one. Ummm... Shoots, that was energy and that is it for District 3 Thank you very much. LT: Moving forward to District 4 Mr. Brian Ley... BL: Brian Ley district 4. Good news Pohiki dredging is way ahead of schedule, it's moving a lot faster than they originally planned. Hopefully we can keep that momentum going, and we get that one open up soon. Pigs are always an issue, also the deforestation and lot clearing is going like crazy in Puna, it seems like another boom town, so a lot of pigs moving,the strawberry guava blight is really taken affect in Puna, so we'll have to see what happens,when strawberry guava inaudible...I notice....I had to remove a couple of trees ... it started getting ripe yeah...but we'll see how that will affect the pigs, yeah. I stopped by the DLNR office, I get a little frustrated I don't get any answers, I never get any call backs or anything from them...I specifically asked how many people applied for the sheep removal permit, I know they were offering 16 permits, but I could not get any answers of how many people applied or anything like that. And we had the eradication of the first and second, I don't have no idea how many sheep were taken, I heard a rumor from somebody,we need to look into it,they was hunting up Mauna Kea, and they said there was a helicopter herding sheep, before the eradication. I'm not sure if that should be allowed or even if legal, or stuff like that, to herd the sheep during hunting, when people are actively trying to hunt, and there is flying helicopters moving sheep for easy kill zones. And there is another eradication at the end of August scheduled. And that's it for my report. Thank you. RD: Can I share, and add in to commissioner's report, DOFAW has been missing in action, on any kind of request for information. It's not true of other agencies in DLNR, but they seem to have a habit here of not responding to questions. BL: Oh, one other thing here, I went with some friends to mile marker 16, and DOCARE took the whole...the good zone and the 100 yard.... inaudible....and they wouldn't let body in there. And like I said, you know...we need...I don't know why they don't have their own range to qualify, and why they have to use public one, and take the whole thing, without any notification or anything. So that was kind of little discouraging. I had a friend to ask about that, he said, no, you guys, after 3:00 pm you can come here. So, we had to go to the short range, ... sight of the muzzle loaders for the season. So ?: Person did not state his name. Sounds like Steve Araujo. Can I comment on some of this. 8 LT: Yes sir, ?: (Steve Araujo) The sheep on the meat salvage, back in the 90's I set it up, there is a provision in the rules that says, that anyone request meat from DOFAW DLNR...DLNR has to provide the meat. It says that there, So I don't believe in wasting meat...inaudible...So I requested all of the meat...for my personal use. So, I requested all of the meat up there belongs to me. But what I did now... Talk to, at the time it was John Griffen he was the head of Forestry, and I set it up. Whoever wanted meat or needed meat...had the sheep accessible to them. Their drop of points suppose to be Kilohana check in station, behind Mauna Kea State Park, and Hale Pohaku. You do not need a 4-wheel drive. After years of watching them do it...in the beginning everything was going really smooth. I mean you could go up there with a bicycle and take you meat, and I told them if there was one (1) sheep, and had four (4) guys, that sheep had to be quartered so everybody be equal. Okay, I kind a got overworked, other guys took over, that's when the thing, oh you need a permit, oh, you need 4-wheel drive...oh you need to drive behind the mountain, that's when all of that came up. So, I've been talking to the DLNR guy, and said trying to put things straight...being that I've been reflected to this commission...this commission can also reflect what I told you on to the DLNR. Because essentially like I said the meat is mine... LT: The original deal? ?: (Steve Araijo) Yeah, but I haven't taken one read ounce. It's all, I gave it to the general public. So, if you guys can put it back into perspective...ummm Steve Bergfeld, was in forestry at the time, the retired person Jon DeMello, he also knows that, Ron Lockman, John Griffen, they in a better place...these are people that are still there. That suppose to know these things, so if you contact and ummm on DOFAW taking over the 16-mile marker, that's BS. They cannot take over a section of forest for their own private thing. Turn them in they have superiors, turn them in. ummm do not let, I mean stand your ground...don't go overboard, stand your ground. You know the State and conservation guys...okay thank you. AA: (Abel Aquino) Just a few concerns off the bat. The manta permit although they're good to have the boats permitted their uncapped, so talking to Capt. Bill Murta, his boat the Nainoa, down at Keauhou Bay, showing me some footage of an average night out there, where there can be an upwards of 30 boats, that creates a real problem especially with swimmers and divers in the waters, in the dark. These boats are on motors, so the props are spinning forward and backwards. We already had one (1) death out there, and super concerning, I think the place is overpopulated and we need to consider, regulating the amount of Manta permits out there. They are also$300.00 bucks'flat rate, which doesn't make sense with the guys operating, the double haul Wa'a with only about 6 occupants and the large boats having about 50 upwards of that, maybe the price should be adjusted depending upon how many swimmers they have in the water at night. Definitely I think 9 30 boats they have on one side is too much pressure on both wildlife and super dangerous for the people enjoying the activity. Another concern is that I see a lot of chalk and paint on the lava rocks, even north of our district pass the airport, I'm not sure if it's from the ironman people or what, if you are driving along the highway, headed towards Waikoloa pass the airport, you'll see a bunch of Graffiti defacing of our Aina. People are painting on the lava, it might even be chalk, but it may be permanent if you drive that way you'll see a bunch of white marks, squares, letters, all kinds of stuff on the lava and that's unacceptable for the public and it's an eyesore, defacing our natural resource. The feral cats at Old A's( Maka'eo) I've had a bunch of complaints,from some community members about that. Super large population down there. They're being fed actively, and they combined with the mongoose, make an unsightly situation. Especially for the Keiki's and the people utilizing the run walk trail down there, the run walk path. The last thing, the cruise ships dumping their waste, close to shore. As I understand it, they are only restricted half mile to shore. That puts their human waste right back into Kailua Bay. I know for myself, I got the Staff infection really bad and almost lost my foot. I had to work with Dr. Alex Totulio and get some pretty aggressive antibiotic, and she was telling me it's directly from the cruise ship waste being dumped too close to shore. If there is a way we can start to circulate some information and possibly come up with a better solution, if not, having them find a way to process their own waste, on a shoreline facility, at least pushing it further out into the Alenuihaha Channel where it'll get dispersed more evenly with the harder currents out there. Maybe pushing it out closer maybe to 5-7 miles. The only reason they are dumping it so close to shore is to save money on gas prices. Which is terrible, it's really hurting the water quality in Kailua Bay. It's making it unsafe for swimmers and paddlers. That's how I got it, just paddling wa'a with Kai Ehituu and it was pretty scary, pretty aggressive form of Staph from that human waste and pretty disrespectful too. You latterly can see the toilet paper and that kind of stuff in the water. Well,those are just a few of the concerns I've noticed over the last few months. LT: Yes sir, thank you very much - right on. Mahalo for that first commission report. That was an amazing one. Thank you very much. ? Aloha LT: Where to step in. Ahhh...just going back... the Manta Tours, I think a year or two ago, we max, we counted around eighty (80) one night. AA: Whew!!!! LT: Eighty (80) illegal boats, in one night. So, I'm happy that it got down to the thirty (30) you're talking about. But still, that's Aole! We to figure that out. 10 RD: Chair.... AA: Actually, for the guys doing it correctly, like Capt. Bill Murtagh, Kalani Nakoa, Kona Style, they're doing it really well. They educate the population;they tell them not to touch etc.. You got a lot of these new guys who just came in from Florida, whatever, I almost got ran over, a few times with my friends,fishing for menpachi at night coming in with our Kayaks, they are looking backwards, addressing their clients as they are almost running us over. But some of the old school captains, Capt. Bill have got the Nainoa down, low-capacity fishing boat, these guys, should really have preference, because they are doing it correctly, spreading their education, kind of the Aloha for the sea. RD: Chair Natalie Reynolds, was heading up a PIG, dealing with Kailua Bay, and the issues there, including the Manta. Kinda held off on this PIG, until Able could become commissioner, essentially get to Able, so we finally have a report, the reports' written, but we'll get Ables' mana'o into it and present it to the commission, which I believe then, is the first month the report gets presented, the second month it's commented on, the third month it gets' approved. AA: Excellent LT: Amazing....thank you guys... TWC: Taysen district 2 is there any way we can maybe make a regulation as to how many X- number of boats will be present in the area during a manta session? RD: Robert Duerr District 1, essentially what happen DOBOR got in the commercial business, so what they do they have a monthly fee, which is $300.00 a month, plus a percentage of the total revenues. So, they were motivated to just run just as many permits as they could. They realized they had a problem, so Natalie and I attended a Manta hearing on the westside county campus, which was loaded...so they know, one of the problems is, they've issued permits, people have bought boats, and now they want to take away the permits, which essentially taking away their livelihood away, but the issues need to be addressed. TWC: I still believe there are too many boats in one area. Not only for the wild marine life, but for people as well...you know, it can be devasting situation, especially if get kids involved in the water, something you know, being concerned. BL: (Brian Ley) Some concern for DLNR, you guys may have the permits, make time slots, where people may have 2-hour time slots. So, you'll have so many boats, but you can still accommodate more people, and the guy can still have a good discount, as a suggestion. 