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maybe we don't lose anything, but I have hope that the Planning Department's going to turn around in the next four years and therefore, I'm a little concerned about the • ramifications. The third point I wanted to make is it makes sense to combine all the functions, Wastewater and other things that the Public Works Department has, into a Department of Environmental Services. But if you're going to do that, I do strongly recommend that youremove the requirement that the head be a registered engineer. That requirement is an antiquated requirement that Robert Moses introduced in the 1930's in New York City and it was transferred across the country when Civil Service reform was all the rage, and it has become a curse because it really limits the opportunities to have broad thinking people head that department. RAY: Okay, now, are you speaking about the Department of Public Works or the new department? FRANKEL: The new department. I guess I was under the impression that the Department of Public Works was, sort of, going to disappear into the Department of Environmental Services. RAY: No, no. The Public Works Department would still exist, would still be in charge of four divisions, Building, Engineering, Traffic, whatever. So, there'd still be a Public Works Department, may or may not be headed by a registered engineer. • Then there'd be a separate Department of Environmental Management, which could or could not be, we'd have to decide that, headed by a registered engineer. So, they're separate. So, your suggestion is that we don't mandate the Department of Environmental being headed by a registered engineer. FRANKEL: Right, Environmental Services being - Particularly if solid waste and recycling are issues where you do not need to have an engineering background to head the department. Yes, you need to have engineers in your department, for example, to design a good landfill, but you don't need one to design a successful recycling program. In fact, I would suggest there's a lot of engineers who don't design recycling programs properly. The last point I wanted to make, which is my most important point, is I'm strongly opposed to the idea of having at -large Council members. I think that is a huge step backwards for the County. Anyone who runs for an at -large seat requires a lot of money. Some of you have run for office before. You know that one of the burdens of running for office is raising money. There's no question that if you are running for office for an island -wide seat, you need far more money than you do for one Council seat. You need far more money. Look at how much money the current candidates are spending. Look at how much money was spent in the last campaigns for Mayor vs. any Council seat. What this does is it reduces the influence of ordinary citizens, and I think 12