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ISAACS: And these I get -. WOODWARD: The higher you are in the food chain, the more that toxin gets concentrated; and that’s why people -, even though barracuda is an excellent tasting fish, a lot of people don’t eat barracuda because they are the top order predator. But I have a real question whether development has anything to do with that, to be honest with you. As I say, there has been extensive development in the Florida Keys, and to my knowledge, not a case of ciguatera poisoning in the last 20 years.So it’s a bit of specious science, I think. Yeah, ciguatera poisoning exists; but I don’t think you can trigger that to, or tie that to development, to be quite honest with you. ISAACS: Can I comment on that? RHO: Sure. ISAACS: Growing up on the Big Island, we never knew what that was because it didn’t exist. And this was before coastal development. There was no ciguatera. Nobody got sick. It’s only when coastal development started that this started to come about. And you can find, how they say, the worst areas and look at what’s beyond it. WOODWARD: Well, my understanding is that it’s a basically random event related to a particular type of coral, or particular type of algal bloom that has the DNA – I think it’s got a virus in it or something – that causes the problem. And again, I don’t think you can say it’s tied to development. You know, the fact that it occurred when this development was occurring, I think it’s probably more coincidental than anything else. As I say, there has been extensive development in the Florida Keys and extensive damage unfortunately to the coral reefs, and there is no ciguatera. So -, and there is ciguatera in other places in Caribbean. So, yeah, okay, that’s a problem; ciguatera is a bad thing to have. But I’m not sure that there is any real science that ties it to development, to be honest with you. RHO: No other questions? Thank you very much, Mr. Isaacs. ISAACS: Thank you. RHO: So we can continue and move along, and ask Mr. Lim to step up. Before we proceed, I just want to ask the audience to see if there are any other persons that wanted to testify who have not signed up. We had two signed up, and both have testified. If not, we’ll go ahead and proceed. Can I ask both applicant and the Department to swear in? Do you both swear or affirm to tell the truth now before the Planning Commission? YUEN: Yes. LIM: Yes, we do. RHO: Okay. And we can start with the applicant, Mr. Lim. EXHIBIT A 12