11 AA: (Abel Aquino) Absolutely, way too many boats and having your engine on and the props spinning, people in the dark is really a recipe for disaster especially with one death already. But, another possible solution, when the jet ski island, when the barge was being utilized by the jet ski island in middle of Kailua Bay, we put some lights on there, ran it for about 3-4 months, and we had a Manta population every night within that. So, we could expand the industry a bit. We have the bay by, possibly put a mooring that has powered light that lights up. Make a secondary, third dive spot at Kailua Bay. I know there's one by the airport, that is also being used, not as bad, not as crowed out there, but it could be another solution, then we'll have another spot in Kailua, issue those permits and make them site specific. LT: Noted that down...Ok mahalo very much, anymore comment? None seen, moving forward...Moving forward to District 8 Mrs. Cortney Okumura... CO: (Cortney Okamura) Mahalo chair, and welcome Commission Aquino, we're happy to have you, thank you for being here and for your service. So, kind of link to that, former chair Antonio sent me on July 1st, DLNR put out an announcement that DOCARE is now doing Marine patrols, on all Islands, and one of the patrols that happed on Hawaii Island, was at Keauhou during the night, to patrol these operation happening off of Keauhou Bay, it says that they did numerous safety boarding, which they check the presents of required safety equipment, ensured that the vessel were properly licensed and permitted. That sounds like as far as that situation went. I'm happy to hear that this is going to be carried forward and you have got some great ideas, thank you for doing that. So, anyway also for awareness, if anyone that is interested, so you can just go to the DOCARE website, that article is there for more information about where they've been patrolling and things like that. And then, for ... I'm not sure if the public, if anyone has heard, there's going to be some public hearing put on by the police department, where, I guest the public is going to be invited to share our thoughts on the proposed changes to the rules of gun permits and licenses, and the first hearing is going to be on Monday, August 11t", at West Hawaii Civic Center, and the second one will be August 14t", at Aunty Sally Kaleohano Luau Hale in Hilo. I can send this information over to Barbara, it was a public announcement that went out. It does say that written comments will be part of the official records on this and any comments sent in after the hearing may not be considered, but if you want to read out there's link out on the proposed rule changes, I can send it to you guys as well. So, if you are available, you can get your information from there. That's all I have. Thank you. TWC: Do you know the time at Aunty Sally's? CO: Yes, 5:00 pm on Thursday, August 14tn LT: Mahalo, 12 CO: The other one is also 5:00 pm, the one at West Civic Hawaii Center LT: Mahalo, just a comment on that...that's too soon for us to officially get something together from the commission, but we can show up in a personal manner, and give our opinion on that, because I'll be there too. All right, that's it for our District Reports by our commissioners. Moving forward to our next agenda item. Oh...okay...1 2 3 4 and agenda item 5. PRESENTATION: a. Bret Nainoa Mossman, DLNR Division of Forestry and Wildlife (DOFAW) Natural Area Reserve System, Hawai'i Island Avian Biologist to speak on the "Palila and its Endangered Species Recovery Status and Analysis including analysis of the "Technical Report HCSU-115 2022—2024 Status and Trends of the Palila (Loxioides Bailleui)." LT: Today we were supposed to have two (2) presentations, and we weren't able to get in contact with Nainoa Mossman and who is the leader of our Birds program here with DLNR and NARS. He is the head of NARS up at Kulani too, I'm just going to read out Bret Nainoa Mossman DLNR Division of Forestry and Wildlife (DOFAW) Natural Area Reserve System, Hawaii Island Avian biologist to speak on the Palila and it's endangered species recovery status and analysis including analysis technical report HCSU 15 from 2022 to 2024 status and trends of the Palila. And that is this report just came out on the Palila birds. For our presenter, is he coming next month with Okano? The presenter had to cancel this month because they had other meetings that were more important. We'll have them back next month, but I feel we should use this time for us, if you read it, we can have a discussion amongst ourselves, and kind of understand, before we get a presentation, what our ideas are, maybe we want to write a letter to, to a specific office, individual or I dunno, that's why...we have time here to brain storm...I'll start this off,just by reading...the abstract...all right...Just a paragraph..read good. English is my third language so bear with me. Palila our critically endangered Hawaiian honey creepers specializing on the seed pods Mamane and restricted to Mauna Kea volcano on the Island of Hawaii. A previous analysis of survey data estimated 89% population decline, between 1998 and 2001. Using the most recent annual survey data from 2022, 2023, and 24, we report undated population estimates and trends since 1998. The 2022 population estimate was between 367 and 742 birds. In 2023 the population estimate was between 374 to 842 birds. And the 2024 population estimate was 412 Palila with a max of 970 birds. Our estimate survey years prior to 2022 were within the confidents intervals, of the estimates of the previous analysis. Our models, likewise, showed a population fluctuating between 4,000 and 6,800 birds, from 98 to 2005. Except for an unusually low estimate in the year 2000, and then a steep decline through 2010. For the next decade, Palila abundance fluctuated between 776 to 1,346 birds before declining again in 2021 to 679 birds. From 98 to 24 the 13 population decline to 90% to 203 birds a year with very strong statistical evidence with overall downward trend. Okay... BL: Brian Ley district 4, 1 just want to put it on the records, the massive decline in 2021, 1 want to remind everybody July 30, 2021 is when we had the mana fire, and you know...we need inaudibly. Sheep and address the elephant is the fire is obviously the biggest threat we had and the mana fire and we had another couple other fires on Mauna Kea that went to the edge of the Palila critical habitat area...you know, now we get more scientific evident the biggest threat to these birds is fire. I just want to get it on the record, the sheep is not the villain, the money needs to be put towards more management of the birds, instead of continuing the charade of going after the sheep, and of wasting millions of dollars on fencing, which is just causing environmental havoc on HBP and Hawaiian Homes lands, and these sheep are not able to get to the hunting areas where they can be managed. My two cents on this and something once again I think we need to look into and go after the true culprit and spend our money wisely on saving these animals and birds. RD: Chair Robert Duerr District 1, After repeated, the procedure to get an DLNR, spokesperson, or through DLNR communications.They were reached out twice, and both times, no answer...Dan Dennison who was the former head, who retired July 1, he did do a five (5) minute a video interview of Bret Mossman on the mountain talking about the Palila and the recovery. He sent that to me; I forward it to Barbara. I don't know if that video is capable of being played. Other then that, zero feedback from DOFAW, Zero! Dan Dennison went out of his way to say, hey, I'm on the mountain, and I filmed him. LT: Leomana District 3... So that's how we got that updated video, you reached out... RD: I reached out LT: And that was specifically for us. RD: Right. LT: Okay, right...Well ka la mai...point of order...We have someone's audio coming through... if we can just mute all the mics...thank you very much. We can hear all the cars going by... TWC: Taysen District 2, 1 just wanted to point out key factors, when I pint point out this for the reading of the minutes, I say this 1982 till present...95% of the Palila resides on the South Western slope of Mauna Kea right, this also pin points decreased population by 21.8% from 2021 to 2022,another decrease by 30%from 2022 to 2023 on page 7. Slight increase by 8.2% between 2023 to 2024 that's the figures of 49 to 53 in a year, that's for birds. That's not big ...inaudible...Who knows if they not counting the same bird, it also states over here as well, on the first page of the article I just read, the 89% population decline 14 of 1998 to 2021, and they also stated that the very strong statistical evidence overall downwards trend, so they also stated as well that, the sheep got to stop being labeled as a problem.You know, look at all the sheep that have been removed since the 70's till now. I can