2023-09-29 Merit Appeals Board Minutes

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Merit Appeals Board September 29, 2023 CHR. CABANAS: Go ahead, Charlie. MR. KUNZ: I mean, I know not knowing the process or the protocol totally the perception can be distorted. And you got to have, kind of, tough skin to go through this thing. If you're going to have an appeal in front of a panel and then once you started explaining it—because I'm sure you explained it clearly and calmly enough. It's just that it may not be for everybody. And I think this is more reactionary because of that protocol that's in place. I think it'sit can be, sort of, intimidating. And then, his to me, his response just sort of reflects that. I don't think that I wasn't here for that, by the way. But I don't think anything that the panel did or yourself, kind of, put him in that position to feel like as loudly and almost subjectively as we're reading this but I don't think it's something that you did, said, or the panel did. I think it's just the perception of the process is intimidating. And then, he kind of felt that. And, like I said, you got to have tough skin to go through it that you're going to be you are going to be questioned, you're going to have witnesses, you going have—it's a very formal process. So, I wouldn't—we shouldn't try to stake too much claim that it was something that this panel did versus just maybe a normal reaction to what the process, you have to adhere to, can be pretty challenging, I think, for some person. And go, like, "You know what, if we got to do this, I don't want to do this"—and they might have felt that way but I don't think it's anything that this group did. MS. MATHEWS: I'm not thinking that it's anything that we did. What I am thinking, though, is that I think we have failed the individual and individuals by not having, like, some really clear brochure they can read that warns them. And do you really have to have tough skin in order to feel something that you feel where you've been wronged? That, to me, is another one of those — I mean, I understand what you're saying and I totally agree with you that people have to be tough and there's no advocate for them. So, they're sitting there having to respond to something when you've got at least one attorney and sometimes two that know the law, that know how to play the game— CHR. CABANAS: Okay. I hear what everyone is saying. I need to remind the Board members, we are in open session. And I'm going to ask for our Assistant Corp. Counsel for advice at this point. MR. YOSHIMOTO: I think we need to just focus on the matter on the agenda, and Mr. Hakoda has indicated what he wants to do, and the Board should act upon it. As far as procedures, I think that can be an agenda item for another topic, if the Board wants to address it. I think we need to address the matter on the agenda. Page 7