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actions that the Planning Director makes and yet the body is, that's hearing the appeals is also in the same department. I have to spilt staff in the same way I think that Corporation Counsel would need to split their staff so that it's clear who represents essentially the Board and who represents the Director and/or the Commission. So we talked about Corporation Counsel as perhaps as neutral a body could be the agency which would house the Board of Appeals. Now although the Corporation Counsel Wurdeman has agreed to this, I know that there has been internal discussion on that the same kind of conflict though will arise within the Department. So the question is so where do we house the Board then? MCINTOSH: I would take it out of the County Building totally. GOLDSTEIN: No, no, but that's -. MCINTOSH: I would take the whole process out of the County Building and then hire independent counsel to process the paper if that's what it takes and to be totally independent. Because whenever an action of the Board of Appeals goes to court, you have one member of the Corporation Counsel arguing in favor of the Board of Appeals, and then you have Fred Giannini arguing for the Planning Commission, and then you may have someone else representing the Department of Public Works arguing yet another standpoint. So here you have, and we have a situation like that right now where the Board of Appeals overturned an action of the Planning Commission, it has been appealed to the court, and so now we have the County in effect suing itself. GOLDSTEIN: That's right. MCINTOSH: And so I think that the resolution of this issue is not going to be solved by moving the paper from, or the function. I mean you and I have talked about this for years that it really, some serious consideration needs to be given to maybe taking it out of the County Building totally so that the Board of Appeals has its own independent counsel, and maybe that independent counsel then processes the paper. I think this issue needs a lot more discussion before I'm comfortable making a recommendation to the County Council. And I also want to clarify that the issues that you talked about quasi-judicial, you're talking about special permits, for instance, that we issue, and the interpretation has been that those can be appealed to the Board of Appeals and then to Third Circuit Court. You're clarifying that so that the Board of Appeals is taken out of those processes -. GIANNINI: Right. MCINTOSH: Totally and it goes directly to Third Circuit Court. GIANNINI: So which means that any, that will get to the situation of any of the permits, by quasi-judicial action we mean like special management area permits, use permits, special permits under 15 acres, shoreline setback variances and any of those would no longer, 510