honestly say from what I visually see on the mountain I don't hear no 700 plus birds, that the state supposedly be estimated. I would love for them to take me on an excursion; I want to hear those birds for myself. I can count them on one hand how much Palila sing, chirping I can hear in one day up at the mountain that's fact. As far as also where it states here, with the estimated this abstract on page 4, you know how they have the counts, it's kind of confusing,this one...the number that they provide in the abstract verses what they show in the count in the survey, LT: Yep TWC: Totally off their counts. So, once again that brings me back to my conclusion says, are they counting the same birds ten plus time a day, you know that is a big question mark? Makes me question this data analysis period. I just want this in the minutes. LT: Leomana District 3. If we have any more comments on this, I got a couple of things, it might take me about 10 minutes to go through,so ifguys want to provide more comments for that or after. RD: Ummm one, the video by Mossman is not able to be shown? CO: Chair Barbara asked for help if she wasn't able to get it done from her end. LT: Okay CO: Happy to do it, if I'm able to share BK: Go ahead and share LT: That would be amazing. I watched this morning and it's real short. so umm BK: It's 5 minutes, Courtney go ahead, I'm at a different computer CO: Let me see if I can get going... RD: Chair, In the meantime, what we're talking about here, is a legal case that was brought here at the Federal Court, LT: Ka la mai, Yes sir, Continue 15 RD: In 1967, Palila was listed as an endangered species. In 1973 Palila was listed as a Federal endangered species, under the Endangered Species Act, in 1978 the US Fish and Wildlife designated critical habitat on Mauna Kea. Critical Habitat is a geographic center for endangered species. 1979 the landmark case Palila Bird vs Hawaii Department of Natural Resources ...the Federal judge Samuel King orders the Hawaii Department of Land and Natural Resources to stop maintaining in population of feral sheep and goat with in the Palila habitat. 1986 United States court Hawaii, the mouflon sheep numbers sufficient purposes are harmful to the Palila. 1987 US District courts Hawaii, State must eradicate mouflon sheep and hybrids within one year. 1998 Defendants and Plaintiffs agree to stipulation in order for DLNR will use best efforts to minimize the migration of ungulates into critical habitat. 1999 Hunters organization intervene that DLNR to move and modify the 1987 order, the request is denied. 2000 Hunter Organizations file an appeal of the 1999 decision; the Nineth Court dismisses the appeal. 2009 files a motion to enforce the eradication of 1979, 1987 and 1998. This is basically, I had more, but I threw it out. These two folders is about 7 inches of documents, this is from the 1998 legal case, that John Carroll put together. The document on this would be two (2) feet tall or more. It's, basically going-here is the 1979 review of the U S Court District for the District of Hawaii. In it states why, essentially the State of Hawaii has full jurisdiction in Hawaii. However, in this document, the Federal Government is arguing that because the Federal Government has treaties with Great Britain and Japan and a World Treaty to protect the endangered birds, those treaties are the law of the land and that preempted what Hawaii had. The reason that it preempted what Hawaii had, because Hawaii was taking Federal Funds. So once Hawaii became Federal Funds, they were under the jurisdiction of the Feds could come in and mandate the eradication. Essentially looking at the technical report, Paul Banko is the guy who on this report as well as 1998, he's probably the leading fellow. The agency that oversees Palila COP, is the USGS, they are the guys that oversees it. Essentially what you have here, what Teyson brought up, essentially the number of these issues we are dealing with, is how the survey was commented. Trend detection, first the Bootstrap sample estimates, (A Bootstrap model is a dialog box or pop-up window that appears overlaid on the main content of a webpage. It is a UI component built using HTML, CSS, and JavaScript, designed to display information, forms, or other content in a temporary, focused manner.) then the Bayesian State Model (A Bayesian state-space model is a flexible statistical framework that combines Bayesian inference with state- space models to analyze systems with unobserved internal states that evolve over time, allowing for uncertainty quantification through probability distributions for both latent states and parameters.)Then the Markov Chain Monte Carlo algorithms- (Markov Chain Monte Carlo (MCMC) is a class of algorithms used to sample from complex probability distributions, particularly in Bayesian inference, by constructing a Markov chain whose long-term behavior(stationary distribution) matches the target distribution) LT: That's for auto correlation... 16 RD: Yes,The Violin Pilot(A violin plot visualizes the distribution and probability density of data, combining features of a box plot and a kernel density estimate to show not just summary statistics but also the shape, skewness, and potential multiple modes (peaks) within a dataset) You're essentially dealing with mathematical models, that is going to need mathematician to understand. Now, obviously the state has it's feet in these models, but to understand like you are saying, where...I don't hear how these models are working. Essentially for us to impact we're going to have to have professional PHD's to be on our side to help us digest this. One of the key piece of information here, was on the count, they were saying, on the count, the males were outnumbering the females. So, the genetic population bases were in material, because the males were not breeding. So that's other...how many female's vs males. At the end of the day, it's a dismal report by any means. But for us to move forward to have any kind of impact, essentially we are going to have to...hunters have been in the court, inaudible...work to see, quite frankly, I think if we combine with people that we now have an alliance with, the Sierra Club, Na Ala Hele and we do a consultation with. Guys, the mountain birds what's going to happen? Can we work on this, what is a viable alternative? Here's the other question, if you brought in sheep are they going to able to take that fire load down? Do you have to manually take afire load and have grazing animals come in? This is We've had guys...This is a big issue. It's ... For us to go head on into court, is going to be, it's going to be counter...we don't have guns, we don't gun, we don't have the manpower, we don't have the guns. If we can work it out with other stakeholders, I think that's our best shot. LT: Yes Sir, do you have a comment? DY: My name is Dwayne Yoshina, I used to be on this commission. LT: Yeah, Uncle Mahalo DY: We weren't to affect, because we're still here. We're still talking about those same issues, and you know, I really don't want to point fingers, perhaps cultivate an understanding while we talked about this during our initial phases of our discussion, it was quite clear whatever the state was doing, doesn't work. That's effort (?) So some of us were foolish enough to ask the question, "So what are you guys going to do?and there was no answer. The state has since many years ago catered to those interests that has the loudness voices. And right now, those conservationists has a loud voice. And so, you have to go talk to them and try to work together, as Bob noted, and you know the conservation community, have to agree with what the hunters are saying. It's not the hunters, it's not the sheep, it's not the goats, if it's in your equations, those are not the reasons, what are you guys, the state and the feds, doing? You're just perpetuating a program that has proved to be ineffective. You have got to the point where, okay what is effective? You know, you have to start talking story with these guys. This person_??_she don't want to come to the meeting, because she is afraid of you guys, us guys and unfortunately if you go to the meeting and start talking like this, will they listen? I don't know. You know, 17 we have similar goals, we can't seem to sit down and talk stories across the table. I'm a conservationist, before conservationist was a big thing. I was a Boy Scout, one of the first things they teach you in Boy Scout is only take what you need. You don't over fish, you don't over hunt, you don't. You know. But to get the conservationist like the Sierra Club to even acknowledge the fact that maybe the sheep and goats are not the problem, as Bob says, when you have the male, female ratio of birds that can not naturally sustain itself, why are you protecting this whole area and it's not doing the job. I don't know, I sat on the board for many, for number of years, I just, life is too short. LT: Thank you...yeah it is TWC: I thank you for your time in the commission as well, It is unfortunately we are still talking about the same problems, but I believe in time does tell yeah,what we are...and to answer your question also, the Sierra Club is back in the GMAC now, just for your information, they also showed up for us in the county council meeting the General Plan. He also did mention in the minutes as well, he is in support of GMAC and believes the sheep is not the problem. And the whole Sierra Club, mission all for actual management plan involving GMAC to be part of that plan. Is it going to be a process? Yeah, now, I'm only 38 years old. I've been going to meetings with my dad, growing up, I'm basically following his footsteps, because I believe in my lifetime, I can try and change. Mauna Kea is a big thing to me,that's where I grew up on it. I started shooting archery, I was hunting with archery, before I shot one gun. I'm doing that with my kids today. To see...to see it slowly heading in a direction, from what, I've been ...I only been here next month, makes my one year next month, and what I have been last year till now, we're slowly seeing the steps, and the people we need to come across to make this happen and we keep it on the agenda to keep it rolling, because of the fact that,we actually, it doesn't seem like it at the moment, but we actually do have a lot of support to make this moment. We are just going into fact of the process, which is kind of long unfortunate for legislation and stuff like that, but right now we do have a lot of people in support of hopefully in amending this, this whole eradication process. Just wanting to share with you that. DY: Thank you. LT: Yes Sir, ??: (Steve Araujo) I don't know where you guys were back in 1980, that's when everything started 1970— 1978 It started with the con-con, we arrange sections, LT: Hold on I going give 3 minutes, we going watch the video, so that way we get time to respond. ??: (Steve Araujo) Judge Heen, original order stated the birds, and the sheep can live together, okay, only thing, the sheep had to be brought down in numbers and managed. The state said, "all or nothing, So, all or nothing, because the Judge in turn because of 18 noncompliance said irradicate. The lawsuit when was a big BS. The hunters joined the state, because they thought the state wanted the sheep, but it was the opposite way around. John Caroll went back to the Supreme Court. I was part of it. He did not get support of the state. The state told him, "You want to go to court, go to court. Without the partners being together, the lawsuit is not going to happen. So, I think John Carroll is one of the last hunters from that organization to trial the state, I don't know how that's going to be. Okay, I went through this state, they talk about the bird population increasing, they have not said why. I read Environmental Hawaii; you guys know that magazine? Pat Cummings was on the news, Palila numbers down this and that, what is the problem? Their Concern is what is the problem?Sheep almost gone, essentially the sheep is not the problem,the problem is the rats and the cats, which back in the 90's they did this video, "Hawaii Born of Fire", they made this video they showed a rat eating the eggs and stuff, so they collared the rats and let them go, they collared the cats and let them go. If you catch a predator, kill, common sense. But honestly guys, it's all about the money. The Endangered Species Act, Federally Endangered species act states, Wildlife will be holding to the state, belongs to state, not the fish and wildlife service. You guys should carry this little book around,the Palila numbers has also gone down, because back in the 90's they forgot something like 5 or 7 mist nets, those mist nets were left there for days, all the Palila that went into the nets, all dead. They did the same thing in Kulani, I think at Kulani they had like 14 nets. So, the condition is work, you guys want to pursue this is work, go get the evidence. And if guys read some of the Palila reports, I do a lot of politics too, this involves politics. Back in Cayetano time...I read one, the Palila nest is empty because the Palila is an Aditi, (The assertion that the palila bird is an "aditi" is incorrect. A palila is a critically endangered Hawaiian honeycreeper, while Aditi is a prominent goddess in Hindu mythology. The two are unrelated concepts from different fields of knowledge.) it's here in black and white. Umm...Paul Cayatano went after Mike Wilson, big time, what kind of stupid report is that. The reports are stupid. LT: Mahalo Uncle thank you for that, I did take notes on that. We're going to jump forward to Mrs. Cortney Okumura and just watch this 5-minute video and I can give my mana'o about this, and we'll move on to the next agenda item. On the Screen we have Bret Mossman. (Video -with Q&A): What are your thoughts on the precipice decline of the Palila populations on Mauna Kea in particular thus far? 19 BM: Yeah, it kind of following the pattern we've seen with a lot of native birds, unfortunately as things have changed in the landscape they're going to decline. On Mauna Kea specifically on Hawaii island, there has been 250 years, basically unmanaged grazing. The habitat has been really damaged. It's going to take a long time to recover from those lows. You know, in the 90's we had this really bad drought, that really caused the Palila population to fall down below 2,000 individuals, at that point they became really susceptible to other treats, such as predators such as feral cats, and that cause them to continue to decline over time. Every year we are getting new threats, naio thrips, t8tg12 thri s C r cm r~p„ My cm 2d) are a destructive invasive insect pest from Tasmania that attacks the native Hawaiian naio tree (Myoporum sandwicense), causing leaf distortion, galling, dieback, and potentially tree death)to Russian thistle(Russian thistle is a summer annual weed also known as tumbleweed. It is primarily a weed in sites where the soil has been disturbed. When Russian thistle). Which is now invading the Saddle region, increasing fire risk. Just new threats are coming in on top of the treats we have been already experiencing over the last few 100 years, and it's kind of expecting to see them continue to decline. We're learning more so we are able to take more action, but you know it's a devasting impact, but we have the tools and the assets to be able to do something about it. It's ruff and it's hard to see, but if we keep protecting the habitat and if we keep address predators, you know, if we keep trying new things, eventually we are going to figure out, what's going to be the key, the key recipe for making sure we keep them around and hopefully we build them to recovery. What are your latest counts that you have seen? BM: Oh yeah,fortunately wejust had a report by USGS of our partners, and forthe last 3 years, we actually seen a slight up-tick, and the number of Palila is very, very small. They were declining from 2019 to 2022;there is a pretty steady decline in the number of Palila. From 2022 to 2024, we have seen a slight increase, so by 2024 we have 666 individuals the estimated population, and we got a few more raw detections in 2025 than we did in 2024. So hopefully we've seen an even increase from that. It seems, like some of our really high intensity management that the Mauna Kea Forest restoration project has been engaging in practically the expansion of predator control, and the wildlife program in East Hawaii, we've seen a hopeful response to that, really stepped-up management. Ah yeah, only time will tell, and we're trying to implement a bunch of new strategies, so, we're hoping the next for years to do, we're what we are calling it Rear n Release, we're going try to collect eggs from the wild, bring those into captivity, raise them up to fledging age, for just a few months and release them back out with the wild flocks, so they can learn their wild behavior before they get stuck in captivity 20 for too long. So, we're trying a bunch of different strategies, and so far, at least it seems like, we're trying to make some progress. What's the ideal number if there is an ideal number for the sustainable population for Palila? BM: That's kind of a hard question, but I would say back in the 90's there were around 3 to 6,000 birds, so we need to get back to that number, that would be great, I would love to see at least two populations of Palila. One in their current range and one on the North slope and on the East slope, where they were found more recently. Yeah, ideally, we want to see...to me if we can get stable numbers, that's the biggest thing. From there we can start growing that population that's even better. But I would love to see at least a thousand (1,000) preferably two to three thousand (2,000 to 3,000) Palila. Even then more the merry, there probably used to be tens of thousands of Palila. To me there is no real number where we have enough, but ultimately, we can get above these few hundreds to a few thousand again that will be in a much better place. Feral cats, what's happening to keep them in control in the Palila habitat? BM: You'll be surprised where feral cats turn out. Pretty much from the coast to the summit, there's just about feral cats everywhere. And that, from previous studies done, that seems to be the main non-native predator that attacks Palila. So, they typically prey on the nestling. But we don't know how often cats are predating on adults. They might be more often than we realize because when the adults' birds are sleeping, they are completely susceptible to a predator coming in to get them. So, cats are being addressed. So, as I mentioned before,you know highlighting the expansion of predator control,there is a much larger effort across the mountain to control feral cats, rats and mongoose. So, the teams with the Mauna Kea Forest restoration project are in particular are really working hard to catch as many cats, as they can and they are removing dozens of cats per year, from Palila critical from the Palila core habitat, not just Palila critical habitat. LT: That was our video from Mr. Mossman. Just to give us a little update. Same thing as inside of the report. Just going forward I'm going to give my mana'o, so we can move forward. So, starting, at the abstract, when ever I read scientific paper, I got my degree in physics, and I was trying to get my PHD in astro physics over here, and I dropped out, one was because of the stats that they used, so whenever I read reports like this, I don't take the range of numbers, I take the lowest count because it's a population count and you can not go lower. So, I don't take 742, 1 take 368 and that is just the way I do the stats. The stats and mathematics I follow is error analysis by John Taylor. This is a physic textbook, ummm..600 level physics over here. Umm...So, when ever I look through what they put out, I have the same thing as Bob, when I got to the methods of collection and algorithms they used, I noted down on page 6 there is 7 different methods and algorithms and mathematics statistical errors they used to get the numbers they want and the data 21 that collect in the trend detection is diagnostic, what is this, visual inspection of residue plots. This is how they collect their data, so, when they go up there, they go up there and they look for some residue, on top of the plots they put out. That's what they put in their mathematical equations to get these numbers, so, the statistics over here, I cross reference it with I know, and I get confused. I didn't have too many days to look at this, I probably spent four (4) days, trying just to go back and forth, what math equations they used. How they, ummm...right here we give it a plus and minus on the error bars. How are you guys getting this error? The over under is too big. I don't accept 700, if you tell me between 400 and 500, I'll accept that, if you say 300 and 900, that error gap is too big. I don't accept your mathematics, and I don't accept your stats.To go back to the, on page 4, on population count, you brought up the fire, 2001, it was the biggest fire we ever experienced. If we look at the count from 2020 and 2021 and 2022, there is no decrease in the population counts after that big fire. So, you're telling me that the biggest fire we ever had covered Mauna Kea all the way to Mauna Loa in the critical habitat area had no effect on the population counts, that's what they are telling us. The biggest fire we ever experienced. When we went back the difference was two (2) 2021 to 2022/ 2022 to 2021 the difference was one (1) count. From 2021 to 2022 the difference was five (5) So you are telling me that because of the fire we only lost five (5) birds! No way, I don't accept that either. So, these numbers that they are putting out, you know they say that they, on page 6 using the...due to sarcastic fluctuation (The phrase "due to sarcastic fluctuation"is not a standard idiom orscientific term. It is likely a nonsensical or humorous expression created by combining a specific Psychological concept with technical sounding, but irrelevant.) population in overall trends, they used the intern annual noise, and it was audio correlated with alternative trend assessments, using Biege space models. These are five (5) different algorithms and mathematical equations. Do one, take that, put them into a different one, take that, put it into a different one and it just keeps jumping. If this was a math class, I wouldn't accept that. If this was an astronomy paper, I wouldn't accept that. This is just my mana'o looking at this from a science background. The reason I dropped out of UH Physics was because I had a conversation with one of my professors, and he's the head professor of astronomy here and he used to be the director of telescopes. And I had a conversation with him, in my last year about error analysis and data collection, where he told me 50% of all data we find in our books is just straight up a lie. This is from my professor and that's why I gave up my scientific, my PHD because I don't want to spend my life going through the lies,just so I can prove my own truth. So, I left, and I came across this, and this is the kind of lie that he was telling me about, where we use mathematics to forge numbers, because real life doesn't reflect these counts. So, that's just my understanding using my degree and error analysis by John Taylor. Just cross-referencing all the algorithms and trend detections they talk about. Other than that, this is just my mana'o and what I read, just going through this. I got the book right here, if you guys want to read it. Don't read it...Life is too short...like uncle said. That's my mana'o and we can go forward from there. 22 TWC: Taysen Wong-Chong District 2 Another thing I'd like to add to where we are at. We also got to remember the problem with the cats, that we are facing a problem too, the state the DLNR they introduce the problem, what year they introduce the mongoose, does anybody know what yearthey introduce the mongoose?(The small Indian mongoose was introduced to the Hawaiian Islands in 1883 to control rats on sugarcane plantations, but it failed to significantly impact the rat population because mongooses are diurnal (active during the day) and rats are nocturnal.) From the thirty's (30's) to the seventy's (70's) mongoose was overpopulated as well, because why the fact it wasn't a proven problem solver as to the rodent problem, rats and everything right? That was plantation time, so now,they fail to mention,they mention mongoose, but it's always the last thing that they mentioned. Yeah, they talk about cats all the time, but me personally in the mountain I also seen mongoose climbs these trees. In all honestly, they need to take accountability where I see it and never do. That the state has failed also big time and this could be a concern as well to the Palila decline. They brought the mongoose here, the state, that's a big-time predator. That could be possibly the number one reason why we are losing these birds. Who knows, that's why I mentioned I do see mongoose climb these trees as well, mongoose kill just to kill, they don't even eat the dam thing. For example, they will kill a chicken and not even eat it. So, I want to make that for the record as well. That the need to take accountability for their mess up with the mongoose and bring it here, and potentially being a big Palila problem as well. LT: Maika'I Mahalo, So, we have Mr. Aquino AA: I just wanted to point out the fact to that the native bird population especially like the Palila, the I iwi, Alawi their importance can't be overstated. Right, they're not just independent endangered species, their role are all help in this critical habitat, the forest is huge. They are pollinators and seed distributors, mamane and other native trees species and their decline continues, and we can't get a hold of it, it can really devastate the way our biodiversity of how our forest develops. So, this is a heavy thing, pest like mongoose especially by the state, the feral cats just got to be hammered, you know. Possibly putting a bounty on them. Something like that could help. Get some locals out there, trapping and hunting the mongoose and feral cats, and putting up a small reward, a bounty would be a pretty interesting program. I just wanted to suggest that. TWC: inaudible...Put a bounty on the mongoose like that to help mitigate the problem.... RD: Chair Robert Duerr District 1 - I want to thank you for that mathematical analysis. That was awesome. Do you have a handle on like, what should happen next as far as dealing with the studies and the algorithm or you know,just the complexity of their report? LT: I think the short answer is, we might have to go and get some people from UH and just pay. We got money, can you run a study for us a math professor and give us your professional analysis on this, and $500. Bucks, whatever, we got to pay for the study, we 23 need a third-party opinion of a professional. So, I just,... It's a lot to go over math, it takes a long time, and I'm not the best at it and it is just a part of something, I had know. ??: (Steve Araijo) My suggestion, post your report to the council, have the county council they address the issue of what is county, Mauna Kea included. This is a concern of the people, not only the commission, the people. Could they offer some kind of help to resolve this situation? Even if it is the County of Hawaii, request that the Department of Land and Natural Resources re-look at Mauna Kea sheep eradication court case and take it back to court, that is a very strong way to come at this. When you come to this kind of stuff, I suggest you guys come full force ??? use all of your backing, and you'll have your support from the council. LT: Mahalo Yes Sir, BL: Brian, just something else you need to consider, when we're talking about the rats, you know, once you remove the sheep, we've got these invasive grasses move in, then the Pu'eo, and the I'o can't effectively hunt the rats, because of the grass are too tall for the them to predated on the thing. So, we have disrupted the balance and like you said, anybody who has drive up or drove down, old saddle road, where do you see the Pu'eo? There on short grass where the cattle graze and PTA. I've had Pu'eo follow me bird hunting looking for rats and stuff, cool to having your own personal fowl following you, and that's something to consider, rarely do I see Pu'eo on Mauna Kea anymore or I'o the grass are too tall, they can't effectively predate on the rats and we have created a problem, the State has created this problem where we got the tall grass. Not only is it a fire hazard, now it's a breeding sanctuary for the rats, nobody can predate on. Another two cents worth. Thank you. b. Ryan Okano, Division of Aquatic Resources (DAR) Department of Land and Natural Resources to speak on the proposed Division of Aquatic Resources Community Project entitled, "Resurrecting the Wailoa Station to Support 'Ama'ama Production to Help Revitalize Fishponds." And, to share an update on various DAR Hawai'i Island community efforts. LT: Mai'ka'I Thank you for that. That was our Palila report, sorry we couldn't get Mr. Mossman here this month, but it gives us an idea that we can go back next month and how we can move forward, so just let that cook and brainstorm. Moving forward,Agenda Item: 5B Mr. Ryan Okano from DAR, but he's not here this month, but I'm going to give it overto commissioner Duerrto kind of give us a short breakdown of what the presentation will be about next month. RD: Basically, it'll defer to next month. Essentially, it's going to deal with, starting up the agricultural center on Kamehameha Avenue, as a feeder for fishponds in Keaukaha as a which also would be feeding native stock into the open ocean. He'll also be talking on Kaupulehu, ongoing issues over there for closures. Always about moluwai? the notion 24 that the estuaries, mountain Mauka to Maka' I is feeding the ocean. Then also Holumua, Holumua is a big Holumua initiative is coming to Hawaii Island, which is a big deal. Not only on Maui Island, but Holumua is a big deal of essential self-governance, the biggest issue who gets to be on the board to make those decisions on self-governance. Those are some the issues he'll be bringing up. LT: All right, yes Sir, thank you for that and setting that up for us. I look forward to that. Moving forward to: 6. OLD BUSINESS: a. GMAC "Mana Aina Awards": Continue discussion and/or finalizing the nomination form, and other related materials, to honor outstanding individuals or groups who have demonstrated exceptional dedication to support the hunter-gatherer community and protecting our natural resources. This award recognizes efforts that embody the spirit of stewardship and respect for the land and community.Chair Turalde. So, a couple of months ago we were trying to schedule professional hunters gathers from the public to give us presentations and because I get into you know technicalities in the way, so, we came up with the Mauna Aina Award. The Mauna Aina Award is community recognition. So, the hunter gathers and natural resource community we can recognize experts in our field and the requirement you get, it was with twenty-five (25) signatures from the community and if you get these twenty-five (25) then we'll recognize you as an expert. The reason for these twenty-five (25) is because to apply for the mayor you need twenty-five signatures, then you can submit an application. We were told that, sometimes it is hard to get twenty-five (25) signatures from our hunting community. We do not have too much people. So, maybe we should lessen the number of signatures down to 15. Because county council to apply for county council you only need 15 signatures. So, lessen the requirement to 15 signatures to support you are the community expert, we recognize as the source of information so that way we can bring you into our commission meeting and give you fifteen (15) or twenty (20) minutes presentation instead of just having you give 3 minutes testimony. Right, so you can actually be the source of knowledge, instead of providing testimony. That was the idea of the Mauna Aina Awards. And so, we put it back on the agenda today because, we have already written out in English and we wanted to add, you know when you go to the Mayors office and they give you the blue paper and you shake the mayors hand, I got an award from the county. So, we wanted to add a palapala, a certification that we submit to the mayors office and our community members, uncle yourself and yourself, where we bring you in and Mahalo you for all the hard work that you do, this palapala Mauna Aina is a community certification that we give to the people that deserve it so,that when you come to this building's, technically we can sign you up for presentation. Because they have all these rules. But it is also a good way for us to Mahalo the people who put in time and give them some high acknowledgement, and ceremony, because I believe in that. 1 25 believe in if you work hard, that I gotta reward that hard work. So today I just bring the Hawaiian language to the English language. Because we have the English one put in, this is the old Hawaiian language. I went to UH and talk to the professor, eh help me figure this out, I only speak Hawaiian, I'm not an educator in Hawaiian, I want the official language from the people, so today we just submit the Hawaiian language part for the certificate from the mayor's office and I was hoping Micah would be here he is the guy that was going to print this out and I can give this to you. RD: Do we need a motion to accept that? LT: We need a motion to accept the Hawaiian language, Well no, no, no. The last meeting we had was amendments, and the two meetings after that, we got cancelled right, that's why I bring it back to this meeting, because the last three (3) meeting it got cancelled, so we are supposed to bring back the amendments, we did a vote. I just wasn't able to bring back the Hawaiian part. RD: Oh, okay LT: So that's what this is about, and this section of the agenda, was suppose to be all part of my commissioners report like I was talking about it earlier, because they want us to agendize our commissioners report so that way the public could know what each district was talking about. But, with the change with Corp Counsel and the change of the rules and stuff, we don't need to do it that way. We can do it the way we had. Mahalo for the change and for everybody getting through the last 6-7 months. So now we got through the change, and we are getting back to regular deals. So, that's the Mauna Aina Awards. Just to let you guys know, because this is very important for us to bring in our third-party members who are experts in our community and not officially recognized. You know they are having us, if you not part of the planning department you cannot come to our commission meeting and talk about the General Plan right. They were saying that you have to be in the planning department, and this is kind of our push back against that. So, thank you guys for that. If you guys want to look at it, we'll upload the packets today on top of our website in the GMAC folder so everybody can see this. Okay, moving forward from that, if no one doesn't have any discussion. That was just a basic breakdown if you guys like, we'll get one to you. b. The Commission intends to discuss and may take action on creating informational marketing materials of the Commission.Chair Turalde. 26 Moving forward Agenda Item 6b the commission intend to discuss Taking action creating informational marketing materials of the commission. So, last year we went to the legislation, so, we flew to Oahu, a couple of us, we went to the legislation, and a part of what we wanted to do was to provide more educational opportunities, a lot of our communities they don't know what the GMAC is. They don't know about the Palila and the things that we cover and so we wanted to make informational pamphlets or cards or maybe get a little trinket like a pig or a sheep with a tag and you giving them away to the kids to inspire them, to look the pig, look the birds and maybe that will inspire them a little bit more. And just like informational packets to handout when we go to meetings. Here's a paper full color, here's a picture of the animal, here is our issues, here's what we want. You know, just as a handout as education and advertising material for GMAC. I really didn't know how to start that discussion or where we go from there about advertising and marketing and education. So that was kind of what I was thinking throwing it in there to let you guys know we can educate and be more present in the public, yeah that was my mana'o. If you guys have any thoughts on that? I'm going let them go first.... BL: Could we go like to Maku'u Farmers Market and set up a little booth and discuss GMAC topics and stuff or does that take up a whole quorum or if we wanted to do something like that? KW: (Attorney Wong) If you wanted more than two (2) people or less than quorum, then you would establish a community inter-action group to be present there to provide a presentation or you know to give information out, if you wanted to go with two (2) people, you could just do that. It just how many people want to participate and what level of information you want to share. TWC: Question: Could it be possible if there was two (2) sections, let say Maku'u and Kona, situation where we set up same day, but two different time both communities be aware is that possible? KW: Yea, I've done that with the youth commission before where they had two separate two town hall meetings where youth was on the Hilo side and youth was on the Kona side and it was just give information to the youth of the county, to say this is what we're about, these are our goals and if anybody is interested and want to attend the meetings and if you're interested in becoming a commissioner this is the process you go through. For the informational material if anybody here is good at Canva creating artwork I mean design and that sort of thing, my suggestion is maybe for the next meeting, bring a couple of proposed designs, then the commission can then choose the design that they like. TWC: Also, a suggest too, I actually reached out to a few people inaudible??? Sponsorship or something like that, I can get in contact with somebody impressionist stuff like that and 27 mitigate onto our program like Gyotaku artwork. I can ask him myself if he'd be willing to submit ????to do stuff like that?That would be a possibility to do something like that? KW: Yes, you need to get their permission right? TWC: I just want to clarify if it was possible, because I get some connection to that situation. KW: Yes, it's possible TL: That's it marketing and advertising material education... RD: Should we leave this on the agenda? TL: Yeah, next month come back to it. Commissioner yes, Mr. Abel Aquino AA: (Abel Aquino)Yeah, I've been a professional designer for over twenty-two (22)years, and of native ancestry. I might be able to help with, I may be cool to do something like an enamel pin that goes with pamphlet or even like a patch like a Girl Scout or Boy Scout participation. That talks about the Palila, then when they have the three (3) page foldout brochure, you get a patch or pin with it and once you're educated with that particular animal and we could do that with fish and Pua 'a, birds, and different things like that. LT: I'll add it to next month's agenda in the meantime if everybody can just brainstorm. Maybe we're all experts and we focus on different areas in game management just bring one solid idea. Have your idea written out and presented to the commission next month and we can go forward from there. And we can talk about how to pay it forward and who does it and all of that stuff. Yes, sir, SA: Same issues with the Pig Hunters Association, what we found out is don't go to the extreme kind of get a balance we people we own all the birds, we own the insects, we own the forest we own the pigs, we own everything because everything is for the people. So, no go like inaudible....give them good balance because the hardest thing is the kids, a lot of the kids are already brainwashed so, you don't want them take the thing and comeback in your face. You want, just to make them think. You know just keep that in mind. And you talk about educating people, get up there and educating the county council, get up there and educating our state reps, county reps, our senators. Both sides need education, because they have power. TWC: The reason why we are trying to educate the public is because we can get more public involvement in meetings, more testimony... SA: See and what you do and its' within the parameters of the law, I hate to see anybody being thrown out. 28 c. GMAC 2025 First Quarter Report on its activities,Chair Turalde. LT: Okay, thank you for that Mana'o on the educational and marketing materials Moving forward to Agenda Item 6c GMAC 2025 1st Quarter report on its activities Ahh,this special meeting that we held for the General Plan, I got to sit down and talk with councilman Inaba on our quarter report, and he was really excited. Cause he hasn't seen that in GMAC until we started to do that again, so he was, so one of the points he brought up was thank you so much for the quarter report you know if we can do it like this, I'm kind of talking with him right now, how to set it up and he gets it, the information he wants right at the top. Writing it up, so I'm trying to get that outlined and square away with him and I'll probably see them in the next two(2)days,and come back in next months meeting being with that cleared up. d. Report on the site visit with NABS, DOFAW,GMAC,and hunters of the proposed fencing of Puumakaala Forest from 800 acres to 400 acres,Chair Turalde. LT: Moving forward from Agenda Item #6c to Agenda Item #6d Report on the Site visits with NARS and DOFAW, GMAC and Hunters of the proposed fencing of Pu'u Maka'ala forest from 800 to 400 acres. This was a huaka'I excursion that we took myself, Mr. Taysen Wong-Chong, and representing the public we had one of our professional pig hunters and community hunters Mr. Abraham Antonio and we went up there and spoke to the head of NARS and Nick Augustas, you guys know NARS Nick Augustas he is the head of NARS up there at Pu'u Maka'ala. They proposed fencing another 800 acres to add to the NARS area they got from the prison. A lot of the land designation, doesn't allow hunters to access the area because the old property belongs to the prison and it's under some weird jurisdiction where we cannot travel with weapons across the prison road to get to our hunting area. That is one of our concerns, of how can we get hunters up here when the hunters cannot travel with any weapons? Because the roads go through the prison grounds. From our conversation we didn't get in official writing yet, but the ask was that they wanted 800 acres to fence. We went up there we had our conversation we got them to communicate to us what about 400, what about cutting the fencing area down by half these are the kind of deals that GMAC in my personal opinion needs to be there to talk to the heads of these other organizations. We can kind of discuss and kind of train and teach each other, in real time and go from fencing 800 and to 400 acres. You know here in our meetings and our letters, that we do, sure we can write letters and hope that people, kind of take our opinion, but to me that was a direct action talking to Nick up there in the forest and say eh we no like your 800 acres idea, give us a different idea, and they go what about 400, let's work with 400 we can do that. So, to me if.. all of my time spent in GMAC, that's the kind of things that we can personally accomplish, because the Palila stuff is going take a life time, right Palila is going take a life time and small things like small wins like this, means a lot to the individuals who come in here that care about fencing off specific areas. So, I just wanted to bring that to mind, I wasn't aware of this area, when I came into the commission, but this was an important thing to our community our hunters and past commission members that — I still push whatever they had on the 29 agenda from the years before. So, I just wanted to bring this up and say, "Eh, we still working on it. We brought down from 800 to 400 words of mouth we are still waiting on the letter, and we're going to go back and follow up. I just want to give an update on that situation. Yes, sir... ?: (Steve Araijo) Could you get it down to zero? Listen up HRS 195 is NARS ... inaudible...This area is not a natural area reserve; NARS has no jurisdiction outside of their boundary. Do not give them jurisdiction because it's the first step to take the rest of the land hold it to zero because I believe that area is outside of the prison boundary which makes it forest reserve. Okay, you have a forestry. Forestry cannot give anything to NARS, NARS cannot give anything to Forestry. To become a NARS, there is a procedure. It has to be ...inaudible...it has to go through NARS membership. It has to pass through NARS commission, if pass the NARS commission, the Governor has to sign it or else the NARS commission is not enforced. NARS commission can not say, we want this", okay no matter what reason they give you, especially if it is a beautiful koa forest. Because the partnership that is NARS national park, Kamehameha Schools, Kamehameha Schools has about 2,000 acres of koa right there above that was the old Keauhou Ranch ???? they took the Kulani prison area Kulani prison area consist of 10,000 acres there are giant koa stands in there, I've been there. And in the old days, for you're guys reference, you could hunt in Kulani prison, no firearm, knife, bow or spear. Okay, hunting was allowed in it. So, that area should not have any other jurisdiction, but forestry and the guys' name is Nick Augustus. If you guys going give them 400 acres, you are giving them people's land, and they going take the 400, then in two years it is going to increase to 800, later on it going keep increasing. Hunters are going to lose more land and then what, going be like Palila? Okay, going take 100 years to get something back? Don't give them the land, fight them, LT: Yes, Sir, ?: (Steve Araujo) Fight them tooth and nails. LT: I like that idea of Zero! ?: (Steve Araujo)They took Kulani prison... LT: It'll really take support for all of us to go down to Zero! Even me, I'm still learning about NARS and how they apply their land. So, thank you for that. ?: (Steve Araujo) If you allow that, if you guys going go this commission to take back 400 acres, go give your information marketing, the hunters will be pissed off. LT: Mahalo...Moving on to Agenda Item #7—7A We have statement from the public.... 30 AA: (Abraham Antonio) I just wanted to touch up little bit on that, you know we were there and opposed the 800 acres, and asked them what their plan and what was the negotiation that they would like to come up with? Of course,you know they mentioned the 400 acres and at the time I still opposed that 400 acres, I totally agree with what Steven is saying. We see what they come back with, it's still an open negotiation between the hunting community and I guest with GMAC representatives that were there and with the DOFAW NARS representatives. Nothing is in stone yet, still in negotiations and their reasoning, you guys already know, it's for the birds, the birds is moving down slowly, that's why they like go down and if we give them anymore acreage,then how much more they going take, then Kulani and Mauna Loa slopes going end up like Mauna kea too as well, then will get fenced off, then eradicated. Then we really not going to have anything to provide for our families. That's all I can say for that, for now. LT: Yes, Sir, thank you very much and thank you for always fighting for our Game management. 7. NEW BUSINESS: a. The commission intends to discuss topics for future GMAC agenda presentation. Chair Turalde. LT: We got our next meeting basically covered with our presentations and we can start lining them up again, for September, October, .... RD: Chair, Duerr District 1...It's kind a like what we had today, for issues one (1) Claudia Rohr was asking to be on the agenda for the Pepeekeo public access. Jordan Lerma (sp?) was talking about a report for the cats and also, he has a pig dot Pua'a mapping system, potential also just an update for the General Plans. This may be under other business, just small reports, at least the public knows. There was also a question about DOFAW, what's the regulations on DOFAW ...inaudible? Mr. Araujo was talking about, one time they had a system, and they constantly watered it down. Also, commissioner Ley has not been able to get reports from DOFAW on this. The other thing that's coming up is the Gun Regulations reports, so when you guys go to that meeting to be able to have on the agenda a report and just an update. The other thing too, we just was on is NARS, You have somebody from NARS make a presentation, what is their jurisdiction, why are they up there, what do they do on this Island? How many acres do they have? Chair there is also, at our last June 16t", meeting, we were given a memorandum by Merrick Nishimoto, which was the enclosed administrative process for Game Management Commission, it's hard to know if this is a proposed memorandum? It was three (3) pages where he was telling us what is essentially needs to happen at our meetings. Do we need to have him come here and kind of explain this memorandum? KW: Try ask Barbara, if she knows. 31 RD: That was passed out at the June meeting. A Miss Wan at the beginning passed it out. LT: Is that the one with the SunShine Law? RD: Yeah, And if we didn't have quorum, we had to cancel the meeting and not have a presentation is what he was saying in there. KW: (Attorney Wong) If the commission doesn't have quorum, you can still have presentations, you can ask the presenters questions, you can still take public testimony, you can ask the testifiers questions, you just can't discuss or take any actions. You can still have a meeting, ??: Can't vote on it either? KW: Yes, you can still have a meeting. Sometimes it's hard for other boards and commission, you know, you guys have to drive, people have to drive in, chairs of those other commission they say we're just going to cancel so that people don't have to drive. So, that's up to you chair and commission if you guys want to continue, everybody shows up and whoever doesn't show up, if it's canceled, we still want to allow the meeting to continue to proceed with the presentations. You know the presenters are also driving here too and receive public testimony, that's the decision you guys can make. BL: Brian Ley District 41 said the same thing to Sylvia Wan, and she still canceled the meeting. I said we can still have the meeting and the presentation, we can't do anything official, and she said NO! You don't have quorum; we're shutting the meeting down. After we all drove here and did everything else. KW: That's incorrect, you can still have presentation and public testimony, under Sunshine Law. At the next subsequence meeting though, someone has to give a report. LT: Yeah, okay KW: You know the information BL: And she still has a job... ??: Let's be honest... BL: She sandbagged this commission for months, and she still has a position? I mean she can't do her job; it's not like she got her thing, ..inaudible.....We just got testimony that she blatantly lied to us and not let us have our meeting and set us back a month that we were trying get the thing, we had to have a special meeting. INAUDABLE...... 32 KW: There is no letter, commission has been re-assigned to Deputy Frenz. INAUDABLE....to many talking of once LT: Thank you very much for that change too INAUDABLE.... TWC: Just acknowledging Abraham Antoinio, I appreciate the fact that we wouldn't have known about this Maka'ala forest if it wasn't for him, because technically it has taken us behind the scene, the public, because we are trying to do public situation to get out to the public to set up booths, because we want the public to know on one hand to be more involved that NARS are going to push this fence, without nobody even knowing. They have the funding already to do this fence job. If it wasn't for Abraham, honestly from the ????and looking back at the research, to help us do this, yes we did want zero for the fence, going back and forth we didn't get it set in stone stuff like that 400 was a compromise, but in regards to making roads accessible, punching different new roads, so it was like a compromise, not set in stone also, yes, zero would be an absolute number for sure. I just want to make that acknowledgement, that's why we want to make the public involved. Pretty much making noise, through booths activities, possibly in the future through pamphlets, radio announcements, stuff like that so that the public can be more aware and active to where we can get the evenings going again, and the mayor is aware of that and just get the ball rolling, new age...at different manner. So, that's what I wanted to say. RD: Chair one questions for corporate counsel, "If an agency refuses to come and meet with us, do we have subpoena power? Can we force an agency or what's our process to have someone to come like the Palila people? KW: So, the commission do not have subpoena power. What I can tell you is that my recommendation is to have the mayor reach out and ask an agency to be available. And you know you can write out the reason why the commission wants to discuss XYZ please confirm that a representative will, can present, and when those dates would be. And if I could respond to commission Ley, because you know you were talking about got no reply when you submitted to, I guess DLNR DOFAW, and got no response. BL: I did submit and went in to talk to them several times... KW: Okay...So they.... BL: Left messages and nobody returned anything... 33 KW: State agencies are required to either to provide you with a response, saying we cannot give you that information, or say, we will get you that information by this date. There is a deadline under the US State of information agency. �ni arrn In arrna °i.on Prac°tic°es Ac°t UIPA ............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................. (The Office of Information Practices ("OIP") was created by the Legislature in 1988 to administer the Uniform Information Practices Act(Modified), chapter 92F, Hawaii Revised Statutes ("UIPA"), which is Hawaii's public records law and can be found here. To help government agencies and the public understand the UIPA, OIP has an Open Records Guide, which can also be found here.) BL: Does it have to be a written request? KW: I can get you that form... BL: I appreciate that... LT: Thankyou very much...Alright Thank Very Much...Okay I have one(1) more. Just one more question...for Corp Counsel, for our advertising our public education, like radio announcements,does that have to go through the communication director of the county? Or can we put out stuff on our own like public service announcement? KW: I think communication from the commission itself, I think we should go through the mayor's office, with Mr. Tom Callis. He is the mayor's PIO. LT: Okay, all right that's it for our agenda. No one else ...Yes, sir, ?: (Steve Araujo) Did you guys submit the letter to Corp Counsel that you was suppose to submit? LT: Ummm ?: (Steve Araujo)Two days later, they are waiting for it. LT: No, we didn't submit a letter because they fired her, before we submitted the letter, and I communicated with the head of Corp counsel in person. INAUDABLE.... ?: (Steve Araujo) We didn't know that ...???Just asked a little while ago and how come she still got job? 34 KW: No, no, no, If I may, the assignment for this commission, was re-assigned to another attorney. She got re-assigned. LT: Re-assigned... Okay KW: So, there is no need for a letter... ?: (Steve Araujo) This commission should be sent to those who help the commission also when this meeting is going to be changed to evening time because, I not coming already. This is taking too much of my work time, LT: So, we communicated with Bill, the managing director, and he said, within thirty (30) he will get an answer of the timing, the funding that you know, whatever excuse they have, within thirty (30) days he'll have an answer for me on those excuses that have. ?: (Steve Araujo) Okay,Also, Corp Counsel office training,take theirtraining even if you have to do a special meeting, usually training the public not involved. Take the training and also do housekeeping. On your website, the last meeting was the beginning of June, the special meeting is not on the agenda, it's not on the website. This meeting is not on the public website. I personally had to go on the board in the front to look if there was a meeting today and what was on the agenda. And also, when you go to the website, there's got to be the agenda items. The website on the upper lefthand corner, it says, PATH (?) The PATH is no longer supposed to say mayor's office, suppose to say county council. Put your house in order. In my opinion, not having the minutes of the last meeting available for this meeting to be approved is unacceptable, it is totally unacceptable. You don't go to a county council meeting, oh sorry we don't have the minutes of the last meeting. Everything is supposed to be in order. So again, I hope you guys do good, I know you guys on the right path. Square your solidity away first,you guys be solid, and whoever comes after you, you guys set the foundation. Some of you guys can come back, right you know. Foundation set solid, and everything can move forward. ...inaudible.. With that being said, I see you guys when you have the evening meeting. LT: Hopefully that's going to be in the next thirty (30) days. Just to confirm usually after the meetings, I always go to the mayor's office and bug them so okay. Mahalo for that everyone. 8. ANNOUNCEMENTS: a. Next Meeting: August 19, 2025, at 9:00 a.m. 25 Aupuni Street, Puna Conference Room, 1501, Hilo HI 96720 LT: Moving on to the next Agenda Item Announcements Agenda Item 8A next meeting August 19, 9:00 am, here. Before we conclude, remember we were talking about making a motion to change the rules to night-time? Instead of asking them, we create a motion we push that ourselves... 35 RD: Can that maybe be on the agenda? LT: Okay so actually.. KW: So another piece of it that we make sure on the availability of facility space, which I think the managing director (MD) Bill Brilhante is the part that he is looking into as well and usually they alternate between Hilo and Kona, so I don't know if that is a consideration for MD you know, bring that back, it may be something. I just throw that out there. LT: I know today and tomorrow, Tuesday, and Wednesday the council long days, so he was saying something about that, we may have to switch to Thursday. The open slot, we kind of figured out anyway that was the situation. TWC: Corp counsel you sure you available for one meeting? KW: Yeah LT: Okay so we got that added to next month's agenda item. If there's nothing left, can I please get a motion to adjourn the meeting? TWC: Taysen district 2 moves to adjourn the meeting... BL: District 4 second LT: I got a motion and a second to adjourn the meeting, any discussion none seen? Roll call vote: District 1 - Robert Duerr, aye District 2—Taysen Wong Chong, aye District 3— Rhon Leomana Turalde, aye District 4— Brian Ley— aye District 5-Vacant District 6—Vacant District 7—Able Aquino aye District 8—Cortney Okumura — aye District 9—Justin Ackerman— excused Motion passed with 6 ayes and 1 excused. The meeting adjourned at 11:12 a.m. Respectfully submitted by, Barbara Kossow Secretary 36